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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    Really with all due respect mate, what the hell does his work with cancer got to do with him lying n cheating, why is it even bought into it, is it something that his last supporters cling onto like the old chestnut ''but they where all doing it''..
    Lance is out for himself, always will be always was, he wouldnt have done anything for cancer if he never got it himself, the blokes as sociopathic as you can get, and deserves every bit of bad press he gets..
    Look at him sitting back pretending nothings happened, not having the guts to face the charges in court, the guy is an Agrade grub.......
    I'm with you there.. and I suppose I made the impression that I support him, but I don't. Obviously there is a certain lever of shadyness that has always surrounded Livestrong. I also agree that he wouldn't have given a damn about cancer awareness if he himself hadn't suffered. Though a lot of the money went into the pockets of some shiesty individuals (Lance included), my point was that SOMEWHERE along the line positive and honest experiences exist.
    We can't stop here, this is bat country..

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by shekky View Post
    "the guy is an Agrade grub......."

    what, pray tell, is an "agrade grub"?

    and it's jose CANSECO not "conseco"
    LOL, a GRUB is generally a fly, moth, or insect larvae that lives in rotton wood, fruit, dirt, s**t, etc, usually at ground level but not always, a grub is generally dirty and eats anything dead or dying to survive and turn into its adult form.

    Agrade is top of the class, or gets extra points for being a grub in its true definition lol..

    So lance in Ozzy terms is an Agrade Grub lol..

    And as i didnt make the cAnseco comment i'll leave that for the poster who did to reply...
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    .......................Did you actually look this up first, or did you just respond to the dictionary definition of "awareness"?
    I thought it was about werenessies, you know, men who turn into Lochness monsters upon a fullmoon, kind of like werewoves.

  4. #29
    I build my own.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Well, the guy who has had and recovered from cancer on this board, Natehawk, said that Livestrong did a lot to help out with his situation. It seems like he's gotten quite tired of having to explain this to every and anyone who comes along claiming based on the "word" that it's not helping people. Basically filling in the gaps apart from "just the medical stuff", like family coping, help with day to day stuff, etc...Did you actually look this up first, or did you just respond to the dictionary definition of "awareness"?
    I looked it up and I agree with the-one-1.
    Of the $42 million Livestrong raised last year, $2 million went to administration, $4 million went to "fundraising" and $29 million went towards their programs. One of which is "cancer awareness". The other $5 million? Who knows? I'm sure they have an accounting of it but they didn't explain it well on their website.

    This is all money that didn't go to the American Cancer Society which also has similar programs AND they fund research.

    I don't know how many more foundations there are like Livestrong but I'd rather see the money they all spend on administration, "fundraising" and "awareness" go to one organization (the ACS or the CCS) to help fund research and provide help for victims and families.

    For the record, there are many people on this board who have, or have had cancer. There are also Type1 diabetics, a guaranteed fatal disease (my son is one) and people who suffer from all kinds of other ailments. My money goes to the JDRF (diabetes) BECAUSE they are working to cure the disease. I don't want them to spend my money on "awareness".

    I want them to cure my son.
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  5. #30
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    Of all the people that have donated to Livestrong, how many would have donated to a different organization had Lance or Livestrong not been in the equation?
    Bikes

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeithxCourage View Post
    Of all the people that have donated to Livestrong, how many would have donated to a different organization had Lance or Livestrong not been in the equation?
    That sir, is a very good question. I hadn't thought that they were donating to the name rather than the cause.

    Even so, a celebrity could solicit donations for their cause of choice and then donate all funds to the appropriate organization and I'd still get my ideal charity scenario where more funds go to research.
    I have a device that can access the total knowledge of man. I use it to look at pictures of cats and argue with strangers.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeithxCourage View Post
    Of all the people that have donated to Livestrong, how many would have donated to a different organization had Lance or Livestrong not been in the equation?
    I didn't give the organization a dime until I got cancer and they did some things for me.

    They paid for me to attend a survivorship retreat where I got to interact with others close to my age who also had cancer. It was the first time I could relate to other survivors really well. We had seminars on different strategies to move on with our lives and they gave us a forum to share with each other different things we had all found that helped us. Everybody had something different.

    There really is a need to help survivors navigate the types of assistance that's out there. They helped me learn that the ACS will provide assistance for travel costs to the hospital (mine was over 3 hours away from me and I had to get hotel rooms and food on a regular basis). They helped me find out about multiple fitness options geared towards survivors that I really needed.

    No organization can do everything. Livestrong tried to help fill gaps in care, especially with survivor care. A lot of the awareness stuff was for global efforts to help survivors in other countries where cancer carries a large negative stigma. Nobody in this discussion comes from one of those places, so I think you can stop with the derision towards the organization about that issue.

    If research is what you care about that's fine but the research doesn't address what survivors have to deal with when the doctor tells them to go home. Doctors are not known for providing that kind of help.

    Does that change what Lance did WRT cheating and lying? No. Lance did not do himself or Livestrong any favors in doing that, though both did reap short term rewards while the lie held. Livestrong's books should be investigated because Lance may have extended his shady cheating ways outside of cycling. I think there is good reason to suspect it.

    am I angry about any of this? No. I am disappointed that Lance's lie has cheapened how people think of supporting cancer survivors. Awareness is not a bullsh!t cause. A cancer organization is not worthless because they have chosen not to fund research. Research is expensive and it has many fruitless paths before you find any promise. It has a low bang for the buck and you need to spend a lot to make a difference. And that difference has a long latency. It may be years before the research your dollars helped fund helps anyone. It may not even happen in your lifetime.

    When you look at helping survivors and their emotional and mental wellbeing, and their physical fitness, your dollars help them in the here and now. There are many organizations that provide this kind of help in a lot of ways. Are they pointless, too, because they don't fund research?

    Is it wrong to help sick and dying people have some positive experiences? Is it wrong to help cancer survivors cope with how their lives have changed? Is it wrong to help people in third world and developing countries who have survived cancer escape the negative stigma associated with the disease in those places by promoting awareness?

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by shekky View Post
    "the guy is an Agrade grub......."

    what, pray tell, is an "agrade grub"?

    and it's jose CANSECO not "conseco"
    Glad you got help from Tone on the Grub thing

    Thanks for the headsup on my mistake with JOSE's name
    I fixed it.. although considering the topic and the reason I put his name in my post at all... CON might be a better fit than CAN.. just saying

    AND... on a serious note...

    Thanks Nate for the personal experience and info... learned something today!

  9. #34
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    "CON might be a better fit than CAN.. just saying"

    you got that right!

  10. #35
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    Has anybody caught this documentary on CNN yet?
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  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsmac View Post
    EH!.... they should all BURN IN HELL!
    Or rather ON THE CROSS!
    I suppose it'd be good enuf just to stake'em out and let them get a really NASTY SUNBURN! That'd teach'em all!!!



    Isn't it nice how easy it is to focus on one, or a very small few, of the nasties instead of actually cleaning up every amateur and professional sport IN THE WORLD?

    Hmmmm....
    -Eric Jacques (he got a whole 10 MINUTES added to his time in the 1976 Vuelta a España! That sure got the attention of Pro Cyclists everywhere! )
    -Floyd Landis
    -Jose Conseco... CANSECO... thanks for catching me on this!
    -Marion Jones
    -Bill Romanowski
    -Paul Doherty
    -Eastern Block Olympic women..no men...no uh wo/men?(actually this is a pretty large group of UGDCE (undetermined gender due to chemical enhancement) athletes and so might not be the best example for my list)

    Yep... the list grows fast in SINGLE DIGITS folks!
    The message is clear! WE'RE COMING TO GET YOU!... but not ALL of you...

    Nailed it!

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by shekky View Post
    "CON might be a better fit than CAN.. just saying"

    you got that right!
    No doubt! I definitely want to catch this documentary.

  13. #38
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    And...

    ....Lance's peers were doping too....
    .....and.....they are still doping today.

    What's the difference? What's the gain? Those good today who have connections will break the rules. When they lose their connections they lose their untouchable status and then they are called dopers.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by rakerdeal View Post
    ....Lance's peers were doping too....
    .....and.....they are still doping today.

    What's the difference? What's the gain? Those good today who have connections will break the rules. When they lose their connections they lose their untouchable status and then they are called dopers.
    ^ Yep!

    Want to end Doping FOREVER?

    Lock up all possible ingredients for synthesizing drugs, and then...

    LOCK UP ALL THE DAMN CHEMISTS!
    Bwahahahahaha

    Once we started teaching chemistry to anyone we opened up a Pandora's Box for sure!

    I think there should be two categories in sports... doped and no-doped.
    This won't solve issues of the dopers trying to sneak into the no-doped areas when they feel it's worth the risk, but at least there won't be all this wasted time and money trying to catch, control, crucify, anyone who just absolutely HAS to dope.

    Then... piss-test and blood test EVERY SINGLE DAMN ATHELETE from High School UP!

    Just do that damn testing... on everyone... no random crap. Provide your sample on race day. If you test positive, then you go through a process of them proving and you defending.
    Proven guilty... loss of winning and removed from the record book for that event.

    Hmmm... this is going on too long... got better things to do this morning...

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE, View Post
    For anyone interested keep an eye out on CNN. This show that prompted me to start this thread will surely be shown again. From the small portion I saw it brought forth actual testimony from team mates and his inner circle, of what he and many others were doing. It sucks he is getting the brunt of it but come on all those years of deceiving the world. Everybody thought he was superhuman for so many years. And many refused to believe these accusation's for so many years. I myself have been in denial until I witnessed just a portion of this CNN Documentary. Be sure to catch it if you can. It may open your eyes and change your mind.
    Or you could also read the volumes of evidence released by USADA.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE, View Post
    Has anybody caught this documentary on CNN yet?
    say there DJ, is it this one?


  17. #42
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    ^^^ good Aussie doco there, ye get to the bottom of it down here
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  18. #43
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    This just in, the letters L and A are being dropped from the alphabet.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS View Post
    This just in, the letters L and A are being dropped from the alphabet.
    Ye h I he rd. bout th t. s I r ad it in the p per ast week.
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  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeithxCourage View Post
    Of all the people that have donated to Livestrong, how many would have donated to a different organization had Lance or Livestrong not been in the equation?
    I'll be donating more because of this stupid witch hunt!
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  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    I'll be donating more because of this stupid witch hunt!
    LOL, The old 'witch hunt' chestnut, only second to ''but they all were doing it''
    Oh well the Lance lovers need something to hang on to Shawn......
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    LOL, The old 'witch hunt' chestnut, only second to ''but they all were doing it''
    Oh well the Lance lovers need something to hang on to Shawn......
    I'm not even a Lance lover. I'm not even a lover of road bike racing. I just think that if they are going to do that, then they should treat everyone the same. I'm actually against any type of doping. I'm just looking for equality. They should test every rider before every stage in a race like the Tour, and deal with it in a reasonable amount of time, instead of years later.
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  23. #48
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    If these doping agencies were really good at their job, their wouldn't be a doping problem.
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  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    If these doping agencies were really good at their job, their wouldn't be a doping problem.
    SHawn first of all thats like saying if the cops were doing their job there would be no crime, its never going to happen mate, it works the other way round.
    Secondly, sometimes it takes years to get a case together, it takes years for witnesses to come forward and things to come to light.
    Thirdly the dopers in most cases are light years ahead of the testers, always have been always will be.
    With all due respect Shawn your quotes above suggest to me that you are not up to date with how things work and the realities of doping in sport.

    Its ignorant to think just lance has been targeted, infact 21 out of the last 26 top place getters in the tour have been found guilty of drug use..
    so infact its not a witch hunt at all, it took them a while with lance, but they nailed him and nailed him good, id commend that instead of calling it a witch hunt mate.

    The biggest long term cheat and liar has been caught and so have many of the others, if thats your idea of a witch hunt i find that pretty funny.
    Cheers mate
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    SHawn first of all thats like saying if the cops were doing their job there would be no crime, its never going to happen mate, it works the other way round.
    Secondly, sometimes it takes years to get a case together, it takes years for witnesses to come forward and things to come to light.
    Thirdly the dopers in most cases are light years ahead of the testers, always have been always will be.
    With all due respect Shawn your quotes above suggest to me that you are not up to date with how things work and the realities of doping in sport.

    Its ignorant to think just lance has been targeted, infact 21 out of the last 26 top place getters in the tour have been found guilty of drug use..
    so infact its not a witch hunt at all, it took them a while with lance, but they nailed him and nailed him good, id commend that instead of calling it a witch hunt mate.

    The biggest long term cheat and liar has been caught and so have many of the others, if thats your idea of a witch hunt i find that pretty funny.
    Cheers mate
    Dude, you just schooled me!
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