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  1. #1
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    Protect your frame

    Just a heads up to current and future Mojo owners. The finish on the nude carbon will scratch and wear through pretty easily. It's a very good idea to use some kind of clear protection, especially in high wear areas. The crew at Ibis includes some clear protection stickers, so make sure you use them. But even these are not enough. I applied a product called BONK protection film to the larger areas of the frame and it seems to do the trick.
    After a few months of use, my frame is definitely showing some serious nicks and scratches. Not a knock by any means. Scot and co. have posted here on the frames' durability and the steps that should be taken to protect it.
    Force yourself to take the time and apply this stuff (tough to do when you could be riding it!) But it is definitely worth it...

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbexx
    Just a heads up to current and future Mojo owners. The finish on the nude carbon will scratch and wear through pretty easily. It's a very good idea to use some kind of clear protection, especially in high wear areas. The crew at Ibis includes some clear protection stickers, so make sure you use them. But even these are not enough. I applied a product called BONK protection film to the larger areas of the frame and it seems to do the trick.
    After a few months of use, my frame is definitely showing some serious nicks and scratches. Not a knock by any means. Scot and co. have posted here on the frames' durability and the steps that should be taken to protect it.
    Force yourself to take the time and apply this stuff (tough to do when you could be riding it!) But it is definitely worth it...
    Sounds like good advice. Any info on where to get BONK?
    For max protection under a few high wear cable areas, I used little adhesive carbon fiber pathes that are made by Token, and available from a few sellers on eBay. They come with a Token logo, but a quick swipe with acetone removed the logo leaving a nice strong protective patch that doesn't look out of place on the carbon frame. The patches that Ibis provided are almost invisible when installed, but I'm not sure how long they will last under high-rub areas.
    Also, has anyone fitted a Lizard Skin to the chainstay? If so, what size worked?

  3. #3
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    Couple earlier suggestions from deep in the Mojo Build thread:

    noshortcuts:
    This clear tape looks good for these protective purposes: http://www.findtape.com/shop/product.aspx?id=173&bc=F
    Outdoor grade, clear, no yellowing, and protective.

    Tall Tom:
    In regard to protective films, we have used a 3M product called "Leading Edge Tape". This stuff is used to protect airplane wings, so I'm pretty confident that it's up to the task of protecting a mountain bike. It's available from aircraft supply companies such as Aircraft Spruce: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...ngedgetape.php
    in 100 ft rolls. It's kind of expensive, but 1 roll will probably last you a lifetime.

    Also I found a $4 small roll of 3M car upholstery clear tape at a car parts store (Kragan in San Rafael) that seems to hold up very well to cable rub (unlike most other cheap plastic tape which wears out quickly).

    Rather than wrapping the stays, I'm using double sided tape to hold shaped scissor snips of inner tube onto the chain and rear stays to eliminate chain slap noises and protect the stays. My Mojo is very quiet now even in very rocky conditions.

  4. #4
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    I found that Specialized makes a chain stay protector big enough to fit around the chainstay. The two seem to get along quite well together.

    Also durring a 6 hour race last week I noticed the bottom of the bottom bracket was taking a beating from my chain if I left it in granny gear during desents. (It was 6 hours and I got tired... sue me for running the granny gear.) So I stuck a peice of velcro over the affected area and it worked just fine. It was just the soft fabric side with sticky tape on the back.

  5. #5
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    Can you post pic's of the affected areas, & of what you did? Which Spec model chain stay protecter?

  6. #6
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    Here's a link to that bonk product I referenced. Most of the online stores have it, pricepoint is where I purchased. The stuff Tom referenced is really expensive, but probably is bulletproof. Price per square inch may actually be the same, it's just that this is sold in a smaller size. This is a 3M product as well, so it should last a long time.

    http://www.bonkprotection.com/index_flash.html

  7. #7
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    Don

  8. #8
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    After reading this post I put carefully-trimmed black protective tape on the side of the headtube wherever housing could rub during handlebar turning and/or suspension action which causes housing to go up and down. Can't even see the protector on the frame!

    I took an old thin road inner tube and tightly wrapped the chainstay and secured it with black electrician's tape; again, can't even tell it's there! The bike was super quiet before, and I'm sure it'll go to the next level of stealthness now.

    And I put a thin layer of protection on the underside of the downtube.

    Quiet, lightweight and durable. I know mtb riding is not about keeping things clean and "pretty," but if I can preserve the frame I will.

  9. #9
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    3m motorcycle fuel tank protector kit. It's the right quantity, cheap, very thin and will fold around curves very easily.

  10. #10
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    good one

    Quote Originally Posted by Hud
    3m motorcycle fuel tank protector kit. It's the right quantity, cheap, very thin and will fold around curves very easily.
    where is it found? Is it common in motorcycle stores or online?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by noshortcuts
    where is it found? Is it common in motorcycle stores or online?
    Google search & surf found this 3M Paint Protection Kit for bicycles:
    $25 online. 2" x 48" plus 1" x 48"

    http://www.empireclearshield.com/sit...roduct/PPFbike

  12. #12
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    better yet

    Quote Originally Posted by derby
    Google search & surf found this 3M Paint Protection Kit for bicycles:
    $25 online. 2" x 48" plus 1" x 48"

    http://www.empireclearshield.com/sit...roduct/PPFbike
    I did google for it but had "motorcycle" in the terms and did not find much, and not this.

    This seems good because it has 1" and 2" tape in the kit, which is great for the intended purpose - bicycles!

    It appears to be an identical product to BONK but with 1 and 2 inch tape instead of 2" and 4".

  13. #13
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    He gads, this is the deal to go for

    http://www.findtape.com/shop/product.aspx?id=173&bc=F

    I have used it all over the bike. A great product. 1 inch x 30 feet for $15

    Covered about 75% of the rear triangle in it and the bottom of the down tube. And its easy to cut and it bends pretty well.


  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by derby
    Google search & surf found this 3M Paint Protection Kit for bicycles:
    $25 online. 2" x 48" plus 1" x 48"

    http://www.empireclearshield.com/sit...roduct/PPFbike
    I wonder what the application solution is ? Soap water ?

  15. #15
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    Mojo protection

    Quote Originally Posted by MJ51
    Sounds like good advice. Any info on where to get BONK?
    For max protection under a few high wear cable areas, I used little adhesive carbon fiber pathes that are made by Token, and available from a few sellers on eBay. They come with a Token logo, but a quick swipe with acetone removed the logo leaving a nice strong protective patch that doesn't look out of place on the carbon frame. The patches that Ibis provided are almost invisible when installed, but I'm not sure how long they will last under high-rub areas.
    Also, has anyone fitted a Lizard Skin to the chainstay? If so, what size worked?
    Hey MJ51 try specializeds chainstay protector. All the Lizard skin protectors didn't fit, at least all the ones at the bike shop. They had Specialized stay protectors and I have the biggest enduro one they had and it works great a perfect fit.

  16. #16
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    Here is a pic of my Mojo, I used the leather carbon lizard skin chain stay protector, I also added one small piece right behind the chainrings and under the chainstay, that took care of any chain slap I was getting, the main noise was the chain hitting that lower spot, with the twist in the chainstay and the drive trains geometry the top of the chainstay doesn't seem to get slapped as much.

    I put lots of tape on any place that might get scratched...I took a huge digger on Tuesday and the frame made a monster hit square on a rock and all it did was peel the tape, amazing.

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    Last edited by pastajet; 12-14-2006 at 04:22 PM.

  17. #17
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    This might be worth a try as well. Im going to order 2 diff rolls to see if the colored one or standard black looks better.

    http://www.mcmaster.com/nav/enter.as...pe=&catnum=113

    goto catalog page 772 and hit enter.

  18. #18
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    I know this is an older thread but I was digging around in anticipation of receiving my mojo and found this product.

    http://www.veloskin.com/products.html

    Looks like you can get a decent kit for $21.95.

  19. #19
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    Another option that looks good from the moto world:

    http://www.tapeworks.com/Surface%20P...ctionFilm.html

  20. #20
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    I went to my local automotive window tint/body shop and picked up a slice of 3M ClearBra material. Kinda expensive, but it works pretty well and was easy to manipulate. Plus, it becomes pretty much invisible, even on my Guiness Foam frame. But I missed a spot on my chainstay that I thought was protected by my neoprene chainstay guard. The finish doesn't appear to be very durable unproteced, I'm afraid... and after ten miles or so I managed to chew through the clear, the paint, and in a smaller patch the base layer- OUCH! On my first ride!
    **** censorship

  21. #21
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    I was actually able to score 30 ft of 2.5in and 30ft of 1.5in off of ebay for 14.99. Talk about a deal!

  22. #22
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    Chainstay Protection Handlebar Tape

    Quote Originally Posted by MJ51
    Also, has anyone fitted a Lizard Skin to the chainstay? If so, what size worked?
    For the chainstay I decided to give a try to road bike handlebar tape. I picked a fake carbon variety on E-bay for a few dollars and here it goes. It looks very good (better then in the photo, it blends in with the frame), can be applied very easily and in layers if you want to (you just have to cut it in strips corresponding to the 3M tape) and works perfectly: not a blip of noise from the chainstays It came with a pair of nice "carbon" handlebar plugs that actually look nice on the bike and look sturdy, better then the original overengineered "LOVE" plugs by Azonic

    PS sorry for the weightweenie scale! but I did save 19 grams!!!!
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    Last edited by Davide; 04-12-2007 at 08:18 AM.

  23. #23
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    Just finished building my bike, and after trying out multiple different chainstay guards with unsatisfactory results, I decided to make my own. I think overall it came out pretty good considering I hand stitched it. I used two chainstay guards and a chunk of old tube to make it. I used the tube along the inside of the dropout so it would conform to the stay and clear the chain when it is in the highest gear. I placed some double sided tape on the inside of the frame before installing the guard so the rubber will be held firmly to the conturs of the frame. I spoke to the guy's at ibis at the sea otter and they said they are working with lizard skins on a proprietary guard. Until then I think this one should work pretty well.
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  24. #24
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    I look forward to the proprietary guard, good job on your custom one session.

  25. #25
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    There's a lot of good information regarding some sources for paint protection film but does anyone have any updates regarding their effectiveness?

    ie. Is the standard 8mil good enough? Or should I go thicker? Any peeling taking place?

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbon Ken
    There's a lot of good information regarding some sources for paint protection film but does anyone have any updates regarding their effectiveness?

    ie. Is the standard 8mil good enough? Or should I go thicker? Any peeling taking place?
    I don't think thicker would be helpful except maybe on the chain stay if you use the tape for protection from chain suck. For this, I use the attached metal plate, one carbon chainstay protector, and a bit of electrical tape between the two.

    The 8 mil from findtape.com works perfectly, especially for large areas. It holds up excellently, cleans easily, repels rocks and normal abrasions, and is not noticeable visually. As long as the edges of the tape are on a relatively flat area and not bent over an edge, the tape does not peel. It does peel off nicely by giving it a start with your finger nail.

    I have had some bunching with the round tape that came with the Mojo. It starts to slide and fold from constant cable rub. I might try a larger patch of the 8mil in it's place.
    Last edited by noshortcuts; 04-25-2007 at 12:11 AM.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  27. #27
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    I also have used the findtape stuff and its worked fine. Almost have the rear triangle completely covered with it. No peeling in almost a years use. Hit the tape hard with a sharp rock and it does gouge but its better to replace the gouged tape then to get dings in the clearcoat or carbon fiber. You do not notice the tape unless you look extremely close. The .8 mil is fine. Makes it easier to work on the swooping arcs of the frames bends, especially in the round sections of the rear triangle.

  28. #28
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    Hey, thanks for that findtape link.

    That looks like an indispensable site.

  29. #29
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    Thanks for the update.

    I just ordered a roll from findtape.

    Any Mojo riders from Calgary are welcome to drop by and grab a feet or two of my tape.

  30. #30
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    Buying tape - what size?

    About to buy some tape from find tape and just looking for guidance from those who have used it. Should I buy the 1" wide or 2" wide roll? Or do I need one of each - wider for downtube and narrower for rear triangle?

    Any thoughts are appreciated.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by phat_tony
    About to buy some tape from find tape and just looking for guidance from those who have used it. Should I buy the 1" wide or 2" wide roll? Or do I need one of each - wider for downtube and narrower for rear triangle?

    Any thoughts are appreciated.
    2" works great. It cuts easily too.

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  32. #32
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    Here's some tape that looks like it was designed for this kind of application

    http://www.findtape.com/product171/I...d=2&info=tough

  33. #33
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    I like the 1 inch size, fits the chainstays perfectly, the 4 inch might be a bit much to work with?

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gregg K
    Here's some tape that looks like it was designed for this kind of application

    http://www.findtape.com/product171/I...d=2&info=tough
    I thought that was what we were talking about already.... Oh, wait, that is the "indoor grade". I use the "outdoor grade" to insure no yellowing. The link to the outdoor grade is on the same page under "related products".

    Quote Originally Posted by pastajet
    "I like the 1 inch size, fits the chainstays perfectly, the 4 inch might be a bit much to work with?"
    Either would work fine. The 2 inch fits two sides of the chainstays at one time and fits the downtube perfectly for complete protection from the front tire throwing rocks.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  35. #35
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    I use 3M clear bra material. I got it from my local auto body/glass outfit. It's kinda pricey at $10 per square foot, but it has the advantage of being able to move it and position it on the surface it's being applied to. Plus, it's almost invisible once it's on.
    Seems to be pretty durable too (it's made to deflect rocks at 75mph, right?).
    edit: I guess I already mentioned this earlier. On my first frame I just peeled the 3M and slapped it on the frame. The trick that I learned for the second go-round was to spray the surface with soap and water which is the key to the workability of the material.
    **** censorship

  36. #36
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    Stop the Noise!

    Maybe I'm beating a dead horse here, but has anyone found an elegant solution for reducing chain slap noise while simultaneously protecting the frame? (At least while we wait for Ibis deliver the solution they are evidently discussing with Lizard Skins.) These clear tape ideas above are great for protection from dings (I just ordered some), but they don't really help reduce chain slap NOISE.

    I installed an old large neoprene chainstay protector I had, but it's not long enough and still leaves some chainstay exposed. And the chain also slaps the seat stay sometimes, so maybe I need to buy a protector for that too? Davide seems to have a good idea that isn't ugly (Protect your frame, but not sure how well bar tape would hold up against chain abuse.

    Any specific noise reduction ideas appreciated (besides just turning up my ipod)---and photos/links/specific product names welcome!

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by getbusyliving
    Maybe I'm beating a dead horse here, but has anyone found an elegant solution for reducing chain slap noise while simultaneously protecting the frame? (At least while we wait for Ibis deliver the solution they are evidently discussing with Lizard Skins.) These clear tape ideas above are great for protection from dings (I just ordered some), but they don't really help reduce chain slap NOISE.

    I installed an old large neoprene chainstay protector I had, but it's not long enough and still leaves some chainstay exposed. And the chain also slaps the seat stay sometimes, so maybe I need to buy a protector for that too? Davide seems to have a good idea that isn't ugly (Protect your frame, but not sure how well bar tape would hold up against chain abuse.

    Any specific noise reduction ideas appreciated (besides just turning up my ipod)---and photos/links/specific product names welcome!
    I wonder if you are using too much chain and / or a Shimano rear der.? Expensive, but using a Sram XO rear derailleur solves it. No chain slap at all unless maybe you leave it in an uphill gear ratio while flying down a nasty downhill. Cheaper is to wrap multiple layers of electrical tape on areas still getting hit. It's not noticable on naked carbon and should look ok on painted. That's all my ideas for now.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  38. #38
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    I have a Shimano drivetrain with a 11/32 cogset and I have a small piece of lizards skins carbon leather chainstay protector located the bottom front by the small chainring in addition to about a 6 inch piece on top of the chainstay. I do not have that much noise and it has never hit the seat stay. Something seems wrong with you the chain line or perhaps to much chain. I get some noise but nothing thats beyond reason and I hardly notice it and I really hate any annoying nosies coming from by bike.

  39. #39
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    Interesting that you get little chain slap even on bumpy stuff. I'm running SRAM X9, and almost never use granny gear, certainly never downhill. I may be wrong on the occasional seatstay slap, but it's definitely making too much noise on chainstay. I'd be surprised if I have too much chain---since my LBS that assembled it is very detail oriented, and all shifting is smooth. But I guess it's possible. How can I tell if I'm running too much chain (besides chain slap)?

  40. #40
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    chain slap noise reduction

    Quote Originally Posted by getbusyliving
    How can I tell if I'm running too much chain (besides chain slap)?
    Since you aren't spending time in the small/small and have X9, then I think that only leaves chain length as a possible culprit (?).

    Unwrap the chain from the derailleur and then re-wrap it around the large front ring and large rear cog. Have the chains meet on the large front ring. Sheldon Brown says, "Start with the shortest chain that would permit connection... while on the large/large gear. Then add one complete link." I think Sram says to have two links of overlap. Further description and photos here: http://sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html#chain.

    You might try looking for scratches in the carbon or stand beside the bike and bounce it to see where the chain hits. Then wrap that area with a material thick enough to absorb the noise.

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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by getbusyliving
    Interesting that you get little chain slap even on bumpy stuff. I'm running SRAM X9, and almost never use granny gear, certainly never downhill. I may be wrong on the occasional seatstay slap, but it's definitely making too much noise on chainstay. I'd be surprised if I have too much chain---since my LBS that assembled it is very detail oriented, and all shifting is smooth. But I guess it's possible. How can I tell if I'm running too much chain (besides chain slap)?
    On the forward end along the lowest area on the bottom face of the chainstay just behind the chain-suck metal protector, also inside face of dropout area facing the cogs, I've used pieces of the firmer (hooked side) of sticky-back Velcro for protection. Those are not visible areas and sticky back Velcro holds up well for years.

    On the rear of the chain stay and lower end of the seat stay facing the chain, I've used black inner tube cut to blend with the shape of the stays held on by strips of double sided sticky tape (from a hardware store). Tape both the inside faces and top side face of chainstay, and bottom side face of seat stay. On the outside of the double-sided sticky tape I've stuck shaped pieces of inner tube so that it wraps around the two faces of each stay.

    I've also tied a little strip of inner tube around the rearward crossover area of the front derailleur.

    Now even in the wrong gears for optimum chain tension, the only chain noise over bumps is from the front derailleur side plates and next larger ring if I'm not in the big ring. The soft protection is very low-key and not very noticeable. The bike is very quiet now.
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    Last edited by derby; 05-04-2007 at 08:59 PM. Reason: Add picture

  42. #42
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    I plan to try some of this 40 mil "vynil" headlight grade protection 3m film on my upcoming green chainstays and possibly on vulnerable areas under the cranks.

    It's the same stuff that has protected my subie foglights and headlamp lenses for the past 6 years.. It is thick enough that it should damp the impact of the chainslap sound vibration and or minor impacts on the lower part of the frame.. it's designed to protect against small rock etc on the road to ~ 120mph.

    http://www.xpel.com/products/bulk.asp

  43. #43
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    Chainslap/Chain Size

    It's very important to add more links than what the Sheldon Brown site says. The DW Link grows the chain by about an inch under compression, so if your chain is less than an inch "too long" it will rip your derailleur off if you hit a bump in the big/big combo. You can use the Sheldon method if you deflate the shock and measure with the suspension compressed. I ended up with 4 extra links (2") since you can't do 3. Forget about med. cage derailleurs with this design, you'll end up only getting to use the bottom 4 gears at most in the small ring and even then you'll probably drop the chain the first time you hit a bump in the small ring.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan C.
    I ended up with 4 extra links (2") since you can't do 3. Forget about med. cage derailleurs with this design, you'll end up only getting to use the bottom 4 gears at most in the small ring and even then you'll probably drop the chain the first time you hit a bump in the small ring.
    I use a medium cage der and I don't seem to have any problem with the chain ... in any ring ... (sorry for the it was just too fun to put it there).

  45. #45
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    I use a short cage XO, & don't have any problems. I wanted quick & snap gear changes. I will never use big-big combo. (My 2 cents)

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by scarsellone
    I use a short cage XO, & don't have any problems. I wanted quick & snap gear changes. I will never use big-big combo. (My 2 cents)
    I wondered about that especially after seeing the Spanish Mojo test (http://ibiscycles.com/mountain/press/) where they seem to be using X.0 short cage with all three rings in place. It is normally considered a no-no. I was surprised their bike was set up that way. If I could read spanish, maybe I could have learned something.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  47. #47
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    Cheap(er) leading edge tape

    I bought some leading-edge tape from these guys, it was way cheaper than anyplace else I've looked. I think they call it "Helicopter tape". A friend who has built up a few bikes using it says that he has used the 8 and 14 mil tape, and the 8 mil is fine. I used the 2" wide stuff on my Mojo and it's the perfect width for the top and down tubes and stays. It's amazing how well it conforms to curves.

    www.racerstape.com

    Edit: It looks like it could be the same stuff as on the findtape.com site posted above.

  48. #48
    komojo dragon
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    40 mil expel on chainstay

    This isn't easy nor too difficult if you understand what you are about to do - ie getting something not designed for this to go with your intentions ( heat gun ) - gently and conservatively used! practice on something else first.. i had applied this stuff to the subie headlights and foglights some time ago, and my first piece on the mojo was over the bottom bracket area. I made patterns out of "flimsy" a light weight tracing paper, and then cut the xpel accordingly. The better your pattern design the more elegant the results will be... I may do a little how to on this if there is interest.

    results: so far so good! very little noise from chain slap, very good protection, and preservation of factory colour

    note on pics:

    from the outside shot of the chainstay the weirdness underneath is the fact that i left the factory clear chainstay protector on and applied the xpel over the top - so it's not a wrinkle just another edge underneath, and i took this just after application, and there is a tiny bit of the water/alchohol mixture you use to do the application along that edge.

    ( I misspelled Xpel... ooops )
    http://www.xpel.com/products/bulk.asp
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by 1scotto; 06-21-2007 at 02:28 AM.
    O-Jo-Mo-Jo!

  49. #49
    mtbr member
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    1scotto,

    That is some really good work! A complete write up along with some larger pics would be great! I've got some 8mil on the stays and downtube but it'd be cool if I could replace the Lizard skin with some 40mil.

    Incidentally, I'll be getting my Subie in a few weeks so I'll probably get some of the Xpel for my lights... and maybe some extra for my Mojo.

  50. #50
    komojo dragon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbon Ken
    1scotto,

    That is some really good work! A complete write up along with some larger pics would be great! I've got some 8mil on the stays and downtube but it'd be cool if I could replace the Lizard skin with some 40mil.

    Incidentally, I'll be getting my Subie in a few weeks so I'll probably get some of the Xpel for my lights... and maybe some extra for my Mojo.
    Thanks! it could be better still, as i didn't retest my pattern after I cut it out, and i did it primarily with the bike upside down.. but i'll pass these tips along... i put some 8 mil on a part of my wifes downtube for practice i think i'll redo what the LBS did on my downtube with 8 mil to proctect against the rubbing of the bike lock cable for the car rack journeys!

    Xpel in Canada with all the little rocks flying about on the roads etc, very good idea! that 8 mil to protect the paint on the front bumper and front of the hood could be good also! my bumper gets pretty worked and it needs touching up now and then....

    what subie model are you getting?

    I'll post a seperate "how to" on this in the next couple of days
    O-Jo-Mo-Jo!

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