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  1. #26
    Just go ride!
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    Direction, Detours and Dates

    Some facts and my opinions to go along with them...

    Direction:

    Seems like everyone is assuming we’ll start in Denver. Why not Durango?

    Detours:

    I took a peek at the new (7th edition) CT guidebook. Elevation profiles have been updated! This should almost be mandatory reading for anyone attempting the trail as it has been rerouted in a several spots over the last 5 years. Also, the “official” detours are clearly defined in the book.

    Might as well list ‘em up so we can discuss. Starting from Denver we have:

    1.) Mandatory Lost Creek Wilderness (LCW) Detour
    a.) Ride out to Bailey, then up US-285 to Kenosha Pass. ~25mi
    b.) Ride the Tarryall detour. 72 miles
    c.) Hike 1st section of LCW (7ish miles), ride to Long Gulch, detour on FSR-56

    2.) Optional Tenmile Range Detour
    a.) Ride the Tenmile Bike Path
    b.) Ride the actual CT

    3.) Mandatory Holy Cross & Mt. Massive Wilderness Detour

    a.) Ride from Wurtz Ditch Rd. to Leadville, then out to Halfmoon Creek TH

    4.) Mandatory Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Detour
    a.) Ride to Hwy. 24, left on CR-371 to Buena Vista. Out CR-306 to Avalanche TH

    5.) Mandatory La Garita Wilderness (LGW) Detour
    a.) Ride Rd. NN14 to KK14 over Los Pinos Pass to Hwy 149
    b.) Ride to edge of LGW, hike 2.5 miles to Eddiesville TH, get lost trying to find Rd. NN14

    6.) Optional Coney Summit Detour & Mandatory Weminuche Wilderness Detour
    a.) Continue LGW Detour on Hwy 149, Ride over Cinnamon Pass to Silverton
    b.) Ride the actual CT to Rio Grande Res. Rd, detour over Stony Pass to Silverton
    c.) Ride the actual CT to Carson Saddle. Detour down Wager Gulch and over Cinnamon Pass to Silverton

    Yup, that’s a lot of friggin’ detours. There are even more, so if you are adamant about adding another, let me know and I’ll edit this post. I love nepbug’s checkpoint + choose-your-own-adventure idea, but I think this only makes sense for the LCW detour and only if we outlaw going to Bailey. On all the other options, the detours would be much faster!

    In my opinion, if you’re gonna hike at all, you might as well hike everything, so I vote for ‘em all (detours, that is): 1a, 2a, 5a, 6a. Unfortunately, this makes the race probably only half on singletrack. But at ~500 miles, that’s still a lot!

    Dates:

    If we can put off setting the date until next April, that would be perfect. Then, if the snowpack is low, (like this year, 2006) we can start in early/mid July. If it is a big spring snow season (like in 2005, especially in the San Juans), starting in early/mid July would make for a crappy race. If you have any doubts, check out some of the snow pics from my unsuccessful ’05 attempt here. I agree that the earlier we can start, the better, but when it comes down to it, I vote for less light and less snow – mid to late July. I also vote for the weekday start.

    As for finish time predictions, having 1st hand knowledge of the abilities of several of the people posting here, I’ll make a friendly wager of a beer or 3 that it goes in under 5 days! Any takers?
    Last edited by Stefan_G; 08-24-2006 at 12:24 PM.

  2. #27
    'r you some kinda ssissy?
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    this looks interesting.

    i've been looking for an excuse to build a multi day mtb specific bike. this may be it.

  3. #28
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    Detours

    Damn I just calculated the distances of each segment and the detours today. However if Tarryall is really 72 miles I'm a little off. The guidebook conviently stops giving distances as 49.4...

    With doing 1a,2b,3a,4a,5a,6b and if Tarryall is 72 miles that gives a total (guidbook) distance of 538.9 miles.

    A weekday start is fine with me but I'd rather that the first 5 days cross at least 2 weekend days so that those of us with full time jobs at least get full use of our 2 "free" days off. I'll be out on the Denver end of the trail tomorrow from the evening on until Saturday afternoon. If you see me on a monocog and Dave on his fixed crosscheck say hi. Try not to run over us if we bivy somewhere.
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  4. #29
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    you bastards

    so you bastards have started talking about a CT race without me? anyways sounds pretty damn cool, i have ridden the whole thing with minimal detours and it is rugged in many places, i say we go minimal detours as otherwise it becomes too similar to the great divide as far as i can tell, long dirt roads going way outta the way, and the ridding in between is damn cool. So what would be the rules on support, mail drops ok? just wondering, gas station food doesn't do much for me except hurt. when i rode it i rode durango to gunny(+) with dog, bob trailer etc and it took 11 days, then in august of 05? i rode gunny to denver in 5 days solo unsupported carring all my food, that was brutal, but awesome. The only problem i can see is too many of these damn super hardcore races and not enough recovery time! peace out

  5. #30
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    How about making this an ITT, and let everyone set their own date? You can set an ideal date for a mass start, but allow others that may not be able to make it then do the ITT before or afterwards. Kind of like how the fastpackers set records on major trails. I think thats how MC has done his mega races also. I may be able to do this, but I don't know yet what will be happening with my job.

  6. #31
    Scott in Tucson
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan_G

    Seems like everyone is assuming weíll start in Denver. Why not Durango?
    Not sure. People have experience with the route in the Denver->Durango direction. Also, start logistics are much easier for those flying in. Since people tend to drop out in these events, it makes sense to have the start be the easiest to access.

    Any reason to start in Durango?


    1.) Mandatory Lost Creek Wilderness (LCW) Detour
    a.) Ride out to Bailey, then up US-285 to Kenosha Pass. ~25mi
    b.) Ride the Tarryall detour. 72 miles
    c.) Hike 1st section of LCW (7ish miles), ride to Long Gulch, detour on FSR-56
    I'm thinking (c). Makes things a little interesting. With an appropriate start no one will be able to get there before dark. Dark = no hikers = good.

    Mike and I hopped back on the trail near Rock Creek and rode it to Kenosha Pass. All good stuff there.

    2.) Optional Tenmile Range Detour
    a.) Ride the Tenmile Bike Path
    b.) Ride the actual CT
    (a) for reasons already stated. Pretty much a hike-a-bike for anyone I've ever seen ride a bike.

    3.) Mandatory Holy Cross & Mt. Massive Wilderness Detour
    a.) Ride from Wurtz Ditch Rd. to Leadville, then out to Halfmoon Creek TH

    4.) Mandatory Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Detour
    a.) Ride to Hwy. 24, left on CR-371 to Buena Vista. Out CR-306 to Avalanche TH
    These both make sense, bringing us into Leadville for resupply and avoiding fairly long sections of wilderness.

    5.) Mandatory La Garita Wilderness (LGW) Detour
    a.) Ride Rd. NN14 to KK14 over Los Pinos Pass to Hwy 149
    b.) Ride to edge of LGW, hike 2.5 miles to Eddiesville TH, get lost trying to find Rd. NN14
    We successfully made it from Eddiesville to Los Pinos Pass. The road climbs high (11,500) but it's well graded and fast. The canyon west of Los Pinos (on the LGW detour) was surprisingly spectacular.

    So I might go with (b). The hike is essentially flat and very easy. There's so much to detour coming up that I'd want to stay with the trail longer while it's rideable.

    ]6.) Optional Coney Summit Detour & Mandatory Weminuche Wilderness Detour
    a.) Continue LGW Detour on Hwy 149, Ride over Cinnamon Pass to Silverton
    b.) Ride the actual CT to Rio Grande Res. Rd, detour over Stony Pass to Silverton
    c.) Ride the actual CT to Carson Saddle. Detour down Wager Gulch and over Cinnamon Pass to Silverton
    Not sure here. We got the crap kicked out of us up on the actual CT. The first mile was unrideable mud, the second mile no-trail rockiness, then the storms started building...

    We ended up bailing off the side of the ridge down to Castle Lakes. Ever bushwhacked 3500 feet downhill in less than 2 miles, with a loaded bike? Not reccommended.

    In short, I haven't seen the trail from the hike-a-bike up the cliff face to Wager Gulch and Pole Creek. Does it improve or get worse after the cliff hike?

    Cinnamon Pass is a superb ride. If it weren't for the 75 thunderstorms breathing down our necks it would have been a complete blast.

    It's a tough one, though. It makes for a long section of dirt roads if you don't head up to Spring Creek Pass. Another plus of staying off the CT in this area is snow -- it tends to linger a while above 13k.

    In my opinion, if youíre gonna hike at all, you might as well hike everything, so I vote for Ďem all (detours, that is): 1a, 2a, 5a, 6a. Unfortunately, this makes the race probably only half on singletrack. But at ~500 miles, thatís still a lot!
    Indeed, that's still a boatload of singletrack. I agree with you except that I'm toying with the idea of requiring the Lost Creek and La Garita hikes.

    If we can put off setting the date until next April, that would be perfect.
    Might be too late for people that need to plan ahead. I don't mind being fluid (my plans usually are), but others might object... ??

    I also vote for the weekday start.
    Weekday sounds good, but quickly overlapping a weekend for those with that J-word.

    Iíll make a friendly wager of a beer or 3 that it goes in under 5 days! Any takers?
    We shall see. I think it could go <5, but probably not the first year and only with good conditions.

    Scott
    Author of TopoFusion GPS Software. MTB+backpacking = bikepacking.net. Ride Diary.

  7. #32
    Scott in Tucson
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    Hey Jefe--

    Quote Originally Posted by wookieone
    so you bastards have started talking about a CT race without me?
    Next time we'll be sure to ask your permission first...

    anyways sounds pretty damn cool, i have ridden the whole thing with minimal detours and it is rugged in many places, i say we go minimal detours as otherwise it becomes too similar to the great divide as far as i can tell, long dirt roads going way outta the way, and the ridding in between is damn cool.
    No real comparison between the CTR and GDR, even with more detours than we're discussing here. I think it's going to be rugged enough....

    So what would be the rules on support, mail drops ok?
    Sure. Same rules as the GDR.

    just wondering, gas station food doesn't do much for me except hurt.
    You can always hit Breck for some fine dining.

    There are quite a few grocery stores on or near the route, too.

    when i rode it i rode durango to gunny(+) with dog, bob trailer etc and it took 11 days, then in august of 05?
    Whaa? Did you go up Stony Pass, Pole Creek to Spring Creek Pass? With Bob and Dog?!

    The only problem i can see is too many of these damn super hardcore races and not enough recovery time! peace out
    I hear that!
    Author of TopoFusion GPS Software. MTB+backpacking = bikepacking.net. Ride Diary.

  8. #33
    Scott in Tucson
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrwmojo
    How about making this an ITT, and let everyone set their own date? You can set an ideal date for a mass start, but allow others that may not be able to make it then do the ITT before or afterwards. Kind of like how the fastpackers set records on major trails. I think thats how MC has done his mega races also. I may be able to do this, but I don't know yet what will be happening with my job.
    Once we set a route, anyone is free to ITT it at any time. If they follow the same rules of self-support and ride faster than anyone in the race, they'll be recognized as such.

    In the interest of using competition to motivate and push the envelope further, we'll set a date for a race. 'Sides, misery loves company...
    Author of TopoFusion GPS Software. MTB+backpacking = bikepacking.net. Ride Diary.

  9. #34
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    Hell yeah. I'm so excited about this race I can't stand it. Set the date, give me info, let's talk. I even got the go ahead from the wife. Only problem, I'll have to run it with gears. I don't think I could handle all the pushing on a SS. My knees would hate me! I've got so many questions I don't know where to begin. I'll just wait for one of the head honchos to pipe up and get the ball rolling. One things for sure, I ain't worried about no stinkin water bottle cage bolt placement. OOOOPPPSSS!

  10. #35
    Time to go farther
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    excited!

    Excited isn't the word! I spent the weekend on the trail with a race like load. Despite the rain and rocking the single I had an amazing time. It's going to be an awesome race.

    I will do any route/detours that others want. Only thing about making only some hikes mandatory is that it no long feels like a bike race to me. I dunno, something makes me say either do it all straight through with all wilderness sections hiked or keep the detours biking. Either way I'll be section hiking and riding the majority of the trail between now and the race as weather and snow allows. It's so much fun!!! I will be racing on a geared bike though.
    On-One Lurcher SS
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  11. #36
    Really I am that slow
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    Chris you panisy

    Gears for that race come on..... You could do it on the single =)

    Super fun weekend with chris in the rain =)

    Can't wait to scout more of it....

    Not too much of a fan of hiking with the bike.... I'd kinna ethier want to bike to whole thing or hike the whole thing
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  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlowerThenSnot
    Gears for that race come on..... You could do it on the single =)
    I could do it on the single for sure. The fact for me remains that I'm slower on the singlespeed and I have limited time away from the dreaded J-word. I'll keep to doing the preriding on the singlespeed and it will all feel real easy with cheater gears.
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  13. #38
    Just go ride!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krein
    Any reason to start in Durango?
    I think it might go faster/easier from Durango to Denver. I felt that both the 2b and 6b detour might have been a bit more rideable in that direction. That's only speculation on my part though. The Sargents Mesa segments might actually be worse. Also, the last 70+ miles would be quite a bit easier too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Krein
    I'm thinking (c). Makes things a little interesting. With an appropriate start no one will be able to get there before dark. Dark = no hikers = good.
    I like this idea, however, everyone entering the race should be aware that they are fully responsible for "hiking" through the LCW should any questions arise. Same goes for the tiny piece of the LGW near Eddiesville TH. More opinions, please!

    Quote Originally Posted by Krein
    We successfully made it from Eddiesville to Los Pinos Pass. The road climbs high (11,500) but it's well graded and fast.
    I'm glad you were able to scope this out. In this case, I change my vote to 5b for sure!

    Quote Originally Posted by Krein
    We ended up bailing off the side of the ridge down to Castle Lakes. Ever bushwhacked 3500 feet downhill in less than 2 miles, with a loaded bike? Not reccommended.

    In short, I haven't seen the trail from the hike-a-bike up the cliff face to Wager Gulch and Pole Creek. Does it improve or get worse after the cliff hike?
    Uggh, that sounds miserable. After the cliff hike-a-bike, the trail is mostly rideable all the way to the uphill part of the next segment. Then, the downhill along Pole Creek was pretty crappy and muddy. Made it feel more like up than down. I've ridden Cinnamon Pass before, and think it's a great option. That would also make Lake City much less out of the way which would be good. It's a looooong way from Buena Vista to Silverton on the CT!

    Quote Originally Posted by Krein
    Another plus of staying off the CT in this area is snow -- it tends to linger a while above 13k.
    Total crap shoot there. This year, the snow above 12k-13k was gone in early July. Last year, it stuck around all through July, especially in the San Juans!

    I'll toss a start date of Thurs or Fri, 7/19/07 or 7/20/07 out there to see what people think.

  14. #39
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    ride

    this sounds great. I guess it's been in the back of many a people minds. I for one would favor a ridable course. If you're really psyched on pushing your bike, or think you're super manly and will ride everything after 20+ hours of riding, there is the event for you, it's called montezuma's revenge. July sounds good, re routing the wilderness and unridable sections sounds good.

  15. #40
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    Wilderness

    I'm really not in favor of a setup that might encourage people to ride the wilderness areas, even at night. Tire tracks would still be there for one thing and two it's just not right. We can hike the wilderness or detour around it but let's not poach it at night. That sets a bad example I think. If i just interpreted the posts wrong then my fault. Just thought I'd put that out there.

    On a cheery note, Oh boy am I having fun getting ready!
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