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  1. #201
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    My RCT3 Damper seems to no longer be locking out or changing damping at all regardless of where it is set (open/ climb/ lockout). I haven't had a chance to check oil levels or the like, but thought I'd post here just to gather ideas/ experience from others.
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

  2. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by alshead View Post
    My RCT3 Damper seems to no longer be locking out or changing damping at all regardless of where it is set (open/ climb/ lockout). I haven't had a chance to check oil levels or the like, but thought I'd post here just to gather ideas/ experience from others.
    I think you already nailed it with the fluid level.

  3. #203
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    Was it working when you installed it

  4. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by alshead View Post
    My RCT3 Damper seems to no longer be locking out or changing damping at all regardless of where it is set (open/ climb/ lockout). I haven't had a chance to check oil levels or the like, but thought I'd post here just to gather ideas/ experience from others.
    More then likely oil level..... rct3 seems to be very sensitive to that
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  5. #205
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    But a change in oil level means a leak somewhere then.....check bottom bolts for a good seal and no drips ..may need to change crush washers

  6. #206
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    Right now I have the 100mm Bluto on my Framed Minnesota 3.0. I have issues with it bottoming out easy. So would my first step be to add another black token ? I have not opened it up, but it should have 2 of them? so adding one more would make 3 ?


    I am 250 before gear so around 260. I have 155 in the shock but did not want to go any more for a few reasons.


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  7. #207
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    I weigh 240, 250+ geared up and I went from zero to three tokens in my 120mm Bluto to get it from bottoming out while still having small bump compliance. I would say add a token or two. Only takes about 5 minutes to swap them out - I started with two, then went to three. I am probably going to try a fourth once it gets warm again and I start riding harder. :-)
    I have the RCT3 damper and more tokens to add to my 100mm Bluto as well - but still waiting on my Bucksaw frame to get here. If you want to run that low of pressure, I would put in the max (four) tokens at the start. I believe I am running 200# in my Bluto with the three tokens. Before the tokens at 200PSI I would bottom out, 220 I would not bottom out easily but the fork was very stiff and didn't move very well on smaller bumps.

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlowerThenSnot View Post
    More then likely oil level..... rct3 seems to be very sensitive to that
    Thanks, Dave- that's what I've heard.

    I also picked up the Borealis/ Turnagain ETR/ O-Ring kit and plan on installing that in the next few days, so I'll have the whole fork apart either way. I don't think I'm getting fluid loss at all, but it's possible that with the colder temps, the fluid isn't flowing well and so the damper is acting like it doesn't have enough. Or something.
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

  9. #209
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    Ok, so my awesome friend at one of my LBS gave me 2 black tokens. I put them in, I now have 4.

    After seeing what they are, I want to know what they do, and how they work ??
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  10. #210
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    I am not sure how they work, but they make the spring rate more progressive. Air forks are more progressive than spring forks, but lots of technology and tuning has gone into air forks to make them more linear like a coil fork. This takes some of that away and makes it more progressive (harder to compress the farther down the travel it goes).

    As for the science behind it, I have no idea other than changing the air volume, like how changing oil levels or adding spacers was done on previous air forks to get the progressiveness where you wanted it.
    I know from experience that it makes a difference and works. I just don't really know how.

    :-)

  11. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Javorsky View Post
    Ok, so my awesome friend at one of my LBS gave me 2 black tokens. I put them in, I now have 4.

    After seeing what they are, I want to know what they do, and how they work ??
    I imagine they just reduce the air volume in the fork while leaving the travel the same. in effect you can start with a lower air pressure for initial stroke and because of the lower volume of air, the pressure builds more quickly proportional to the stroke so you end with the same max pressure at the bottom of the stroke.

  12. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlowerThenSnot View Post
    More then likely oil level..... rct3 seems to be very sensitive to that
    Stink. I pulled the RCT3 damper last night and, sure enough, oil was low. I topped it off and re-assembled, but the damper still isn't locking out. I assume the oil level is the same for the RCT3 damper as with the stock damper (service manual says RL and RLT are 71-77mm from top of crown surface - as opposed to 64-70mm for the RL3)?

    Any other thoughts from anyone?

    No leaking/ fluid loss apparent anywhere. Pogo stick fork on climbs...
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

  13. #213
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    My buddy's Bluto wont fully extend the last 20%.

  14. #214
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    Bluto Tuning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by kntr View Post
    My buddy's Bluto wont fully extend the last 20%.
    There is too much pressure in the lower leg. Open the air side bottom hex screw and release the pressure from the bottom side of the fork (there is a schrader valve inside the leg). This is the quick (but not the permanent) solution.

    I recommend to open the whole fork and change the factory grease (red sticky pm800 military grease) to eg. Slick Honey.

  15. #215
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    Wow I must just be lucky because I never touched my bluto and I think it's great. We'll, I did one ride and didn't use enough travel, so I let a little air out. Done. I may have also opened up the rebound just a hair on the first ride but I don't even recall. Haven't felt the need to touch it since, or even think about it.

  16. #216
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    Bluto Tuning Thread

    I moved to fatbikes from full susp bike with quality susp parts. Riding the stock Bluto was a bit of a shock and hence I updated my 100 mm Bluto to 120 mm with RCT3, Slick Honey and Redline fork oil and now I'm finally happy. IMO this is how RS should ship Blutos.

  17. #217
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    I had a problem with my bluto from the get go. After my first ride the 100mm had sucked down to about 70mm. So I had to take the bike back to the shop. The mechanic thought it might just be the cold air making it contract but I thought that sounded stupid. After leaving the bike there overnight they told me they had to pump up the pressure really high because they thought it was grease clogging the valve that controls the air between the positive and negative chamber. It's been working fine since but still not too sure about the explanation.

  18. #218
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    Edit: RCT3 damper and DigValve rebound damper sold.

    Phenomenal upgrade though!
    Last edited by 06HokieMTB; 03-16-2015 at 09:07 AM.
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  19. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by alshead View Post
    Stink. I pulled the RCT3 damper last night and, sure enough, oil was low. I topped it off and re-assembled, but the damper still isn't locking out. I assume the oil level is the same for the RCT3 damper as with the stock damper (service manual says RL and RLT are 71-77mm from top of crown surface - as opposed to 64-70mm for the RL3)?

    Any other thoughts from anyone?

    No leaking/ fluid loss apparent anywhere. Pogo stick fork on climbs...

    Sounds to me like you're still too low on oil.

  20. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by alshead View Post
    Any other thoughts from anyone?
    I assume that while pushing the damper in to the fork, it's possible that the shim stack rotates (not a fact, only my assumption) somehow so that the lock-out doesn't work, even though one has the correct oil level in the fork. So, take the RCT3 damper out from the fork again and keep it in your hands, then try to rotate the shim stack part of it (the most bottom part) while pulling it apart simultaneously (the spring resists this). Pay attention what rotating does and try to find a position, where the shim stack rests well and is properly aligned to the damper. You can also try the lock-out by using the lock-out ring and rotating it.

    Then, be careful while pushing the damper back to the fork (no excessive force needed) and after the assembly, push the fork all the way down and back up slooow-ly a couple of times (if needed, take out some pressure from the air side, to do this) so that the oil really flows through the damper. Do this with the lock-out fully open, in pedal position and fully closed.

    I ended up having the same no lock-out problem with my RCT3 once and above mentioned helped to resolve it. During one push-in, the fork stiffened and the lock-out started to work again. As a side note, the fork does not lock 100 % and I assume this is expected behaviour.

    PS. Remember to attach the lock-out ring with the "ring nut" before pushing the fork down - it's not nice to try to find two little steel balls and one little spring from your shop floor after the needle in the middle of the damper has popped out.. (been there, done that )

  21. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by villho View Post
    PS. Remember to attach the lock-out ring with the "ring nut" before pushing the fork down - it's not nice to try to find two little steel balls and one little spring from your shop floor after the needle in the middle of the damper has popped out.. (been there, done that )
    Dood I soooooo did that with mine

  22. #222
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    Been there..........

  23. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by villho View Post
    I assume that while pushing the damper in to the fork, it's possible that the shim stack rotates (not a fact, only my assumption) somehow so that the lock-out doesn't work, even though one has the correct oil level in the fork. So, take the RCT3 damper out from the fork again and keep it in your hands, then try to rotate the shim stack part of it (the most bottom part) while pulling it apart simultaneously (the spring resists this). Pay attention what rotating does and try to find a position, where the shim stack rests well and is properly aligned to the damper. You can also try the lock-out by using the lock-out ring and rotating it.

    Then, be careful while pushing the damper back to the fork (no excessive force needed) and after the assembly, push the fork all the way down and back up slooow-ly a couple of times (if needed, take out some pressure from the air side, to do this) so that the oil really flows through the damper. Do this with the lock-out fully open, in pedal position and fully closed.

    I ended up having the same no lock-out problem with my RCT3 once and above mentioned helped to resolve it. During one push-in, the fork stiffened and the lock-out started to work again. As a side note, the fork does not lock 100 % and I assume this is expected behaviour.

    PS. Remember to attach the lock-out ring with the "ring nut" before pushing the fork down - it's not nice to try to find two little steel balls and one little spring from your shop floor after the needle in the middle of the damper has popped out.. (been there, done that )

    Okay- this is awesome. I was just getting on to share my latest findings. So, I pulled the damper out again (before seeing your post) and remembered that when I had it out the first time, I pulled on the shim stack and it was possible when it went back in, it didn't line up right. SO- I started playing with it. On what I assume is the Shim Stack, there are little detents- when you turn the lockout, you can see some of these detents in the aluminum plate just below a black plastic plate that has cutouts on opposite sides. As you rotate the lockout lever, the Shim Stack/ Aluminum plate with detents rotates, exposing different combinations of the detents. Most of the detents are just small, circular pockets/ holes (but don't go all the way through the aluminum), but one is a larger cavity. I lined it up so that "Open" position was over the largest cavity and put it back together. I now have lockout in the lockout position, but "pedal" position basically also feels locked out (a little less than full lockout) and the "open" position has some compression, but doesn't feel like as much as it used to.

    Does anyone know the proper alignment for those detents in the open position? It's also possible that I topped off the oil a little too high (thinking fluid level was the problem) and this is the proper alignment. Slowerthansnot- any insight here?

    Sorry I don't have any pics. I'll probably pull it apart later tonight and I'll try to snap a couple.
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

  24. #224
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    With 2 tokens I'm very happy with the Bluto performance. Bombed down a rough 20 minutes descent yesterday in the snow and I thought the fork did a great job. If anything I'd like to see a Pluto (Pike plus Bluto), something stiffer and more capable!
    14 Aurum, 16 Fuse, 17 T130

  25. #225
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    Bluto Tuning Thread

    Not detents at all- they're holes.

    I think I know how it's supposed to line up, but it's still not locking out when I put it together.


    There are two types of mountain bikers. Those who are faster than me, and me.
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

  26. #226
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    Just thought I'd share my experience with the bluto. It's been cold lately, a few 20 degree or less rides, and the fork has been feeling awful. It just feels "dead" soft and wasn't rebounding fast enough for me.
    I pulled the lowers, greased and lubed the seals and foam rings. I generally use a 10/30 high grade motor oil as lower lube, and motorex prep-m for sliding parts and seals. I also disassembled the air spring and used prep-m on everything in there. I dumped the damper oil and replaced it with a cocktail of 20cc 5 wt, and the rest 2.5 to. Get an oil height of about 75mm.
    What a difference! I can now run the damper adjustments in the middle positions and everything feels great.
    I'm very aggressive 200lb rider, who likes to jump things on the trail. I'm running 2 tokens at 105 psi, and I like light compression with fast rebound.
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  27. #227
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    ^Nice! Great report. I think the stock grease is absolutely horrible for cold temps. Hell, I thought it was bad in warmer temps. My fork was kinda sticky right out of the box, but a rebuild with Slick Honey and it felt worlds better.
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

  28. #228
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    I was out in 0f the other night, with the slick honey and the stock oil weight and the rebound on the fast side I thought it was working great.

  29. #229
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    Thanks for this thread. My fork was rigid at 5 F the other day, swapped the stock grease for slick honey and I had suspension today at 5 F.

    Doing the rebuild, I had a bear of a time with the snap ring. Finally got it out. The other thing I almost bodged up was the 5 ml of oil in each leg. I was happily torquing the hex bolts at the base of the fork leg and luckily I remembered I hadn't put any in. doh!

  30. #230
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    Rode mine today at 11F smooth as a baby's a,,

  31. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat907 View Post
    Rode mine today at 11F smooth as a baby's a,,
    My original plan was to go back to the carbon fork for winter but after a month on it I went back to Bluto and it's staying on.

  32. #232
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    Re: Bluto Tuning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    My original plan was to go back to the carbon fork for winter but after a month on it I went back to Bluto and it's staying on.
    My original plan was to go back to the carbon fork for winter but after being too lazy to swap forks and riding the bluto in the snow a few times, it's staying on.

  33. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by matto6 View Post
    My original plan was to go back to the carbon fork for winter but after being too lazy to swap forks and riding the bluto in the snow a few times, it's staying on.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to matto6 again.

  34. #234
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    Sold my carver carbon so I wouldn't be temped......lol

  35. #235
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    I have a similar setup and am going to at least try it.
    Good to see the successful rebuild info on the Bluto.

    Quote Originally Posted by matto6 View Post
    My original plan was to go back to the carbon fork for winter but after being too lazy to swap forks and riding the bluto in the snow a few times, it's staying on.

  36. #236
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    I fitted my bike with a 100mm Bluto because that's what was in stock when I went to buy. I just purchased a 120mm Bluto equipped bike for my wife and I want it the other way around. Is it easy to change the parts over over should I have a shop dot it. I think its jus the air tube but not sure what that all consist of to do?

  37. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cody01 View Post
    I fitted my bike with a 100mm Bluto because that's what was in stock when I went to buy. I just purchased a 120mm Bluto equipped bike for my wife and I want it the other way around. Is it easy to change the parts over over should I have a shop dot it. I think its jus the air tube but not sure what that all consist of to do?
    Not quite sure exactly what your asking but, if you want the 120 and her the 100 then why not just swap the forks?

    However if you want to change the internals this video is exactly how to do it. Just make sure you you buy the proper airshaft for the Bluto and use the recommended oil levels for Bluto. You'll have to decide for yourself if your capable of doing the work. Good luck


  38. #238
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    A few rides with the Bluto and I have put my carbon Fatboy fork up for sale. Even a stiff Bluto is better than the carbon fork when trying to ride non groomed foot traffic trails.
    '17 Cutthroat
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  39. #239
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    Would anyone out there with an RCT3 be able to help me out with a configuration issue? I have an RCT3 that I pulled out because my fluid levels were low. While I had it out, I started toying around with it and I must've screwed up the alignment of the lower compression plate. Right now, I'm getting full open, but lockout and "climb" seem to be pretty much the same (mostly locked out). When the compression is open ("descend"), the largest port on that lower plate (aluminum plate that lines up against the black plate with an opening on opposite sides) lines up perfectly, letting all of the fluid flow through, but when it's in middle and lockout, both have two holes (ports) showing- which is why (I think) it appears to perform the same in both positions. I just need to see what a stock one looks like so I can get it lined up correctly. Thanks!
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

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  41. #241
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    ^Yup. Actually picked up the kit a week or so ago with the intent of rebuilding, but haven't had any issues with stock setup yet, so have just left it alone.
    "There are two kinds of mountain bikers in the world: those who are faster than me, and me."

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    Honestly, I can't imagine buying the ETR seal kit, as the coldest temp that I've ridden my Bluto with the stock seals has been somewhat -15-16 C (5 F) and that is as cold as I plan to ride. No issues in that temp.

    I do have changed the red sticky stock grease to Slick Honey and I'm currently running the fork with 5W Redline (and this is something that I recommend all the Bluto owners to do). So if one changes the stock grease to better one, selects the fork oil that suits the riding season and is ready to play around with the damping controls/fork pressure when it gets a bit colder, I see no issues using the stock seals.

    If you decide to change your oil to Redline, one thing to note is the Redline 5W's pour point that is in somewhere -20 C. Redline is a bit like water; viscosity does not change that much when the temperature goes down (at least not as much as most of the other fork oil brands), but when the temperature goes down enough, suddenly you don't have liquid anymore, but jell-o/vaseline. This means that if you stay above the pour point, you should be good to go, but if you go below, your fork will lock up.

    If you're interested in the behaviour of Redline oil, some guys in Finnish bicycle forum have been doing testing on different weights. The text is of course in Finnish, but you can see a couple of charts attached to the message. On the X-axis you have the temp of the oil before pouring and on Y-axis the time (in seconds) that how long it took for 10 ml of oil to go through a narrow syringe (without a piston, by gravity). Guys said that they kept all the oils in -21 through the night and only 2.5W and 5W were in liquid form in the morning, but there is some variation and debate on this as others have had a bit different results. Google Translator might or might not be your friend in case you want to read more from there.

  43. #243
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    I rode in 10F last night, my Bluto lost some of it's air. I haven't checked it yet to see exactly how much, but it was probably about 50% sag when sitting on it. Not a big deal assuming it airs up today. I imagine it will since it wasn't completely stuck down I know there's some air in there.

  44. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jisch View Post
    I rode in 10F last night, my Bluto lost some of it's air. I haven't checked it yet to see exactly how much, but it was probably about 50% sag when sitting on it. Not a big deal assuming it airs up today. I imagine it will since it wasn't completely stuck down I know there's some air in there.
    You have still the stock grease in the fork, I assume? Bluto, with the sticky stock grease, seems to have tendency to go out of balance of the air pressure between the upper and lower fork (solo air principle is that the fork should automatically balance this pressure). Air pressure goes to the lower leg, but doesn't balance back and this causes the sag to increase. I had the same, when I was running the stock setup, but problem went away after cleaning the stock grease out and putting Slick Honey in.

    If you don't want to change the grease yet, quick resolution is to take the hex screw out from the bottom of the fork in the air side and then to release the air pressure via schrader valve that can be found behind the screw (you need a narrow screwdriver or something similar to reach the valve). No need to take the tire off, just turn your bike upside down. Be careful that the air doesn't shoot the lower leg lubrication oil to your face

  45. #245
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    Thanks!

  46. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jisch View Post
    I rode in 10F last night, my Bluto lost some of it's air. I haven't checked it yet to see exactly how much, but it was probably about 50% sag when sitting on it. Not a big deal assuming it airs up today. I imagine it will since it wasn't completely stuck down I know there's some air in there.
    I had mine do that on a ride once and after letting all the air out of the upper and lower and pumping it back up it was fine and haven't had an issue since. Villho was spot on.

  47. #247
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    I have had this happen with other forks in the past. Unless it sticks down, it's usually not a problem.

  48. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by villho View Post
    Honestly, I can't imagine buying the ETR seal kit, as the coldest temp that I've ridden my Bluto with the stock seals has been somewhat -15-16 C (5 F) and that is as cold as I plan to ride. No issues in that temp.

    I do have changed the red sticky stock grease to Slick Honey and I'm currently running the fork with 5W Redline (and this is something that I recommend all the Bluto owners to do). So if one changes the stock grease to better one, selects the fork oil that suits the riding season and is ready to play around with the damping controls/fork pressure when it gets a bit colder, I see no issues using the stock seals.
    Yeah- I don't think they're necessary unless you're having a problem. Turnagain even notes that some of the seals will be fine because the tolerance has a margin- so some are going to be fine in colder temps, while other seals/ o-rings may contract and let fluid and/or air seep through into the wrong chamber. I do think the Slick Honey helps the seals do their job a lot better, especially at colder temps, but next time I pull my fork apart, I'm going to swap the seals over just as a precautionary measure.
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  49. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by villho View Post
    You have still the stock grease in the fork, I assume? Bluto, with the sticky stock grease, seems to have tendency to go out of balance of the air pressure between the upper and lower fork (solo air principle is that the fork should automatically balance this pressure). Air pressure goes to the lower leg, but doesn't balance back and this causes the sag to increase. I had the same, when I was running the stock setup, but problem went away after cleaning the stock grease out and putting Slick Honey in.

    If you don't want to change the grease yet, quick resolution is to take the hex screw out from the bottom of the fork in the air side and then to release the air pressure via schrader valve that can be found behind the screw (you need a narrow screwdriver or something similar to reach the valve). No need to take the tire off, just turn your bike upside down. Be careful that the air doesn't shoot the lower leg lubrication oil to your face

    There's two valves? My bluto collapsed entirely. I tried to air it up but it didn't work. Also tried to let out all air but alas the fork was stuck with about 50% travel remaining . I returned the fork to my lbs but even they couldn't fix it so they returned the fork to the manufacturer. Still is there.

  50. #250
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    ^ Yes there are, but you can't add any air from the bottom one, only take it out. As I said, a solo air fork works so that when you add the pressure from the top valve, the same pressure balances to the bottom as well. Ie. in solo air you (should) have always the same pressure on both sides, where in dual air you can decide the pressures separately depending on that what kind of behaviour you expect from your fork. Same pressure on both sides is in most cases good enough and solo air forks simplify reaching this with only one air valve.

    Now, in Bluto it seems that quite often too much air goes to the bottom and it doesn't balance back (I say this is due to the sticky stock grease). And too much air in the bottom means too much sag that you can't get back no matter how much air you try to pump to the top (or at least you will be out of any suitable pressure scales and the fork will feel shitty). Quick resolution is to take extra pressure out from the bottom and after this to check the pressure from the top again. Long term solution is ditching the sticky "PM800 military red grease" or whatever RS calls that **** and putting something more suitable in (eg Slick Honey).

    Taking the air out from the bottom is as easy I said; if you have a right size hex key, it will take less than a minute.

  51. #251
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    Thank you. If it happens again I will certainly try this.

  52. #252
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    Just finished installing a Bluto on my Farley 6 and reading through this thread. I bought the remote pushloc version since it was a lot cheaper than the crown adjust. After hooking up the cable and getting it working I noticed that the cable only pulls the adjuster cap about an eighth of a rotation. The fork does 'lockout' when the cable is released and compress when it's pulled but I wonder if it's fully opening? I can stick an allen wrench in the set screw and rotate the cap quite a bit more than the cable pulls it. Am I worried about nothing?

  53. #253
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    I haven't read through this entire thread, so my apologies if this has been covered. I'm a little frustrated & didn't feel like reading...

    Went out for the first time today with the Bluto & bottomed out a few times so i mostly rode locked out.

    When I got home I started to check the psi & add some air, but when I hooked up the pump it read 0... I pumped it up to the recommended psi for my weight & as soon as I unscrew the pump I hear the air coming out. Screw it back on & it reads zero... I tried googling & youtubing but i'm coming up with nothing. My LBS is closed so I can't get any other guidance until tomorrow & i'm impatient with my new toy.

    Yes, i'm an idiot & this is probably something i'm overlooking...
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  54. #254
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    Is the Schrader core tight?

  55. #255
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    I'd use some soapy water and see if you can track down where the air is leaking out. Likely suspects are the schrader valve, the hex bolt on bottom, or fork seals.
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  56. #256
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    I had this same problem when i first got my bluto. What it ended up being was a stuck schrader valve pin. The pump wasnt able to depress the needle in the schrader enough to let the air in, so the reading on the pump gauge was only the air in the hose of the pump, none actually got in the fork. I remember thinking, wow this is a low volume air chamber, since it came up to pressure so quick. But it still confused the hell out of me for a good hour or two till i figured it out.. Fully depress the pin a few times with an allen key and put a few drops of oil in there and try it again..

  57. #257
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    Bluto Tuning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by hiss2 View Post
    I had this same problem when i first got my bluto. What it ended up being was a stuck schrader valve pin. The pump wasnt able to depress the needle in the schrader enough to let the air in, so the reading on the pump gauge was only the air in the hose of the pump, none actually got in the fork. I remember thinking, wow this is a low volume air chamber, since it came up to pressure so quick. But it still confused the hell out of me for a good hour or two till i figured it out.. Fully depress the pin a few times with an allen key and put a few drops of oil in there and try it again..
    Thanks, I'll give this a shot.
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  58. #258
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    ^This. If you're hearing air leak out, it's likely that the valve core is loose. Tighten it up and try again. If you don't have a valve core tool, most automotive stores (which are open late) will have one, or you could try a pair of tweezers to snug it up.
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  59. #259
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    Here's another question...

    When working properly with the correct amount of psi, should I be able to just lean on the front of the bike & bottom the fork out? I'm a bigger guy, but if I do this on my Fuel w/ a Fox fork there's not a chance in hell I bottom it out. It feels much stiffer than the Bluto. I know this might be apples & oranges, but the Fuel was my first bike w/ suspension so that's what I have to compare it to...
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  60. #260
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    I'm maybe 170 geared up and found 2 tokens are needed to keep the


    bluto from blowing thru its travel.
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  61. #261
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    No. If you have the proper pressure in, and the compression opened up, you should be able to compress it maybe 2/3 of the way or so if you really press down hard and fast. You should not be able to bottom it out.
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  62. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigVaz View Post
    Here's another question...

    When working properly with the correct amount of psi, should I be able to just lean on the front of the bike & bottom the fork out? I'm a bigger guy, but if I do this on my Fuel w/ a Fox fork there's not a chance in hell I bottom it out. It feels much stiffer than the Bluto. I know this might be apples & oranges, but the Fuel was my first bike w/ suspension so that's what I have to compare it to...
    I had this happen during a ride once, fugger just lost everything. Took it back to the lot pumped it up a little higher and same friggen thing. Tried one more time with an excessive amount of air took it out for a good thrashing and it pulled out of it, no idea what happened.

  63. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Lynch View Post
    I'm maybe 170 geared up and found 2 tokens are needed to keep the


    bluto from blowing thru its travel.
    The 100 mm travel Bluto should come with 2 tokens installed. Bigger guys, or people that want to run lower air pressure and still keep from bottoming out put 1 or 2 more in.

  64. #264
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    The 120 version has no tokens stock.
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  65. #265
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    I weigh 75 kg (~150 lbs) and have 120 mm Bluto. To keep it nice and plush, I run it with low-ish pressure (~70 psi) and hence I have currently 3 tokens to avoid it from bottoming. This setup works well; the fork is at the same time plush with nice progression and the closest I've been able to get it to bottoming has been ~ 5 mm (small drop with bad landing).

    (And just for the record, I have RCT3 as well)

  66. #266
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    Villho- next time you pull your RCT3 damper out, would you mind looking at the lower plate and telling me how the holes in the aluminum plate line up against the black plate with the two opposite openings?

    I think I'm losing oil/ fluid in the damper side as I keep having to top off the oil on the damper side. Not sure how to remedy this (other than take it in for service).
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  67. #267
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    Bluto Tuning Thread

    Just some info on mine if anyone is looking at a similar set up.

    Bluto 120 on an On-One Fatty (66degree HTA with fork)

    Because of slacker HTA I can run higher pressure and stay smooth.

    I am 180lbs kitted up.
    Run 95lbs in fork. 0 tokens.
    12 psi front 9 psi rear tires.
    Also swapped red grease for slick honey. Stock damper as I have no complaints.

    Riding is mostly hardpack single track with lots of roots and rocks. 2-3 foot drops are not uncommon. I think I have only bottomed once. Plenty smooth for me.
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  68. #268
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    Anyone have a bottomless token or 2 they'd like to sell? Got a feeling I'd like to run lower air pressure for small bump compliance but ramp it up to keep from bottoming.

  69. #269
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    I've got an 80mm BLUTO on my Mayor and need to chop the steer tube. Is there a special pipe cutter or will any type do?

  70. #270
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    Bluto Tuning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    I've got an 80mm BLUTO on my Mayor and need to chop the steer tube. Is there a special pipe cutter or will any type do?
    I use a pipe cutter from the hardware store. Works perfect and smooth edges. Better than our park tool we had at the shop.
    The most freeride like fat bike I could make with available parts...

  71. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    I've got an 80mm BLUTO on my Mayor and need to chop the steer tube. Is there a special pipe cutter or will any type do?
    i use this
    Park Tool Co. ¬Ľ SG-6 : Threadless Saw Guide : Frame & Fork Tools
    and a regular metal saw

  72. #272
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    Pipe/tube cutter from Home Depot- just slowly increase the pressure when you cut and it won't flare and you end up with a smooth straight cut.

    If you need at move the star nut, a 1 ft section of M6 rod and a few washers/nuts works very well to pull it deeper in the tube.
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  73. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Pipe/tube cutter from Home Depot- just slowly increase the pressure when you cut and it won't flare and you end up with a smooth straight cut.

    If you need at move the star nut, a 1 ft section of M6 rod and a few washers/nuts works very well to pull it deeper in the tube.
    My wife really enjoyed your recommendation. Thanks for the advice

  74. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue_biker View Post
    I use a pipe cutter from the hardware store. Works perfect and smooth edges. Better than our park tool we had at the shop.
    Thanks for the advice.

  75. #275
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    Glad to see others are experimenting with their forks. From experience, I have experimented with changing the oil viscosity in the damper of my Reba and plan to also do on the Bluto.

    I found that keeping the viscosity the same (VS temperature) is the key to having the damping circuit work properly in low temps.

    In reviewing viscosity and temp, I found that 2.5w rock shox oil (at low temps) is the same viscosity as the 5w oil at 70deg.

    Note - oil weight and subsequent viscosity bear no semblance. They are all over the map but there are charts online that will tell you viscosity of various weight oils. Some having differing temperature reactions... just FYI.

    So, I have previously swapped oils around in my Reba for winter use and really liked the improvement.

    I also discovered the issue of fill level. If you look at the tolerance, it's +-2ml tolerance for amount of oil in damper. Too much, it locks out. Too little, I suspect it does not damp properly. To play it safe, overfill slightly - then remove 2ml of oil at a time till you get the proper amount of travel with no air in the air spring side. THIS IS KEY TO GETTING PROPER TRAVEL OF YOUR FORK. 2ml is NOT a lot and makes all the difference in a properly working damper.

    So, take that for what it's worth - another point of light.

    some prior math (for my Reba shock):

    Stock 5w Rock Shox viscosity @ 20 C is approx 37 cSt (a measure of viscosity)

    @ 0 C - 83 cSt! (ouch, much thicker)

    To achieve this with redline:

    Lightweight @ 0C = 49 cSt (still thicker.. but much better)


    But... using 2.5w Rock Shox @ 0 C = 31.95 cSt... might be a good choice for colder weather riding.. particularly below freezing.

    and even closer:

    Maxima Racing Shock Fluid (Light, 3wt) @ 0 C = 38 cSt


    So... just FYI, achieving a similar viscosity is possible with a bit of work. Kind of a PIA.. but for cold weather bumps, it might be worth the switch.
    Last edited by Maine_Rider; 02-05-2015 at 10:25 AM. Reason: fix wrong oil viscosities

  76. #276
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    Question...I was riding my new bluto for the first time the other night . Cold...like 10deg...fork compressed all the way down and totally lost pressure. I Aires it back up after getting home...160psi...the fork isn't nearly as tall as it was...can barley see the 80mm on the fork but could easily see the 100mm before. Any advice???

  77. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by cavedweller32 View Post
    Question...I was riding my new bluto for the first time the other night . Cold...like 10deg...fork compressed all the way down and totally lost pressure. I Aires it back up after getting home...160psi...the fork isn't nearly as tall as it was...can barley see the 80mm on the fork but could easily see the 100mm before. Any advice???
    Read through this thread, somewhere it talks about all the air going to the negative side and how to fix it. Pretty simple fix.

  78. #278
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    Yup...took the air out of the top then out of the bottom....aired it up and fork popped back up to normal. Thanks! Slick Honey in the mail.

  79. #279
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    I'd appreciate people's thoughts on whether to go with the remote lock-out option or not? This will be going on a Pivot Les Fat.

  80. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastman115 View Post
    I'd appreciate people's thoughts on whether to go with the remote lock-out option or not? This will be going on a Pivot Les Fat.
    Boxers or briefs?

  81. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastman115 View Post
    I'd appreciate people's thoughts on whether to go with the remote lock-out option or not? This will be going on a Pivot Les Fat.
    I have the lock...use it quite a bit compared to my FS rig...you want all the stiff you can get when cranking uphill so I constantly use the lockout. It's according to preference and type of riding you do.

  82. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastman115 View Post
    I'd appreciate people's thoughts on whether to go with the remote lock-out option or not? This will be going on a Pivot Les Fat.
    I bought a remote lock version since it was a lot cheaper than the regular one and haven't had any issues yet. It's easy to convert to the regular type if you find you don't like it. Just pull the damper up out of the right side tube and use a pick or screwdriver to dislodge the spring in the middle a couple of turns. Then you can turn the cap by hand and it'll stay where you turn it. Just put an oring under the cap. I think it's written up with pics somewhere in this thread.

  83. #283
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    Everywhere I've seen the remote version cost $50+ more.
    I dont really see the point in it either. I'll take the ability to adjust the damper a few clicks version all or nothing. I run it full open descending, halfway most the time on rolling terrain and almost locked for the beach.
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  84. #284
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    Any extra trigger on my bars is reserved for a dropper post.

    Never needed a remote lockout, but then again SoCal and NorCal trails generally telegraphed their long fire road climbs well in advance, easy to reach down.

    I could see it for one of those forks with adjustable travel - push it out to 150m to descend, tighten up to 110mm to climb - but that's not in the fatty cards for a while I'd guess.

  85. #285
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    Post deleted, not beneficial to the thread
    Cheers,
    FGO
    Last edited by Father Guzzi Obrian; 02-09-2015 at 04:17 PM. Reason: Not helpful

  86. #286
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    Quote Originally Posted by cavedweller32 View Post
    Yup...took the air out of the top then out of the bottom....aired it up and fork popped back up to normal. Thanks! Slick Honey in the mail.
    So unfortunately I've been hit with the same issue where I've lost travel after a cold weather ride. I've read through the whole thread and am still not able to fix it.

    If I interpreted it properly, the procedure is to:
    1. Remove top air cover and release all pressure (non drive side)
    2. Remove bottom 5mm bolt on same side of fork (non drive side)
    3. Try to press in on schrader valve on bottom (this is where I get stuck)


    For the life of me, I can't figure out why the bottom schrader valve won't push in to release the negative pressure.

    Am I doing the right things? Any ideas?

    Thanks!

  87. #287
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    My Bluto did the same thing. Rode 400 or more miles in above zero temps with no issues Bluto functioning well. Rode once in approximately 10 below F, and it compressed about 1/3 down. Took it to LBS and $55 later it got the Borealis Turnagain cold weather kit installed. Have ridden many below zero miles since over 5 weeks and no issues. It is a daily commuter.

  88. #288
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    My google-fu is fubar. Anyone have a source for tokens? LBS tried to sell me pike tokens, so not going back to them.

  89. #289
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    Look part way down the page you will see em for 32mm forks, the black ones.

    Universal Cycles -- Rock Shox Bottomless Token Spacers

  90. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by ishpeming View Post
    My Bluto did the same thing. Rode 400 or more miles in above zero temps with no issues Bluto functioning well. Rode once in approximately 10 below F, and it compressed about 1/3 down. Took it to LBS and $55 later it got the Borealis Turnagain cold weather kit installed. Have ridden many below zero miles since over 5 weeks and no issues. It is a daily commuter.
    I guess I may have to do that too. Called LBS and they talked about different weight oils and other solutions. To me, it sounds like the Turnagain kit has done the trick for enough that it seems like a fairly safe bet. I tried to loosen the bottom bolt and took a couple of light hits to it but it didn't seem to do anything. If anyone has other ideas, I'd love to hear them!

    Overall, it's just a bummer that a $600 fork built for fat bikes (often ridden in the winter), has this problem. I can only imagine that the problem will continue to grow as more and more start riding with Bluto.

  91. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by ishpeming View Post
    My Bluto did the same thing. Rode 400 or more miles in above zero temps with no issues Bluto functioning well. Rode once in approximately 10 below F, and it compressed about 1/3 down. Took it to LBS and $55 later it got the Borealis Turnagain cold weather kit installed. Have ridden many below zero miles since over 5 weeks and no issues. It is a daily commuter.
    Is the modification using the kit an easy one?
    Can any bike mechanic do it; or does it require a mechanic with special skills?

  92. #292
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    Mine has been awesome down to - single digits f with just the slick honey upgrade.

  93. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    Mine has been awesome down to - single digits f with just the slick honey upgrade.
    Ditto- mine appears to work at temps that I quit at.
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  94. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins17 View Post
    I guess I may have to do that too. Called LBS and they talked about different weight oils and other solutions. To me, it sounds like the Turnagain kit has done the trick for enough that it seems like a fairly safe bet. I tried to loosen the bottom bolt and took a couple of light hits to it but it didn't seem to do anything. If anyone has other ideas, I'd love to hear them!

    Overall, it's just a bummer that a $600 fork built for fat bikes (often ridden in the winter), has this problem. I can only imagine that the problem will continue to grow as more and more start riding with Bluto.
    So just a quick follow-up to my post: With the bike upside down and the pressure already released from the typical (only) inflation valve, I was able to loosen the nut halfway. With light to moderate hammering on the 5mm bit/socket extension still in the half loosened nut, the air pressure did let go. From there, I was able to repressurize just a little bit (to roughly 40 psi) using the normal valve, get the nut back on and tightened, and continue the inflation from the normal valve. I will note that I did finish off the task by manually pulling the fork to its maximum extension (apparently the point where the fork auto equalizes the pressure).

    I certainly can't say for sure if this is the perfect way to do it, but it worked for me and I was able to go back out and ride in 20 degrees F without any issues. (the issues started last time at 3 deg F).

    Thanks all who posted comments that helped with this temporary resolution. I'm still likely to install the turnagain seals because I want to be able to ride in all conditions.
    Last edited by Higgins17; 02-25-2015 at 09:47 PM.

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    We the people ...

    I don't believe changing the seals will resolve this problem but I believe slick honey comes with the kit and that will. I think it has something to do with the grease plugging up the orifice the equalizes the pressure between the pos and neg side. I could be wrong altogether though

    Edit, I guess it could be the air seal shrinking to much in the cold and letting to much air into the negative side but I haven't had this issue in the cold with the standard seals.

    Oh and I'm not sure why you are beating on anything, you take the bolt out and the valve is under it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Bluto Tuning Thread-solo-air_4.jpg  


  96. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I don't believe changing the seals will resolve this problem but I believe slick honey comes with the kit and that will. I think it has something to do with the grease plugging up the orifice the equalizes the pressure between the pos and neg side. I could be wrong altogether though

    Edit, I guess it could be the air seal shrinking to much in the cold and letting to much air into the negative side but I haven't had this issue in the cold with the standard seals.

    Oh and I'm not sure why you are beating on anything, you take the bolt out and the valve is under it.
    Definitely! My first go around was to remove the nut completely and lightly press on that valve with a hex tool. Perhaps if I had pressed harder it would have released the pressure, but I was concerned about bending or breaking the valve, especially given that the schrader on the top of the shock is so easy to press. Can you confirm that's worked for you?

    P.S. - thanks for the tip on the slick honey. Looks like people swear by that stuff!

    Edit: Just wanted to mention that I didn't make up the beating on the nut piece. There were a couple of videos around including the , where they use light tapping to free up the lowers. I haven't had a ton of experience working on forks but I had to ride tonight!

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    Yeah that is correct to take the lowers off you loosen that bolt and tap on it. I guess it would also release the pressure as well.

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    The only reason, why someone would tap the bottom nut/screw, is to take lowers off, as said in the thread. Of course it will also release the pressure from the negative side, but if there is a valve for that, why not to use that.

    And no, there is no reason to release the pressure from the top, to release the pressure from the bottom. Actually, I think it's better to keep the pressure in the top, as then the fork pops right back up to the full lenght, when you release the pressure from the negative side (ie. bottom). Then you at least know that you have done it correctly.

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    I must be one of the lucky ones because I have ridden in 3 degrees and have not had a single issue.........but I have done quite a few mods to date with the exception of the turnagain mod..slick honey and 7.5 wt being the most beneficial

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat907 View Post
    I must be one of the lucky ones because I have ridden in 3 degrees and have not had a single issue.........but I have done quite a few mods to date with the exception of the turnagain mod..slick honey and 7.5 wt being the most beneficial
    Well, I have neither had any issues since Slick Honey. I'm running my Bluto also with 2014 Sid RCT3 comp/reb internals + RedLine 5W.

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