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  1. #176
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    I have the Dually front with a Knard and Blunt 35 with a X-King neither or which are tubeless specific and I haven't had any problems in the 5 months or so that I've had this setup. Just using the Velocity blue tape with the valves. It was quite tough to get the Knard set up tubeless but the trick that I found is to air it up with the wheel laying on its side on a garbage can so that the Stans pools on one side then flip it over continuing to give it air. It took a good 10 to 15 minutes of keeping air on it with a lot of sealant lost before it would seal. Haven't had any issues though since.

  2. #177
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    What kind of pressures are you guys running with your Knards and Dually's tubeless?

    I ran with tubes for about a week just to get them seating well and to help set the single strip of stans tape over the spoke holes, and they worked fine at about 10 pounds PSI with tubes in rocky terrain.

    I then just carefully took the bead off one side, pulled the tube and put 3 scoops of orange seal in. Did this over at my local LBS and used there air compressor and it sealed right up with a little leaking around the beads that went away soon.

    Problem is I can't even run the pressures as low as I was with tubes as I get small burps with sealant coming out.

    skylerd from your description it sounds like I need to build up the shelf a bit with some gorilla tape, how many wraps around the rim do you do? Do you leave a little room between the side wall and the tape or are you butting the tape right up to the sidewall?

    Thanks

    Really looking forward to the Maxxis Chronicle coming out as it looks to be a tubeless tire with sidewall protection.
    Last edited by TahoeBC; 06-06-2014 at 12:52 PM.
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  3. #178
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    I've run mine tubeless with Knard, Nobby Nic, and Racing Ralph. The Schwalbe tires got on the bead seat better but still burp at higher pressures than I want to run (16psi). The Knards suck to get seated and are really too loose on the bead seat, IMHO.

    I anxiously await fat rims from Notubes and would have built this bike on Flows in the meantime if I had known.

  4. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by seely View Post
    Thanks for pointing this out. Other companies seem to choose to make their rims to cater to tubeless conversions, while we make ours to be compatible with actual tubeless tires. Surly tires seem to have the widest range of success and failure running tubeless. I've had reports of everything from one layer of Velotape or Stans, to 5 to 6 layers of Gorilla tape to screw it I'll just run tubes.

    Personally, I'm running the 26" Dirt Wizard and wound up using a layer of Velotape and then a layer of a thick rubbery tape. Even then I only got the tire to seat after wrapping it tightly with some of our packing wrap. It's holding great, but Surly tires have loose tolerances and certainly were not designed for tubeless applications.
    Yes, I say this in my review. I know that Surly tires are not tubeless ready. I'm referring specifically that I had to try to build a bead shelf out of tape. You'll notice that I'm the only person who has done that, and I seem to be one of very few people responding that has never had a tire burp. If you read my review, you'll notice that it's really positive...if that's what you're worried about.

    And it should be, I've thrashed around on them for nearly 6000km.

  5. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylerd View Post
    Yes, I say this in my review. I know that Surly tires are not tubeless ready. I'm referring specifically that I had to try to build a bead shelf out of tape. You'll notice that I'm the only person who has done that, and I seem to be one of very few people responding that has never had a tire burp. If you read my review, you'll notice that it's really positive...if that's what you're worried about.

    And it should be, I've thrashed around on them for nearly 6000km.
    I did read your review, quite carefully. What I am confused on is how a successful tubeless setup with a non-tubeless tire somehow makes our claim of tubeless ready "bogus."
    bike dude, velocity employee (this is my personal account)

  6. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeBC View Post
    What kind of pressures are you guys running with your Knards and Dually's tubeless?

    I ran with tubes for about a week just to get them seating well and to help set the single strip of stans tape over the spoke holes, and they worked fine at about 10 pounds PSI with tubes in rocky terrain.

    I then just carefully took the bead off one side, pulled the tube and put 3 scoops of orange seal in. Did this over at my local LBS and used there air compressor and it sealed right up with a little leaking around the beads that went away soon.

    Problem is I can't even run the pressures as low as I was with tubes as I get small burps with sealant coming out.

    giantone from your description it sounds like I need to build up the shelf a bit with some gorilla tape, how many wraps around the rim do you do? Do you leave a little room between the side wall and the tape or are you butting the tape right up to the sidewall?

    Thanks

    Really looking forward to the Maxxis Chronicle coming out as it looks to be a tubeless tire with sidewall protection.
    We recommend going edge to edge with the tape, even for UST tire applications. If you're running non-tubeless tires, Gorilla Tape may work better than our thin stuff.
    bike dude, velocity employee (this is my personal account)

  7. #182
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    Right. It's just the lack of bead shelve ridges that I'm referring to. I guess that makes them "almost tubeless-ready", requiring just a bit of modification. Seems that with the tape shelf, the risk of burping is way lower. The diameter is clearly correct for airing up tubeless-ready tires without full-width tape, the profile just might not be correct for keeping them there.

    If the Duallies had a bead shelf ridge, they'd be a 5-star product. It's what people want. It would probably be a lot easier to make rims with bead shelf ridges than to convince people that they don't need them.

  8. #183
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    I have a set of Duallies I have been running on my FS bike. For tires I am some old 2.4 kendas that I had hanging around, the only reason I am using them is I wanted something more aggressive than knards. Still waiting for a 3 inch aggressive tire.
    I found the Duallies to work very well tubeless with thin tape, they have a good shelf that the tire sealed on before it popped onto the bead. I think surly tires suck I have several pairs of surly fat tires, the quality has no consistence. One tire will fit tight the other will almost fall off the rim. I think like stated before it a tire problem not a rim problem.

  9. #184
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    I just had Angry Catfish, in Minneapolis, build a 29+ wheel set for my Mukluk using the Duallies. They are built around I-9 hubs, and use the 29x3 Knards, set up with tubes for now. The Duallies were cheaper than Rabbit Holes, but the added expense of the hubs (vs. Salsa hubs) more than offset the savings....

    I plan on using the bike to explore forest roads and trails and figured these would be better at covering distance than the stock Mukluk wheel set.







    Last edited by 2whl-hoop; 06-07-2014 at 08:04 PM.

  10. #185
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    So what's the most reliable tubeless setup for the Dually/Knard combo for aggressive riding? I built my Dually wheelset last week and just picked up some Gorilla tape today. Some say to use no tape, just sealant, some say 1 layer, some say 2 layers. Experience?
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  11. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by sasquatch rides a SS View Post
    So what's the most reliable tubeless setup for the Dually/Knard combo for aggressive riding? I built my Dually wheelset last week and just picked up some Gorilla tape today. Some say to use no tape, just sealant, some say 1 layer, some say 2 layers. Experience?
    You will need tape, no questions asked they simply will not work without it. I would suggest this stuff 3M Scotch Transparent Duct Tape, 1.88-Inch by 20-Yard (2120-A) - - Amazon.com It is slightly wider than you need so it will need to be trimmed down. Tape the entire flat area including bead shelf and you should not have any troubles. Gorilla tape will work but it is heavier and tends to soak up a bit more sealant. My experience was with a trouble free gorilla tape setup that only covered the spoke holes. It was fine but the gorilla tape ended up soaking up more sealant than I would have liked.

  12. #187
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    For my 26er Dually/Husker (front), Dually/Knard (rear) I needed one layer of Gorilla tape to make the rim/tire interface tight enough to not burp. With just stans tape I peeled the tire off.

  13. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by sasquatch rides a SS View Post
    So what's the most reliable tubeless setup for the Dually/Knard combo for aggressive riding? I built my Dually wheelset last week and just picked up some Gorilla tape today. Some say to use no tape, just sealant, some say 1 layer, some say 2 layers. Experience?
    I've seen the most variance in tubeless setup with Surly tires. I love my Dirt Wizards, but on the 26" Dually they were a very loose fit. Others have said theirs fit tight. Guitar Ted, in one of his reviews, mounted Knards easily with a single layer of Gorilla Tape. One of our wheel builders here wound up using 3 or 4 layers. So, all that to say YMMV. With any non-tubeless tire it seems to require some experimentation.
    bike dude, velocity employee (this is my personal account)

  14. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by seely View Post
    I've seen the most variance in tubeless setup with Surly tires. I love my Dirt Wizards, but on the 26" Dually they were a very loose fit. Others have said theirs fit tight. Guitar Ted, in one of his reviews, mounted Knards easily with a single layer of Gorilla Tape. One of our wheel builders here wound up using 3 or 4 layers. So, all that to say YMMV. With any non-tubeless tire it seems to require some experimentation.
    That's what I was thinking. My Knards ( ) are a pretty loose fit. I am sort of expecting at least 2 layers, but wanted to see what others had done. I'll post up when I have time to convert and then again after the first ride.
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  15. #190
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    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  16. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    Whoah. Excellent work. Great tubeless reference.
    You're so cute internet tough guy. Noogie...Noogie...Noogie.

  17. #192
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    I've got a few more long rides in rocky terrain under my belt, never got around to building up the bead shelf, still have a single thin layer of Stans tape covering the the spoke holes and still using the original 3 scoops of Orange seal. I seem to be able to run lower pressures now than originally for what ever reason, maybe enough orange seal has bedded in around the bead. Last Sunday I ran 10 1/2 PSI in both the tires with no issues. These are 120 tpi knards BTW.

    Here I am starting to descend 4500 feet last Sunday

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  18. #193
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    Been running mine with the 27tpi versions since last October with zero issues. They were a ***** to get sealed but once I did they are great. I figured out it was best just to put in about 20 lbs of air and let them rest on each side for a few hours. I run about 12-14 lbs no problem.

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