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  1. #1
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    Opinions please. Trance X3 bike position (w/ pic)

    Hate to ask this in this forum but since the all Trance X riders go here, thought it is the better place to ask.

    Anyways, my son is 5'4.5" and rides a 16" X3 with 90mm stem. We were on the trails last night and he mentioned to me that the back-end seems to always want to come up or lift quite a bit. My initial reaction was to push the seat back. So now, I'm kinda questioning the stem size. Maybe he needs a shorter stem to get his relative position slightly towards the rear (?). Here's a pic of him on the X3. What do you think? It's almost as if he needs to move further back. In the pic, the seat is already pushed all the way back.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Opinions please. Trance X3 bike position (w/ pic)-trancex3_riding_position.jpg  


    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

  2. #2
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    judging by that pic the frame seems a little bit too small for the boy

  3. #3
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    I have to admit I'm not familiar with situations where the back of the bike lifts uncontrollably (the front is way more common). I wonder if maybe there is not enough rebound damping and/or too much p.s.i. in the rear shock, thus catapulting him forward after going over an obstacle.

    In what situations does the back-end come up?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BEEB
    judging by that pic the frame seems a little bit too small for the boy
    I certainly hope that's not the case, not just because we just bought the bike, but coz Giant's sizing will be way off. The 16" was supposed to be for 5'4" to 5'7". I'm 5'7" and fit on it even with the 90mm stem and the seat higher. I did try the 18" but it felt big so I'm one of the in-between guys as well.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

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    Quote Originally Posted by antonio
    I have to admit I'm not familiar with situations where the back of the bike lifts uncontrollably (the front is way more common). I wonder if maybe there is not enough rebound damping and/or too much p.s.i. in the rear shock, thus catapulting him forward after going over an obstacle.

    In what situations does the back-end come up?
    I wouldn't really categorize it as uncontrollably but I would ask him for more specifics as to when this happens. But it happens when he hits a big enough bump and it will bounce the back enough for a slight lift. Also during braking.

    He has been riding an oversized Wahoo (17.5") and with the Genesis geometry, it's really waaaay to big for him. So there might be habits he need to change to adapt to the X3.

    But your comment on rebound damping or shock pressure seems to make sense to me. The front is set to 65psi while the back is at 155psi, based on his weight on 155lbs. He has the rebound 6 clicks out both front and back.

    I really, really hope the frame size is not the problem. I'm about to pick up a 16" X2 myself because this size feels good. Our dimensions are pretty much the same except that I have longer legs (in-seam).

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

  6. #6
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    I have to agree with the boy looking a bit too big for that bike. His body seems a tad way too up front and on top of the front end.
    Ride

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    Is the seatpost extentension ok? Can't judge it from this picture, because the pedals are on the same height. If it's ok then the frame really looks small.
    Under bumps and harsh braking situations it's quite normal that the front end sinks and the back end lifts. He can counter it with correct weight distribution on the bike. If it occurs very fast then more rebound daming helps.

  8. #8
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    I am 5'10 and ride a 18" trance x2, i weigh the same as your son and have the exact same suspension settings psi and rebound except for the front where i have it 9 clicks out and have no problem with the rear end lifting.

    I took a picture of myself on the bike and my ass does hang over the back more than your son's does so maybe you could try a layback seatpost to move his weight futher back and see if that helps
    Last edited by guzz46; 08-12-2010 at 05:08 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fda47
    I certainly hope that's not the case, not just because we just bought the bike, but coz Giant's sizing will be way off. The 16" was supposed to be for 5'4" to 5'7". I'm 5'7" and fit on it even with the 90mm stem and the seat higher. I did try the 18" but it felt big so I'm one of the in-between guys as well.

    i would never buy a bike based on the size the manufacturer recomends for a certain height...
    you have to sit 5mins on the bike to see if fits or not

    lets take commencal as an example... according to their size chart i would go either L or XL
    but L is 18.5 and the last time i went riding a bike that small the fork just went to bottom due to too much weight on handlebar

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    Slow down the rebound

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    Quote Originally Posted by guzz46
    I am 5'10 and ride a 18" trance x2, i weigh the same as your son and have the exact same suspension settings psi and rebound except for the front where i have it 9 clicks out and have no problem with the rear end lifting.

    I took a picture of myself on the bike and my ass does hang over the back more than your son's does so maybe you could try a layback seatpost to move his weight futher back and see if that helps
    You mind sending me, or posting the pic of yourself on the bike that you referred to above?
    It may be that he needs a layback seatpost.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biohazard74
    I have to agree with the boy looking a bit too big for that bike. His body seems a tad way too up front and on top of the front end.
    That's what it seems like. We may need to shift his weight a little to the back by proportionately shortening the stem and using a layback seatpost.

    Our upper body dimensions are pretty close. My seat is a bit higher and when I used it on the trails we go to all the time, it felt pretty good.

    With his seat lower, I think that effectively reduces the cockpit length enough to make his weight front-biased.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

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    Quote Originally Posted by madtrix
    Is the seatpost extentension ok? Can't judge it from this picture, because the pedals are on the same height. If it's ok then the frame really looks small.
    Under bumps and harsh braking situations it's quite normal that the front end sinks and the back end lifts. He can counter it with correct weight distribution on the bike. If it occurs very fast then more rebound daming helps.
    Seatpost may be a little lower that what it ideally should be. I'll take another pic with the pedals on the 6 and 12. Now with all the helpful comments here, I think it all boils down to weight distribution.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

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    Quote Originally Posted by BEEB
    i would never buy a bike based on the size the manufacturer recomends for a certain height...
    you have to sit 5mins on the bike to see if fits or not

    lets take commencal as an example... according to their size chart i would go either L or XL
    but L is 18.5 and the last time i went riding a bike that small the fork just went to bottom due to too much weight on handlebar
    I agree 100%, he did ride this bike around for more than 5mins before we bought it. He got on an 18" as well and that did not work out too well, it was way too big for him. Given that, we went for the 16" so I guess now it's all fine tuning.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem1
    Slow down the rebound
    I suppose you mean slow down the rebound in the back? Gonna try that next time we're out.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

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    FDA I'm the guy in Derry that had been talking to you via PM... I like the bike you got your son, may I ask where you got it.. But yes he does seem small for the frame..

    If your looking for a bike for you still, we might be able to work something out with mine, as I was improperly sized by Bensons, and they won't take it back for a larger frame.. Fwiw its a Diamondback Response Sport 16".. Nothing wrong at all, you could keep all my upgrades, (seatpost, Odi Lock ons, chainstay protector) and I'd sell it for $300.. I paid $489 in May for it..

    We are heading to the rail trails tonight if you guys want to meet up, about 6-630..

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    Fda, take a trip to the Bike Barn in Manch.. Pick up a Bontrager seat post with a 20mm offset.. Also theres no chainstay protector on your sons bike, they have them there for $2.. The seatpost is $20, which I just bought this weekend, and I really like it..

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by madtrix
    Is the seatpost extentension ok? Can't judge it from this picture, because the pedals are on the same height. If it's ok then the frame really looks small.
    Under bumps and harsh braking situations it's quite normal that the front end sinks and the back end lifts. He can counter it with correct weight distribution on the bike. If it occurs very fast then more rebound daming helps.
    This boy is going to continue to grow too.. Bring him in and tell them you want a good half hour on the 18" for the $$ your spending..

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    hey there Iboated

    Ya I know we haven't gotten to ride with you yet. I'm sure one day

    Anyways, the 18" Trance X will really not work out. It's gonna be hard to make that one shrink to fit him now. Even for me, the 18" feels a tad bit big.

    Read about your experience with Benson's. We are going full-sussies thus the Trance X. Going away from hardtails We got the X3 from S&W Sports in Concord.

    Actually, I already spoke with the LBS and they will take a look at the bike fit again tomorrow to see if it's really bad. I do feel though it's simple fine-tuning. It fits me and I feel it's better than an 18" as I can move the bike under me compared to the feeling of sitting on the bike.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

  20. #20
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    Well I am 5'6" with a 29" inseam and my S (16") Trance x2 fits me fine. I also run a 90mm 6 degree stem with 3/4" riser bars with a 20mm setback seatpost. Whats his weight? I am around 170lbs and run 170psi with the rebound set two clicks down from fastest. Never had any issues with it other then my front end coming up off the ground on some tech uphills, but thats more riding style then anything else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fda47
    It may be that he needs a layback seatpost.
    It might be that he even doesn't need anything new.
    Maybe you have to teach him to go out of and behind the saddle more on the trail or in braking situations?
    Also pushing down the bike after small bumps (like you do it in 4x or pump track riding) helps to don't get bucked off.

  22. #22
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    Set back seat post . You can see in the photo that the rider's knee is ahead of the pedal spindle center line , needs to be seated further back to get the knee @ or behind the pedal center . Here is a link to Sheldon Brown that may help ;

    http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0oG76deDG....com/kops.html

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    Excellent points all. I'm taking all these new-found knowledge with us to the LBS (who btw has been extremely helpful) who will help him with the correct body positioning.

    Quote Originally Posted by jdgang
    Well I am 5'6" with a 29" inseam and my S (16") Trance x2 fits me fine. I also run a 90mm 6 degree stem with 3/4" riser bars with a 20mm setback seatpost. Whats his weight? I am around 170lbs and run 170psi with the rebound set two clicks down from fastest. Never had any issues with it other then my front end coming up off the ground on some tech uphills, but thats more riding style then anything else.
    He is 155lbs with the shock set to 155psi and 6 clicks from slowest. So maybe that's why the rear end is slow to track back? Gonna try less damping in the back. I believe the stock Giant seatpost is not setback at all. LBS has one that they will have him try tomorrow, one with a 20 or 25mm setback.

    Quote Originally Posted by madtrix
    It might be that he even doesn't need anything new.
    Maybe you have to teach him to go out of and behind the saddle more on the trail or in braking situations?
    Also pushing down the bike after small bumps (like you do it in 4x or pump track riding) helps to don't get bucked off.
    You are most probably right. With the 17.5" Wahoo, he did not have the need to do that as it has like 23.8" ETT so his weight is further back with a shorter stem. He would need to unlearn old tricks and learn new ones

    Quote Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Set back seat post . You can see in the photo that the rider's knee is ahead of the pedal spindle center line , needs to be seated further back to get the knee @ or behind the pedal center . Here is a link to Sheldon Brown that may help ;

    http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0oG76deDG....com/kops.html
    That's exactly what I noticed while watching him pedal. He is not centered on the bike at all.

    2009 Giant Trance X3
    2010 Giant Trance X2

  24. #24
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    Here is mine, i use a 80mm stem, sounds like you already have the same rebound setting as jdgang, his is 2 clicks from fastest and yours is 6 clicks from slowest and there should only be 8 clicks available, if you wanted to slow it down a bit you could try 4 clicks from either way which is what i used to run but found it didn't rebound fast enough over braking bumps.


    Opinions please. Trance X3 bike position (w/ pic)-130820105981.jpg

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    Some things to consider.
    I'm 170 lbs and race xc[ firm set up] using only only 140 psi in the rear shock and 50 psi in the fork He is running 165 psi and is only 150 lbs.[ pump gauges do vary, but try lowering shock pressure.] Ignore mfg recommended pressures. Try to keep fork and shock pressures feeling similar[ firm or soft to balance out the ride. the fork or shock will xfer force to the other through the bike.]
    The x3 has built in platform in the shock which adds additional kick over tree roots etc.and does require lower pressures[ more sag] than shocks without platform.

    The Trance x has one of the steepest seat post angles in the business[steeper than most xc bikes] to offset it's long wheelbase. Hence, you see many Trance x riders who want to ride a smaller frame with offset seat posts so they can get the seat back far enough.

    I ALWAYS take measurements of effective top tube,seat to bar , seat to BB etc measurements on old bike to xfer riding posn stem length etc to new bike. The effective top tube is the most important bike fit measurement .

    What was he riding before and how does seat / BB/ bar position , effective top tube measurement compare to the Trance x?
    Last edited by gvs_nz; 08-13-2010 at 12:05 AM.

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