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  1. #1
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    Mojo Seat Tube Insert Problem

    So, I just got my Ibis frame and built up my bike. In the first mile of the first ride, I notice that the aluminum insert that Ibis uses in the seat tube is loose in the frame! The seat tube clamp is secure to both the insert and the seat post, but the insert will rotate and pull up a little. I guess I'll test out that excellent customer service later this morning when I call them. Anyone else have this issue? Or any ideas on how to fix it?

    BTW: I think I'm going to really enjoy this bike if the seat tube insert problem can be fixed. It climbs surprisingly well and handles great. I'll post some build pics here in a bit.

    --MXFanatic

  2. #2
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    Never heard of that problem before. Hopefully there's a quick fix for something like that...

    Let us know how it goes.

  3. #3
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    So, I called Ibis and they didn't disappoint. Tom answered immediately and was very helpful! He immediately agreed to send me out a new front triangle. This is fantastic! I knew I picked the right manufacturer.

    WAY TO GO IBIS!

    --MXFanatic

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    So, I called Ibis and they didn't disappoint. Tom answered immediately and was very helpful! He immediately agreed to send me out a new front triangle. This is fantastic! I knew I picked the right manufacturer.

    WAY TO GO IBIS!

    --MXFanatic
    Wow! That's amazing. I haven't had any problems with mine, but if I do I feel confident it will be handled quickly.
    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  5. #5
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    Ah yes, please excuse me while I go semi-OT on my soapbox....

    I am music producer and studio owner. My recording equipment is my life and bread and butter. When choosing what equipment to base my studio around, instead of subscribing to the marketing rhetoric of mega-companies such as Digidesign (ProTools), etc, I chose to do business with a small manufacturer of a high-integrity audio recording hardware device Same exact story- any time I need anything, they bend over backwards to make it happen. You call tech support, you get a human in 30 sec or less. Their product is amazing, rock-solid, and stable, something you NEVER find with most software based recorders. Some might say you 'pay' for this service with a higher starting price..... compared to how bad so much customer service is in industries across the board right now, can you really put a price on outstanding customer service?

    Just goes to show you that commitment to customer base is an invaluable tool and selling point for Ibis and all smaller manufacturers. We know how easy it is for one bad apple to spoil the bunch.... the current level of customer support ensures that we end users continue to sell the heck out of the Mojo/Silk with our exuberance and boundless enthusiasm.... no doubt, priceless.

    Nice job, Ibis.

  6. #6
    It's the axle
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    I found that the seat clamp lever was more decorative than functional. My seat also slipped for the first few rides. Use a wrench and torque the screw until it's about right. Your seat will never slip again. Just my experience.

    Hey G-Box, here's the new studio my friend just set up. Go ahead and drool.

    http://www.earthwire.com/

  7. #7
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    Thanks for the update on the seat clamp. My problem isn't with the clamp or the post. It is really with the part of the frame that the clamp clamps to. It looks like there is a bonding problem in the frame. The insert doesn't stay in the frame. Even with the clamp tight, the clamp, seat post, and frame insert will rotate and pull out. I'm sure this was just one of those one off situations. I'm excited about getting my replacement and getting back to riding.

    --MXFanatic

  8. #8
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    Ibis is definitely a stand out company. You can tell that they're comprised of a team of cycling enthusiasts who've created a dream bike of their own to sell to a select group of discriminating buyers.

    Of course I wish them great success but at the same time, I hope they remain small... or at least retain that small company image.

  9. #9
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    Uh oh, same problem!

    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    Thanks for the update on the seat clamp. My problem isn't with the clamp or the post. It is really with the part of the frame that the clamp clamps to. It looks like there is a bonding problem in the frame. The insert doesn't stay in the frame. Even with the clamp tight, the clamp, seat post, and frame insert will rotate and pull out. I'm sure this was just one of those one off situations. I'm excited about getting my replacement and getting back to riding.

    --MXFanatic
    Today while climbing up Caballero - a short but steep and fairly technical single track- I could feel my seat moving side to side slightly. I didn't want to break my momentum to tighten the seat post clamp so I waited until I reached a meeting spot about 3 miles into the ride. I tried to adjust the seat post clamp but noticed it wasn't loose. I moved the seat slightly to the side and the post and seat post clamp moved with it. I pulled up slightly and the whole assembly came right out of the frame with the seat post clamp still attached. I considered abandoning the ride but it was only my second off-road ride on it and I wasn't about to quit after 3 measly miles! So, I rode it with the seat moving around and....(big dramatic pause) it was STILL AWESOME!

    I cant say that I'm too happy about the seat post moving around in the sleeve, but I do hope I have the same luck with getting it fixed as MXFanatic. I don't even want a new front triangle, just bond my together so it stays tight! Tom from Ibis, what can I do????
    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  10. #10
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    Wut, it seems there is a quality control problem, OMG

  11. #11
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    BunnV,

    I'm sure you will get the same great service as I did. I hope that these are isolated issues, and not with the entire batch or dare I say, design. Either way, I'm sure that they will be resolved. I'm not sure if there is a way to bond the two together after the manufacturing. I thought about possible glue methods, but I was unable to come up with one that I was comfortable with at the time. Besides, I'd hate to try and fix it, then have to explain it if I had other issues. Better to have them warranty it now.

    If there are any Carbon guru's out there that know about bonding carbon to metal, please enighten us...

    --MXFanatic

  12. #12
    It's the axle
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    Argh. I posted without reading that the whole tube was loose.

    It's the only part of the bike design I was nervous about. Just visual inspection. Not a well founded conclusion.

    But you know, with Ibis as great a company as they are, I am reassured this won't be a disaster for the bike owners.

    Man, you guys really come through. I hope for your sake that this isn't a big problem.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    BunnV,

    If there are any Carbon guru's out there that know about bonding carbon to metal, please enighten us...

    --MXFanatic
    Hello Forum!

    It sounds like there's more than one of these. Of course call us or email and we'll take care of it.

    If you just want to get riding with the least amount of effort here's an excellent, easy and still under warranty no matter what fix:
    JB Weld. at most harware and auto parts stores.
    It is a very strong metal filled 2 part epoxy. Very close to what they use to hold the dropouts in at the factory.

    Or contact us and we'll get a new front triangle out to you asap.

    Hans from Ibis

  14. #14
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    Thanks for the update Hans! I've used JB Weld in the past on other things, I just didn't know how it would do on the carbon.

    I (as I'm sure others) really appreciate you guys reading and posting on the forums.

    Thanks!

  15. #15
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    When I got home, I thought I'd go ahead and pull out the insert to see what it really looked like before I sent it back. As you can see in the picture below, the insert is about 4 inches long and has a spiral groove in it. I think that the groove is to hold epoxy. Based on the shine on the epoxy, it looks like it cured too much before it was inserted in the frame. (or sandwiched. I''m not sure of the manufacturing process) The clearance into the frame seems nice and tight, so I don't think that's an issue. It will be interesting to see what Ibis thinks of this.

    If the insert on the replacement triangle gets loose, I'll certainly use JB Weld on it. I will roughen up the insert and inside of the frame a little to help the epoxy bond. I'll keep posting updates as this goes along.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  16. #16
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    Smile Ibis Customer Service is Awesome

    Hey-

    Ibis will take care of you. I had a few minor issues. Mistakes happen etc - nothing is perfect. I was annoyed at first, but Ibis is super cool and laid back. They truly believe in thier product (which is a blast to ride). Hans is awesome, he should be a philosopher. This is by far the best company that I ever delt with. I have owned a number of high end bikes (will not name the companies), but all seem to have some sort of problem. It seems crazy for this to happen, but it does. However, Ibis responded the best....I love the bike! and now the company only adds to the whole experience....

  17. #17
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    Ibis gave me options

    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    ........ it looks like it cured too much before it was inserted in the frame. (or sandwiched. I’m not sure of the manufacturing process) The clearance into the frame seems nice and tight, so I don't think that's an issue. It will be interesting to see what Ibis thinks of this.
    I think you are right. Mine looks the same. I took my bike to the dealer to show them and they called Ibis while I waited. Hans asked them if I was one of the guys that posted on mtbr about this problem! (How cool is that?) I told them yes and they put me on the phone with Hans.

    Hans was very sympathetic to my problem and offered two options to get it handled. Like MXFanatic, he offered me a replacement front triangle. That is great, but I really don't want to wait what could be months for it to come in. The second option was something I really hoped he would say anyway. He told me it could be fixed using JB Weld. I know there is a previous post about that but I didn't see it before I spoke with him. I took my Mojo out of the LBS and drove straight to Pep Boys for the JB Weld.

    I took the assembly apart (sleeve, post and clamp) and cleaned it as best I could. I didn't have any contact cleaner or alcohol so I used fine steel wool prep the outer part of the sleeve.

    I mixed the JB Weld 50/50 as the directions said. Starting at about 3/4s of the way from the top, I smeared the entire sleeve with the JB Weld. I don't recommend doing it that way again! I should have only put JB Weld on the bottom half. When I pushed the sleeve into the frame (with the clamp attached so it would go in the exact, correct depth) a lot of the epoxy gushed out of the top and onto the paint on the seat tube. Luckily, Hans told me to be careful of that so I had a terry towel ready. The JB Weld wiped right off except for a fine, grey line visible between the seat post clamp and the orange paint.

    I'm going to let the JB Weld cure for 24 hours before I touch it. I feel pretty confident that it will be in there tightly and for a long, long time.

    Even though Ibis offered to replace my frame, I'd rather just fix this one and take my trip to Cannell Plunge (http://www.mountainbikebill.com/CannellPlunge.htm) on Thursday like I planed!

    It's really a win-win option for me anyway since Ibis will STILL replace my frame if the JB Weld trick doesn't work.
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    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  18. #18
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    BunnV, Thanks for the update and pics! I hope you enjoy your ride!

  19. #19
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    Caution;  Merge;  Workers Ahead! waiting for the "cure"

    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    BunnV, Thanks for the update and pics! I hope you enjoy your ride!
    My pleasure. I checked the bond this morning...it's really tight. I'm going to give it a full 24 hours to cure before I put the seat post back in and ride it. Of course I'll report the results.
    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  20. #20
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    As promised, my replacement triangle from Ibis showed up yesterday! Fantastic! I put her all back together and she's ready to ride. Thanks Ibis!

  21. #21
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    Follow-up on JB Weld fix

    I just came back from a three day bike trip in Kernville Ca. I'm happy to report that I had no problems with the seat post insert. The riding in Kernville is really rocky and technical. I found myself adjusting the seat up and down much more than I ever do at my local trails. There was a lot of pounding from riding through rock gardens. The bond held tight and I had a fantastic time riding my Mojo!
    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  22. #22
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    Mine came out also

    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    So, I just got my Ibis frame and built up my bike. In the first mile of the first ride, I notice that the aluminum insert that Ibis uses in the seat tube is loose in the frame! The seat tube clamp is secure to both the insert and the seat post, but the insert will rotate and pull up a little. I guess I'll test out that excellent customer service later this morning when I call them. Anyone else have this issue? Or any ideas on how to fix it?

    BTW: I think I'm going to really enjoy this bike if the seat tube insert problem can be fixed. It climbs surprisingly well and handles great. I'll post some build pics here in a bit.

    --MXFanatic
    Hey MX

    Mine came out as well but like you mentioned Ibis has taken care of it with flying colors. I posted my experience on another thread ( I did not see this one)

  23. #23
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    Mine came out this morning. Will JB Weld it.

  24. #24
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    Mine came out yesterday.

  25. #25
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    Cross my fingers... my replacement triangle has been holding tight! Going to Durango tonight. I hope it stays in. Bringing the JB Weld with me just in case.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by sadgit
    Mine came out this morning. Will JB Weld it.

    So I did, and two short rides later it came out again tonight. Hugely bummed. The tolerance is so tight its hard to get any of the JB weld to stay in when you re-insert the glue covered insert.


  27. #27
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    Re-do

    Quote Originally Posted by sadgit
    So I did, and two short rides later it came out again tonight. Hugely bummed. The tolerance is so tight its hard to get any of the JB weld to stay in when you re-insert the glue covered insert.

    Hey Sadgit

    I did mine yesterday and I covered the whole sleeve and like a dumb butt I left the seatpost in. This was a bad idea because I just spent the last half hour banging the seatpost out. I put so much on that when the seatpost was in JB got stuck on the bottom and it would not come out until I beat it out. Needless to say the sleeve did not move at all. I would take it out again and douse that sucker with JB. Keep a towel handy for the overflow. Good luck hopefully this will work for you. I'm riding mine tomorrow so we will see how mine holds up.

  28. #28
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    not enough epoxy?

    Quote Originally Posted by sadgit
    So I did, and two short rides later it came out again tonight. Hugely bummed. The tolerance is so tight its hard to get any of the JB weld to stay in when you re-insert the glue covered insert.

    Mine is holding fine. Before I put any JB Weld on I cleaned the insert and inside the frame. I used fine steel wool to make sure there was nothing on the insert that would hurt the bond. I don't know how much JB you used, but I coated mine thoroughly all the way around for 3/4's of the length of the insert starting at the bottom. When you push the insert into the frame, lots of JB Weld will seep up to the top and spill over onto the frame. Be ready to wipe it off quickly with a terry towel. If you do it that way, you'll know you have plenty of JB Weld -from top-to-bottom- inside the seat tube. Don't even think about touching it until it has cured for 24 hours. If you do it that way you shouldn't have a problem.
    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  29. #29
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    Hello Sadgit and Forum,

    Here are some tips that might help. If you're up for trying again, please note that it helps a lot to sand the outside of the insert tube and the inside of the frame to give the surface some "tooth". Of course make sure it's all clean.

    When you make up the batch, make some extra so you don't have to skimp, then coat the inside of the seat tube before you put the insert in (also sanded and coated).

    Use the seat clamp and post as a fixture to give you grip and to locate the part.
    When you get it all in place, gingerly remove the post and seat clamp and wipe all the excess off everything. Or you might leave the seat clamp (for sure take the post out) and just wipe everything off as best as you can and clean up the area just under the seat clamp after it dries, your call. I think if you can take the clamp off with out displacing the tube that will end up being the best

    It should stay there forever after 24 hours full cure.

    Can you verify that you got the regular JB Weld, not the "quick cure" kind? Just in case... I don't have any experience with the quick cureing kind and assume that the original is stronger.

    I hope you are back in action asap. Give us a call if we can assist in any way.
    Hans

  30. #30
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    Any symptoms before isert came loose?

    Anyone getting any creaking before the insert came out?
    Don

  31. #31
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    yes.

  32. #32
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    Mine never creaked, it just came loose. my replacement frame hasn't come loose at all. It can have a bad case of creaks if you don't use grease on the seat tube and clamp. There is a nice squeaking / creaking thread on here where Tall Tom from Ibis tells you how to grease the seat and seat post. My seat had a bad forward to back creak and I was sure that my insert was coming out, but a simple clean and grease cleared it up immediately. As a matter of fact, it can stop from simply dropping and raising your post and re-clamping it.

  33. #33
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    Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by MXFanatic
    Mine never creaked, it just came loose. my replacement frame hasn't come loose at all. It can have a bad case of creaks if you don't use grease on the seat tube and clamp. There is a nice squeaking / creaking thread on here where Tall Tom from Ibis tells you how to grease the seat and seat post. My seat had a bad forward to back creak and I was sure that my insert was coming out, but a simple clean and grease cleared it up immediately. As a matter of fact, it can stop from simply dropping and raising your post and re-clamping it.
    I eliminated the post and the seat. I noticed the CF seatpost had a powdery substance on it and it never really stopped slipping. I've got a Thomson and it stays put with a Silk seatpost clamp. I feel a little more comfortable with a Thomson(durability)
    Don

  34. #34
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    last sunday, during the ride, i noticed the seta post moving side to side when i climb, after riding 4 months with no problems, i`m worry now, what can i do?

    ha!! i ear some noises (from the shock, i think). any sugestions?

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by bichu du matu
    last sunday, during the ride, i noticed the seta post moving side to side when i climb, after riding 4 months with no problems, i`m worry now, what can i do?

    ha!! i ear some noises (from the shock, i think). any sugestions?
    Seat post: see posts above, take out the post and confirm there is a problem in the seat tube. If so, call Ibis or your bike shop to sort it out.

    Noises: Almost every time someone thinks they have shock noise on the Mojo it has turned out to be a dirty cable end. See the following thread for explanations of the problem and easy solutions: Creeking mojo

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  36. #36
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    it's not too hard to fix

    Quote Originally Posted by bichu du matu
    last sunday, during the ride, i noticed the [seat] post moving side to side when i climb, after riding 4 months with no problems, i`m worry now, what can i do?

    ........
    If you didn't already, check out my post here... http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.ph...33970#poststop

    I fixed mine myself and forgot about it!
    I'm unique, just like everyone else....

  37. #37
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    My Mojo seatpost sleeve came loose on a trip to the French Alps, becoming increasingly unrideable over the course of the week. After reviewing the discussion here I decided to rebond the sleeve rather than go through the process of having a replacement shipped to Ireland. Since JB Weld is not available here I emailed Ibis to identify a similar product, however they were not very helpful other than to simply recommend 'a two part epoxy.' JB Weld is described as a steel/epoxy product which would suggest it is different to a standard epoxy - Ibis would not clarify this for me. Eventually I located what appeared to be a similar product in a Bondloc steel epoxy B2013 which seems to have worked to date. Perhaps someone could clarify the difference, if any, between a standard two part epoxy and a steel epoxy for those who may be anxious about rebonding their expensive frame.

  38. #38
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    I've seen the Bondloc brand. The reason they didn't give much more information is that these are all two part epoxy resin systems. You can't go wrong with any of them. In fact, I think JB Weld is one of the cheaper, generic brands. I've got one called Epoxy Patch. They're all a resin and a catalyst.

    Go for it. You're fine. Just make sure it cures at a reasonable temperature, and you mix properly.

    Edit- Wow, Ireland. Cool.

  39. #39
    MOJO BICHU
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    my seatpost came out (totally) last saunday, i clean the frame and the tube. this evening i`ll try to fixed it w/ a two part weld ( henkel).....

  40. #40
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    Be careful to do a very good job on the cleaning. Get ALL the old adhesive off the insert , I used a hacksaw and file.

    I followed those instructions on my second attempt as I didnt do it the first time, and it came out! Its been fine since August.

  41. #41
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    Now I am having this problem on a brandnew frame.

    It's probably ok for this to happen a couple of times over a short production run ... six months later I'm not so sure.

    What is the current recommendation?

  42. #42
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    seat tube insert

    Hello!
    Sorry to hear you've had the seat tube insert come loose. We've been doing 100% QC on those both here and at the factory, so we must have missed one...
    As to getting going again you have options.
    1. You can bond it back in your self
    2. You can send it to us and we will take care of it.

    The advantage to doing it your self = less time involved. It takes about 20 - 30 minutes to do the repair, and 24 hours for the glue to cure, but longer than that to go through returning the frame and having us do it. So... our suggestion is to try the fix your self and use us as a back up if there are problems. We will make sure you end up with a good frame in the end either way.
    Here are the instructions for rebonding the seat tube insert. Please call us if you have any questions or would like us to take care of it. We will be back in the office on the 2nd.
    Phone 1 831 461 1435 Thank you, Hans

    How to rebond a seat tube insert
    We see this happen occasionally when the the sleeve is not properly bonded into the frame.
    The fastest way to remedy the situation is to re-bond it. If you feel up to it, it is actually a fairly easy thing to repair. The procedure goes like this:

    Get some two-part epoxy from your local hardware or home improvement store. Good brands are JB Weld (our favorite) Hysol and Loctite, but there are probably several others that would be OK.

    You'll need to sand the seat tube sleeve to remove the old epoxy and make a rough surface for the epoxy to stick to. Use some course - 100 grit - sandpaper to remove the old epoxy and to roughen the surface. You don't need to remove all of the old epoxy. Roughening the surface is the most important thing.

    Use a clean rag to soaked in isopropyl alcohol or acetone to clean the dust off of the sleeve and to clean out the inside of the seat tube on the frame. Let both sit until the alcohol evaporates away.

    To get the proper positioning of the sleave and give you something to hold on to: Insert the seat post into the seat tube sleeve just far enough to block the slot at the top of the sleeve. Use the quick release clamp to hold the seat tube sleeve on the seat post. This will also act as a fixture to hold the sleeve at the proper height in the frame while the epoxy is curing. The slot in the seat tube sleeve and the slot in the quick release should be aligned at the top of the sleeve.

    Use a small, flat, disposable stick or spatula to mix up generous batch of the epoxy on clean disposable surface - like a plastic lid.

    Keep several clean disposable rags handy to clean up any epoxy that goes where it is not supposed to. Soaking them in the alcohol will help with clean up.

    Apply some of the epoxy on the inside of the frame at the seat tube opening. Clean off any epoxy that gets on the rim of the seat tube or exterior of the frame immediately.
    Starting from the bottom of the sleeve and working quickly spread a generous amount of the epoxy around the sleeve. Continue until you have covered at least the bottom 2/3 of the sleeve. The upper part will get covered as the epoxy is pushed up while inserting the sleeve into the frame.

    Insert the sleeve/seat post/seat clamp assembly into the frame. Quickly wipe off any epoxy that overflows onto rim of the seat tube or exterior of the frame. Try to keep the epoxy off of the underside of the seat clamp or from getting into the slot at the back of the sleeve as well.

    The seat clamp should nest on top of the frame and hold the sleeve in the frame at the proper height.

    Let the epoxy cure according to the manufacturer's directions - usually 24 hours or more.

    After the epoxy has cured, check to make sure that the fix has worked. With a seat post clamped securely in the frame, move the seat back and forth and see if you can get the sleeve to twist in the frame. You don't need to go crazy with this. Use just enough force to check that everything is secure.

    That's it. Time to ride!

  43. #43
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    Thanks, Hans.

    I just did the rebonding myself, even used steel colored JB Weld. Your instructions really helped.

    In the end I decided to do two things differently: I did not apply any epoxy on the inside of the frame. That way no epoxy will build up against the bottom end/edge of the insert and there is no chance of an epoxy ridge forming there. I didn't even apply epoxy to the bottom 5 mm of the insert, because that made inserting it cleanly a bit easier.

    I also did not leave the seat clamp attached to the insert during the procedure. There were a few paint marks on the insert that allowed me to reposition it correctly and wiping off overflowing epoxy was easier without the seat clamp getting in the way.

    That's it, except for the curing process. It will be time to ride when that is over!

    Thanks, Hans

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by yo_ca
    Thanks, Hans.

    In the end I decided to do two things differently: I did not apply any epoxy on the inside of the frame. That way no epoxy will build up against the bottom end/edge of the insert and there is no chance of an epoxy ridge forming there. I didn't even apply epoxy to the bottom 5 mm of the insert, because that made inserting it cleanly a bit easier.

    I also did not leave the seat clamp attached to the insert during the procedure. There were a few paint marks on the insert that allowed me to reposition it correctly and wiping off overflowing epoxy was easier without the seat clamp getting in the way.
    Great!, that all sounds good and I understand why you made the changes you did. If it does slip again, go for as much glue in the interface as possible and deal with the overflow by cleaning it up after. We usually try to get as much surface area coated as possible. The JB weld is really strong though and if you got even half of the insert bonded to the seat tube it will probably be OK. It has been holding the clutch fulcrum pin in place on my car with less than 1 square inch bonded, steel to steel for a couple of years. Much easier than pulling the engine and transmission to replace it. I have no idea how we will remove it someday way in the future when it's time to put a new one in?? Hopefully never

    Hans

  45. #45
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    Good Ole JB Weld

    Wow, JB Weld!.... who'd have thunk it? I've seen that stuff used successfully to repair cracked blocks on high compression diesel engines... it will definitely hold those seat tube inserts no problemo.

  46. #46
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    Has Ibis fixed this problem in the future Mojo's? or the current batch of Mojo's
    07 Giant Anthem 2 (Int'l Edition) | omartan.co.cc
    Im a MOJO Fanboy

  47. #47
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    Yes

    Hi Wheelhot,
    Yes, there may be a few more as the frames sell through, but in general it has been taken care of.
    Have a great New Year!
    Hans

  48. #48
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    Sure seems like a week link.

    Sounds like a switch to the carbon insert the sl uses could be the answer if it's a galvanization thing. (If they would match) that is what I think I would ask for is for you guys to send me a carbon insert.
    .....Actually, aw heck, just send me an sl !

  49. #49
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    In my case it just wasn't properly bonded from the start, no galvanization involved.

    It's just slightly annoying and not a big deal. The insert can bond to the seat tube in such a huge area that the bond would probably support 10 tons when it's done right.

  50. #50
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    Seat tube bonding

    Well I had that problem also here in Barcelona Spain, my seatube was loose, I contacted Ibis quick answer and I rebonded.....not much problem , but annoying in a new beand bike.....but the bike is just great !!!

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