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  1. #1
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    HD retrofit swing arm for more 650B clearance

    As a service for HD owners, we are making a batch of swingarms with more clearance for 650B and 11 speed. They will be made to order with the original HD paint and graphics. We are only going to make one run of these. They are 142 x 12 axle compatible.

    Mojo HD Retrofit Swingarm for 650b/27.5" wheel conversion – Ibis Cycles Online Store

    Here's the text from the page for more detailed info:

    If you own a Mojo HD and want to run 650b wheels with robust mud clearance, this new swingarm is what you need. Additionally, we've modified the dropouts to be fully compatible with 11 speed cassettes.

    We are taking custom orders for this retrofit swingarm, and delivery will be 60-90 days from order. Your card will not be charged until it's shipped. We will be painting these to match the original Mojo HD, so your bike will look fresh and new (well, at least the swingarm will).

    With 650b wheels, this swingarm works in the shorter travel mode using the 140mm limbo chips. If you have an HD 140, no problem, this will bolt right on with the limbo chips and shock you already have.

    If you're running a 160mm HD, then you will need a 7.875" x 2" shock along with some 140 limbo chips. You can order the limbo chips from us, in the related products below. We are not currently selling any shocks to match.

    This swingarm will give you identical geometry to the Mojo HD 140. So if you're switching from 26" to 650b wheels, your bb height will grow approximately .5", depending on your tires.

    Finally, this swingarm has 142 x 12 Maxle rear axle spacing. So if you are converting from an HD with a 135 x 12 Maxle, you'll need to modify your rear hub to fit. If you have a set of 142 Maxle wheels for your HD (140 or 160) and have one of the older 135 Maxle HD swingarms, this will also work as an upgrade.

    International Customers: The shipping cost on the swingarm is $50.


    H

  2. #2
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    Thanks for supporting your loyal existing customer base. I am not planning on ordering since I love my HD in 160/26 mode, but it is awesome you did this for us.

  3. #3
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    Hans, I'll take one with an extra serving of awesome sauce on the side.

    Does it include a derailleur hanger? I'm upgrading from the 135mm rear so just wondering if I need to order some extras as well.

    Thanks for this! Further evidence that the HD is the most versatile mountain bike one can buy, bar none. Cold, dead hands & all that...
    On heavy rotation: White Lung: Deep Fantasy

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by budgie View Post

    Does it include a derailleur hanger? I'm upgrading from the 135mm rear so just wondering if I need to order some extras as well.
    Yes, it comes with a RD hanger installed.

    We're happy to support HD owners and keep 'em rolling on the bigger wheels.

    H

  5. #5
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    yes, thank you Hans...it's allowing me to keep my white HD - and I just really like the white. I'm currently running it 650b but don't like the tire choice / lack of clearance in the rear end in it's current state...it's such a great bike in both 26 and 650b form...so I look forward to having for a long time to come.

  6. #6
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    That's great news and thanks for the heads up.

    i'm curious, i have both a 135x12 and a 142x12 HD. Would I be better off to convert the 142x12 for the added seat tube clearance?

  7. #7
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    Hans, how long will we be able to order this?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by crlavoie View Post
    That's great news and thanks for the heads up.

    i'm curious, i have both a 135x12 and a 142x12 HD. Would I be better off to convert the 142x12 for the added seat tube clearance?
    Move the 142X12 over to the frame with the 135X12 and then put the retro-fit swingarm on the frame with the extra clearance. Now both frames are 142X12....if that's what your looking for.

  9. #9
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    HD retrofit swing arm for more 650B clearance

    Quote Originally Posted by crlavoie View Post
    i'm curious, i have both a 135x12 and a 142x12 HD. Would I be better off to convert the 142x12 for the added seat tube clearance?
    Yes, there a bit more room at bottom out on that one.
    H

  10. #10
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    so if i want to stay in 160 mode (i have roco tst r shimmed to 150mm travel) is there any other improvement besides clearance at yoke? what tires are known to work well with improved clearance? i have been on neo moto 2.3 for 2 years so far.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by d-bug View Post
    Hans, how long will we be able to order this?
    Through the end of this month.
    H

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by brankulo View Post
    so if i want to stay in 160 mode (i have roco tst r shimmed to 150mm travel) is there any other improvement besides clearance at yoke? what tires are known to work well with improved clearance? i have been on neo moto 2.3 for 2 years so far.
    Unless you are having tire rub / mud clearance problems on the chainstay bridge or 11 speed clearance issues currently, there would be no reason to change swingarms.

    The tire to seat tube clearance at bottom out is the same and is the limiting factor for how big a diameter tire you can run in 650B.

    H

  13. #13
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    Hans:

    Continuing with my theme of dumb questions...

    If I'm ordering the new HD rear tri, and want to get an extra derailleur hanger to keep as a spare, I'd want the standard HDR/Ripley/SLR 142mm hanger and not the modified HD 1x11spd hanger, correct?

    TIA!
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by budgie View Post
    Hans:

    Continuing with my theme of dumb questions...

    If I'm ordering the new HD rear tri, and want to get an extra derailleur hanger to keep as a spare, I'd want the standard HDR/Ripley/SLR 142mm hanger and not the modified HD 1x11spd hanger, correct?

    TIA!
    Correct, use the standard hanger on this one...

  15. #15
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    Thanks!
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  16. #16
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    Will this new rear give the same 130mm travel as the HDR in 27.5 mode?

    Also the website says this would give the same geometry as the HD 140 with a gain of approx .5" in bottom bracket height so would that mean the BB would be around 14" (HD140 geometry says 13.5" BB)
    Last edited by ScottW; 12-09-2013 at 06:59 AM.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    Yes, it comes with a RD hanger installed.

    We're happy to support HD owners and keep 'em rolling on the bigger wheels.

    H
    it is good move by Ibis.
    how about support the SL/SLR owners, Hans?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottW View Post
    Will this new rear give the same 130mm travel as the HDR in 27.5 mode?

    Also the website says this would give the same geometry as the HD 140 with a gain of approx .5" in bottom bracket height so would that mean the BB would be around 14" (HD140 geometry says 13.5" BB)
    Yes on both questions.
    H

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by inter View Post
    it is good move by Ibis.
    how about support the SL/SLR owners, Hans?
    You could put an HD or HD 650b retrofit swingarm and HD / HDR links on the SLR and make it a light weight HD 140 / HDR 130. The head angle would be 1 degree steeper than the HD / HDR, but you could get that back to HDR numbers with an Angleset.


    H

  20. #20
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    Good job! This is Customer Service

    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    We're happy to support HD owners and keep 'em rolling on the bigger wheels.
    Even though I decided to go all-in on an HDR, this is the kind of Above & Beyond effort that I love about Ibis.

    Incredible bikes backed up by incredible people.

    HUGE!
    - -benja- -

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    You could put an HD or HD 650b retrofit swingarm and HD / HDR links on the SLR and make it a light weight HD 140 / HDR 130. The head angle would be 1 degree steeper than the HD / HDR, but you could get that back to HDR numbers with an Angleset.


    H
    What????? Seriously????? The HD, HDR, and retrofit swingarms fit on the SL-R? Does the original shock work ok too? Since I already have the Angleset installed on my SL-R, I may be able to get away with just the swingarm and wheelset. I think that a 650b front will fit in the Fox 32 fork. The only issue I would have is that the colors you have listed do not include the silver of my SL-R.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRSpalding View Post
    What????? Seriously????? The HD, HDR, and retrofit swingarms fit on the SL-R? Does the original shock work ok too? Since I already have the Angleset installed on my SL-R, I may be able to get away with just the swingarm and wheelset. I think that a 650b front will fit in the Fox 32 fork. The only issue I would have is that the colors you have listed do not include the silver of my SL-R.
    Yes, the SLR shock will work.

    Clarification from the engineering dept: the retrofit on a SL-R results in the HD140 Geo, not the HDR 130 geo. It will have a few more mm of travel and a little higher BB.

  23. #23
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    And the Mojo SL?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRSpalding View Post
    The only issue I would have is that the colors you have listed do not include the silver of my SL-R.
    Go with a VitP rear, call it The Mullet: business in front, party out back.
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  25. #25
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    Does the retro fit swing arm have more tire clearance for a 26 inch wheel? Say for a 2.35 hans dampf?

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by capthowdy View Post
    Does the retro fit swing arm have more tire clearance for a 26 inch wheel? Say for a 2.35 hans dampf?
    There is more clearance behind the chain stay bridge, and will have the same clearance to the seat tube.

  27. #27
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    White rear end on order.

    Looking forward to a little winter project. Fork and wheels to choose.

  28. #28
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    Whilst I have absolutely no intention of buying this equipment to replace the rear end on my HD160, I wholeheartedly applaud Ibis for making it available. Seriously, well done, Ibis!
    @pinkrobeyyc
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  29. #29
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    Fantastic news, thank you Ibis!

    Is a 142mm Maxle Lite included or do we need to order that separately?

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by kestrel242 View Post
    Fantastic news, thank you Ibis!

    Is a 142mm Maxle Lite included or do we need to order that separately?
    Good question!
    We will include a Maxle.
    Those things are expensive...

    H

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    Good question!
    We will include a Maxle.
    Those things are expensive...

    H
    Love it! Name one other company, when faced with a "those are expensive" spec decision, who opts to save the consumer that expense instead of trying to cut their own costs. You guys are a freakin' miracle!
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  32. #32
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    I got a new Mojo HD three weeks ago so I won't get the retro swingarm for the time being (even I prefer 26" wheels).

    Nevertheless, I think it is an awesome courtesy by Ibis with their customers. I have always thought that Ibis is an exclusive bike brand but now, I'm totally sure about it.


    Congratulations!

  33. #33
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    Hans,
    If this swingarm gets put on a SL/SL-R, with the suspension perform like the SL/SL-R or like the HD?
    Reason I ask is I converted my HD160 to HD140, and used the shock from my SL. The suspension did not feel as good on the HD140 as it does on the SL. The shock is a PUSH tuned RT3.
    The design between the 2 seems to have some differences making them not feel the same.
    If I could run the SL with an HD swingarm and have it feel like the SL does now, I would be happy camper.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    Good question!
    We will include a Maxle.
    Those things are expensive...

    H
    That is why I buy and ride Ibis. Stellar service, and great people

  35. #35
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    "Whilst I have absolutely no intention of buying this equipment to replace the rear end on my HD160, I wholeheartedly applaud Ibis for making it available. Seriously, well done, Ibis! "

    I completely agree, I'm quite happy with my HD 160 and don't really think a 1" larger wheel would be that much of a difference but it's great that Ibis is taking care of those who want it. I also think Ibis will come out with a longer travel 27.5 in the future, perhaps using the Ripley pivot design.

  36. #36
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    Hans, So as I understand it, the changes in the new swingarm are (1) additional tire clearance at the chainstay yoke (2) clearance for the 11 speed cog (3) 142 x 12 axle, which once installed net the exact geometry numbers for the HDR 140/160?
    Is the chainstay length the same for this swingarm and the original HD model? Are you aware of any configuration or shorter shock setup that would slacken the HA and lower the BB to the appropriate 13.2" +_ in the 650b mode (as opposed to a skyscraper 14" BB that results w/ the 650b mode)?

    I believe only the Burgtec offset bushings will achieve this, at the expense of possible tire rub at the seat tube.

  37. #37
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    The numbers are the same as for the HD 140 + .5" BB height.

    Anything done to shorten the shock eye to eye or move it forward without reducing the travel the same amount is likely to create tire interference at the seat tube. Depending on the tire size and riding style, you might be able to get a little more out of it, but the math does not allow for a lot of wiggle room.

    It's primarily offered as a service for those who are already riding 650B on an HD, like it, and want more tire clearance. They won't notice any substantial change in the way the bike rides.

    H

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    The numbers are the same as for the HD 140 + .5" BB height.

    Anything done to shorten the shock eye to eye or move it forward without reducing the travel the same amount is likely to create tire interference at the seat tube. Depending on the tire size and riding style, you might be able to get a little more out of it, but the math does not allow for a lot of wiggle room.

    It's primarily offered as a service for those who are already riding 650B on an HD, like it, and want more tire clearance. They won't notice any substantial change in the way the bike rides.

    H
    Hans,

    I'm a little slow sometimes when it comes to understanding things. I am planning on running mine with the 8.5 x2.5 rear shock shimmed down for proper travel. So just to get this straight.

    The advantages are:
    -Stiffer rear axle 142 x 12
    -better tire clearance
    -only a half inch of additional BB height if running 650B

    Are there any other geometry changes or benefits that I am missing?

    If needed would I still be able to use a 26" wheel with the new rear triangle or would it mess things up numbers wise?

    Anything else I should be educated about before plopping down my $$$ for this?

    Also to the general public I am wondering how many people who are running 650B are purchasing this new triangle or staying with their original set-up's.
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  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by spunkmtb View Post
    Hans,

    I'm a little slow sometimes when it comes to understanding things. I am planning on running mine with the 8.5 x2.5 rear shock shimmed down for proper travel. So just to get this straight.

    The advantages are:
    -Stiffer rear axle 142 x 12
    -better tire clearance
    -only a half inch of additional BB height if running 650B

    Are there any other geometry changes or benefits that I am missing?

    If needed would I still be able to use a 26" wheel with the new rear triangle or would it mess things up numbers wise?

    Anything else I should be educated about before plopping down my $$$ for this?

    Also to the general public I am wondering how many people who are running 650B are purchasing this new triangle or staying with their original set-up's.
    You can run it on your 26" x 160 travel set up, but there would be little point unless you wanted to change to 11 speed or 142x12. If you were running out of tire clearance, it might help but really large tires might hit the seat tube anyway though.

    H

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by carlozzz View Post
    And the Mojo SL?
    bump

    You said in a previous post that it works on both sl/slr. I've been on an hd/slr, and feel a revised swingarm could really stiffen up the sl.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by redmr2_man View Post
    bump

    You said in a previous post that it works on both sl/slr. I've been on an hd/slr, and feel a revised swingarm could really stiffen up the sl.
    In theory you could put HD links and swingarm on an SL, but it's probably not worth it. Maybe on an SLR. The Rev 14 lower link and Lopes Link will get you quite a bit of stiffness improvement if you don't already have them. The lower link was redesigned to incorporate advancements we made when designing the HD.

    By the way, we don't have any feasible way to paint swingarms to match the SLR and SL, so the mismatch would get ugly....

    Also, we are not trying to push this as a product or a retrofit for SL and SLR, more as an approved hack for HD owners who are already running 650b or want to. We are just making them per the requests we're getting.

    H

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    By the way, we don't have any feasible way to paint swingarms to match the SLR and SL, so the mismatch would get ugly....


    H
    He's already got a mismatched swingarm, and he looks in the mirror, so he's used to ugly already

  43. #43
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    HD retrofit swing arm for more 650B clearance

    Quote Originally Posted by hanssc View Post
    In theory you could put HD links and swingarm on an SL, but it's probably not worth it. Maybe on an SLR. The Rev 14 lower link and Lopes Link will get you quite a bit of stiffness improvement if you don't already have them. The lower link was redesigned to incorporate advancements we made when designing the HD.

    By the way, we don't have any feasible way to paint swingarms to match the SLR and SL, so the mismatch would get ugly....

    Also, we are not trying to push this as a product or a retrofit for SL and SLR, more as an approved hack for HD owners who are already running 650b or want to. We are just making them per the requests we're getting.

    H
    This addresses the stiffness, but those of us with an SL contemplating a 650b wheelset may still be wondering if this would allow for better tire clearance. I've been thinking of converting my (2009) SL for quite a while, but am concerned about being severely limited to narrower tires with 650b rims. Having a bit more clearance to run 2.2/2.3 tires out back and not rub the frame would be enough to convince me to get a new swing arm and go for it. Might even be able to run derby's rims...

  44. #44
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    So, in theory, anyone who is in this thread that upgrades to a revised swingarm, should sell me their standard HD swingarm, and it would work?

    score!

    my bike has been mismatched for many swingarms, doesn't bother me.

    I have rev 14 links, hd/slr still feel stiffer. Same wheel tire combos on all test bikes (flows/specy tires). So you're saying an upgraded swingarm wouldn't help with the stiffness much? (I'm on a 10x135 dt swiss RWS thru bolt)

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by plantdude View Post
    This addresses the stiffness, but those of us with an SL contemplating a 650b wheelset may still be wondering if this would allow for better tire clearance. I've been thinking of converting my (2009) SL for quite a while, but am concerned about being severely limited to narrower tires with 650b rims. Having a bit more clearance to run 2.2/2.3 tires out back and not rub the frame would be enough to convince me to get a new swing arm and go for it. Might even be able to run derby's rims...
    Don't forget that the HD links are required as well. Then there's wheels, fork, tires...
    H

  46. #46
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    I'll sell you mine. white. 142

  47. #47
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    I like my HD a lot in 26er 160 mode. I don't see the point in the new rear end "upgrade" due to the stated limitations - I could go for a 27.5 150-160mm Bike with bigger tire clearance and 13.5 BB and slightly longer top tubes / reach though. A true Mach 6 / Bronson competitor which I don't feel the HDR quite is. I assume its in the works but I wonder when we will see one?

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by plantdude View Post
    This addresses the stiffness, but those of us with an SL contemplating a 650b wheelset may still be wondering if this would allow for better tire clearance. I've been thinking of converting my (2009) SL for quite a while, but am concerned about being severely limited to narrower tires with 650b rims. Having a bit more clearance to run 2.2/2.3 tires out back and not rub the frame would be enough to convince me to get a new swing arm and go for it. Might even be able to run derby's rims...
    HD retrofit swing arm for more 650B clearance-mojo-derby-lo-res.jpg

    Don't let your SL rear clearance stop you from getting Derby rims... I'm running them on my SL, and they've turned the 2.1 - 2.25 tires that already fit the rear triangle when mounted on Flows into tires with the equivalent volume of 2.4's (at least in feel... I have no way of actually measuring volume).... those midsized tires gain a bunch of volume "down low" on the Derbys, but don't grow much at all in the tread area.

    I get where you're coming from... I love my SL in 650b mode....all it's really lacking is more rear clearance (and more frame stiffness wouldn't be a bad thing)... but I'd keep that $600 to save for an HDR 650. By the time you put links and mismatched HD retrofit swing arm on there you're in for $750 if not $800 w/ shipping... save that $800, sell your SL frame for $800 - 1000, and you're getting pretty close to a new HDR, which is a lot more bike in every way.

    Just my 2c....but if you do mount a retrofit swing arm on your SL, I want to hear all about it!

  49. #49
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    Currently running a HD 140 on 650B mode- with Fox 32 150 mm fork in the front (fits 2.25 Hans Dampf no problem) and a 2.25 Nobby Nic in the rear. Love the way it rides, and ordered the new rear triangle as I will be looking at going 11 speed and the option of fitting beefier rear tyres. May change the fork to a Fox 34 27.5 in future.

    Glad I bought an Ibis.
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  50. #50
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    FYI, I just received an email from Scot saying that the 142mm Maxles are not included. Just be forewarned.

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  5. Retrofit 650b wheels onto a 29er?...
    By dirtrider7 in forum 27.5
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