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  1. #1
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    10spd short cage derailleur w/ 38 front!

    buddies bike sports a 11-36 rear w/ 38 ring up front. stock 2011 sram xo SHORT (55mm)cage derailleur.an agressive rider on an epic 29r. not one problem to date.
    i call sram because my long cage xx derailleur *11-36(on my2013 superfly ht)seems to make my chain flop around and wants to derail in the front at bottom. xx is a month old.
    that short cage xo 's spring is much stiffer than that long cage xx spring.
    so i wanted to look into a short cage setup.sram says to stay w/ my long xx and adjust chain length to just one link extra w/ bypassing derailleur on large /large rings.did so. still not fixed ...maybe better,but have to soft peddle if caught in time prior to chain drop.
    do i go xo short? (that stock epic measures 55mm center wheel to center wheel)is this the norm in mm on all 10spd xo short der.
    do i go short xx? or is the xx spring on the short just as soft as the long cage.
    are all 10spd xo 2009-12 the same?
    would it even matter using a short cage period ,if i decide to use it as a 2x driveline as long as i dont go small /small combo.

  2. #2
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    is this your bike? Superfly HT Pro SL

    EDIT: step 1 before you do anything with the chain is to make sure that your front and rear derailleurs are adjusted properly and that the chain is fed through the RD correctly. these simple things could really screw something up. on a brand new bike that costs this much, the shop you bought it from should literally be bending over backwards to make it right.

    but anyway--

    on that bike, long cage is absolutely the right one. short cage can only be used by a single front ring, or very odd 2x10 combos with small cassettes. the sram type2 midcage only works if you have a 11-32 cassette or less. for your combo (and most others), you need the long cage.

    shorten the chain until the small-small combo works. (get help from a friend or ask how to size a chain here on MTBR if you've never done it.) I have no idea how it could have been delivered to you with a chain so overly long that it doesn't work, but I do know that your long cage will work with your 26/39 11-36 combo with a fairly wide range of chain lengths. make sure you test your big-big combo on the workstand before riding it.

  3. #3
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    i have the comp carbon frame..same as 2012 top of line.i only took 2 links out to adjust for what sram said for length.i should mention,chain derails only in rutted trail sections, not all the time. i went thru the gears on a stand w/ buddies bike setup and even took air out of rear shock to find its tightest spot in growth. smooth fromm 11 thru 36 w/ a 38 up front.no more than two links slack on 36x38.
    im going w/ short cage for mine,just dont know if spring tensions are same xo vs xx,,,and if all sram short cages measure 55mm jocky wheel to jocky wheel as my friends stock 2011 xo.or is his a bit longer..specialized propriatory? and what changes are there on model yr xo rears,that may hinder my application.
    im still confused why all those formulas wont allow a short cage on a 11-36 w/ 38 front when i see stock spech. evo comes stock w/ short .yea,stock front is 34.
    i never cross small/small so i dont know if thats why ,if it was a 2 by would make a diff. w/ shorter cage.

  4. #4
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    i just do not know if i order an xo short cage derailluer today,if it will be of the same as the one on my friends epic evo w/ 55mm measurement and if anything if at all is different.
    i was temped to replace spring from my 9 spd xo onto the xx n see if it makes it tighter. but then i see people having another issue w/ chain riding off the side of lower jocky wheel on the long xx cages.so why bother.

  5. #5
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    ah. if you're derailling in bumpy sections you need a guide. you could use this one: Universal Cycles -- Truvativ X-Guide MRP AM Chain Guide

    or there are many others. I have a much cheaper and simpler one, but it works: Universal Cycles -- Blackspire Stinger Chain Tensioner

    you cannot use a short cage derailleur unless you convert your bike to a single ring. with a single ring, you ABSOLUTELY will also need a guide. your friend who has a single ring should know all this, unless someone else did all the work on his bike.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippy895 View Post
    buddies bike sports a 11-36 rear w/ 38 ring up front. stock 2011 sram xo SHORT (55mm)cage derailleur.an agressive rider on an epic 29r. not one problem to date.
    i call sram because my long cage xx derailleur *11-36(on my2013 superfly ht)seems to make my chain flop around and wants to derail in the front at bottom. xx is a month old.
    that short cage xo 's spring is much stiffer than that long cage xx spring.
    so i wanted to look into a short cage setup.sram says to stay w/ my long xx and adjust chain length to just one link extra w/ bypassing derailleur on large /large rings.did so. still not fixed ...maybe better,but have to soft peddle if caught in time prior to chain drop.
    do i go xo short? (that stock epic measures 55mm center wheel to center wheel)is this the norm in mm on all 10spd xo short der.
    do i go short xx? or is the xx spring on the short just as soft as the long cage.
    are all 10spd xo 2009-12 the same?
    would it even matter using a short cage period ,if i decide to use it as a 2x driveline as long as i dont go small /small combo.
    I have a lot of trouble following your post. Are you running 1x10? If so, small is fine, regardless of the ring size.
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

  7. #7
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    as of right now,i have it as a 2 by.but will be going 1by with e13 XCX-ST D-Type,. testing the waters w/ the 38 q ring before pulling off granny ring n front der.
    i am the one that more or less set up my buddies epic,it started w/ a crappy stock spech chain guide, i made an mrp 1by guide bracket replaced w/ a 38 front then as of now switched to a dmd e13 guide.zero issues.
    my issue is really the rear deraileur purchase.xo that im uncertain if desgins changed that would hinder same performance as one on the epic...
    can i buy a xx short but will the spring be soft like my long xx or stiff like that short xo.
    xo weights are all over the place from 190-201grams.did something change per yrs?
    then i see short xo w/ 28tooth max stamped on it....is that cage smaller than 55mm?
    bottom line is,give me a short 55mm xx with stiff spring,,,if they do not make them,then,i will buy same as stock 2011 epic 29r evo xo 55mm short cage that weighs more. now how do i order what i want without getting wrong item.
    Last edited by zippy895; 12-12-2012 at 11:46 AM.

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    to make matters worse, i have another friend whos about to burn his long cage xx thats on his superfly100 used in a 2x and 1x setup ..with proper chain length.

  9. #9
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    Unfortunately I can't really understand you, either. I don't get how you 'pretty much setup' your friends 1x10 and then you have questions like these. Maybe you weren't making your questions clear.

    I have a pretty good bike, but I've never seen a bike with XX on a trail. If you and your riding buddies can afford that, then surely you guys can afford to pay the LBS to make your bikes right. And as I said before.... your bike should work perfectly fine as-is, providing that it is tuned properly and you avoid shifting at the front over really super rough sections. Or if you backpedal while in mid-shift, that'll drop the chain on *any* setup.

  10. #10
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    (dupe post)
    Last edited by ColinL; 12-13-2012 at 09:02 AM. Reason: duplicate post

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippy895 View Post
    to make matters worse, i have another friend whos about to burn his long cage xx thats on his superfly100 used in a 2x and 1x setup ..with proper chain length.
    This comment says and means nothing.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippy895 View Post
    as of right now,i have it as a 2 by.but will be going 1by with e13 XCX-ST D-Type,. testing the waters w/ the 38 q ring before pulling off granny ring n front der.
    i am the one that more or less set up my buddies epic,it started w/ a crappy stock spech chain guide, i made an mrp 1by guide bracket replaced w/ a 38 front then as of now switched to a dmd e13 guide.zero issues.
    my issue is really the rear deraileur purchase.xo that im uncertain if desgins changed that would hinder same performance as one on the epic...
    can i buy a xx short but will the spring be soft like my long xx or stiff like that short xo.
    xo weights are all over the place from 190-201grams.did something change per yrs?
    then i see short xo w/ 28tooth max stamped on it....is that cage smaller than 55mm?
    bottom line is,give me a short 55mm xx with stiff spring,,,if they do not make them,then,i will buy same as stock 2011 epic 29r evo xo 55mm short cage that weighs more. now how do i order what i want without getting wrong item.
    A RD with a 28T max cog size with not work well with a 36T, if at all.

    AFAIK there is no difference in the springs. The short cage just has less leverage on the spring so it feels stiffer.

    Two things could be going on with your "issues". One, you are on the smaller chainring and have more chain slack which lets the chain "flop" more.
    Two, you are on the big ring and a larger cog. This is a poor chainline and the angle of the chain, combined with the ring's shift ramps lets the chain drop easily.
    Spring tension will do little to nothing to fix this.

    If you go to a 1x you need to run the ring as far inboard as possible and use a ring with straight cut teeth
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy View Post
    This comment says and means nothing.
    I was trying to help, but it just hurts my head to try and understand what this guy is writing.
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

  14. #14
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    so it could be because i am using xx 39 front ring w/ shifting ramps thats causing the chain to derail 4 times in the rough portion trail during race while running in around middle of rear gears..?
    went to lbs today.apparently spring is on soft side on rear xx.did some www searching as well n found somebody with same issues.going to remove the spring n hopefully relocate it into a stiffer setting hole .will keep u posted.sorry for the hard to follow rant.lol.im known for being confusing.
    im new to this hardtail racing...new issues .i thought a ht was to be a simple ride. in all my yrs ,fullys never an issue in this department.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippy895 View Post
    so it could be because i am using xx 39 front ring w/ shifting ramps thats causing the chain to derail 4 times in the rough portion trail during race while running in around middle of rear gears..?
    went to lbs today.apparently spring is on soft side on rear xx.did some www searching as well n found somebody with same issues.going to remove the spring n hopefully relocate it into a stiffer setting hole .will keep u posted.sorry for the hard to follow rant.lol.im known for being confusing.
    im new to this hardtail racing...new issues .i thought a ht was to be a simple ride. in all my yrs ,fullys never an issue in this department.
    Being a hardtail is not the problem
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  16. #16
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    ok, i modified the xx long cage derailleur to give it a tighter spring tension.feels way better now. will ride it sunday.

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