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  1. #1
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    Ok, so I cannot descend with my Mojo SL. Whatīs going on?

    Hi all,

    First of all, I come from a Chumba VF2, size M which is equal to the Large Mojo SL.
    The thing is that in the VF2, I felt really confident while descending on rocky terrain and in general while descending technical stuff.

    Well, Iīve been riding my Mojo SL for about 2 months and I havenīt been able to feel as confident with the Mojo while descending than with my old VF2. Somehow I feel a lot less "in control" of the bike.

    What do you guys think? The strange thing is that my previous VF2 has the same measures than the Mojo, so Iīm thinking to try with a shorter stem.

    Iīm 5ī10" and ride a Large Mojo, with a 90mm stem. Do you think that a 70mm could help to aleviate this problem?

    Regards

    BTW, is there anything "special" with the Mojoīs rear hub measures? because I run a pair of Mavic SLR Crossmax wheels, and somehow thereīs a strange "clicking" on the rear wheel when Iīm not pedaling and advancing.
    I have already taken the rear wheel to service but everything is ok and the clicking is still there.

  2. #2
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    Reputation: miles wadsworth's Avatar
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    I am guessing you need a shorter stem and wider lower bars.
    milesW

  3. #3
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    I'm also 5' 10 riding a large mojo. I run a 70mm stem and a joplin seat post. I have no problem with decending. I was always dropping my seat on the steeps before I got the joplin so it has just been a really nice bonus.

    Straw
    Ease & Flow Where Ever I Go

  4. #4
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    im 5'10" on a large with 70mm on highrise bar, i feel very comfortable. still playing with bars though, gonna throw on my low rise this week and see how it feels.

  5. #5
    bike rider
    Reputation: Lelandjt's Avatar
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    The Mojo has a kinda steep headtube. I combat this by running very little fork sag and 25%+ shock sag.
    A 70mm stem and 27 or 28" bars will help also.
    You're running an adjustable post right? Descending with a post at full height makes proper weight transfer difficult.
    Keep the Country country.

  6. #6
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    I think you are probably afraid to put any scratches on such a beautiful frame. You just need to push until you stack and put your first scratches on the bike then you can relax and enjoy it. I put tape all over my Mojo but now after more than 3 years there are scratches and chips in places I couldn't imagine. I just don't care anymore and the GF's clear nail polish fixes must scratches.

  7. #7
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    Run the shock a little softer and follow above advice on bars and stem. I'm you height on a med and wouldn't go over 70mm. The DW link feels quite different over short sharp hits. Theres a lot more feedback

  8. #8
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    Yes, in addition with what others suggest... The VF2 is slacker and shorter travel. You'll have more braking dive on the Mojo.

    A shorter stem wider bars as low as you can mount them will make a world of difference. Also lowering your seat and pinching it loosely with your legs makes it easier to get behind the wheels.

    It's not about how slack or steep the geo, it's getting behind the wheels for gaining confidence while descending.

  9. #9
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    are the parts the same ie did you swap onto a frame or was it a new build. The common mistake virtually all riders make is to run their dampers too fats. I was a big culprit esp with forks. On an Rp23 I find the best compromise rebound setting to be about 2 clicks out from too slow, faster than this and the shock actually feels harsher and I get chucked about. On my Lyriks , after much fiddling and thinking I knew better than Rockshox I have ended up with almost stock settings 12 clicks from fast on rebound and 4 clicks each on HSC and LSC from full open. On my van R the rebound is 6 clicks from slow. For some reason rebound is expressed as clicks out from closed and full slow and compression often expressed as clicks out from full open or min comp damping. Push express these settings consistently as out from full closed on the dampers.
    I also run about 30-32 psi in the rear tyre and 28-30 in the front. Almost always Maxxis in some Highroller (front) and something else (currently a Crossmark 2.2) in the rear.
    Hope that helps

  10. #10
    bike rider
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    Quote Originally Posted by derby
    It's not about how slack the geo, it's getting behind the wheels for gaining confidence while descending.
    A slacker head angle places you more behind the front wheel.
    Keep the Country country.

  11. #11
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    Hi all, thank you very much for your advice.

    Today I went to make the exact same trail and I felt a little bit more confident, I guess somedays you feel more comfortable to attack technical descends.

    Anyway, I do feel less confident with this bike than with the VF2. The VF2 gives you less small bumps feedback.

    I will try a shorter stem, Iīm going for a 70mm. ON the handlebar side, I run a low rise 27" so I wonīt be going wider as I think this one is wide enough.

    I currently donīt have a adjustable seatpost, Iīm considering one, but even do getting one will help me, I donīt think thatīs the reason Iīm facing this "lack of control" issues.

    Regards

  12. #12
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    Reputation: budgie's Avatar
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    Lots of great info on here, but also a couple of points that I (respectfully) disagree with. Personally I think the benefits of a slacker head angle might be a bit overblown: it's not a cure-all. In my experience with Horst link bikes, they tend to sit further into their travel & more readily, which slackens the bike out & might give the illusion of better handling downhill. The problem though is that you have even less travel to handle bumps & such, making it harder to track the terrain & defeating the purpose of the suspension in the first place. So yes, the Mojo might be steeper both at rest and in action, but the trade-off is that you have the full use of all 150mm when things get nasty. From where I'm sitting, that's good news. Having said all that, for sure a longer fork and slacker geometry will help in many instances, but I think there's plenty that can be done with improving technique instead of trying to solve the problem with equipment.

    Along those lines, & re: derby's point about getting behind the wheels, I've recently come to see this a bit differently. I've been riding for over 20 years, and it's come to my attention that basically I've been going about it all wrong this entire time when it comes to descending. The Fluidride "Ride Like a Pro" DVD (excellent, btw) points out that the further back you go, the straighter your arms will be, which puts them in a really weak position and makes it all that harder to use the "natural suspension" of your arms to help track the terrain and react to what's coming at you. You just end up getting bucked around. Staying further forward, more centered over the bottom bracket, allows you to move the bike forward & backward under you, "pumping" the terrain even when it gets steep. Definitely the wider bars and stem help here, since you can get forward (or more accurately, get centered over the bottom bracket) more easily without feeling like you're hanging out over the front wheel. With today's suspension, going over the bars is way less likely than it used to be, so there are really very few benefits to the rearward, arms-straight stance of old. I've been watching the world cup DH pretty closely this year, and this is how they do it: centered, aggressively down over the bars, constantly pushing the bike forwards and backwards, really tracking the terrain. Even on the steeps.

    Anyway, sorry for the long narrative. To be clear, I'm not trying to suggest that there is an absolute wrong and a right way to do this. Everyone needs to figure out what works for them. I just wanted to pass on something that's really helped me descend faster and more confidently lately. Go get the Fluidride DVD. I'm definitely not riding like a pro yet, but for sure better than before.

  13. #13
    bike rider
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    misspost
    Keep the Country country.

  14. #14
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    Shorter stem and wider bar would definitely make a different on the handling. I just swap the fork on my Mojo, I originally ran 75mm on a Duc32 then swap to Magura Wotan and run 100mm stem it feels a bit strange.

    I like to manual over small stuffs with 100mm it was harder to get a good pop, while waiting for my 70mm stem I put a my other 50mm stubby stem on, wow! what a big difference. It feel so much easier to pop the front wheel and keep it up. Not sure if I want to put the 70mm on just now, at least not yet anyway too much fun.

  15. #15
    More Torque
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho Marco

    BTW, is there anything "special" with the Mojoīs rear hub measures? because I run a pair of Mavic SLR Crossmax wheels, and somehow thereīs a strange "clicking" on the rear wheel when Iīm not pedaling and advancing.
    I have already taken the rear wheel to service but everything is ok and the clicking is still there.
    Try the following, as it may not be your rear wheel.

    Re-lube your seatpost with a generous helping of carbon paste or fiber grip.

    Make sure your pivots are tight.

    Lube each cable ferrule where it touches the cable stop.

    Make sure your rear wheel QR is liberally greased and very tight.

    Take the derailleur hanger off and lube the interface between the hanger and frame, bolt and hanger, and grease the bolt threads.

    Good luck,

    -D

  16. #16
    Proud bike-o-holic
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diesel~
    Try the following, as it may not be your rear wheel.

    Re-lube your seatpost with a generous helping of carbon paste or fiber grip.

    Make sure your pivots are tight.

    Lube each cable ferrule where it touches the cable stop.

    Make sure your rear wheel QR is liberally greased and very tight.

    Take the derailleur hanger off and lube the interface between the hanger and frame, bolt and hanger, and grease the bolt threads.

    Good luck,

    -D
    Will do. Thanks!

    Actually I just tighten a little bit more the thru axle. Tonight I will relube all the places you mentioned.
    Tomorrow I will let you know if that worked.

    Regards

  17. #17
    aka dan51
    Reputation: d-bug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by budgie
    ... the further back you go, the straighter your arms will be, which puts them in a really weak position and makes it all that harder to use the "natural suspension" of your arms to help track the terrain and react to what's coming at you. You just end up getting bucked around. Staying further forward, more centered over the bottom bracket, allows you to move the bike forward & backward under you, "pumping" the terrain even when it gets steep. Definitely the wider bars and stem help here, since you can get forward (or more accurately, get centered over the bottom bracket) more easily without feeling like you're hanging out over the front wheel. With today's suspension, going over the bars is way less likely than it used to be, so there are really very few benefits to the rearward, arms-straight stance of old. I've been watching the world cup DH pretty closely this year, and this is how they do it: centered, aggressively down over the bars, constantly pushing the bike forwards and backwards, really tracking the terrain. Even on the steeps....
    This is great advice.
    Here's an example is being too far back going wrong. I roll through first, then my girlfriend gets too far back and ends up out of control.
    Those who know, ride a Mojo AND a Mojo HD.
    Quadzilla
    Quote Originally Posted by benja55
    Ok, whatever, cold water on my bike boner right there.

  18. #18
    www.derbyrims.com
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lelandjt
    A slacker head angle places you more behind the front wheel.
    ...and softens bump hits. And plows sand, gravel, and loam with less hooking. More stable at speed. A lot of advantages downhill.

    But he can't change the head angle without an expensive taller fork. After lowering the seat, a shorter stem and wider bar would be the first steps at getting behind the wheels further when descending IMO.

  19. #19
    flow where ever you go
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    Quote Originally Posted by d-bug
    Here's an example is being too far back going wrong. I roll through first, then my girlfriend gets too far back and ends up out of control.
    Not a fair comparison with you on the Mojo and all!
    It does show how the front can get away from you with too much weight back and no arm bend left to steer. Not in position for effective braking either.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  20. #20
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    Good advice all around. Also, when I got my Mojo it took me several months before I felt fully confident on it. No matter how great a bike is, if you've been riding another design for several or more years, it takes time to fully learn and internalize its capabilities.

    One other thought...it may sound totally obvious, but are you running the same tires and pressure? Tread design and tire pressure can make such a huge difference.

  21. #21
    Well Biked
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    Having a similar issue with my HD. Came off a Highline which I rode for a few years (full on freeride bike). But I have yet to feel as confident riding down some of the steeper nasty stuff I rode the Highline down. I have been using a 70mm stem and I'm gonna switch next week to a 60, which is the same size I used on my Highline. The two bikes have a very different feel.

  22. #22
    Genius
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    I demo'd 3 Ibis bikes in the spring when the Manufacturers demo van came to my local trail. I was disappointed. Granted they were demo's but after repeated attempts with the ibis mechanic to get the setup in the ball park I gave up and just rode. The bike was all over the place on the downhills. Climbed well but just like OP the confidence was not there for me on these bikes.

    True that every bike takes some getting used too but being I get in on several demos every year I'm a pretty good adapter and I know these trails like the back of my hand. Sometimes you have to realize when I bike is just not for you. Maybe this is true for you too OP.
    "I think im gonna go to walmart and look at the mountain bikes and see if i can salvage the rear frame."- Nick_Knipp 3/21/12

  23. #23
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    I run more sag than recommended. Contrary to what people post I don't think the DW link is especially plush esp over square edge hits. Every DW bike I have ridden has needed to have about 30-35% sag even in trail bike mode. This is no bad thing as the suspesion design makes it a very efficient pedaling. I think Dave Weagle even posted recently that he runs 30% sag and running more isn't really an issue. I run you shock soft, you will encounter some "wallow" as you discover the is littlew mid-stroke damping in most air shocks. Bikes are always set up to be the best compromise for the given rider

  24. #24
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    That seems like an odd comment.

    The Mojo's geometry quite similar to all those other bikes in the "all mountain" category: whether it be a Sanata Cruz or a Turner etc.

    DW or Ibis would I am sure be interested to see why those bikes could not be decended in a at least a similar way to .. similar bikes.

    Shock calving, fork setup, cockpit dimensions etc make all the difference of course

  25. #25
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    OK, not that I am speaking from authority with my experience but I find this so odd I wanted to comment. I am certainly no benchmark but I feel the bike is amazing.

    The bike flat out begs/inspires me to descend, be it 28mph down sketchy loose washout trails or crawling down and around switchbacks litered with basketball sized rocks.
    At 5'11ish on the med I felt a wee bit OTB prone but all that went away w/ the lrg.
    I run a 25" bar on a 110 stem with the stem sitting on the tall CC cap.
    (I tried a 5mm spacer under the stem and that change was very noticable in steering.)
    The bike feels laser guided.

    Now when I get tired, and sit on my ass like a comfort bike things don't go so well. But certainly the bike will do everything my old 'balls' and not so great stamina will push it to do. It tracks where I point it, so long as the tires grip the terrain and the fork isn't rebounding your ass in the opposite direction? I did have a learning curve setting up the forks. Some local lbs experts really don't know how fork features even work.

    As people wrote, tire pressure is a big one.

    Don't base your set up on what someone on the net has, your arms could be 4" shorter than mine or longer than theirs. You could be all torso and I am all legs... Understand the basics of rider position, like the bent arms and attack position then buy cheap parts to dial it in.

    oh, and adjustable seatposts rock (with remote, screw taking your hand off the bar).
    note to self, do not read rider down forum.

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