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  1. #1
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    Hey SURLY.....Quit Starting $hit!!!!

    “Inside sources at QBP confirmed the reincarnation of the Surly Instigator as a complete bike and as a frame only, no fork. Interesting. It looks like they changed the font as well.”

    Carry on
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Hey SURLY.....Quit Starting $hit!!!!-instigator.jpg  


  2. #2
    Minister of Propaganda
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    Sweet.
    www.surlybikes.com

    Life isn't all about getting drunk and eating chicken fingers.

  3. #3
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    Re: Hey SURLY.....Quit Starting $hit!!!!

    Stoked !

  4. #4
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    Can someone explain why this is good other than it is new, surly and new? I want to be stoked too.
    laotzucycles.blogspot.com

  5. #5
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    Inject fat into the equation

  6. #6
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    I see nothing exciting about a NON-Fat, heavy, 10 year old, CroMoly frame ... Clue me in, please.

  7. #7
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    Probably move this to the Surly brand section.
    ...Be careful what you're looking at because it might be looking back...

  8. #8
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    Dont pass judgement yet!!! Patience grasshopper

  9. #9
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    Symmetrical steel fatbike?
    Lucky neighbor of Maryland's Patapsco Valley State Park, 39.23,-76.76 Flickr

  10. #10
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    i dont' see what the excitement over the instigator is..


  11. #11
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    I thought "fat bikes" meant the tires. :P

  12. #12
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    oh snap.. I have been referring to my bike as the fatty this whole time...

    I'm gonna ride the fatty today..

    great time with fatty in the woods

    just another beauty shot of fatty

    stripping her down and spraying the insides.

  13. #13
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    subscribed....
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeabuser View Post
    I see nothing exciting about a NON-Fat, heavy, 10 year old, CroMoly frame ... Clue me in, please.
    A very strong bike that can be loaded with 70 pounds for offroad expeditions - sounds useful to me.

    Also ideal for adding an Xtracycle rear end.

    Probably why I have hung on to my Instigator frame.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    A very strong bike that can be loaded with 70 pounds for offroad expeditions - sounds useful to me.

    Also ideal for adding an Xtracycle rear end.

    Probably why I have hung on to my Instigator frame.
    Yet NOT Fat !
    Agreeing with Duggus.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by nitrousjunky View Post
    subscribed....
    Wise choice.....

  17. #17
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    Re: Hey SURLY.....Quit Starting $hit!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by bikeabuser View Post
    I see nothing exciting about a NON-Fat, heavy, 10 year old, CroMoly frame ... Clue me in, please.
    It's no Mongoose Beast, that's for sure.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    It's no Mongoose Beast, that's for sure.
    Quite true !

  19. #19
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    According to the Surly website, the frame has FFF chain stays. However the only close to fat tire that fits is a 24 X 3.0.

    http://surlybikes.com/uploads/downlo...Instigator.pdf
    Riding Fat and still just as fast as I never was.

  20. #20
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    I always wondered why surly never sold many instagators. Looking at reviews...I know why.

  21. #21
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    That .pdf is from 2003. So I'll venture a guess. They will reuse the name and the curved top tube, maybe the gusset and release a frame that will handle 4" or 29" Knards in the rear, symmetrical.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithcreek View Post
    That .pdf is from 2003. So I'll venture a guess. They will reuse the name and the curved top tube, maybe the gusset and release a frame that will handle 4" or 29" Knards in the rear, symmetrical.
    If they go that far, the might as well ditch the Pug's.
    Then again ... It's tooled up and popular, so cut production a bit, and see if they keep selling.

  23. #23
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    Nobby is often in the know, and I'm getting the feeling there's something to be in the know about, but a slightly more flexible version of an already versatile bike, is not my idea of breaking new ground.

    Of course, I'd be happy with a 29X3 Bud, so don't listen to me.....
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

    - FrostyStruthers



    www.mendoncyclesmith.com

  24. #24
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    I wonder how many of those knocking the Instigator have actually ridden one.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  25. #25
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    Hey SURLY.....Quit Starting $hit!!!!

    Oh, quit toying with 'em Nobby.

    Have you gotten a chance to see it?

    I've only heard info about it... but I'm really looking forward to seeing the complete bike.

  26. #26
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    Another new wheel size with an aggressive/dj style frame much like the original Instigator is what my sources have lead onto.

  27. #27
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    This is my Instigator as built for a 1,200 mile (approx) completely offroad ride in Oz (about 11 years ago). At the time that was as fat as I could get.

    One problem I had was to carry sufficient water and most of the weight of the stuff carried on the bike was water because temperatures are usually in the high 30s+ at that time of year. Basically enough water to get me to the next waterhole, plus enough to get me back if it was dry, so for some stretches that's 30kg of water alone to get a decent safety margin. That makes allowance for a lot of footslogging pushing the bike through thick bulldust.



    The USP of the Instigator is that heavily braced steering head. It doesn't wobble at speed when it's heavily laden, a problem I found with the first bike I built up. I suspect it's why it's the basis for the Big Dummy - I'd like a fat one of those.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  28. #28
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    ^^^ A FAT Big Dummy would be much more exciting.

  29. #29
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    ahh have not considered that.. yes that would be something worthwhile to add to their line up

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeabuser View Post
    ^^^ A FAT Big Dummy would be much more exciting.
    This!

  31. #31
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    This thread has been picked up by Surly's FB feed.

  32. #32
    aka bOb
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    A Big Fat Dummy.......Yeah not touching that one!

  33. #33
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    If they end up making a BFD, there will be no need for my minivan anymore(do it Surly, do it Surly, do it!). Poor Honda, you so sad.
    2014 Big Dummy
    2015 Salsa Beargrease Carbon 1
    2015 Ice Cream Truck

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    A Big Fat Dummy.......Yeah not touching that one!
    that means we're on to something

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmooveP View Post
    This thread has been picked up by Surly's FB feed.
    I hope they're listening !

  36. #36
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    funny, surly linked to this thread on their facebook page. If its's a symmetric rear end (less the dropouts) fat bike, then retaining the instigator name for it seems unlikely. The troll has largely replaced the instigator, unless they're thinking of a counterpart to the karatemonkey. i.e., KM: ogre::instigator:troll

  37. #37
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    I don't see why they couldnt update the instigator to take fat wheels for those folks who want a stock, all-mtn, hardtail, fatbike platform. As more and more folks take the fatties to the hard stuff, there is an opening for a fattie geared towards more agressive trail riding.

  38. #38
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    Ps. I doubt they're gonna do a fat dummy, unless they make one with a hundo BB and 170 rear end. I think I'd be weirded out by an offset 135 cargo bike. I think a Short Fat Dummy would be awesome though. With an integral rack setup rather than the xtracycle-y stuff

  39. #39
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    Maybe it's time for them to ditch the 135mm offset designs.

    I understand their reasons, but a FBFD would make one hell of a camping/excursion bike, and 170mm hubs are what everyone else is doing, it seems.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeabuser View Post
    Maybe it's time for them to ditch the 135mm offset designs....
    No, no, and no again. Please.

    Embiggen hubs as much as you like, but leave our 135mm offsets alone.

    They're a perfectly cromulent design for those of us who like light cheap hubs and/or hub gears.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  41. #41
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    Re: Hey SURLY.....Quit Starting $hit!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    No, no, and no again. Please.

    Embiggen hubs as much as you like, but leave our 135mm offsets alone.

    They're a perfectly cromulent design for those of us who like light cheap hubs and/or hub gears.
    The offset design works great. I love my Alfine 8 pugsley.

    On a related note, I got an email from surly saying they are only shipping bikes and framesets with non-offset forks now. They said they will still produce the offset forks for individual purchase, but new bikes won't come with them.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    This is my Instigator as built for a 1,200 mile (approx) completely offroad ride in Oz (about 11 years ago). At the time that was as fat as I could get.

    One problem I had was to carry sufficient water and most of the weight of the stuff carried on the bike was water because temperatures are usually in the high 30s+ at that time of year. Basically enough water to get me to the next waterhole, plus enough to get me back if it was dry, so for some stretches that's 30kg of water alone to get a decent safety margin. That makes allowance for a lot of footslogging pushing the bike through thick bulldust.



    The USP of the Instigator is that heavily braced steering head. It doesn't wobble at speed when it's heavily laden, a problem I found with the first bike I built up. I suspect it's why it's the basis for the Big Dummy - I'd like a fat one of those.
    How'd you get that IGH on there without a tesnioner?

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by aBicycle View Post
    How'd you get that IGH on there without a tesnioner?
    Calculated which combination of chainring and rear cog would give me a Magic Ratio setup with the chainstay length of the bike.

    I do the same with my 907 which is either singlespeed or hubgear.

    It also works with belt drive (I've done a couple of conversions for that).

    The downside with Magic Ratio is there is no provision for taking up slack in the chain as it wears so it's not a great idea for a bike used a lot in muddy abrasive conditions. I keep a stock of halflinks for making adjustments, but it's generally not a problem if you are using proper single chainline rings and cogs, because the bike can tolerate a lot of slack before it will drop a chain off full size teeth. (Mine never get slack anyway).
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    No, no, and no again. Please.

    Embiggen hubs as much as you like, but leave our 135mm offsets alone.

    They're a perfectly cromulent design for those of us who like light cheap hubs and/or hub gears.
    +1 - Since Salsa and Surly are essentially the same company we already have a QBP 170mm fat bike option. No need for Surly to replicate what Salsa is already making.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  45. #45
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    That's at least a +1 million for using embiggen and cromulent.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    +1 - Since Salsa and Surly are essentially the same company we already have a QBP 170mm fat bike option. No need for Surly to replicate what Salsa is already making.
    lots of shops can't get the salsa stuff, so it's not the same to many. aluminum vs steel of course, too.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by PretendGentleman View Post
    lots of shops can't get the salsa stuff, so it's not the same to many. aluminum vs steel of course, too.
    That's qbp's stupid strategy...

  48. #48
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    Stupid strategy ... I thought someone had said they were separate entities that are marketed by QBP.

    Regardless,
    I have already stated it's a dumb system ... Manufacturing & distributing an entire years stock by April = Bad idea !

    IMHO,
    That doesn't really increase demand ... It causes people to seek another manufacturer.

    If Surly started making a 170mm non-offset, they would sell.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by PretendGentleman View Post
    lots of shops can't get the salsa stuff, so it's not the same to many. aluminum vs steel of course, too.
    Salsa will sell your LBS who is a non-Salsa dealer their product if they have it in stock and if there isn't a local Salsa dealer. I asked them directly about this.

    If there isn't any stock that's a different issue not related to Salsa vs. Surly.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    On a related note, I got an email from surly saying they are only shipping bikes and framesets with non-offset forks now. They said they will still produce the offset forks for individual purchase, but new bikes won't come with them.
    Really? Then what are they shipping on next year's Pugsleys? 135mm symmetric frot forks ala the Necro doesn't quite make sense to me.... nor does 100mm symmetric forks (even if that's the Pugs that I would personally buy).

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