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  1. #1
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    Weight and travel of new MKIII?

    I was going to purchase a new Santa Cruz Blur or a Yeti 575, but I recently became interested in the new Iron Horse MKIII.

    Does anyone (Ska Todd?) know what the front and rear travel and weight of the new MKIII is? Is the price going up over 2004 prices? If the prices will stay within the range of the 2004 Hollowpoint Expert at Supergo or Performance, I'll buy an MKIII over the Blur or 575.

  2. #2
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    price, but not weight

    05 pricing is:

    Azure
    Comp = $1999
    Expert = $2999
    Team = $4299
    Factory frame kit = $1599

    Mk III
    Comp = $1999
    Expert = $2799
    Team = $4299

    7POINT
    3 = $2499
    5 = $2999
    7 = $4299

    Sunday
    Team = $3999
    World Cup = $4999
    Factory frame kit = $2299

    Availability is expected for Dec/Jan.

    -ska todd

    This was from the thread "new bikes" down below.
    As far as weight they probably don't know. When that question was about the azure frame kit, an estimate was all he could give back.
    There are a bunch of us "poor slobs" that will have to shop elsewhere for bikes and frames now after the price increases. It is totally unacceptable for ironhorse to tell you to buy a warrior full sus. as a replacement for the hollowpoint. IT'S NOT THE SAME! I'm not telling them how to run their business (well, yes I am) but, you guys should have thought about keeping the 2004 design around for a long time to allow newbies to experience dw-link sus. without breaking the bank.
    I'm in a groove now, or is it a rut?

  3. #3
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    That sucks. I guess it makes my decision easier.

    Quote Originally Posted by zoo00oom
    05 pricing is:

    Azure
    Comp = $1999
    Expert = $2999
    Team = $4299
    Factory frame kit = $1599

    Mk III
    Comp = $1999
    Expert = $2799
    Team = $4299

    7POINT
    3 = $2499
    5 = $2999
    7 = $4299

    Sunday
    Team = $3999
    World Cup = $4999
    Factory frame kit = $2299

    Availability is expected for Dec/Jan.

    -ska todd

    This was from the thread "new bikes" down below.
    As far as weight they probably don't know. When that question was about the azure frame kit, an estimate was all he could give back.
    There are a bunch of us "poor slobs" that will have to shop elsewhere for bikes and frames now after the price increases. It is totally unacceptable for ironhorse to tell you to buy a warrior full sus. as a replacement for the hollowpoint. IT'S NOT THE SAME! I'm not telling them how to run their business (well, yes I am) but, you guys should have thought about keeping the 2004 design around for a long time to allow newbies to experience dw-link sus. without breaking the bank.
    Wow! $500 more than last year? Too bad. I was going to buy one if it was around $1600 like Supergo and Performance sell them for now. But at the same discount, the MKIII Expert will be $2,000 at Supergo or Performance. I can get a Yeti 575 X-Disc for $250 less than that on sale. Oh well. I guess I'll cross it off my list.

    Thanks for the info zoo00oom.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoo00oom
    There are a bunch of us "poor slobs" that will have to shop elsewhere for bikes and frames now after the price increases. It is totally unacceptable for ironhorse to tell you to buy a warrior full sus. as a replacement for the hollowpoint. IT'S NOT THE SAME! I'm not telling them how to run their business (well, yes I am) but, you guys should have thought about keeping the 2004 design around for a long time to allow newbies to experience dw-link sus. without breaking the bank.
    Zoom,

    I have explained this on other threads here on emptybeer and over on RM. Prices across the globe have gone up for goods in the past year. This is due to increases in costs for raw materials, labor, and transportation and the decline in the US dollar. Iron Horse is not alone in the bike industry with this, nor alone in the world of business.

    To combat these rising costs manufacturers can do two things; downspec bikes or maintain spec and charge more. Iron Horse chose to raise prices as to not affect the ride quality, performance, and durability of the bikes. It's a catch 22, if we down spec'd you would have been screaming that the bikes didn't have the same value or performance as 04.

    In relation to pricing, Iron Horse always publically quotes highest suggested retail pricing. Prices will vary from dealer to dealer. Overall, considering the market conditions and new technologies, prices did not go up substantially vs 04 msrps.

    04 Hollowpoint / 05 Mk III
    Sport = $1699 / Comp = $1999
    Expert = $2599 / Expert = $2799
    Team = $4099 / Team = $4299

    04 SGS-FR / 05 7POINT
    Expert = $2099 / 3 = $2499
    Pro = $2599 / 5 = $2999
    Team = $4099 / 7 = $4299

    -ska todd

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoo00oom

    There are a bunch of us "poor slobs" that will have to shop elsewhere for bikes and frames now after the price increases. It is totally unacceptable for ironhorse to tell you to buy a warrior full sus. as a replacement for the hollowpoint.
    Zoom, that's kind of a low blow.

    Consider the heavily discounted NRS2 I bought in 2001, for about $1500. That bike was spec'd with heavy & cheap Race Face Prodigy cranks, an unimpressive Rock Shox Judy XC, a POS Rock Shox SID rear shock, some low end Titec bars, stem & post, Avid discs and Deore drivetrain with the exception of an LX derailleur.

    At about the same time I bought a brand new XT 9 speed cassette for around $36.

    Just last month, I sold that exact same USED cassette for $60 on ebay. Sixty Bucks! And a USED XT derailleur for $32. That's just one indication of how much component pricing has increased in the past year.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=7101949332
    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=7102938308

    And compare that $1500 NRS spec to the '04 Hollowpoint Expert, which I saw at Supergo's sale for about the same price. That in itself is remarkable (the amount of value IH is dumping into these bikes). And the '05 IH spec looks even better by a good amount.

    I think we're going to see other brands in exactly the same position when the '05s hit the shops -- either that or downspec'd, like Todd brought up.

    And let's face it, IH is a different company today than just a few years back. They've reared an awsome, respected lineup over the past three years. Their customer service kicks ass. Their product manager responds to all kinds questions on bulletin board forums. Their father of their suspension design will talk you dizzy explaining why his design is superior, or, at the very least, what it does (and not just some marketing BS). They've developed a pretty decent race team. I think that all pretty well justifies a fair price on their bikes, to where they can stand shoulder to shoulder with the other big names and stop being compared to Weyless in the "What Bike to Buy" forum.

    And hey, that's just my 2.

  6. #6
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    Excellent post Nate

  7. #7
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    okay, so the bikes went up a few hundred dollars in price for an entirely new frame design and increased material cost. I like the new specs and I've actuly decided I'd be fine droping down a model because the spec on the MKIII Comp is more comparable to the Hollowpoint Expert than the Hollowpoint Sport. I would expect to see supergo price them about 400 or so bellow MSRP atleast.
    "Physics is timeless. Marketing and bs never lasts. Thats been proven time and time again."
    -Dave Weagle

  8. #8
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    travel and weight

    Quote Originally Posted by k1dude
    I was going to purchase a new Santa Cruz Blur or a Yeti 575, but I recently became interested in the new Iron Horse MKIII.

    Does anyone (Ska Todd?) know what the front and rear travel and weight of the new MKIII is? Is the price going up over 2004 prices? If the prices will stay within the range of the 2004 Hollowpoint Expert at Supergo or Performance, I'll buy an MKIII over the Blur or 575.
    I do no frome talking to our former customer service rep bruce from a phone conversation about 2 months ago that the info he gave me was 5 inch's front and rear and about the same weight as the HP witch is 29 to 30 pds. also was told that it could handle alot of abuse 4 and 5 foot drop's with ease. sound's like a winner to me also pricing should be comparable to the past HP's if you purchase online maybe 100 to 200 more if you go through supergo and the bikes come well specked for the price definitly the best bang for the buck hope this helps Jan R

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jan R
    I do no frome talking to our former customer service rep bruce from a phone conversation about 2 months ago that the info he gave me was 5 inch's front and rear and about the same weight as the HP witch is 29 to 30 pds. also was told that it could handle alot of abuse 4 and 5 foot drop's with ease. sound's like a winner to me also pricing should be comparable to the past HP's if you purchase online maybe 100 to 200 more if you go through supergo and the bikes come well specked for the price definitly the best bang for the buck hope this helps Jan R
    Thanks for the reply Jan R. Supergo lists the MSRP of the Expert at $2299. The new MKIII is listed at $2799. That's a $500 difference. If Supergo's new 2005 price is $500 more than their 2004 price, I will not consider the MKIII. But if it is only $100 to $200 more, it will still be worth considering. You can get the 2004 Expert online for $1400. If the 2005 is available for $1500 I will definitely consider buying one over the 575 and Blur. Now the question is: When will they be out? I don't want to wait forever. The Blur and 575 are available NOW.

  10. #10
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    The Supego MSRP is 2299, the actual msrp is 2599 for the Hollowpoint Expert. The MKIII Expert has an actual MSRP of 2799, so a 200.00 difference; not 500.
    "Physics is timeless. Marketing and bs never lasts. Thats been proven time and time again."
    -Dave Weagle

  11. #11
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    availability of MKIII

    Quote Originally Posted by k1dude
    Thanks for the reply Jan R. Supergo lists the MSRP of the Expert at $2299. The new MKIII is listed at $2799. That's a $500 difference. If Supergo's new 2005 price is $500 more than their 2004 price, I will not consider the MKIII. But if it is only $100 to $200 more, it will still be worth considering. You can get the 2004 Expert online for $1400. If the 2005 is available for $1500 I will definitely consider buying one over the 575 and Blur. Now the question is: When will they be out? I don't want to wait forever. The Blur and 575 are available NOW.
    Last conversation with IH say's that late December or early January I guess were all waiting but I just got my 04 waranty frame and have to get it out and ride it tomorrow its a 04 sport frame with the 03 expert build and it looks awsome and fill's great I think Im going to ride my HP another 1or 2 years before I bite the bullet again on another one. The HP just work's so darn good and it just does everthing I ride very well and I out climb quite alot of freind's on other brand's so I think I'll hold on to my Baby And just keep rideing it and do a few upgrades as I were out some of the Part's But so far no problems other than 2 cracked 03 frames Ride On Jan R

  12. #12
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    missed the point...

    completely. You guys are way to defensive. You don't understand my point. I do understand that some parts have gone up, not many but some. And I do understand the cost of R&D, I run a small company. And I do appreciate seeing companies coming out with new and improved designs. The point was that the "MK II" design is complete and has many very happy owners, myself included. And yes the price should increase due to inflation. Why send new bike owners down a path of single pivot (warrior) when you could keep a tried and true frameset alive for many years to come, just have new paint schemes reflecting changing attitudes. The MK III definitely looks cooler from what is posted, and the azure fits the bill for racers, but to keep a design to get newbies on a REAL full suspension bike, would have been an excellent marketing decision. Heck, you could even just have one level of the "old" hollowpoint. I like tinkering so much that there is nothing original on it, except for the handlebars, most riders do enjoy that aspect of biking also.
    My views are not for me, (I would never buy another bike to replace my hollowpoint, because there is nothing wrong with it), but for riders looking to get into full squish.
    Nate, what is the "low blow"? Do you think the single pivot warrior is the same as what we all ride? I still would pay $1199 today for what I paid $999 for two years ago for the same spec'd bike, most all of you would have to agree on that.
    I'm in a groove now, or is it a rut?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoo00oom
    Why send new bike owners down a path of single pivot (warrior) when you could keep a tried and true frameset alive for many years to come, just have new paint schemes reflecting changing attitudes. The MK III definitely looks cooler from what is posted, and the azure fits the bill for racers, but to keep a design to get newbies on a REAL full suspension bike, would have been an excellent marketing decision. Heck, you could even just have one level of the "old" hollowpoint.
    It was not as simple as running forward w/ the Mk II HP frame. If we did this, the bike pricing would not have been that much less than 05 Mk III bikes. We thought about doing this and it was debated heavily within the company. To keep the prices in the $1000-1500 range w/ a Mk II frame would have meant cutting back on the spec and compromising the ride quality of the bike. We chose instead to make a sweet little single-pivot bike w/ great suspension and decked out w/ trail worthy components for this price range.

    The Warrior SP5 frame is a better choice for beginners and entry level rider. Less pivots means less maintenance and the Warrior SP5 frame does not rely as heavily on shock set-up. Additionally, the Warrior SP5 frame is designed to have a similar ride quality to the Mk II Hollowpoint in regards to suspension feel and geometry. The Warrior SP5 frame is not just an off-the-shelf singlepivot design. A lot of design work went into the bike to optimize it's performance.

    The overall goal is for riders to have have positive ride experiences, especially when they are starting out. The Warrior series is perfect for someone who is a newb to the high-end/performance side of the market and doesn't want the hassle of precise set-up and more careful maintenance.

    -ska todd

  14. #14
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    back to you Todd, but a little off topic.

    Todd, all my grumbling aside. I do like what I see with Ironhorse, but my dilemma will remain the same, where am I supposed to go to actually see, touch and smell these new bikes? I bought the hollowpoint from bicyclebuys online, but my buddy already had one that I got to mess with. Where I live, as I told you before, there is not one reputable IH dealer. I travel some and everywhere I go I always look for Ironhorse. I have been all over Virginia, mountains of North Carolina, and Northeast Tennessee, and haven't seen a dealer that carries any full sus. bikes in stock. I do travel to the northeast a couple of times a year into the north jersey, NYC area. Is there anyplace there that would be good?
    I know the line doesn't come out for awhile, but I would like to make plans. Do you guys have a showroom on Long Island? I would make a special trip for that.
    I'm in a groove now, or is it a rut?

  15. #15
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    Zoom,

    Drop the Iron Horse sales dept a call at 800-645-5477 to find out what dealers might be stocking particular models. Here locally in the Northeast you will find a lot of stocking dealers. Off the top of my head, I know Performance stores will also be stocking dealers across the US. The sales dept will know better than me what dealers will stock each particular model.

    -ska todd

  16. #16
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    This does not really go with the thread but his is what concerns me with Iron Horse.

    The $1400 hollow point expert was weighing heavily on my mind. What is
    keeping me from it is the fact that Iron Horse is dumping the design.
    Also I believe is the reason the 2005 Iron Horse has such a late
    release date as compared to other companies is they want their retailers to
    get rid of as many 2004 Hollowpoints as they can so the retailers are
    not mad they were stuck with the 2004 bikes and be reluctant to buy into
    the 2005 and future line.

    What do you think?

  17. #17
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    If they meet the Dec/Jan timeline for '05, they're early compared to previous years. I didn't get my '03 until late March, and mine was amongst the first shipped. I didn't see the first '04s until they showed up at a local Performance in late March '04, when I posted this thread.

  18. #18
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    Well, I am atracted to the price of the current Hollowpoint, and I was very close to buying one. I decided to wait though and see what was down the road. I'm probably going to get the MKIII Comp now if the price and everything pans out like I hope. Otherwise I'll nab one of the remaining Hollowpoints. I don't think they are strugling to get rid of them... Supergo has actualy jacked their prices up on the expert model. Its pretty normal for local dealers to have a few previous model year bikes hanging around that they just put on clearance to sell. I really doubt that they are purposly delaying the MKIII, any delay is probably just from production delays... etc. Many brands don't roll out there bikes until the spring, so IH could also be early
    "Physics is timeless. Marketing and bs never lasts. Thats been proven time and time again."
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  19. #19
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    still nothing about weight of mkIII?

  20. #20
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    Its going to be similar to the 04 Hollowpoint. Expect it to be about 30 pounds.
    "Physics is timeless. Marketing and bs never lasts. Thats been proven time and time again."
    -Dave Weagle

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