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Thread: UST vs Stans

  1. #1
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    UST vs Stans

    My new SL is my first bike with tubeless ready wheels, and I'd appreciate some advice. I am running XT wheels and Kenda non-UST tires. I initially built the bike up using tubes just to get going, but I'd like to switch over to tubeless. Would I be better off buying UST tires or using the tires I have with Stans?

    Pardon my ignorance, but do you use any sealant at all using UST tires and rims? Thanks for any help and advice.

  2. #2
    Amphibious Technologies
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    Yes, UST on UST is best. Stans makes them even better. IME
    "The best you've ridden is the best you know" - Paul Thede, Race Tech

  3. #3
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    I'm also wanting to take advantage of my tubeless wheel set. Has anyone tried the new Ust Kendas yet? They are a dual tread compound 26x2.35 tire.

    Straw

  4. #4
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    Search the Wheels.. Forum there’s much about tubeless setups there. Also check Shiggy’s Tire site: http://mtbtires.com/

    I’ve found that UST rims really only work tubeless very well with UST tire beads. If you want the lightest UST tires, look for the TR (Tubeless Ready) models with light casings which need sealant to hold air, Bontreager and a couple other brands I can’t remember now have these TR type tires.

    I’ve had a few problems with non-tubelss tires with Stans sealant using UST rims. The normal beads don’t seat and seal very well against metal (rims-strips can’t fit to the sidewall), so tires burp rather easily cornering and off camber without higher tire pressures than what tubeless is all about.

    I’m having zero problems with lower tire pressures for XC/AM riding conditions using non-UST rims with Stan’s rim-strips, and sealant using non-UST tires. The thick rubber rimstrips are light weight and seal to the bead perfectly so far. I imagine they also could burp under very hard cornering on good traction with low tire pressures. Be smart with your tire pressures depending on conditions.

    Carry a tube (and a few glueless patches for the tube). You will get tubeless flats, but it’s very, very rare.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by daryder
    My new SL is my first bike with tubeless ready wheels, and I'd appreciate some advice. I am running XT wheels and Kenda non-UST tires. I initially built the bike up using tubes just to get going, but I'd like to switch over to tubeless. Would I be better off buying UST tires or using the tires I have with Stans?

    Pardon my ignorance, but do you use any sealant at all using UST tires and rims? Thanks for any help and advice.
    I love USTs vs. Stans, if you go with a UST tire toss a couple cups of Stans sealant in there anyhow. You want to add it every 4-6 months since it dries up. If you get a hole most times the Stans will clear it up, if not like the other person said carry a tube and shove it in.

  6. #6
    Grams Light Bikes
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    Hmmm, I disagree, it takes a bit more time but I always use normal tubes on my UST rims. You have a lot more variety of tires and you can save weight if done properly.

    I wrote a couple of blog posts on the subject (refer to the bottom of this post). I have been using the tubeless method on my Mavic SL Crossmax for over a year and have never had an issue. Not all tires work well with the tubeless method, check out Stans website for info on tires that work. I use Maxxis and Schwalbe tires myself.

    Again they can take a bit more time to set up compared to the easy pop on of a UST tire but once they're on everything is fine. All UST and Tubeless set ups leak a bit more air then their tubed counterparts over say a couple of days time.

    Tricks of the trade:

    1) pre-inflate your tire with a tube and let sit a bit to stretch out the carcass
    2) put in whatever tubeless kit you want to use, for example Eclipse tubeless UST kit or Stans rim strips
    3) get a bucket of soapy water (1/4 cup of liquid dish soap to 2 cups of water) and put on the tire, lube up the space between the tire bead and rim with the soapy solution
    4) using a high pressure tank or air compressor (suggest 70-90 lbs) inflate the tire, it should pop up on the rim
    5) let sit for a bit
    6) deflate the tire and pour in the sealant (Stans seems to work the best), I like to remove the removable stem core and pour the solution in using Stans Injector (as a funnel)
    7) inflate the tire again (again with high pressure) and then holding the wheel in its normal position slosh it back and forth, rotate 15 degrees and repeat all the way around the wheel
    8) place the wheel flat on a box so that it sits parallel to the ground, wait 5-10 minutes
    9) repeat 7 and 8 for the other side of the tire
    10) repeats the steps for the other tire, or do them sequentially like I do

    Stans installation method

    Grams -The tubeless tire world

    Grams -Tires tires they are tired

  7. #7
    MOJO BICHU
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    I`m with ust kenda navegal 2.1 with specific sealant, about last 6 mounths, i loved. I put them lower pressure than in stans, and never had an issue. i ride in very agressive places (rocks etc..) .

  8. #8
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    I have 3.5 years on a set of stans 350 gram rims. works great with tube type nevegals, xc pros and
    now schwalbe smart sams. just add a cup of stans every 3 months or so if the tire lasts
    that long.
    Mitch
    Boise

  9. #9
    LA CHÈVRE
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    Quote Originally Posted by bichu du matu
    I`m with ust kenda navegal 2.1 with specific sealant, about last 6 mounths, i loved. I put them lower pressure than in stans, and never had an issue. i ride in very agressive places (rocks etc..) .
    MY EYES!

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous
    MY EYES!

    +1 and LMAO

    KN

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by bichu du matu
    I`m with ust kenda navegal 2.1 with specific sealant, about last 6 mounths, i loved. I put them lower pressure than in stans, and never had an issue. i ride in very agressive places (rocks etc..) .
    What do yo mean by "specific sealant"?

  12. #12
    Grams Light Bikes
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    I assume he means Stans sealant or something of that variety. Of course by Kenda
    directions you can't use any sealant, it voids their warranty.

    This is Kenda's website:

    ATTENTION KENDA VALUED CUSTOMERS
    KENDA DOES NOT ENDORSE THE USE OF ANY FLUID BASED SEALANT PRODUCTS IN KENDA TUBE TYPE OR TUBELESS TYPE TIRES. USE OF ANY FLUID BASED PRODUCT IN KENDA TIRES WILL BE AT YOUR OWN RISK AND WILL VOID ANY WARRANTY CLAIMS.

    Schwalbe Tires (which I use) has the same party line:

    Warranty Disclaimer

    The use of “self-sealing” products and/or aftermarket “sealant” systems for the purpose of converting a non-tubeless tire to tubeless, used either on non-UST rims or UST rims, will void any warranty given by the tire manufacturer.
    The use of “self-sealing” products may over time degrade the interior wall of tires, especially non-tubeless tires, resulting in a blistering of the tread and surface layer on the exterior of the tire. This is not a manufacturing defect but the result of an incompatibility of the sealant with the rubber compound and therefore not considered a warranty issue.

  13. #13
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    I roll on Schwalbe tube type converted to tubeless. I love it but have had a few burping issues and one RR delaminated on me.
    A bicycle will take you to fantastic places....if you let it.


    Ibis fan since '08 now rolling on the big wheeled Ripley.

  14. #14
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    I have used the non UST Kendas for years with Stans sealant and have never had a problem.I have never seen any deterioration on the inside of the tire.Just my experience.
    milesW

  15. #15
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    I have just ordered 2 Maxxis High Rollers 2.35 UST for my mojo. It's that time of year when I can ride on the frozen snow and 2.35's definately hold me up better on the snow. I was hoping to try the Kenda Nevegal 2.35 UST but according to an email from them they will not have them until April. That would mean May for me by the time I could get them to Canada. I'll post a pic when I get them on.
    Straw

  16. #16
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    bump

    What's the verdict? UST, or sealant on normal?

  17. #17
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    5+ years on my USTs and a couple cups of stan's sealant at the start of the season, never had a flat and only one blowout on a very sharp rock with old tires.

  18. #18
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    stans arch rims..

    standard kenda tires - nevegal 2.5 (big tire) and small block 8 (2.35)

    initial setup to seal the pin holes/bead takes a little patience...but, if i can do it..anyone can do it.

    put a couple scoops of stans in the tires....we have goatheads here...i've had a few goatheads puncture...but, a quick spin and the stans seals 'em back up..

    check your pressure before each ride....

    if you hear a burp while riding/cornering/etc.. inspect and add some more air...

    light and cheap...

  19. #19
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    Just finished 2nd season on UST rims and UST Highrollers with 2 scoops of Stan's each year. Had a very slow leak for awhile this summer. Just put more air in, took tire off one day and there was a big fat thorn in the tire. Stan's did its thing.

    When the UST Highrollers wear out I am going to put regular HR's on with Stans to keep the weight down.
    Straw

  20. #20
    Church of the Wheel
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    UST or regular tires with Stans is a false dichotomy because there are more choices.

    My personal favorite is Tubeless Ready (not UST) tires with Stans. This combo gives you a UST bead (better tubeless seal than regular beads) but without the full UST weight, the added puncture resistance of Stans, and peace of mind that your tire was designed to work with sealant, unlike some regular tires that can be problematic. And if you decide you want a tube in there, it works fine too, just like a regular tire.

    I still don't understand why all tire manufacturers aren't jumping on the Tubeless Ready bandwagon. For most of them the difference is just adding a UST bead to the regular tires they already make.
    "I thought you'd never love me without my Mojo." -Austin Powers

  21. #21
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    Caffelatex vs Stan's

    Hi;
    Thinking of going tubeless.
    Has anyone used Caffelatex vs Stan's?
    They claim no Ammonia and foaming so it seals sidewall punctures better
    What are the downsides? They recommend 100ml for the bigger 29er tires - is that more than Stan's/
    Thanks

  22. #22
    flow where ever you go
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gotta Know
    bump

    What's the verdict? UST, or sealant on normal?
    The verdict is that Stans wins on weight and performance but ONLY IF you don't mind the extra work, time, and learning curve. Some standard tires are MUCH easier/or/harder to set up with Stans than others and you have to experiment or search out and trust other people's advice. This takes more time than simply buying UST labeled tires for a UST rim. The pay off is that when it works, it works great! and saves a lot of weight! and you can run very low air pressures.

    If you would rather have ease of use, more predictable results with less fuss, and more weight, then go UST/UST.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  23. #23
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    It is possible to mount UST Tire on a Crest Rim??? What types of problems it will bring?? Is the "fitting" of a UST on a STANS secure?? similar to UST-UST??

  24. #24
    Proud bike-o-holic
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    Quote Originally Posted by agnello
    Hi;
    Thinking of going tubeless.
    Has anyone used Caffelatex vs Stan's?
    They claim no Ammonia and foaming so it seals sidewall punctures better
    What are the downsides? They recommend 100ml for the bigger 29er tires - is that more than Stan's/
    Thanks
    I think that the general consensus is that Stan´s way better than latex.

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