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  1. #1
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    Carbon Fiber Rims

    Anyone have any details on these?

    Carbon Fiber Rims-cf-rims.jpg
    --Peace

  2. #2
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    Ha, they beat me to this milestone too?! LOL damn it!!
    Disclaimer: I run Regular Cycles (as of 2016). As a profiteer of the bicycle industry, I am not to be taken very seriously.

  3. #3
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    how wide are they?

  4. #4
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    They are RD width. I believe that's what he used as a mold. He and his wife rode on them all winter. Under racing conditions as well. Pretty cool stuff!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrcRS View Post
    They are RD width. I believe that's what he used as a mold.
    *FACE PALM*

    I cannot believe I didn't think of that. And I had so many things I got done to feel smart today.
    Disclaimer: I run Regular Cycles (as of 2016). As a profiteer of the bicycle industry, I am not to be taken very seriously.

  6. #6
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    The maker of these rims has been working on 80 and 100mm sizes. The 80s are similar to rds. He has been developing them testing and improving them for awhile now. I dont want to give everything away without his permission but they are super light super stiff and so far have held up great! Keep your eyes and ears open. Wont be too long before you see these available.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by alaskairhog View Post
    The maker of these rims has been working on 80 and 100mm sizes. The 80s are similar to rds. He has been developing them testing and improving them for awhile now. I dont want to give everything away without his permission but they are super light super stiff and so far have held up great! Keep your eyes and ears open. Wont be too long before you see these available.
    Enve is my guess based on their proximity to the 907 distribution network in UT.

  8. #8
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    This is a guy in Anchorage. He is making them himself.
    He had different rims at different weights, but one of them was in the mid 500 gram range.
    They looked reasonably well made.
    Unlaced, they are super flexy, laced, they felt solid.

  9. #9
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    Badass. Can't wait to hear more about this.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Diller View Post
    *FACE PALM*

    I cannot believe I didn't think of that. And I had so many things I got done to feel smart today.
    Come on Drew, 'splashing' a mold off a current part is one of the oldest tricks in the book! Do it right and you don't even need to ruin the part. Fun stuff, can't wait to see more on these!
    Whatever floats your bike, dude

  11. #11
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    if you could get a layer of honey comb or another sandwich core construction it would make a stiffer rim with very little weight added

    and that is my 2 cents
    I am slow therefore I am

  12. #12
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    Subscribed......

  13. #13
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    Re: Carbon Fiber Rims

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustin Mustangs View Post
    Come on Drew, 'splashing' a mold off a current part is one of the oldest tricks in the book! Do it right and you don't even need to ruin the part. Fun stuff, can't wait to see more on these!
    Interesting. Do you have any more details of this technique? Or a link? Ive looked but cannot find anything

    Thanks

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by pubwheels View Post
    Interesting. Do you have any more details of this technique? Or a link? Ive looked but cannot find anything

    Thanks
    Silicone resin. Smooth-on.com has some neat stuff. Still chuckling at myself Dustin, but I'm going to exercise some patience and stick with my original design intent.
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  15. #15
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    I'd be concerned about their ability to run as an offset lacing like for the front of a pug.

    I guess you could swap in a different fork and non-offset.
    Fatbike Chicago on Facebook

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by mochunk View Post
    I'd be concerned about their ability to run as an offset lacing like for the front of a pug.

    I guess you could swap in a different fork and non-offset.
    I love my Pugsley and all, but I'd upgrade to a new frameset before I'd upgrade to carbon rims.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Diller View Post
    Silicone resin. Smooth-on.com has some neat stuff. Still chuckling at myself Dustin, but I'm going to exercise some patience and stick with my original design intent.
    You don't even need to get that carried away. Just treat the original part like your plug. Add some temporary flanges around the perimeter and modify the shape of the part if needed with foam covered in tooling resin and/or modeling clay. Coat it with a system of release agents and form the mold right over the original part using standard techniques. A rim doesn't have proper relief for a one piece mold so you would need a parting flange as well (which you can see evidence of right down the middle of the rim).
    Whatever floats your bike, dude

  18. #18
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    no details on those, but I'd prefer to see them double wall and not just a copy of an existing rim... more to come soon.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2silent View Post
    no details on those, but I'd prefer to see them double wall and not just a copy of an existing rim... more to come soon.
    And hopefully with no rim-braking surface for disc only. I'm sure that would shed some grams.

  20. #20
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    certainly

  21. #21
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    First it was drilling holes.. now this! I cannot wait until I sell the kids so I can get started on this sort of thing!

    Amazing!
    My bike is heavier than yours - it does not have Carbon or Titanium parts - I love it!

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbasinger View Post
    This is a guy in Anchorage. He is making them himself.
    He had different rims at different weights, but one of them was in the mid 500 gram range.
    They looked reasonably well made.
    Unlaced, they are super flexy, laced, they felt solid.
    To correct some misinformation:

    Correction 1.......mid 400(!) grams.........a set raced the WhiteMountains 100 in Fairbanks Alaska.......Janice T..........on a 449 gram front rim and 499 gram rear. (That is less than a pound for that front rim. ) Janice T. mentioned that the smooth carbon surface shed overflow and slush....the holy-alum. rims and ribbon rimstrips attracted the slush.

    The "...flexy...", but, "...felt solid." rim that Pbasinger mentions was 411 grams. I go 190 lbs. and was unable to fail it on the rear laced symetrical on my 9Zero7/170 symetrical rear. That 411 gram rim was a "stunt" not for all-world use.

    Asymetrical lacing has been accomplished. Dorothy's 9Zero7/135mm rear is setup this way.

    Correction 2. ......These have been on the trail since fall of 2011. The project began a year or more earlier. They've been on the trail for 2 seasons now in various weights and laminate schedules. (laminate schedule could be defined as...number of layers of material, properties of the various materials, and it's location in the laminate stack...........this is the beauty of composite structures........locate the strength/stiffness/flex(?) where you design it to be)

    Correction 3. .......RD was not used as a "mold". The early-attempted first generation rims were based on a "graceful" rim. The process was not working..... ......as I developed the process the RD became available, and the profile appeared to be a great structural shape...... This second generation rim looks very similar to RD. There are subtle differences.

    Corr. 4. I quote Pbasinger:"...reasonably well made...". Whewh, that could 'ouch' hurt my feelings ("could", but it doesn't....these are made to be light, and the cosmetics will improve)..........I have poured effort into this project......and have derived..and ridden...since fall 2011....an 80mm carbon fat rim......and continue the development. (a 100mm and wider are on tap, as well as a narrower hoop) I refuse to add weight by including a glossy finish or using a pretty carbon weave outer surface for cosmetic reasons alone.......Thank You P for helping me think and realize why I do this........it's about........decreasing the rotating mass of my fatbike........no offense P!!

    A note to all......please take ZERO offense if questions are left unanswered or take some time to be answered. I fix airplanes for a living (yep!, remember the Wright brother's, cycle-builders?) and our busy season in Alaska is just now upon us. Plus, there's great crust skiing to be had soon for us skate skiers, the SuperCub bushplane-accessed backcountry powder is excellent at the moment (I was out yesterday), biking-even skinny biking- can be had, snowkiting is ON, and when the ice breaks up, kitesurfing and surfing season will have arrived. Busy season!!! So why would I be on a webforum???

    Thank You. D E6roller
    Last edited by E6roller; 04-03-2013 at 11:15 AM.

  23. #23
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    Carbon fat wheels

    Well the Rolf fat carbon wheel is a kickassure cool lookin but was an April fools joke I sadly fell for last year
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    Here is the new HED Carbon wheels coming out very soon. Might not be the lightest wheels but hell ya....I want em.
    Carbon Fiber Rims-hed-carbon-fiber-tri-spoke-fat-bike-wheels1-600x517.jpg

  24. #24
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    Or the Spinergy version... in my basement.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Carbon Fiber Rims-spinergy.jpg  


  25. #25
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    wow super interested in the wider than 100, how much like a 110? 120? do tell I'd love to hear more.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by yxan View Post
    wow super interested in the wider than 100, how much like a 110? 120? do tell I'd love to hear more.

    Hi. about 111.

  27. #27
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    ....it's 11 more than 100.

    (sorry for the "This is Spinal Tap" reference, but that show was pretty funny)

  28. #28
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    I am guessing these will be very costly.

    I'd consider laying down serious money only if the rims were designed and functioned well set up tubeless. Paying a lot of cash to save 400+ grams rotating weight only to put 300 grams of tube on the rim seems counter productive.

    The benefit of lighter weight is greater the farther out from the wheel center due to centripetal force. So the benefit of weight reduction on the rim is greater compared to the benefit of weight loss at the hub, but the benefits are even greater when the weight reduction is even further out at the tube and tire.

    Hoping you are already working this angle.

    And totally stoked to see this level of innovation!

  29. #29
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    Impressive to say the least. I feel lucky to be living in the cradle of fat bike technology.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2silent View Post
    Or the Spinergy version... in my basement.
    2silent....How you do dat? Hubs? You runnin two rears? I got me Spins collectin dust. 2silent... Can it be done?

  31. #31
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    awesome!

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoobytao View Post
    I am guessing these will be very costly.

    I'd consider laying down serious money only if the rims were designed and functioned well set up tubeless. Paying a lot of cash to save 400+ grams rotating weight only to put 300 grams of tube on the rim seems counter productive.

    The benefit of lighter weight is greater the farther out from the wheel center due to centripetal force. So the benefit of weight reduction on the rim is greater compared to the benefit of weight loss at the hub, but the benefits are even greater when the weight reduction is even further out at the tube and tire.

    Hoping you are already working this angle.

    And totally stoked to see this level of innovation!
    Tubeless Fatty Carbon???

    Please check and respond to the thread on Fatty Tubeless methods and actual weights that I started in the FatBike forum.

    If you have had excellent to perfect results going tubeless, your findings and a report would be valued.

    Thank You. D

  33. #33
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    PS. Thank You to all my prospective testers!!!! (and Thank you for all the encouraging personal messages,!!) I do not require test riders at present. Again, thank you for the interest!

    I have hammered stuff hard. I thought my carbon bars, fork, and seatpost would break on some of my early rides last fall when out of synch on some whoops and g-outs (pretty thin snow cover early last fall in Anchorage). Zero rim issues!

    Again, I do not require testing assistance at this date. But Thank You!

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoobytao View Post
    save 400+ grams rotating weight only to put 300 grams of tube on the rim seems counter productive.
    I am running 8 ounce inner tubes and a 1 ounce rim strip......9 ounces equals....254.3 grams....I have been weighing the tubes and rim strip materials in my wheels and others'. This is real world weights.

    Tubeless would be great for other advantages, but so far, I have not heard of any tubeless set up that could save even as much as 75 grams from that.

    WE can argue tubeless advantages on another thread. I am all ears on that topic!

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    Tubeless would be great for other advantages, but so far, I have not heard of any tubeless set up that could save even as much as 75 grams from that.
    I dont mean to diminish the amazing potential of superlight carbon fat rims, whether tubeless or not.

    And yes, I understand that most methods with tape, foam, or split tubes haven't delivered real weight loss. (I tried Gorilla tape and gave up when I felt like I got the worst of both worlds - heavy AND unreliable.)

    That said, I was working with a rim not designed for tubeless. Speedway appears to have a succesfully created a fat rim that can be used tubeless without all that. Just a rim strip and a couple? few? scoops of Stans.

    Oddly, the Uma 90 rim is kinda heavy. Is extra rim thickness needed for the ridge/bead shelf?

    If functional weight loss for fatbiking by going to a tubeless ready rim is a fantasy, I'd like to know, and will adjust my expectations and purchasing accordingly. But if it is possible, then rims that aren't tubeless ready will be at a significant disadvantage.

    Thanks for putting the tubeless weight loss question out there in the other thread to analyze this. I hope the forum gets lots of input (specifically on the Uma's, the only rims designed to run tubeless) to settle this question.

  36. #36
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    any chance of making a 65mm rim?

  37. #37
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    I dont want to test, I want to buy!

  38. #38
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    A narrower fatty is on my 'To Do' list.

    Going narrow was once a way to save weight and rotating mass.

    This lightweight (449 gram) 80mm hoop is a revelation in handling and acceleration.

    It has similar stiffness, unlaced, as a comparable single wall alum. rim. (I must note that the "flexy unlaced" 411 gram rim previously mentioned by Pbasinger was a test/stunt. The current 449 gram carbon hoop is comparable to aluminum in stiffness). But it weighs half (!) of the aluminum rim weight.

    carbon 80 versus alu. 55:
    ...In one case, my wife came off a 55mm aluminum hoop that served her well and is now on my 80mm that weighs 449grams......... (wait a moment.......I will weigh the 55....it is 665 grams or 23.4 ounces bare hoop)........the 80's she is riding are 216 grams or 7.6 ounces lighter than the 55 aluminum.

    ....anyway, the point is she is now riding 80mm carbon hoops that are 32 percent lighter than her 55mm aluminum hoops and will never go back to the narrow rim at that weight.

    The rotating weight savings comes in to play as a feeling of quick handling as well as quick acceleration. For me, it remains to be seen if a narrower fat-rim is necessary, but I will do one at some point. The tire profile (with the available tire-width/carcass/tread added to rim-width combinations)....and it's affect on handling feel, are areas to explore. It is very cool that we have several tire's to choose from!!!

  39. #39
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    PS. ScoobyTao, sans-tube-ready graphite hoops are not a fantasy. It will happen.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by e6roller View Post
    i am running 8 ounce inner tubes and a 1 ounce rim strip......9 ounces equals....254.3 grams....i have been weighing the tubes and rim strip materials in my wheels and others'. This is real world weights.

    Tubeless would be great for other advantages, but so far, i have not heard of any tubeless set up that could save even as much as 75 grams from that.

    We can argue tubeless advantages on another thread. I am all ears on that topic!
    uma 90.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTR2ebike View Post
    uma 90.
    Speedway's UMA 90 is a very nice wheel....working tubeless flawlessly for years with Stan's FatTape and Sealant. That is VERY COOL!!


    Are you saying the tubeless method on them is saving more than 75 grams? As I had postulated against in my statement that you quoted? I would like to defend my statement.

    Let us be friendly here, please.


    ......I mentioned that I had not heard of any reliable tubeless method saving as much as 75 grams from my 254.3g tube and rim tape ..........REGARDLESS of TUBELESS ADVANTAGES, that was simply a statement about what I have learned thus far of various tubeless method weights. If I am wrong, I will gladly accept correction!!

    Let's take a look at my math:
    254.3 grams is the weight of my 1 ounce rim tape and 8 ounce innertube....(.measured weight is 8.9701685 ounces..).... this is not a "superlight" tube, by the way. I'll find out exactly what it is.
    254.3g minus 75 grams = 179.3 grams......this is the weight you'd have acheived with your tubeless method to make my qouted statement incorrect.

    Stans and tape and foam filler and valve stem:
    3 scoops of sealant= 6 fluid ounces = about 170 grams (I'm allowing you some advantage here)
    Tape weighs=?
    Ribbon weighs=?
    Foam filler weighs=?
    valve stem=?

    ..........170g of sealant weight alone. You can see that the tape, ribbon, valve stem, and foam filler would weigh at least the remaining 9.3 grams to stay within the weight of my inner tube and rim tape minus the 75 grams savings I have yet to hear about.

    Hey. I'm just defending my statement above. No offense. Please let me know what you're thinking. And make a post on the FattyTubeless summary thread.

    I'm glad you mentioned the UMA 90. IT's BEEN tubeless for several years in extreme conditions. Excellent product from Speedway/FatBack Cycles!!

  42. #42
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    Today I used a lot of duct and packing tape on a "stock" rim. I was able to get an inner profile/bead that aired up with my floor pump and held air until I came to work (4 hours) with zero sealant. It wasn't overly hard to get the tire onto the rim and when I let the air out the beads stayed set...

    A rim built with that profile would save a lot of grams.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by E6roller View Post
    Speedway's UMA 90 is a very nice wheel....working tubeless flawlessly for years with Stan's FatTape and Sealant. That is VERY COOL!!

    Are you saying the tubeless method on them is saving more than 75 grams? As I had postulated against in my statement that you quoted? I would like to defend my statement.

    Let us be friendly here, please.

    ......I mentioned that I had not heard of any reliable tubeless method saving as much as 75 grams from my 254.3g tube and rim tape ..........REGARDLESS of TUBELESS ADVANTAGES, that was simply a statement about what I have learned thus far of various tubeless method weights. If I am wrong, I will gladly accept correction!!

    Let's take a look at my math:
    254.3 grams is the weight of my 1 ounce rim tape and 8 ounce innertube....(.measured weight is 8.9701685 ounces..).... this is not a "superlight" tube, by the way. I'll find out exactly what it is.
    254.3g minus 75 grams = 179.3 grams

    Stans and tape and foam filler and valve stem:
    3 scoops of sealant= 6 fluid ounces = about 170 grams (I'm giving you an advantage here)
    Tape weighs=?
    Ribbon weighs=?
    Foam filler weighs=?

    ..........170g of sealant weight alone. You can see that the tape, ribbon, and foam filler would weigh at least the remaining 9.3 grams to stay within the weight of my inner tube and rim tape minus the 75 grams savings I have yet to hear about.

    Hey. I'm just defending my statement above.

    I'm glad you mentioned the UMA 90. IT's BEEN tubeless for several years in extreme conditions. Excellent product from Speedway/FatBack Cycles!!
    I've said from day one I don't think you can save much if any weight going tubeless on a fatty. However I think UMA's are the only possible exception. If Speedway made a lighter and thinner rim with that same system i'd be all over it.

    I ran 3 scoops in my UMA/BFL combo, never got a flat, never added sealant. Opened them up after a year and their was still 2 solid scoops that hadn't dried up. I now run marge lites, split tube, NO foam w/2 scoops and it works. I have run 1 scoop before and I bet you'd be more likely to get a flat with a tube than 1 scoop of sealant. I've also had rolling darryls set up the same way.

    If you're just talking weight (not other tubeless benefits) then you don't need foam or 170g of sealant. Assuming you don't have any spoke poking out of the nipple that eliminates the need for ribbon or duct tape under the fat stans as your carbon wheels don't have holes. In my mind a carbon wheel with a proper bead hook all your looking at is fat stans + sealant.

    The only time I ever had tubes in my fatty was day 1, I ended up walking back to my car with one flat and the next morning had 2 flats. Went tubeless that same day.

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    I don't think the stan's yellow fat rim tape has a valve stem does it?

    so, even if the rim didn't need any build up material, we still need sealing tape, a valve stem, and at least a couple scoops of sealant.

    I would want any rim that I was working on to be tubeless ready. I hate the way most bicycle tires, especially fat tires fit the rims. I would rather have to struggle to get the tire over the rim with levers, than have it fall on, and have to struggle to get it centered, and still have issues with it having a loose seat on the bead.

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    Keep me posted!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by autodoctor911 View Post
    I don't think the stan's yellow fat rim tape has a valve stem does it?

    so, even if the rim didn't need any build up material, we still need sealing tape, a valve stem, and at least a couple scoops of sealant.

    I would want any rim that I was working on to be tubeless ready. I hate the way most bicycle tires, especially fat tires fit the rims. I would rather have to struggle to get the tire over the rim with levers, than have it fall on, and have to struggle to get it centered, and still have issues with it having a loose seat on the bead.
    You don't need a valve stem to go tubeless, hopes and dreams will make it air tight
    Add 4g for a valve stem

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    Quote Originally Posted by GTR2ebike View Post
    You don't need a valve stem to go tubeless, hopes and dreams will make it air tight
    Add 4g for a valve stem
    Ok, thanks, I agree with you. A properly designed rim and tire combo would do very well with 50-100g of sealant, a 4g(not verified by me yet) valve stem and about 20g of tape at most. with no holes, the tape can be thinner, as long as no sharp edges are forced against it.

    Question to E6roller:

    have you stayed away from double wall designs due to manufacturing difficulties, or because the single wall will work just as well in fat applications?

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    I want a 29" 50mm wide rim please!

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    another question to E6roller:

    You say how you can vary the thickness, or layers to put material where you need it. Have you been able to make a thicker backbone type frame that encompasses the spoke holes and outer vertical elements, while leaving the rest thinner?

    Or, Have you just varied the thickness across the width of the rim, like an aluminum rim already can do?

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    Posts
    154
    Autodoctor91. It is single wall and works.

    There are probably 15 ways to skin a cat. 5 of the 15 ways to skin the cat may be acceptable. Of those 5 ways, 2 ways may be really good. The important thing is that the cat is skinned.

    Mr. WishIWereRiding, I want one of those too!

    GTR2ebike, thanks for your clarification.

    Have a nice weekend all!

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