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  1. #1
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    Ibis Mojo HD or Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon? Tough decision - Where are the HD reviews??

    Hi, I am looking for a new all-mountain rig. After many hours of raping google I have 2 favorites: The Ibis Mojo HD and the Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon.
    I expect the Nomad Carbon to ride almost the same as the normal alloy Nomad. It will be stiffer and lighter but performance should be the same.
    But what about the Mojo HD? I've seen some people already having their frames but no reviews yet?
    Both bikes have nearly the same geometry so it comes down to suspension performance I think. Which one will have the edge on that?
    I usually prefer coil shocks but Ibis mentioned that the Mojo HD is working best with an air shock. So a Nomad Carbon with a good coil vs. Mojo HD with the air?
    Has someone been able to test ride both?

  2. #2
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    nice problem to have.

    I'm biased but I think the Mojo HD looks awesome

  3. #3
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    Only review I've seen has been on the turner forum - and that is probably just a troll.

  4. #4
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    Your dilemma is a lovely one. I've owned and loved a Nomad for years, sometimes as my main ride. I've got a Mojo SL now and for me it comes down to the suspension when climbing under power. I *love* how the Ibis flavor of DW works going uphill.

    The Nomad I had was on the lighter side at 30.5lbs and in general it shined. What slowly started annoying the sh!t out of me was the pedal kickback when climbing tech, usually square-edged bumpy sections. This is the achilles heel of the VPP IMO. I know they've improved the design some, but I suspect it's still there.

    The DW Mojo just feels more neutral. I suspect the HD will continue that tradition.
    - -benja- -

  5. #5
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    There is a short writ up in the AZ forum.

  6. #6
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    My standard Mojo C rides and pedals smoother than the aluminum Nomads I've ridden. And my Mojo rear braking is grippier, more powerful, before locking up or skipping traction. I like the looks of both the HD and the Nomad frames without the stripes, the HD stripes are more pleasing to my eyes.

    I can only imagine the HD is even more plush and smooth, more so night and day in suspension quality with DWL and similar travel to the Nomad VPP.

  7. #7
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    OK, so there's 10 posts on this thread now, and nobody has answered the OP's question:

    "Has someone been able to ride both?"

    All together now: "NO"

    just trying to slow down the e-speculation train as it leaves the station.
    here we go again

  8. #8
    The Crow
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    Review on Turner thread
    Mojo HD: A REAL Thoroughbred
    There's a feeling I get
    When I look to the West
    And my spirit is crying for leaving

  9. #9
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    Hope some people will come with reviews on the weekend.
    What make me wondering a bit: Shimano was showing their news 3x10 drivetrain on the Mojo HD but no reviews on the bike they rode?
    Come on guys, their are already some lucky owners of the HD out their, please post your comments on the new bike.

    For me the most important thing is the suspension. They should ride somewhat similar due to their geometry, but how is the suspension working on both the Mojo HD and the Nomad?

  10. #10
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    I am planning to hit the demo on Sunday to ride the HD. There is a short rock wall section on the trail where they are demoing that I can push it through its paces on (not too hard since its not my bike). I will ride it on the same trail back to back with my uzzi VP for a good comparison between the two. I will post something here if I do indeed make it out.

    I unfortunately haven't ridden a V.2 nomad to give a comparison there.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithrider
    I am planning to hit the demo on Sunday to ride the HD. There is a short rock wall section on the trail where they are demoing that I can push it through its paces on (not too hard since its not my bike). I will ride it on the same trail back to back with my uzzi VP for a good comparison between the two. I will post something here if I do indeed make it out.

    I unfortunately haven't ridden a V.2 nomad to give a comparison there.

    That would be great. I know the Uzzi so it would help me (and others as well) I think.

  12. #12
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    If you literally couldn't call it either way, I'd get the Mojo HD for the absolutely flawless warranty, at least 3 years of confidence you'll be sorted out. Only 2 years on the Santa Cruz and it's quite a bit bigger company.

  13. #13
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    For me the decision was easy. The DW link suspension simply pedals more effeciently than the VPP2 used by Santa Cruz. I know this first hand as I ride both a Mojo SL and a Santa Cruz Blur XCc, and look forward to getting the Mojo HD built up (waiting on Fox fork). The pedal feedback on the blur is noticible, though minimized by my conversion of to the XX 2x10 drivetrain (bigger ring), It was very noticible w/ 3x9 granny, where I made a subconscience effort to stay in the middle ring. So the DW link provides a more plush travel, better climbing traction overall. The Mojo HD for this reason wins out over Nomad. I must say, however that the SC carbon Nomad is one beautiful frame. I think Santa Cruz has a little better carbon formula, as my blur frame is uber stiff and has little details like molded cable guides that are lacking in the Ibis.

  14. #14
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    I was trying to decide between Blur LT/Mojo/Nomad/Mojo HD. I first tried the Blur and Nomad and really liked them although they didn't feel as plush as when I got to try the Mojo and the Mojo felt like it climbed better. One factor for me was I am right in between sizes of L and XL on both brands and the Ibis XL is slightly smaller than SC XL, only about 0.2 inches in top and head tube and 0.7 in wheelbase??? so was leaning that way.

    Once I got to try the HD, I was sold right away. Didn't have much time on it but it just felt "right" for me. Another factor dissuading me from the Nomad was that there isn't a very clear preference on what rear shock to use. Seems pretty split on whether to use air or coil whereas the Mojos were designed around the air, so right of the bat, lighter frame and shocks on the Ibis side.

    Lastly, the Mojo HD is priced equivalently to the aluminium Nomad and around here, the carbon would have been ~$3-500 more, so that was a bonus too.

  15. #15
    Fragglepuss The Chaste
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    These comparison debates always turn out a bit odd/biased especially when asked in a particular brand's forum.
    Do you prefer VPP or a DW-Link bike? Once you figure that out you'll know which bike you want. You can't go wrong with either brand.

  16. #16
    Solo Bici Magazine Spain
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    Hi there! I have ridden both. I mostly do agree with Buggycanman and Robnow. I have to say I have ridden pretty much every bike from Santa Cruz and IBIS. Although it had more pedal feedback, more chain extension, etc... I really liked VPP first generation bikes. Higher virtual pivot trajectory, different position of the links made a plusher ride you cannot find on any -Blur xc c, Blur LTc or Nomad c now, compared with the let's say old ones. I have been recently riding these SC carbon bikes and I will also say the Blur LT is a good all terrain bike but it has a too steep HA, too slack SA, pedals better than the XC carbon but you still beg for a more capable, plusher overall ride and rear suspension. Pedals too good for this 5.5 bike.
    But Blur LTc is way stiffer, great links etc, but not as good overall plush ride as the Ibis Mojo Carbon. I have and Ibis Mojo for 2 years now and I have to admit it is the best bike I have ever ridden. This 5.5 inch bike is my cross country-trail bike with a super light kit and it really shines climbing anywhere any gear (of course some granny feedback you can of course admit and cannot complain about) and it is almost a downhill bike going down. So impressive the downhill skills of the standard Mojo. Better going down than any other DW similar bike you can compare. Of course I would prefer more stiffness here or there or even a slacker HA, 67º should also be a standard for 5.5 bikes.

    Going back to Nomad Carbon and IBIS HD.
    The Nomad is sooo beautiful. Pedals good, good geometry -Santa Cruz trademark geo- good overall bike/ride.
    IBIS HD. Pedals impressibly well, better than the Nomad for sure, middle and big ring effectiveness is so impressive. It pedals better than some of even most 4" to 5" inch bikes. Test it to believe. For the tech geeks middle ring anti-squat is on the 100% level all the time meaning effectiveness is there, with no pedal induced feedback of rear suspension bobing interference on most cogs. Geometry feels just perfect. If you like longer travel bikes perhaps you would have preferred a slacker HA. But with a Lyrik or a 36 from Fox (I have been testing the HD with a Fox 36 Talas 2011) feels just right for any type of riding. And there is always room for a more tight BB height which makes a difference. On the HD feels just okay.
    The ride is soo precise. HD is so stiff. Nomad is also very very stiff and if you look into details you realise the Nomad is a piece of art. But so is the HD. I could also notice more stiffness on the rear end maybe because of the thru axle of the HD. That makes a difference for the ones of you looking for a more extreme ride where you can really benefit of this. I am not saying the Nomad is flexy, you can really feel some kind of flex if you compare and hey, flex is welcome in some cases, and the Nomad carbon feels just right. Another key note. I rode the HD with Fox Talas front, RP23 Boostvalve rear. A perfect match. You can also fit a DHX Air on HD M, L XT. I rode the Nomad with a DHX Air and Lyrik 170 Motion Control DH fork. Rear suspension designs are different, shocks are different, you can play more with the DHX Air to allow you to dial the ride to your likings but the result is that I also felt that the HD has a more supple ride over bumps compared to the Nomad. Hey this is just what I was feeling from a 2 day ride on the HD and 5 day ride on the Nomad carbon. If you buy a Nomad you will never have a problem. Any of them are perfect bets. Nomad c frame is bomb-proof and rear suspension is now with the VPP2 100% reliable -as it is on any other alu SC bikes- and you will not have to suffer noisy rides as with first gen VPP past bikes. Mojo HD is so beautiful too. For my liking this is now my first choice if I could buy a new bike now. It will never dissapoint you. If you are a hardcore xc profile guy you will love the new HD, but hey, have you ridden the standard Mojo?? The HD for sure is way stiffer and it offers a completely different ride but for maybe 95% users I would recommend the Mojo over the HD. I love the HD as it stands as the perfect example of high technology and the latest of our passion nowadays which is mountain biking. A 160 mm bike that can handle anything and pedals as good or better than most xc bikes? Oh my God, take a ride and let us know. Of course the Nomad is a good example here too. You can build these HD/Nomad bikes for a more xc ride or a more freeride use. I think the Nomad is perhaps more suited for a more freeride oriented ride but then you realise it is not a slack as it needs to be, but feels okay for most of the ride but the steepest downhills. You can run a guide and single ring if you want it too on the HD too. Ask Lopes and see his results on the HD. Awesome.
    I would spec both with 2x10 if I could and in both cases you will have a better pedal efficiency compared to using a 22 or 24 granny. Thru axle 135x12 on the HD is just perfect in a world that, from 2011 on, we will all be using thru axles (135x12 and 142x12 mm) in all or most of our bikes. From full suspension xc to downhill rear thru axles makes sense. For any bike from the Specialized Epic to the Santa Cruz V10 thru axles makes sense.
    Last one. This DW Link HD design might appear to be and old design as it is, but it gets the best out of a air shock. Being regressive then rising rate, coupled with a tuned Fox RP23 shock makes a simply great ride. I felt the Santa Cruz Nomad carbon more rising towards the end than the HD which I didn't like (the Nomad being so rising). I prefer a more linear stroke, that I think I could have had playing more with the DHX Air.
    Although I really had a great and unforgetable times riding the Nomad in the Santa Cruz area / mountains, I would say that I like the HD more. Fox 36 Float,Easton Haven wheels and 2x10 combo and i will be happy. Oh, Joplin post or something similar for the big rides is mandatory too. But for the rest?? I would not change my standard Mojo 5.5 bike for nothing.
    The only problem for the HD is that there are still just a few available. You'd better place your order now if you really like it. Weights and pricing are similar. In this high end high tech bikes how good a bike look is also very important. And hey, for most of us is the most important thing. Bling bling factor is a key thing too, right? hehe.
    I don't know if I am helping somehow or confusing but I would just like to be fair on my comments as I have had the chance to ride all VPP bikes from Santa Cruz from 2001 on (where is the original Blur awesome ride pleaseeee!!!!!) and latest from IBIS too.
    If any question I would try to answer soon.
    Have a great riding weekend and happy trails !!!

  17. #17
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    I got to test ride the HD for 40 minutes this morning. I currently have a pivot firebird.

    Because it was such a quick ride, I didn't really get a chance to dial in the suspension completely. I did a steep climb (botasso link trail) and turned around and did the downhill.

    When climbing, the HD felt a lot like the mojo that I demoed last year. The suspension was compliant on the uphill, and had a nice buttery feel to it, softer than the pivot. I didn't feel like it was inefficient at all though. I had propedal turned off the whole time. Like with the firebird, with the head angle you really have to be alert on steep climbs so you don't steer off the trail.

    When I turned around and rode the downhill - the suspension felt pretty firm to me. At the bottom I took out 10lbs from the rear shock and went partway up the climb again. It steepened up the head angle and made it a little tougher to steer going up, but it still felt ok for pedaling, if a little too soft. Going down the suspension was definitely much more plush. So I've tried too plush and too stiff on the suspension, and in both I thought the pedaling was fine. So there's probably a level in the middle that's just right. I didn't play with the rebound at all either, so that might play a role.

    Handling was nice - I think the bike had a longish stem on it (maybe 100mm?) and I felt fairly stretched out when seated. On the descent though I didn't feel like I was reaching for the bar, good stuff. I'd probably go a bit shorter on the stem.

    I have a heckler, and that's a bike that likes to pop a wheelie. The firebird has longer chainstays and its more of a task to ride the back wheel. The HD is a bit less long in the chainstays and so it was easier to wheelie than the pivot I think.

    So to sum up, firebird vs HD:

    - climbing, the HD has that great mojo feel to it, it rounds off the bumps yet still feels efficient. There is something to be said for the pivot though, it feels super solid when pedaling, if a less compliant on rocks and roots.

    - descending, I have to give the nod to the firebird for now. This is basically because I have it more dialed in for me suspension wise. Probably, the HD suspension could be set up to be just right also, but I didn't get a chance to do that.

    - handling, I think the bikes are about even. The HD is maybe a little more playful with the shorter chainstays, while the pivot might be a little more stable for the same reason, but its not a huge difference. The steering geometry is very similar.

    Other stuff:

    the test bike had the new 11 speed XT drivetrain with a 36 tooth gear in the back and a 24 tooth granny in the front. Shifting was fine although the FD needed some tuning. I didn't feel at a loss for gears.

    There was also one of the new CB joplin 4s on there. Unlike my 3 inch joplin it stayed down when in the down position, and up in the up position. Better seals, or just hasn't developed the problems yet? Who knows. I might spring for the 125$ upgrade in a few months if it has good reviews.

    Last was the WTB mutano 2.4 tires. These looked pretty much identical to the mutano raptors I've run in the past, maybe a little bigger than I remember them. They were set up tubeless on some crank brothers wheels, I put the pressure at about 22-23lbs. On the way up I lost grip a couple times on the damp roots and rocks. I'm not sure if grip would have been any better with a different tire or not. The back tire had a bit of wear on it. I'm a fan of the mutanos, so I'm glad to seem them updated with the tougher sidewalls and UST style bead.

  18. #18
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    Good reviews!

  19. #19
    Dirt Drifter
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    Bonking ... not feelin' well Wow

    I really appreciate the time you put in to the response, but man being strait forward with your opinion and less talking in circles would be nice.



    Quote Originally Posted by Isracing
    Hi there! I have ridden both. I mostly do agree with Buggycanman and Robnow. I have to say I have ridden pretty much every bike from Santa Cruz and IBIS. Although it had more pedal feedback, more chain extension, etc... I really liked VPP first generation bikes. Higher virtual pivot trajectory, different position of the links made a plusher ride you cannot find on any -Blur xc c, Blur LTc or Nomad c now, compared with the let's say old ones. I have been recently riding these SC carbon bikes and I will also say the Blur LT is a good all terrain bike but it has a too steep HA, too slack SA, pedals better than the XC carbon but you still beg for a more capable, plusher overall ride and rear suspension. Pedals too good for this 5.5 bike.
    But Blur LTc is way stiffer, great links etc, but not as good overall plush ride as the Ibis Mojo Carbon. I have and Ibis Mojo for 2 years now and I have to admit it is the best bike I have ever ridden. This 5.5 inch bike is my cross country-trail bike with a super light kit and it really shines climbing anywhere any gear (of course some granny feedback you can of course admit and cannot complain about) and it is almost a downhill bike going down. So impressive the downhill skills of the standard Mojo. Better going down than any other DW similar bike you can compare. Of course I would prefer more stiffness here or there or even a slacker HA, 67º should also be a standard for 5.5 bikes.

    Going back to Nomad Carbon and IBIS HD.
    The Nomad is sooo beautiful. Pedals good, good geometry -Santa Cruz trademark geo- good overall bike/ride.
    IBIS HD. Pedals impressibly well, better than the Nomad for sure, middle and big ring effectiveness is so impressive. It pedals better than some of even most 4" to 5" inch bikes. Test it to believe. For the tech geeks middle ring anti-squat is on the 100% level all the time meaning effectiveness is there, with no pedal induced feedback of rear suspension bobing interference on most cogs. Geometry feels just perfect. If you like longer travel bikes perhaps you would have preferred a slacker HA. But with a Lyrik or a 36 from Fox (I have been testing the HD with a Fox 36 Talas 2011) feels just right for any type of riding. And there is always room for a more tight BB height which makes a difference. On the HD feels just okay.
    The ride is soo precise. HD is so stiff. Nomad is also very very stiff and if you look into details you realise the Nomad is a piece of art. But so is the HD. I could also notice more stiffness on the rear end maybe because of the thru axle of the HD. That makes a difference for the ones of you looking for a more extreme ride where you can really benefit of this. I am not saying the Nomad is flexy, you can really feel some kind of flex if you compare and hey, flex is welcome in some cases, and the Nomad carbon feels just right. Another key note. I rode the HD with Fox Talas front, RP23 Boostvalve rear. A perfect match. You can also fit a DHX Air on HD M, L XT. I rode the Nomad with a DHX Air and Lyrik 170 Motion Control DH fork. Rear suspension designs are different, shocks are different, you can play more with the DHX Air to allow you to dial the ride to your likings but the result is that I also felt that the HD has a more supple ride over bumps compared to the Nomad. Hey this is just what I was feeling from a 2 day ride on the HD and 5 day ride on the Nomad carbon. If you buy a Nomad you will never have a problem. Any of them are perfect bets. Nomad c frame is bomb-proof and rear suspension is now with the VPP2 100% reliable -as it is on any other alu SC bikes- and you will not have to suffer noisy rides as with first gen VPP past bikes. Mojo HD is so beautiful too. For my liking this is now my first choice if I could buy a new bike now. It will never dissapoint you. If you are a hardcore xc profile guy you will love the new HD, but hey, have you ridden the standard Mojo?? The HD for sure is way stiffer and it offers a completely different ride but for maybe 95% users I would recommend the Mojo over the HD. I love the HD as it stands as the perfect example of high technology and the latest of our passion nowadays which is mountain biking. A 160 mm bike that can handle anything and pedals as good or better than most xc bikes? Oh my God, take a ride and let us know. Of course the Nomad is a good example here too. You can build these HD/Nomad bikes for a more xc ride or a more freeride use. I think the Nomad is perhaps more suited for a more freeride oriented ride but then you realise it is not a slack as it needs to be, but feels okay for most of the ride but the steepest downhills. You can run a guide and single ring if you want it too on the HD too. Ask Lopes and see his results on the HD. Awesome.
    I would spec both with 2x10 if I could and in both cases you will have a better pedal efficiency compared to using a 22 or 24 granny. Thru axle 135x12 on the HD is just perfect in a world that, from 2011 on, we will all be using thru axles (135x12 and 142x12 mm) in all or most of our bikes. From full suspension xc to downhill rear thru axles makes sense. For any bike from the Specialized Epic to the Santa Cruz V10 thru axles makes sense.
    Last one. This DW Link HD design might appear to be and old design as it is, but it gets the best out of a air shock. Being regressive then rising rate, coupled with a tuned Fox RP23 shock makes a simply great ride. I felt the Santa Cruz Nomad carbon more rising towards the end than the HD which I didn't like (the Nomad being so rising). I prefer a more linear stroke, that I think I could have had playing more with the DHX Air.
    Although I really had a great and unforgetable times riding the Nomad in the Santa Cruz area / mountains, I would say that I like the HD more. Fox 36 Float,Easton Haven wheels and 2x10 combo and i will be happy. Oh, Joplin post or something similar for the big rides is mandatory too. But for the rest?? I would not change my standard Mojo 5.5 bike for nothing.
    The only problem for the HD is that there are still just a few available. You'd better place your order now if you really like it. Weights and pricing are similar. In this high end high tech bikes how good a bike look is also very important. And hey, for most of us is the most important thing. Bling bling factor is a key thing too, right? hehe.
    I don't know if I am helping somehow or confusing but I would just like to be fair on my comments as I have had the chance to ride all VPP bikes from Santa Cruz from 2001 on (where is the original Blur awesome ride pleaseeee!!!!!) and latest from IBIS too.
    If any question I would try to answer soon.
    Have a great riding weekend and happy trails !!!
    Courtney

  20. #20
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    I just got back from riding the Mojo HD. Here is my mini review. I will do it as a comparison to my current bike (Intense Uzzi VP with DHX-Air) and Pivot Firebird which I spent a few days on in Moab.

    There are a few caveats I want to throw into this review. The HD was setup with some less than stellar tires (Mutano’s I believe) and a really long stem for this class of bike. The trail was also very crowded so I was only able to get the flow going in a few sections and down the most important part, the rock garden.

    Climbing

    Winner hands down is the HD. Color me a believer in the DW Link. No pedal feedback and I did not perceive any pedal bob. The thing just climbed like no other while soaking up the technical features on the trail. I was really impressed with how this thing performed.

    A pretty close second goes to the Firebird. It was a bit stiffer off the top giving it a nice platform but it loses out because the HD absorbed the technical climbs better while offering the same perceived benefits from the anti-squat. Both brilliant climbers for what they are.

    My Uzzi brings up the rear. The VPP2 is almost equal to the DW Links in the middle ring but doesn’t seem to have the same pep in the granny. There isn’t the nasty pedal feedback anymore but it just doesn’t have the same pep / drive as the two above-mentioned rigs. It still suffers from a bit of mid-stroke wallow as well with the DHX-A which hurts its climbing to a certain extent. That said, it is not a bad climber just not great. But hey, it’s more on the FR side and I am comparing it to two of the best climbers I have ridden.

    Descending

    First place goes to the Uzzi. This thing just rips. This result is really not a surprise as it is more on the FR side than the other two frames as I mentioned above.

    It feels longer (it is), slacker (slightly with my talas 36 and standard king headset – 66.7 degrees) and lower than the other bikes (even though the numbers don’t say its lower but about the same). I think it feels lower than the others because the VPP/DHX-A begs you to ride it with more sag than the DW bikes. I ride 33% sag on my air shock on the uzzi and never knock the ring off. I rode the HD with much less sag and drove the ring right to the end of the travel without pushing it too hard today. This increased sag, combined with longer travel leads to a low riding bike that loves to carve. The other thing about the Uzzi that I like is the longer top tube (which leads to longer wheel base as well) allows me to run a short stem without feeling too cramped. I really like large frames that are longer in the wheelbase and top tube with a 50mm stem and wide bar. This is personal preference though.

    There are two negatives for descending on the Uzzi. First, if things get flat and tight, you wrestle with the bike a bit but that is where the Talas comes in handy. Second, with the DHX-A in the seven inch mode (haven’t used 6.5 yet) the curve could use a bit more mid stroke support for popping off jumps and a bit less ramp at the end of the stroke. This type of curve is a positive for the low riding mentioned above but I would like to see it go a bit back in the other direction. This is also a consequence of the curve being designed around a coil. The upside to this is it soaks up EVERYTHING.

    Second goes to the Firebird. The Firebird’s geometry made it more similar to the Uzzi just watered down a little bit. It felt longer and lower than the HD and it was really a fun bike when things got hairy. It was one of those bikes that I almost immediately felt at home on when I started on my first ride with it on Hazard/UPS/LPS/Porc - which is saying something.

    The negative here is I really didn’t think the DW link was well sorted for downhill on this bike. I was getting bucked around a lot on square edged hits no matter what I did to the suspension. Geometry is more important than suspension performance to me so it is no way a deal breaker but I think this could be improved upon (or my shock tuning sharpened???).

    Third goes to the HD. Don’t take third as this bike didn’t handle downhill well because it did. It is just third in comparison to the two bikes above which are great descenders. I will start with the pros first. I cannot say enough about the rear suspension action. The rear end on this bike is just eutopia. It was firm and controlled yet plush. Amazing mid-stroke support for an airshock. I would have liked a bit more ramp at the end of travel but that is a very MINOR request. The back end just inspired confidence on the way down. I would also say this bike takes flight off lips better than any bike I have ridden. It launches you into the air effortlessly and markedly higher than the other two. This made for a very fun ride.

    The reason it slipped to third is that it just felt a bit higher, shorter and less stable going down than the other two bikes. Not by a wide margin but it felt a bit more trail oriented. This also could have had a bit to do with the setup on the bike as well (more trail oriented stem, bars and tires). This thing was still a ripper.

    There is my quick review. I think the best thing I can say about it is next time I am in the market for a new frame, the HD will be in the top one or two slots for consideration. Hands down, the HD offers the least compromises within the all mountain realm (for bikes I have ridden) for someone looking to keep up with their XC buddies and rip it the next day down a steep rocky trail.

    I would really like to try one setup with better tires and cockpit at some point for a better comparison.

    On a side note, I really couldn’t tell a difference between the carbon on the HD and the aluminum on every other bike I have ridden. Not sure if it is a bit placebo or if my butt isn’t as sensitive to the deadening sensation carbon provides. However, I have no hesitance in buying a carbon frame that is well designed.

    Cheers to the Ibis guys who were great in talking about the bike and getting me setup!

  21. #21
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    Thanks for your review too. Which size was the Mojo and how long was the stem on it (and how tall are you)?
    You also said you've run much less sag on the Mojo HD than on your Uzzi (which is about 33%). When I remember correctly this is not the best for the Mojo. I think it has to be ridden with about 30-40% sag. That's what DW said in a thread here on mtbr.

    I am really close on ordering a Mojo HD instead of the Nomad Carbon right now. Regardless the riding qualities it has a few things that I miss on the Nomad like a 12mm axle in the rear (very importand to have a thru axle today I think) and better color choices (I would go for the Vitamin P on the HD). It even has the postmount standard for the rear brake which is great I think.
    What I am not very sure about is the size I should get. I normally tend to ride medium frames so far but it seems that a lot of riders with my size (6') are going for a large mojo. But some are on mediums too so that's my hardest decision right now.
    I also will swap the RP23 for a custom tuned coil shock I think.

  22. #22
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    It was a large mojo. The stem looked like a 100mm or so. I am 6'1 and 205 with gear.

    The man himself set me up on the HD and actually made the rear a bit softer than normal due to the shock pump crapping out towards the end of the adjustments. They may say it likes more sag but it doesn't seem to cope with the less air to achieve that sag at the end of stroke as well as the VPP (not abhorent though as I still feel it has the best suspension action of the bunch - everything is a compromise. I also always blow through rp23's too easily on every frame I have ridden them on). The reason for my conclusion is I don't think I really pushed it too hard and used all of the travel on the bike. This could also have been due to a setup issue with too little air (who knows). It was just a quick test ride so take all of my comments with a grain of salt.

    It is a great bike and I really enjoyed it. I am sure you will not be dissapointed. Like I said, I would consider getting one myself. There really aren't too many compromises with this frame.

    Edit: I would also take this over the Firebird without hesitation. I think IBIS did themselves a huge disservice with how they setup their bikes. I am sure a proper setup would narrow if not almost eliminate the descending gap between the two frames from a geometry/feel perspective. Combine this with the better suspension and really good climbing and I would take it over the Pivot. And the Pivot is d*** ugly.
    Last edited by smithrider; 05-16-2010 at 02:40 PM.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithrider
    I just got back from riding the Mojo HD. Here is my mini review. I will do it as a comparison to my current bike (Intense Uzzi VP with DHX-Air) and Pivot Firebird which I spent a few days on in Moab.

    There are a few caveats I want to throw into this review. The HD was setup with some less than stellar tires (Mutano’s I believe) and a really long stem for this class of bike. The trail was also very crowded so I was only able to get the flow going in a few sections and down the most important part, the rock garden.

    Climbing

    Winner hands down is the HD. Color me a believer in the DW Link. No pedal feedback and I did not perceive any pedal bob. The thing just climbed like no other while soaking up the technical features on the trail. I was really impressed with how this thing performed.

    A pretty close second goes to the Firebird. It was a bit stiffer off the top giving it a nice platform but it loses out because the HD absorbed the technical climbs better while offering the same perceived benefits from the anti-squat. Both brilliant climbers for what they are.

    My Uzzi brings up the rear. The VPP2 is almost equal to the DW Links in the middle ring but doesn’t seem to have the same pep in the granny. There isn’t the nasty pedal feedback anymore but it just doesn’t have the same pep / drive as the two above-mentioned rigs. It still suffers from a bit of mid-stroke wallow as well with the DHX-A which hurts its climbing to a certain extent. That said, it is not a bad climber just not great. But hey, it’s more on the FR side and I am comparing it to two of the best climbers I have ridden.

    Descending

    First place goes to the Uzzi. This thing just rips. This result is really not a surprise as it is more on the FR side than the other two frames as I mentioned above.

    It feels longer (it is), slacker (slightly with my talas 36 and standard king headset – 66.7 degrees) and lower than the other bikes (even though the numbers don’t say its lower but about the same). I think it feels lower than the others because the VPP/DHX-A begs you to ride it with more sag than the DW bikes. I ride 33% sag on my air shock on the uzzi and never knock the ring off. I rode the HD with much less sag and drove the ring right to the end of the travel without pushing it too hard today. This increased sag, combined with longer travel leads to a low riding bike that loves to carve. The other thing about the Uzzi that I like is the longer top tube (which leads to longer wheel base as well) allows me to run a short stem without feeling too cramped. I really like large frames that are longer in the wheelbase and top tube with a 50mm stem and wide bar. This is personal preference though.

    There are two negatives for descending on the Uzzi. First, if things get flat and tight, you wrestle with the bike a bit but that is where the Talas comes in handy. Second, with the DHX-A in the seven inch mode (haven’t used 6.5 yet) the curve could use a bit more mid stroke support for popping off jumps and a bit less ramp at the end of the stroke. This type of curve is a positive for the low riding mentioned above but I would like to see it go a bit back in the other direction. This is also a consequence of the curve being designed around a coil. The upside to this is it soaks up EVERYTHING.

    Second goes to the Firebird. The Firebird’s geometry made it more similar to the Uzzi just watered down a little bit. It felt longer and lower than the HD and it was really a fun bike when things got hairy. It was one of those bikes that I almost immediately felt at home on when I started on my first ride with it on Hazard/UPS/LPS/Porc - which is saying something.

    The negative here is I really didn’t think the DW link was well sorted for downhill on this bike. I was getting bucked around a lot on square edged hits no matter what I did to the suspension. Geometry is more important than suspension performance to me so it is no way a deal breaker but I think this could be improved upon (or my shock tuning sharpened???).

    Third goes to the HD. Don’t take third as this bike didn’t handle downhill well because it did. It is just third in comparison to the two bikes above which are great descenders. I will start with the pros first. I cannot say enough about the rear suspension action. The rear end on this bike is just eutopia. It was firm and controlled yet plush. Amazing mid-stroke support for an airshock. I would have liked a bit more ramp at the end of travel but that is a very MINOR request. The back end just inspired confidence on the way down. I would also say this bike takes flight off lips better than any bike I have ridden. It launches you into the air effortlessly and markedly higher than the other two. This made for a very fun ride.

    The reason it slipped to third is that it just felt a bit higher, shorter and less stable going down than the other two bikes. Not by a wide margin but it felt a bit more trail oriented. This also could have had a bit to do with the setup on the bike as well (more trail oriented stem, bars and tires). This thing was still a ripper.

    There is my quick review. I think the best thing I can say about it is next time I am in the market for a new frame, the HD will be in the top one or two slots for consideration. Hands down, the HD offers the least compromises within the all mountain realm (for bikes I have ridden) for someone looking to keep up with their XC buddies and rip it the next day down a steep rocky trail.

    I would really like to try one setup with better tires and cockpit at some point for a better comparison.

    On a side note, I really couldn’t tell a difference between the carbon on the HD and the aluminum on every other bike I have ridden. Not sure if it is a bit placebo or if my butt isn’t as sensitive to the deadening sensation carbon provides. However, I have no hesitance in buying a carbon frame that is well designed.

    Cheers to the Ibis guys who were great in talking about the bike and getting me setup!

    thanks for the great writeup.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fadl
    Has someone been able to test ride both?
    Good to see a direct ride experience comparison, and reviews of the HD ride compared with the alu version Nomads and even much longer travel 7.5 inch travel Uzzi VPP. It sounds like carbon fiber didn't magically transform the VPP suspension to be competitive with DWL quality.

    The XC race length stem on the HD is puzzling. I guess Ibis is showcasing the HD as a crossover bike. The frame certainly is as light as many aluminum 4 inch travel XC bikes. And more experience DH oriented riders can look past the long stem fit position. Maybe the demo team could carry some 70mm stems to give riders a moderately shorter stem choice for more AM/FR oriented riders.

    The HD is off to a raving review start!

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithrider
    It was a large mojo. The stem looked like a 100mm or so. I am 6'1 and 205 with gear.

    The man himself set me up on the HD and actually made the rear a bit softer than normal due to the shock pump crapping out towards the end of the adjustments. They may say it likes more sag but it doesn't seem to cope with the less air to achieve that sag at the end of stroke as well as the VPP (not abhorent though as I still feel it has the best suspension action of the bunch - everything is a compromise. I also always blow through rp23's too easily on every frame I have ridden them on). The reason for my conclusion is I don't think I really pushed it too hard and used all of the travel on the bike. This could also have been due to a setup issue with too little air (who knows). It was just a quick test ride so take all of my comments with a grain of salt.

    It is a great bike and I really enjoyed it. I am sure you will not be dissapointed. Like I said, I would consider getting one myself. There really aren't too many compromises with this frame.

    Edit: I would also take this over the Firebird without hesitation. I think IBIS did themselves a huge disservice with how they setup their bikes. I am sure a proper setup would narrow if not almost eliminate the descending gap between the two frames from a geometry/feel perspective. Combine this with the better suspension and really good climbing and I would take it over the Pivot. And the Pivot is d*** ugly.
    Just like the standard Mojo's I'm betting it performs even awesome(r) with a custom tuned shock, some of the things you didn't like about the mojo (bottom out, sag level, etc) is cured with a PUSH tuned shock. You want to run deep sag on the Mojo just like your Uzzi, it makes a big difference in the ride quality. Unfortunately with the stock RP23's they wallow in the midstroke and bottom out more easily with the deeper sag until you have PUSH tune it.

    They should of put you on a XL with a 50mm stem without a doubt, Ibis seems to be able create some awesome frames but seems to have no idea how to setup a bike NON XC.

    OR they are heavily trying to market to their XC riders, putting the mutanoraptor 2.4's, the long stem, the triple chain ring,. the garbage crankbro wheels, etc etc, to make sure that it pedals nicely. I bet the last thing they want is for people to get on a HD and think that they don't need such a long travel bike since it doesn't pedal well. If so it would make sense to put on the fast rolling tires and the long stem etc so the xc guys figure hey why not have the extra travel it still pedals just as nicely.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yody
    Just like the standard Mojo's I'm betting it performs even awesome(r) with a custom tuned shock, some of the things you didn't like about the mojo (bottom out, sag level, etc) is cured with a PUSH tuned shock. You want to run deep sag on the Mojo just like your Uzzi, it makes a big difference in the ride quality. Unfortunately with the stock RP23's they wallow in the midstroke and bottom out more easily with the deeper sag until you have PUSH tune it.

    They should of put you on a XL with a 50mm stem without a doubt, Ibis seems to be able create some awesome frames but seems to have no idea how to setup a bike NON XC.

    OR they are heavily trying to market to their XC riders, putting the mutanoraptor 2.4's, the long stem, the triple chain ring,. the garbage crankbro wheels, etc etc, to make sure that it pedals nicely. I bet the last thing they want is for people to get on a HD and think that they don't need such a long travel bike since it doesn't pedal well. If so it would make sense to put on the fast rolling tires and the long stem etc so the xc guys figure hey why not have the extra travel it still pedals just as nicely.
    I think I would agree with everything you stated. I believe I am a minority in the market in how I like my bikes setup. They are catering to the masses who really should still be on a Mojo; hence the XC build.

    I would love to try an XL with a 50mm stem. I would just be concerned that the seattube would be too long. This would lengthen the WB and keep a respectable reach. Also, a push bottom out bumper and slightly higher HSC would fix the bottom out problem. That is why I didn't really see it as an issue.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithrider
    I think I would agree with everything you stated. I believe I am a minority in the market in how I like my bikes setup. They are catering to the masses who really should still be on a Mojo; hence the XC build.

    I would love to try an XL with a 50mm stem. I would just be concerned that the seattube would be too long. This would lengthen the WB and keep a respectable reach. Also, a push bottom out bumper and slightly higher HSC would fix the bottom out problem. That is why I didn't really see it as an issue.
    Right on, I feel exactly the same.

    At 6" tall I don't think the seattube would be an issue unless you were trying to run that 9" seat dropper.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithrider
    I think IBIS did themselves a huge disservice with how they setup their bikes.... ...And the Pivot is d*** ugly.
    Agreed on both counts.

    The HD should not be demo'd with anything over a 90mm stem, and even that's a bit much.

    As for Pivot aesthetics... They are not good looking bikes IMO. They lack the graceful lines of a Mojo, or the brutal utilitarian appeal of a 5-Spot. In the end, they just look like a kit of tubes built around a DW-link spec. They may ride lovely but they're not visually appealing in the least.
    - -benja- -

  29. #29
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    I think every stem longer than 70mm is not suiting the HD. It is a really rad bike and no xc racing bike.
    I will order mine asap after I've chosen my frame size....

  30. #30
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    My buddy is looking at a Mojo. Would a Mojo HD hold up to a aggressive 250 lb AM rider?

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by kntr
    My buddy is looking at a Mojo. Would a Mojo HD hold up to a aggressive 250 lb AM rider?
    yes.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by meph
    yes.
    Now that is convincing.

    I wish the HD came with ISCG tabs for a HammerSchmidt.
    Last edited by kntr; 05-19-2010 at 07:44 AM.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by kntr
    Now that is convincing.

    I wish the HD came with ISCG tabs for a HammerSchmidt.
    HammerSchmidt won't work good with the Mojo. The DWL is not designed for it.

  34. #34
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    pssh tough decision... how about the mojo sl or the mojo hd...? $100 bucks more...?! this is my new dilemma!

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrow209
    this is my new dilemma!
    Get one of each. No dilemma.
    08 Ibis Mojo SL
    09 Ibis Tranny SingleSpeed

  36. #36
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    haha i wish! but alas, i lack the funds of such a grand purchase and can pick only but one frame!

    sorry for the thread hijack...!

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fadl
    HammerSchmidt won't work good with the Mojo. The DWL is not designed for it.
    Who cares...

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by kntr
    Who cares...

    I know you don't

  39. #39
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    I hear the Mojo HD is not coming out till late summer. What is the word?

  40. #40
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    They are out now, but you might not be able to get your hands on one till then.

  41. #41
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    My buddy is 6'4" and 240 lb. What size do you guys recommend? Anyone know a shop with a L or XL in stock?

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by kntr
    I hear the Mojo HD is not coming out till late summer. What is the word?
    Patience.
    There's a feeling I get
    When I look to the West
    And my spirit is crying for leaving

  43. #43
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    I think Cal Coast Bikes has an X-large Vitamin P on the wall.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yody
    Just like the standard Mojo's I'm betting it performs even awesome(r) with a custom tuned shock, some of the things you didn't like about the mojo (bottom out, sag level, etc) is cured with a PUSH tuned shock. You want to run deep sag on the Mojo just like your Uzzi, it makes a big difference in the ride quality. Unfortunately with the stock RP23's they wallow in the midstroke and bottom out more easily with the deeper sag until you have PUSH tune it.

    They should of put you on a XL with a 50mm stem without a doubt, Ibis seems to be able create some awesome frames but seems to have no idea how to setup a bike NON XC.

    OR they are heavily trying to market to their XC riders, putting the mutanoraptor 2.4's, the long stem, the triple chain ring,. the garbage crankbro wheels, etc etc, to make sure that it pedals nicely. I bet the last thing they want is for people to get on a HD and think that they don't need such a long travel bike since it doesn't pedal well. If so it would make sense to put on the fast rolling tires and the long stem etc so the xc guys figure hey why not have the extra travel it still pedals just as nicely.
    Why do you say the Crank Brothers wheels are garbage? They having some issues? I just got my HD with the Iodines and they look great, but only been on a few rides.

    Greg

  45. #45
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    I've had a few friends who destroyed the rims, everything on them is proprietary, they're heavy, and I know that they had a lot of wheels with rear hubs that would literally just implode, although they might of fixed that issue, but if I recall, it was a big issue.

    For the money there are better wheels out there without the weirdo one-off spokes and are lighter, and stronger.

    Saying that I rode a set on a Blur LTC and they were very stiff, I'll give them that, but I think most people are just attracted to the fancy colors and look that they have. I've never delt with Crankbrothers wheel service department but I know I've had some real annoying issues everytime I have sent in my seat dropper, the people there did not instill any confidence after dropping the ball time after time.

    I'm a huge fan of the Easton Havens, although they run a proprietary rim and hub, at least if you break a spoke you're not screwed, and they're way lighter with equal strength and cheaper at that.

    If you already have a set, enjoy them. I'm sure the majority of the riders on them like them.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yody
    I've had a few friends who destroyed the rims, everything on them is proprietary, they're heavy, and I know that they had a lot of wheels with rear hubs that would literally just implode, although they might of fixed that issue, but if I recall, it was a big issue.

    For the money there are better wheels out there without the weirdo one-off spokes and are lighter, and stronger.

    Saying that I rode a set on a Blur LTC and they were very stiff, I'll give them that, but I think most people are just attracted to the fancy colors and look that they have. I've never delt with Crankbrothers wheel service department but I know I've had some real annoying issues everytime I have sent in my seat dropper, the people there did not instill any confidence after dropping the ball time after time.

    I'm a huge fan of the Easton Havens, although they run a proprietary rim and hub, at least if you break a spoke you're not screwed, and they're way lighter with equal strength and cheaper at that.

    If you already have a set, enjoy them. I'm sure the majority of the riders on them like them.
    Thanks for the info Yody.

    I had ordered I9 wheels, but they were not going to be available at the time my HD arrived, so I bailed at the last minute and went with the Iodines. I am pretty hard on wheels, so I should know soon if they are going to be problematic.

    I also have the brand new Joplin 4 and hope that they have fixed the issues with sliders.

  47. #47
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    I have a new joplin 4 myslef, its working ok, gets a lil spongy up top frequently but so far hasn't been a big issue, I had the 3 for a year or so, I got the bad service when I sent in the old 3 for the new 4 replacement program, they made a bunch of promises that they failedto deliver on and took an excessive amount of time to ship out the new one

  48. #48
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    So there are a lot of reviews about the Mojo HD, but not much experience with the Nomad Carbon.
    What I seem to be reading is that people aren't altogether ecstatic with the way the Mojo HD descends. It has an air shock, which kinda limits the DH-feel of the bike, something that the Nomad with an RC4 might not suffer from.
    So what do you guys think - pedaling be damned (they obviously both pedal well), what's going to descend rough stuff better? I used to FR and DH a 1st gen Nomad and was really happy until I got a VP Free, but I'm looking for something that can be a middle bike for me. I am as yet still undecided, but I think I'll keep my Mojo SL built up to ~25 lbs, and I have a dedicated DH bike too... I just want a bike for anything from lift assisted DH and jump trails to longish pedals around the Front Range (I only pedal so I can go back down).
    I'd be putting a DHX Air on the Mojo HD and probably the RC4 on the Nomad unless I can get my CCDB adjusted so that it makes the NomadC come alive like it did with my first Nomad.
    Again, those with experience riding the bikes (especially the NomadC!) would be appreciated. Impressions from those who ride more down than up would be even better - performance going down is much more important for me since both bikes climb well.
    I will probably build the bike into the low 30's with a 180mm RC2 TALAS and a double-bash setup.
    Thanks!

  49. #49
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    IMHO, the Mojo HD rocks. Period. Then again I use mine for AM riding, not as a park bike or shuttle Queen. I feel I have an honest opinion, as I also have a Mojo HD and SC Blur XCc in the stable (as well as demo time on the Nomad. My conclusion is that the DW link suspension pedals much better and decends better also, than the VPP2, utilized by both the SC Blur and Nomad. Flat out. So, the choice is yours. Cannot loose either way, depenfing on where you ride. The differences are indeed subtle, but real (unlike steel) !

  50. #50
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    Just like the original mojo, I think you could find somebody who could put a coil shock together for you that will work on the HD. I think its just that most off the shelf coils won't be optimum

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikkellison
    So there are a lot of reviews about the Mojo HD, but not much experience with the Nomad Carbon.
    What I seem to be reading is that people aren't altogether ecstatic with the way the Mojo HD descends. It has an air shock, which kinda limits the DH-feel of the bike, something that the Nomad with an RC4 might not suffer from.
    So what do you guys think - pedaling be damned (they obviously both pedal well), what's going to descend rough stuff better? I used to FR and DH a 1st gen Nomad and was really happy until I got a VP Free, but I'm looking for something that can be a middle bike for me. I am as yet still undecided, but I think I'll keep my Mojo SL built up to ~25 lbs, and I have a dedicated DH bike too... I just want a bike for anything from lift assisted DH and jump trails to longish pedals around the Front Range (I only pedal so I can go back down).
    I'd be putting a DHX Air on the Mojo HD and probably the RC4 on the Nomad unless I can get my CCDB adjusted so that it makes the NomadC come alive like it did with my first Nomad.
    Again, those with experience riding the bikes (especially the NomadC!) would be appreciated. Impressions from those who ride more down than up would be even better - performance going down is much more important for me since both bikes climb well.
    I will probably build the bike into the low 30's with a 180mm RC2 TALAS and a double-bash setup.
    Thanks!

    i wonder how the vivid air would perform on the mojohd or an evolver isx or an xfusion h3. the dhx air and rp23 seem to both struggle in the middle of their range. air does work and if the mojohd was designed around an air shock, it'd be interesting to see how it rides with one of the shocks i mentioned.

    sadly fox has the oe market cornered on air shocks. not that they're dogs, they just might not be the best match to the hd.

  52. #52
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    The debate continues...
    Mojo HD Pros:
    12x135mm T/A rear
    Coolest finish (IMO = raw carbon)
    Mojo HD Cons:
    Tapered headtube
    Proprietary chainguide
    No ISCG tabs
    Axle path is less rearward than then Nomad VPP2
    Leverage ratio being designed for an air shock exclusively means that I can't use a coil (which I want to since I want it to be almost DH-capable, and by DH-capable I mean roots, braking bumps and holes at speed with turns which was NOT the Canberra World's course where Lopes rode it).
    NomadC Pros:
    1.5" headtube
    ISCG tabs
    more rearward axle path
    Coil shock compatible
    NomadC Cons:
    Quick release rear
    Paint isn't as cool (IMO)

    I think the above are the major differences.
    However, I did find one interesting thing in my reading:

    ...so maybe it is possible to run certain coil shocks!

    So it really comes down to the through-axle that I love versus the axle path and the coil shock option. I'm just thinking that the Nomad would be that much better for DH with the axle path and coil shock.
    Last edited by erikkellison; 07-26-2010 at 12:07 AM.

  53. #53
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    There are people on the boards which run a coil on their Mojo. I think the key is having the shock tuned for the rider/bike. I currently run a Push MX Tune VAN R and other than the 1lb weight penalty it's awesome.
    As much as I want to loose some weight from the bike sometimes, I couldn't imagine riding it without the coil and I'm too cheap to spend the coin for a Ti spring...

  54. #54
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    I asked Ibis and was told the RC4 was compatable with the HD, since it has an air bottom out assist. I would love to hear a review from someone who converted their HD to coil.

    I'm not sure if it would be possible to spec the bike with the RC4, but you might want to contact Ibis about that if the coil shock is going to be the dealbreaker.

  55. #55
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    A number of factors are pointing me toward the Mojo HD at the same time... the rear axle, the finish, the warranty, the customer service, the fact that I'm going to get a 1-1/8" fork regardless of which bike I get. And I have an appropriately-sized CCDB anyway, so I can always experiment - what's the worst that can happen? The shock won't feel as good as the DHX Air.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikkellison
    A number of factors are pointing me toward the Mojo HD at the same time... the rear axle, the finish, the warranty, the customer service, the fact that I'm going to get a 1-1/8" fork regardless of which bike I get. And I have an appropriately-sized CCDB anyway, so I can always experiment - what's the worst that can happen? The shock won't feel as good as the DHX Air.
    From my understanding, the main issue with running a coil on a bike like the HD is that the leverage rate/kinematics are designed to take into account the progressive spring rate of an air shock. As the air shock compresses, the air spring volume decreases, thus increasing the spring rate as the shock cycles deeper into its stroke. The HV aircan minimizes this effect to some extent, but my understanding that in order to compensate for this effect the suspension design has a more linear rate curve, allowing the progressiveness of the airshock to control bottom out and overall suspension feel.

    Worst case by running a coil, the linear nature of most traditional coil shocks will lead to a ride that may bottom easy when set to proper sag. This can be handled with a custom tune and/or something as simple as running a larger bottom out bumper on the coil damper. It may also be necessary to run a slightly higher spring rate on the coil than what you may run on other bikes with this set-up.

    I plan to run a coil on my HD at some point (MX Tune VanR). I'm coming off a Intense SS with a Push MX Tune VanR. I'm running the standard RP23 on my HD and feel like the HD gives up very little if anything to my SS with the pimpy coil. Only thing I've noticed is a bit of damping inconsistency on long rough descents over the coil, but pretty minor at that. Also a strong believer that DW trumps VPP in every way now that I've spent some time on it. I've had 3 VPP bikes and this is my first DW bike. I'm a fan of DW now for sure. Also originally shared your view of the ISCG tabs and head-tube, but now I don't care, the HD rides so well and my e13 DRS works well without the ISCG. Also, the new CC angle headset set will work with the tapered HD headtube if you want to slack it out up to 1.5 degrees if you have a straight 1.125" steerer fork. Don't see the advantage to the 1.5 HT on the BromadC really.

    My $0.02 anyway...

    BY
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro....

  57. #57
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    HD with 2010 Marzocchi TST R Coil

    Has anyone done this to the HD in this forum?


    Please share your review if you have.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by marklky
    Has anyone done this to the HD in this forum?


    Please share your review if you have.

    Well, I'm not about to share a review with you because I haven't bought one yet. However, I would like to find out from you how that set up is treating you so far?

    I'm thinking of buying the HD and do it with coils and 180mm fork.

    I have a Mojo SL with 160mm Lyrik, Firebird with Totem solo air and Driver 8 with Dorado. All these bikes I like very much.

    I'm thinking to replace the Firebird with the HD and am not sure if it's going to be the right move.

    I'm not sure if the HD can do everything the Firebird can, plus a little more. I know the HD will climb better. But what about the other aspects?

    Of course the other choice is the Nomad C with RC4 (isn't what this thread is about?).

    So maybe a review from you could be helpful for my decision.

    Thanks

  59. #59
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    MTBR review..HD vs. Nomad vs. Remedy

    http://reviews.mtbr.com/interbike/sa...nterbike-2010/

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajaguy
    MTBR review..HD vs. Nomad vs. Remedy

    http://reviews.mtbr.com/interbike/sa...nterbike-2010/
    A very safe review, but better than nothing.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajaguy
    MTBR review..HD vs. Nomad vs. Remedy

    http://reviews.mtbr.com/interbike/sa...nterbike-2010/
    I also rode both of them at Interbike, and Francois and I agreed on most everything. I think the Nomad Carbon is a pretty sweet ride (as is the HD), and I got the joy of using one with a TALAS 180 and DHX Air. They both share some common traits, mostly due to the use of the carbon material, excellent damping qualities, stiff, muscular and taut. I liked the Nomad a tad better since I felt it was more plush on the nasty rocky shite and going downhill, with the slight edge going to the HD for longer climbs. And yes, I swear the carbon magically makes the VPP a better suspension system!

  62. #62
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    Better system itself or better than DW? I didn't get to ride the Nomad neither at Interbike or Northstar were they had them for free demos. Way too much people. I did get to ride the HD two times and I must say I was impressed, just faster and plusher than my SL. First time I tested it, the fork was not tuned right as it felt it didn't match the rear in plushnes, but on the other run the bike was more balanced, all the gnarl just disappeared, insane. The more i rode the bike the faster I was going in it, freaking awesome. A friend of mine did get to try both and did 4 runs on the downhill in the HD, lucky atomic ant, however haven't had the chance to ask him about his impressions. I rode Downieville for the first time in my SL this weekend and I felt like it was created for that kind of trail, I can imagine the HD must be awesome on it. I want one!!!, my SL will be for sale as soon as I can secure an HD.. One thing I noticed after a whole day testing other bikes and getting back on the HD for the final bike in the day was the pedaling efficiency, I was wasted as I've been riding for two days in that hellish heat, and when I hopped in the HD every pedal stroke was like what? just forward movement...

    Also rode the Firebird, which felt pretty close but it has a bigger build with the 180mm Float, shorter stem, wider bar and burlier parts. Felt less agile but more planted downhill like, maybe because of the longer wheelbase and fork. Tested a 5 spot, which felt very close to my SL, only stouter and heavier. All great bikes which I wouldn't hesitate to put my money on. Got to meet Chris and Dave W, both intelligent and humble guys. Chris is soon to do carbon.... In all had a great time up there, hope to be back soon, anyone has any job openings in Norcal for a trailbuilder bike addict??
    Last edited by Relayden; 09-29-2010 at 07:56 PM.

  63. #63
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    I´m attached the geometries of every bike

    (IBIS, NOMAD2 AND FIREBIRD)

    it´s time to talk with data....

    NOMINAL SIZE------------------------------- IBIS LARGE ---------------------------- NOMAD2 LARGE ---------------------------- FIREBIRD LARGE
    Seat Tube Length----------------------------- 19"------------------------------------------ 18,5"-------------------------------------------- 19"
    Top Tube Length------------------------------ 60,45cm------------------------------------- 60,3cm----------------------------------------60,9cm
    Head Tube Length------------------------------ 11,8cm-------------------------------------12,7cm------------------------------------------- 12,7cm
    Chainstay Length------------------------------- 435mm---------------------------------- 431,8mm-------------------------------------------- 431,8mm
    Seat Tube Angle---------------------------------- 71º-----------------------------------------71,5º------------------------------------------------ 71,5º
    Head Tube Angle----------------------------- 67º------------------------------------------ 67º------------------------------------------------ 67,2º
    Wheelbase--------------------------------------- 1134mm-------------------------------- 1143mm------------------------------------- (Not Found)
    Standover --------------------------------------- 760mm--------------------------------------736,6mm------------------------------------------711,2mm

  64. #64
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    If only those numbers translated into how the bikes performed! I wish analyzing a bike's performance were as easy as looking at the geo numbers! But you forgot some important numbers like the front-to-center distance which most MFGs don't list, but some are catching on. You could also throw up leverage ratio curves if you had them - maybe overlay those with chain growth curves. You also forgot weight - a very important number, especially since the Firebird is nowhere near close to the NomadC or MojoHD. Or what length seatpost you can fit inside the seat tube (an indicator of being able to get enough extension for pedaling and enough dropability for descending).
    And I'm sure that there are even more important numbers that only engineers discuss that are not made public. So much info. So much easier to just demo a bike

  65. #65
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    Having ridden the Nomad and HD pretty often, the med Nomad feels more like the large HD

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikkellison
    If only those numbers translated into how the bikes performed! I wish analyzing a bike's performance were as easy as looking at the geo numbers! But you forgot some important numbers like the front-to-center distance which most MFGs don't list, but some are catching on. You could also throw up leverage ratio curves if you had them - maybe overlay those with chain growth curves. You also forgot weight - a very important number, especially since the Firebird is nowhere near close to the NomadC or MojoHD. Or what length seatpost you can fit inside the seat tube (an indicator of being able to get enough extension for pedaling and enough dropability for descending).
    And I'm sure that there are even more important numbers that only engineers discuss that are not made public. So much info. So much easier to just demo a bike
    I´m completely agree with you erikk, so that I going to show a leverage ratio of the ibis, compare with the turner rfx, firebird and nomad..

    http://linkagedesign.blogspot.com/search/label/Ibis

    It´s in Spanish but you will translate more or less across google translator

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by c-wal
    There are people on the boards which run a coil on their Mojo. I think the key is having the shock tuned for the rider/bike. I currently run a Push MX Tune VAN R and other than the 1lb weight penalty it's awesome.
    As much as I want to loose some weight from the bike sometimes, I couldn't imagine riding it without the coil and I'm too cheap to spend the coin for a Ti spring...
    I put a stock 04 Fox Vanilla RC coil on my mojo and have been very happy will the coil. It is much smoother on the rough stuff. The RP23 is just around for a back up.

    I wouldn't throw out the idea of a coil on a HD.
    09 Ibis Mojo - All Mountain Moab Edition

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianoMTB
    I´m attached the geometries of every bike

    (IBIS, NOMAD2 AND FIREBIRD)

    it´s time to talk with data....

    NOMINAL SIZE------------------------------- IBIS LARGE ---------------------------- NOMAD2 LARGE ---------------------------- FIREBIRD LARGE
    Seat Tube Length----------------------------- 19"------------------------------------------ 18,5"-------------------------------------------- 19"
    Top Tube Length------------------------------ 60,45cm------------------------------------- 60,3cm----------------------------------------60,9cm
    Head Tube Length------------------------------ 11,8cm-------------------------------------12,7cm------------------------------------------- 12,7cm
    Chainstay Length------------------------------- 435mm---------------------------------- 431,8mm-------------------------------------------- 431,8mm
    Seat Tube Angle---------------------------------- 71º-----------------------------------------71,5º------------------------------------------------ 71,5º
    Head Tube Angle----------------------------- 67º------------------------------------------ 67º------------------------------------------------ 67,2º
    Wheelbase--------------------------------------- 1134mm-------------------------------- 1143mm------------------------------------- (Not Found)
    Standover --------------------------------------- 760mm--------------------------------------736,6mm------------------------------------------711,2mm

    Those numbers are not correct. Nomad HT length should be 11.9 cm and Chainstay 44.2 cm.

  69. #69
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    I´m talking about Nomad2...

    About the nomad carbon, I´m haven´t seen it yet...

  70. #70
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    Well the CS is still wrong or am I missing something?

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianoMTB
    I´m talking about Nomad2.....
    you are still wrong.

    the Nomad 1 had a 17.5" CS
    ALL Nomad 2's have 17.4" CS

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePunisher
    you are still wrong.

    the Nomad 1 had a 17.5" CS
    ALL Nomad 2's have 17.4" CS
    So in this case, the Spanish web it´s still wrong

    Ok! Thanks for the Info!

  73. #73
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    Smile The best all round bike around

    Forget the Nomad, the HD 140 with 130/150 talas just rocks... best looking bike on the planet. Here's mine.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Ibis Mojo HD or Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon? Tough decision - Where are the HD reviews??-new-1111.jpg  

    Ibis Mojo HD or Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon? Tough decision - Where are the HD reviews??-new-1444.jpg  

    Ibis Mojo HD or Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon? Tough decision - Where are the HD reviews??-new-2.jpg  

    Ibis Mojo HD or Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon? Tough decision - Where are the HD reviews??-shed4.jpg  

    Ibis Mojo HD or Santa Cruz Nomad Carbon? Tough decision - Where are the HD reviews??-shed2.jpg  


  74. #74
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    Mojo HD - Ride 3

    Just got back from my 3rd and longest ride on my new Mojo HD. SRAM XX build with FOX 36 Float on the front and RP23 rear. Industry Nine AM rims and i9 Enduro Hubs. Continential Mountain King Tubeless. Cane Creek Angle Set with .5% added slack head-angle.

    I come from many years of riding VPP suspensions from Santa Cruz to Giant. Up and down the range from XC to Downhill. I can't compare the Nomad Carbon which I'm sure is an awesome bike. (Note: one friend just sold an HD to buy a Nomad Carbon, so eager to compare notes. His comment was, "missed the plush easy comfort of the Santa Cruz") Another Note: Wife kills it on an HD and is not switching.

    Riding area is Hood River, OR. I'm 5' 10" 180 lbs and riding a Medium with a 55mm stem. Stem is perfect especially with the width on the Haven Carbon bars. I have a 30" inseam to give you some indication.

    I can say some words about the HD after being very used to VPP.

    First of all the climbing. First 2 rides I was a bit off balance climbing, due to shock pressures not being dialed in nor seat position.

    Rear shock pressure. On the VPPs, I'm used to more shock pressure and less initial sag setup. On the HD, I'm finding that the rear end has a very specific ideal pressure and you start with more initial sag on the shock, something like 40%. Once I did this, the bike was very steady climbing with almost no pedal feedback. Bike is really quiet and it feels extremely connected on the climb with very little power lost in the suspension, advantage HD.

    I've gotten used to the pedal feedback on the VPP when climbing technical, I use it to my advantage, but is it an advantage. Not so sure. The HD is quiet instead. I can't say yet whether this is better, but I think it may be when I get used to it.

    On Climbing again...Moving the seat about an inch forward from center was HUGE. This totally locked me into the perfect relaxed climbing position. For me, this opened up the bike as an awesome climber as well as a descender. A bike that can hang on the longer XC rides as well as completely slay the descents. I wonder if other Mojo HD riders have experienced this as seems like everyone would want their seat forward as well. Seems counter intuitive to tighten the cockpit, but it was less that and more wanting weight over the pedals more.

    One the down, my first ride with too much rear shock pressure felt too stiff. Once I got sag set right and also after a bit of break in on the shock, the rear end really opened up in an amazing way. The rear end has this center zone of buttery springy awesomeness (That's a technical term) (Is this the linear zone?), but at the end it seems to ramp up progessively which is incredible, especially since I'm using an RP23 which is easily blown through and bottomed out on my VPP bike. I was wondering whether I should go with the DHX AIR but after today, the RP23 is feeling more confident than it has ever felt for me on the VPP bikes.

    OK, now let's talk descending. Holy **** this thing is a missile. Again, on the VPPs, I'm used to a squishier experience bombing downhill. The Mojo is a very connected experience. For example, when you rails a turn or blow through a big gully, it doesn't compress and wallow there, it takes it and shoots you out the other side like an ICBM with almost no speed loss. I can see how racers are going to love this bike. It is just fast. This is probably partially due to the carbon and wheelset but definitely the rear suspension is at play here big time. I wonder how much of this is just carbon and confidence and lightweight, vs DW link. DW link seems very well tuned to the air shock, wheras the VPP back ends always feel like they need a coil.

    Gunning it down some rocky straight lines I had something happen that I have never experienced before. The front end couldn't keep up with the rear end. The rear end was so damn good and connected, but the front fork was stuttering. Obviously, I need to dial in the FOX 36 properly next.

    Bike takes to the air really easy. Just will it so and off it goes.

    The .5 slacker head-angle is working great for me. I was worried it would feel a bit sluggish in the tight stuff, but after today, I'm sold on it. A lot of tight trees at speed and bermy or loose turns. It's all good. Feels centered on the climb too.

    Speaking of the FOX 36 Float. After I got my climbing position figured out, I definitely don't think I would use the height adjust on the Talas. Especially given that I've had multiple bikes already with Talas' and never use the adjust.
    So I'm glad I didn't go there.

    All I can say is finally a 160mm bike that I can use for all my XC riding. And the downhill just got a lot faster.
    Last edited by barnone; 08-28-2011 at 06:18 PM.

  75. #75
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    What I would really like to see is a comparison of the Mojo HD, Nomad C, and the new Yeti SB-66.

  76. #76
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    I agree with you on the climbing position. I run my seat moved almost all the way forward on its rails, although I am running a setback Specialized command post (only because its the only dropper post that works). But even with a straight post my seat is moved pretty forward.
    The HD is a rocket, thats for sure.

  77. #77
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    I bought an HD to replace a santa cruz blur lt2 and a specialized demo 7, a lot to ask of one bike.

    I found the VPP2 sat too far into its travel and tended to bottom out easier than I would have liked. My comments on the HD echo others in this thread. I am in love with DW link and really enjoy the way the HD sits higher in its travel yet still takes big hits amazingly well. There are probably plusher bikes out there but for me I prefer some feedback and more of a sport tuned feel.

    The RP23 has been pretty amazing, no issues and only really feels like its packing up at the end of very long lift accessed or shuttle runs. Raced a long (12min) DH with it and was totally happy with how it performed, was slower than the full on DH'ers but still competitive.

    Now.... when will see an Ibis DH bike.... I can dream....

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by barnone View Post
    Mojo HD - Ride 3

    I come from many years of riding VPP suspensions from Santa Cruz to Giant.

    All I can say is finally a 160mm bike that I can use for all my XC riding. And the downhill just got a lot faster.
    Barnone, what Santacruz did you use if you don't mind?
    It is interesting you said that SC used less sag to compensate the plushness through out the stroke while DW Link used more sag to compensate the tendency of riding high at the travel. Which one is more bump compliance? Is the more trail feedback on the DW translated to some harshness?
    I come from SC Nomad VPP1 which I commended for it's plushness, something I don't want to miss while eliminating pedal feedback inherently attach to vpp when going to other suspension design.
    Ulating blencong sejatine tataraning lelaku...

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by softailteamrider View Post
    Barnone, what Santacruz did you use if you don't mind?
    It is interesting you said that SC used less sag to compensate the plushness through out the stroke while DW Link used more sag to compensate the tendency of riding high at the travel. Which one is more bump compliance? Is the more trail feedback on the DW translated to some harshness?
    I come from SC Nomad VPP1 which I commended for it's plushness, something I don't want to miss while eliminating pedal feedback inherently attach to vpp when going to other suspension design.
    I've only owned the Blur and Blur LT, but my bikes when I bought the Mojo were a Reign XO, Trance XO and Faith 1. A fair number of my friends are riding Nomads but I haven't ridden one enough to be an authority on them. I think I mentioned that one friend had an HD and sold it for the Nomad carbon because he said he missed the couchy easy plushness of the Nomad VPP. His wife who is a kick ass rider still rides an HD.

    I would definitely ride it. But....be very sure to set the rear shock pressure properly. Too much rear pressure and it's a jarring ride. I think people coming from VPP bikes are used to certain pressures and initial sag that don't work right on the DW.
    The right amount for me (I'm at 35-40% initial) and it opens up and becomes what I'd consider to be very plush yet very nimble. I've only ridden the bike a small handful of times, so I may completely do something different when I get more experience. I've seen it posted as 30% ideal, but the suspension is really sensitive to the intial sag setup and would encourage people to try it with more.

    The one VPP vs DW link difference that I noticed, was when the VPPs are compressed to the bottom of their range in the rear, they tend to wallow there more than the DW link in my humble opinion. Hence the feeling that the DW squirts you out of turns and big compressions better. I haven't had the chance to air it big yet, so not sure what happens at bottom out.

    The only problem with demoing the bike, is it will take a few rides to adjust and setup your cockpit before you will really know for sure.

    All I can say is I love this bike, but it's also my first carbon bike and a very nice build with i9 wheels and XX groupo, so what's not to like.
    Last edited by barnone; 09-12-2011 at 10:06 AM.

  80. #80
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    Hey barnone can you comment on the HD suspension vs the Giant maestro stuff?

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by barnone View Post
    I think people coming from VPP bikes are used to certain pressures and initial sag that don't work right on the DW.


    The one VPP vs DW link difference that I noticed, was when the VPPs are compressed to the bottom of their range in the rear, they tend to wallow there more than the DW link in my humble opinion.
    barnone, very well said, can't express it better.
    I am used to super plush VPP1 of my Nomad and now riding Mach 5.7. Indeed Pivot has always touted as firmer DW Link as compared to like Ibis, it maybe too big gap for me from the VPP plush to DWL firm. I might be more happy with Mojo HD.

    Don't get me wrong, I am super happy on how it climbs, no bob, no hang up, while still track the trail nicely. I expect to be more compliant on the rocky rooty descends, not that it's twitchy or buck me up. I set it up at the recommended sag-o-meter -I believe it's 30% sag- Must try your approach 35-40% sag.
    Or maybe it's the limit of Fox RP3 can do? I have an Elka Stg-5 I can slap in to the frame, but Pivot didn't recommend a coil shock (with medium compression tune) will work better than low compression tune RP3 on the DW Link.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ansible View Post
    Hey barnone can you comment on the HD suspension vs the Giant maestro stuff?
    Just happened I had a Maestro bike as well, to chime in. And this was the reason I moved to Mach 5.7. I tried to rationalize a Nomad (VPP1) and Anthem-X (Maestro) to one bike. See that it was so simple to let go 6.5" VPP and 4" Maestro to become one 5.7" DW Link, so mathematical .
    I had something missing on Maestro, couldn't set it up to my liking.It was firm with good pedaling platform but couldn't get full travel, when it was set up to use full travel, I lost the mid-stroke support, a bit wallowy. Again it might not be Maestro characteristic, maybe shock limitation and my lack of skill/knowledge to set it up right. And granted it was not 6" bike. It is a bike created to shred an XC singletrack (and racing).
    Come to think of it, a DW-Link depending on how you set it up could cover a wider range of trail application. I just need to be more patient on getting the set up right
    Ulating blencong sejatine tataraning lelaku...

  82. #82
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    @softailteamrider

    Thx for the confirmation.

    The other thing about sag on the Mojo HD, is it seems to sit up in the rear on the descent. So if you have the shock pressure too high, it's jarring and jacking you up. If it's right, there is a knuckle in there where it releases and it totally balanced and lively yet it feels quite resilient to bottoming out. So yeah, initial sag may seem high, but you get it back on the descent. It's a feeling not actual knowledge of the mechanics involved.

    @Ansible
    Everything I said about VPP = Maestro IMO. Now someone for sure is going to correct me on that, but maestro and Santa Cruz VPP seem awefully similar to me. But I don't know all the nuance between the different revs etc. DW link is a much bigger shift if you are used to Giant or Santa Cruz.

  83. #83
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    SC states that they use a one piece layup process. Is this different than what Ibis is doing?

  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimat99 View Post
    SC states that they use a one piece layup process. Is this different than what Ibis is doing?
    What does that mean?
    milesW

  85. #85
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    Get rid of the RP23

    Quote Originally Posted by erikkellison View Post
    What I seem to be reading is that people aren't altogether ecstatic with the way the Mojo HD descends. It has an air shock, which kinda limits the DH-feel of the bike, something that the Nomad with an RC4 might not suffer from.
    Replaced my RP23 with a Monarch Plus RC3 and it transformed my bike. Like chalk and grapes!

    RP23 is a great shock, but I think tuners are trying to get too much out of it. RP23 on a 3" race and RP23 on 6.5" AM beast - one shock can only do so much. Yeah bigger can, different tune, but still.

    HD hasn't suffered anything climbing wise with the M+ (not that I would care too much), but it has gained A LOT coming down.
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  86. #86
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    really useful write ups, I am in the market for a 30lb 160mm travel and was hedging between the mojo HD and the Carbon nomad, (or possibly the SB 66 when it comes out in carbon) Any one sat on one yet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iwan View Post
    Replaced my RP23 with a Monarch Plus RC3 and it transformed my bike. Like chalk and grapes!

    RP23 is a great shock, but I think tuners are trying to get too much out of it. RP23 on a 3" race and RP23 on 6.5" AM beast - one shock can only do so much. Yeah bigger can, different tune, but still.

    HD hasn't suffered anything climbing wise with the M+ (not that I would care too much), but it has gained A LOT coming down.
    stock tune or pushed Monarch? And if stock, what tune did you settle on?

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatdad View Post
    really useful write ups, I am in the market for a 30lb 160mm travel and was hedging between the mojo HD and the Carbon nomad, (or possibly the SB 66 when it comes out in carbon) Any one sat on one yet?

    Check the yeti forum, the sb is having switch bearing issues. I've heard yeti is replacing them no questions asked, but I wouldn't buy one until long term reviews are in. Yeti's asking price for an outsourced AL frame is a joke too. That said, I think it's a cool frame, love the geo, but they are showing reliability issues right off the bat. No 180 fork option, and no end stroke support make it less FR friendly than the HD and nomad. Both the HD and Nomad have little to no end stroke support too, but I've heard reports of the SB feeling harsh on big hits unlike the HD and Nomad. Shock tuning should take care of any issues. 150 travel with a end stroke ramp up may not feel as nice as the 160 of the HD and Nomad though.

    I've only pedaled one around a parking lot so I'm just regurgitating what I've read on the interwed.

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    LBS is currently sorting SB 66 demo bike bearings! Thanks for heads up. Ibis and SC are demoing at LLandegla 18 feb so will have an opinion after that

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    [QUOTE=fatdad;8901595]LBS is currently sorting SB 66 demo bike bearings! Thanks for heads up. Ibis and SC are demoing at LLandegla 18 feb so will have an opinion after that[/QUOTE

    Word on the street is santa cruz is suing yeti because switch is too similar to vpp? I live in Durango CO, so I like Yeti, but I want to see how well switch holds up long term, or if it's even going to be around after all this? Maybe someone can chime in and set the record straight on the lawsuit thing.

  91. #91
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    [QUOTE=slimat99;8901865]
    Quote Originally Posted by fatdad View Post
    LBS is currently sorting SB 66 demo bike bearings! Thanks for heads up. Ibis and SC are demoing at LLandegla 18 feb so will have an opinion after that[/QUOTE

    Word on the street is santa cruz is suing yeti because switch is too similar to vpp? I live in Durango CO, so I like Yeti, but I want to see how well switch holds up long term, or if it's even going to be around after all this? Maybe someone can chime in and set the record straight on the lawsuit thing.
    I believe this thread will keep updating the issue.
    Santa Cruz sues Yeti!!
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  92. #92
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    I always felt the maestro was a copy of DW with longer links. (rotating the same way)
    VPP links rotate opposite each other, I like the Nomadc a lot, I loved my old Intense 5.5 too. The pedaling feedback being a minor annoyance .

    Maestro is soft and plush, but after seeing broken links I avoided it.

  93. #93
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    Is it still true that only the Nomad can be fitted with 7" coil shock?
    What about a dual crown fork, 170~180MM?
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    wrong thread

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    Quote Originally Posted by erikkellison View Post
    .....I would like to switch to a 36T cassette, but I don't want to pony up for 10 speed everything just yet for a 5.5% increase in ease of pedaling - I'm pretty sure my legs could be 5% stronger, and I have no issues with walking sometimes.
    ...
    Mtbtools on Ebay sells a 36t stainless cassette cog and a spacer. Take off your 11t, add the 36t and spacer and use a 12t lock ring and away you go. Good price and it works.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by noshortcuts View Post
    Mtbtools on Ebay sells a 36t stainless cassette cog and a spacer. Take off your 11t, add the 36t and spacer and use a 12t lock ring and away you go. Good price and it works.
    Cool idea! I will have to look into that for front range riding... at the parks I'd really miss my 11T, but swapping out the cassette is pretty easy since every time I want to do it, it'll probably need a cleaning anyway.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by erikkellison View Post
    Cool idea! I will have to look into that for front range riding... at the parks I'd really miss my 11T, but swapping out the cassette is pretty easy since every time I want to do it, it'll probably need a cleaning anyway.
    After I did mine I heard that you can pull off the 12t or 13t and leave the 11t in place (then you keep the low gear and don't need a new lock ring). I can't confirm, but should work.

    "I must not be crazy because I'm seriously questioning my sanity"

  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrailNut View Post
    Is it still true that only the Nomad can be fitted with 7" coil shock?
    What about a dual crown fork, 170~180MM?
    Not sure about the shock, DC fork is nice.

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