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  1. #1
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    x.9 type 2 derailleur problems

    Hey guys i installed my SRAM x.9 rear derailleur type 2 with all new 10 speed gear cassette 11-36, chain, and front 34T ring i was having trouble after about a month on the new setup i noticed that there was a strange noise coming from the bike while pedals in the low gear when i put the bike was in the stand i noticed that it was also having a hard time dropped from the low gear (36) to the next gear down, its also having trouble dropping down from the second to last high gear to the highest gear (11) cable tension would help a little but the B screw seemed to help the most but i could never get it perfect and today after pulling the chain i noticed the top pulley was completely worn out already! does anyone have some insight on this?

    derailleur to close to cassette?

    chain line issue?

    to much tension from type 2 system?

    installer error?





  2. #2
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    Don't know anything about type two's, but that derailleur looks way too folded forward and stretched out for being on the big ring in back. Chain too short?

    edit* after looking at the photo again, something seems totally screwed up. To me the hangar even looks funny and the upper jockey wheel is waay too close to the cassette.

  3. #3
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    I was messing with the b screw in that picture I wanted to show you guys the setup the chain is the correct length it has about another 1" the derailleur can swing up. The suspension bottomed out completely

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkstar187 View Post
    I was messing with the b screw in that picture I wanted to show you guys the setup the chain is the correct length it has about another 1" the derailleur can swing up. The suspension bottomed out completely
    Not shifting off the big cog easily is one of the symptoms of a too short chain.

    I would add a link (at least) and adjust the B-screw.
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  5. #5
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    I have the exact set up as you and have the exact same problem. Tell you what, I've about had it with sram & about ready to go back to shimano. Already switched to servo wave brakes and they blow away avid cr's. Pedals- shimano, cassette , no contest shimano etc. I also have had 2 model years in row x9 rear derailleurs where it was impossible to adjust either the H or L screw with out it bottoming out on the other rendering it useless.

    Having played with the chain length I don't beleive it to be a factor (the upper pulley runs to close to the cogs despite chain length or b-screw tension). In a nut shell, the derallieur action between the 13t cog & 32t cog is inaccurate. You can NOT tune the derallieur to run true on both the 13t cog & the 32t cog simultaneously & have to choose one or the other. On a positive note I will say there is zero chain slap.


    Been tuning derallieurs for 20+ years and it is not rocket science. If anybody else has any insight into the issue I'm all ears.

  6. #6
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    i tired a new chain and that sure wasnt it! I took it to a shop they sure couldnt do it!

    Hey big JC thanks for chiming in! It is complete BS that this wasn't corrected before the derailleur was put into production. I called SRAM and they are warranting it. I am kinda glad that im not the only one having issues. I am also fed up with the new SRAM stuff i had new XO brakes they are ready failed i am now on to XT brakes they are the bees knees! I put all my old X9 9speed stuff on it is so nice how the shifter feels so much lighter and it responds instantly! I will agree to the face that there was zero chain slap!

  7. #7
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    My X.0 Type 2 has what seems to be a similar issue.

    There is an audible clicking or knocking sound on initial suspension compression. It seems to be coming from the clutch one-way mechanism. I can see the pulley cage move a few mm exactly when the suspension starts to cycle. It started in lower gears, and has worsened so that it doesn’t matter which gear it is in.

    As part of diagnosing, I took off my shock to cycle the suspension and observe everything. I have my chain length set so the r. derailleur still has some swing left at full travel in "big-big" with my chainguide. I have no shifting, guide, or tension issues. There is just a lurch in the cage/ clutch rotation. The knock sounds becomes worse over time as well.

    I've used one-way needle bearings at work (high end R/C race cars) that exhibited this behavior when they were undersized for the application. They work intermittently… very similarly to how by Type 2 action is working.

  8. #8
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    I have been thinking of upgrading to this RD, it seems like a good thing to hold off a little longer and do more reading. I hope this problem is not widespread as I really like the low chain slap everyone brags about with this item.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghettocop View Post
    Don't know anything about type two's, but that derailleur looks way too folded forward and stretched out for being on the big ring in back. Chain too short?

    edit* after looking at the photo again, something seems totally screwed up. To me the hangar even looks funny and the upper jockey wheel is way too close to the cassette.
    actually it looks too far away or just about right.. it should be around 6mm tooth of cassette to tooth of jockey wheel unless they changed that with the new clutch units

    the way that jockey wheel is worn it looks to me that the hanger is slightly bent (if you notice the angle worn into the side of the tooth it says the chain is sliding off the side not off just the top) Also having the B screw set too far away the top edge of the jockey wheel tooth will wear in a "shark fin" like that because the chain isn't leaving the wheel smoothly and is using less of them to guide the chain onto the cassette.. closer to the cassette give the chain more wrap around the jockey, more teeth doing the same job..

    the chain does look a tad short ... with a guide like that the chain should have at least 2-4 extra links..
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  10. #10
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    Update:

    After talking to SRAM and shop handling my warranty for the knocking issue, it seems the X.0 medium cage w/ the type 2 clutch is only rated at a 35T capacity. Their non-type 2 medium is usually 37T.

    I'm running a 24/36 with an 11-36 cassette which needs 37T (which their older medium cages could handle)...

    Short version is that they are sending me a long cage and I would expect them to update their tech specs shortly if that truly is the issue. I'll report back once installed.

    Side note: The XTR shadow plus medium cage and shifter I'm using in the meantime has zero issues with everything else being identical.

  11. #11
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    How is the XTR RD working perfectly with SRAM shifters? That surprises me.

    Anyway... about the main issue of chainwrap capacity. The SRAM documentation online is correct. There is a graphical diagram on the derailleur paper document which shows the valid combos. It's two triangular wedges... not the easiest thing in the world to read IMHO. They should just have a grid with a green check mark or a red X. Sheesh!

    The type 2 X9 & X0 rear derailleurs have the following capacity:

    short cage - 30
    mid cage - 35
    long cage - 47

    There are many 2x10 combos that could result in the mid cage being inadequate if you're using the 11-36 pie plate... very annoying. and-- yes, I had it happen to me. I chose to run a 11-32 cassette I already had instead.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by tree_trunks View Post
    Side note: The XTR shadow plus medium cage and shifter I'm using....
    Note: I switched to the XTR derailleur and XTR shifter I had from another bike already.

    Sorry if my lack of specifics implied I mated the X.0 shifter to the XTR der.

    If the cable pull was compatible betwen the two, I'd just use the X.0 shifter with the XTR Shadow+ and call it a day... I can dream right?

    From everything I've read, the average cable pull on Shimano 10 speed (offroad) is 2.3mm/ click mated to their 1.7 actuation ratio where the SRAM is 3mm of cable pull with their 1.36 ish actuation ratio. So they're obviously not compatible.


    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    ... not the easiest thing in the world to read IMHO....

    short cage - 30
    mid cage - 35
    long cage - 47
    I agree about their new instructions... I completely missed that the capacity shrank to 35 for the mid cage from the older X.0 37 capacity. I hope all is good when my long cage shows up. A number chart like your 3 lines above is a hell of a lot simpler.

    http://cdn.sram.com/cdn/farfuture/qq...components.pdf
    Last edited by tree_trunks; 09-18-2012 at 12:50 PM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by thomllama View Post
    actually it looks too far away or just about right.. it should be around 6mm tooth of cassette to tooth of jockey wheel unless they changed that with the new clutch units

    the way that jockey wheel is worn it looks to me that the hanger is slightly bent (if you notice the angle worn into the side of the tooth it says the chain is sliding off the side not off just the top) Also having the B screw set too far away the top edge of the jockey wheel tooth will wear in a "shark fin" like that because the chain isn't leaving the wheel smoothly and is using less of them to guide the chain onto the cassette.. closer to the cassette give the chain more wrap around the jockey, more teeth doing the same job..

    the chain does look a tad short ... with a guide like that the chain should have at least 2-4 extra links..

    The chain is the correct length it is 1091 with one link removed on my santa cruz nomad.

    As for the b screw it probably is not adjusted correctly in the photo. I had been adjusting in and out after i was pretty fed up trying to figure out if that indeed was the issue with the derailleur not shifting correctly.

  14. #14
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    Here is a video of the issue that i was having. On top of the shifting issue i was having a clunking noise as you can see if i move the cage forward the noise goes away as if the tension was to much. (You can also see the B screw adjusted)


    <object width="560" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/_cEET7lQ96s?version=3&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/_cEET7lQ96s?version=3&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="560" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>



    I moved on to a Zee (also has a clutch) rear derailleur and saint shift and things are working perfectly!
    Last edited by Darkstar187; 09-18-2012 at 01:49 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkstar187 View Post
    Here is a video of the issue that i was having. On top of the shifting issue i was having a clunking noise as you can see if i move the cage forward the noise goes away as if the tension was to much. (You can also see the B screw adjusted)







    I moved on to a Zee (also has a clutch) rear derailleur and saint shift and things are working perfectly!
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  16. #16
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    ok fixed!

  17. #17
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    hmmm can't really tell much that far away from the drive train..

    does look like the B screw is WAY tooo far out but again, hard to tell... can't really even see what the issue is if the Shimmy stuff is working.. leave it
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  18. #18
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    I can hear that it sounded like something was very wrong with the clutch. I can also see that his derailleur isn't overstretched, unlike some. He didn't have a capacity or chain length issue that I can see.

  19. #19
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    With the b screw adjusted out that far was the only way to get it to down shift. I have adjusted many derailleurs this one in the defective state was a battle to even get to to almost shift normally. The b screw not having anything to do with the problem or even the chain length which was the correct length. Only one link short of a new chain on a 1/10 with 34 x 11-36 med cage derailleur is defiantly not going to be on the short side. The deraileur did work correctly when it was first installed after a few rides the shifting became temperamental I noticed in certain gears.

    As you can see in the picture shimano set up the proper b screw distance is set.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by thomllama View Post
    actually it looks too far away or just about right.. it should be around 6mm tooth of cassette to tooth of jockey wheel unless they changed that with the new clutch units

    the way that jockey wheel is worn it looks to me that the hanger is slightly bent (if you notice the angle worn into the side of the tooth it says the chain is sliding off the side not off just the top) Also having the B screw set too far away the top edge of the jockey wheel tooth will wear in a "shark fin" like that because the chain isn't leaving the wheel smoothly and is using less of them to guide the chain onto the cassette.. closer to the cassette give the chain more wrap around the jockey, more teeth doing the same job..

    the chain does look a tad short ... with a guide like that the chain should have at least 2-4 extra links..
    I understand that it is fixed OP, so that is great news! Just wanted to address Mr. Llama for a sec.......You are absolutely right. With the pic blown blown up like that it is indeed too far, not too close. Good eye!

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    After looking at the new Specialized Enduro drivetrain setups. 11-36 rear cassette and 36/24 chainrings. They are using the type 2 mid rear mechs. Wonder if they are having these issues also because I was looking to get the same setup as the new enduros.

  22. #22
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    broken sram x9 swing arm

    Does anyone know if you can replace the inner side(closer to the wheel) of a sram x9 rear derailleur. I was biking along and my derailleur kept making noise in the high gears, i jumped, started pedaling and SNAP. the swing arm had got jammed in the spokes an broke the inner swing arm and hanger. i had like only 15 to 20 miles on the derailleur after restoring my gary fisher Cake. i cant find any replacement part for the x9 and i dont want to spend another $80. for now i'm stuck riding my eatern bmx(not so bad) so i'l appreciate any advice.

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    Question for ColinL--I installed an X0 Type 2 in place of an existing XX. On my 2x10, 11-36, 38-24, I set the chain length for small chain ring and small cassette cog. When I next shift to the large chain ring and shift up the cassette gears, the chain gets stuck at about the 8th cog--not enough chain length. If I add a link, the jockey wheel will rub the chain when on the small cassette cog and small chain ring. The chain wrap capacity and cassette capacity appears to be the same for the medium cage XX and X0 type 2. So, why does XX work, while the X0 Type 2, does not?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by testtech View Post
    Question for ColinL--I installed an X0 Type 2 in place of an existing XX. On my 2x10, 11-36, 38-24, I set the chain length for small chain ring and small cassette cog. When I next shift to the large chain ring and shift up the cassette gears, the chain gets stuck at about the 8th cog--not enough chain length. If I add a link, the jockey wheel will rub the chain when on the small cassette cog and small chain ring. The chain wrap capacity and cassette capacity appears to be the same for the medium cage XX and X0 type 2. So, why does XX work, while the X0 Type 2, does not?
    umm supposed to be large -large, not small-small for the chain length... probably destroying your whole drive train right now
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    Quote Originally Posted by thomllama View Post
    umm supposed to be large -large, not small-small for the chain length... probably destroying your whole drive train right now
    Probably impolite, but I seriously LOL'D at this.

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    Perhaps you are right, but that is what the expert mechanic at the bike shop was doing. Today, the maximum expert at the bike shop arrived and informed the junior expert that the B adjustment was incorrect. The shifting now appears to be working properly.

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    So unfortunately I found this thread right after I bought the type 2 derailleur and after reading through all this it sounds like the main problem is when you exceed what is supposed to be the max travel of the derailleur. I currently have a 26-39 on the front and 12-36 on the back for a total of 37T. I will be switching the back out to a 11-32 which should be in line with what Sram is recommending but my question is this. Do you think it will be ok to ride the bike while I am waiting for the rear cassette to arrive? It would seem the only problem would happen when you run the two biggest gears at the same time.

  28. #28
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    You can do that but you'll lose more than just the 36. You probably won't be able to shift to the 32 either.

    I speak from experience. I had the same setup except a 11-36 cassette and I switched to 11-32 rather than get a long cage RD. If you make the chain extra long to try big-big then you'll loose a bunch of gears in your small chainring... like 3-4.

    You can ride it safely in the small chainring, with a properly sized chain, until you get the new cassette.

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    ColinL are you saying you switched to a smaller rear cassette and could not use the two big gears with a normal length chain? That doesn't seem right. It is not good practice because the alignment is also at is worst but I have on occasion done it while riding my 2x10 with the old setup

  30. #30
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    No, when I had the 11-36 cassette with a long (like 57 links) chain, I still couldn't use the two biggest cogs. And I couldn't use the 3 smallest cogs in the small chainring. Exceeding the RD capacity by that much is a bad thing.

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    my experience...

    Perhaps ignorance is bliss.

    I'm running an 11-36T cassette and 24/36 in the front with the X.9 Type 2 medium cage. When I bought it I wasn't aware that the medium Type 2 no longer supports 37T capacity. However, I've taken it on a few rides now, and I haven't noticed any problems yet.

    - Chain slap is gone.
    - Shifting: I'm able to cycle through all the gears without any problems. I've adjusted the B-tension to the recommended 6mm from 36T in the back.
    - Chain length looks good at full compression

    After reading the OP, I did notice some wear on the upper pulley (NO shark fins though). I also hear the quiet/subtle clunk in the clutch when cycling the suspension. But I don't notice it at all while riding. Maybe the clunk is b/c I've exceeded the tooth capacity of the medium cage, but that's just speculating. So far I don't really notice anything wrong while I'm riding.
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by enduro View Post
    Perhaps ignorance is bliss.

    I'm running an 11-36T cassette and 24/36 in the front with the X.9 Type 2 medium cage. When I bought it I wasn't aware that the medium Type 2 no longer supports 37T capacity. However, I've taken it on a few rides now, and I haven't noticed any problems yet.
    This is exactly what my 2013 stumpy evo came with. I'd imagine if a stock bike has been spec'd with this setup then you shouldn't expect any issues?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bad andy View Post
    This is exactly what my 2013 stumpy evo came with. I'd imagine if a stock bike has been spec'd with this setup then you shouldn't expect any issues?
    A SRAM tech let me know that you can run 37T "at the absolute most" (direct quote from the email) with a type 2 midcage, but 38 will *not* work.

    On your stumpy, if you shift into small-small, what does your derailleur look like? How does the chain sound? It might bind a little, I'm curious.

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    Oh -- also, there is another possible route if you have the 26/39 XC crankset and a type2 midcage RD:

    You can use a Shimano 11-34 cassette. SRAM doesn't make 11-34, but Shimano does. I have used a Shimano cassette on otherwise all-SRAM drivetrain on my roadbike and it was just fine.

    I thought about that for my MTB, but I already had a SRAM 11-32 cassette on hand so I threw that on and I've found the gear range adequate. When I wear that cassette out, however, I probably will go 11-34.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    A SRAM tech let me know that you can run 37T "at the absolute most" (direct quote from the email) with a type 2 midcage, but 38 will *not* work.

    On your stumpy, if you shift into small-small, what does your derailleur look like? How does the chain sound? It might bind a little, I'm curious.
    I can't really test. I converted to 1x10. Running a single 32t up front now. I got a buddy with the same bike though, maybe I'll take a glance at his.

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    LOL at the people who say shimano is "better" when the person realized they didn't use the correct set up for SRAM.

    Both products are great, but you need to install them using the correct gearing...

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    What the hell???

    Sorry for the ridiculous question but how is all this 30, 35, 40 thing worked out? Is it the following?

    (largest sprocket on the cassette - smallest) + (largest chainring - smallest)

    Anyway I'm running 38/24 chainrings and an 11/36 cassette so according to the sophisticated formula above that would be 39T, therefore no chance of a medium cage X9 Type 2?

    So to run the medium cage X9 Type 2 I would need to change the cassette to an 11/32 as this would result in 35T. Is this correct?

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    Quote Originally Posted by searchtime View Post
    Sorry for the ridiculous question but how is all this 30, 35, 40 thing worked out? Is it the following?

    1. (largest sprocket on the cassette - smallest) + (largest chainring - smallest)

    2. Anyway I'm running 38/24 chainrings and an 11/36 cassette so according to the sophisticated formula above that would be 39T, therefore no chance of a medium cage X9 Type 2?

    3. So to run the medium cage X9 Type 2 I would need to change the cassette to an 11/32 as this would result in 35T. Is this correct?
    1. yes, that is how you calculate chain wrap capacity. yep, you have 39 and you would need a long cage type 2 RD.

    2a. sophisticated? it's just counting the differences in the teeth, which ends up as extra chain and then the rear derailleur needs to take up the slack in the chain. this is the need for larger amount of rear derailleur capacity.

    2b. officially 35T is the spec. as noted previously, a few times by different people, sram says that 35T can be slightly exceeded but absolutely no more than 37.

    3. that is one option and it's what I did (26/39 rings) when I learned this the hard way and couldn't get my 11-36 cassette to work. but you could use a shimano 11-34 cassette and that would be 37T capacity, the absolute max sram allows, and you could probably get it to work as long as you don't mind a noisy or maybe even non-functional small-small gear combination.

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    So how does the result of the "sophisticated" formula allow the chain length to be calculated?

    P.S. I hope the speech marks allude to sarcasm as it is obviously very hard to convey in writing.

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    You can't calculate chain length like that-- you need chainstay length and number of teeth on your biggest chainwheel and biggest cassette cog. There are several sites with calculators that get you within 1 link which is pretty good, assuming you account for any chainstay growth on a FS bike.

    The rear derailleur has to then absorb all that chain capacity when running smaller teeth combinations, down to small-small.

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    Ive had exactly the same shifting problems with x9 type 2 mech, first one got replaced under sram warranty and the second still wont index properly! if i put my non type 2 x9 mech back on it works fine!! so i give up with it, but would love to know what the actual problem with it is?!?!

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    3. that is one option and it's what I did (26/39 rings) when I learned this the hard way and couldn't get my 11-36 cassette to work. but you could use a shimano 11-34 cassette and that would be 37T capacity, the absolute max sram allows, and you could probably get it to work as long as you don't mind a noisy or maybe even non-functional small-small gear combination.
    since someone else replied & bumped this thread, I guess I'll quote myself and update my config. I really wanted to use the 11-36 cassette and just stay in my big ring most (actually nearly all) the time.

    so I bought a raceface turbine 28T small ring. this gives me (39-28)+(36-11) = 36T capacity. my SRAM type 2 midcage works great. I also put a 1.0mm shimano cassette spacer in there to setup a perfect chainline on the big ring. (My lockring can still be torqued to 40nm, no problem, and it doesn't rub on the dropout.)

    I'm glad this worked because my other consideration was to switch to a single 32 or 34 chainring but that would have cost more and obviously have less gear range than my somewhat weird 28/39.

  43. #43
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    Reading this thread has kept me from this upgrade. Initially I wanted the type 2 after vein told by SRAM that it is AM rated and built tougher. Then realizing my 22-44 and 11-36 setup up 3X10 I conceded that I must move to a 2X10. I have chosen and new rear cassette with 12-28 and 26-39 in the front. I too would like to use a mid-cage. I am hoping this will be fine, and after hearing your new setup I think everything should work well. Thanks!
    ****I should ride less and post more****

  44. #44
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    That is actually 29T capacity so technically you could use the short cage (30), but I would buy the midcage which will let you use up to 11-34.

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    After reading all this I went out and checked my bike, which is a 2013 Norco Shinobi 1 with a 2X10 drivetrain. It came set up with a Sram X9 type 2 rear derailleur, a 11-36 cassette, and 22/36 chainrings. That works out to 39T. It was also spec.d with a medium cage derailleur.

    I checked out Sram's website to try and confirm if my derailleur really is a medium cage, because if it is, it's being asked to perform way out of it's intended range. Sram doesn't seem to give measurements for the cage length, so I can not tell, but they do state that the long cage model is intended for 3X10 set-ups.

    Could someone who is sure they have a medium cage measure for me, center-to-center on the jockey wheels?

    My rear derailleur seems to function OK, and I have been regularly cross-chaining it big-big with no apparent problems. (not 'cause it's brilliant to do so, but it happens) The downshifts can be a little slow, which I was attributing to the Type-2 mech. & the X-Guide up front both increasing and maintaining higher chain tension. I do have one problem though, and that's throwing the chain off the outside of the big ring in front. I have carefully adjusted the front derailleur so it no longer happens when I shift in front. At this point it is only happening when I am flying along in top gear over rough stuff, for instance spinning downhill over washboards.

    So now I'm wondering; is the derailleur not able to properly maintain chain tension when I am at either end of the range, as in this case; high gear?
    Last edited by 883883; 12-09-2012 at 05:07 PM.

  46. #46
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    I can guarantee you have along cage because I tried everything with my midcage to make 38T work, including emailing sram for help, and it is a no-go.

    There is absolutely, positively no way a midcage would work with your setup.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    I can guarantee you have along cage because I tried everything with my midcage to make 38T work, including emailing sram for help, and it is a no-go.

    There is absolutely, positively no way a midcage would work with your setup.


    OK, that's certainly suggests I've got a long cage despite the literature that comes with the bike and specifies it's a medium. I've just measured it; it's 100mm center-to-center (one jockey wheel to the other). I'd still like to find out what that measurement is for either a known long or a known medium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 883883 View Post
    ...I've just measured it; it's 100mm center-to-center (one jockey wheel to the other). I'd still like to find out what that measurement is for either a known long or a known medium.
    The long cage is 100mm.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by 883883 View Post

    OK, that's certainly suggests I've got a long cage despite the literature that comes with the bike and specifies it's a medium. I've just measured it; it's 100mm center-to-center (one jockey wheel to the other). I'd still like to find out what that measurement is for either a known long or a known medium.
    I had some trouble getting my caliper on there properly but my midcage x9 type 2 is approximately 75mm.

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    OK, thanks everyone, it's good to know what I'm working with.

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