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  1. #1
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    Tubless fat tire

    Pros and Cons. Please weigh in your opinion.

  2. #2
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    More supple, less puncture flats, can run lower psi without pinch flats, less rolling weight, less $ on tubes.

    The only con I can think of is not being able to swap tires quickly.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazlow View Post
    Pros and Cons. Please weigh in your opinion.
    the search feature will reveal numerous threads with all the necessary info.
    "ORANGE IS THE NEW BLACK"

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    The search feature (more like "search failure!") is difficult to use well for me.

    Depending on your fatty tubeless setup/scheme.......less rolling weight is not an attribute of most tubeless fatty setups. FYI IMho FWIW YMMV LOL

    Less rolling resistance than tubes IS an attribute of tubeless> (though I am not sure we have quantified the data) (search function for that???) .

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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    The search feature (more like "search failure!") is difficult to use well for me.
    I find that it's much easier to type in "use the search feature" and add to my post count, than it is to actually be useful in a post.

    I'm also looking for a truly compelling reason to try tubeless, and I've yet to see it, plus I'm now subscribed without having to use that painful Subscribe to This Thread button.
    Riding Fat and still just as fast as I never was.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiniTrail View Post
    I read that all the cool guys do it
    have you had a eye exam as of late??
    "ORANGE IS THE NEW BLACK"

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiniTrail View Post
    Actually, I subscribe to these to watch you spar with the cool guys

    OP look for ozzybmx's thread on the subject. Good post
    mums the word..........ozzy's is a good read though.
    "ORANGE IS THE NEW BLACK"

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raul34 View Post
    More supple, less puncture flats, can run lower psi without pinch flats, less rolling weight, less $ on tubes.

    The only con I can think of is not being able to swap tires quickly.
    But how much is spent on sealant and tape?
    Riding Fat and still just as fast as I never was.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by crashtestdummy View Post
    But how much is spent on sealant and tape?
    not only that but the PSI is identical along with weight. and what do tubeless folks do when they do flat due to a puncture? install a toob.
    "ORANGE IS THE NEW BLACK"

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvphatty View Post
    not only that but the PSI is identical along with weight. and what do tubeless folks do when they do flat due to a puncture? install a toob.
    Nope.. Lower pressure with tubeless, half a pound lighter and IF I get a flat dunno, never happened but might just use stans and pump..

  11. #11
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    You know what helps make the search function work better? Spelling the most important word in your post title correctly. Hmph.

    I've been mountain biking for 25 years, fatbiking for almost 3, have a fleet of bikes, do my own builds and repairs and I've never run tubeless, ever. Always been curious, but never compelled to do it.

    My biggest reason for not running them on the fatbikes us that no rims and tires are designed to be tubeless yet, and I don't trust the so-called ghetto tubeless techniques. I barely trust the tubed rim/tire products that currently exist. The QC on the tires is especially bad, with ridiculously loose or poor fitting beads, and out-of-round tires. I haven't had a tire come off at speed yet, but I've heard the tales, and they often seem to involve going tubeless.

    Also, if you flat while tubeless out in the woods, how do you get the tire seated again without using a tube? (I know, you don't) So now you have a tube. Are you really gonna swap that out when you get home? I wouldn't, cuz I'm lazy.

    I think I'll switch to tubeless when I stop seeing threads about the pros and cons of going tubeless.

  12. #12
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    Oh shit I got 10 hours community service for using bad language.

    https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=si...hrome&ie=UTF-8

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    The search feature (more like "search failure!") is difficult to use well for me.
    I typed in "fatbike tubeless" into the search box top left of the page. Result #9 from the top:

    FATTY TUBELESS Summary of methods & ACTUAL WEIGHTS?

    a little deeper was this:

    tubeless fatbike made easy

    If I was prepared to invest more than 45 seconds on this search I could find a whole bunch more useful info.

    Just saying....
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  14. #14
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    Zero flats. /thread
    And yes, gotta be part of the cool crowd to go tubeless.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    I typed in "fatbike tubeless" into the search box top left of the page. Result #9 from the top:
    Is that like 'tire' and 'tyre'?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeddyTS View Post
    Nope.. Lower pressure with tubeless, half a pound lighter and IF I get a flat dunno, never happened but might just use stans and pump..
    nope in either case sorry. Toobs can go down to 3psi with no problem and weigh the same or less. and if ya go any lower it's flat end of story so ya might as well huck it.
    "ORANGE IS THE NEW BLACK"

  17. #17
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    Small puncture resistance and weight saving are the 2 major reasons, I read about lower pressures but my findings were opposite, I don't need the super low pressures so rim hits are a non event for me. If anything the more supple casing with tubeless got me pumping 0.5-1psi more in the big-ole-bags.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by crashtestdummy View Post
    But how much is spent on sealant and tape?
    Nevermind the cash, the time spent on my 5 attempts (2 sets of wheels) before I got it right blew the cost out of the water by 100:1

    Once dialled its a relatively painless process.... kinda
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvphatty View Post
    nope in either case sorry. Toobs can go down to 3psi with no problem and weigh the same or less. and if ya go any lower it's flat end of story so ya might as well huck it.
    I can't, the tyres start to slip on the rim.. so depends of the rim-tyre combo how down one can go. With tubeles no such issue..

  20. #20
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    I'm tubeless on my fat bike and mountain bike because I'm lazy. It's easier to put in two scoops of sealant than fuss with a tube. I really hate interupting a ride to change a tube on a ride because of a pinprick puncture that sealant can handle with no problem.

  21. #21
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    Has anyone tried sealant in a tube? Any specific product recommendations?

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    My primary reason for running my BFLs tubeless is the same reason that all my MTBs are tubeless- the tires conform to the terrain a lot better without tubes. The difference in traction and ride quality is even more noticeable on the 4.7 BFLs than on a standard 2.35 MTB tire.

    I use Fatback Uma 90 rims, which have a bead locking ridge for running tubeless. The BFLs pop onto the bead tightly, just like a Stans rim, and I have had zero burps since converting. All they require are sealant, tape, and a valve, just like a Stans rim.

    A lot of the "tubeless doesn't work with fat tires" talk comes from people having limited success with ghetto conversions (split tube, foam strips, ect.) on rims that were not designed for tubeless use.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raul34 View Post
    More supple, less puncture flats, can run lower psi without pinch flats, less rolling weight, less $ on tubes.

    The only con I can think of is not being able to swap tires quickly.
    I don't understand why running tubeless makes swapping tires any more difficult.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvphatty View Post
    the search feature will reveal numerous threads with all the necessary info.
    It will also reveal your disdain for tubeless. As someone else has asked, why do you even read threads about tubeless if you are so opposed to it?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by crashtestdummy View Post
    But how much is spent on sealant and tape?
    About $40 A small fraction of what I spend on my biking sport and it makes it more enjoyable because I don't deal with flats, ever.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvphatty View Post
    not only that but the PSI is identical along with weight. and what do tubeless folks do when they do flat due to a puncture? install a toob.
    NOT. This event is so rare it isn't worth being prepared for it no further than most ride from civilization. But the tire can be patched just like a tube. My most recent 1/2" wide puncture has sealed just fine and I've been riding on it all summer.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvphatty View Post
    nope in either case sorry. Toobs can go down to 3psi with no problem and weigh the same or less. and if ya go any lower it's flat end of story so ya might as well huck it.
    This is totally WRONG. 3psi will pinch a tube very easily. During the winter, 3-4 psi is generally my high, with 1-2 psi when the snow is difficult. The tire isn't flat but it does have a lot more surface area.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    NOT. This event is so rare it isn't worth being prepared for it no further than most ride from civilization. But the tire can be patched just like a tube. My most recent 1/2" wide puncture has sealed just fine and I've been riding on it all summer.
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    This is totally WRONG. 3psi will pinch a tube very easily. During the winter, 3-4 psi is generally my high, with 1-2 psi when the snow is difficult. The tire isn't flat but it does have a lot more surface area.
    negative on both counts so why read these threads when you want everyone to believe as you do?? 1-2psi is flat and has nothing to be gained over 3-4psi and i challenge you to come up with a quantitative measurement between the two.
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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    About $40 A small fraction of what I spend on my biking sport and it makes it more enjoyable because I don't deal with flats, ever.
    far more than what toobs cost and time to prep with all sorts of ghetto stuff. and yes you will get flats so stop pretending ok?
    "ORANGE IS THE NEW BLACK"

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvphatty View Post
    negative on both counts so why read these threads when you want everyone to believe as you do?? 1-2psi is flat and has nothing to be gained over 3-4psi and i challenge you to come up with a quantitative measurement between the two.
    There is a large quantitative difference to be experienced when riding on snow that won't pack or climbing in fresh snow at 2 psi vs. 4 psi. You challenge me? Someone already has and in one of the previous threads I did calculate the added footprint of the different pressures. But, I'll do it again.

    As far as switching tires, which by the way, I don't do often because I like to ride my bike, not work on it, I don't see the problem. The tire comes off the exact same way. Yes, there is "slime" in the tire but it doesn't make the tire change anymore difficult. Take the tire off and pour the slime into the new tire. Mount it and air it up. Actually, it might be easier because one doesn't have to deal with a tube which for some causes problems.

  31. #31
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    Switching tyres is a pain in the a$$, it probably doesn't take much longer than swapping tubbed tyres over but there sealant everywhere and getting the tyre seated again to deal with.

    I have 2 sets of wheels, both marge lites with 183mm hope rotors and cassettes already fitted to each set, one with 4.8" buds and the other set with 4" HuDu's. So my tyres switch is dead easy.... just cost a bit to setup.
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  33. #33
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    There is no need to get sealant everywhere and if done well, putting air back in the tire isn't hard either. Mini, no, I don't switch tires very often. To me, it's a pain in rear to switch tires with or without tubes. I just don't like doing it. It's not that I can't, it's just not something I care to do. But, I have, and do. Yes, there will be some sealant that gets on the rim. Use a rag and wipe it off. You can't change tires without washing your hands anyways.

  34. #34
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    No one is winning this argument. Do whatever suits you.

  35. #35
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    gcappy, you are correct, but we do it so MiniTrail has something to read. (see post #8)

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    I can't believe every question turns into an argument lately. Oh we'll, as long as I know my way is correct!!!

  37. #37
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    I have yet to experience any downside to going tubeless. I documented the steps I took here:

    Tubeless Fatbike Conversion | Cycles In Life

    Tubless fat tire-img_0485s.jpg

  38. #38
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    CUJarrett, in the first few paragraphs of your description you mention that "...there are no dedicated tubeless wheels...".

    This is incorrect.

    Speedway Cycles, the designer/builder of the FATBACK frame and forks have their "UMA" series of rims. They go tubeless just like a Stan's rim. Just use Stans "wide tape" and sealant and air them up.

    It was mentioned earlier in this thread. It is a fact.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    CUJarrett, in the first few paragraphs of your description you mention that "...there are no dedicated tubeless wheels...".

    This is incorrect.

    Speedway Cycles, the designer/builder of the FATBACK frame and forks have their "UMA" series of rims. They go tubeless just like a Stan's rim. Just use Stans "wide tape" and sealant and air them up.

    It was mentioned earlier in this thread. It is a fact.
    I don't want to get into an e-argument, but I believe we are saying two different things. I believe Fatback/ Speedway rims can be made to work tubeless, as I have proven so can Surly Rolling Daryls, however neither website advertises they are tubeless rims.

    I verified this on Fatback and Speedway's sites.
    FATBACK Ľ 90mm Rims

    The closest thing to advertising the rims as tubeless is:
    "Secure bead lock holds tire tight even at low pressures", which is not the same thing as saying "tubeless ready".

    Overall I believe we are all winners as we as a community have proven that there are working solutions!

    Thanks for the feedback man!

  40. #40
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    Note to others...

    Don't Google "uma rims"
    I see hills.

    I want to climb them.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevob View Post
    Note to others...

    Don't Google "uma rims"
    Had to try

  42. #42
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    The curiosity is too much.

    After you search it and read about Uma doing some rimming.... click on the IMAGE button at the top, its all clean and many wheel pics.
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  43. #43
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    CUjarret......peace brother!......but.....

    Arguments over semantics aside, I brought this out because your article could have mentioned the Fatback Speedway UMA as the viable tubeless solution it presents due to it's performance-similarity to a Stans Tubeless rim.

    UMA rims.

    Stan's rims.


    Stan's..........Stans-tape the spoke bed, throw on a tire with sealant, and blow.

    Speedway/Fatback UMA........Stans-FAT-tape the spoke bed, throw on a FAT-tire w/ FAT-sealant and blow.



    I hope that doesn't sound argumentative. It is a fact.

    also, others'........for realities-sake, let us not think that tubeless options save any weight over available inner-tube options.

    Peace! D

  44. #44
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    gcappy, the other reason for me to enter into these discussions is so that I can get negative reputation from nvphatty. Maybe he's spread it around enough to do so again.

  45. #45
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    So.. is there a consensus that UMA rims are better suited to being set up tubeless than say Surley rims for example?

  46. #46
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    mtuck1.......I don't want to be the guy to tell you to go "do your homework"...or "...did you try to use the 'search function', dude?..." because I've been hasssled and told those things.

    But......there is a ton of info. of guys doing UMA's tubeless. There is a "Stan's Fat Tape" that is for doing UMA's.

    I'll wait for the rest of the "consensus-ers"...

    PS, I do not run tubeless....but......when running less than 4 PSI on 80mm rims with HuskerDu's and tubes I am hearing alot of squishing/squeaking/stretching-rubbery noises from my tires and I suspect it to be tube versus tire relative movement. There is no question that it is annoying and maybe even causing me to spend more energy to keep them rolling

  47. #47
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    No worries... I am currently running tubes in Marge Lites but there is a tubeless method in another thread that simply uses a Clown Shoe rim strip to seal the Marge Lite and that seems very simple and light (compared to tubes). But I am also considering a set of UMA's as a second wheel set. Not sure which makes the most sense at this point.

  48. #48
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    Has anyone got a good photo of the UMA rim profile? Especially the bead seat.
    I see hills.

    I want to climb them.

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    Stevo, inquire into shipping them here (maybe its changed). The Price of shipping a set of UMA rims to oz would near buy you a set of Marge lites from Jensons and ship for $28.
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  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    also, others'........for realities-sake, let us not think that tubeless options save any weight over available inner-tube options.
    What kind of statement is this ^^^^
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  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevob View Post
    Note to others...

    Don't Google "uma rims"
    So I watched one of those Uma rim videos. That guy was definitely going tubeless and the "sealant" went all over the place. Someone mentioned that it was a messy process. Boy, they were right.

  52. #52
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    Tubless fat tire

    Messy, not always...but I try to keep the process outside. So far, a full year on tubeless, with two sets of tires, I haven't had a flat to speak of. Meanwhile, I have sold two of my 3 toobs to my fat riding toobed friend, as he flats with them...so $20 up for me.

    I think the ride is way better, minimal weight savings, no flats, cool factor...all benefits. The only con that I see is that the controversy is brought up time and time again on here.

    If you are having a hard time setting them up...try harder. I gets easier.

    I am going to try to make a fat tubular tyre next time I set mine up, should make tyre swaps easier. I'll post it.

    There was some other stupid statement made about toobless that I was going to argue with, but I can't remember what it was. Take your pick.

    Toobless is better.


    "You're like a Ferrari engine driving a dump truck"

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    CUjarret......peace brother!......but.....

    Arguments over semantics aside, I brought this out because your article could have mentioned the Fatback Speedway UMA as the viable tubeless solution it presents due to it's performance-similarity to a Stans Tubeless rim.

    UMA rims.

    Stan's rims.


    Stan's..........Stans-tape the spoke bed, throw on a tire with sealant, and blow.

    Speedway/Fatback UMA........Stans-FAT-tape the spoke bed, throw on a FAT-tire w/ FAT-sealant and blow.



    I hope that doesn't sound argumentative. It is a fact.

    also, others'........for realities-sake, let us not think that tubeless options save any weight over available inner-tube options.

    Peace! D
    Again, I am not saying they don't or have not historically worked as a tubeless solution. I am however saying that they are not advertised by the manufacturer as a tubeless solution.

  54. #54
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    A war is coming, pick a side!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    What kind of statement is this ^^^^
    Some have claimed that tubeless is lighter than tubes. Most tubeless methods are heavier than inner tubes.

    Was that statement non-sensical? I apologize! D

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    Quote Originally Posted by OFFcourse View Post
    A war is coming, pick a side!
    That's pretty funny I'll stop now.

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    Some have claimed that tubeless is lighter than tubes. Most tubeless methods are heavier than inner tubes.

    Was that statement non-sensical? I apologize! D
    Wheres you proof ? I have a document, weighed and pictured thread here with the weight saving explained. You have just made an unsubstantiated bullsh1t statement based on your fumbling effort to go tubeless... which if anyone pays attention to, discredits everything 'we' who have spent a bit of time and thought going tubeless with well thought out tape, foam and rimstrips.

    Theres now 6 of us in SA (South Oz) with ~25lb Ti Fatbikes and without the tubeless conversion the bikes sit up near ~26.5lb.
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  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    Stevo, inquire into shipping them here (maybe its changed). The Price of shipping a set of UMA rims to oz would near buy you a set of Marge lites from Jensons and ship for $28.
    Ouch

    hang on, so prices are comparable...which way would you go? You got the ML right?
    I see hills.

    I want to climb them.

  59. #59
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    On my non-fat bike, weight isn't an issue. Definitely lighter when tubeless. Thorns are an issue however. Before I went tubeless, I once had three punctures in a night's ride (and each stop I was swarmed with mosquitoes). Tubeless wins every which way in my book. Weight loss is only a bonus compared to every other benefit.
    I see hills.

    I want to climb them.

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevob View Post

    hang on, so prices are comparable...which way would you go? You got the ML right?
    I have 2 sets of Magelites now, i wanted a set of 70mm Uma and priced up getting them sent here, cant remember exactly but it was approx $200, then $360 for the rims... with the exchange rate now thats over $600. I like the look of the UMA's, lovvin them square holes.
    Jensons will pricematch the cheapest Margelite price and ship them here for $28.... it works out less than half the price, The marges are lighter too and hold a tyre beautifully at 3psi on extended soft sand rides.
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  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevob View Post
    On my non-fat bike, weight isn't an issue. Definitely lighter when tubeless. Thorns are an issue however. Before I went tubeless, I once had three punctures in a night's ride (and each stop I was swarmed with mosquitoes). Tubeless wins every which way in my book. Weight loss is only a bonus compared to every other benefit.
    Same here, its 100% puncture proofing why im tubeless on all my bikes, including my CX.

    The weight loss side effect with fatbikes needs also be taken advantage of as you can build the lightest bike out of super blinged up components but it doesnt help the fact we are rolling (at the lightest) 600g rims and 1250g tyres with heavy tubes and rimstrips... anything that can be saved off this rolling weight is a bonus.
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  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    I have 2 sets of Magelites now, i wanted a set of 70mm Uma and priced up getting them sent here, cant remember exactly but it was approx $200, then $360 for the rims... with the exchange rate now thats over $600. I like the look of the UMA's, lovvin them square holes.
    Jensons will pricematch the cheapest Margelite price and ship them here for $28.... it works out less than half the price, The marges are lighter too and hold a tyre beautifully at 3psi on extended soft sand rides.
    Cool. Thanks for that. Still can't see myself affording anything other than the On-One Fatty rolling bundle, which includes wheels. Nice to know that info for the future though.
    I see hills.

    I want to climb them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post

    PS, I do not run tubeless....but......when running less than 4 PSI on 80mm rims with HuskerDu's and tubes I am hearing alot of squishing/squeaking/stretching-rubbery noises from my tires and I suspect it to be tube versus tire relative movement. There is no question that it is annoying and maybe even causing me to spend more energy to keep them rolling
    That's the primary reason I switched over. The tires conform to the terrain a lot better without tubes, and the bike rides, handles, and just "feels" better. The amount of surface area in a 4.7 tire creates a lot more noticeable tire/tube friction than a standard MTB tire.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by OFFcourse View Post
    A war is coming, pick a side!
    Sweet, those of us that are tubeless will just take them through a bunch of cactus and will ride off into the sunset while those with tubes will be patching tubes.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    . You have just made an unsubstantiated bullsh1t statement based on your fumbling effort to go tubeless... .
    You have quite a harsh tone OZZ. Is that what you meant?

    Sure, we're on the internet and all I can use to ascertain your attitude is the words, but I think you meant to be harsh. It is totally uncool and not necessary!

    Relax!

    I said "...most tubeless methods are heavier than inner tubes...".

    The inner tubes I have been using (in the snow, and occasionally sand and singletrack dirt, in Alaska, bought from a local Anchorage bike shop) weigh between 8 and 9 ounces, with rimstrips that weigh less than an ounce.

    I'll go searching for your tubeless method, 'cuz I wanna know how to do it your way. Would you mind providing a link?

    Are we cool? or What?!

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    Andy, thanks for the confirmation!

    Alphazz, I was thinking it was a war of words and semantics.

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    Even my ghetto tubeless is lighter than a standard Surly tube (one Q-Tube, 24"x2.25" split down the middle. After the tire install and a few squirts of Stans trim off the excess tube on the sides, about 1/2" each side). Plus all the other benefits that go with it. I have not weighed one set up but all you have to do is compare the weight of the two tubes to realize there is substantial weight savings. I wouldn't care if it didn't save weight.

  68. #68
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    Tubless fat tire

    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    You have quite a harsh tone OZZ. Is that what you meant?

    Sure, we're on the internet and all I can use to ascertain your attitude is the words, but I think you meant to be harsh. It is totally uncool and not necessary!

    Relax!

    I said "...most tubeless methods are heavier than inner tubes...".

    The inner tubes I have been using (in the snow, and occasionally sand and singletrack dirt, in Alaska, bought from a local Anchorage bike shop) weigh between 8 and 9 ounces, with rimstrips that weigh less than an ounce.

    I'll go searching for your tubeless method, 'cuz I wanna know how to do it your way. Would you mind providing a link?

    Are we cool? or What?!
    I would also assume that he meant toobless to be lighter than a surly toob, which is what MOST people would be using, even though it's a boat anchor.

  69. #69
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    Tubless fat tire


  70. #70
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    OzzyBMX's Tubeless Tuesday thread: Tubeless Tuesday.

    Documented tubeless at 170 grams, with 2 scoops of Stan's sealant.

  71. #71
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    Seems the key to Ozz's weight savings and also, his success, is the use of a tape that appears to be the same stuff as the Stan's tape, in a width suitable for fat-tires.

    Also, Ozz used 2 scoops of Stan's sealant in his "...-Tuesday..." thread.

    Most other tubeless methods other than UMA's use gorilla tape which is HEAVY. Many other methods use 3 scoops of sealant. I suppose it is in the details as to why OZZ's method works, and works well!

    tubeless is in my future this coming Alaskan winter, for sure. And no it is not about the weight savings.

  72. #72
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    E6roller - I am still anxiously waiting for your tubeless ready carbon rims. Any word on progress?

  73. #73
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    aha

  74. #74
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    I have been on the uma 90's for over a year tubeless. Just one w
    rap of Stans fat tape and two scoops of sealant. Not sure on weight but I really like the way it rides at lower pressure and more compliant. They are pretty easy to switch as well maybe not as easy as with tubes but just put one bead on, pour in 2 cups of stans, install second bead, spray with a little ether, Light with long handle lighter (very important), put out any fire (also very important), pump up, and done. The tire also gets a little bigger when set up tubeless.
    Last edited by bdundee; 09-03-2013 at 06:40 AM.

  75. #75
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    Yeah all cool
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  76. #76
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    So after reading through this thread this morning, I've come to this conclusion...

    It's rad to go tubeless, but it's also awesome to ride with tubes in.

    Sweet.

  77. #77
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    When I first heard about tubeless fat....I thought it was cool if it worked, but why bother?

    After getting out where less than 4 psi was necessary to stay on the bike rather than push it in soft snow conditions.....I realized that I was probably wasting energy because the tube and tire were moving around relative to each other......this realization came from the noises in my tires, and the visual "curdling", or "wrinkling" of the tire sidewalls.

    ........this is the reason for my current interest in tubeless. Nothing to do with punctures, or "feel", or weight. It's about noise and energy wastage.

    I would like to see this quantified, rather than my subjective "feeling" about it. Anyone???

  78. #78
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    Tubless fat tire

    The creasing and wrinkling sidewalls doesn't go away when toobless...so mark that one off of you list.


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    I was running nice, lightweight 29er tubes---knocked a lot of weight off the bike even if the tires hooked up a bit strangely.

    Rode a long WA state Beach ride and hit the dunes....little teensy weensy grass tips poked through my Larry and Endo...patched the tubes...kept riding...flat again...changed the tube...flat again....walked miles back to the car...

    Went tubeless the next day. Haven't had a single flat since...barnacles, grass, glass, thorns, nails, angry crabs, pissed off seagulls, kids with bb guns....no flats.

    And my split tube set up is heavier--and I still won't go back.

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunttofu View Post
    Went tubeless the next day. Haven't had a single flat since...barnacles, grass, glass, thorns, nails, angry crabs, pissed off seagulls, kids with bb guns....no flats.
    You forgot oyster shells but not to worry they don't give you flats, they cut your stomach open so your entrails spill out.

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schott View Post
    The creasing and wrinkling sidewalls doesn't go away when toobless...so mark that one off of you list.
    But the friction between the tire and the tube in those crinkles does go away, which is nice.

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    "there is a tubeless method in another thread that simply uses a Clown Shoe rim strip to seal the Marge Lite and that seems very simple and light"

    I just did this method and it worked GREAT.

  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobkorn View Post
    "there is a tubeless method in another thread that simply uses a Clown Shoe rim strip to seal the Marge Lite and that seems very simple and light"

    I just did this method and it worked GREAT.
    Did you use any tape under or on top of the rim strip?

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    Quote Originally Posted by OFFcourse View Post
    Did you use any tape under or on top of the rim strip?
    No, just the rim strip.

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    Re: Tubless fat tire

    I've been reluctant to try toobless on my clown shoes as it seems like it is just going to be difficult... even though I have loved it on my 29ers. But think I'm going to have to start looking into those tubeless clown shoe methods... damn random flat tire today. Not sure what I even got into as it was a really slow leak.
    ...Be careful what you're looking at because it might be looking back...

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by duggus View Post
    I've been reluctant to try toobless on my clown shoes as it seems like it is just going to be difficult... even though I have loved it on my 29ers. But think I'm going to have to start looking into those tubeless clown shoe methods... damn random flat tire today. Not sure what I even got into as it was a really slow leak.
    I tried the foam and tape and all that stuff on BFL's and Clownshoes. The bead area is just not there on the Clownshoe. Every thing I tried the tire just blew off the rim when I rode it. I went back to tubes. When my wife took over my bike I wanted tires with more grip for her so I put a set of NATES on it. Thats when I tried the split tube method on the Clownshoe. It worked like a dream and was simple to set up. I have been changing pressure on them from 4-12 and they perform flawlessly. I used Q-Tubes, 24X2.75 presta removable core tubes. No leaks, No drips, No flats!

  87. #87
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    Wow, I've ridden a lot of miles with the BFL/Clownshoe combination tubeless this summer. I pushed a stick through the rear tire early in the summer and it took a little while to seal, leaking out of the star shaped hole for days, but it eventually sealed and has been good ever since.

  88. #88
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    Another Clown Shoe rider with split tubes (I used Schwalbe AV10D) with zero problems with leakage, burps or rim blows at any pressure. And I've even tried going below my digital meter readings (less than 2 psi), running virtually on the wheels with a huge pancake of a footprint from the tire.

    Definitely not going back to tubes: Surly are too heavy and SV17F wouldn't stretch to fill a BFL or Bud/Lou on CS rims at low enough pressures for me.

  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    Wow, I've ridden a lot of miles with the BFL/Clownshoe combination tubeless this summer. I pushed a stick through the rear tire early in the summer and it took a little while to seal, leaking out of the star shaped hole for days, but it eventually sealed and has been good ever since.
    Not saying the BFL's wouldn't have worked with the split tube method. I did not try it. I just went directly to the NATE's because they were better traction for my wife.

  90. #90
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    Re: Tubless fat tire

    Yeah I'm not sure what I want to try first.. good and bad comments from both sides with split tube or build up/gorilla tape methods. I might go gorilla tape because I don't really want tube sticking out the side. At the same time I'd rather do what is easiest and works best. Better read more into it while at work tomorrow
    ...Be careful what you're looking at because it might be looking back...

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by duggus View Post
    Yeah I'm not sure what I want to try first.. good and bad comments from both sides with split tube or build up/gorilla tape methods. I might go gorilla tape because I don't really want tube sticking out the side. At the same time I'd rather do what is easiest and works best. Better read more into it while at work tomorrow
    No tube sticking out. When your finished with the instal you trim the excess off with a razor knife, very carefully! You can't see mine at all.

  92. #92
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    Re: Tubless fat tire

    Quote Originally Posted by gcappy View Post
    No tube sticking out. When your finished with the instal you trim the excess off with a razor knife, very carefully! You can't see mine at all.
    Have you ever had the tube pull back inside at low pressure since its cut so close? I suppose that is pretty rare though.
    ...Be careful what you're looking at because it might be looking back...

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by duggus View Post
    Have you ever had the tube pull back inside at low pressure since its cut so close? I suppose that is pretty rare though.
    I keep checking but so far no. I have them down to 4 psi regularly and we are riding a course with nothing but baby heads and loose gravel.

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    I've been looking at this thread for a while, and I don't think I've found my answer. My apology if this has been asked and answered already. There have been references to Stan's fatbike tape (90mm). I can't seem to find it anywhere. Is this product still made? Most are using gorilla tape instead of Stans. Anyone know the weight difference? I'm not gunning for massive weight differences.

  95. #95
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    I left the split tube untrimmed on the outside of the tire and rim. The seated tire pushes the split tube against the rim so it's actually laying quite flat against the tire instead of flapping about. Barely noticeable and makes for an easy tire installation.

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailblazer29er View Post
    I've been looking at this thread for a while, and I don't think I've found my answer. My apology if this has been asked and answered already. There have been references to Stan's fatbike tape (90mm). I can't seem to find it anywhere. Is this product still made? Most are using gorilla tape instead of Stans. Anyone know the weight difference? I'm not gunning for massive weight differences.
    Fatback bikes in AK is the only place that has it that I know of. They do have a few retailers around you could possible call. As far as weight you can easily figure out the Stans weight (roughly) but I have no clue on the Gorilla Tape but I would guess its quite a bit hard heavier. And as far as changing tubeless tires I would guess it takes me about 1-2 minutes longer than tubed tires.

  97. #97
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    3 wraps of 8898 packing tape is about 10-15g, 1 wrap with overlap of thick'n'wide gorilla is approx ~60g if I remember correctly. The difference is massive and the 8898 leaves no sticky residue.

    8898 is basically stans tape, some say its thinner but I have never used a vernier on it to check as I no longer own any wheels with stans tape fitted.

    If you live in the US it can be bought from RS Hughes online in many different thicknesses.
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  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saul Lumikko View Post
    I left the split tube untrimmed on the outside of the tire and rim. The seated tire pushes the split tube against the rim so it's actually laying quite flat against the tire instead of flapping about. Barely noticeable and makes for an easy tire installation.
    I only cut the excess of after the tire is installed and inflated to the highest pressure I would ever use. Thus the split tube is stretched as far as it will ever be when cutting the excess off.

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    Day 1: Fail

    So I stopped at the hardware store and got some gorilla tape to try that method... as it is what I am most familiar with. I got some foam as well. I thought I had it wrapped pretty well and was surprised that the tire popped right onto the bead with no fuss whatsoever. Had some little bubbling out the side and did the stans shake many many times. I also noticed I had a couple bubbles coming from some of the rim cut outs. It seemed to all eventually seal up, but this morning: flat. Boo.

    Round 2 tonight... otherwise I'm going to split tube.

    Tubless fat tire-1.jpgTubless fat tire-2.jpgTubless fat tire-3.jpgTubless fat tire-4.jpg
    ...Be careful what you're looking at because it might be looking back...

  100. #100
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    My experience exactly with the G-tape method. I wondered if maybe using the 6" wide tape would help.

    Ended up using the split tube method and the tires held air all summer...

    Rather than use a foam buildup to help the tire seat, I just used a strap around the tire and a compressor to get it to seat.

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