• 12-05-2012
    zul
    DEMO - Large Volume Shock for the HD - DEMO
    RP23 - We've tried spacers, bottom out bumpers and all sorts of air pressure and settings. We got the HD to ride ok with the RP23 and it is no longer bottoming out.

    This week, the LBS put a demo shock on my HD. It is a high volume Rock Shox Monarch Plus/Pushed. The Fat Tire bike shop, here in Sedona, will let me run this shock for 2-3 days. They offered up the chance to demo and try several different new shocks and I thought that was a pretty cool offer.

    Monarch Plus/Pushed
    Bouncing around the parking lot, not really feeling it... Finally, getting onto single track and it becomes clear ... while riding a high volume shock, you will be done fussing with your RP23. The ride improvement is huge. Once on the new shock, you can really feel where the mid-travel problems are with the RP23, blowing through the mid-stroke travel on nearly every obstacle and then a long pause waiting for the rebound to come back. When on the trail, the big improvements became super clear: climbing, small bump comp/rebound, G-Outs and all types of descending. It's like a whole new platform for the rider and bike position. Really hooks up and keeps the rear wheel on the ground. Later off the pedal stroke and much sooner on the pedals coming out of chop. The entire bike is constantly in better position.

    Here are the shocks that I will be able to demo:

    Rock Shox Monarch Plus/Pushed
    CC Double Barrel
    RS Vivid Air
    X Fusion

    Can anyone fill in the blanks re: Price? What has been the shock of choice for HD riders re: Performance?? I am trying to get ready to digest $500-$600 because the thought of going back to the RP23. Ugh.

    I will add my thoughts on these shocks as I get the chance to demo each one over the next 2-3 weeks.

    Zul

    === Edit Update ===
    Rock Shox Monarch Plus/Pushed

    On the latest ride w/ the Monarch @ 160psi and 20% sag we found a way to make it blow through it's travel ... an 18inch wheel drop ??!!

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    Thoughts on this??!! -- The shock has preformed well in the other areas ... ??
  • 12-05-2012
    manchvegas
    that's cool that you get to demo a bunch. I personally am just waiting for the Marz. roco TST R's to be back in stock, an that's what I'll be going with..
  • 12-05-2012
    brankulo
    i am most likely getting vector hlr air soon. was considering roco too but dont really care for switching between open closed position and everything in between since i ride open all the time on rp23
  • 12-05-2012
    Salespunk
    Once I rode a Monarch RC3 the RP23 got put in a box. I now run a Pushed RC3 and it is even better.
  • 12-05-2012
    Iceman69
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by brankulo View Post
    i am most likely getting vector hlr air soon. was considering roco too but dont really care for switching between open closed position and everything in between since i ride open all the time on rp23

    I too am seriously considering the Vector air HLR to replace my Rp23 high volume with med shim. Go ride has it for 450 beans but will need the dw tune if not already included in price. Extra 50 beans.
    Anyone got to demo this shock with rp23 comparison?
    Curious about the Marz rocco tst as a rear shock too.
    Bottom line is any shock other than Rp23 is a major step forward!:rolleyes:
  • 12-05-2012
    budgie
    Looking forward to hearing the results of this! It would be nice if Ibis would offer some XFusion OE options, particularly since the two companies are basically neighbors!
  • 12-05-2012
    cm223
    x fusion vector air hlr. Ive ran every shock on the hd and like the xf the best. Call them direct, they can get it tuned for dw link
  • 12-05-2012
    bajaguy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by cm223 View Post
    x fusion vector air hlr. Ive ran every shock on the hd and like the xf the best. Call them direct, they can get it tuned for dw link

    +1..Im running this on my HD with the DW tune and it is an awesome shock. I went from an RP23 to an RC4 to the Vector and the Vector is hands down the best shock I've run on the bike.
  • 12-05-2012
    crlavoie
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by zul View Post
    RP23 - We've tried spacers, bottom out bumpers and all sorts of air pressure and settings. We got the HD to ride ok with the RP23 and it is no longer bottoming out.

    This week, the LBS put a demo shock on my HD. It is a high volume Rock Shox Monarch Plus/Pushed. The Fat Tire bike shop, here in Sedona, will let me run this shock for 2-3 days. They offered up the chance to demo and try several different new shocks and I thought that was a pretty cool offer.

    Monarch Plus/Pushed
    Bouncing around the parking lot, not really feeling it... Finally, getting onto single track and it becomes clear ... while riding a high volume shock, you will be done fussing with your RP23. The ride improvement is huge. Once on the new shock, you can really feel where the mid-travel problems are with the RP23, blowing through the mid-stroke travel on nearly every obstacle and then a long pause waiting for the rebound to come back. When on the trail, the big improvements became super clear: climbing, small bump comp/rebound, G-Outs and all types of descending. It's like a whole new platform for the rider and bike position. Really hooks up and keeps the rear wheel on the ground. Later off the pedal stroke and much sooner on the pedals coming out of chop. The entire bike is constantly in better position.

    Here are the shocks that I will be able to demo:

    Rock Shox Monarch Plus/Pushed
    CC Double Barrel
    RS Vivid Air
    X Fusion

    Can anyone fill in the blanks re: Price? What has been the shock of choice for HD riders re: Performance?? I am trying to get ready to digest $500-$600 because the thought of going back to the RP23. Ugh.

    I will add my thoughts on these shocks as I get the chance to demo each one over the next 2-3 weeks.

    Zul

    OK... First, realize that Dave is without a doubt, one of the most knowledgable suspension gurus out there. He is a CNC machine short of being the next PUSH. To that end, your results will vary greatly from the average Joe just based on his ability to squeeze performance out of your suspension. I've never ridden a PUSH'ed Monarch, but from what I have read (specific to the HD) and from my conversations with the guys at PUSH, you should take it.

    On the other hand, for the ultimate flexibility AND if you're willing to spend the time, I don't think you can get better than the CCDB. I have one on my 160 and I have it pretty well dialed to the point that I can adjust it based on the ride. Your learning curve will be much shorter if you're local to Sedona and can have those guys help you dial it in.
  • 12-05-2012
    lazarus2405
    I had considered going with the Monarch Plus, but I have had a hard time finding it in the low compression/mid rebound tune Ibis suggests. I called them up and asked which was a better compromise, LL or MM, and they flat out said I'd be better off with a different, appropriately-tuned shock, specifically naming the Vector.

    So, I'd be really interested in a comparison between a well-tuned Monarch Plus and a well-tuned Vector HLR on an HD.
  • 12-05-2012
    Yody
    I'm running a push'd monarch plus with 4 foam spacers in it to reduce volume, run 150psi (i weigh 180) and run it on the middle compression setting. Can't remember rebound but I wanna say somewhere about halfway

    Thing is fookin dialed.
  • 12-06-2012
    zul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Yody View Post
    I'm running a push'd monarch plus with 4 foam spacers in it to reduce volume, run 150psi (i weigh 180) and run it on the middle compression setting. Can't remember rebound but I wanna say somewhere about halfway

    Thing is fookin dialed.

    ACE Hardware foam spacers or a specific kit from Rock Shock??
  • 12-06-2012
    Yody
    Red foam rings that go in the external can. They come direct from rockshox
  • 12-06-2012
    Maverick005
    I like your thinking Budgie, will wait and see what my HD arrives with, but thinking the Vector air might be worth a try in the New Year, liking allot about XFusion, maybe I just picked up the cool aid from around here but they seem legit performance wise from you guys.

    Question does the XFusion come with 3pce reducers like Rockshox, Marz or 2 like Fox used to do.

    Cheers
    Mav
  • 12-07-2012
    Kerberos
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by zul View Post
    Here are the shocks that I will be able to demo:

    You are one lucky guy. Support your LBS and buy the shock of your choice from them in the end, that's for sure.

    I just want to add that I am extremely happy with my Cane Creek Double Barrel Air. I can't compare to any other than the 2012 Float RP23. Although for me the RP23 was never as bad as others wrote, the CCDBA is a major improvement, I won't go back.
  • 12-07-2012
    Kerberos
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by zul View Post
    On the latest ride w/ the Monarch @ 160psi and 20% sag we found a way to make it blow through it's travel ... an 18inch wheel drop ??!!

    Add low speed compression and then maybe a bit of rebound. - And please note that the HD likes to ride with more SAG, say around 30%. Seriously, try it, if the other parameters are adjusted accordingly, that will make another step up regarding the planted rear wheel.
  • 12-07-2012
    zul
    Still on the Monarch and had an excellent extended ride yesterday. No bottom out issues.

    It is currently around 25% sag and will re-adjust to 30% for today's ride as everyone keeps suggesting. We shall see?!?

    Also looking into the possibilities of adding a bottom out bumper ... Some have suggested running a smaller tire, currently on Ardent 2.4 (big volume).. It's only been an issue with the video example. Seems like all other ride situations, the Monarch is preforming well.

    Thx all!
  • 12-08-2012
    mazspeed
    Of the 4 which do you like best?
  • 12-08-2012
    fuenstock
    Im also running a pushed monarch plus (30% sag - 3 tunning bands) on my HD 160. Huge improvment over the stock kashima rp23. Rp23 is in my junk parts drawer as a back up shock. I have not tried any of the other shocks you asked about, but most likley any of them would be better than the rp23.
  • 12-22-2012
    zul
    Vivid Air
    After spending a week on the Vivid Air, it has clearly outperformed the other air shocks (RP23 and Monarch Plus Pushed).

    The Monarch made the thought of riding the RP23 again ... painful. The Vivid Air makes the other air cans feel like toys. Vivid Air is on another level of performance.

    It is easy to notice the 'Smoothness' of the stroke. Both in the way that it moves (overall) and in the way that it moves through it's travel. As you approach bottom out, it doesn't feel like compressed air. It just keeps you and bike in stable position.

    The first time you send it through chop, you know. Small chop, large chop, at any speed ... it's erased. You don't feel it and the bike remains stable. Marginal improvement on any rough trail or downhill. You are simply riding on something that is clearly more stable. Within the first hour of riding this setup, I was looking for rougher lines and couldn't believe how smooth, ironed out everything felt.

    Dave at the Fat Tire bike shop setup the Vivid Air with 36-37% sag.

    I would say that all shocks did well in the first 1/3rd of it's travel, even the RP23.
    The Monarch made some big gains in the middle 1/3rd.
    The Vivid Air feels much smoother on the final 1/3rd. It is most comfortable deep in it's travel.

    Con: Pedal-ability. It does feel squishy or bouncy on climbs while pedaling. Could be a setup issue with the large % sag but a small price to pay for the excellent feel on the downhill side. It still climbs. It still betters the mid stroke problems of the RP23. The 2013 Vivid Air has an additional knob which Dave says may improve the 'pedal-ability'. Perhaps more air or change-up settings on the current shock could resolve this?

    Overall: I ride rough and rocky AM trails which includes plenty of climbing, lots of climbing. The lack of pedal performance is a big issue for me because of local terrain. With that said, you can't deny the feel of the Vivid Air. Plush and smoothness, redefined. Hands down winner thus far.

    Next Week: Cane Creek Double Barrel :thumbsup:
  • 12-22-2012
    Yody
    Nit surprised that the most dh oriented shock, felt the best on dh amd worst on pedaling. 40 percent sag is way to much for any trail bike and will make most shocks feel ultra buttery, but the bike is not going to be very efficient and will likely bottom easily, not to mention there wont be much of a platform to push off of. The thought of a mushed out plow bike that wont pedal doesnt sound good at all to me. The problem with your feedback is who knows what kind of riding you are doing or how you are doing it. While youre gushing over the plushness of a dh shock set at nearly half the travel for sag, im thinking that sounds terrible, lol.
  • 12-30-2012
    CANADIANBACON
    A little bird told me that Zul's Vivid Air was set up with 35% sag. ;):thumbsup:
  • 12-30-2012
    lazarus2405
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by zul View Post
    Next Week: Cane Creek Double Barrel :thumbsup:

    Is the XFusion Vector Air on your list to test? If it's available, I'd be very interested in how it compares to the Monarch, Vivid, and DBAir. :thumbsup:
  • 12-31-2012
    mbikerguy
    I have tried all of these shocks except for the vector air.
    My top pick and the one I run is the DB-Air (upgraded inner air sleeve) followed closely by the marzocchi rocco air and vivid air.

    The RP23 was a huge waste of time at my 225lbs weight.