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  1. #1
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    California: "I just made the dumbest tax ever" Oregon: "Oh yeah? Hold my Pilsner"

    Oregon passes a $15 tax only for a healthy pastime.


    Oregon Legislature passes $15 bike tax | Bicycle Retailer and Industry News

  2. #2
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    It is to pay for all the sweet single track in Portland ... Hmmm....

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  3. #3
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    Still cheaper than Washington's 8+% sales tax on every bike sold and at least the OR tax is claimed to support biking infrastructure.

    On adult bikes over $200.

    People predicting that mom and pop bike shops will go out of biz due to the tax is a stretch.

    Claiming that bike demand will drop is poo.

    Speculating that the $15 will push more people to online purchases to try to get around it is bogus--already happening and people who support local still will.

    Relax Oregon. You'll still be that quirky biking state.
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  4. #4
    NRP
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    A funding source dedicated to bicycle infrastructure doesn't sound like a terrible idea.

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    At some basic level it's a good idea; bikes need dedicated bikes-only trails and this would be a good start in funding them. Sort of like California's "green sticker" funding for OHV's.

    But the specific implementation in the Oregon statute is pretty wonky; why just a flat fee and not include a percentage? Or just a % to capture those cheepo Walmart bikes? (Shows who's got the lobbying power)

    All dealers will have an additional burden in bookkeeping; a mom & pop shop on the edge might be pushed over.

    Might be time for a new sub-26" tire size! 25.5" anybody? It could be called the "Oregon" wheels!
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    Here in Colorado Springs we've had a $3 charge on bike sales for 20+ years that goes towards bike path building.
    It doesn't raise much money but it helps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moe Ped View Post
    At some basic level it's a good idea; bikes need dedicated bikes-only trails and this would be a good start in funding them. Sort of like California's "green sticker" funding for OHV's.

    But the specific implementation in the Oregon statute is pretty wonky; why just a flat fee and not include a percentage? Or just a % to capture those cheepo Walmart bikes? (Shows who's got the lobbying power)

    All dealers will have an additional burden in bookkeeping; a mom & pop shop on the edge might be pushed over.

    Might be time for a new sub-26" tire size! 25.5" anybody? It could be called the "Oregon" wheels!
    Yeah, talk to anyone in the green sticker program about how well the monies are spent....... Government run programs like this are just stealing more money from the taxpayers under the guise of providing services to an already overtaxed population. How about you spend the money I already give you in a more appropriate manner instead of coming to me with your palm up looking for more. When that happens I'll gladly chip in more. In California there is already money earmarked for these kinds of things, how is that working for us......? Yet we will be asked to give more at some point, guaranteed.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRP View Post
    A funding source dedicated to bicycle infrastructure doesn't sound like a terrible idea.
    It sounds like a great idea BUT...they will toss the money in the general fund to pay for pension plans that are underfunded now.

    Just like how someone wrote about the green sticker money in Calif. Being a moto biker for 50 years I can attest to success/failure of that program
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    they will toss the money in the general fund to pay for pension plans that are underfunded now.

    You are pretty optimistic about that! They won't fund the pension liability until they have to, which means their will be a new tax in the next 10 years to "fund it" The green sticker program is really a great example as is the lottery........which was supposed to magically solve school funding problems until the legistator pretty much reduced general fund school support dollar for every dollar the lottery produced. As a CPA everytime I hear about a new tax or fee tha is guranteed by audit etc. to go to a specific program I know its just another bs pitch for a money grab and I vote no......if given chance.

  10. #10
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    Without green sticker money there would be very little legit OHV access in California.

    True, it's not always well spent and the fund is often raided but that's not the fault of the fund. BTW most of the fund's monies come from fuel taxes, not registration fees.
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  11. #11
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    Here in California I would happily pay this, if nothing more than to shut up the people that complain that 'you bikers use the roads/trails/etc but don't have to pay for them'.
    "When life gives you lemons...say f@%k it, and bail"

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    tendency to over react because it is an unusual tax. skeptical about the use of proceeds but who knows maybe they provided zero discretion in the law?

    still, don't like the approach if funds get redirected. They have an enormous pension problem in Oregon, idiotic promises that can't be kept. Maybe this part of a trend to create other revenue streams so property and income taxes can be entirely devoted to pensions?


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    oh yeah, it will be interesting to see whether they come close to the revenues given how easy it can be to avoid.


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    Lol, when has government ever taxed anybody promising to use that money for their benefit but instead the money disappeared into a bureaucratic black hole? Like, that would be unusual right???

    There's no separate coffer for bike infrastructure. It all goes into the same toilet bowl.

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    Which politicians nephew gets $100,000 per year to administer this 1.2 million dollar pension grab?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjsb View Post
    tendency to over react because it is an unusual tax. skeptical about the use of proceeds but who knows maybe they provided zero discretion in the law?

    still, don't like the approach if funds get redirected. They have an enormous pension problem in Oregon, idiotic promises that can't be kept. Maybe this part of a trend to create other revenue streams so property and income taxes can be entirely devoted to pensions?


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    Most States have underfunded pension plans, which means that either folks won't get what they were promised or major tax hikes will be required to fill the gaping hole.

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    It would be great if it went to good use for bike infrastructure, but I have lost faith in the gov't agencies managing and spending money efficiently.

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    There's no sales tax in Oregon. $15 is about 0.25% of the cost of the bikes most of us ride. Choose your battles.
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  19. #19
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    2000 and up might be better - it would appear to be a luxury tax to most of the population, not a penalty on low income riders.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRP View Post
    A funding source dedicated to bicycle infrastructure doesn't sound like a terrible idea.
    Until it's actually used to prop up a pension plan...


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    You should experience the high taxes we have here in the Northeast. Lousy weather and not-so-epic trails if you are lucky enough to even live near them.

    I'm in PA - we have the highest gas tax in the country and yet some of the worst roads. Plus a 6% sales tax. A 2.8% income tax. Another 1.5% or whatever income tax split between your town and school district. Then a school district, county, AND town real estate tax. The school district tax on a 1,100 square foot older rancher on a neighborhood like mine can run $3,000-$4,000 a year easy.

    Scary thing is my friends in N.J. and N.Y. have it even worse. 🤤

    Plus you have to buy your liquor at state-owned stores at a markup in PA. Good news though! The law changed to allow beer to be sold in some grocery stores with walled-off sections and their own cashiers so you don't have,to go to a distributor and get a whole case anymore.

  22. #22
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    Yeah, what's with the roads in PA? I lived there a long time ago and they were consistently voted worse road in the nation by some truckers magazine. People would say it was because of the weather but then yo'd cross a bridge into Jersey and the roads were fine. When they did patch a pothole in Philly, they'd overfill it so that it stuck up two inches above the road surface. When I sold my car there, all four rims were bent.
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  23. #23
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    What could go wrong? I mean it's not like you already can't let your bike out of your sight in Bend.

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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackies Pasture View Post
    What could go wrong? I mean it's not like you already can't let your bike out of your sight in Bend.

    https://www.thelundreport.org/conten...rug-possession
    Yeah Oregon politics are pretty wacky; sort of reminds me several areas in California---Santa Cruz comes to mind.

    "Steal a bike; get a ticket"

    Back OT; a "bike tax" might work if there were "teeth" put in the legislation. For example collected funds held in escrow and disbursed by the equivalent of a probate (or bankruptcy) judge. Put a time limit on collected monies; if not spent on appropriate bicycling projects within the time prescribed then the funds would be rebated to those that paid them.

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  25. #25
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    you can argue that the tax is ok since its supposedly earmarked for bicycle infrastructure but I dont see it that way.

    Usually you would tax things that you view as bad and then spend the money on alternatives in order to provide a nudge to change behavior. for example raising the gas tax and then spending it on public transit and bicycle infrastructure. bikes are good since its healthy, doesnt pollute the air and doesnt destroy the roads.

    this is the opposite. the amount of funding this provides is quite small compared to the needs or to the funding that automobiles get. cars are taxed because we all suffer the externalities of the traffic, pollution, noise, and maintenance issues.

    Its also a regressive tax in that the people buying inexpensive bikes shoulder more of the cost percentage wise. If you have enough money to buy a 6000 dollar carbon wonderbike what is another $15? on the other hand if you are scraping together change from the couch cushions for a $250 bike then that $15 could be a lot. maybe you buy a $180 bike instead.

  26. #26
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    Reading the article at

    Oregon Legislature passes $15 bike tax | Bicycle Retailer and Industry News

    It says that it will support Multi-Use trails. Okay, then how about a $15 tax on all hiking boots, and a $15 tax on all horse tack. Seems like Oregon saw a nice little revenue stream and grabbed it. Granted, $15 bucks on top of a decent MTB is nothing, but it sure seems like there is no equal protection under the law.

    I also agree with Sean Allen about how the green sticker fees are administered, a lot of revenue and really nothing to show for it.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent_G View Post
    Reading the article at

    Oregon Legislature passes $15 bike tax | Bicycle Retailer and Industry News

    It says that it will support Multi-Use trails. Okay, then how about a $15 tax on all hiking boots, and a $15 tax on all horse tack. Seems like Oregon saw a nice little revenue stream and grabbed it. Granted, $15 bucks on top of a decent MTB is nothing, but it sure seems like there is no equal protection under the law.

    I also agree with Sean Allen about how the green sticker fees are administered, a lot of revenue and really nothing to show for it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazpat View Post
    Yeah, what's with the roads in PA? I lived there a long time ago and they were consistently voted worse road in the nation by some truckers magazine. People would say it was because of the weather but then yo'd cross a bridge into Jersey and the roads were fine. When they did patch a pothole in Philly, they'd overfill it so that it stuck up two inches above the road surface. When I sold my car there, all four rims were bent.
    Good 🕳 question🕳. People where I live🕳 tend to drive big pickups in part to keep the potholes 🕳from ripping their tires🕳 and rims apart 🕳like they would 🕳with smaller wheels on a Prius or something.🕳

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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Pure discrimination, class action law suit.
    What they really need up there is a tax on flannel. Talk about revenue!

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    Too bad all the admin/compliance costs probably wipe out the net gains in trail spending. I'd rather have seen them pass the hat around at all the bike shops before raising a tax, probably would have netted out more dollars to go to this otherwise worthy cause.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clayncedar View Post
    You should experience the high taxes we have here in the Northeast. Lousy weather and not-so-epic trails if you are lucky enough to even live near them.

    I'm in PA - we have the highest gas tax in the country and yet some of the worst roads. Plus a 6% sales tax. A 2.8% income tax. Another 1.5% or whatever income tax split between your town and school district. Then a school district, county, AND town real estate tax. The school district tax on a 1,100 square foot older rancher on a neighborhood like mine can run $3,000-$4,000 a year easy.

    Scary thing is my friends in N.J. and N.Y. have it even worse. 🤤

    Plus you have to buy your liquor at state-owned stores at a markup in PA. Good news though! The law changed to allow beer to be sold in some grocery stores with walled-off sections and their own cashiers so you don't have,to go to a distributor and get a whole case anymore.
    I was contacted about a job in Pittsburgh a few years ago and I could not believe that a $12-20k per year property tax was quite doable in terms of likelihood of being assessed--and then there are state a local community income taxes!!!! At least in texas you pay high property taxes but no state income taxes.


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    Quote Originally Posted by cjsb View Post
    I was contacted about a job in Pittsburgh a few years ago and I could not believe that a $12-20k per year property tax was quite doable in terms of likelihood of being assessed--and then there are state a local community income taxes!!!! At least in texas you pay high property taxes but no state income taxes.


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    Yeah. That's why Texas' population is growing so fast and is projected to surpass California's while PA's population has stagnated for decades.

    Not much of an incentive to live here unless you're a New Yorker or N.J. escaping over the wall.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clayncedar View Post
    Yeah. That's why Texas' population is growing so fast and is projected to surpass California's while PA's population has stagnated for decades.

    Not much of an incentive to live here unless you're a New Yorker or N.J. escaping over the wall.
    I was "intrigued" by this expected tax burden, which incidentally explains what used to be fairly low home prices, so I did some research and from an outsiders' view it seemed like there were taxing body after taxing body, in terms of small governments and townships, it was like those Russian dolls with one after another on the inside. My general impression was that many middle and high income whites fled Pittsburgh and established their own piece of government wherever. Again, an outsiders' limited perspective was that the entire multi-county area should have been consolidated into a single government taxing body, with a single school system, police, fire, etc...

    If home prices in that area have increased as in other parts of the country I don't see how people can afford it with a property tax bill that it as large as another mortgage.

    As an aside, it seemed like Pittsburgh, "got even" with white flight, similar to my home town, Chicago, by establishing outrageous parking rates as an indirect tax on commuters from the suburbs and tourists.


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    Anyone who thinks this is a good idea that will benefit bikers does not understand the government, or how taxes work. You probably also believe that your social security withholdings go into an account for you to collect when you retire. But it really comes down to this, the government should be encouraging people to bike, not tax them for it and the taxes we already pay should be funding bike infrastructure.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ljsmith View Post
    Anyone who thinks this is a good idea that will benefit bikers does not understand the government, or how taxes work. You probably also believe that your social security withholdings go into an account for you to collect when you retire. But it really comes down to this, the government should be encouraging people to bike, not tax them for it and the taxes we already pay should be funding bike infrastructure.
    Line item specific taxes that are ring-fenced from the bottomless pit of tax-spend politicians can be more effective at getting resources to do what they are intended to do. It depends on how the legislation is written and whether those types of ring-fenced funds are permissible under a states' laws on taxation.

    But if it can just be swept into the General Fund then the bottomless pit will be fed...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Clayncedar View Post
    You should experience the high taxes we have here in the Northeast. Lousy weather and not-so-epic trails if you are lucky enough to even live near them.

    I'm in PA - we have the highest gas tax in the country and yet some of the worst roads. Plus a 6% sales tax. A 2.8% income tax. Another 1.5% or whatever income tax split between your town and school district. Then a school district, county, AND town real estate tax. The school district tax on a 1,100 square foot older rancher on a neighborhood like mine can run $3,000-$4,000 a year easy.

    Scary thing is my friends in N.J. and N.Y. have it even worse. 🤤

    Plus you have to buy your liquor at state-owned stores at a markup in PA. Good news though! The law changed to allow beer to be sold in some grocery stores with walled-off sections and their own cashiers so you don't have,to go to a distributor and get a whole case anymore.
    They just added another $5 for each vehicle registration in Montgomery County too. Supposedly this will help fix all the roads maintained by the county. Uh huh.

    Philly now has an additional 2% sales tax BUT they have a 10 year tax abatement on new houses. How does that make any sense???

    You've heard of the Johnstown Flood Tax right? The flood that happened like a hundred years ago that we're still paying a tax on through the state stores...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ljsmith View Post
    anyone who thinks this is a good idea that will benefit bikers does not understand the government, or how taxes work. You probably also believe that your social security withholdings go into an account for you to collect when you retire. But it really comes down to this, the government should be encouraging people to bike, not tax them for it and the taxes we already pay should be funding bike infrastructure.
    this guy gets it
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackies Pasture View Post
    Great response from SC.


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    Next up, gps trackers to tax your bike by the mile! All cyclists please report to nearest Ministry of Bikes Administration immediately.
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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clayncedar View Post
    Yeah. That's why Texas' population is growing so fast and is projected to surpass California's while PA's population has stagnated for decades.

    Not much of an incentive to live here unless you're a New Yorker or N.J. escaping over the wall.
    Texas gets you with sales tax (and other forms of revenue). To hear them say constantly that their taxes are so much less...well, sure, if you don't buy anything. Here in AK, we don't have sales tax in the municipality (or income tax), but the cost of everything is much more than down south, so it all evens out.

    Course, that's assuming you'd want to live in Texas in the first place.
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  42. #42
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    Tax the rich
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Allan View Post
    Yeah, talk to anyone in the green sticker program about how well the monies are spent....... Government run programs like this are just stealing more money from the taxpayers under the guise of providing services to an already overtaxed population. How about you spend the money I already give you in a more appropriate manner instead of coming to me with your palm up looking for more. When that happens I'll gladly chip in more. In California there is already money earmarked for these kinds of things, how is that working for us......? Yet we will be asked to give more at some point, guaranteed.
    This is how it always goes. If the majority of politicians weren't greedy lying parasites I'd be in favor of them stewarding some money for good use. But they are greedy lying parasites and it rarely happens as they say it will.

    Here in CT we have a marine gas tax that was supposed to pay for some programs for marine fisheries. After they stole that money and put it in the general fund, several years later, they established a fishing license with a fee to pay for... you guessed it! The same programs that they were supposedly funding with the gas tax. Now they are about to go bankrupt because they are unproductive lying parasites who spend our money like drunken sailors.
    Last edited by Len Baird; 09-11-2017 at 05:17 AM.

  44. #44
    U sayin' Bolt ?
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    FWIW this is part of the $5.8B transportation bill. Which also includes pushing a new 4 cents per gallon gas tax up to 10 cents in 8 years. As well as a half a percent tax on new car sales, and adding rush hour tolls on the freeways up and down the Portland metro area.

    $15, only on brand new complete bikes is not going to hit diehard cyclists very much at all. And the new infrastructure will be more than worth it. Heck most people around portland prefer used bikes anyways. If they wanna hit those folks, tax beer.

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