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  1. #1
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    hub standards, or lack thereof.

    Leaning toward a ti or alu (if I can find one) Lg mukluk. Would like to get the carbon salsa 15 mm x 142 Thru Axle fork....AFAIK there are no other rigid forks w/ the big A2C and offset.

    OK, front hub choice. I could get the Salsa hub...but it apparently doesn't convert to 15x135, which means no compatibility w/ a current suspension fork (all 15x135 right? Rockshox will likely be that too?) if / when I buy one. Borealis, Hope pro2 fatsno = 15x135, not 142 correct? So Salsa has released a suspension corrected frame but you'll have to build a new wheel if you buy a suspension fork? Maybe I just live with the Salsa alu fork, and get a Borealis hub in QR configuration. Yuck.

    Then there's the rear hub. I bought a 170 Hope pro2 fatsno...arrives tomorrow... but not sure Hope has the parts avail to convert to 12x177. So can't get the Salsa 12 mm T/A alternator dropouts? Can I at least convert to 10 mm thru axle and get Hadley axle?
    Originally posted by bucksaw87
    I still fail to see how mustaches, fixies, and PBR are ironic.

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  3. #3
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    Industry Nine also makes hubs that fit...

  4. #4
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    Thanks for the info. All my Google searches came up empty:

    . Your search - hope fatsno front hub 142 - did not match any shopping results.
    Haven't found a US retailer yet listing 142 x 15 hope....might order from UK. Regardless, I'm glad to see it has FDS. Guess I was mislead by the crap Hope website info: Pro 2 Evo Fatsno Hubs - Pro 2 Evo Fatsno Hubs - Product Details
    Originally posted by bucksaw87
    I still fail to see how mustaches, fixies, and PBR are ironic.

  5. #5
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    All Mukluks are suspension corrected, it's just that this year they are using the term as a sales pitch.
    Jason
    Disclaimer: www.paramountsports.net

  6. #6
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    They have been further corrected an additional 15mm.

    Quote Originally Posted by JAGI410 View Post
    All Mukluks are suspension corrected, it's just that this year they are using the term as a sales pitch.

  7. #7
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    White Industries Snowhite hubs are also available in a 135x15 configuration. You could email them and see if they would make you a 142. They are very easy to work with.

  8. #8
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    I have a Hope rear hub that is ready for 12x177. And you can get Salsa alternator dropouts that work with it. What is missing is the alternator dropouts come with a 142mm thru-axle. You should help me pressure Salsa to make the 177mm thru-axle available.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by frorider View Post
    Leaning toward a ti or alu (if I can find one) Lg mukluk. Would like to get the carbon salsa 15 mm x 142 Thru Axle fork....AFAIK there are no other rigid forks w/ the big A2C and offset.

    OK, front hub choice. I could get the Salsa hub...but it apparently doesn't convert to 15x135, which means no compatibility w/ a current suspension fork (all 15x135 right? Rockshox will likely be that too?) if / when I buy one. Borealis, Hope pro2 fatsno = 15x135, not 142 correct? So Salsa has released a suspension corrected frame but you'll have to build a new wheel if you buy a suspension fork? Maybe I just live with the Salsa alu fork, and get a Borealis hub in QR configuration. Yuck.

    Then there's the rear hub. I bought a 170 Hope pro2 fatsno...arrives tomorrow... but not sure Hope has the parts avail to convert to 12x177. So can't get the Salsa 12 mm T/A alternator dropouts? Can I at least convert to 10 mm thru axle and get Hadley axle?
    I feel your pain. Just yesterday I was asking a hub manufacturer about which standards they support.

    With interchangeable caps, hub bodies could relatively easily support any of the standards. It appears that Hope makes caps for every option: quick release, through axle and through axle with 3.5mm extension on each side.

    As of yet though, fat component companies aren't doing a very good job at publishing exactly which options are available. Both 9:zero:7 and Hope have yet to update their websites with their latest hubs, let alone which caps are available. I'm waiting for word back from Borealis about if their rear hub supports 12mm axles.

  10. #10
    drev-il, not Dr. Evil!
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfiler View Post
    I feel your pain. Just yesterday I was asking a hub manufacturer about which standards they support.

    With interchangeable caps, hub bodies could relatively easily support any of the standards. It appears that Hope makes caps for every option: quick release, through axle and through axle with 3.5mm extension on each side.

    As of yet though, fat component companies aren't doing a very good job at publishing exactly which options are available. Both 9:zero:7 and Hope have yet to update their websites with their latest hubs, let alone which caps are available. I'm waiting for word back from Borealis about if their rear hub supports 12mm axles.
    I wrote to Hope tech regarding what is needed to convert the standard Fatsno 170mm rear hub to a through axle. Simon's response:
    Hi, you will need the X12 142 conversion to convert the Fatsno to a 177. The part number is: HUB242. You can get those through any of the dealers on the locator on our site.


    Now I have to figure out what sliding dropouts I need from Paragon to match it. Are these it?
    www.paragonmachineworks.com - DR4028RightSide
    www.paragonmachineworks.com - DR4027LeftSide
    "Keep your burgers lean and your tires fat." -h.d. | bikecentric | ssoft

  11. #11
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    Hey Ricky, are you building a new frame or trying to retrofit your Vertigo?

    Steven

    Quote Originally Posted by Drevil View Post
    I wrote to Hope tech regarding what is needed to convert the standard Fatsno 170mm rear hub to a through axle. Simon's response:
    Hi, you will need the X12 142 conversion to convert the Fatsno to a 177. The part number is: HUB242. You can get those through any of the dealers on the locator on our site.


    Now I have to figure out what sliding dropouts I need from Paragon to match it. Are these it?
    www.paragonmachineworks.com - DR4028RightSide
    www.paragonmachineworks.com - DR4027LeftSide

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drevil View Post
    I wrote to Hope tech regarding what is needed to convert the standard Fatsno 170mm rear hub to a through axle. Simon's response:
    Hi, you will need the X12 142 conversion to convert the Fatsno to a 177. The part number is: HUB242. You can get those through any of the dealers on the locator on our site.


    Now I have to figure out what sliding dropouts I need from Paragon to match it. Are these it?
    www.paragonmachineworks.com - DR4028RightSide
    www.paragonmachineworks.com - DR4027LeftSide
    Those dropouts would work with the Hope hubs. The problem you are going to have is finding a 12x177 thru-axle. Any 12mm dropouts on the bike will work with hubs set up for a 12mm thru-axle. But the dropouts will only work with one specific thru-axle. On the Paragon site they will sell you the Shimano 12x142 thru-axle that fits their dropouts, but you need a 12x177 thru-axle.

  13. #13
    drev-il, not Dr. Evil!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Welnic View Post
    Those dropouts would work with the Hope hubs. The problem you are going to have is finding a 12x177 thru-axle. Any 12mm dropouts on the bike will work with hubs set up for a 12mm thru-axle. But the dropouts will only work with one specific thru-axle. On the Paragon site they will sell you the Shimano 12x142 thru-axle that fits their dropouts, but you need a 12x177 thru-axle.
    Ohhhh... I assumed the right axle would be included with that kit. If not, is there someone that makes one and is available now? It'd be pointless getting that kit now and not be able to use it.
    Quote Originally Posted by shoo View Post
    Hey Ricky, are you building a new frame or trying to retrofit your Vertigo?

    Steven
    I've used the Hope, Hadley, and Salsa QR skewers for 170mm hubs, and after a few rides, they somehow get loose. I'd like something that I wouldn't have to worry about that will self-loosen, and this seemed like the ticket.

    BTW, I've never used a through axle on any of my bikes. Are they generally accepted as being better in all aspects, except for maybe not being quite as quick to release as standard QRs?
    "Keep your burgers lean and your tires fat." -h.d. | bikecentric | ssoft

  14. #14
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    DT Swiss has a skewer available to fit the dropout you linked to.

    I have been using Bontrager skewer's for years and have had great luck with them. I use a 10mm Through Axel Skewer on my Hope hub and that works good. It fits a standard dropout and it works like a regular skewer just larger diameter. The through axels screw into the right side drop out, I have never used one of those except on a Downhill bike, seems like overkill for a fat bike.

    Steven

    Quote Originally Posted by Drevil View Post
    Ohhhh... I assumed the right axle would be included with that kit. If not, is there someone that makes one and is available now? It'd be pointless getting that kit now and not be able to use it.

    I've used the Hope, Hadley, and Salsa QR skewers for 170mm hubs, and after a few rides, they somehow get loose. I'd like something that I wouldn't have to worry about that will self-loosen, and this seemed like the ticket.

    BTW, I've never used a through axle on any of my bikes. Are they generally accepted as being better in all aspects, except for maybe not being quite as quick to release as standard QRs?

  15. #15
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    I think the appeal is that if you're going to use a real axle instead of a skewer, it is actually both lighter and stronger to have it thread into the frame or dropout chip. If you're willing to use an allen wrench to remove the wheel, even the QR lever can be eliminated. That leaves you with a hollow aluminum axle with no nut on one side and an allen head on the other side. That's light and strong.

    The tradeoff is requiring a tool and needing to turn the axle a few times to get the wheel out rather than just flipping a QR lever.

    ---

    The hope fatsno hubs are tempting because Hope has been around for a while and if I need to convert to a different axle system in a few years, parts will be easy to find. However I remember having read that the original fatsno hubs were not compatible with the rest of the hope hubs. Meaning, you couldn't just use the various end caps already available. Yet I think they realized that this was a mistake and redesigned the fat hubs to use the same caps as the other hope hubs.

    Unfortunately the hope website is pathetically out of date. If there were specs available on their current product offerings, I might actually buy one of their fatsno hubs.

  16. #16
    drev-il, not Dr. Evil!
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    Quote Originally Posted by shoo View Post
    DT Swiss has a skewer available to fit the dropout you linked to.

    I have been using Bontrager skewer's for years and have had great luck with them. I use a 10mm Through Axel Skewer on my Hope hub and that works good. It fits a standard dropout and it works like a regular skewer just larger diameter. The through axels screw into the right side drop out, I have never used one of those except on a Downhill bike, seems like overkill for a fat bike.

    Steven
    Hooboy! That 177 DT RWS skewer is $75 by itself. Add the dropouts, and that's another $36. $111 before shipping, and that's not including Hope's axle conversion kit.

    Any leads to the Bontrager 10mm 170+mm skewer? Google had zippo. This will also require a Hope endcap change too, amiright?
    "Keep your burgers lean and your tires fat." -h.d. | bikecentric | ssoft

  17. #17
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    The Bontrager is a standard skewer. The 10mm axel/skewer is a Fatback model they are about half the price of a DT.

    Quote Originally Posted by Drevil View Post
    Hooboy! That 177 DT RWS skewer is $75 by itself. Add the dropouts, and that's another $36. $111 before shipping, and that's not including Hope's axle conversion kit.

    Any leads to the Bontrager 10mm 170+mm skewer? Google had zippo. This will also require a Hope endcap change too, amiright?
    I have a year old Hope 170mm rear and I was able to buy end caps to run a 10mm through axel/skewer.

    Quote Originally Posted by dfiler View Post
    The hope fatsno hubs are tempting because Hope has been around for a while and if I need to convert to a different axle system in a few years, parts will be easy to find. However I remember having read that the original fatsno hubs were not compatible with the rest of the hope hubs. Meaning, you couldn't just use the various end caps already available. Yet I think they realized that this was a mistake and redesigned the fat hubs to use the same caps as the other hope hubs.

    Unfortunately the hope website is pathetically out of date. If there were specs available on their current product offerings, I might actually buy one of their fatsno hubs.

  18. #18
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    Doesn't Hadley sell a 10 mm x 170 nutted axle? I've used that on 135 hubs and its light, stiff, convenient--the alu nut slots into the dropout, so u only need an Allen key on one end.
    Originally posted by bucksaw87
    I still fail to see how mustaches, fixies, and PBR are ironic.

  19. #19
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    i have a hadley axle for a 135 OLD hub...i dont *think* they do one for a 170mm OLD hub. if they do i am very interested...

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dRjOn View Post
    i have a hadley axle for a 135 OLD hub...i dont *think* they do one for a 170mm OLD hub. if they do i am very interested...
    Me too, I was getting ready to buy a grade. 8 bolt just to see if I could feel the difference or get let rear triangle flex/ tire rubbing.

  21. #21
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    I have Hadley hubs on my Blur TRc and tried to get them for my 170mm fat bike. They make a quick release hub for Fatback, but they do not make a thru-axle version.

    Quote Originally Posted by Drevil View Post
    ...
    I've used the Hope, Hadley, and Salsa QR skewers for 170mm hubs, and after a few rides, they somehow get loose. I'd like something that I wouldn't have to worry about that will self-loosen, and this seemed like the ticket.

    BTW, I've never used a through axle on any of my bikes. Are they generally accepted as being better in all aspects, except for maybe not being quite as quick to release as standard QRs?
    I think that the thru-axle is the most important on the front. There is an issue with the braking forces from a disc brake that tends to loosen a quick release and pull it out of the fork. A thru-axle stops this and also adds rigidity to the fork, but that is more important if it is a suspension fork.

    I don't think that they make much of a difference on the back of a normal hardtail, but I think that they do with a 170-190 hub. The guy that built my fat bike wheels suggested that with my weight (200ibs) on a Mukluk Ti that I should get a thru-axle in the rear. It would definitely solve the loosening quick release problem.

  22. #22
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    Anyone with a new hope hub that can clarify the following?

    The hope website says 24 engagement points but elsewhere online it is described as having 40 or 80, possibly with two offset pairs of pawls.

    The hope website says that the front hub has rear-wheel disc spacing but elsewhere online it is listed as front spaced.

    I suspect this has to do with the design changing at least once. However it isn't clear which design is which or even if they have different names.

    Only one website even lists the 190mm pro 2 evo fatsno hubs for sale so perhaps they just aren't available yet and more details are forethcoming. I've contacted hope with these questions as well. We'll see if mtbr forums or the company itself can provide better clarification.

  23. #23
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    The new hope hubs have 40 point engagement. The new version of the Hope front hubs are available in Front disc spacing or Rear disc spacing.

    Quote Originally Posted by dfiler View Post
    Anyone with a new hope hub that can clarify the following?

    The hope website says 24 engagement points but elsewhere online it is described as having 40 or 80, possibly with two offset pairs of pawls.

    The hope website says that the front hub has rear-wheel disc spacing but elsewhere online it is listed as front spaced.

    I suspect this has to do with the design changing at least once. However it isn't clear which design is which or even if they have different names.

    Only one website even lists the 190mm pro 2 evo fatsno hubs for sale so perhaps they just aren't available yet and more details are forethcoming. I've contacted hope with these questions as well. We'll see if mtbr forums or the company itself can provide better clarification.

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