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  1. #1
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    Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Salsa seems to be expanding in many directions. They have as many Fat Bikes as regular bikes, maybe more. The one that caught my eye is the new Blackborow seen here.

    It has room for 5" tires 132mm BB shell, 76mm chainline and alternator dropouts making for a very adaptable bike.

    They even have a dinglespeed version.

    There are a few things I would do a little different but overall it looks like a nice bike.

    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-2015_blackborow_ds_profile.jpg

    What do you think?
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  2. #2
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    Call me a cynic but subtle as its inserted in the middle is an entire paragraph on the offset 132mm bb. Sounds a lot more like a distraction to get people's mind away from an ever expanding Q-factor.

    Then its said to be mated to the OD Moonie crank-- which is only for up to 100mm bb (unless there are new longer options now) .. Am I missing something?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by shoo View Post
    Salsa seems to be expanding in many directions. They have as many Fat Bikes as regular bikes, maybe more. The one that caught my eye is the new Blackborow seen here.

    It has room for 5" tires 132mm BB shell, 76mm chainline and alternator dropouts making for a very adaptable bike.

    They even have a dinglespeed version.

    There are a few things I would do a little different but overall it looks like a nice bike.


    What do you think?

    Too bad about the non-standard bottom bracket. Otherwise, it looks awesome! Well done, Salsa!
    --Peace

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by anvil_den View Post
    Then its said to be mated to the OD Moonie crank-- which is only for up to 100mm bb (unless there are new longer options now) .. Am I missing something?
    I haven't put a tape on them, but do recall, the Moonie crank makes use of two cone shaped, fairly thick spacers, one on each side. Might well be at least 32 mm of space added, if those were removed.

    That said, wider *standards* every year be it headset/steerer, BB, rear end, etc, will only serve to discourage manufacturers from jumping on board, and confuse the ever loving hell out of consumers and retailers alike.....

    Standards just aren't standard anymore.
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  5. #5
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    I'm not crazy about the extra Qfactor, but the 22" frame is promising.

  6. #6
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    I rode it yesterday. Didn't like it. The front end is wandery at low speeds and its a slug going uphill. Maybe I just don't like Bud and Lou...

  7. #7
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    Yea I understand what your saying. There is a bit of confusion even amongst Surly and Salsa. Surly list a crank for the Ice Cream Truck but they list it for a 100mm BB, I believe that is the crank you would need. I think it is a typo of sorts. I think the bike is a great alternative to the Moonlander, I think it is ugly but it should do what it is intended quite well.

    Quote Originally Posted by anvil_den View Post
    Call me a cynic but subtle as its inserted in the middle is an entire paragraph on the offset 132mm bb. Sounds a lot more like a distraction to get people's mind away from an ever expanding Q-factor.

    Then its said to be mated to the OD Moonie crank-- which is only for up to 100mm bb (unless there are new longer options now) .. Am I missing something?
    Lucky neighbor of Maryland's Patapsco Valley State Park, 39.23,-76.76 Flickr

  8. #8
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    wouldn't the BB shell difference be made up because it is Pressfit and not external cup? Seems the spindle length would end up being about the same if you move the bearings inboard.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombinate View Post
    wouldn't the BB shell difference be made up because it is Pressfit and not external cup? Seems the spindle length would end up being about the same if you move the bearings inboard.
    Yes!

    So, a wider BB shell doesn´t necessarily mean a wider Q-factor.

  10. #10
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    My understanding is a 120mm press fit is the same as a 100mm external cup. On the Blackborow and the Ice Cream Truck they are using a press fit 132mm with offset so I believe it to have a longer spindle.

    Quote Originally Posted by zombinate View Post
    wouldn't the BB shell difference be made up because it is Pressfit and not external cup? Seems the spindle length would end up being about the same if you move the bearings inboard.
    Correct. A wider shell does not necessarily mean wider Q. But in this case it may have a wider Q, the way they mount the rings can minimize the increase but I am guessing it is at least a few mm's wider than a Moonlander. Maybe someone at Saddle Drive could measure the Q factor and chime in.
    Quote Originally Posted by FlowinFlo View Post
    Yes!

    So, a wider BB shell doesn´t necessarily mean a wider Q-factor.
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  11. #11
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    76mm is more in line with the wackadoo mongoose dolomite. 69-70mm is optimal for a 190 hub running 1x?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by anvil_den View Post
    Call me a cynic but subtle as its inserted in the middle is an entire paragraph on the offset 132mm bb. Sounds a lot more like a distraction to get people's mind away from an ever expanding Q-factor.
    nope, no wider Q-factor. It's just the bearings are inside the frame now.
    Last edited by Hand/of/Midas; 07-22-2014 at 12:28 PM.

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    BD the disruptor of the industry.. forcing premium brands to "innovate" to justify the price.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shoo View Post
    My understanding is a 120mm press fit is the same as a 100mm external cup. On the Blackborow and the Ice Cream Truck they are using a press fit 132mm with offset so I believe it to have a longer spindle.



    Correct. A wider shell does not necessarily mean wider Q. But in this case it may have a wider Q, the way they mount the rings can minimize the increase but I am guessing it is at least a few mm's wider than a Moonlander. Maybe someone at Saddle Drive could measure the Q factor and chime in.
    I thought 120mm bottom brackets were introduced in conjunction with 190mm rear rub spacing. A 20mm longer spindle is needed with 190mm as compared to 170mm rear spacing. One way to do that is to use a 120mm instead of 100mm bottom bracket.

    For crank systems where the spindle is separate from the bottom bracket, when a 100mm shell is used with 190mm rear spacing, 10mm of spacers are used on each side between the bearing and crank. For this type of crankset, it is critical to get the proper spindle length. One is intended for 170mm spaced frames and the other for 190mm.

    Or perhaps I'm imagining things. But that makes sense to me.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by boogman View Post
    BD the disruptor of the industry.. forcing premium brands to "innovate" to justify the price.
    And I thought I only came up with stupid things like this to say, congrats welcome to my level.

  16. #16
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    gimme some rep pts then plz!

  17. #17
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    Big tires + thru axle + longer wheelbase + alternator. Does that spell trouble with lateral forces?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cartski View Post
    Big tires + thru axle + longer wheelbase + alternator. Does that spell trouble with lateral forces?
    Yeah trouble with a capital T, now what the h#ll are you talking about?

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    Rip down a hill and whip around a corner. Or slide into a skid. Would the longer wheelbase, tires that stick the ground while the body, gear and bike are going the other way, and rear bits that are screwed into the frame....is something going to fail?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cartski View Post
    Rip down a hill and whip around a corner. Or slide into a skid. Would the longer wheelbase, tires that stick the ground while the body, gear and bike are going the other way, and rear bits that are screwed into the frame....is something going to fail?
    You either are drunk or have no idea what you are talking about. Please step away from the interweb now and continue on with your life or whatever you call it

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cartski View Post
    Rip down a hill and whip around a corner. Or slide into a skid. Would the longer wheelbase, tires that stick the ground while the body, gear and bike are going the other way, and rear bits that are screwed into the frame....is something going to fail?
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    Say what???

  22. #22
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    Maybe he's never seen pro downhillers and what they do to bikes.

  23. #23
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    The Blackborrow looks pretty awesome - except for the funky BB. You can only use the Surly OD cranks, right?

  24. #24
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    Interesting how many models get super hyped and others fly under the radar. The Surly ICT seems to be all the rage, and the with Salsa , this model seems to be overshadowed by the carbon beargease and the new full sus offering.
    Sorry to resurect, but didnt want to create a new thread. Just surprised that I havent seen more buzz about this plus size offering.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    Interesting how many models get super hyped and others fly under the radar. The Surly ICT seems to be all the rage, and the with Salsa , this model seems to be overshadowed by the carbon beargease and the new full sus offering.
    Sorry to resurect, but didnt want to create a new thread. Just surprised that I havent seen more buzz about this plus size offering.
    You probably will start seeing more about this bike here soon. They are due to hit bike shops, (geared ones, anyway), by the end of this month. The Dinglespeed version isn't coming until sometime in December.

    I've seen a few Facebook posts of QBP employees. Salsa employees, and a couple select dealers that are out riding some pre-production samples. I have a Blackborow DS on order, so I am maybe a bit more on the lookout for info than others, but there is a bit of excitement about this bike out there if you look hard enough.

    This bike and the aluminum Beargrease are the "sleepers" in Salsa's line up, in my opinion.
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  26. #26
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    FWIW, I think the push to gain maximum standover on fat bikes is overrated for most applications. Myself, I wouldn't trade too much storage space for marginal clearance gains.
    Last edited by frozenmonkey; 01-03-2015 at 08:58 AM. Reason: didn't know what the hell i was talking about

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guitar Ted View Post
    You probably will start seeing more about this bike here soon. They are due to hit bike shops, (geared ones, anyway), by the end of this month. The Dinglespeed version isn't coming until sometime in December.

    I've seen a few Facebook posts of QBP employees. Salsa employees, and a couple select dealers that are out riding some pre-production samples. I have a Blackborow DS on order, so I am maybe a bit more on the lookout for info than others, but there is a bit of excitement about this bike out there if you look hard enough.

    This bike and the aluminum Beargrease are the "sleepers" in Salsa's line up, in my opinion.
    ^Ditto. Right now, the Blackborow is at the top of my list... it pretty much covers all the base's and ready to move ahead into the future... as far as floatation riding go's anyway. Best potential I've seen yet for "one bike does it all" alternate set-ups!

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    Rather than the DS, I wish they had a cheaper option with 4"/80mm wheel package. Give it the same package as the Muk 3 for the same price.

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    Except the bike was designed around 5" tires.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by frozenmonkey View Post
    Except the bike was designed around 5" tires.
    No kidding.

    Yeah, well, the percentage of the time I would want to run 5" tires is small compared to the percentage of time I would run 4" tires. Having the versatility to do so is great.

    Tire capacity isn't the only thing good about the Blackborow. Thru axles both ends, Bluto compliant front hub, and the geometry are the other reasons this frame is good besides running 5". I think it would be a good way to lower the price point as well.

    17.3" chainstay length at the shortest setting is awesome. The Farley is the only other production bike that is that short and it fits 4" max.

    My point is that this is a great frame regardless of tire capacity, and I would choose it over others for those reasons.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Train View Post
    No kidding.

    Yeah, well, the percentage of the time I would want to run 5" tires is small compared to the percentage of time I would run 4" tires. Having the versatility to do so is great.

    Tire capacity isn't the only thing good about the Blackborow. Thru axles both ends, Bluto compliant front hub, and the geometry are the other reasons this frame is good besides running 5". I think it would be a good way to lower the price point as well.

    17.3" chainstay length at the shortest setting is awesome. The Farley is the only other production bike that is that short and it fits 4" max.

    My point is that this is a great frame regardless of tire capacity, and I would choose it over others for those reasons.
    ^Yup! I think this one was designed, like I said, to cover all the base's. If I buy one, I'll for sure build a set of Marge Lite's or a 29+ set for all around... but I like that it comes with the high dollar 100's & Lou's included in the under $3000 price. And the low standover is an attribute to anyone who has stepped off into soft snow or sand... certainly not a "deal breaker". The high BB will also come in handy riding the rocky, "raw" desert trails we have in my area in the Summer... And the 69.5 HT seems pretty "all around" too... not too steep, not too slack... I like it!

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Train View Post
    No kidding.

    Yeah, well, the percentage of the time I would want to run 5" tires is small compared to the percentage of time I would run 4" tires. Having the versatility to do so is great.

    Tire capacity isn't the only thing good about the Blackborow. Thru axles both ends, Bluto compliant front hub, and the geometry are the other reasons this frame is good besides running 5". I think it would be a good way to lower the price point as well.

    17.3" chainstay length at the shortest setting is awesome. The Farley is the only other production bike that is that short and it fits 4" max.

    My point is that this is a great frame regardless of tire capacity, and I would choose it over others for those reasons.
    This was Salsa's foray into a purpose built 5" bike. Just sayin'. Of course the narrower wheelset wouldn't be a trade off and I would definitely be investing in a second narrower wheelset if I bought one. The glitch on the 2nd wheelset is the pricepoint on decent hubs just now that are Bluto ready. I was only interested in the DS version, and a 5" ready bike at that. The Mukluk could technically run 4.8" on 85mm, the geo is so similar, and the pricepoint is already pretty decent, so I guess if I'm Salsa I wonder if I really need to try and market an 'Ops' Blackborow.

    Versatilty, yes please.

    All the same reasons I had for being interested in it. Especially the chainstay length.

  33. #33
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    I tend to agree with your line of thinking. A bike with the capability for 5"/100mm but spec'ed with 4"/80mm wheel package is very desirable. Even with the same spec it would be worth a little more. There are many people who don't need maximum float but want room to grow as the need arises.

    Quote Originally Posted by El Train View Post
    Rather than the DS, I wish they had a cheaper option with 4"/80mm wheel package. Give it the same package as the Muk 3 for the same price.
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    My local shop here in Raleigh, NC just got in a Blackborow 1 size Large. He just got it this week and it isn't built yet. I plan to stop by once it is built up to take it for a spin.

    I asked about the DS version as it would be a nice partner for packing and beach trips instead of my carbon Beargrease. His reply was that he would never sell a DS version except to me possibly in this neck of the woods. Then again I am about the only person that seems to really ride a fat bike off road around here. A few people around with them ride on the greenways and around their farms on them.

  35. #35
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    I'm really liking the DS version but my wife would definitely divorce me!
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  36. #36
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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Uh-oh? I just received my! Blackborow DS today!!! Tire is huge. Front tire fit into a Bluto (a Mukluk that was in the shop) but will definitely rub on out of the saddle climbing. I bought a medium (18") and the weight was 31.85 lbs without pedals. Frame is awesome and can't wait to ride it.

    Sunday will be it's maiden voyage.

    I'm a single speeder at heart but have been on a carbon Beargrease for the last couple of months. Can't wait....

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    LBS has one in stock. Looks bada$$ with the big ol' tires. If the graphics on the top tube were removable I would think about it.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonshonda View Post
    LBS has one in stock. Looks bada$$ with the big ol' tires. If the graphics on the top tube were removable I would think about it.
    Interesting you say that because I was thinking that top graphic looked out of place as well. Looks like a Wal Mart bike....would look much better without
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  39. #39
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    Here's mine.....

    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-blackborow-ds.jpg

    Very impressed. It came a bit earlier than I had expected, so I have to leave in the shop till I can arrange finances, but I have tooled around on it a bit.

    My coworker and I agree- this is a well designed and fun fat bike. Well, that's what I think so far.......
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  40. #40
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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Got my pedals and grips put on so far. First ride tmw!
    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-uploadfromtaptalk1416107897383.jpg

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    I'm really digging this bike. I hope my vaya sells soon, so I can add one of these to my stable.

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    These look awesome!!! Is yours a large GT?

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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    So I took the Blackborow out for the first time today.

    I'm 5'10" on a medium and the stem seems a little short? Other than that, the bike rode awesome! The wider tires just float sooo much better than the tires on my Beargrease. The bigger tires also give some nice "suspension " as well. I'm 210 lbs and running 5psi.

    We did around 18 miles with 2k ft of climbing and the taller gear was used 50% of the time. I switched to the lower gear on the way back and was actually surprised how well it did? I did spin out but it was nice to just sit and spin up most of the climbs. Since I'm more of a masher, I'll probably switch back to the taller gear and try to get in better shape? The low gear is nice to have though...

    Here are a couple of pics from the ride.
    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-uploadfromtaptalk1416193723365.jpg
    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-uploadfromtaptalk1416193743552.jpg


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    Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    How do you switch between gears? Is the low gear enough to get through deep sand?


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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumblefish29er View Post
    How do you switch between gears? Is the low gear enough to get through deep sand?


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    You have to remove the rear wheel to change gears.

    You can motor thru deep sand awesome in either gear, just depends how steep it is?

    The whole reason I changed the gears was to climb a gnarly sand trail around here (#60) in Ft. Ord

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    Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Is that easy to do on the trail or is it more something you would typically do before going out for a ride?


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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumblefish29er View Post
    Is that easy to do on the trail or is it more something you would typically do before going out for a ride?


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    No. Very simple to do right on the trail.

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  48. #48
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    I love my dingle 29er and look forward to a dingle Blackborow!

  49. #49
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    Finally pulled the trigger and ordered the DS earlier this week. Hoping it shows up right after Thanksgiving.
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  50. #50
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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyBuckeye View Post
    Finally pulled the trigger and ordered the DS earlier this week. Hoping it shows up right after Thanksgiving.
    Awesome! I'm sure you'll like it.

    Since getting my DS, my Beargrease has only been ridden once. The bigger tires are great imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by floorguy724 View Post
    Awesome! I'm sure you'll like it.

    Since getting my DS, my Beargrease has only been ridden once. The bigger tires are great imo.
    Can you elaborate on how it rides and handles compared to the Beargrease? I have a 2014 Beargrease and have been considering adding a Blackborow DS but am not sure how different they will ride other than more float.

  52. #52
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    Salsa Demo vehicle rolls through my area tomorrow, will be taking one of these out for a ride for sure (along with Muk 2, Beargrease, and Bucksaw as well)!
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  53. #53
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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by keifla123 View Post
    Can you elaborate on how it rides and handles compared to the Beargrease? I have a 2014 Beargrease and have been considering adding a Blackborow DS but am not sure how different they will ride other than more float.
    The DS tracks better, has more suspension, and has better traction imo. All this due to the bigger tires imo...

    Also, I ordered a medium DS and wish I would've bought a large since the medium feels a little too small for my likings. I can always put a longer stem, but I'd rather have the longer top tube. I'm 5'10" with a 32" inseam so I'm right in the middle.

    The dual gear options are awesome! I'm embarrassed to say, but neither my lbs or myself even thought about the 2 gear options even though the name is totally obvious lol! I use the taller gear for the flatter stuff, then switch to the lower gear for steeper stuff. With the lower gear I can pretty much sit and spin up the steep stuff and it has proven to be a very useful gear. Changing between the 2 gears literally takes about 1-2 minutes. With the rear axle I haven't had any kind of brake pad rub in between changes, which I absolute hate!

    Since riding my Beargrease, it feels faster, stiffer, and lighter compared to the DS. I can honestly say that the DS is more fun to ride.

  54. #54
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    A few pics from a stock build at my L to the B to the S....










  55. #55
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    Awesome build man. My lbs has the same bike in a large and it felt great.

    Enjoy.

  56. #56
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    Wow, Lou, Lou!!

  57. #57
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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by gcappy View Post
    Wow, Lou, Lou!!
    Yup! I also have 2 - Lou ' s and am very impressed with them! I'm 210lbs and currently run 5lbs and it's perfect for my style of riding.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by floorguy724 View Post
    Yup! I also have 2 - Lou ' s and am very impressed with them! I'm 210lbs and currently run 5lbs and it's perfect for my style of riding.
    Are you mostly on sand where you ride, or are you riding rocky trails as well with the Lou/Lou? I am ready to either get the frame and do my own build, or the geared version. Not sure about the 5" for general trail usage, and with the Blackborow 1 that would mean also purchasing a 65mm wheelset...

  59. #59
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    Re: Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by the_eleven View Post
    Are you mostly on sand where you ride, or are you riding rocky trails as well with the Lou/Lou? I am ready to either get the frame and do my own build, or the geared version. Not sure about the 5" for general trail usage, and with the Blackborow 1 that would mean also purchasing a 65mm wheelset...
    I ride Ft. Ord/Sea Otter all the time. It's mostly sand and a few nice rocky trails. Tons of single track here. The thing I love about the Lou's is the pure traction, especially for a single speed. No tire spinning on out of the saddle climbs, no tires falling into ditches/trenches, etc....

    Since coming to fat bikes, I've since sold all my 29ers and don't mind the extra weight.

  60. #60
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    Does anyone know if the Salsa/Revelate Frame bags fit in the Blackborow or if Salsa is releasing new ones that will?
    "Events in the past may be roughly divided into those which probably never happened and those which do not matter."

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by floorguy724 View Post
    The DS tracks better, has more suspension, and has better traction imo. All this due to the bigger tires imo...
    .....
    Since riding my Beargrease, it feels faster, stiffer, and lighter compared to the DS. I can honestly say that the DS is more fun to ride.
    Very useful information. I too have sold off all my 29'ers as I was exclusively riding my Beargrease in every terrain. Would be nice to get back to having a single speed as a back up/packing bike.

    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyBuckeye View Post
    Does anyone know if the Salsa/Revelate Frame bags fit in the Blackborow or if Salsa is releasing new ones that will?
    No clue if the current bag designs would fit but based on the low top tube I would be surprised if it did. Though I can almost guarantee Salsa/Revelate will have one out for the Blackborow in short order.

  62. #62
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    Anyone ridden this bike with a Bluto yet?

  63. #63
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    Seeing the Lou Lou combo in the LBS has me wanting to go that route instead of Bud/Lou - hmmm. Not that those tires are in the budget any time soon, but they look killer (as does the bike!).

  64. #64
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    Just picked up my blackborow frame! Time to start the build, I still need to order spokes and grab some derailleur cable housing. Then it's time to ride.

    <a href="http://s170.photobucket.com/user/jlarue66/media/blackborow_zpsd8a6f3a2.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u262/jlarue66/blackborow_zpsd8a6f3a2.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo blackborow_zpsd8a6f3a2.jpg"/></a>

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    Sorry for that crappy pic, to excited to get going to setup a nice shot.

  66. #66
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    Cool! Looking forward to your build. Is that a medium?

    Quote Originally Posted by mtndude23 View Post
    Just picked up my blackborow frame! Time to start the build, I still need to order spokes and grab some derailleur cable housing. Then it's time to ride.

    <a href="http://s170.photobucket.com/user/jlarue66/media/blackborow_zpsd8a6f3a2.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u262/jlarue66/blackborow_zpsd8a6f3a2.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo blackborow_zpsd8a6f3a2.jpg"/></a>
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  67. #67
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    Yeah it's a med frame, I got most of it together now. My bb was supposed to show up yesterday afternoon, but usps didn't bring. I was hoping to get most of the drivetrain sorted out. Oh well, I'll order spokes today and hopefully be rolling by next week.

  68. #68
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    I found it very interesting they chose lou lou for this. Most have commented that Bud rolls easier, and I have not seen any complaints about Buds' capabilities as a rear tire.

    LBS has a med, and with those big meats it is a mean looking setup. I just cannot get over the "mid-80's snowmobile jacket" graphics on the TT.

  69. #69
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    Any more ride reports on either Blackborow?

  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_eleven View Post
    Any more ride reports on either Blackborow?
    [ATTACH=CONFIG]946037[/ATTACH

    I have been riding mine for awhile now. We had some snow, but it's all gone now, so nothing to say about how this does in the deeper stuff yet.

    I love how the bike handles. I thought the Lou-Lou combo would roll slowly, but other than the rumbling sounds, it doesn't slow me down at all, and this is compared to Larrys, BFL, and Sterlings.

    The bike has a shorter wheel base than my Mukluks did and the weight balance is much better for popping the front end up and maneuvering over the bike in undulating terrain.

    It's the best fat bike Salsa has done for the "out of bounds" bushwhacking and general fat biking style. Beargrease is lighter, sure, but limited in tire size and cannot pull off what I suspect this bike can in deeper snow, mud, or sand. I'm really stoked on my Blackborow so far.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-pb260015.jpg  

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  71. #71
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    Picked up my DS last night

    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-20141215_211852.jpg

    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-20141215_211816.jpg
    Today I will do what others won't, so tomorrow I can do what others can't

  72. #72
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    If there is one fatbike I like more than my Moonlander, it's the Blackborow.

  73. #73
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    Hows this bike handle the trails, quick test ride felt great around parking lot and such...just waiting to pull the trigger as its a little more than I wanted to spend for the 1

  74. #74
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    I'm amazed that Lou Lou seems to work so well. I run Bud and Lou and was considering running Bud Bud or Dillinger 5's to try and get back a little speed.
    I like turtles

  75. #75
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    almost 2 hours of dense beach grass, riding/climbing dunes as well as some frozen beach last night, I'm in love with the blackborow, can't wait to hit some singletrack with it and then if we ever get some snow....
    Today I will do what others won't, so tomorrow I can do what others can't

  76. #76
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    good to hear, this will be my only mountain bike for all situations so just curious on all aspects of how people have been riding it.

  77. #77
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    Finally got mine all put together, now if it'd stop raining I could get out for a ride-other then around the block.


  78. #78
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    Incase anyone is planing on using the raceface cinch setup on theirs, let me save you some hassle. If you can find the ice cream truck kit in stock-get it. I couldn't find it anywhere, so I got some 1mm bb30 spacers from universal cycles. With a direct mount ring(concave side facing to the centerline of the bike) you'll need 4mm of spacers on the DS spindle, with the stock RF 11.5mm spacer on the NDS, then a bit of cinch preload.

    This puts the chainline right 76mm, there is plenty of room for the lou. You could get it closer, but the chainring will hit the chainstay.

  79. #79
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    Still stoked on this bike. Bushwhacking and beach riding has been a blast so far. Waiting on the snow.....Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-pc200072.jpg
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  80. #80
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    Rode this back to back with a fatboy and went with the blackborow.
    Awesome bike handles great and can out climb my leg power without a slip of the tire.
    Only a quick ride before dark but plan to take out again in the morning.

  81. #81
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    Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-image.jpgSalsa expansion.    Blackborow-image-1-.jpg

    Short ride from yesterday

  82. #82
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    Looks good in the woods. I can't always tell from picture's how steep a hill is but that looks steep. Do you get much snow where your at? Did you get it as a year round bike>

    Quote Originally Posted by edved37 View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Short ride from yesterday
    Lucky neighbor of Maryland's Patapsco Valley State Park, 39.23,-76.76 Flickr

  83. #83
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    Yeah I live in northern IL, so we usually have plenty
    of snow by now. This will be my year around bike.
    Can't wait to get out it again.

  84. #84
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    Like it... a lot. Only change so far is the Brooks saddle and I'm waiting on a set back seat post. Changing the drive train over is a sub 60 second job. Start with the larger of the rings whether in cruise or climb mode makes it easier. I notice there is quite a difference in chain tension between ranges.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Salsa expansion.    Blackborow-bbaustinf2.jpg  


  85. #85
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    Well, I finally have been able to get some decent dirt miles in on this bike, what a load of fun. It's kind of crazy how much traction these big tires find! It did take some time to get used to not keep smashing my pedals into rocks, I normally just cruise around.

    The only real downside to this bike is, now I really wish I had brought a bucksaw instead!

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtndude23 View Post
    Well, I finally have been able to get some decent dirt miles in on this bike, what a load of fun. It's kind of crazy how much traction these big tires find! It did take some time to get used to not keep smashing my pedals into rocks, I normally just cruise around.

    The only real downside to this bike is, now I really wish I had brought a bucksaw instead!
    You can buy the BS frame and swap your parts over or wait until the gen 2 BS gets released and pick up a gen 1 BS cheap from someone that has to have the latest tech.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  87. #87
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    I'm with you on the traction, can't believe how it climbs and rolls
    over everything I can find.

  88. #88
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    Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    You can buy the BS frame and swap your parts over or wait until the gen 2 BS gets released and pick up a gen 1 BS cheap from someone that has to have the latest tech.
    BS won't fit those wheels and tires.


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  89. #89
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    A pic from today's nice little ride.

    <a href="http://s170.photobucket.com/user/jlarue66/media/IMAG00751_zps6ad51af1.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u262/jlarue66/IMAG00751_zps6ad51af1.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMAG00751_zps6ad51af1.jpg"/></a>

    It'll be at least a year before I pickup a bucksaw-if I do even. The blackborow isn't going anywhere. I got it to add a bit of cushion on bikepacking trips over my el mariachi. I don't want to deal with bringing a shock pump-or shocks failing in the middle of nowhere.

    I could see the bucksaw replacing my FS 29er for normal trail riding though. But, the bike fund is tapped out right now. So maybe a used frame next fall.

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by racefit View Post
    BS won't fit those wheels and tires.
    Damn those supermodel fat bikes!
    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  91. #91
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    Blackborrow is really flying under the radar, I got a few more rides in on mine now and it's amazing, can't wait to take it bikepacking
    Today I will do what others won't, so tomorrow I can do what others can't

  92. #92
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    Ssshhhhhhhh!!!! I don't want anyone to scoop the one I have in my sights. I had one out for a good ride on the weekend twice and I'm seriously considering it over the ICT I just bought. Combo of the weight, the slightly steeper HA, and TIGHT wheelbase felt so good. It's a total tractor and performed awesome on drops and getting up and over stuff.

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by TitanofChaos View Post
    Blackborrow is really flying under the radar, I got a few more rides in on mine now and it's amazing, can't wait to take it bikepacking
    Quote Originally Posted by frozenmonkey View Post
    Ssshhhhhhhh!!!! I don't want anyone to scoop the one I have in my sights. I had one out for a good ride on the weekend twice and I'm seriously considering it over the ICT I just bought. Combo of the weight, the slightly steeper HA, and TIGHT wheelbase felt so good. It's a total tractor and performed awesome on drops and getting up and over stuff.
    I was torn between the ICT and BB. Finally decided on the BB, went to all my LBS'.... nothing. The shelves were bare. After calling every Salsa dealer within 3 states of me, I found a BB DS and had a buddy who lived nearby go in and purchase it for me. It's on it's way now, I can't wait.

    I also tried the new 190mm 9zero7 fat bike and while it is nice (light&quick), the Salsa oozes quality with the alternator drops and better welds, and the handling was night/day better over the 9zero7. Salsa continues to invent and impress. I'm glad I put the effort into going after the BB.

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlyMpls View Post
    I was torn between the ICT and BB. Finally decided on the BB, went to all my LBS'.... nothing. The shelves were bare. After calling every Salsa dealer within 3 states of me, I found a BB DS and had a buddy who lived nearby go in and purchase it for me. It's on it's way now, I can't wait.

    I also tried the new 190mm 9zero7 fat bike and while it is nice (light&quick), the Salsa oozes quality with the alternator drops and better welds, and the handling was night/day better over the 9zero7. Salsa continues to invent and impress. I'm glad I put the effort into going after the BB.
    I think you called the shop I work at. I heard a story hauntingly familiar to this from our buyer today at work.

    Glad you tracked one down. I'd have to agree that this bike (and possibly the aluminum Beargrease) is the sleeper in the Salsa Cycles fat bike line right now. I am very pleased with my Blackborow DS so far.

    Congrats on scoring one.
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  95. #95
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    Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by frozenmonkey View Post
    Ssshhhhhhhh!!!! I don't want anyone to scoop the one I have in my sights. I had one out for a good ride on the weekend twice and I'm seriously considering it over the ICT I just bought. Combo of the weight, the slightly steeper HA, and TIGHT wheelbase felt so good. It's a total tractor and performed awesome on drops and getting up and over stuff.
    Interesting comments. I was considering switching my Moonlander frame for an ICT.

    What types of riding do you typically do?


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  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtndude23 View Post
    Incase anyone is planing on using the raceface cinch setup on theirs, let me save you some hassle. If you can find the ice cream truck kit in stock-get it. I couldn't find it anywhere, so I got some 1mm bb30 spacers from universal cycles. With a direct mount ring(concave side facing to the centerline of the bike) you'll need 4mm of spacers on the DS spindle, with the stock RF 11.5mm spacer on the NDS, then a bit of cinch preload.

    This puts the chainline right 76mm, there is plenty of room for the lou. You could get it closer, but the chainring will hit the chainstay.
    All the Cinch set up info on here has my head spinning. Are you running the 170 or 190 spindle?

    Cheers

  97. #97
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    I'm using the 190 spindle. I've thought about getting a 170 to try fitting though. To me, I think you might be able to get it to work if you flip the direct mount ring. But it will be a tight fit if it does work, or if it doesn't.

  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by racefit View Post
    Interesting comments. I was considering switching my Moonlander frame for an ICT.

    What types of riding do you typically do?


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    A bit of everything. Right now, near my house, I'm trying to lay in a decent pseudo-snow pump track at an unused off leash area for dogs with some cool existing berms. With two young kids it's harder for me to hit the trails regularly, so i use my fat bike for a fair bit of urban bombing around and play. That's in part why I'm going to try a smaller frame with the Blackborow as well. I commute on the fat bike as conditions dictate, but I'm also way drunk on the fat kool-aid and will grab my fat bike for anything. Go rid of my 29er after the Krampus kicked him out of the shed. I also like to load it up with bags and beer and explore with my buds and the Blackborow ticks all the bikepacking boxes, same as the ICT. I'm kinda torn to have to sell the ICT and take the $$$ hit, but the Salsa rides really nice and the weight is definitely noticeable. Plus my LBS gave me ridiculous deal with a Oneup 1x conversion and RF Turbines rolled in.

    Fat bike trail use has exploded pretty good around here so our local network is usually well packed fairly soon after snowfall. I rode my Puglsey year round, trail, commuter, hauling kids, as well, until I bought a Krampus, which was what got me interested in the ICT. The Blackborow wasn't really on my radar and I'm a bit of a steel / Surly fanboy to boot, so when the ICT came out it felt really natural going from my Krampus.

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtndude23 View Post
    I'm using the 190 spindle. I've thought about getting a 170 to try fitting though. To me, I think you might be able to get it to work if you flip the direct mount ring. But it will be a tight fit if it does work, or if it doesn't.
    Awesome thanks.

  100. #100
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    Salsa expansion. Blackborow

    Quote Originally Posted by frozenmonkey View Post
    A bit of everything. Right now, near my house, I'm trying to lay in a decent pseudo-snow pump track at an unused off leash area for dogs with some cool existing berms. With two young kids it's harder for me to hit the trails regularly, so i use my fat bike for a fair bit of urban bombing around and play. That's in part why I'm going to try a smaller frame with the Blackborow as well. I commute on the fat bike as conditions dictate, but I'm also way drunk on the fat kool-aid and will grab my fat bike for anything. Go rid of my 29er after the Krampus kicked him out of the shed. I also like to load it up with bags and beer and explore with my buds and the Blackborow ticks all the bikepacking boxes, same as the ICT. I'm kinda torn to have to sell the ICT and take the $$$ hit, but the Salsa rides really nice and the weight is definitely noticeable. Plus my LBS gave me ridiculous deal with a Oneup 1x conversion and RF Turbines rolled in.

    Fat bike trail use has exploded pretty good around here so our local network is usually well packed fairly soon after snowfall. I rode my Puglsey year round, trail, commuter, hauling kids, as well, until I bought a Krampus, which was what got me interested in the ICT. The Blackborow wasn't really on my radar and I'm a bit of a steel / Surly fanboy to boot, so when the ICT came out it felt really natural going from my Krampus.
    It seems the Blackborrow is marketed as primarily a bike packing ride. Interesting then that you prefer it over the ICT which is often described as playful and lively.

    Are you selling an ICT frame or complete?


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