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  1. #1
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    Anyone Riding XX1 Yet?

    Now that is available would love to hear some feedback on it. Thinking about making the switch, but am nervous since I have been an XTR guy for the last 20 years.

  2. #2
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    XX1 has been one of the most significant ride-impacting upgrades I've done to date on any of my bikes, ever. I have XX1 on a Carbine 275 and on a 2011 S-Works Epic 29er. Was riding XTR prior to XX1 and XX prior to that.

    My favorite perks:

    1) Silence - Yes, XTR Shadow Plus and XO type 2 rear derailleurs were a huge improvement over traditional chainstay-slapping versions. But even with those, you got chain strikes on the front derailleur cage causing noise. Also, the chain tension from the rear mech is much greater than XTR or XX and helps immensely. XX1 is dead silent.

    2) No left shifter and front derailleur - this is obvious but until you try it, you won't understand just how great this is. Riding in situations with quick transitions from climbs to descents or slow turns to sprints, or in rolling terrain, you are in the right gear all the time without having to think about it at all. No mixing chain ring and rear cog combos is necessary, no sticking with the wrong chainring just to avoid front shifts, no chain drops. More focus is available for shredding the trail. No large compromises either as with the missing ranges on a 1 x 10. Heck, its even easier to clean since dirt and mud do not pack into the front derailleur gaps, between chainrings or between bottom bracket and inner chainring area.

    3) Less weight!

    4) Ground clearance - with the standard 32 tooth up front, I am able to clear more logs and obstacles without grinding the ring.

    Least favorite thing:

    1) Lost some top end - in order to maintain the same low end gear ratios as my 2 x 10 setups I've had to give up the highest gears. Not by much, but enough to necessitate more RPMs on fast stretches and sprints.

    Hope that helps!


    EDIT (more info below as requested)

    Personal preference thing:

    1) Trigger Shifter ergos - I moved from XX to XTR largely because I preferred Shimano's smooth, longer throw lever ergos and push/pull trigger shifting option to the XX's short, snappy thumb-only shifting. Moving to XX1, I am back to the thumb-only shifts, but am willing to compromise here due to the huge benefits of the system overall. Actually, the shifts feel better and much lighter than XX despite the tighter rear mech spring. You can also shift up 5 cogs in one long lever push. Shifting to smaller cogs still require a single click per gear but is not much of an issue since most of this kind of shifting is done under light loads on the drivetrain, and can be done in rapid fire.

    2) Gripshift ergos - Thought I wouldn't like gripshift since I didn't back in the 90's. I do now. Controlling the entire gear range of the bike in one twist of the wrist is very cool and after a couple of minutes, becomes completely intuitive. The action is also much lighter than I remember old gripshift to be. What I didn't like are the really long and hard grips provided. Because of the gripshift mech and the still longish right grip provided, the right brake gets pushed very far inboard effectively narrowing your bars when you compensate by holding onto the grips further inside. There's a matching left grip, also long. I took a box cutter and a Dremel to the right grip of a pair of Ourys and now have a much better feeling setup.

    3) Confidence - yes, knowing very little can go wrong with the drivetrain is great. The rear mech's horizontal-movement design eliminates ghost shifts on the rear and the single ring front eliminates chain drops, which by the way never happens even on the harshest terrain. I initially wanted XX1 after reading about it a couple of days after dropping my chain and miss-shifting the two-ring set up on my S-Works Epic yet again on a short-course race. After trying out XX1 on the race bike, I immediately saw potential benefits for trail riding, put it on the Carbine as well, and have been a happy camper ever since. My old drivetrains now feel obsolete.

    Weights:

    Someone asked about parts weights. Yes, I did incidentally weigh almost everything as I unboxed the stuff:

    Crank (BB30 166 175mm w/ 32-tooth) - 548g
    Crank (GXP 166 175mm w/ 32-tooth) - 566g
    Rear Derailleur - 240g
    Cassette - 266g
    Trigger Shifter - 110g
    Sram BB-92 GXP Bottom Bracket with Wave Washer - 90g
    Sram PF30 Bottom Bracket - 82g
    Last edited by ducrider; 12-03-2012 at 04:00 PM.

  3. #3
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    From what drivetrain did you migrate to XX1?
    There's a feeling I get
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iwan View Post
    From what drivetrain did you migrate to XX1?
    Read his post much?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by ducrider View Post

    3) Less weight!
    great review! I recently saw two XX1 builds that were very similar to my XX race bike, and I was surprised to see that the groupsets are very close together! You gain some weight on the cassette, and the cranksets are about the same weight too. Did you happen to weigh the full group, or each part individually?

    ps, post pics. It's monday morning, we need some bike pron!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ducrider View Post
    Was riding XTR prior to XX1 and XX prior to that.
    Thanks for a great review - everything you say is what I would expect and why I'm excited about this group (not that I can pony up for it anytime soon).

    Curious: why did you go back to XTR after XX? (if I'm reading this right).

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemikemike View Post
    Thanks for a great review - everything you say is what I would expect and why I'm excited about this group (not that I can pony up for it anytime soon).

    Curious: why did you go back to XTR after XX? (if I'm reading this right).
    Mike & RedMR2, I've updated the original post with the details and weights

  8. #8
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    Thank you. Interesting that the cassette is only 70g heavier than xx 11-36.

    That bb30 crankset weight is 120g under what i've seen, that is great news!

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    Great Review. Thanks
    What did you do about wheel systems? This seems like the biggest impediment to changing over.
    Salespunk- what will you do with your EC90's? Is there a conversion?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trashcanmike View Post
    Great Review. Thanks
    What did you do about wheel systems? This seems like the biggest impediment to changing over.
    Salespunk- what will you do with your EC90's? Is there a conversion?

    The carbon Rovals on the S-Works Epic 29er use DT Swiss internals. On the Intense Carbine, I have a set of Enve AM 650b wheels which also use DT Swiss 240 hubs. It took all of 30 seconds to swap each of these to the new DT Swiss XX1 hub bodies, no tools needed.

    Right now, if looking to use your existing wheelset, best case would be that you have either Sram or DT Swiss rear hubs which have readily available XX1 compatible hub body replacements available.

  11. #11
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    Easton is working on the new cassette body for the M121 hub, which is the late 2011 update. The older M120 will not have the ability to upgrade. Really interested in trying the XX1 though. I like the gear spread and not having to run a chainguide.

    Awesome feedback and thanks for the datapoints.

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    XX1 would be a very nice upgrade coming from a 1x9 setup. The biggest draw back, though is you have to change your rear hub just to accommodate their cassette. I hope shimano is working on something that would not let you change the hub just for you to have a new drive train.

  13. #13
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    Nice write up Ducrider. Just for the record Hope has a cassette body available also.
    Last edited by Jamenstall; 12-04-2012 at 12:37 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    Easton is working on the new cassette body for the M121 hub, which is the late 2011 update. The older M120 will not have the ability to upgrade. Really interested in trying the XX1 though. I like the gear spread and not having to run a chainguide.

    Awesome feedback and thanks for the datapoints.
    Sweet!

    Loving XO with gripshift and type 2 RD but the FD mount has issues (not perfectly straight) so this is worthy of consideration next year!

  15. #15
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    Shimano will not be able to run a 10t in the rear without a redesign of the cassette either. It is a physical limitation based on the diameter of current freehub bodies. Without a 10t they will not be able to get the same topend. What I like about the XX1 is that a 38t up front gives a similar low gear to a 28/36 which is my current low and a high gear similar to 40/11. I am switching to 1x tonight with a 32t up front and will probably go to a 34 before the end of the month.

  16. #16
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    156 Q-factor

    Anyone try the narrower q-factor XX1 cranks on an Ibis Mojo or HD? Wondering if the arms will clear the chainstays without problems

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by SOFTBUTT View Post
    Nice write up Ducrider. Just for the record Hope has a cassette body available also.
    Wow didn't know that hope has one. Do you have any idea how much is the cassette body?

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    XX1 is a great concept. But I too prefer Shimano. What I'm more concerned about over losing top end is the low end. I hate climbing so I currently run 22t granny and 36t rear. Call me old fashioned but it makes climbing less painful for these tired legs and lungs.

    Going 32t-42t is still not low enough for me. Guess I'm sticking with my current setup. That's good. I need to wear this one out before I blow another wad of cash.
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    I haven't been able to find any online, but I would assume/hope they would be around the same price as their standard bodies.

    I did although speak to Hope USA and they were placing an order for them. That was about 3 weeks ago.

    Quote Originally Posted by timex99 View Post
    Wow didn't know that hope has one. Do you have any idea how much is the cassette body?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by myitch View Post
    XX1 is a great concept. But I too prefer Shimano. What I'm more concerned about over losing top end is the low end. I hate climbing so I currently run 22t granny and 36t rear. Call me old fashioned but it makes climbing less painful for these tired legs and lungs.

    Going 32t-42t is still not low enough for me. Guess I'm sticking with my current setup. That's good. I need to wear this one out before I blow another wad of cash.

    BTW, there is a 28-tooth XX1 chainring available which will get you the equivalent of 24 front, 36 rear. Pretty close to your setup.

  21. #21
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    You might try pushing a bigger gear. I have found that it lowers my heart rate and breathing considerably. Doesn't make me faster though

  22. #22
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    Hans confirmned my frame is shipping to me today yay, My XX1 has been lonley in its box, I dont get the fasination with losing gears, Ive been on single rings for years, ran 11/36 x 33t up front still rode up everything everyone else did, was it harder yes, but still no issue, with XX1 it will be a doodle, why do people knock what they haven't tried.

    The rear d is heart of XX1 that I find sexy, the cage does not need to go forward and back it just follows each cog, quite amazing, I cant wait to get it on my HD.

    Maybe next week by time it lands goes through customs get her built up, so excited, nit been so excited about a frame and drivetrain for years.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    You might try pushing a bigger gear. I have found that it lowers my heart rate and breathing considerably. Doesn't make me faster though
    Yeah, but I prefer to spin vs. push. And I'm not a big roadie either but I feel it's more effecient. Don't get me wrong, though, this XX1 has me very tempted but dang, gotta change the whole drivetrain AND freehub body. I just bought my new 10spd goods too.

    I bet in about 1-2 yrs Shimano does something similar and maybe even better. Without getting into a Shimano vs. SRAM debate, Shimano has just been better for me. Like disc brakes and suspension forks did, the technology will improve and come down in price. I'll wait for better carbon wheels/rims, and now this 1x11 concept too.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ducrider View Post
    BTW, there is a 28-tooth XX1 chainring available which will get you the equivalent of 24 front, 36 rear. Pretty close to your setup.
    Perfect, that's my current setup on 2x10. 30T might be and option to try also.

    Hadley will have a freehub available in January and I9 is already shipping theirs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by unclekittykiller View Post
    Anyone try the narrower q-factor XX1 cranks on an Ibis Mojo or HD? Wondering if the arms will clear the chainstays without problems
    I recently e-mailed Ibis about this and he gave me the thumbs up:

    "Yes, a 156mm q-factor SRAM crank will fit on the HD. Clearance is tight, but it does work just fine. We specced 156q cranks in our XX kit for years and didn't have any issues."

    You might consider the size of your feet and how they are positioned on the pedals though.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by myitch View Post
    Yeah, but I prefer to spin vs. push. And I'm not a big roadie either but I feel it's more effecient. Don't get me wrong, though, this XX1 has me very tempted but dang, gotta change the whole drivetrain AND freehub body. I just bought my new 10spd goods too.

    I bet in about 1-2 yrs Shimano does something similar and maybe even better. Without getting into a Shimano vs. SRAM debate, Shimano has just been better for me. Like disc brakes and suspension forks did, the technology will improve and come down in price. I'll wait for better carbon wheels/rims, and now this 1x11 concept too.
    I am/was a spinner too. Just went to a 28/40 XTR 2X and was surprised how much I liked it and adapted to it. My last ride I did not go above by 28/28 and felt really good. Going to a 34 1X today, but I do like the idea of the XX1. Hopefully Shimano will have a solution soon.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    Shimano will not be able to run a 10t in the rear without a redesign of the cassette either. It is a physical limitation based on the diameter of current freehub bodies. Without a 10t they will not be able to get the same topend. ...
    Might be misunderstanding you but I have 07 XTR wheels/freehub with 0h 12 two by ten. No prob. Do you mean Shinamo wheels can't fit an 11 tooth with the current spacing? That would be a deal breaker to me. I want hubs I can O/H in 10 minutes with $10 woth of tools on the floor of a hotel room at 2 am. Shimano or bust there. If the 1x11 would fit XTR wheels I'd consider it for sure...

    OP do you ever find the XX1 shifter tripple clicks down on you when you only wanted one gear? My X0 used to do that to me all the time especially on bumpy ground like say in the mountains. Want one gear...get three.

  28. #28
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    Correct, Shimano hubs cannot fit the XX1 rear cassette. The diameter of the Shimano freehub is too large to fit ANY 10T cassette. Might want to check out the SRAM wheels, but it sounds like you are refusing to run any wheels that have sealed bearings which is really limits your choices.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by conekilr View Post
    I recently e-mailed Ibis about this and he gave me the thumbs up:

    "Yes, a 156mm q-factor SRAM crank will fit on the HD. Clearance is tight, but it does work just fine. We specced 156q cranks in our XX kit for years and didn't have any issues."

    You might consider the size of your feet and how they are positioned on the pedals though.
    I did make a quick call to Ibis and they also confirmed that the 156q will work for the Ripley as well. I have small to medium sized feet so I'm not so much worried about heel rub, but the narrower q-factor should help with pedaling for my short ass legs.

  30. #30
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    Wondering if there is/will be a bash guard available for the XX1. Otherwise it would be very painful to break some tooth of the chainrings or even damage the chain or the carbon crank while accidently hitting some rocks on the trail....

  31. #31
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    An MRP XCG BB mount might work, the cranks themselves can't take a bash guard as std they only have the one ring mount, unless you can remove replace the spider as you can on XO cranks.

  32. #32
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    Is the design of the XX1 crank a lot different from others? Normally it is no problem to just add an outer bashguard and lock it with longer screws to the original spider/chainring?!

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    I also would like to have a bash option. Living in New England I know I could find a way to smack the single ring.

    It's still so new but I'm sure someone will come up with a solution(s)
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post
    I also would like to have a bash option. Living in New England I know I could find a way to smack the single ring.

    It's still so new but I'm sure someone will come up with a solution(s)

    Well I found this one:

    MRP Responds To SRAM XX1 With Three New Chainguides - Eurobike 2012 - Pinkbike

    But I would prever a solid outer ring instead of a flimsy chainguide solution.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalkhoffpink View Post
    Well I found this one:

    MRP Responds To SRAM XX1 With Three New Chainguides - Eurobike 2012 - Pinkbike

    But I would prever a solid outer ring instead of a flimsy chainguide solution.
    Yes but is that compatible with the IBIS dw link?
    Doesn't say its BB compatible?
    Edit, I found this thread answer from Noahcolorado cheers
    It is BB compatible sweet, may look at one of these myself.
    MRP1x or eThirteen XCX on 1x10 HD?

    Kalk. Ski, the XX1 crank like the rest of the system has been designed ground up each component is not like any other component before it so you cant compare to what you have been used to.

    The cranks spider as std has no recesses its only one is for the chain ring, longer bolts will do nothing, this is to optimise the chain line I would say.

    Like other Sram cranks you maybe able to replace the spider, I would look but all my parts are at the LBS waiting on the frame for installation.

    The MRP XCB should def be compatible anyways.
    Last edited by Maverick005; 12-07-2012 at 11:07 AM.

  36. #36
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    Found this pic, first in this link, looks like the spider is removable so in theory you could mount a std Sram spider to allow for bash ring compatibility.

    SRAM XX1 Review

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick005 View Post
    Found this pic, first in this link, looks like the spider is removable so in theory you could mount a std Sram spider to allow for bash ring compatibility.

    SRAM XX1 Review
    I am not the best engineer in the world but the chainring on the XX1 is easily removable to swap the chainring to another size. IMHO it should be no problem for what company ever to invent a simple bash guard with the right holes and dimensions to fit the xx1 like any other bash to be attached with longer spider-screws...

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalkhoffpink View Post
    I am not the best engineer in the world but the chainring on the XX1 is easily removable to swap the chainring to another size. IMHO it should be no problem for what company ever to invent a simple bash guard with the right holes and dimensions to fit the xx1 like any other bash to be attached with longer spider-screws...
    You are missing the point, maybe read some XX1 articles thoroughly you don't need to be an engineer just read it, this is not a standard spider on the crank arm.

    Ive run single rings for years with bash rings I know what you're assuming, they're is no way a standard bash ring can mount on that spider, read my earlier post about the removable spider then yes a std bash and ring will fit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick005 View Post
    You are missing the point, maybe read some XX1 articles thoroughly you don't need to be an engineer just read it, this is not a standard spider on the crank arm.

    Ive run single rings for years with bash rings I know what you're assuming, they're is no way a standard bash ring can mount on that spider, read my earlier post about the removable spider then yes a std bash and ring will fit.
    Hmm, I didn´t get it. From my point of view I see no problem. Heres a pic:
    To me the crank with the spider and the chainrings look like on every other crank.
    Maybe the dimensions are a little different. But why should a bash with longer screws not fit on this one? And I do NOT mean an existing one it hast to fit the XX1 dimensions of course. Where is my mistake?


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    Well you could probably jury rig longer bolts and spacers but there will be no shoulder edge for the bash to mount on. Totally supported by just the bolts which I don't like the idea of.

    This thing is so modular that there will be a good solution in short time for a full outer bash ring like for example this spider assy from North Shore Billet for XO and X9 cranks arms that allow the use of 104BCD rings (for those stuck with the 120BCD cranks)

    2 x10 104BCD Spider for SRAM X0 & X9 Cranks « North Shore Billet
    Last edited by skidad; 12-07-2012 at 11:56 AM.
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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalkhoffpink View Post
    Hmm, I didn´t get it. From my point of view I see no problem. Heres a pic:
    To me the crank with the spider and the chainrings look like on every other crank.
    Maybe the dimensions are a little different. But why should a bash with longer screws not fit on this one? And I do NOT mean an existing one it hast to fit the XX1 dimensions of course. Where is my mistake?

    The four bolt holes on the XX1 spider are not equidistant from each other. The 76 BCD on the spider requires the two holes along the crank arm to be spaced further apart in order to get an allen key in there. There aren't currently any bashes on the market with this configuration.

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    Anyone know if the crank arm removes from the spider or is it integrated or bonded or whatever? Looks like it might be removable?
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  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post
    Anyone know if the crank arm removes from the spider or is it integrated or bonded or whatever? Looks like it might be removable?
    It is removable. It is a splined interface - same as X0, X9, and Truvativ AKA. AFAIK the XX1 arms are the same as X0. I am using an XX1 spider and ring on my X0 crankarms.

    One of the reasons a bashguard won't fit on the standard XX1 setup is that the spider is has no surface to mount one on.

    An MRP XCG will keep you protected - or an MRP AMg will keep you protected AND ensure you never lose a chain.

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  44. #44
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    Another wheel options would be Industry Nine. They have a freehub that fits it also.
    Industry Nine SRAM XX1 Hub and XC29 Carbon Wheels | Mountain Bike Review
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    Any chain drops with XX1 crank?
    Is the crank reliable enough not to use a chain guide or something like that?

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    You might try pushing a bigger gear. I have found that it lowers my heart rate and breathing considerably. Doesn't make me faster though
    Ah, the old high vs. low gear argument. I thought it was generally understood at this point that spinning lower gears is more efficient than pushing big gears - which tires out your quads faster and strains your knees. It's not wimpy to prefer lower gearing. Use what feels right to you. If you like to grind, go for it
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

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    If you had read my entire post you would see that I used to spin small gears. I don't believe it is wimpy, I was encouraging people to try new things. I have gone from a 22/32/42 triple to a 28/40 2X to a 35 1X in the last 60 days and felt better on the climbs each time. Try it, you might like it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    If you had read my entire post you would see that I used to spin small gears. I don't believe it is wimpy, I was encouraging people to try new things. I have gone from a 22/32/42 triple to a 28/40 2X to a 35 1X in the last 60 days and felt better on the climbs each time. Try it, you might like it!
    Congrats to your strong thighs, but I do not see how this should work with normal bikers. At the moment I am riding a 22/36 2x combination and on my tours I am often very happy about the 22 front, 36 rear combo because otherwise I would not be able to climb a lot of parts of the trail.
    Thinking of switching to 34 in front and 42 (XX1) in the rear within 60 days would be a miracle. How should this work without month of training? I would definitely start with the 28 front 42 rear combo at first...

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    Well, the whole thing about XX1 is that you can pretty easily change the front ring. Buy 2 or 3 and change them out whether you ride trails or mountain stuff.

    Only a monster could crank up a hill in the alps with 34/42. On the contrary on those trails you harldy need a big ring going down because anyhow you don't need to pedal to get speed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    If you had read my entire post you would see that I used to spin small gears. I don't believe it is wimpy, I was encouraging people to try new things. I have gone from a 22/32/42 triple to a 28/40 2X to a 35 1X in the last 60 days and felt better on the climbs each time. Try it, you might like it!
    As my entire post said "ride what you like"

    I still have my 26" SS. If I want to grind a big gear climbing, I can. I put "a normal" sized ring on my 26" 1X9 (32T) for the greater efficiency while climbing in a lower gear. On the other hand, while hammering, I rarely spin out the 32:11. On my SS, I frequently spin out 32:17

    Everybody is different. I have been in many arguments with "pedal harder" 29'er folks who insist they have no problem riding bigger hoops with gearing designed for smaller hoops.

    Not me. Whatever floats your boat.
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

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