knees

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  • 02-16-2013
    theMeat
    Agreed, maybe no proven scientific evidence, but seeing it work for 2 of my dogs, and for my shoulder is proof enough for me.
    Think the key is to take it with meals, think dinner is best, and take it along with some fish oil. The fish oil has many benefits, not only for joints, but it helps your body absorb the gluc. Also, double up the dose, meaning take twice a day, for the first 4-6 weeks. Udo's flax seed or one of their other plant based blends is good stuff too.
    Maybe try some BIG platform pedals like Atomlabs Pimplite to get more freedom/adjustment of movement.
    Also, don't know your stats or bike set-up, but maybe a shorter crankset will serve you well.
  • 02-16-2013
    HitmenOnlyInc
    I am 46 and although I don't have the problems some of you have mentioned, I have had issues from long backpacking hikes. I found on my last fully loaded hike into and out of the Grand Canyon a few years ago that my knees were not what they used to be. I tried the Glucosamine/Chondroitin products out there with no discernible difference.

    What I have found, like others have stated is, regular exercise, stretching work wonders. I am also a firm believer that if you want to get better or stronger in a certain activity, the best way to do that, is to do that activity. I would also add that along with proper seat height, proper cleat position, if you are running clip less, will relieve stress on your knees as well.
  • 02-16-2013
    bulerias
    One thing not touched upon is lateral cleat placement on the shoe. I went from Shimano to Giro shoes and the cleat is more laterally centered; sure, you can use wedges all you want but unless the pedal has lateral support it will be a waste of time.

    Road pedals are different and wide flats are wide and flat. The SPD cleat system is lateral support disaster so having it in the right place to wobble on matters. The downside of the Giro shoes is that you lose some ankle clearance.

    I wouldn't have thought that what happens at your foot would have so much effect on knee tracking. I won't say no knee problems but they immediately went from getting worse to getting better and I can ride as long as I want. I think Specialized shoes are similar to Giro but haven't checked. With a road cleat you can do lateral adjustments but SPD is just fore and aft so you've bought the lateral with the shoe.

    Having a pedal with support for the shoe pontoons and pontoons hard enough to utilize it are considerations. I've finally been able to ditch my road pedals and use SPDs on the road with a combo of ATACs and Giro shoes. Mo bettah in the coffee shop and they're always right side up.
  • 02-16-2013
    ElwoodT
    I haven't seen for and aft position of the saddle mentioned. Too far back can lead to knee pain.
  • 02-16-2013
    DavyRay
    Overextension!

    Others have mentioned saddle position and height. One problem I used to see with road racers was a tendency to put the saddle so high that the leg completely straightened out at full extension. Actually, perhaps a bit past that point. I do not see this much with mountain bikers, but it is worth noticing. Snapping the knee back on every stroke hurts after a while.

    I used to put my saddle really high because it felt so efficient. Didn't work so well.
  • 02-16-2013
    zephxiii
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by DavyRay View Post
    Overextension!

    Others have mentioned saddle position and height. One problem I used to see with road racers was a tendency to put the saddle so high that the leg completely straightened out at full extension. Actually, perhaps a bit past that point. I do not see this much with mountain bikers, but it is worth noticing. Snapping the knee back on every stroke hurts after a while.

    I used to put my saddle really high because it felt so efficient. Didn't work so well.

    Yeah too high is no good. I hate trying to find the right saddle position, seems like a never ending process at times!
  • 02-16-2013
    Blurr
    Hydration is your best friend, it takes time for your body to absorb water so hydrate two hours before physical activity, second walnuts are natural anti inflammatory and supposed to help rebuild cartlidge, all I know for sure is once I started eating walnuts daily my shoulder which has plagued me with issues since i was 19 quit hurting.
    third subject yourself to honey bee stings, these have helped people with arthritas it is called Apitherapy I again used this on my hands as I have suffered arthritas for most of my life and in the cold when snowmobiling I could not even grip the handles, this not only allowed me full function again, but took away the pain.

    Alcohol is also an inflammatory so something to think about in that regard if you like your brew
  • 02-16-2013
    HitmenOnlyInc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Blurr View Post
    Hydration is your best friend, it takes time for your body to absorb water so hydrate two hours before physical activity, second walnuts are natural anti inflammatory and supposed to help rebuild cartlidge, all I know for sure is once I started eating walnuts daily my shoulder which has plagued me with issues since i was 19 quit hurting.
    third subject yourself to honey bee stings, these have helped people with arthritas it is called Apitherapy I again used this on my hands as I have suffered arthritas for most of my life and in the cold when snowmobiling I could not even grip the handles, this not only allowed me full function again, but took away the pain.

    good luck and remember though there is no magic bullet.

    Very interesting advice! I'm gonna get some walnuts today!! Not sure about the bee stings though, but if I get stung, I'll think about it in a different light. Thanks!!
  • 02-16-2013
    jackthejedi
    I've Ti plate and 26 Ti screws holding my right knee and thigh together, but i have major problems with my left, mainly fluid, any ideas ? plate's been in 26 years
  • 02-16-2013
    theMeat
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jackthejedi View Post
    I've Ti plate and 26 Ti screws holding my right knee and thigh together, but i have major problems with my left, mainly fluid, any ideas ? plate's been in 26 years

    For your right knee I think a good synthetic grease. For the left some stretching, exercises, along with some glucosamine/fish oil couldn't hurt.
  • 02-16-2013
    dru
    Fluid? I guzzled Ibuprofen for almost two years straight about 10 years ago, and ice, and it definitely helped. My ACL transplant was very sucessful 21 years ago but it didn't leave me with much of an inside meniscus. I don't run anymore and biking really helps my knee health. I don't know why I don't get pain, I should.

    I haven't taken Glucosamine for years now and I beleive it makes no difference. JSYN I used to swear by it.

    For knee pain, saddle height is critical as is avoiding mashing big gears. The only pain I ever get is caused by these factors if my patellae are bothering me (very rarely).

    I lift weights moderately mostly as a preventative since I'm turning 50 this year. I like squats but worry far more about hurting my back than my knee.

    Drew
  • 02-16-2013
    zephxiii
    Re: knees
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by HitmenOnlyInc View Post
    Very interesting advice! I'm gonna get some walnuts today!! Not sure about the bee stings though, but if I get stung, I'll think about it in a different light. Thanks!!

    I've found nuts and berries to be a very good trail snack to pack.

    Sent from my MB865 using Tapatalk 2
  • 02-16-2013
    Mountain Cycle Shawn
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jackthejedi View Post
    I've Ti plate and 26 Ti screws holding my right knee and thigh together, but i have major problems with my left, mainly fluid, any ideas ? plate's been in 26 years

    I'd get a good electric screw driver! Lol
  • 02-16-2013
    zephxiii
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jackthejedi View Post
    I've Ti plate and 26 Ti screws holding my right knee and thigh together, but i have major problems with my left, mainly fluid, any ideas ? plate's been in 26 years

    Sounds like they did a pretty awesome job on the right knee!!
  • 02-16-2013
    zephxiii
    Uhg this weekend my knees were feeling somewhat inflamed in a very very mild but my mind still picks up on it kinda way. Mild arthritis I think might be the best way to describe it.

    Knee awareness all started after my first epic trip to Brown County in which i had my first climb of 800ft the one day i rode. Shortly after I foolishly went after a pr on a 10 mile pavement run. After that my knees ached pretty bad in the joint to where I had to stay off of them. I think the main problem on the ride at BCSP was not gearing down enough and possibly not having ideal saddle position (fore/aft).

    After that i started taking Glucosimine which *seems* to have helped a lot (but not verified). I made another trip down to BCSP and rode twice as many miles and was completely fine, i made sure to gear down properly though too.

    Now it seems I am dealing with just mild and fine inflammation (I guess). I rode today anyways since I had a new bike, 17 miles total. I didn't have any pain while out there or after like what I had after my first BCSP trip. It just feels very mildly achy.

    I hate knees. Here's hoping for the Enterprise to come back in time on a mission then gently crash land in the states in front of everyone so we can have access to their medical technology and rebuild/enhance our knees in a super way hehe [/ENDDREAM]

    I picked up another bottle of Osteo Bi-Flex with 5-Laxin since I ran out and some Fish Oil to give a try for some more wishful thinking.


    Quote:

    "Glucosimine and fish oil definitely help too, but spinning rather than mashing is key."
    Meaning keeping cadence high by gearing down?
  • 02-16-2013
    J.B. Weld
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ElwoodT View Post
    I haven't seen for and aft position of the saddle mentioned. Too far back can lead to knee pain.

    Good point, and too far forward can be bad as well. Dialing fore- aft position can make a big difference, and is often overlooked.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    Yeah too high is no good. I hate trying to find the right saddle position, seems like a never ending process at times!

    Find it, measure it, write it down. ;)
  • 02-16-2013
    cyclelicious
    I've read that Devil's claw may help to relieve joint pain due to osteoarthritis.
    Devilís claw is an herb.It can be taken alone or along with nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) seems to help decrease osteoarthritis-related pain.

    I'm 40+++ female who dh's all summer and ride all winter. The only knee problem I've had is a Baker's cyst (last spring) which subsided after a couple of months. I take Glucosamine and Chondroitin daily as a prophylactic. I eat healthy, and practice daily yoga
  • 02-16-2013
    shiggy
    knees
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by cyclelicious View Post
    I've read that Devil's claw may help to relieve joint pain due to osteoarthritis.
    Devilís claw is an herb.It can be taken alone or along with nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) seems to help decrease osteoarthritis-related pain.

    I'm 40+++ female who dh's all summer and ride all winter. The only knee problem I've had is a Baker's cyst (last spring) which subsided after a couple of months

    I love devils claw as an anti inflammatory. Works better and faster as a tincture than dry in capsules.
  • 02-17-2013
    bikeabuser
    Not much I can add ... Just want to say thanks for all the great advice, as I also suffer from knee pain, if I over do it.

    Devil's Claw ... Gotta check that out !
  • 02-17-2013
    HitmenOnlyInc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jackthejedi View Post
    I've Ti plate and 26 Ti screws holding my right knee and thigh together, but i have major problems with my left, mainly fluid, any ideas ? plate's been in 26 years

    Have a Ti plate and 26 Ti screws added to the left knee and you should be good to go!!
  • 02-17-2013
    jackthejedi
    mmm electric screw driver and grease sounds ok.
    Try'd every anti inflam's from the doc's but no joy may have to kick off next visit for a scan but being in the UK even though its free by the time you get to see a decent doc it'll be like 2014.
    Plate came free after a confrontation with a Frence 40 foot artic while riding my racing 225 Vespa
  • 02-17-2013
    Mtn-Rider
    I've always loved jogging on the street but had to give it up when the knee pain from the impact was excessive. That's when I put all my energies into mountain biking some 4 years ago. It cured the ground impact problem (not the mtb ground impact though) and I though mtb had saved my knees.

    Going to cleated shoes was an awesome improvement in performance but it also brought me to my new leading edge. That's the point where I discovered how far my knees would go on a bike.

    There's two things that have greatly helped keeping my knees healthy for mountain biking:

    1) eating fish several times a week helps a great deal in maintaining joint health.
    2) reduce intensity of rides to limit wear and tear on knees, this is key and it's what let's me ride everyday.
  • 02-17-2013
    aBicycle
    Get fluoride out of your diet. My knees hurt for years before I started filtering my water. You need a special filter for it. CuZn filter sells one that uses activated alumina to remove it. Also, take short showers as it is absorbed through the skin (If you're on the fence about this, dozens of studies also show it causes lowered IQ, some even at low doses. Look it up.)

    Also goat butter and maybe butter from grass fed cows works, preferably unpasteurized if you can get it.

    Make sure that you're not eating processed foods as well.

    Some people get help from glucosamine, chondroiton and msm.

    Also, gelatin seems to help some people.

    Also, make sure that you don't have those pedals that are concave in such a way that causes your feet to angle inward. Those can be killers on the knees. The low point of the concavity will be perpendicular to the axle with these types of pedals. If the low point of the concavity is parallel with the axle, well, you've got a good set of pedals!


    And on that note, If you have flat feet, get orthotics.


    Also, don't rely on NSAID's as they tend to cause liver damage.
  • 02-18-2013
    telemike
    I'm a medicare man. I just get off the bike if the climbing is too hard. Yes, sometimes I blast up a short climb, but my knees are worth too much to be proud.

    Years ago, I trained for road bike racing and went very fast until I developed knee problems (chrondomalacia patella) that pretty much got me off the bike for a decade.

    Pushing hard uphill is really hard on knees and since I only have another decade of hot biking and skiing, I can't afford years off the bike (and skis, etc).

    That also goes for downhill. If you see a geezer walking the hard stuff, that's because I've already hurt about everything on this old body and can't imagine going without riding and skiing while I recover. Perhaps cowardliness has an element of experience and daring an element of naivety.
  • 02-19-2013
    Roy Miller
    Exercise regularly, progress gradually
    Meniscus was removed from left knee in 1973. Skiing caused the left knee to ache all the time for the next 20 years until I started cycling in 1993. When I got started cycling it was a gradual progression. If you build up your miles and conquests slowly your body will adapt. Now my knee rarely bothers me. I ski hard and fast with no pain. Where we ride in BC there are no single speed riders climbing the hills (they are off the bike pushing). I don't stretch but I always take my time warming up. Spin up those hills as best you can, you paid for those gears so use them. Last year I had 180 days of riding and 20 days of skiing. Zero days of running which is the bane of knees! My biggest cycling day was from the beach at Paia to the top of Haleakala (10023' climb). If I'm sore after a ride some beer and IB or Tylenol easily take care of it.

    PS. If you can't get out riding try to get in a 30 minute spin at the gym just to keep everything supple. Try to get in 4 or 5 days of exercise a week. You may miss some good TV (or use PVR) but it's good for you. Doctor on the TV last week said "If exercise was a pill people would be lined up to take it." Get out and play!