Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 58
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    58

    We the people ... To "Ellsworth" or not?

    After 12 years of riding "cookie cutter" hardtails I've decided to treat myself to a custom full suspension bike. After looking around it looks like most frames are around $2,000, so I'm not sure it matters much, when you look at cost, as to which brand you go with.. One thing that pointed me to Ellsworth is their claim of being very efficient when it comes to climbing, climbing is what I like to do the most so I would like to get the most out of the frame I can. That is one of two questions I have for all you Ellsworth owners out there, do their "efficiency" claims hold true? The other question I have is their swing arm beefy enough to hold up to some heavy duty torque, in other words will it flex? Looking at the construction of it, it looks really strudy and well built.
    The Stumpjumper Pro I have now flexes like a wet noodle and I have lots of problems with shifting and things like that during technical steep climbs. I guess the new and improved M4 material they made the frame out of was not intended to be real stiff.
    I would love to demo one but the "demo crew" will not be in Colorado Springs again till spring time and I do not want to wait till then and the bike shop is not going to let me ride one of there bikes where I would want to test ride it ...
    I would appreciate any comments or suggestions anyone might have.
    I realize I have asked probably the most biased riders on this "Ellsworth" forum, but I have been on enough forums to know that everyone thinks their's is the best no matter what brand it is, so I figured I would directly to the riders who own one.
    Thanks a lot!!!

  2. #2
    Custom User Title
    Reputation: coldsteele's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    1,287
    As to whether they are stiff or not. I have bent the 4th and 5th cogs on couple of cassettes, XT XTR and SRAM. That would make me to believe that the back end is plenty stiff. Well I do also have a CK hub with the 10mm bolts. I think the ability of the bike is hampered by the rider some times. Sometimes it is the other way around.

    I was on an ID for 2.5 years then went to a Moment. I've been on it for 2 years. I like the ride but the VPP design rides nice also. Each suspension design has its benefits and drawbacks. Find out what is more important to you and you will be on the right bike for you.

    There are plenty of EW riders in CO. I'm sure they will chime in.

    Good Luck
    Team MOJO Wheels.

  3. #3
    Time is not a road.
    Reputation: chad1433's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,136
    Which frame are you looking at buying? Down n Dirty seems to have asked the same question as you at the same time...about the Epiphany.

    Honestly, I've not heard that flex is an issue with any Ellsworth bike to date. I have heard that about Specialized FSR bikes, but not really any other linkage bikes, like Turner, Kona, Ventana (especially) or Titus to name a few. I have personally not noticed anything like brake rub or tire rub, no loss of traction on turns, things like that.

    As far as climbing goes, I'd say if you can push the gears, the bike will find the traction. Today's shocks make a heck of a difference too, but really, I like my bike best with minimal compression damping. It really bites into the terrain well. I have to say, though, that the best benefit of the suspension design, in my eyes, is the braking performance.

  4. #4
    Hooray Beer!
    Reputation: kid A's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    68
    is the Epi stiff ...h(ells) yeah. go for it

  5. #5
    The Dude Abides
    Reputation: UP Dude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    212
    I can say that the "100% efficient" claims are not true. No machine in existence is 100% efficient, and if you watch the little ICT video on the Ellsworth site, they show you so.

    Anyway, this seems to start out negative, but really I love my Moment. It is the greatest bike I have ever ridden. I did a significant suspension comparison this year at Interbike. Rode as many different designs as I could. So I can tell you this, you will probably not find a bike that is better at climbing technical terrain. If you are going to ride up fireroads and bomb down singletrack, VPP would be the way to go. But thing that makes the Ellsworths so great is that no matter what situation you are in, just keep pedaling, and the bike keeps going.

    My last ride was up one of our "peaks" here in da UP of Michigan. It starts out as sand, moves into loam, and turns into rock at the top. You are climbing up a trail that is basically all babyheads and bedrock, so in other words, bumpy as all heck! And as we were going up, I took notice to how amazing the suspension was working. As long as kept a nice, consistent pedal stroke, suspension kept taking the hits and the chain kept moving me forward. It really is an amazing experience.

    In contrast, I came from another Ellsworth before my Moment, the single pivot Joker. And while that was a great bike, the suspensions are night and day. The Joker was very much effected by the pedaling input. And I got very good at pedaling it to where if we were climbing up a road, I could keep the suspension from moving. But when it came to climbing the trail, that effect of the chain (lack of activeness) works against you and you find yourself being hampered by the terrain more than you should be.

    So heres the moral: Ellsworths are very, very good and being very, very active under any situation. They do a good job of keeping all elements of the suspension separated (bump absorption, pedaling, braking). However, they do bob more than a VPP or high single pivot which rely on the chain force to keep them steady. I say, an Ellsworth will climb better in a technical situation than most other bikes. Not to mention the decend like a bat out of hell!

    You should buy one, you won't regret it!

  6. #6
    over 50 years of cycling
    Reputation: Twisted Trail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    533

    steep is good

    Climbing ability is ONE of the main points that drew me to Ellsworth.

    I have a bro-in-law who can't say enough about his Truth's climbing ability. He rides in the Bay Area in CA, and I consider myself as a "hill climber" until I get around him. He goes up (and down) stuff that I can't even walk. He switched from a hard tail (Trek carbon) to some other suspension, then to the Truth. He is an INSANE rider. Says he climbs step ups and big stuff that his equally insane firends can't get over with their stable of pricey machines.

    I do twisty tight technical XC and love pushing the limits of traction going up. I actually created a trail system in my neighborhood that is called Willows Fjords. Its all maxed all vertical.

    I have a modified build kit Ellsworth Epi on order..I am a chunk heavier than my Bro-in-law..Unfotunately its taking a bit longer to get it than I anticpated , but just due to the shop where I am ordering it said they had the frame in stock...until I put money down, then changed their tune and now say the frame should be coming in "soon". AARRGGGHH!

  7. #7
    VooDoo user.
    Reputation: TIMBERRR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,394
    I recomend looking at the new Moment but you should definately ride others like the Chumba evo, Turner rfx, etc.

    Then make your own decision.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    728
    Ellsworth ICT in general are great, efficient technical climbers. Especially the Truth and Epiphany.

    Evo is a pretty good bike--stiff, heavy and solid. Its strength is on going down and is not on climbing. It needs the help of a travel-reduction fork to keep from wandering on steep climbs.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    60
    When you drop $2000 on a frame, whether it's Ellsworth, Turner or whatever you won't be dissapointed. I think the most important factor is the fit and how it feels when set up properly to suit your riding style.

    I have a Truth and Moment which are both great bikes, but like any frames they have limitations too.

    Take your time, test ride as much as possible then buy an Ellsworth!!

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation: brucemit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    9

    grinning ear-to-ear... but try b4 buy

    You simply must ride any frame before making a buy (same for snow skis, by the way). You just cannot go off of reviews or testamonials. Probably of no consequence what I say after that, huh?

    I rode a few bikes, including the Epiphany, when I was shopping. I bought the one that felt great and brought a big smile with it. I'm lucky to have a shop that will loan you an Ellsworth for an hour and you can be on dirt in about five minutes from their door. Took it for one hour, then came back a few weeks later and did a 24 hour demo/rental for second confirmation.

    I love the Epiphany and got no such feeling from anything else I tried: Specialized, Cannondale, Fischer... (did enjoy the Cannondale monofork, but the bikes felt sluggish somehow and the pedal/rear interaction was not right for me).

    Every time I jump on the Epi I am pleased beyond words (I keep having the Epiphany). It feels just completely right to me (after 3.5 months of ownership)...

    And, it is the best mix of climbing ease/traction and downhill control/comfort that I've ever been on. The feel and ride on this bike is just great for me. I guess I won't go shopping again for a few years...

    Buy a bike that fits you! Buy one that makes you grin from ear-to-ear and makes you want to get out and ride!!!

    -B

  11. #11
    mbabaracus
    Guest
    I recently demo'd an epi at the Singltrack Factory in Denver. If you don't mind a short drive, you can demo Ellsworths and Turners there. I took it to red-rocks which is a short hop away and gave it a good run through. Good shop with helpful people.

    The epi is on my short-list.

    bm

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    58

    Good job! Cool so far!!

    Hey, thanks for the insight so far!!! I do appreciate the replies.. I will have to visit the shop and try to talk them into letting me take one of their bikes out..
    mbabaracus thanks for the 411 on the Denver shop, I may need to resort to going there if my LBS won't let me do what I want although I would rather buy local...

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    115
    There may be beter bikes out there , but I guess noone would really know unless you owned them . Pardon the pun , but the truth of the matter is I own a truth and a moment and am very happy with them . I initially was concerned in making the financial commitment in buying my first Ellsworth (since they are expensive) , but after getting my first one I could say that I was very happy even though I cracked a chainstay, I still think very highly of their bikes , and continue to enjoy riding them .

  14. #14
    zeb
    zeb is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    279
    I went to other side,not anymore Ellsworth for me.I used to have two bikes:Moment and ID Last friday i bought new frame:Nicolai Helius FR,

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: elivingston's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    143
    The Ellsworth ICT is great. My Moment climbs like a rat up a drain pipe, and I can pull of pretty gnarly decents, too. Generally speaking, most Ellsworth owners love their bikes and they perform like no other. You'd have to pry mine out of my cold dead hands!

    Also, I'm a former Ventana owner (it was stolen ) and I'd buy another in a second. Definitely check them out... they have some killer new models for '07, too!
    - elivingston

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    181

    100% efficient?

    I'll agree with UP_Dude, it's my experience that suspension bikes are not 100% efficient. I started riding my Truth again after spending the last two years on my SS. I was always a sitdown and spin climber on my ells and could climb up any technical section... it excels here.

    After using the SS (36X20) for 99% of my rides, I learned to enjoy middle ring climbing on fire roads while standing and mashing on the pedals. You can't beat a hardtail for this type of climbing. Maybe if I had a stable platform shock it would help, but when I stand and pull on the bars while riding a f/s bike the back tire is much easier to overtorque since the shock is going to compress instead of apply the pressure to the rear tire.

    So it depends on what kind of climbing you do and the terrain. You can't beat a fully active suspension when it comes to technical climbing, the back tire sticks instead of getting bounced around. I left the SS at home when I went to Porc Rim.

    As far as lateral flex, I can't tell the difference between my SS and the Truth. My legs are not strong enough to cause noticeable flex. I can only wish they were, I'd like to know what it's like to ride a noodle.

    Get the frame and you'll enjoy the downhills as much as you do climbing.
    Last edited by BundokBiker; 11-03-2006 at 04:45 PM.

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation: pixelninja's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,044

    Customer Service issues?

    I'm thinking about coming back to Ellsworth ('03 Isis stolen and replaced with a Yeti 575), and want to know if anyone has any customer service stories (good or bad) from within the last 2 years. I've read all the horror stories about the 2001 Truth's and don't want to hear any of that again. What I want to hear are *recent* stories.
    "If you suck, that means I'm better. The more you suck, the better I am. So. Let me count the ways you suck." - Scribb

  18. #18
    over 50 years of cycling
    Reputation: Twisted Trail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    533

    Good job!

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelninja
    I'm thinking about coming back to Ellsworth ('03 Isis stolen and replaced with a Yeti 575), and want to know if anyone has any customer service stories (good or bad) from within the last 2 years. I've read all the horror stories about the 2001 Truth's and don't want to hear any of that again. What I want to hear are *recent* stories.
    I finally got my Epiphany. I am EXTREMELY happy with it. I had an "ultimate" road bike MANY years ago, and always compromised severely on my mtn bikes. This time I said what the heck. I had forgotten just how nice it is to have a no compromise bike that even makes you proud when you LOOK at it, in addition to when you are riding it.

    I was a bit put off by the reports of bad customer service when shopping for an Ellsworth. I came to the same conclusion as you, that these are old reports and one bad dealer in England.
    It appears that Ellsworth has woken up to the fact that good customer service is REQUIRED in ADDITION to making an awesome frame. I hope they plan to continue in this direction.

    I have gotten pretty good customer service response so far.

    I did have a slight issue of discovering that placement of the front derailleur is CRITICAL on the Epi. Luckily most people tend to install front derailleurs to high. Mine wasn't and dinged the frame. (Be especially careful if going to a "2 plus bash ring" front setup) Ellsworth did contact me directly and expressed concern. I also had some contact with them while trying to decide on getting an Epi.

    So I haven't had any MAJOR issues....which is a good thing, so I really haven't put their customer service to the acid test. And I hope I never have to.
    Live in the moment.
    YMMV

  19. #19
    Time is not a road.
    Reputation: chad1433's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,136
    Quote Originally Posted by pixelninja
    I'm thinking about coming back to Ellsworth ('03 Isis stolen and replaced with a Yeti 575), and want to know if anyone has any customer service stories (good or bad) from within the last 2 years. I've read all the horror stories about the 2001 Truth's and don't want to hear any of that again. What I want to hear are *recent* stories.
    There's been a few on the boards. Dave @ Ellsworth has really stepped in and been able to take care of some issues. Check out the thread on the magnesium rockers on the Epiphany.

  20. #20
    Your Imaginary Friend
    Reputation: CranxOC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    695
    Quote Originally Posted by pixelninja
    I'm thinking about coming back to Ellsworth ('03 Isis stolen and replaced with a Yeti 575), and want to know if anyone has any customer service stories (good or bad) from within the last 2 years. I've read all the horror stories about the 2001 Truth's and don't want to hear any of that again. What I want to hear are *recent* stories.
    I've been checking out the Ellsworth boards after seeing my fourth - yes, fourth - Ellsworth break and this last one was just this past Saturday. Two of them were broken by the same rider (both Truths, an '04 and an '05) who is a rather skilled rider who I've rarely seen do any kind of drops (technical stuff, yes, but he's not big on drops). The third was another friend whose '05 Moment cracked and this guy is a rather timid rider who's not a big fan of tech. The final one, the one that occurred this past Saturday, was on an '05 Truth and this one had a complete catastrophic failure where the top tube completely separated from the seat tube (fortunately, the guy was going up hill so he didn't get injured). This final rider is also one of the least aggressive riders I've ever met as he's pushing 60, loves to ride and doesn't want to risk injury.

    In my 6+ years of riding (and I ride a lot) I've only seen one other frame crack and that was on a Turner Nitrous (those things are made to break with a 165lbs weight limit) so either I know a bunch of very unlucky people or - and this latter assumption seems to be more in line with reality - Ellsworth is not only manufacturing a sub-standard product but producing a dangerous one as well.

    Everyone I know who rides one loves the way they ride which, at one time, got me to consider buying one however, after personally seeing so many failures I can only conclude that Ellsworth takes absolutely no pride in their craftsmanship and, worse yet, doesn't care about the fact that they're likely to produce a bike that may well get someone seriously injured or killed.

    Sure ICT is supposed to be great but is it really worth the risk when companies like Titus, Santa Cruz, Turner, Intense, Yeti and others are producing bikes that simply don't have these problems and - with the exception of Intense - are generally several hundred dollars cheaper?
    There's a fine line between courage and foolishness. Too bad it's not a fence.

  21. #21
    over 50 years of cycling
    Reputation: Twisted Trail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    533

    Bonking ... not feelin' well truth or consequences?

    crankxoc wrote:
    "I've been checking out the Ellsworth boards after seeing my fourth - yes, fourth - Ellsworth break and this last one was just this past Saturday."

    This does seem much higher than "normal" statistical odds. As much as I love my Epi, hearing something like this does cast a seed of doubt into me that I might be riding a time bomb.

    Might be a good time for Ellsworth to SHOW their Customer Service new leaf and answer this, hopefully reassuring us Ellsworth owners.

    This is indeed a pretty serious allegation being put forth here. Its either a scarey trend or libel.......

    that is definitely a bad or worse choice.....
    Live in the moment.
    YMMV

  22. #22
    Your Imaginary Friend
    Reputation: CranxOC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    695
    Quote Originally Posted by Twisted Trail
    crankxoc wrote:
    "I've been checking out the Ellsworth boards after seeing my fourth - yes, fourth - Ellsworth break and this last one was just this past Saturday."

    This does seem much higher than "normal" statistical odds. As much as I love my Epi, hearing something like this does cast a seed of doubt into me that I might be riding a time bomb.

    Might be a good time for Ellsworth to SHOW their Customer Service new leaf and answer this, hopefully reassuring us Ellsworth owners.

    This is indeed a pretty serious allegation being put forth here. Its either a scarey trend or libel.......

    that is definitely a bad or worse choice.....
    Not libel, defamation or slander in any way; simply the truth. I have nothing against Ellsworth as I've never actually either owned or ridden one however, having seen the results of their "craftsmanship" I have a serious problem with the product they're putting on the market.

    Like I said, maybe I'm simply an anomaly in that, literally, everyone I actually know who owns or has owned an Ellsworth has had them break (I've met many other Ellsworth owners but only really know three) but, couple my personal experience with the numerous stories I've heard about other Ellsworths breaking, and I simply cannot believe this company is still in business.

    As I mentioned previously, I believe the ICT system may actually be one of the better four-bar systems out there however, the bike quality itself scares the crap out of me.
    There's a fine line between courage and foolishness. Too bad it's not a fence.

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    292
    Quote Originally Posted by CranxOC
    Not libel, defamation or slander in any way; simply the truth. I have nothing against Ellsworth as I've never actually either owned or ridden one however, having seen the results of their "craftsmanship" I have a serious problem with the product they're putting on the market.

    Like I said, maybe I'm simply an anomaly in that, literally, everyone I actually know who owns or has owned an Ellsworth has had them break (I've met many other Ellsworth owners but only really know three) but, couple my personal experience with the numerous stories I've heard about other Ellsworths breaking, and I simply cannot believe this company is still in business.

    As I mentioned previously, I believe the ICT system may actually be one of the better four-bar systems out there however, the bike quality itself scares the crap out of me.
    I suggest you bring some hard evidence. Pictures? What Ellsworth told them etc? I could easily write about cracked Specialized, Turners or any other Manufacturer here. I think the problem some people have with Ells at the moment is that they are putting out some great bikes - which doesn't sit too well with some people.

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    23
    Just my twopenn'orth - I've had my Id for 11 months (one of the last ones?) and it is without doubt the best bike I've had) It climbs brilliantly and descends like a demon (the high BB is useful for rocky bits), but is a bit twitchy at times, probably due to the steep head angle. however, I've just had to replace all the pivot bearings. I know it is muddy here in Yorkshire, but those bearings were rubbish. it has been used once a week on average, I'm fairly gentle on bikes in general (althogh we do have some very rough fast descents) and I'm very careful when cleaning. 11 months is not really good enough in my opinion. I'll have to see how long these bearings last - I bought them from a local bearing supplier.

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    58
    Sounds like some silly talk going on here... I have faith that Ellsworth can weld two pieces of pipe together securely enough to withstand my abuse. As far as customer service, at least "locally" where I am at I have been offered by one of the employees of the bike shop to take his personal bike out for a "real" test on the single track before I buy one and I've yet to actually meet the guy.. Thanks man!! I realize that doesn't show for the entire company but it's a great start.. Thanks for all the input so far on this thread, I thought it was dead but I guess it's been brought back to life...

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •