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  1. #1
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    Bender! Fire! Chutes and Ladders, Oh My!

    Just in case you guys missed this article on TE and the travails of evacuation, here ya go!


    San Diego Union Tribune Sunday 01-20-2008

  2. #2
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    Thanks for the Link

    Thats a good read-interesting that E's half brother owns Beyond Bikes. Hope all is well in E land now.

  3. #3
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    TE talks too much...

    I think talking too much gets TE into trouble. It is was caused his problems with some people on the boards by trying to communicate on the warranty issues and ending up putting his foot in his mouth (at least as the affected people saw it).
    From the article:
    "Ellsworth also found a way to work around the loss of telephone service, which lasted through December, by using Skype, a software program that allows users to make telephone calls over the Internet. He used Skype to route the company's phone calls to his employees' cell phones."
    TE and a billion other Skype users never bother to read the EULA:
    http://www.skype.com/legal/eula/
    "2.1 License. Subject to the terms of this Agreement, Skype hereby grants You a limited, personal, non-commercial, non-exclusive, non-sublicensable, non-assignable, free of charge license to download, install and use the Skype Software on Your computer, phone or PDA for the sole purpose of personally using the internet communication applications provided by Skype and any other applications that may be explicitly provided by Skype. For the avoidance of doubt, You are allowed to use Skype Software at work, in accordance with the terms of this Agreement."
    You are allowed to use it at work, but not for work (from what I remember it seems they added that little "at work" clause since the original EULA). If you use Skype services for your business, you are supposed to pay! Maybe he did pay, but I strongly believe he, like many others, did not.
    So, did TE make a public admission of theft? One thing is for sure: If you are in business, especially if you are an owner or an officer of the company you need to watch what you say - less is usually better.

    Oh yeah, another thing - is that a legal open trail you are riding on Mr. Bender? Ok, maybe its on TE's property. Or maybe not. But pics of Josh riding on a "charred hillside" aren't actually good PR now, are they?

  4. #4
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    For a second I thought this was about a ride in Fruita.

  5. #5
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    I think it is interesting that everyone who has asked Ells about fitting Marzocchi rear shocks (myself included) has been told "no, we have not tried one, use a Fox", and then they use a picture of Bender running a Roco and a 66.

  6. #6
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    So Ellsworth sells around 1100 bikes a year? (revs of 3.3M, assumed average cost of 3k) A far smaller number than I would have assumed.

    Anyway, good thing his business didn't burn to the ground. A really interesting DR article, too.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHorse
    I think talking too much gets TE into trouble. It is was caused his problems with some people on the boards by trying to communicate on the warranty issues and ending up putting his foot in his mouth (at least as the affected people saw it).
    From the article:
    "Ellsworth also found a way to work around the loss of telephone service, which lasted through December, by using Skype, a software program that allows users to make telephone calls over the Internet. He used Skype to route the company's phone calls to his employees' cell phones."
    TE and a billion other Skype users never bother to read the EULA:
    http://www.skype.com/legal/eula/
    "2.1 License. Subject to the terms of this Agreement, Skype hereby grants You a limited, personal, non-commercial, non-exclusive, non-sublicensable, non-assignable, free of charge license to download, install and use the Skype Software on Your computer, phone or PDA for the sole purpose of personally using the internet communication applications provided by Skype and any other applications that may be explicitly provided by Skype. For the avoidance of doubt, You are allowed to use Skype Software at work, in accordance with the terms of this Agreement."
    You are allowed to use it at work, but not for work (from what I remember it seems they added that little "at work" clause since the original EULA). If you use Skype services for your business, you are supposed to pay! Maybe he did pay, but I strongly believe he, like many others, did not.
    So, did TE make a public admission of theft? One thing is for sure: If you are in business, especially if you are an owner or an officer of the company you need to watch what you say - less is usually better.

    Oh yeah, another thing - is that a legal open trail you are riding on Mr. Bender? Ok, maybe its on TE's property. Or maybe not. But pics of Josh riding on a "charred hillside" aren't actually good PR now, are they?

    Jeez get over yourself - go ride your Yeti and stop whinging about Ellsworth at every opportunity. That is one of the most pointless posts I've seen in an age - what do you hope to achieve by it?

    "Oh yeah, another thing - is that a legal open trail you are riding on Mr. Bender? Ok, maybe its on TE's property. Or maybe not. But pics of Josh riding on a "charred hillside" aren't actually good PR now, are they?"

    How sad are you!!? Pathetic.
    "[SIZE="3"][SIZE="2"]but I do not see anything in the world of suspension methods that is superior to the 4 Bar.

    Dave Turner[/SIZE][/SIZE]

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zakster
    Jeez get over yourself - go ride your Yeti and stop whinging about Ellsworth at every opportunity. That is one of the most pointless posts I've seen in an age - what do you hope to achieve by it?

    "Oh yeah, another thing - is that a legal open trail you are riding on Mr. Bender? Ok, maybe its on TE's property. Or maybe not. But pics of Josh riding on a "charred hillside" aren't actually good PR now, are they?"

    How sad are you!!? Pathetic.
    Zakster: I am sad because you have me confused with someone else. I own and ride two Ellsworth bikes and love them. I have never whined about Ellsworth bikes or the company or even TE ever. I don't own a Yeti or even ever rode one. You could check all my posts if you really want to confirm that.
    The point of the post is in relationship to Tony's tendency to "say too much". Its what got him a "black eye" from other people (not me) on the forum. Its not a smart idea to put into public print an admission of using Skype to save your business. If he used the free services its theft. And, Skype knows every call ever made using it, to who and from who. Legally, they can send him a bill for the services.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by lidarman
    For a second I thought this was about a ride in Fruita.
    Ellsworths are not allowed to be ridden in Fruita, or Moab, it will void the warranty

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by rroeder
    Ellsworths are not allowed to be ridden in Fruita, or Moab, it will void the warranty
    Funny in that is where I found my Truth cracked in 2003--on Steve's loop.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jefe74
    I think it is interesting that everyone who has asked Ells about fitting Marzocchi rear shocks (myself included) has been told "no, we have not tried one, use a Fox", and then they use a picture of Bender running a Roco and a 66.
    I noticed that. I've always wanted one of those damned shocks, too...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by lidarman
    Funny in that is where I found my Truth cracked in 2003--on Steve's loop.
    Both of mine were broken at Moab

  13. #13
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    It's cool to know what's on his mind. After all, we subscribed to his product.
    It's a chronic addiction

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHorse
    Zakster: I don't own a Yeti or even ever rode one. You could check all my posts if you really want to confirm that.
    Maybe Zak meant go and grab your Yeti grips, it seems I remember a Yeti brand from your Epi build.

    Good point about Skype. I've been accused of talking too much also. I think it's because of the enthusiasm I have for my passions. Sometimes we get carried away and it can get us into trouble.

    Be quick to hear, slow to speak, and slow to anger.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by mouse jockey
    Maybe Zak meant go and grab your Yeti grips, it seems I remember a Yeti brand from your Epi build.

    Good point about Skype. I've been accused of talking too much also. I think it's because of the enthusiasm I have for my passions. Sometimes we get carried away and it can get us into trouble.

    Be quick to hear, slow to speak, and slow to anger.
    It would be completely brain-damaged of me to post something critical of "the man" in the Ellsworth forum and not expect an arrow in the head
    Actually, I made a mistake and thought I was posting in the socal forum. Thus my cryptic comment about the "charred hillsides". Sensitive issue in San Diego after the fires and trail closures what with all the anti-bike nuts.
    Well, I apologize for getting people pissed off. I try to be objective but sometimes it just comes out wrong.
    Anyway, I did "grab the Yetis" today. Epi on Ice is Nice...
    Attached Images Attached Images

  16. #16
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    Why am I not surprised that the ownership of BeyondBikes is related to TE... the business practices are so similar I'm surprised this bit of trivia didn't come out sooner.
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHorse
    It would be completely brain-damaged of me to post something critical of "the man" in the Ellsworth forum and not expect an arrow in the head
    Actually, I made a mistake and thought I was posting in the socal forum. Thus my cryptic comment about the "charred hillsides". Sensitive issue in San Diego after the fires and trail closures what with all the anti-bike nuts.
    Well, I apologize for getting people pissed off. I try to be objective but sometimes it just comes out wrong.
    Anyway, I did "grab the Yetis" today. Epi on Ice is Nice...
    Hey OH,

    Good riding with you the other day! Too bad you didn't have your Epi it would have handled the ride better than the NRS, but you did really well either way. If you want to ride again PM me or DT, and we'll make it happen. BTW, the clavicle is in no worse for wear after testing it on the DH. How'd you like the second half of the ride?


  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mouse jockey
    Hey OH,

    Good riding with you the other day! Too bad you didn't have your Epi it would have handled the ride better than the NRS, but you did really well either way. If you want to ride again PM me or DT, and we'll make it happen. BTW, the clavicle is in no worse for wear after testing it on the DH. How'd you like the second half of the ride?

    MJ:

    Thanks for the ride with you and DFT. Sorry to not reply sooner, back in BJ now and things were hectic for a week. Iron mountain was fun, but as you note it would have been more fun with the Epi. The Giant NRS I borrowed is, IMO, fundamentally flawed in that if the front wheel and the back wheel are both simultaneously taking a drop-off the suspension reacts badly. It kind of becomes progressively additive and you get a lot of bounce. So it doesn't handle the stairstep type of trail well at all. The second half on the backside is a lot of climbing but was ok in spite of the Giant weight. Ok, I am whining... The weather in SD is always great and it was a fabulous day to ride
    Not sure when I will be back, but when I do we can all go out to Anderson Truck Trail and check out the spot where you snapped your clavicle

  19. #19
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    curious

    Quote Originally Posted by rroeder
    Both of mine were broken at Moab
    just curious, after you broke the frames, what happened next? are you keeping it, throw it to the garbage, try to welded again and using/sale it again, or exchange it due to warranty? and how about if it out of warranty?
    since I just got a second-hand 07 Epi and don't know anything about the warranty of Ellsworth's frame (no info on the website), though it may not apply to my condition but I just curious about it.

    thanks.

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