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  1. #1
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    Yeti 575 vs. Ibis Mojo

    Anybody have the opportunity to ride the new carbon mojo? Geometry looks pretty similar to a 575, travel is pretty close and it uses the same RP23 that on the 575s now, as well as specing a 140mm fork which it seems is ideal for the 575. Just curious to hear if anybody has personal experience on both and what kind of comparisons can be drawn between the two bikes.

  2. #2
    In my mind, I can do it!
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboysen
    Anybody have the opportunity to ride the new carbon mojo? Geometry looks pretty similar to a 575, travel is pretty close and it uses the same RP23 that on the 575s now, as well as specing a 140mm fork which it seems is ideal for the 575. Just curious to hear if anybody has personal experience on both and what kind of comparisons can be drawn between the two bikes.
    I doubt you will find many who have written the Ibis since it is so new and still kind of difficut to get.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboysen
    Anybody have the opportunity to ride the new carbon mojo? Geometry looks pretty similar to a 575, travel is pretty close and it uses the same RP23 that on the 575s now, as well as specing a 140mm fork which it seems is ideal for the 575. Just curious to hear if anybody has personal experience on both and what kind of comparisons can be drawn between the two bikes.
    You may want to ask on the Ibis board or the Iron Horse board (since the Mojo and the IH both uses the DW link for suspension). It looks like the Mojo and the 575 carbon frames weigh about the same.

  4. #4
    EDR
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    never mind....forget i was here.

  5. #5
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    The mojo is sweet looking. However, I'm thinking that carbon frame will come at a higher price.
    National Athletic Trainers' Association, www.nata.org

  6. #6
    Mojo Rider
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    Holly Shiot. What more can I say. Took the Mojo out to Rockville
    (in Fairfield, CA) last Saturday and was just completely blown away. I
    thought the Blur was a great bike, but now I know what a great bike
    is. I was expecting great improvements on the down hill aggressive
    stuff. And it truly is much more like the Nomad once aimed down
    hill. However, where I was really surprised was on the ups. Techy
    very steep climbing stuff was so easy, the Mojo totally kept it's
    line and stay planted on the ground. And, in general, climbing is
    so crisp and efficient, with this bike I feel like a much stronger
    climber... Amazing!!!


  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboysen
    Anybody have the opportunity to ride the new carbon mojo? Geometry looks pretty similar to a 575, travel is pretty close and it uses the same RP23 that on the 575s now, as well as specing a 140mm fork which it seems is ideal for the 575. Just curious to hear if anybody has personal experience on both and what kind of comparisons can be drawn between the two bikes.
    Ibis Mojo certainly looks sweet, and I'd love to ride one but I'm just not sold on the idea of a carbon frame "all mountain" bike. My 575 takes a lot of abuse from rocks, falls, transport and carbon can be damaged by these types of things.

    I love my full carbon fiber road bike, its super compliant and light, but I'll take aluminum for blasting 25mph+ down the ski resort trails.

    Not trying to talk you out of a Mojo, if you can find one to test I'd say absolutely do it as it looks impressive in pics and on paper. I'm just trying to give you some food for thought about the potential drawbacks to it.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jdub
    Ibis Mojo certainly looks sweet, and I'd love to ride one but I'm just not sold on the idea of a carbon frame "all mountain" bike. My 575 takes a lot of abuse from rocks, falls, transport and carbon can be damaged by these types of things.

    I love my full carbon fiber road bike, its super compliant and light, but I'll take aluminum for blasting 25mph+ down the ski resort trails.

    Not trying to talk you out of a Mojo, if you can find one to test I'd say absolutely do it as it looks impressive in pics and on paper. I'm just trying to give you some food for thought about the potential drawbacks to it.
    The only mountainbike I've ever snapped was an AL bike (old-old Fisher Supercaliber, pre-Trek). I've used and abused (and still do) ti, steel, and carbon mountainbikes without problems. Up until the 575, I was riding a Fuel 100 (built stupid-light) and have crashed it a number of times in Moab, Fruita, Idaho, etc... without failure...
    Of course, YRMV and the durability of carbon (vs. AL) is probably more dependent on the manufacturer's design and QC than anything else...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipnidaho
    The only mountainbike I've ever snapped was an AL bike (old-old Fisher Supercaliber, pre-Trek). I've used and abused (and still do) ti, steel, and carbon mountainbikes without problems. Up until the 575, I was riding a Fuel 100 (built stupid-light) and have crashed it a number of times in Moab, Fruita, Idaho, etc... without failure...
    Of course, YRMV and the durability of carbon (vs. AL) is probably more dependent on the manufacturer's design and QC than anything else...
    Yeah I've snapped an aluminum mountain bike as well. Not trying to say that aluminum is immune to its problems, but I worry about how gracefully a carbon bike would take a fall into some jagged rocks.

    I don't worry about snapping it, more about scraping it badly in a crash/slow speed fall-over type accident. Maybe my concerns are not just, but just last weekend my Big Betty slammed a fist-sized rock into my downtube. It chipped the paint, but nothing more than a cosmetic problem. Would a carbon downtube been able to sustain that impact? I don't know, but its something I would seriously consider before buying a carbon bike.

  10. #10
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    Thanks for the replies guys, keep 'em comin! I'm curious to hear from Ibis as to what the Mojo's durability is supposed to be like. I agree that chucking the bike into a rock garden seems like it would cause more damage to the carbon frame than to an aluminum frame, but I think it's also possible the perceived damage would be much worse than it actually was.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboysen
    Thanks for the replies guys, keep 'em comin! I'm curious to hear from Ibis as to what the Mojo's durability is supposed to be like. I agree that chucking the bike into a rock garden seems like it would cause more damage to the carbon frame than to an aluminum frame, but I think it's also possible the perceived damage would be much worse than it actually was.
    Check out the Ibis web site www.ibisbicycles.com. They have a whole seciton on carbon technology, comparing it to other materials (al, Ti, ChroMo...). It sounds pretty darn strong. They also have a seciton on fixing Carbon, which is relatively easy to do. Reparis cost anywhere from $35 for small stuff to about $250 for something that would be a dead frame of any other material.

    I am not sure if I am selling the Mojo to you all or to myslef. But I took a chance. Baught this bike sight-un-seen, and now that I have it I am really happy. Nothing but smiles.

  12. #12
    Mojo Rider
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    Another thing I should mention is that the guys at Ibis are really cool. Definite small company mentality. They are easy to get in touch with, return calls and emails and care about their bikes and customers. That is a rare quality these days.

  13. #13
    Adobo Lover
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    The pricing isn't bad. I thought it would be more than 1899.
    National Athletic Trainers' Association, www.nata.org

  14. #14
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    that ibis looks cool..and yea, i try to support small companies as much as i can myself...

  15. #15
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    does it come in turquazee?yes i did it

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboysen
    Thanks for the replies guys, keep 'em comin! I'm curious to hear from Ibis as to what the Mojo's durability is supposed to be like. I agree that chucking the bike into a rock garden seems like it would cause more damage to the carbon frame than to an aluminum frame, but I think it's also possible the perceived damage would be much worse than it actually was.
    The durability and longevity of carbon is going to be dependent on the impact. I think that in certain cases it will outperform Aluminum, and in certain cases it won't.
    The carbon is ridiculously strong, we've been talking about making up a little video for the website showing us doing some really stupid things to a carbon frame with a baseball bat. We've been beating on a frame at the shop lately, and it's comical how hard you can hit it with no damage.
    In the real world, as flipnidaho said, YRMV. [I actually figured out what that means!]

    Some things to note:
    The Mojo has a polyurethane clearcoat. Compared to the carbon weave underneath, or for example an anodized layer on an aluminum frame, the clear is not as durable.
    But I don't think we're talking about scratches in this thread, more likely the big hits that can ruin a frame. And this is where I think carbon can fare very well, but again YRMV.
    If there is an impact big enough to crush the cured weave, I can assure you that the same impact on an aluminum frame will also cause damage. This is where we get into an argument that no one can answer definitively, as each crash or rock impact is going to be different, and therefore it's impossible to predict which material will behave better given all the possible scenarios. I don't have any hard data for this, but it is my experience that an impact big enough to seriously damage carbon will also seriously damage aluminum. That's a big huge gross generalization, but we're talking theoreticals here.
    I have crashed so hard on my Mojo, watched it careen into a huge rock with sickening hollow sounding carbon crushing thud, that I thought for sure I'd be walking home. I was amazed that all I saw was a scratch in the clear coat (hint: touch 'em up with nail polish). That's one crash, so only one data point. I really did think I ruined the frame though as I lay on the ground and watched it peg that rock.

    Here's what we do know once that happens once either frame gets damaged.
    Carbon: You should definitely get the carbon repaired, and here's the good part, it is repairable as zrymland pointed out, quite possibly for a reasonable sum. True it won't look like new but it will be as strong as new.
    Aluminum: Generally, if an aluminum frame is damaged to the point of needing repair, you'll just throw away the triangle (or swingarm as the case may be) and get a new one. That is because to replace an aluminum tube is a pain. Then you have to heat treat the entire triangle after a new tube is welded in which is a pain. And deal with cable stops. And deal with ano or paint. So by the time you've cut out the old tube replaced it and all the weld-ons or cable stop things, heat treated again and refinished, you're probably better off buying a new triangle anyway.

    If a carbon monocoque is damaged beyond repair, like aluminum you will also need to replace the whole triangle or swingarm. Same same in this case.

    We offer a "no fault' crash replacement warranty where we will replace the frame or swingarm at a nominal charge if you 'run out of talent' in spectacular, frame-crushing fashion.

    cheers,
    Chuck Ibis

  17. #17
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    i'm liking the price tag on the ibis frameset. so now i'm trying to figger out the ideal fork for that bike. the pike coil/575 i currently own has sweet geometry all-round for the rocky trail riding i tend to do...i think the HA on the ibis mojo is 69 degrees, which is a little steeper than the yeti 575, so i'm thinking i'd want a 150 or 160 mm fork on the mojo to keep the HA slack enough for my tastes. but i don't like the high-hassle servicing on the Talas 36. and i want travel adjust. perhaps the 2007 marz AM SL1 is the ideal fork for the mojo...sub 5 lbs, travel adjust from 120 to 160 mm.

    or i could just put the 140 mm coil pike on the ibis, since i own that fork already.

    zrymland, i assume your positive review was for a 2007 160 mm travel fox 36 talas / mojo?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by frorider
    i'm liking the price tag on the ibis frameset. so now i'm trying to figger out the ideal fork for that bike. the pike coil/575 i currently own has sweet geometry all-round for the rocky trail riding i tend to do...i think the HA on the ibis mojo is 69 degrees, which is a little steeper than the yeti 575, so i'm thinking i'd want a 150 or 160 mm fork on the mojo to keep the HA slack enough for my tastes. but i don't like the high-hassle servicing on the Talas 36. and i want travel adjust. perhaps the 2007 marz AM SL1 is the ideal fork for the mojo...sub 5 lbs, travel adjust from 120 to 160 mm.

    or i could just put the 140 mm coil pike on the ibis, since i own that fork already.

    zrymland, i assume your positive review was for a 2007 160 mm travel fox 36 talas / mojo?
    My build is with the new 07 Fox Talas 32 (100 - 140 mm adjustable). At 100mm you can climb up a tree. At 140 my head angle is 69 degrees which is just fine for me and I do some pretty aggresive down hill stuff. The bike seems setup just right. It is quick and responsive yet not twitchy and holds a line beautifully even through very aggresive rock gardens and baby heads. You can see my whole build on the Ibis Mojo Build thread.

    I don't know if the Talas 36 would be too much on the Mojo or not. I would like to give it a try, but for me I like the lighter front end of the 32. Either way I think you are going to love the frame.

  19. #19
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    First off i have a 575 and an Ibis, but my Ibis is a 1984 trials bike.

    I love both of these bikes. The bigger differences are probably in the pivot location and the progression rate of the suspension that you will feel when riding the two than the visual and material differences.

    Both bikes are 6.2 lbs but the 575 with a carbon swingarm is actually lighter at 5.9 lbs. The Yeti is a bit less expensive and Yeti can get damages and repairs taken care of more quickly.

    Both are fairly tough for how light they are and can both be damaged in a crash.

    So down to the differences.
    The Ibis uses DW link suspension which has a firmer feel under pedaling than the 575. This is good and bad. If you are man enough to middle ring most climbs the Mojo's suspension gives a great quick yet active feel. For the rest of us who climb big mountains in the granny ring there is a bit of noticeable pedal feedback in a 22t ring. This makes the bike firm up and grip hard while climbing steeps. However if the climb consists of loose, rocky, stair steppy sections the pedal feedback makes for a little herky jerky sensation that can cause stalling and spitting of rocks by the rear wheel. This feel is highly personal, and some will love it and others may have issues.
    The 575's pivot location is nestled right between the 22 and 32 t rings. This offers very mild chain torque when in the granny and a hair soft in the middle ring.The chain torque is so mild that it cannot really be felt as pedal feedback but does occasionally spit out rocks. This location is a happy medium that makes many people satisfied.It may not have as ideal of a wheelpath when in the middle ring campared to the Ibis but no one comes back from a test ride with any question about pedaling over rocks.
    So why does the 575 mysteriously pedal so great if the pivot is below the 32t ring? The answer is in the shock compression ratio that has been discussed many times here on the Yeti board before.
    Where ibis chooses a little chain torque to gain quick accelaratoin Yeti chooses a unique falling- to -rising rate compression rate to get a bit of firmness at the sag point. This little bit of firmness keeps the bike from sogging down as pedal pressure is applied. When a significant bump is hit the yeti sinks into a softer part of the travel and then eventually ramps up at the end to resist bottoming. This offers the famous 575 feel that is like a 4" bike while cruising up a climb and a 6" bike when rallying faster trails.
    Both systems are great. If you are thinking the Ibis is like a Heckler type semi active ride it is not. The chain torque is mild enough that many may not even notice it. Also, since the Ibis does have a bit of chain torque they can run the shock compression rate a little softer for a smoother ride over small bumps. This i do not know for sure since i have only ridden the bike for about 10 minutes. Perhaps Mr Chuck can enlighten us even further about his little wonder bike he has crafted.

    For the moment i will stay on the 575, but the mojo could be in my future.
    Krispy
    Currently enjoying life Giant Trance Advanced 27.5/Rockshox Pike/Sram XX1
    Giant STP

  20. #20
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    I've been eyeing the 575 for some time now and was ready to pounce on a Team Turquoise with carbon stays when I noticed that the Ibis Mojo was only around $200 more !

    Needless to say, I've put a deposit down on the Mojo and I'm supposedly the first person in Calgary who's supposed to get it.

    This isn't to say that the 575 is completely off my mind. I'll be looking to replace my second mountain bike in the future and I'd love to have that turquoise beast sitting next to the Mojo.

  21. #21
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    zrymland

    What kind of seatpost is that?
    Nice bike....I almost got one through wrenchscience, but the wait was gonna be too long.

    BTW, that techy analysis by Krispy was great.

  22. #22
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    575 vs Mojo saga continues

    After reading all the posts here I am even more confused about which would be the better bike. The reason I a moving from my Titus switchblade is to get something that descends abit better, I don’t require a downhill machine plushness. What bike descends better , the 575 or the Ibis, from what I can gather is the Ibis climbs better, and is lighter, but at almost $300 more will there be a big enough jump in descending stability to justify the price?

    I think both are very sweet looking bikes, and since test riding is not a option i really need to rely on the info I get here.

    Thanks

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DH_WP
    After reading all the posts here I am even more confused about which would be the better bike. The reason I a moving from my Titus switchblade is to get something that descends abit better, I donít require a downhill machine plushness. What bike descends better , the 575 or the Ibis, from what I can gather is the Ibis climbs better, and is lighter, but at almost $300 more will there be a big enough jump in descending stability to justify the price?

    I think both are very sweet looking bikes, and since test riding is not a option i really need to rely on the info I get here.

    Thanks
    Titus made the Switchblade head angle steeper a 2 or 3 years ago, quickening steering to better match the common 4.25 inch travel used.

    If you have one of the earlier original model Switchblades before the later head angle change, the handing of the early Switchblade set up with the long rockers for 5.25 rear travel and the same fork on the Mojo would handle close to the same. I don't recall the BB height of the SB, the Mojo is probably a bit lower at 13 inches at top out with 2.1 tires making the Ibis most stable descending.

    The 575 has a slacker head angle, about 68 degrees compared to the Mojoís and early SBís 69 degrees with 140mm fork. The 575 has fewer size options and should be sized larger rather than smaller than your current bike if not the same for a more stable descending bike than the SB. But the Ibis is more nimble handling, which helps in maintaining stability a bit better in tight downhill transitions than both other bikes.

    The Mojo is worth much more than the 575 or SB in overall value, it is light in frame weight but also built very strong to be a more versatile bike, which can be set up as XC racer to all but the most severe Freeride and DH.

  24. #24
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    575 or Mojo?

    I owned a 575 for 1.5 years and now own a Mojo. Overall, I like the Mojo much more. For descending the Mojo feels more plush. I know this is hard to believe since the 575 is already pretty plush. I think the DW link works substantially better on square-edged hits and the Mojo has more of a bottomless sensation.

    There is no doubt that the Mojo exhibits far less pedal-induced bob as the DW link is truly amazing in this department. I've owned 15 full-suspension bikes since the early 1990s and this design is a very noticeable improvement over everything else that I've ever tried.

    We will see about the carbon durability in the long run. I have owned a full-suspension carbon race bike (Giant NRS) and had no issues with the carbon in that case. I believe the carbon fiber and more specifically the Mojo lay-up/design make this bike exceptionally stiff laterally. I think the Mojo frame actually steers much better than the 575 and is way less flexy. This is one feature that has really surprised me. I notice much less deflection going through rock gardens and very bumpy section. I also think that the carbon fiber does take-out some of the very small bump buzz, similar to what you experience on a good carbon road bike.

    Don't get me wrong, I think the Yeti 575 is an excellent bike, but I do think the Mojo is superior in just about every way. I do feel more in control in very dicey situations on the Mojo. The only advantage to the 575 is that you can find them used and fairly cheap. However, considering the quality offered in the Mojo, it is a real bargain for the price. Also, the Ibis customer service is fantastic! I hope this helps your decision.

  25. #25
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    Thanks, I have never ridden a 575, so cant really comment on the plushness, but people have been raving about it, if this is better then my mind is made up, think I will wait the extra 2 months and get the Mojo then....

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