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  1. #1
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    betd/ enduro bearings

    01 NRS with a "few" miles on it.... ive had some problems with ghost shifting. ive have full lenght housing to the r. der. and it fixed the first ghost shifting problem. but the chainstay is warping under load... im going to try replacing all the bushings with either betd's bearing kit(100) or enduro's (50)... does anyone know if this will fix the problem before i drop a bunch of cash. do you have them and do the stock pins work with either of sets of bearing kits???? i need new set of teflon washers would htey be included???

    the 2nd problem is a clunking in the shock area... i think its up at top of the shock linkage. should i just replace the reducers and pins???? any place to do it cheap and save some $$ or just go to the LBS. (i try to avoid the LBS as much as possible, different story)

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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    01 NRS with a "few" miles on it.... ive had some problems with ghost shifting. ive have full lenght housing to the r. der. and it fixed the first ghost shifting problem. but the chainstay is warping under load... im going to try replacing all the bushings with either betd's bearing kit(100) or enduro's (50)... does anyone know if this will fix the problem before i drop a bunch of cash. do you have them and do the stock pins work with either of sets of bearing kits???? i need new set of teflon washers would htey be included???

    the 2nd problem is a clunking in the shock area... i think its up at top of the shock linkage. should i just replace the reducers and pins???? any place to do it cheap and save some $$ or just go to the LBS. (i try to avoid the LBS as much as possible, different story)
    The Enduro kit comes with 4 PAIR of Enduro MAX bearings, enough to do any year NRS. It's designed to be used with the newer '04/05 bikes that have the bearings in the HL pivot (as opposed to bushings). If you have an early frame (pre-'04) then you'd also need to purchase the HL pins/bushings seperately from your LBS/Giant dealer. The Enduro kit comes with ONLY the bearings, NO hardware. You also get a neat little do-dad to help you take out the main pivot bearings (the one's behind the BB). If you have a pre-04 NRS you simply don't use the 2 HL bearings. Keep in mind these 4 pair are to replace the main pivot (again, behind the BB), the fore AND aft bearings in the rocker plates and the HL bearings.

    I can't say 100% what exactly you get for bearing quality with the BETD kit. They could be "Japan" bearings, maybe 2RS, maybe not (2RS means 2 Rubber Seals - better sealing), but they're not Enduro MAX bearings. I know you have the choice between early and late-style NRS, but that's it. The BETD kits come with all new hardware to convert the early frames to bearings in the HL pivot.

    I'm not sure what you mean by Teflon washers. Perhaps you mean the plastic bushings in the HL pivot? You obviously would not use those if you were to convert to bearings there.

    Will replacing all the bearings/bushings fix your problem? That's hard to say. It REALLY depends on how bad your current pieces are. If they're in bad enough condition, then yes, certainly they can/will help. I, for one, can't say without seeing your frame in my hands.

    As for clunking in the shock - you need to see exactly where it's coming from to be sure. It might be the bearings, the pins, bushings to mount the shock, maybe the eyelets (the part that's pressed into the shock) or even the shock itself. OR it could be ANY combination of those.

    Replacing the PINS is easy. You only need a 6 mm allen key. Same goes for replacing the bushings (the aluminum shock mounts). The REAR linkage plate bearings are easy as they use an allen key to secure them (don't ask me why - stupid, IMHO). When you need to replace bearings or shock eyelets THEN you start to get into territory where you want to be SURE you know what you're doing. Having a vise with different sized sockets helps. Some people like to use a hammer and punch ..... ummmm, not my idea of good, but that's just me.


    A little friendly hi-jacking? If anyone has an '04/05 you wanna post some pics of the HL hardware PLEASE????????????? Might be nice to see for a comparison against BETD's kit.
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  3. #3
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    enduro bearings

    ENDURO kit for an 01 NRS, the bearings for the horst link wont fit.? is my next best option be to get a new pair of plastic bushings and new bushings/pins for the HL pivot. when i replace all the stock pins, would i order the same pins, or do i need a different size to fit the bearings?
    I have your standard car mechanic shop available to me, so would the average guy be able to replace everything? any tips since i havent done it before?

    just so its spelled out for me, i need:
    Horst link bushings, pins, plastic bushing/washer
    new pins for all pivots
    new reducers and pins for the shock

    clunking
    would just replacing the reducers and pins be a good place to start trouble shootin

    THANKS for the help!
    ben

    whats IMHO?

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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    ENDURO kit for an 01 NRS, the bearings for the horst link wont fit.? is my next best option be to get a new pair of plastic bushings and new bushings/pins for the HL pivot. when i replace all the stock pins, would i order the same pins, or do i need a different size to fit the bearings?
    I have your standard car mechanic shop available to me, so would the average guy be able to replace everything? any tips since i havent done it before?

    just so its spelled out for me, i need:
    Horst link bushings, pins, plastic bushing/washer
    new pins for all pivots
    new reducers and pins for the shock

    clunking
    would just replacing the reducers and pins be a good place to start trouble shootin

    THANKS for the help!
    ben

    whats IMHO?
    IMHO - In My Honest Opinion

    clunking - yup, try that. Chances are that will be all you need.

    The list you have is correct.

    The Enduro kit will have all the bearings you need, but you wouldn't use the bearings for the HL. Those 2 would be "left over". You can't use those bearings unless you have specific hardware to make it work. I'm not 100% sure if you can buy the '04/05 HL hardware and have it fit perfect. It should, theoretically, but I haven't done it myself. I'm hoping to find out tomorrow (Friday).

    I have to do mine and I was going to do it this weekend anyways. How about I do up a nice picture thread, yes? It's fairly easy. If you have auto mechanics to do it then hopefully they know what they're doing.
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  5. #5
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    bearings are on the way. if you get a chance to take some pics this weekend i could use the help. Ive seen a few threads on here from people just using a vice and a couple sockets. Its what ive been planning on doing, but is there a better way to get everything out w/o damaging things?

    Thanks for the help

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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    bearings are on the way. if you get a chance to take some pics this weekend i could use the help. Ive seen a few threads on here from people just using a vice and a couple sockets. Its what ive been planning on doing, but is there a better way to get everything out w/o damaging things?

    Thanks for the help
    The vice-and-socket method would be best. You'd want to use the largest socket that will fit THROUGH the bore. The idea is that you want to push out the bearing cartridge ON the seal. If you don't you might have an issue with having the center section of the bearing come out and the race of the bearing (the largest part) staying in place. BAD NEWS when that happens! If you don't have a vice you can alwasy use a C-clamp.

    Which bearings did you end up buying? What about the HL pivot? Bearing or bushing? Just curious.


    Also, about the BETD kit, a copy/paste from the other thread so you know;


    I e-mailed BETD about what we've been discussing. As follows;

    1) pricing - the 30 GBP for the HL kits ONLY are for a pair, enough to do both sides of one bike. Obviously the FULL bearing kit is enough to do one bike.

    2) the spacers and other hardware used in ALL of the NRS kits is aluminum. Notsure about the bolts, though. I didn't think of asking about that (assuming they're steel).

    3) the bearings used are Enduro Max bearings.

    I still can't comment on wether or not it's worth it to switch to bearings in the HL pivot, but a chat with the local authorized Giant dealer revealed that the bushings "are stronger because there's more surface area", "the bushings are lighter" and "it's cheaper to buy the bushings then buy an expensive kit". Quotes because they're his words, not mine - I am inclined to believe him though.
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  7. #7
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    I ended up picking up the enduro bearings. I asked them in an email last week if the stock pins would work with the bearings. Their customer service wasn’t sure so they ended up giving me a great discount just to find out and report back to them. Great service to say the least.

    I’m not sure which you were referring to the other day. You said “The Enduro kit will have all the bearings you need, but you wouldn't use the bearings for the HL. Those 2 would be "left over". You can't use those bearings unless you have specific hardware to make it work. I'm not 100% sure if you can buy the '04/05 HL hardware and have it fit perfect. It should, theoretically, but I haven't done it myself. I'm hoping to find out tomorrow (Friday).”

    I asked if the stock pins would work with the new bearings, just to refresh your memory. Will the horst link need specific pins? Do all the replaced bearings work with the old pins? Or will I need to order a new “different” set of pins all together? I ordered just the bearings from ENDURO. I was planning on going to the LBS this afternoon/tomorrow morning to order the same pins that are currently there with the bushings. Will that work or do I need a different diameter/length? Sorry to ask the same question again.

    I was also wondering about the SGF rocker arms. I haven’t seen any ads up for them in a while. Have you seen them? Have you heard what people have thought of them?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    I ended up picking up the enduro bearings. I asked them in an email last week if the stock pins would work with the bearings. Their customer service wasn’t sure so they ended up giving me a great discount just to find out and report back to them. Great service to say the least.

    I’m not sure which you were referring to the other day. You said “The Enduro kit will have all the bearings you need, but you wouldn't use the bearings for the HL. Those 2 would be "left over". You can't use those bearings unless you have specific hardware to make it work. I'm not 100% sure if you can buy the '04/05 HL hardware and have it fit perfect. It should, theoretically, but I haven't done it myself. I'm hoping to find out tomorrow (Friday).”

    I asked if the stock pins would work with the new bearings, just to refresh your memory. Will the horst link need specific pins? Do all the replaced bearings work with the old pins? Or will I need to order a new “different” set of pins all together? I ordered just the bearings from ENDURO. I was planning on going to the LBS this afternoon/tomorrow morning to order the same pins that are currently there with the bushings. Will that work or do I need a different diameter/length? Sorry to ask the same question again.

    I was also wondering about the SGF rocker arms. I haven’t seen any ads up for them in a while. Have you seen them? Have you heard what people have thought of them?
    The only bearings you won't be able to use in the Enduro kit are the HL pivot with your stock hardware. No way. You need special hardware for that to convert it. The rest of the locations (main pivot behind BB, fore and aft linkage plate bearings) are 100% matched with your stock pins. Maybe I didn't make myself clear - sorry!

    SGF - yup, i've seen them in my hands and felt them on my bike. VERY different feel. I'm mixed feelings right now. I like them, but i'm not sure it's what i'm looking for. I need more time in the actual conditions I ride to make a better evaluation. Immediate impression; good machine work, standard bearings (put the Enduro bearings in them!), pretty colours and does what they say - more travel and less input required to make your suspension work (not sure that's a good thing - to each their own).

    http://www.SGFComponents.com

    They have moved to Texas. They only have red or blue left. They are only $39 U.S. (not what they show). "They" is Sergio - great guy!
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  9. #9
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    Oh man, it's just WAY too cold to be doing this stuff outside. I lasted 15 minutes and now I can't feel my fingers! I don't think my camera can feel it's fingers either!

    If there's something else you've seen here (?) with people using a vice and sockets then use those pics. I'm sure it'll work out fine. The most important part is to make sure the bearings go into the bore STRAIGHT. If they start going in crooked and you persist then that's when you start wrecking things.
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  10. #10
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    thanks for all the help. i searched the old forums and found one from JOHN thats a little over a year old, but it has pics. im just waiting for everything to com in the mail now!! i was talking to one of my buddies back home about my ghost shifting problem... hes accusing me of using cheap shift housing(and old bushings).. which i am... i had XTR cable and housing for a while, but never noticed a difference... any take on that?

    thanks for all the help

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    thanks for all the help. i searched the old forums and found one from JOHN thats a little over a year old, but it has pics. im just waiting for everything to com in the mail now!! i was talking to one of my buddies back home about my ghost shifting problem... hes accusing me of using cheap shift housing(and old bushings).. which i am... i had XTR cable and housing for a while, but never noticed a difference... any take on that?

    thanks for all the help
    Bad bushings might make a difference. The RD and cable are on the same seatstay, but it does alow more flexing of the entire rear of the bike, so it's possible.

    As for the cable housing - the difference between cheap and not-cheap might make a difference, however i'm inclined to say that either are paultry to what you'd find if you just went with continuous housing in the rear. I've used Shimano SS and Nokon (briefly with the Nokon) and it's the same thing. Now i'm running the Shimano SS again, but full housing - much better. The point is that i'm eliminating what the cable "see's" as flex in the seatstay by using full housing for the RD. Use a dremel to open up those two cable stops (or just zip-tie a line and by-pass them if you don't want to make permanent modifications to your frame ) and don't look back. You could always switch to SRAM, also. The difference in cable pull seem's to make a difference as some have reported. I've not tried. I'm a Shimano Rapid Fire biatch.
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  12. #12
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    would you recommend replacing the shock eyelet bushing also? or just the reducers along with everything else...

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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    would you recommend replacing the shock eyelet bushing also? or just the reducers along with everything else...
    I'd say just get the reducers first and see how they fit. Maybe you'll be lucky, maybe you won't. When you have to replace them it's easy to do. When you have to replace eyelset/bushings then it can be a pita. Not to say it's much different of a process, but from my experience it's a much tighter fit then bearings and their bores.

    Just to be sure - eyelets/bushings are the pieces that are pressed into the ends of the shock. Reducers are the pieces that mount inside those and to the frame.

    Don't ask me for a reliable source for either - I don't know. I've either been lucky with my reducers or made my own. I haven't had to change any eyelets on my shocks .... yet. One of my C9's needs it though. I'd assume to get either from the shock manufacturer.
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  14. #14
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    i finally got around to calling the LBS about the pins and bushing. they got a quote from giant for me today. $$95! they said that they can only order the entire kit (pins, washers, bushings...) how much did it set you back? if you dont mind me asking. i might just go w/ it so i can get bakc in the saddle. do you know anywhere that i might be able to pick it up a little cheaper?

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    Quote Originally Posted by laackund
    i finally got around to calling the LBS about the pins and bushing. they got a quote from giant for me today. $$95! they said that they can only order the entire kit (pins, washers, bushings...) how much did it set you back? if you dont mind me asking. i might just go w/ it so i can get bakc in the saddle. do you know anywhere that i might be able to pick it up a little cheaper?
    Wow, that much, eh? Hmmm, my LBS said they could order it in "sections" - whatever that means.

    As luck would have it (for a change) I didn't need to order any of the pins as mine are still in great condition. I was toying with the idea of making some ti kits, but I don't think anyone would buy them, so I just got a set of the Enduro Max bearings and the HL bushings (from John) and called it done.

    I don't know of any other sources for the pins and such.
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