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  1. #1
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    Back to Back BronsonC -- HDR650

    i,ve been try my HDR650 and my friends Bronson c on my local trails , its full of natural obtacles, tech climb, tech descend and very long steep fire road climb. so i like to share somethings in my mind with some bike mates here. both bike with 150 pike . Bronson is 26.4 lb(ctd shock)---HDR650 28.5 lb(bikeco 147 shock). both with King hubs braced with chinese carbon rims.

    1) pedalling on tight single track
    its an even here, both bikes handle well on tight narrow track and turn .

    2) roots ,rocks climbing section
    HDR shining bright here due to its 'roll over everythings' instead of 'suck everything'

    3) tech descend
    i would vote for bronson , its plush and stable especially when moving slow on real rough section .(some guys may say its a unfair comparable cos both bikes different rear travel, but what can i say, just two bikes here, bro) . only i complaint is bronson's swingarm flex !! some high speed tech area i rather like the HDR shorter travel and feel more confident.

    4) long , steep fire road climbing
    Definitely Bronson become a superstar in this section, Santa Cruz forward the Bronson Geometry bit this time, 73' STA so good on long fireroad climbing , HDR hands down on this section even with its famous DW link pedalling Efficiency ( my friends said maybe is because HDR heavier than Bronson, come on !)

  2. #2
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    Thank you for the write up. - It was only after you mentioned the less travel in your HDR that I was sure you refer to the 650b version of it. You may want to articulate that more clearly.

  3. #3
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    Back to Back BronsonC -- HDR650

    The thread title says HDR650 and so does the first line !


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  4. #4
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    Interesting comparison. Thanks for posting. I just sold my BronsonC and am building up a 2013 HD 650B conversion with bits stolen from the Bronson. Never really got the Bro where I felt confident on the fast technical descents. My other complaint on the Bro is technical rocky climbing. Also felt it was a tad flexy but accelerated and pedaled like crazy. Sounds like from what you are saying I will prefer the HD (assuming it behaves like the HDR). The HD conversion will only be ~127mm with a 2" stroke shock. I have a 2.25" stroke shock on there now which should give me 143mm of travel, assuming I can fit the rear tire in there without hitting the seat tube on full compression. The HD frame (size L) with 7.875x2.25 Monarch plus weighs 7lbs even... Forget what the Bronson was supposed to be, but I thought it was sub 6lbs with shock (float CTD). Excited to get this build up and running!

  5. #5
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    Sounds cool decision , looking forward your ride review here !

  6. #6
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    Just of of interest and accuracy re comments on flex, what wheels, rims spokes, were these hand built or machine built etc etc.

    Carbon frames will seek out any other area that is weak and amplify it, this is unlikely a frame issue, I know others who have that frame with top wheel builds and flex does not come into it.

    I recently tested an M6 and it was not a particularly enjoyable ride in part mostly down to the std Stans EX wheelset which were very disappointing to see on an XX1 level build, it has made it very difficult to compare anything as it really hindered my ride, but I am aware that the wheels were the issue not the frame and the dam fork and tires, didn't help either.

  7. #7
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    interesting share, maverick. you really make a point here, wheel set is play a important role too. i'm so interested your m6 with stans EX review. can you share with us more specific? y this wheels so dissapoint you?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick005 View Post
    Just of of interest and accuracy re comments on flex, what wheels, rims spokes, were these hand built or machine built etc etc.

    Carbon frames will seek out any other area that is weak and amplify it, this is unlikely a frame issue, I know others who have that frame with top wheel builds and flex does not come into it.

    I recently tested an M6 and it was not a particularly enjoyable ride in part mostly down to the std Stans EX wheelset which were very disappointing to see on an XX1 level build, it has made it very difficult to compare anything as it really hindered my ride, but I am aware that the wheels were the issue not the frame and the dam fork and tires, didn't help either.
    You are right. Wheels make a huge different in stiffness.
    My Bronson had 30mm wide Light Bicycle Carbon rims hand built by Dave Thomas at Speed-dream wheels, These are pretty stiff wheels, stiffer than a similar pair of Flow's. That said I never thought the Bronson was overly flexy until I built up a Pivot Mach 429C which I have been riding lately. The Pivot has Easton EC70 carbon wheels which are more XC oriented (and 29er). The whole package blows away the Bronson in terms of stiffness. Is this due to DW v VPP, 100 v 150mm of travel, or just that Pivot makes their bikes uber-stiff??? I test rode my buddy's M6 with Derby 40mm Carbon wheels and it felt comparable to the M429. He had the rear floatX set really plush too.

    I kept the wheelset from the Bronson to build my next project... HD 650 conversion so it will be interesting to compare. Now if only Brown Santa will deliver the Pike I ordered.

  9. #9
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    Hopefully hear from you soon, Brian

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    AW: Back to Back BronsonC -- HDR650

    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    The thread title says HDR650 and so does the first line !
    ... because he edited it after my hint. No harm future9398, I just don't want to look like a tool in this thread.

  11. #11
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    Thanks bro

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Damage View Post
    You are right. Wheels make a huge different in stiffness.
    My Bronson had 30mm wide Light Bicycle Carbon rims hand built by Dave Thomas at Speed-dream wheels, These are pretty stiff wheels, stiffer than a similar pair of Flow's. That said I never thought the Bronson was overly flexy until I built up a Pivot Mach 429C which I have been riding lately. The Pivot has Easton EC70 carbon wheels which are more XC oriented (and 29er). The whole package blows away the Bronson in terms of stiffness. Is this due to DW v VPP, 100 v 150mm of travel, or just that Pivot makes their bikes uber-stiff??? I test rode my buddy's M6 with Derby 40mm Carbon wheels and it felt comparable to the M429. He had the rear floatX set really plush too.

    I kept the wheelset from the Bronson to build my next project... HD 650 conversion so it will be interesting to compare. Now if only Brown Santa will deliver the Pike I ordered.
    Who you calling plush! I prefer husky!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Damage View Post
    You are right. Wheels make a huge different in stiffness.
    My Bronson had 30mm wide Light Bicycle Carbon rims hand built by Dave Thomas at Speed-dream wheels, These are pretty stiff wheels, stiffer than a similar pair of Flow's. That said I never thought the Bronson was overly flexy until I built up a Pivot Mach 429C which I have been riding lately. The Pivot has Easton EC70 carbon wheels which are more XC oriented (and 29er). The whole package blows away the Bronson in terms of stiffness. Is this due to DW v VPP, 100 v 150mm of travel, or just that Pivot makes their bikes uber-stiff??? I test rode my buddy's M6 with Derby 40mm Carbon wheels and it felt comparable to the M429. He had the rear floatX set really plush too.

    I kept the wheelset from the Bronson to build my next project... HD 650 conversion so it will be interesting to compare. Now if only Brown Santa will deliver the Pike I ordered.

    Ah nice, well I don't know re travel but I have my suspicions about that as my test on the M6 which is also a Pivot and many have commented that it felt flexy, but like I said same wheels as I tested that Ive read about anyway so once wheels are eliminated, my other theory is shock type/tune and travel.

    So for those not used to longer travel a longer travel bike may feel more flexy, but borne out by your comments that while you felt the Bronson was flexy it still accelerated impressively, acceleration is part of the stiffness equation, add tires etc etc, but stiffness is a key part, so still not convinced what you feel on the Bronson was flex, SC Fox shock tunes usually lack good mid stroke support, I would think this is more the case, Pivot are notorious for going the other way, exception be the M6.

    I would think a shorter travel bike should feel stiffer, not just frame, but less travel less the shock fork has to react to or control, but also the angles, they are just different bikes so it becomes hard to compare because where each model is designed to excel the other should be weaker, people often forget this why so many comparison are just waste of time.

    An F1 car is going to be better on an F1 track than a Baja truck and vice versa, but in mountain biking this comparison is very grey when people use comparisons.

    One issue key issue is people change too much at once, don't stay on a particular frame for long enough to reap the benefits from the design of it and then is truly the right design or tool for them? So becomes very subjective.

    Its one benefit I see in 27.5 many people should will be riding bikes with travel more suited to their terrain and probably skill base, instead of wanting to be cool riding bikes way beyond they're needs and trying to make square pegs fit in round holes.

    As to the VPP vs DWL, um not sure, again they're is not real current direct comparison to correlate, HDR is 130mm, Bro 150mm, M6 is 160mm, just too much difference to say, if all 3 were of same travel, builds were exactly the same, setups etc, then you could maybe hammer that one out, I prefer dwl myself, but I also like VPP so Im not really biased on that one.

    But if you're on the right size frame then, components need to match, the big issue is getting tunes that are good on the shock in std form from the factory (imo that can affect the feel of flex after the wheel is sorted)

    For example, I still wasn't blown away by the Float X, not the same quality to my Vector, that maybe me, but thats my honest experience, vector sits higher and again big thing for me is controlled feel and uses only what it needs.

    I spent a whole day on over 30km of different tracks I ride regularly on this bike, so I really dissected it and believe this is a frame I wanted to go out and buy, I"m just going to sit on the fence a bit longer since my HD is so good right now, checking sags, getting things dialled so I gave it a good opportunity, I will try to get another ride on one I know is built the way it should be and compare again.

    No rush though, its taken me awhile but Ive got the HD to where I want it, now its up to the rider.

  14. #14
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    Reading about bikes being flexy on mtbr, you have to really think about what you're reading. Not everyone knows what flexy even is. There are a lot of factors that can make a bike "feel" flexy even if its plenty stout. First off is tire pressure, everyone thinks 20psi is the way to roll. Well thats cool but if you're not used to that, the bike will feel ultra flexy but its really just the tire rolling all over the place. Second is suspension, run it with no compression and rebound or too much sag and its gonna wallow bad, which also gives a bike a flexy feel. Big volume tire on a skinny rim? Another place you will feel flex. Crappy built wheels? Same.... gotta take it all with a grain of salt. I've ridden some Bronsons before and they are anything but flexy, super robust just like the HD. No idea on the Pivot but they've never been known to come out with flexy frames in the past, that I've ever heard of or felt...
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  15. #15
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    I believe we can define bike's frame flex into :

    Vertical
    Torsional/lateral
    Bottom bracket

    Three types of flexes intimately link each other. I'm please if somebody can tell me the feeling to differentiate wheel flex and swing arm flex when ride on trail . Need some help here .

  16. #16
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    Hd650!

    Quote Originally Posted by future9398 View Post
    i,ve been try my HDR650 and my friends Bronson c on my local trails , its full of natural obtacles, tech climb, tech descend and very long steep fire road climb. so i like to share somethings in my mind with some bike mates here. both bike with 150 pike . Bronson is 26.4 lb(ctd shock)---HDR650 28.5 lb(bikeco 147 shock). both with King hubs braced with chinese carbon rims.

    1) pedalling on tight single track
    its an even here, both bikes handle well on tight narrow track and turn .

    2) roots ,rocks climbing section
    HDR shining bright here due to its 'roll over everythings' instead of 'suck everything'

    3) tech descend
    i would vote for bronson , its plush and stable especially when moving slow on real rough section .(some guys may say its a unfair comparable cos both bikes different rear travel, but what can i say, just two bikes here, bro) . only i complaint is bronson's swingarm flex !! some high speed tech area i rather like the HDR shorter travel and feel more confident.

    4) long , steep fire road climbing
    Definitely Bronson become a superstar in this section, Santa Cruz forward the Bronson Geometry bit this time, 73' STA so good on long fireroad climbing , HDR hands down on this section even with its famous DW link pedalling Efficiency ( my friends said maybe is because HDR heavier than Bronson, come on !)
    OK, first a couple of disclaimers....
    1. I am comparing a 650B converted HD here not an HDR
    2. I've been a long time Santa Cruz fan and some times VPP fan for nearly 20 years and my bike hobby (sickness as my wife refers to it) has had me buy/build/tinker/sell numerous SC bikes over that time including: Tazmon, Superlight1, Blur classic (meh), Nomad1 (coiled and still one of my all time favorites), Nomad2AL (meh), VPFree (fun, but a rolling couch), Superlight2, V10 (I'm just not a DHer), Blur TRc (my first 650 conversion and a great ride, but not durable enough for the rough stuff), and finally a BronsonC last summer.

    So, put 850 miles on the Bronson from July thru Feb according to Strava. XX1, Pike 160, Monarch Plus, LB Carbon rims + I9 hubs, LEV 150 dropper. Came in at 27.1 lbs. Bike is super fun, but I never felt confident at high speed cornering. Tinkered with the setup a lot and finally went to a 50mm stem from a 70 which was about the best I had it at, but still felt sketched about comitting to the front end. Finally decided to ditch the Bronson and built up a used HD frame with the XX1 and wheels from the Bronson. Put a 160 Pike & 150 LEV on it. Sits at 27.8lbs right now with the principal difference being 740mm wide bars vs 710 on the Bro (plus the TT on the L HD is 0.2in shorter). I've always been a tweener on SC sizes being 5'10.5" and always opted for the L frame.

    Also for X-mas this past year I built up a Pivot Mach429C to be my XC ride, but wound up beefing it up with a Pike 140 and meetier tires (Maxxis HR2 F & Ardent R just like on the Bronson). Got the 429 pretty dialed and was putting up better times than I even did on the Bronson on my local segments.

    Now have about 120mi on the HD, 60 of which were in Sedona an 60 on the local La Costa trails. In these 5 or so local rides I have PR's 4 of the 5 DH segs that I frequent on a weekly basis (the 5th I was a couple seconds behind my 429 time that I got just after it rained... Hero Dirt!)

    In response to Future's comparison above:
    1. Tight ST. Agree, both are super fun bikes to ride. I think the HD fits me better so might have an edge here.
    2. Rocky/Root climbing. The HD blows the Bro away here (this was another gripe I had about the Bro).
    3. Tech descent. Here I disagree and favor the HD (strava times below to prove it with only 1 or 2 tries on the HD). IMO the Bronson feels fast, but my times never really were. In fact, I generally put up better times on the 429 and the BlurTRc than on the Bronson which really surprised me.
    4. Long FR climbs. Jury is still out here, but would probably agree (most of the climbing I've done on the HD has been with frequent stops to make adjustments... And its harder to motivate to go after a climb vs a descent)


    Lizard Descent: 1.6mi -505' (53 tries, 31/491)

    1 23-Mar-14 6:07 15.4mi/h HD650B
    2 3-Mar-14 6:16 15.0mi/h MACH429C
    3 7-Apr-12 6:19 14.9mi/h BLUR TRC 26
    4 5-Feb-14 6:21 14.8mi/h MACH429C
    5 6-Mar-14 6:24 14.7mi/h MACH429C
    6 4-Apr-13 6:28 14.6mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    7 19-Mar-13 6:30 14.5mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    8 8-Mar-13 6:32 14.4mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    8 29-Apr-13 6:32 14.4mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    10 24-Apr-12 6:35 14.3mi/h BLUR TRC 26
    29 27-Nov-13 7:13 13.1mi/h BRONSON

    La Costa Switchbacks: 2.1mi, -588' (67 Tries, 20/362)
    1 20-Mar-14 8:57 14.1mi/h HD650B
    2 29-Jan-14 8:58 14.1mi/h MACH429C
    3 23-Mar-14 9:01 14.0mi/h HD650B
    4 3-Mar-14 9:06 13.9mi/h MACH429C
    5 23-Jan-14 9:10 13.8mi/h MACH429C
    6 31-Jan-13 9:15 13.6mi/h BRONSON
    6 26-Sep-13 9:15 13.6mi/h BRONSON
    8 6-Dec-13 9:16 13.6mi/h BRONSON
    9 12-Jun-12 9:19 13.5mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    10 24-Apr-12 9:20 13.5mi/h BLUR TRC 26

    ***** & Moan: 1.3 mi, -220' (29 Tries, 6/277)
    1 Thu, Mar 20, 2014 6:44 11.6mi/h HD650B
    2 Mon, Feb 3, 2014 6:51 11.4mi/h MACH429C
    3 Wed, Mar 12, 2014 6:55 11.3mi/h HD650B
    4 Wed, Jan 29, 2014 6:57 11.2mi/h MACH429C
    5 Wed, Jan 22, 2014 7:14 10.8mi/h MACH429C
    5 Tue, Feb 25, 2014 7:14 10.8mi/h MACH429C
    7 Tue, Jan 7, 2014 7:28 10.4mi/h MACH429C
    8 Wed, Dec 11, 2013 7:38 10.2mi/h BRONSON
    9 Tue, May 7, 2013 7:40 10.2mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    10 Fri, Dec 27, 2013 7:41 10.1mi/h BRONSON

    Powerline to Elfin Forest DH: 0.7mi -311' (28 tries, 2/119)
    1 Sat, Mar 22, 2014 2:03 21.8mi/h HD650B
    2 Thu, Feb 13, 2014 2:13 20.2mi/h BRONSON
    3 Sat, Jan 4, 2014 2:18 19.5mi/h BRONSON
    3 Mon, Feb 17, 2014 2:18 19.5mi/h MACH429C
    5 Thu, Feb 6, 2014 2:19 19.3mi/h MACH429C
    5 Thu, Feb 20, 2014 2:19 19.3mi/h MACH429C
    7 Sun, Dec 29, 2013 2:20 19.2mi/h BRONSON
    7 Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:20 19.2mi/h BRONSON
    9 Sun, Jan 19, 2014 2:23 18.8mi/h MACH429C
    10 Thu, Jan 9, 2014 2:24 18.7mi/h MACH429C

  17. #17
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    Back to Back BronsonC -- HDR650

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Damage View Post
    3. Tech descent. Here I disagree and favor the HD (strava times below to prove it with only 1 or 2 tries on the HD). IMO the Bronson feels fast, but my times never really were.
    Thanks for the data mining and the post! You raise a point that I've been thinking about after going from an HD 160(26") to an HDR650b... Namely, the difference between feeling fast and actually being faster.

    I don't have reliable times on my HDR yet, but it sure feels faster, so much so that I've been freaking myself out on a few regular runs. But is it actually faster?! Don't know yet.

    Gotta be the rider, not the bike, right?
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  18. #18
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    Haha,
    I've ridden bikes that I swore I felt fast on only to see it was not really that fast. I think it has a lot to do with how controlled a bike handles. I think a very composed bike gives the sense that your not going as fast since it's more controlled.

  19. #19
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    I'm no expert but it looks like the HD 650 os faster across the board


    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Damage View Post
    OK, first a couple of disclaimers....
    1. I am comparing a 650B converted HD here not an HDR
    2. I've been a long time Santa Cruz fan and some times VPP fan for nearly 20 years and my bike hobby (sickness as my wife refers to it) has had me buy/build/tinker/sell numerous SC bikes over that time including: Tazmon, Superlight1, Blur classic (meh), Nomad1 (coiled and still one of my all time favorites), Nomad2AL (meh), VPFree (fun, but a rolling couch), Superlight2, V10 (I'm just not a DHer), Blur TRc (my first 650 conversion and a great ride, but not durable enough for the rough stuff), and finally a BronsonC last summer.

    So, put 850 miles on the Bronson from July thru Feb according to Strava. XX1, Pike 160, Monarch Plus, LB Carbon rims + I9 hubs, LEV 150 dropper. Came in at 27.1 lbs. Bike is super fun, but I never felt confident at high speed cornering. Tinkered with the setup a lot and finally went to a 50mm stem from a 70 which was about the best I had it at, but still felt sketched about comitting to the front end. Finally decided to ditch the Bronson and built up a used HD frame with the XX1 and wheels from the Bronson. Put a 160 Pike & 150 LEV on it. Sits at 27.8lbs right now with the principal difference being 740mm wide bars vs 710 on the Bro (plus the TT on the L HD is 0.2in shorter). I've always been a tweener on SC sizes being 5'10.5" and always opted for the L frame.

    Also for X-mas this past year I built up a Pivot Mach429C to be my XC ride, but wound up beefing it up with a Pike 140 and meetier tires (Maxxis HR2 F & Ardent R just like on the Bronson). Got the 429 pretty dialed and was putting up better times than I even did on the Bronson on my local segments.

    Now have about 120mi on the HD, 60 of which were in Sedona an 60 on the local La Costa trails. In these 5 or so local rides I have PR's 4 of the 5 DH segs that I frequent on a weekly basis (the 5th I was a couple seconds behind my 429 time that I got just after it rained... Hero Dirt!)

    In response to Future's comparison above:
    1. Tight ST. Agree, both are super fun bikes to ride. I think the HD fits me better so might have an edge here.
    2. Rocky/Root climbing. The HD blows the Bro away here (this was another gripe I had about the Bro).
    3. Tech descent. Here I disagree and favor the HD (strava times below to prove it with only 1 or 2 tries on the HD). IMO the Bronson feels fast, but my times never really were. In fact, I generally put up better times on the 429 and the BlurTRc than on the Bronson which really surprised me.
    4. Long FR climbs. Jury is still out here, but would probably agree (most of the climbing I've done on the HD has been with frequent stops to make adjustments... And its harder to motivate to go after a climb vs a descent)


    Lizard Descent: 1.6mi -505' (53 tries, 31/491)

    1 23-Mar-14 6:07 15.4mi/h HD650B
    2 3-Mar-14 6:16 15.0mi/h MACH429C
    3 7-Apr-12 6:19 14.9mi/h BLUR TRC 26
    4 5-Feb-14 6:21 14.8mi/h MACH429C
    5 6-Mar-14 6:24 14.7mi/h MACH429C
    6 4-Apr-13 6:28 14.6mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    7 19-Mar-13 6:30 14.5mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    8 8-Mar-13 6:32 14.4mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    8 29-Apr-13 6:32 14.4mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    10 24-Apr-12 6:35 14.3mi/h BLUR TRC 26
    29 27-Nov-13 7:13 13.1mi/h BRONSON

    La Costa Switchbacks: 2.1mi, -588' (67 Tries, 20/362)
    1 20-Mar-14 8:57 14.1mi/h HD650B
    2 29-Jan-14 8:58 14.1mi/h MACH429C
    3 23-Mar-14 9:01 14.0mi/h HD650B
    4 3-Mar-14 9:06 13.9mi/h MACH429C
    5 23-Jan-14 9:10 13.8mi/h MACH429C
    6 31-Jan-13 9:15 13.6mi/h BRONSON
    6 26-Sep-13 9:15 13.6mi/h BRONSON
    8 6-Dec-13 9:16 13.6mi/h BRONSON
    9 12-Jun-12 9:19 13.5mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    10 24-Apr-12 9:20 13.5mi/h BLUR TRC 26

    ***** & Moan: 1.3 mi, -220' (29 Tries, 6/277)
    1 Thu, Mar 20, 2014 6:44 11.6mi/h HD650B
    2 Mon, Feb 3, 2014 6:51 11.4mi/h MACH429C
    3 Wed, Mar 12, 2014 6:55 11.3mi/h HD650B
    4 Wed, Jan 29, 2014 6:57 11.2mi/h MACH429C
    5 Wed, Jan 22, 2014 7:14 10.8mi/h MACH429C
    5 Tue, Feb 25, 2014 7:14 10.8mi/h MACH429C
    7 Tue, Jan 7, 2014 7:28 10.4mi/h MACH429C
    8 Wed, Dec 11, 2013 7:38 10.2mi/h BRONSON
    9 Tue, May 7, 2013 7:40 10.2mi/h BLUR TRC 650B
    10 Fri, Dec 27, 2013 7:41 10.1mi/h BRONSON

    Powerline to Elfin Forest DH: 0.7mi -311' (28 tries, 2/119)
    1 Sat, Mar 22, 2014 2:03 21.8mi/h HD650B
    2 Thu, Feb 13, 2014 2:13 20.2mi/h BRONSON
    3 Sat, Jan 4, 2014 2:18 19.5mi/h BRONSON
    3 Mon, Feb 17, 2014 2:18 19.5mi/h MACH429C
    5 Thu, Feb 6, 2014 2:19 19.3mi/h MACH429C
    5 Thu, Feb 20, 2014 2:19 19.3mi/h MACH429C
    7 Sun, Dec 29, 2013 2:20 19.2mi/h BRONSON
    7 Sun, Feb 9, 2014 2:20 19.2mi/h BRONSON
    9 Sun, Jan 19, 2014 2:23 18.8mi/h MACH429C
    10 Thu, Jan 9, 2014 2:24 18.7mi/h MACH429C

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Damage View Post
    XX1, Pike 160, Monarch Plus, LB Carbon rims + I9 hubs, LEV 150 dropper. Came in at 27.1 lbs. Bike is super fun, but I never felt confident at high speed cornering. Tinkered with the setup a lot and finally went to a 50mm stem from a 70 which was about the best I had it at, but still felt sketched about comitting to the front end.

    principal difference being 740mm wide bars vs 710 on the Bro (plus the TT on the L HD is 0.2in shorter). I've always been a tweener on SC sizes being 5'10.5" and always opted for the L frame.
    Do you think the lack of confidence comes from the cockpit set up on the Bronson? The bro was slacker with the 160 pike (66.5 head angle?), yet you were running a 710 (xc bar in my mind) on an AM bike. Doesnt the bike come with 750 havocs?

    That alone would cause me to feel less confident and my high speed cornering would be affected. Did you try a wider bar?

    Both these bikes are on my short list, I could care less about strava times, I'm more concerned with feel, and your comments have me thinking.

    It's still winter here, so hopefully some demo rides in the coming months.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by EMR View Post
    Do you think the lack of confidence comes from the cockpit set up on the Bronson? The bro was slacker with the 160 pike (66.5 head angle?), yet you were running a 710 (xc bar in my mind) on an AM bike. Doesnt the bike come with 750 havocs?

    That alone would cause me to feel less confident and my high speed cornering would be affected. Did you try a wider bar?

    Both these bikes are on my short list, I could care less about strava times, I'm more concerned with feel, and your comments have me thinking.

    It's still winter here, so hopefully some demo rides in the coming months.
    Yeah, wider bars would certainly have helped. The 710 Haven bars were a carryover from my Blur TC that broke weeks before the Downieville race last year. Fought the urge to spend more $ on the bike by that time, but would 30mm in width make that much of a difference? Guess I'll never know. The HD should actually be slacker??? Bronson is claimed 67deg w/ a 150 Fox @ 544 A-C while the Pike 160/275 is 552 A-C so yes it should be in the 66.5 range. Looking at the HDR-650 numbers, it's 67.1 with a 534 A-C fork, so shouldn't I be in the 66 deg range with my current setup?

    It's interesting because a lot of people really love their Bronsons, I just never got there and usually reached for a different ride when I went to the garage which is why I decided to part ways with her.

    For the Strava times, it was more just of interest to me than really caring about the times. What really stood out in looking at the data was that I PR'd all 4 segments on my 1st (or 2nd) try without feeling like I was pushing my limits while on the Bronson never really got there. THe 429 times were after a number of tries and really pushing it.

    Definetly get as many demo rides as you can, but you can't really go wrong with any of the new bikes out there these days.

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