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  1. #1
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    suspension patents

    I am in the early stages of a full sus build. meaning that I really want to build my own full sus and haven't thought much beyond that.

    I know there are no ramifications of duplicating something for your own use.

    does anyone know how much a design needs changed before it is not a patent infringement? I'm not interested in paying someone for the rights to use their design like some custom builders do.

    sorry if this is something that comes up every other week. Thanks in advance!
    count your blessings

  2. #2
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    Patent infringement/non infringement when it comes to moving a pivot a few mm this way or that is a really grey area and the folks with the deep pockets and lawyers will win those battles, so if you want to sell stuff, I'd stay pretty far away from anything patent protected OR contact the patent holder and pay the licensing fee.

    -Walt
    Waltworks Custom Bicycles
    Park City, UT USA
    www.waltworks.com
    waltworks.blogspot.com

  3. #3
    Randomhead
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    do you know you will be violating patents? Patents are written to be as confusing as possible. It's amazing what people will throw in there and then in the claims it will be some stupid thing that that is actually protected. I helped some students with a project, and they were stumped on the patent question. There were 1800 patents with the name of the object they were building in the title. They found the ones that were like what they wanted to make, and their idea wasn't covered in the claims, so there was no problem.

    In the U.S., personal use still requires a license. I know that's trivia, but I suppose if somehow manage to get noticed it could be a bad thing.

  4. #4
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    Are these design or utility patents?
    NOTHING WORKS LIKE CLOCKWORK

    www.clockworkbikes.com

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clockwork Bikes View Post
    Are these design or utility patents?
    I'm not sure of the difference.
    count your blessings

  6. #6
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    Waltworks Custom Bicycles
    Park City, UT USA
    www.waltworks.com
    waltworks.blogspot.com

  7. #7
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    You want to be very careful if you think you are going to infringe on a patent esp. if you plan on selling the frames. That's the warning sign right there. Then you need to decide if you, or the company you may infringe on, have the most money to spend on lawyers. Your best bet, in the first instance, is to take advice through a patent search and then go from there. The other alternative is to come up with your own design r is that a bit obvious.

    Remember Stratos suspension???

  8. #8
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    Give the frame away for free with a very expensive add on

  9. #9
    will rant for food
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    So, a take away here, if I'm not selling anything, "Who gives a sh!t and just build it" ?
    Latitude: 44.93 N

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Diller View Post
    So, a take away here, if I'm not selling anything, "Who gives a sh!t and just build it" ?
    not too many people will waste their time coming after you if you build a one-off for personal use. What, is DW going to write you a cease and desist letter while you're out plunking around?

    That being said, you can do some pretty amazing things with designs that are not or cannot be patented. A single pivot cannondale rush has the identical anti-squat curve as compared to a DW turner flux, according to linkage. So, pair a single pivot with a nice rising rate linkage, and you have all the fun with none of the mess.

  11. #11
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    Good job!

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Diller View Post
    So, a take away here, if I'm not selling anything, "Who gives a sh!t and just build it" ?
    There have been cases where in the USA patent wont pass muster outside the country
    The system has become a legal moneymaker in its entirity, a lot of what has been patented just needs to be financially argued over in court, unless the military decide thats ours ......There are also processes used in utility patents which inside the USA can be successfully applied for in a particular area whereas in the UK the clerk would point out your wasting your money even trying

    As most court cases go for loss of revenue in Europe at least thats a much bigger issue than the side issue of reputation ,a lot of the time the copy or clone looks aesthetically more pleasing than the original and has substantially better development gone into it, second to market so more time to improve ,of course if they fail to win the legal battle the originator can take all the tweaks of the second company for free

    This happens with what are called pattern parts (rather than aftermarket) where a manufacturer often finds that a part which fails in service can be copied to some degree and enhanced for example features which eliminate the failure say cracking or wear resistance,this could be as simple as an inrcrease in wall thickness and is often cheaper than the OE part and from a less reputable (subjective)company

    One day some guy is going to say who gives a **** ....

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