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  1. #1
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    Camelback hate is imagined.

    Let's go back like 20 years to when mountain bikes were rad and the Chili Peppers were still edgy. Do you remember?

    You had a sweet anodized water bottle cage (or two or three) on your ride and water bottles that either a) leaked all over the damn seats in your Wranger or b) sealed so tight you'd break a tooth popping one open. Your bike was rolling on 45 psi 1.95 pizza cutters on trails with real rocks. Real rocks. Most of the time you'd bounce so hard down the trail you couldn't grab the damn bottle let alone squirt it in your mouth, that is, if the water bottle hadn't flown out of the holder on the way down the last hill. So you'd make several special stops just so you could drink.

    But that's not all. Because you could only carry a bottle or two, you would get a) totally parched or b) completely dehydrated on long summer rides. And don't forget your tools. Those would either go in your jersey pockets that would strangle you or in a seat bag that would trap you behind your non-dropper post on any gnarly descent.

    But then the camelbak blew up and all those problems were instantly solved. You could drink any damn time, you could carry as much as you damn wanted, and your bike lost 5 pounds. It was bliss. Back in the day I don't remember anyone complaining about camelbaks. Ever.

    Then something changed. People started complaining about having a sweaty back (like that's real problem). And the sweaty back was worst thing that ever happened to mountain biking since having to shift with both hands. So we decided a) we need to put that 5 lbs of crap back on a bike (rolling on $2000 carbon wheels to save 200 grams of course) or b) wear a fanny pack which simulates the feeling and aesthetic of having eaten yourself into oblivion at Cici's. This is where we are.

    Like I did with air shocks and two-finger brake levers, I'm calling bullshit. Bottles and fanny packs are trends that limit ride performance and capability for most riders. Ever try to hop a log with bottles on your bike? Sucks. Ever try to... actually I don't have a good performance critique of fanny packs other than they can't hold as much as a larger camelbak, but fanny packs... seriously?
    "You can be clipped in and be boring or ride flats and have a good time." - Sam Hill

  2. #2
    Nat
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    Write something positive.

  3. #3
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    My non-dominant foot thing was positive.

    And you could easily flip this rant to see how much I love camelbaks. Camelbaks are a positive thing. See.

    Did anyone ever accuse Gary Fisher or Fabien Barel for not being positive because they didn't like long stems?
    "You can be clipped in and be boring or ride flats and have a good time." - Sam Hill

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Write something positive.
    Please! it's always an angry rant of some sort. As in all the other threads, just ride how you want, what you want, and carry what you like.

    My set up depends on how long I'm riding, period. Anything local and shorter than 2hrs, a beautiful Podium Chill bottle, and saddle bag.

    I'm very happy I moved my pump from my pack to my frame.

  5. #5
    Sneaker man
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    You've got issues dude...

    for what it's worth, I've used a camleback since '95, they're a handy thing but given the option I prefer not to use one. If I know it's going to a be a long ride, or a ride with changeable conditions so layers/jackets, or riding with other people and I might need a lot of spares, then I'll go camleback especially on my 1 bottle FS bike. Otherwise it's bottles and cages, which is nowdays 95% of my rides.

    As to sweaty backs/camlebacks, rode with one the other day for the first time in ages, end of ride, jumped in the car...ugh sweaty back, was a shock to the system I was so un-used to it.

    And it sucks donkeyballs when they start leaking all over the place.
    All the gear and no idea.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    Please! it's always an angry rant of some sort. As in all the other threads, just ride how you want, what you want, and carry what you like.


    My set up depends on how long I'm riding, period. Anything local and shorter than 2hrs, a beautiful Podium Chill bottle, and saddle bag.


    I'm very happy I moved my pump from my pack to my frame.
    I'll admit I rock a bottle with no tools if I'm doing a short loop or two around the local park where I can walk back to the car if something goes wrong. But otherwise no.

    Part of my point is that people aren't riding how they want. They're riding what trends say they should want and that bottles really aren't practical for most people on most rides. And that fanny packs are just damn ugly why would anyone want that?
    "You can be clipped in and be boring or ride flats and have a good time." - Sam Hill

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by mik_git View Post
    You've got issues dude...
    As to sweaty backs/camlebacks, rode with one the other day for the first time in ages, end of ride, jumped in the car...ugh sweaty back, was a shock to the system I was so un-used to it.

    And it sucks donkeyballs when they start leaking all over the place.
    You could just change your shirt.

    Yeah leaking camelbak sucks but that's why they invented that lock thingy on the bite valve.

    Easy problems solved.
    "You can be clipped in and be boring or ride flats and have a good time." - Sam Hill

  8. #8
    Bikesexual
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    I think people that are ditching camelbacks, ARE riding how they want, no?

  9. #9
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    I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it. - George Bernard Shaw
    The most expensive bike in the world is still cheaper than the cheapest open heart surgery.

  10. #10
    Sneaker man
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    No leaking from the bag, like around the seals and stuff (both the hose and the filler)...

    And yeah right I could have taken a change of shirt just for the issue that i never have when I normally ride without a backpack... unexpected issue not solved by carrying a heap of stuff around all the time.
    All the gear and no idea.

  11. #11
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    I'm riding how I want.

    Some people like following trends, I'm not one of them. But I don't think using bottles is a trend, it's just what some people like.
    There are two types of people in this world:
    1) Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

  12. #12
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    I hop logs with water bottles and jersey pockets full of junk. Also there are real rocks on the trails.
    I brake for stinkbugs

  13. #13
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    The Chili Peppers haven't been edgy for 30 years.
    Is this where I write something witty?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    blah blah blah self gratifying blah
    I use the right tool for the job... a (wet blanket) pack + bottle on epics, a fanny + bottle on medium length warm/long cool rides, and a bottle on short rides or banging out laps. Minimal essentials are strapped to the bike, all else depends on the type of ride.

    Do whatever you like, but if you want to tell me what's practical for me, or try to be the fashion police... kindly F.O. Or not kindly.

    Also, if you're getting stuck because of a saddle bag back in the day, you must have been one of those kooks who had everything and a sack lunch in it. Whatever works for you.

    If you're just trolling and spewing stupidity for a response, nice work... You got me.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazpat View Post
    I'm riding how I want.

    Some people like following trends, I'm not one of them. But I don't think using bottles is a trend, it's just what some people like.
    You're doing it all wrong. I'm pretty sure about that.
    The most expensive bike in the world is still cheaper than the cheapest open heart surgery.

  16. #16
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    Isn’t “totally parched” and “completely dehydrated “ the same thing?


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  17. #17
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    Here in Florida if your water isn't downright warm the bottle will sweat and all the dust and silt from the sand we ride through will stick to it.

    I went with a camelbak when I started sharing trails with horses.

  18. #18
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    You're just upset because you haven't discovered the best water bottle cage ever. The King Cage Iris.

    Name:  10.1_King_White-2_large.jpg
Views: 1005
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    Now you can be happy!



    But seriously, there's no issue here, people just complain that they have to carry a backpack on an after-work loop cuz their bike can't hold a bottle. Lame.
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
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  19. #19
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    I like camelbacks, but I find it’s really not worth the effort of filling/cleaning the bladder for sub-2 hour rides.

    Maybe just wear a camelback if you like them, and not worry too much about what other people are doing?


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  20. #20
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    I'd prefer a single water bottle on my bike if I could, but it's hot where I live most of the year. I'll empty a 20 oz. Water bottle in the first 45 minutes of riding, and then not pee for hours. Hydration packs are the best for that.

    My only beef with packs is that I can never get once to keep its weight in one spot. If I do any sort of jumping or even a steep chutes, I can feel the weight of 3 liters of water suddenly lift off my back and lurch me forward. I have tried a few packs and none of them keep the weight in the same place. It has not cause me to crash, but it's not great for confidence either.

    Pro tip: store your empty hydration bladder in a freezer. I've had the same two bladders for years and years. They are clean because I rinse them out, wash the bite valve, then shove them in the freezer. Never had a need to scrub them out with a brush.
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  21. #21
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    Another Pro Tip: Denture cleaning tablets

  22. #22
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    Honestly, all MTB hydration solutions are lose/lose IMO, at least in most parts of the US.
    I’m don’t mind the ‘sweaty back’ but as Mack noted, even my low-rider Camelbak Skyline moves around and shifts on my back. It’s also inconvenient that I can’t get to anything without taking the pack off.
    I do appreciate having several hours of cool water to drink. That’s pretty awesome.

    And I do like how my bike handles without the weight of 2 24oz bottles and a seat bag.

    On the other hand, ditching the pack- 2 bottles and a tool kit/tube add like 6 lbs to a bike. Here in PHXin the summer, a fully frozen bottle is warm in 60 minutes.


    I only wear a camelbak if I have to, usually on very remote rides wheee there is simply no opportunity for refilling a bottle, and where a lack of tools means a very long walk, or waiting for hours for a buddy to return with a vehicle.
    Don’t modify the trail to match your skills, modify your skills to match the trails.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ARandomBiker View Post
    Here in PHXin the summer, a fully frozen bottle is warm in 60 minutes.
    You're a badass if you're riding in the phoenix heat dungeon in the summer.

    wheee
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
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  24. #24
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    I mostly use a CB, but sometimes I rock a bottle and, sometimes, I just hydrate like hell en route to the trailhead and ride water-free. I enjoy riding in all of these modes. It’s nice to have options and match the hydration method to the ride.

    I enjoyed reading tealy’s opening post. Dude’s never boring. Plus I can relate to the nostalgia.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    it's boring in "C" and I don't have anything interesting or useful to say so you're all gonna pay for it
    FIFY

    "C" for your location, and "d" for your bike set up? You may have dulled the same time as the peppers.

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  26. #26
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    I'll put diluted sports drinks in water bottles, but only plain water in my camelback, unless I'm doing something epic. With just water, there's no need to clean bladder and no sticky residue getting all over the place. One problem with water bottles on mtbs that I have is falling/crashing and winding up with an extremity through the frame in such a way that it breaks the cage. I find the Arundel Sport cages to work well, except for the sticking an extremity through the frame part.
    Do the math.

  27. #27
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    anyone have ideas for getting a pack to stay put and not throw off your CoG so much? that is the only reason I would choose water bottles over a pack some days.

    I have tried strapping mine down tight on the shoulders and using the waist strap to just stablize it, and I have tried cinching it on my hips first, then using the should straps to merely stablize is (which is how you properly fit a hiking pack, but that strategy might not work while riding a bike).

    maybe I need more beer gut. that seems to work for a lot of riders I know.

    related: I am baffled by the size of some of these packs. I have an Osprey Raptor 10. At the time I bought it, it was one of the smallest packs I could get (nice pro-deal at the shop). I have never come close to using its full capacity because it gets so heavy will all that stuff in it. I weighed it with water and my usual gear the other day and it was almost eight pounds. that seems like a lot of extra weight on my back, where it is unstable compared to if I put that weight on my bike.
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    anyone have ideas for getting a pack to stay put and not throw off your CoG so much? that is the only reason I would choose water bottles over a pack some days.

    I have tried strapping mine down tight on the shoulders and using the waist strap to just stablize it, and I have tried cinching it on my hips first, then using the should straps to merely stablize is (which is how you properly fit a hiking pack, but that strategy might not work while riding a bike).

    maybe I need more beer gut. that seems to work for a lot of riders I know.

    related: I am baffled by the size of some of these packs. I have an Osprey Raptor 10. At the time I bought it, it was one of the smallest packs I could get (nice pro-deal at the shop). I have never come close to using its full capacity because it gets so heavy will all that stuff in it. I weighed it with water and my usual gear the other day and it was almost eight pounds. that seems like a lot of extra weight on my back, where it is unstable compared to if I put that weight on my bike.
    The solution is a wingnut bag.


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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    The solution is a wingnut bag.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



    Yes.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    If I do any sort of jumping or even a steep chutes, I can feel the weight of 3 liters of water suddenly lift off my back and lurch me forward. I have tried a few packs and none of them keep the weight in the same place.
    Yeah, that's the worst. You send it off a jump, your pack sends it off your back and pulls you whichever way it happens to go. A lumbar pack is better in that regard. At least the weight stays low on your hips.

    For rides of 90 minutes or less I only need one bottle. I'll drink a bunch before I ride then have some more when I finish. On my home trails there are several creeks and rivers flowing right off the mountains so for longer rides I carry Potable Aqua purification tablets and I can refill from a water source just like a backpacker might. If I'm riding in an unknown area I might use my lumbar Camelbak for insurance.

  31. #31
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    Neither my CB Skyline nor Volt, both lumbar packs, shift on my back. Not much or very often anyway. Then again, I’m not exactly sending it out there like Semenuk or anything.

  32. #32
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    I can't keep up with what is trendy, so I just do what works for me. For my past 35 years of mountain biking, that has almost exclusively been a couple of water bottles on the bike and tools in a seat bag or jersey pocket. My daily rides rarely exceed 30 miles / 3 hours and are near water sources.

    Because I am what the marketing folks call a "late adopter" (if I adopt at all), I didn't buy my first hydration backpack until more than 10 years after they were introduced. The only times I ride with a pack are on big desert epic rides without water sources, long mountain back country rides when changing conditions warrant having extra clothing, and when I am patrolling and need to have first aid and other guest service supplies with me.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    Isn’t “totally parched” and “completely dehydrated “ the same thing? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Totally parched is still a step or two away from completely dehydrated. I like to ride without a pack if possible because I feel cooler and less hindered on the bike. My mountain bike can't even hold a full bottle so on long rides I use a pack. Any bike I can put two bottles on I'd rather use them and a seat pack for tools and a tube.

  34. #34
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    tealy

    You seem very worried about what others are doing. When you have a problem, you don't want to take the available acceptable route to a solution.

    If you want a Camelback, buy one and use it. As you pointed out these things have been in common use since the 1990s. Any rider that wants one can find one easily and use it. Just like the brake lever thing, you can just take the available solutions on the market. Being upset that there is a trend that doesn't match your choices may not be healthy. I hear what you are saying about calling BS, I would go for a ride today and burn off some of that angst if you can.

    Or hang out here and argue that every available product is trash expect for the one you like ...

  35. #35
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    To the guy having issues with his CB water sloshing around: Do you push all the air out of the bladder after filling it, keep the pack high on your back, and keep the sternum and waist straps tight? My pack stays in place and I rarely notice it.

    To the guy who hates cleaning out the bladder: I agree that sucks. That's why I only keep water in bladder. Give it a few rinses before a new ride and I'm good to go.

    To everyone who has issues with telling people what to do: If you really truly love bottles or fanny pack packs, that fine. I really don't care. We need weirdos in the world. But what are forums for other than telling other people what you think or what to do?

    My rant is more in response to the frequent threads where people are like "How do you carry all your crap?" and people throw out crazy responses like, "You need to wrap your tube in a plastic bag and attach it to your frame with a special strap. Then you need to cut threads into your handle bars or steerer tube and purchase a special multi-tool to fit inside. Strap your pump to the frame. Mount 3 bottles on your frame. Mount the phone to your stem. Carry goos, keys, wallet, knife in your jersey pocket. And you if you need extra gear like a jacket or medicine, just leave it behind and hope nothing goes wrong or have your friend carry it..." And all I can think is OR YOU CAN JUST USE A DAMN CAMELBACK.
    "You can be clipped in and be boring or ride flats and have a good time." - Sam Hill

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    To everyone who has issues with telling people what to do: If you really truly love bottles or fanny pack packs, that fine. I really don't care. We need weirdos in the world.


    Someone who doesn't care wouldn't post a full-on rant saying that bottle users only imagine that they like them better. I agree that we need weirdos in this world, carry on!
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  37. #37
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    Really depends on the trail and ride you plan on doing.

    Local rides 2 hours and under I usually don't bring water.

    "Fanny packs" I have 3 old Columbia Sport fanny packs that are no longer made, and were out well before such packs were made for riding. They are quite streamlined and well fitted to my hips. I can store 1L of water in a water sack in it along with my tools. You forget you are wearing it. I use the same packs for XC/BC skiing and hunting. They are the best.

    For very long rides I do use a Camel. The Skyline LR which is great. I've still got really old Camels that I no longer use for biking but they serve as a staple for carrying stuff on day hikes and trail work days.

    Riders do get hung up on following bike specific gear trends.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    Let's go back like 20 years to when mountain bikes were rad and the Chili Peppers were still edgy. Do you remember?

    You had a sweet anodized water bottle cage (or two or three) on your ride and water bottles that either a) leaked all over the damn seats in your Wranger or b) sealed so tight you'd break a tooth popping one open. Your bike was rolling on 45 psi 1.95 pizza cutters on trails with real rocks. Real rocks. Most of the time you'd bounce so hard down the trail you couldn't grab the damn bottle let alone squirt it in your mouth, that is, if the water bottle hadn't flown out of the holder on the way down the last hill. So you'd make several special stops just so you could drink.

    But that's not all. Because you could only carry a bottle or two, you would get a) totally parched or b) completely dehydrated on long summer rides. And don't forget your tools. Those would either go in your jersey pockets that would strangle you or in a seat bag that would trap you behind your non-dropper post on any gnarly descent.

    But then the camelbak blew up and all those problems were instantly solved. You could drink any damn time, you could carry as much as you damn wanted, and your bike lost 5 pounds. It was bliss. Back in the day I don't remember anyone complaining about camelbaks. Ever.

    Then something changed. People started complaining about having a sweaty back (like that's real problem). And the sweaty back was worst thing that ever happened to mountain biking since having to shift with both hands. So we decided a) we need to put that 5 lbs of crap back on a bike (rolling on $2000 carbon wheels to save 200 grams of course) or b) wear a fanny pack which simulates the feeling and aesthetic of having eaten yourself into oblivion at Cici's. This is where we are.

    Like I did with air shocks and two-finger brake levers, I'm calling bullshit. Bottles and fanny packs are trends that limit ride performance and capability for most riders. Ever try to hop a log with bottles on your bike? Sucks. Ever try to... actually I don't have a good performance critique of fanny packs other than they can't hold as much as a larger camelbak, but fanny packs... seriously?

    I do get a sweaty back and changed from a full backpack to one of those front handlebar packs, that slings onto my back, much smaller, much better. I can even have it swing over to my front side and still pedal fine. Love the compact and light pack, it's a lot nicer than a crapload of gear in a backpack. I used to have water bottles in the backpack but two of them in holders on the frame are enough now. Camelbacks are not my style.

    I'm not sure what the BS is about air shocks and brake levers...no comment on those.
    Hypercritical is good. Hypocritical is bad. Nice people can still be bad people.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazpat View Post
    I'm riding how I want.

    Some people like following trends, I'm not one of them. But I don't think using bottles is a trend, it's just what some people like.
    Wait a minute didn't you get a gravel bike?
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    I hop logs with water bottles and jersey pockets full of junk. Also there are real rocks on the trails.
    You didn't know that someone with a Camelback can automatically clear all rocks from the trail like magic?
    Hypercritical is good. Hypocritical is bad. Nice people can still be bad people.

  41. #41
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    I hate hydration packs, not imagined. Seriously do not get how that is comfortable to ride with, but do what ya want!

    Into the bibs now that have the pockets built into them.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    ...I'm not sure what the BS is about air shocks and brake levers...no comment on those.
    Why are ALL brake levers STILL designed for 2-finger braking?

    Why are we still riding air shocks?

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    "You need to wrap your tube in a plastic bag and attach it to your frame with an Awesome Strap.
    fify
    There are two types of people in this world:
    1) Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    Wait a minute didn't you get a gravel bike?
    I sold my very rarely ridden tri bike and bought a CX bike as I can ride road 2 miles from my house to reach some singletrack and then ride out the other side to connect to a multiuse gravelly path and then to a paved mutliuse path or roads with bike lanes. It allows me to commute to work if I want. I don't like riding a mountain bike for long distances on pavement and the single track is too rough for my regular road bike; it won't fit anything wider than 28c, maybe only 25c. I don't own an official "gravel bike"; my CX was manufactured before that term was around. If I'm mountain biking, I'll just ride the two miles on the road to the trails on my mountain bike.

    FWIW, I usually use bottles on the CX but if I am spending most of my time on the singletrack, I may go with a Camelbak. I have had the bottles get pretty nasty from kicked up leaf litter, etc on damp singletrack.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    Let's go back like 20 years to when mountain bikes were rad and the Chili Peppers were still edgy. Do you remember?

    You had a sweet anodized water bottle cage (or two or three) on your ride and water bottles that either a) leaked all over the damn seats in your Wranger or b) sealed so tight you'd break a tooth popping one open. Your bike was rolling on 45 psi 1.95 pizza cutters on trails with real rocks. Real rocks. Most of the time you'd bounce so hard down the trail you couldn't grab the damn bottle let alone squirt it in your mouth, that is, if the water bottle hadn't flown out of the holder on the way down the last hill. So you'd make several special stops just so you could drink.

    But that's not all. Because you could only carry a bottle or two, you would get a) totally parched or b) completely dehydrated on long summer rides. And don't forget your tools. Those would either go in your jersey pockets that would strangle you or in a seat bag that would trap you behind your non-dropper post on any gnarly descent.

    But then the camelbak blew up and all those problems were instantly solved. You could drink any damn time, you could carry as much as you damn wanted, and your bike lost 5 pounds. It was bliss. Back in the day I don't remember anyone complaining about camelbaks. Ever.

    Then something changed. People started complaining about having a sweaty back (like that's real problem). And the sweaty back was worst thing that ever happened to mountain biking since having to shift with both hands. So we decided a) we need to put that 5 lbs of crap back on a bike (rolling on $2000 carbon wheels to save 200 grams of course) or b) wear a fanny pack which simulates the feeling and aesthetic of having eaten yourself into oblivion at Cici's. This is where we are.

    Like I did with air shocks and two-finger brake levers, I'm calling bullshit. Bottles and fanny packs are trends that limit ride performance and capability for most riders. Ever try to hop a log with bottles on your bike? Sucks. Ever try to... actually I don't have a good performance critique of fanny packs other than they can't hold as much as a larger camelbak, but fanny packs... seriously?
    I know I'm going to regret this.....I largely agree with this as a blanket statement, although the jury is still out on air shocks and brake levers.

    I honestly don't care what everyone else does, but the industry clearly ebbs and flows. In the 90s having frame packs and saddle bags were all the rage. People clipped their pumps to their frames, etc. At some point, that changed and everything shifted to their backs. Now it's back on the frame again (just look at EDC tools, a million different frame bag makers, etc.).

    All of that is fine, but then you see the comments from people and magazines how this is clearly the better method, when you know many of those people were on other side of things just years ago.

    It's fine to switch back and forth. It's fine to change with the trends too. No big deal either way. Let's just be up font and admit that it exists.

    The same discussion can easily happen with roof rack vs. rear hitch (sorry if I stole a thread slated for next week Tealy!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    wear a fanny pack which simulates the feeling and aesthetic of having eaten yourself into oblivion at Cici's.
    Lol!
    I mostly agree and enjoyed your post. Camelback for me for every ride. I love big backcountry rides and wear it every ride as a matter of conditioning. I also agree about getting the weight of your bike point. Packs with suspension like the Osprey syncro series are the bees knees for most of the problems mentioned. I honestly don't care what other people do. I ride with a guy that rarely brings anything including water even on huge desert rides. I can't imagine what that's doing to his kidneys etc., but hey, whatever works.
    It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.

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    No mention of Vista Outdoors in this thread?
    I am shocked!
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  48. #48
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    hour long rides or so = water bottle, multi tool

    longer rides = camel, multi tool, some snacks etc

    works for me. if i get too hot, ill dump some water on me

  49. #49
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    Hate all you want.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Camelback hate is imagined.-20170924_164153.jpg  

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    I switched to the camelbac and never looked back, ever. Sweaty back, seriously? My entire carcass is sweaty after a ride, who gives a damn if my back is also sweaty. Pretty lame excuse I hate to say. I never liked frame bottles and was glad when an alternative came out. I don't notice the weight on my back at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodiakrider View Post
    Sweaty back, seriously? My entire carcass is sweaty after a ride, who gives a damn if my back is also sweaty. Pretty lame excuse I hate to say.

    Why would anyone need an excuse to prefer bottles?
    I brake for stinkbugs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodiakrider View Post
    I switched to the camelbac and never looked back, ever. Sweaty back, seriously? My entire carcass is sweaty after a ride, who gives a damn if my back is also sweaty. Pretty lame excuse I hate to say. I never liked frame bottles and was glad when an alternative came out. I don't notice the weight on my back at all.
    It's less about a sweaty back and more about thermal regulation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ctxcrossx View Post
    roof rack vs. rear hitch
    Seriously?

    You know what the trend was...? Putting all your sh!t in a backpack for any type/distance/duration of a ride. Now people have options. Some things are actually more functional and convenient. It's a beautiful thing.

  54. #54
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    Wait...we're supposed to be rinsing out our Camelbacks?

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuck80442 View Post
    Wait...we're supposed to be rinsing out our Camelbacks?
    No, just fill with Whiskey every other time.
    I brake for stinkbugs

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    Quote Originally Posted by EatsDirt View Post
    Another Pro Tip: Denture cleaning tablets
    That's my drill. Water only. Clean, nice water only. Then every so often a few efferdent in there - squeeze it down the tube. Leave it over night. Next day rinse it out a couple times and it's good.

    No fuss, drying rack tube brushes or other fooforall.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EatsDirt View Post
    It's less about a sweaty back and more about thermal regulation.
    Really? I'm going to assume you are joking lol. I mean heck, back in my Army days we'd hump 12+ miles with over 80 pounds of ruck on the back, full combat gear, in crappy Georgia summer humidity. You would be surprised how little thermal regulation you get. That's probably why I don't see the big deal having a camelbak on my back, I've just simply done far worse than anything mountain biking has to offer. I get it though, everyone has their comfort level.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodiakrider View Post
    Really? I'm going to assume you are joking lol. I mean heck, back in my Army days we'd hump 12+ miles with over 80 pounds of ruck on the back, full combat gear, in crappy Georgia summer humidity. You would be surprised how little thermal regulation you get. That's probably why I don't see the big deal having a camelbak on my back, I've just simply done far worse than anything mountain biking has to offer. I get it though, everyone has their comfort level.
    Im sure you're just tough as nails, but if you don't understand the performance gained with better thermal regulation... I don't know that you're worth debating.


  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    Hate all you want.
    .
    Thats awesome Travis, what else are you hiding under there?

  60. #60
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    Some have been mentioned already, but for those using Camelbaks:
    - Only use water in it
    - Get the air out of the bladder before riding
    - Make use of the waist straps to stop it moving around
    - If you ride in hot weather, here is something I often do: 1/3 - 1/2 fill the bladder, blow it full of air and lay flat in the freezer overnight. Then top up just prior to riding and enjoy an ice cold back and water for at least some of your ride.
    - If not using for more than a few days I throw the bladder in the freezer (either as above, or emptied), otherwise mould will grow in it.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatsDirt View Post
    Seriously?

    You know what the trend was...? Putting all your sh!t in a backpack for any type/distance/duration of a ride. Now people have options. Some things are actually more functional and convenient. It's a beautiful thing.
    No, frame/saddle bags predated backpacks for supplies and hydration as a trend.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    Let's go back like 20 years to when mountain bikes were rad and the Chili Peppers were still edgy. Do you remember?

    You had a sweet anodized water bottle cage (or two or three) on your ride and water bottles that either a) leaked all over the damn seats in your Wranger or b) sealed so tight you'd break a tooth popping one open. Your bike was rolling on 45 psi 1.95 pizza cutters on trails with real rocks. Real rocks. Most of the time you'd bounce so hard down the trail you couldn't grab the damn bottle let alone squirt it in your mouth, that is, if the water bottle hadn't flown out of the holder on the way down the last hill. So you'd make several special stops just so you could drink.

    But that's not all. Because you could only carry a bottle or two, you would get a) totally parched or b) completely dehydrated on long summer rides. And don't forget your tools. Those would either go in your jersey pockets that would strangle you or in a seat bag that would trap you behind your non-dropper post on any gnarly descent.

    But then the camelbak blew up and all those problems were instantly solved. You could drink any damn time, you could carry as much as you damn wanted, and your bike lost 5 pounds. It was bliss. Back in the day I don't remember anyone complaining about camelbaks. Ever.

    Then something changed. People started complaining about having a sweaty back (like that's real problem). And the sweaty back was worst thing that ever happened to mountain biking since having to shift with both hands. So we decided a) we need to put that 5 lbs of crap back on a bike (rolling on $2000 carbon wheels to save 200 grams of course) or b) wear a fanny pack which simulates the feeling and aesthetic of having eaten yourself into oblivion at Cici's. This is where we are.

    Like I did with air shocks and two-finger brake levers, I'm calling bullshit. Bottles and fanny packs are trends that limit ride performance and capability for most riders. Ever try to hop a log with bottles on your bike? Sucks. Ever try to... actually I don't have a good performance critique of fanny packs other than they can't hold as much as a larger camelbak, but fanny packs... seriously?
    How is 5 pounds on the back different than 5 pounds on the bike? The laws of physics don't change. Ever get mold growing in the Camelbak? Most people don't use anything other than water because of that. Sports drink definitely works. It's easy to keep water bottles clean (I put them in the dish washer). Not so with a Camelbak bladder.

  63. #63
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    This may not work for fully-suspended bikes, but for hard tails just put in a frame bag and put water bladder and tools etc. in. Keeps CG low and everything on the bike and not your bag.

    I added one of those retractable things to my handlebar for the water hose to drink while riding.

    Camelback hate is imagined.-drink_hose.jpg
    Camelback hate is imagined.-fatbag.jpg

    I never tried a camelbak, but think the weight on my back would bother me and the frame triangle is wasted space anyway.

    My hydration bladder stays in my freezer when not in use. Too cumbersome to clean it.
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  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDee View Post
    How is 5 pounds on the back different than 5 pounds on the bike? The laws of physics don't change.
    5 lbs on the bike is very different than 5 lbs on the body.

    When you bunny hop with water weight on the bike, you have lift that extra weight with your arms. When you bunny hop with water weight on your body, you lift that extra weight with your legs. Obviously legs are way stronger than arms, so extra weight is easier to lift with the legs.

    But if you don't bunny hop when you ride, it might not be an issue. But I hop everything, so I like to keep weight off the bike. Even if you don't hop, I still think that extra weight is more noticeable on the bike.
    "You can be clipped in and be boring or ride flats and have a good time." - Sam Hill

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctxcrossx View Post
    No, frame/saddle bags predated backpacks for supplies and hydration as a trend.
    Perhaps your definition of trend does not insinuate what is "in fashion". If so, yes, people actually used the most practical options at the time so yes... I guess that was a trend.

  66. #66
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    Iv'e never thought about a sweaty back, and it's never bothered me. I use a Osprey pack that is designed to keep the pack off your back. It is more comfortable than the several generations of CB MULEs I've used over the years.

    Besides the water in the bladder, I carry two full bottles in the pack. Either for my dog on short rides(15 miles), or myself on longer rides, and carry a recovery bottle on my bike. I've always done it this way and don't know any other way. I'd feel naked without that amount of water. I'm not a manlet and don't feel the weight.
    Ripping trails and tipping ales

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    5 lbs on the bike is very different than 5 lbs on the body.

    When you bunny hop with water weight on the bike, you have lift that extra weight with your arms. When you bunny hop with water weight on your body, you lift that extra weight with your legs. Obviously legs are way stronger than arms, so extra weight is easier to lift with the legs.

    But if you don't bunny hop when you ride, it might not be an issue. But I hop everything, so I like to keep weight off the bike. Even if you don't hop, I still think that extra weight is more noticeable on the bike.
    Yeah, if you need to finesse the bike, what you say is right. Mostly though, I'm just riding fire roads and water bottles are just more convenient for most of my riding.

  68. #68
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    What's a Camelback? I am totally lost. Sounds like something very important to the OP.

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  69. #69
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    I use an older Hawg. I'm 6'5" so it fits me like a Mule fits my 5'10" friends. I put enough water in it for the projected ride. No reason to carry a whole bladder full of water for a ten mile ride. When I do long rides in hot weather, especially in Florida, I fill it with ice and then water. Sometimes even add a bottle to the frame.
    I also carry tools, a pump, granola bars, my phone, a layer of clothing... No one else in my family rides as much as I do so I have to carry all this crap in case of a mechanical or whatever issue may arise. Been riding with it for so long, I hardly even notice it.
    I like turtles

  70. #70
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    I used to ride with a pack going back to the late 90's. I had one of the first packs when they were just bladder and sleeve. No room for anything else. Loved in the small packs I could carry water and everything I needed. I have never had mold grow in my camelbak bladders ever and never washed them. But I only put water in them and keep them the fridge when not in use. Or just dry them in air for longer storage.

    I did just move to bottles for my shorter singlespeed rides and races. Under 2 hours in cool temps is nice to be free an carry less crap. On singlespeed with standing is nice not carry that weight when on the pedals standing. Nice also on short sprint race laps. However it is harder to drink water and you carry less. Also I carry less tools/spares when riding like this. However I am a bit faster with less weight overall. The problem is less stuff for longer riders and more remote rides. These days I don't carry a pump in races or much in the way of spares. Just tube, CO2, tire lever and multi tool. My pack has all this plus other assorted spares and emergency food.

    Now for 4-12 hour backcountry rides I carry my pack and two bottles. I put electrolyte in the bottles and run water in the pack. Plus spares for just about anything that could happen 35 miles from my car. For my this why I love that my 2 primary bikes have 2 bottle mounts. That way I can carry lots of water as being Arizona most long rider don't have reliable water source along the way. So 100oz plus 2 bottles is pure survival. Plus packs are good for extra clothing etc.
    Joe
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  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    5 lbs on the bike is very different than 5 lbs on the body.
    That's a fact. It's been proven that riders with their weight low and centered (frame bag & bottles) are faster than riders with their weight up high (backpack).

    I was an early adopter of the camelback back in the 90's, but ditched it a few years ago because I was tired of all that weight on my back. The bike handles better, and I feel more free on the bike. I've also recently started using stainless steel bottles because I don't like plastics in my diet. It's the perfect setup FOR ME. If you like an ill handling bike, and toxic chemicals mixed in with your water, that's your business.


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  72. #72
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    Camelbak, fanny pack, seat bag, AND two cages with bottles. Gotta have tools, sammiches, drinks, a giant innnertube, and an extra layer of clothes. That's just how it goes when you're the pack mule.

    Camelback hate is imagined.-img_5492.jpg

    But for "real" riding, I never fill more than 60oz in a Camelbak. That high-centered weight pulls me off line all the time, esp. under hard braking - the water wants to come up over my head (the belt thing can't be cinched tight enough while remaining conscious). 2 20oz bottles on the bike make up the diff.

    And I always empty the Camelbak 1st.

    I don't know if anyone remembers the old car seat covers - they were like a mat made of layers of something like plastic screens to allow air to flow through.
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    They were super cheap and tended to squash flat pretty easily, but if Camelbak took a similar approach it would be a huge improvement.

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  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by tealy View Post
    Like I did with air shocks and two-finger brake levers, I'm calling bullshit.
    Hahaha! I like the way you write. My wiz-bang bottle cage costs more than many spend on their helmet or their shoes. I like the freedom of riding packless, so on a short ride I'll bring just a water bottle. It serves double-duty for a bottle of hydration drink on epic-length rides.

    Most of the time I'll use a traditional Camelbak... but I'd rather be going bareback. It was just yesterday I tried out a 1.5 liter fannypack on a longer ride. It was awful. It made my ass bigger than Kim Kardashian's. More than a couple times it snagged on the saddle. As I moved around, it would creep lower and lower so I'd have to readjust. The belt had to be tightened so much that it restricted breathing.

    Never again will a pack grace my behind. If God hadn't wanted me to wear hydration pack on my back, he wouldn't have given me shoulders.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazpat View Post
    I sold my very rarely ridden tri bike and bought a CX bike as I can ride road 2 miles from my house to reach some singletrack and then ride out the other side to connect to a multiuse gravelly path and then to a paved mutliuse path or roads with bike lanes. It allows me to commute to work if I want. I don't like riding a mountain bike for long distances on pavement and the single track is too rough for my regular road bike; it won't fit anything wider than 28c, maybe only 25c. I don't own an official "gravel bike"; my CX was manufactured before that term was around. If I'm mountain biking, I'll just ride the two miles on the road to the trails on my mountain bike.

    FWIW, I usually use bottles on the CX but if I am spending most of my time on the singletrack, I may go with a Camelbak. I have had the bottles get pretty nasty from kicked up leaf litter, etc on damp singletrack.

    OK good, I wouldn't want you jumping on the gravel bike craze. BTW I'm roadbiking with knobby 2.25's in back, and 1/2 worn Kenda Aggressive 1.95's in front and it's not bad at all. Some tire noise on the pavement but a lot quieter than you may think. I actually prefer standard MTB tires on the road as long as they are not too knobby. The hybrid ones seem off-center and overarched, too easy to go off the line for some reason; the MTB ones keep the bike on track a bit better. I don't care about speed either, in case you wondered.
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  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottzg View Post
    You're a badass if you're riding in the phoenix heat dungeon in the summer.

    wheee

    nothing beats riding in phoenix in the summer mornings before the sun comes up. its finally down to 100 by then. when your done you get to wring your shirt out. waterpack required.
    A pristine bike free of dirt, scratches, and wear marks makes me sort of sad.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    Isn’t “totally parched” and “completely dehydrated “ the same thing?


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    Completely dehydrated is a dead dry husk. I guess dehydrated is too, for that matter. Maybe we should use under-hydrated.

  77. #77
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    Ever since I purchased a Hydrapak, I haven't used a water bottle since. I just like it. That's me. I could not care less what other people think or their preference, and that pertains to a lot more than just hydration packs.
    Last edited by MiWolverine; 04-27-2018 at 08:53 AM. Reason: typo, yo!
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  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiWolverine View Post
    Ever since I purchased a Hydrapak, I haven't used a water bottle since. I just like it. That's me. I could not care less what other people think or their preference, and that pertains to a lot more than just hydration packs.
    Ditto!^^

    And in doing so freed up the perfect place for me to carry a...
    (gasp).... BT speaker


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    I've got a pack for all occasions. I wear the hydration pack on the longer rides where I need to carry food, jacket and spares. I wear a hip pack on the shorter rides where all I need is some food and tools. I have a tulbag I can carry if its a short ride and I really don't need to carry anything but the bare essentials. I like options.

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