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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    I don't think that this will be the norm. I'm rough on my stuff, and have a tendency to find the weak point on frames.

    They should probably just hire me as a product tester.
    Pick better lines?

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    Oops.

    I was JRA...

  3. #53
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    That's not a weak point in that first pic. That is bad welding. Total fail.

  4. #54
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    Looks like it broke right at the edge of the weld, which is the weakest part.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by OddTrickStar View Post
    That's not a weak point in that first pic. That is bad welding. Total fail.
    As crash investigators, we usually have to send metal out to a lab to determine that. Impressive.
    Last edited by Jayem; 04-26-2015 at 09:21 PM.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  6. #56
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    The non fatty version of that frame doesn't hold up under hard riding either.Get a refund and wait for the motobecane full fatty.

  7. #57
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    I'm not a crash investigator, but doesn't the second picture indicate that the tube has cracked. So it seems that the weld might be OK, the section of tube below the weld has probably stuck with the weld and it is the tube that cracked under load.
    That's probably worse than the weld cracking - the tube is under designed for the load which applies to all of these bikes, rather than an isolated bad weld which might be down to bad workmanship. It is probably just a matter of time and loading before most of these frame crack (unless there was some random fault in that particular piece of tube).
    Anyway, I'll leave further analysis to the experts.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    As crash investigators, we usually have to send metal out to a lap to determine that. Impressive.
    I looked at it wrong. Ignore me.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichway View Post
    I'm not a crash investigator, but doesn't the second picture indicate that the tube has cracked. So it seems that the weld might be OK, the section of tube below the weld has probably stuck with the weld and it is the tube that cracked under load.
    That's probably worse than the weld cracking - the tube is under designed for the load which applies to all of these bikes, rather than an isolated bad weld which might be down to bad workmanship. It is probably just a matter of time and loading before most of these frame crack (unless there was some random fault in that particular piece of tube).
    Anyway, I'll leave further analysis to the experts.
    That's what I was thinking. I don't want to be a bearer of bad news, but that's why I wanted a refund and not a replacement.
    But like I said, I'm looking for a bike that I can ride hard. This will probably hold up to the average user.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by whichway View Post
    I'm not a crash investigator, but doesn't the second picture indicate that the tube has cracked. So it seems that the weld might be OK, the section of tube below the weld has probably stuck with the weld and it is the tube that cracked under load.
    Cracks that start at the edge of a bad weld can propagate strangely.

    Not saying you're wrong, just saying you're not necessarily right.

    Disclosure: I built a frame at Yamaguchi, and he spent a bunch of time showing us how bad brazes affected tubes, and it's similar enough to welding - areas of tubing change their structure after the heat gets applied because of their alloy properties - that I feel comfortable saying that much.

  11. #61
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    well the welds dont look real flash to start with...it could be that and or poor heat treatment or lack there off

  12. #62
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    when you weld, the surrounding metal in the base material (ie. the tube) is weakened. Commonly called a bad weld, but in reality it's bad heat treatment, welding technique, and post welding heat treatment. End of the day, it's all about the welding procedure. Not saying the tube thickness is too thin for the purpose (I personally think it should be thicker since it's for a fat bike with severe torque), but in this instance, it's all about the weld. I'd still wait to see if motobecane puts out a 4-link.

  13. #63
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    Anybody else get one of these and have better luck than me?
    Last edited by dirtdawg21892; 04-27-2015 at 11:08 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  14. #64
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    First trail ride this morning on the Quigley. My initial set up sucked, so I didnít get to ride as hard as I wanted. The Bluto was bottoming out and my tires felt like they were rolling off the rims. I still put in about 10 miles of good riding. I agree with Dirtdawg, the 22t chainring is useless, while the 36 was really good. Of course there was noticeable bob on the climbs, but I found it tolerable. The one thing that does bother me is the bobbing on heavy acceleration. The bike also feels really tall, maybe due to the height of the stem. Surprisingly, I didnít have any pedal strikes. Once I got home, I checked the air in the Bluto and it was less than 90psi, I had set it up at 135psi. Rear shock was good. Tire pressure showed 9psi, but I donít trust my gauges so I now have them at 15psi. I also removed the spacers under the stem to get a better feel. I actually liked the Vee8s and will be putting them on my Bullseye Monster while the Quigley is getting the Fat B Nimbles. So far, I have only been able to shave a 1lb off the weight. The stock stem was actually lighter than my Raceface and the stock bars were only 36g heavier. Overall, I really liked the way the bike felt on the downhills, now I just hope the frame will stay alive. Going for another hard ride this afternoon and see how it goes.

  15. #65
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    There is a guy on RatRodBikes that got one. He seems happy with it, but I doubt he rides as hard as you do.

  16. #66
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    With the suspension, do you really need the lower pressures? I'd think that with dry dirt, you could go up to 10-12 psi and not loose much traction.

  17. #67
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    /\ /\ /\ /\ Agreed , plus it won't feel like your tires will roll off.

    Body weight makes a HUGE difference too. I'm 240 without gear, and 12-15 psi is as low as I go anytime in not in snow.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    That's what I was thinking. I don't want to be a bearer of bad news, but that's why I wanted a refund and not a replacement.
    But like I said, I'm looking for a bike that I can ride hard. This will probably hold up to the average user.
    Do let us know if you find a fatbike that can be!

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by OfficerFriendly View Post
    Do let us know if you find a fatbike that can be!
    Well, my bullseye monster has stood up to 2000 fairly abusive miles and has been perfect.

    As for suspended fatbikes, I made the mistake of riding a foes mutz yesterday. I never want to ride any of my bikes again.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  20. #70
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    I have been coveting the Mutz myself. Only problem is the cost!

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    Well, my bullseye monster has stood up to 2000 fairly abusive miles and has been perfect.

    As for suspended fatbikes, I made the mistake of riding a foes mutz yesterday. I never want to ride any of my bikes again.
    Sigh...their small standover is 30 inches....to tall for me.
    The bike is never to heavy, you are just to WEAK!

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by blown240 View Post
    I have been coveting the Mutz myself. Only problem is the cost!
    true that. even if i sold all my bikes, my car, a kidney and gave hand jibbers on the side i would barely be able to afford a frame.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  23. #73
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    Frames are $2500 I think. Plus a bluto, plus everything else. And you wouldnt want to hang crap from such a great base. I get it would be roughly $6k to do it right.

  24. #74
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    ok, good news.
    as expected, BD pulled through and offered a refund or replacement. i emailed them saturday and had the reply by 1:00 PM monday. they really take customer service seriously. every experience ive had with them has been awesome, and i have several other bikes from them that are all great. i would not hesitate to buy from them again, but i think i will be sticking with hardtail frames from now on. i would try a 4bar setup, but in general suspension linkages require a lot more R&D and engineering than what went into this one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    ok, good news.
    as expected, BD pulled through and offered a refund or replacement. i emailed them saturday and had the reply by 1:00 PM monday. they really take customer service seriously. every experience ive had with them has been awesome, and i have several other bikes from them that are all great. i would not hesitate to buy from them again, but i think i will be sticking with hardtail frames from now on. i would try a 4bar setup, but in general suspension linkages require a lot more R&D and engineering than what went into this one.

    That's good news, but I was really hoping BD would do this: 1) fully refund you 2) send you a new swingarm 3 ) let you keep the bike and product test it for a year. Their costs would be limited and their feedback would be tremendous. Imagine a weekly report on various terrains to demonstrate where the Quigley shines and where it doesn't, its strengths and weaknesses, likes and dislikes, and areas for future improvements. Bikes Direct, I hope you are reading this.

  26. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmars3571 View Post
    That's good news, but I was really hoping BD would do this: 1) fully refund you 2) send you a new swingarm 3 ) let you keep the bike and product test it for a year. Their costs would be limited and their feedback would be tremendous. Imagine a weekly report on various terrains to demonstrate where the Quigley shines and where it doesn't, its strengths and weaknesses, likes and dislikes, and areas for future improvements. Bikes Direct, I hope you are reading this.
    I liked this idea the first time you brouht it up and i like it even more now. i'm not sure how to suggest that without coming off like a total d-bag though. they probably wouldn't appreciate receiving an email from a customer suggesting that they both give them the money back and let them keep the bike.
    however you're totally right in that i would ride it and give a thorough review, meaning more publicity to them.
    in the two times i road it I have already answered a lot of questions and had a couple people very interested in getting them themselves.
    the bike would be much more useful to them being reviewed than sitting broken in a box somewhere. (i cant imagine they would do anything with it. even if they discarded the frame they can't sell used parts, right?)
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  27. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    I liked this idea the first time you brouht it up and i like it even more now. i'm not sure how to suggest that without coming off like a total d-bag though. they probably wouldn't appreciate receiving an email from a customer suggesting that they both give me my money back and let me keep the bike.
    however you're totally right in that i would ride it and give a thorough review, meaning good publicity to them.
    the bike would be much more useful to them being reviewed than sitting broken in a box somewhere. (i cant imagine they would do anything with it. even if they discarded the frame they can't sell used parts, right?)
    Actually they will probably replace the swing arm and sell it on Bike Island at a discount. :-)

  28. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Destr0 View Post
    Actually they will probably replace the swing arm and sell it on Bike Island at a discount. :-)
    hmm, good to know.
    i thought that BI was mostly scratch and dent/blems. i didnt realize that they sold used bikes on there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  29. #79
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    bikeisland sells used bikes on there, but not because they want to. It's primarily returned bikes they don't sell in their shop, bikes damaged in shipping that they can't sell any other way, or someone lied to bikesdirect when they said they didn't use it, but they did.

    They do carry some spare parts on the bikeisland website, but I don't think I've ever seen the swingarms sold individually. If you are serious about using the bike, ask them if they can order a replacement swingarm. If they can, then bring up the possibility of doing further testing. If you end up breaking swingarm after swingarm, they'll want to know about it.

  30. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by watts888 View Post
    If you are serious about using the bike, ask them if they can order a replacement swingarm. If they can, then bring up the possibility of doing further testing. If you end up breaking swingarm after swingarm, they'll want to know about it.
    they said that they would gladly replace the bike or issue me a refund. they probably dont have swingarms kicking around and therefor would rather just send me another complete that's sitting in the warehouse.
    either way a lot has changed in the 5 months since i ordered it and i need the money more than i need a bike that may or may not break on me again. that being said, i would still gladly test it for them.
    Last edited by dirtdawg21892; 04-29-2015 at 08:49 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  31. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    ok, good news.
    as expected, BD pulled through and offered a refund or replacement. i emailed them saturday and had the reply by 1:00 PM monday. they really take customer service seriously. every experience ive had with them has been awesome, and i have several other bikes from them that are all great. i would not hesitate to buy from them again, but i think i will be sticking with hardtail frames from now on. i would try a 4bar setup, but in general suspension linkages require a lot more R&D and engineering than what went into this one.
    The motobecanes do get plenty of R&D and engineering time.That will be a much better bike.IMO The Quigley is really just a recreational bike.

  32. #82
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    Refund. That's not a one off failed weld, that's a failed design.

    Just spend the money on a good FS fat frame or stick with a rigid.

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    Oops.


  33. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    Yeah, what could possibly go wrong with an x9? It's all name brand stuff except for the frame (which is the same as a 4 season)
    maybe the hub?
    I can't speak for Cody, but IME with an x7 the freehub sounded like a train out of the box, and occasionally a chunk inside it locks it or makes it skip a tooth. The GOX crankset came with bolts for the granny ring that were too short, coupled with the fact the bosses weren't threaded all the way to the face, and only had 3-4mm of thread engaged--not to mention the fact that the BB was ticking--after fifty miles. I had a little interchange with a rep, and decided I would just fix the crap--my fault I bought it and believed it might be anything but crap.

    I just hope the frame stays solid--looks like a cosmetic second, but alignment is OK.
    The geo is nice as well.

    Sucks to see broken frames though, at least with the component fails there are easy options.

    Quote Originally Posted by Destr0 View Post
    Actually they will probably replace the swing arm and sell it on Bike Island at a discount. :-)
    Whoa, hold on there, someone will have to break a front triangle first.

  34. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    Refund. That's not a one off failed weld, that's a failed design.

    Just spend the money on a good FS fat frame or stick with a rigid.
    Just because one of the first bikes delivered and the swing arm has failed doesn't automatically make a "failed design"! Its a bad deal this one broke!

    Mine arrives on Friday and I may be singing a different tune next week!

    Not everyone has the coin for a ~"proven" FS fatty design!
    If the Quigley works out for others then it'll be a plus.

    Gravity bikes are not equal to many name brand bikes in more
    ways than one! (I think everyone knows this!) But it appears they are standing behind their product in this case and offering a refund or fix at customers choice.

  35. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by mxer View Post
    The motobecanes do get plenty of R&D and engineering time.
    Certaintly not by the people selling them. Obviously sombody designed it, but Its all just open mold stuff with stickers on it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  36. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by mxer View Post
    IMO The Quigley is really just a recreational bike.
    It's not spec'd like a recreational bike. You don't buy 4 pot calipers, a 120mm bluto and an x9 RD for recreational riding.

    Maybe they could pair this thing with x5 stuff, some novelas to stop it, and one of those suspension forks you can get for $100 from alibaba. It could sell for like $700 and be a decent entery level FS
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  37. #87
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    Maybe someone should define recreational. Many people doing lift-served downhilling are just recreational riding, unless they're pros in training. Recreational riding certainly includes freeriding, hucking, all-mountain, enduro riding and aggressive XC. But the Quig would not be a logical choice for most of these.

  38. #88
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    Let's be honest folks, this was a questionable design to begin with, then the first one out of the box has a cracked swing arm in less than a week.

    Anyone who buys a full suspension fat bike is going to want to ride it on rough terrain, otherwise what's the point of having full suspension.

    Good luck with your bike.

    I'd recommend sticking with a rigid unless you have the cash to buy a quality FS frame.

    Quote Originally Posted by Back-to-Doo View Post
    Just because one of the first bikes delivered and the swing arm has failed doesn't automatically make a "failed design"! Its a bad deal this one broke!

    Mine arrives on Friday and I may be singing a different tune next week!

    Not everyone has the coin for a ~"proven" FS fatty design!
    If the Quigley works out for others then it'll be a plus.

    Gravity bikes are not equal to many name brand bikes in more
    ways than one! (I think everyone knows this!) But it appears they are standing behind their product in this case and offering a refund or fix at customers choice.

  39. #89
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    is it too early to say "I told you so"?

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    I don't think anyone was expecting a Mutz or a Bucksaw, I'll admit that I was surprised that the frame failed structurally.

    It's a shame for sure, I like the brand as a less expensive way to get riding and test the waters; I got a Lurch for that very reason.

    The swing arm would probably survive if it was steel. Maybe the next frame will have a lower pivot or even a multilink design.

    My Mutz frame, shock, and fork cost double the complete price for the Quigley, so not really accessible to all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantic View Post
    is it too early to say "I told you so"?

  41. #91
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    They put out a bike with bad suspension design that is known for brake jack/pedal bob. If you are going to go single pivot at least make it a much lower pivot.

    So far reports are massive bob in low ring (almost useless) limited travel
    2nd busted swingarm in 2 days with wear patterns showing side loads

    Thats not really a good start. Are there any other reviews on this? I applaud them to try and make one more accessible to people, but whats the point if the design (geometry) sucks and it's potentially not very reliable?

  42. #92
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    This is funny to me.

    A guys bucksaw cracks, and it's okay cause sh*t happens.

    This guy's Quigley cracks, and it's because BD has sh*tty R&D or none at all, and because duh, it's a Gravity.

    Not saying the two are equal in any way, just that the response to both are very different.

  43. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shinkers View Post
    This is funny to me.

    A guys bucksaw cracks, and it's okay cause sh*t happens.

    This guy's Quigley cracks, and it's because BD has sh*tty R&D or none at all, and because duh, it's a Gravity.

    Not saying the two are equal in any way, just that the response to both are very different.
    this is true, and in general i'm very much a sh!t happens kind of guy, and always willing to give a second chance. the only reason i reacted differently to this is because we were all a bit skeptical of the design to begin with. the fact that it broke the second time that i road it just confirmed my concern that they tried to jump on the FS bandwagon before they had worked the kinks out of the design.
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus View Post
    Hell of a jump, dawg. Even though they're baggy shorts, I'm surprised that you can fit your balls into them.

  44. #94
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    I think I'd be even more angry about a Bucksaw failure if it was mine.

    I suppose anything can break, so maybe the Quigley is not as "big a deal" since we all sorta had low expectations to start. I was rooting for the underdog

    Knock on wood, but I haven't had bad luck with bikes, I have not broken a frame, fork, or swing arm. My bad luck is with hubs (muni and bike/tandem), so I get the beefiest ones I can afford.

    I rode a Lurch for a while to "explore my options", I got a Mutz coming, so if it breaks (I can't imagine it) I will be peeved. I plan to ride my Mutz big, all the time, no holding back, it's my monster truck

    My only regret is that I just got a DeVinci Atlas, which I really like, but I have a feeling the Mutz will end up being my daily driver.

    I still gotta rub my head in wonderment that BD didn't produce a frame with a more proven design, they have the technology and access to designs, so why not do it right to start?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shinkers View Post
    This is funny to me.

    A guys bucksaw cracks, and it's okay cause sh*t happens.

    This guy's Quigley cracks, and it's because BD has sh*tty R&D or none at all, and because duh, it's a Gravity.

    Not saying the two are equal in any way, just that the response to both are very different.

  45. #95
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    Part of the problem with the response here is this is the first Quigley to get a review and it cracked. There are quite a few Bucksaws in the wild and only one failure that we are aware of. Now if the other Gravity bikes do not share the same fate then it is a fluke - right now the jury is still out on that one.

  46. #96
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    I will keep giving my reviews as time goes on. So far I have 3 hard rides. I am 210lbs and my riding style is mostly aggressive XC. Most of the terrain I ride consists of rough, eroded, rooty downhills where I can huck at most 1-2ft drops, a few small jumps where you only travel about 12-15 feet, lots of berms, several ditch crossings that one can bunny hop over, and a couple of log crossings. When I was doing Strava, I held a few KOM's on this stuff, so I would like to think I am putting a good beating on the Quigley. No signs of frame breakage as of yet. To compensate for the bobbing, I have ordered a 26t small ring and a 40t Hope cog for the cassette in hopes of being able to keep it in the 36t up front more. 20psi in the tires seems to be just right for me until I lose a few pounds off my gut. The only side to side flexing I am experiencing is on the really fast, twisty, tight trails but I feel the same thing on my Spec Camber. At this point, with only 4 rides in, I am loving it. The Quig is a heavy pig though, but holy cow, it is fun to ride. I just hope that swingarm keeps holding up.

  47. #97
    Pedal through the Pain
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    Quote Originally Posted by benlowery View Post
    So far reports are massive bob in low ring (almost useless) limited travel
    2nd busted swingarm in 2 days with wear patterns showing side loads

    Thats not really a good start. Are there any other reviews on this? I applaud them to try and make one more accessible to people, but whats the point if the design (geometry) sucks and it's potentially not very reliable?

    I have not heard the news of a 2nd busted swingarm. Was the breakage similar to Dirtdawgs?

  48. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by radair View Post
    Maybe someone should define recreational. Many people doing lift-served downhilling are just recreational riding, unless they're pros in training. Recreational riding certainly includes freeriding, hucking, all-mountain, enduro riding and aggressive XC. But the Quig would not be a logical choice for most of these.
    Ok recreational as in rail trails.Better now?

  49. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtdawg21892 View Post
    It's not spec'd like a recreational bike. You don't buy 4 pot calipers, a 120mm bluto and an x9 RD for recreational riding.

    Maybe they could pair this thing with x5 stuff, some novelas to stop it, and one of those suspension forks you can get for $100 from alibaba. It could sell for like $700 and be a decent entery level FS
    That is probably how the should sell it imo.Like i said i have seen the non fat version of this frame fail too.

  50. #100
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    holy crap 20psi off road? I top out around 15 for pavement on my Bucksaw.

    And FWIW, I've put my BS through some tough miles. After this weekend, I've passed 300 on the bike so far. The early miles were mostly non-technical, but with lots of sloppy weather. Wet, cold, ice, mud. Lately it's been dry and I've been beating on it. Just spent the weekend in Pisgah and Dupont State Forest. Took the Avery Creek Trail downhill and the top mile is just nasty. BS didn't complain. As I got lower, I got faster, and I was able to hit some of the chunk at speed. No complaints. Dupont was even faster, with some chunk there, also. A couple of times I took some seriously stupid lines. Still the BS didn't complain.

    This is, I think, the key difference between the BS, the Mutz, the Turner (not so many Khan reviews here yet - are the owners out riding them too much to post?), and the Quigley. These other bikes are getting ridden no less hard. It took quite some time before a problem showed up on a BS frame. For the Quigley, it was almost immediately. Doesn't bode well. To be fair, I tried searching for other cracked Quigleys, and I only found this one. Was this one a fluke? Since nobody has hundreds of miles on one yet, it's impossible to say. It will take time and lots more miles with no problems before we can say this one is not a pervasive problem. But again, it doesn't bode well. FS fat does well ridden aggressively. It's kinda the point.

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