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  1. #1
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    Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!

    I should have known better than to trust those chincy bumpers specialized is sending out to use when you put a fox 40 on their new 2011 frames. This damage was done after a few practice runs at a local flow track. No crashes or hard turning, only some minor whipping. Probably about 15 minutes of seat time on the bike.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!-1.jpg  

    Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!-2-copy.jpg  

    Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!-3-copy.jpg  

    Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!-4-copy.jpg  

    Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!-5-copy.jpg  

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  2. #2
    Glad to Be Alive
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    call specialize in the morning

  3. #3
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    im going to have my shop deal with it. I dont think its enough damage to attempt to warrenty the frame?!?!?
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jurichar
    im going to have my shop deal with it. I dont think its enough damage to attempt to warrenty the frame?!?!?

    Pretty sure they'll send you a new frame so you can dent it again Knowing Specialized , they wont waste their time trying to avoid getting you a new frame.
    Specialized = $$$ no fussing around for this sort of stuff

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuumbaq
    Pretty sure they'll send you a new frame so you can dent it again Knowing Specialized , they wont waste their time trying to avoid getting you a new frame.
    Specialized = $$$ no fussing around for this sort of stuff
    figures. As cool as it would be to go through a frame after 15 minutes of riding. I spent about 40 hours applying clear bra to this entire bike. there is no way in hell i want to go through that amount of pain and suffering again. not to mention the cost of 3m clear bra. its not really noticeable right now and i really dont think its going to be a frame integrity issue (at least if it stays at this level). If it gets worse...maybe?!? I'm just pissed that specialized allowed this to happen. Its a $6200 bike...maybe they should remember that when they design parts for it.
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  6. #6
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    That is definitely worth a warranty, I can't believe that didn't get noticed in testing. I wonder if it happened to berrecloths bike since he runs fox too?

  7. #7
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    In the mean time throw some of those clear picture frame hanging "bumpers" on the frame to prevent that again. I feel your pain, new bike, un-crashed that sucks ! If you get another frame its back to the same problem as you know. (til you come up with a idea). I always thought those Acros headset with the built in stops was cool. This would def be a good use for one. Hope you get sorted !

  8. #8
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    Those things look woefully inadequate. Was it not an option just to run the big bumpers that came with the fork?

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by gollub01
    I always thought those Acros headset with the built in stops was cool. This would def be a good use for one. Hope you get sorted !
    Thanks for mentioning this one, it looks quite interesting indeed, for future reference.

    http://www.acros.de/PRODUCTS/HEADSET...:3_91_145.html

  10. #10
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    Spec will probably call it crash damage and void your warranty. Sorry bout your luck
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman2058
    Those things look woefully inadequate. Was it not an option just to run the big bumpers that came with the fork?
    Yeah. I 2nd that question.
    www.totalbikes.pl - Bike Camps not only in Poland

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by norbar
    Yeah. I 2nd that question.
    It's a matter of the headtube not being long enough for the Fox 40 lower crowns (that have the pinch bolts in the back) to clear the bottom tube when turning to it's maximum radius (when the stanchion bumpers usually touch the frame).

    It's only an issue with the Fox 40, yet still an issue.

    (There's a thread discussing this here: 2011 Demo 8 and 2011 Fox 40's - rubber bumpers don't fit )

  13. #13
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    So correct me if Im wrong but it appears that you cannot run any other fork than the BoXXers ( and possibly 888, Dorados ???) on that frame .Neither can you run ANYTHING else than the stock RC4...no DB, no Elka, BOS and not even the RS yet( which to me is the most laughable thing ever since the development on this thing was done on a RS shock)

    Worst part is , the stock RC4 is poorly valved and there's not much you can about it unless if you know how to play with shims and tune rear shocks...

    Pretty f-ing lame if you ask me, surprise no one said anything about that ... and Specialized is pumping hundreds of those frames out the door, what a joke...SAM HILL, the man himself only started to test this thing back in July and by September they were already taking orders...not a whole lot of development if you ask me...

    Sorry for your frame bro, like I said earlier, Im pretty sure they'll hook u up with another frame but I would get rid of it and support a different company...

  14. #14
    Boomslang
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    Quote Originally Posted by jurichar
    I should have known better than to trust those chincy bumpers specialized is sending out to use when you put a fox 40 on their new 2011 frames. This damage was done after a few practice runs at a local flow track. No crashes or hard turning, only some minor whipping. Probably about 15 minutes of seat time on the bike.
    We are aware that the first batch of bumpers did not turn out as durable as we would have liked. Sorry that you had a bad experience with them. Your shop can get better ones from customer service.

    Boomslang

  15. #15
    Boomslang
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman2058
    Was it not an option just to run the big bumpers that came with the fork?

    No - the Fox crown hits the DT before the bumpers do.

    Boomslang

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by tuumbaq
    So correct me if Im wrong but it appears that you cannot run any other fork than the BoXXers ( and possibly 888, Dorados ???) on that frame .Neither can you run ANYTHING else than the stock RC4...no DB, no Elka, BOS and not even the RS yet( which to me is the most laughable thing ever since the development on this thing was done on a RS shock)
    I've only heard of this issue with the 40, but in theory it could solved for good with either a headset that wasn't zero stack in the bottom cup or the Acros Blocklock mentioned on another post.

    On the rear shock, the issue you mention is it a space one or do you mean the shock mount that has the bearings? On the shock mount, I was under the impression that it is compatible with other shocks, it only requires that the eyelet and rebound knob are rotated 45ļ (like the S Works Enduro Carbon), given that the eyelets are all the same width.

    From the design perspective it does look like they missed some important stuff, but it does look like it's fixable (at least more fixable than say the Fox DRCV or Dyad on some bikes). On the other hand, we're moving more and more towards the "bike for 1 season" thing and the manufacturers (generally speaking) are thinking with that trend in mind too when designing.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by JakeWake
    We are aware that the first batch of bumpers did not turn out as durable as we would have liked. Sorry that you had a bad experience with them. Your shop can get better ones from customer service.

    Boomslang
    So...when Specialized realized the first time they had dropped the ball and came up with this band aid solution...no one made sure they wouldn't drop it a second time ?

  18. #18

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    The shock mount thingy I was mentioning, by the way:



  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by hafnz
    It's a matter of the headtube not being long enough for the Fox 40 lower crowns
    So, the issue is Spesh have put out an inferior product and not told anybody. If they're going to do that they should have put it in writing that you can't run 40s, or need to use a taller headset or... something. Not saying anything then looking surprised when damaged frames come back isn't a great advert.

  20. #20
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    I would be pissed man. If thats what happened after 15 min imagine what the bike would look like after a whole season! Those things dont even look like real bumpers! So due to the stupidity of specialized, you are forced to live with a dented up frame (that is if they dont warranty it) and even if they do you will have to buy a different headset or fork. What kind of company makes a product that requires a consumer to have to shell out more money (as if $6200 wasnt enough) just so they don't damage it while using it for its intended purpose while staying withing the limits of reasonable use? If I were you I would call and give them crap.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norcoshore1
    I would be pissed man. If thats what happened after 15 min imagine what the bike would look like after a whole season! Those things dont even look like real bumpers! So due to the stupidity of specialized, you are forced to live with a dented up frame (that is if they dont warranty it) and even if they do you will have to buy a different headset or fork. What kind of company makes a product that requires a consumer to have to shell out more money (as if $6200 wasnt enough) just so they don't damage it while using it for its intended purpose while staying withing the limits of reasonable use? If I were you I would call and give them crap.
    I completely agree with you on this, but what can they do to make it right if i do complain??? Its gonna happen again even with a new frame. Plus the clear bra issue. It just sucks.
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  22. #22
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    I donít know that I am ready to accept that this happened because of whips. I've never seen a whip violent enough to dent/crack a frame, let alone in 15 minutes of casual riding. If it did, you ought to check your stanchions too.

    Seriously though, it sucks that you now have that to deal with that. My experience with S warranty has been positive the few times that I have dealt with them. I am sure they will take care of you.

    Good luck.

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by mauricus
    I donít know that I am ready to accept that this happened because of whips. I've never seen a whip violent enough to dent/crack a frame, let alone in 15 minutes of casual riding. If it did, you ought to check your stanchions too.
    The stanchions didn't hit the frame, the edges of the lower crown did.

  24. #24
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    Yeah its the lower crown that hits the frame. Im not saying my puny whips caused the damage thats just the only time i can think of that the lower crown hit the frame??? Unless it was when i was pedaling around my living room lol. im am discussing this with spesh right now it sounds like they want to do something to make up for their mistake. i have had no experience with their warrenty but ive heard a ton of good stories. dont take this as a negative post ab specialized, i just dont want a bunch of people to have the same damage as i did.
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  25. #25
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    those bumpers look retardialized

  26. #26
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    Given your bike quiver they would have to be pretty stupid people not to look after you now.

  27. #27
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    I may be blind but is that a hole in your frame? Looks a bit more impressive than a simple dent.
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  28. #28
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    Christ, just looking at those things you can easily tell they are nowhere near upto the job they were intended for, sucks to hear about it man, id feel you pain after putting on all that clear bra, hope it gets all sorted for ya

  29. #29
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    The obvious solution here is get a Boxxer
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  30. #30
    the test dummy
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    That looks like a crack in the frame not just a dent
    Quote Originally Posted by craftworks750
    Riding a mtb is like a reset button, 10 mins in and there is nothing else in the world that matters.
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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fix the Spade
    So, the issue is Spesh have put out an inferior product and not told anybody. If they're going to do that they should have put it in writing that you can't run 40s, or need to use a taller headset or... something. Not saying anything then looking surprised when damaged frames come back isn't a great advert.
    how is a short head tube inferior?
    short head tube = lower front end = faster

    Im going to guess that other frames are going to start having this issue as their head tubes get shorter too. (or fork designs will have to change)
    The mountains are calling and I must go

  32. #32
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    The issue is not the short head tube, but the fact that the downtube starts downwards immediately after the headtube. It would need to head straight back a bit before turning downwards, so to speak. This is an issue because of the shape of the lower crown of the 40 (which is horizontal as opposed to downward sloping like on the Boxxer).

  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan55
    how is a short head tube inferior?
    short head tube = lower front end = faster

    Im going to guess that other frames are going to start having this issue as their head tubes get shorter too. (or fork designs will have to change)
    It's a combination of factors, not just the length of the headtube, but also the angle between the downtube and headtube.

    Other frames will have that problem (and it has always existed with different specific designs, being fork knobs hitting the downtube or otherwise) if it's overlooked when designing, but not a direct consequence of a short headtube.
    The new Turner DHR-DW has quite a short headtube, yet it's not an issue there.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan55
    how is a short head tube inferior?
    short head tube = lower front end = faster

    Im going to guess that other frames are going to start having this issue as their head tubes get shorter too. (or fork designs will have to change)
    The head tube's not a problem at all, the problem is down tube clearance. There are plenty of other frames with short head tubes and zero stack headsets that can take a Fox40 fine.

    The problem is that Spesh haven't profiled their down tube right and the crowns of one of the three major downhill forks don't clear their downhill frame. That's why it's an inferior product. Or more specifically, it's bad form of Specialized not to up and tell anybody but to offer these ineffective bumpers as a solution.

    Even just telling people to use a taller lower headset cup would solve the problem, it's a few millimetres, small enough that you could adjust the height difference out by mounting the stanchions a bit lower in the crowns. It doesn't need to be as bigger problem as Spesh have evidently made it.

    Don't go hatin' the head tubes man.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fix the Spade

    Even just telling people to use a taller lower headset cup would solve the problem, it's a few millimetres, small enough that you could adjust the height difference out by mounting the stanchions a bit lower in the crowns. It doesn't need to be as bigger problem as Spesh have evidently made it.
    .

    Taller headset will not solve the problem. Went to an external cup Cane Creek, and also tried a 1.5 king (both about 8mm extra stack). The 40 crown still hits the DT. this time it's the protrusion of the crown where the 5mm pinch bolts pinch the stanchion.
    Proud to represent Mojo Wheels.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman2058
    This is an issue because of the shape of the lower crown of the 40 (which is horizontal as opposed to downward sloping like on the Boxxer).

    It actually slopes upwards, to give people a lower front ride height back in the days of external headsets and 1.125" head tubes.
    Proud to represent Mojo Wheels.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fix the Spade
    Or more specifically, it's bad form of Specialized not to up and tell anybody but to offer these ineffective bumpers as a solution.

    Even just telling people to use a taller lower headset cup would solve the problem, it's a few millimetres, small enough that you could adjust the height difference out by mounting the stanchions a bit lower in the crowns. It doesn't need to be as bigger problem as Spesh have evidently made it.

    Don't go hatin' the head tubes man.
    Taller lower headset cups do NOT make Fox 40 forks fit any differently. That is why it has not been communicated as an option.

    By offering a Fox compatibility kit, isn't Specialized effectively "telling" their customers how to correctly install a Fox 40?

    JC

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by JakeWake
    Taller lower headset cups do NOT make Fox 40 forks fit any differently. That is why it has not been communicated as an option.

    By offering a Fox compatibility kit, isn't Specialized effectively "telling" their customers how to correctly install a Fox 40?

    JC

    You could say that, but when the bumpers don't work and the fork still causes damage when installed "correctly", then it's incompatible and should be stated as such. It wasn't and now his frame is f*cked up when he did exactly what specialized told him to do.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccspecialized
    You could say that, but when the bumpers don't work and the fork still causes damage when installed "correctly", then it's incompatible and should be stated as such. It wasn't and now his frame is f*cked up when he did exactly what specialized told him to do.
    You are absolutely correct. Every early adopter of the Demo who installed a Fox 40 fork deserves to be notified that an upgrade is available.

    Boomslang

  40. #40
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    So to sum it up, if we install the steerer tube spacer included with the frame for the 40, and the new bumpers, we are good to go?
    Sponsors: Specialized, Honey Stinger, The Hive, Twenty6, 661, Elka Suspension, www.Chainsmokeracing.net

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by jut8
    So to sum it up, if we install the steerer tube spacer included with the frame for the 40, and the new bumpers, we are good to go?
    That is correct.

    Jason C/Boomslang/FSCzar

  42. #42
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    another solution:

    1 - cut old manitou or rockshox fork bumper in half
    2 - zip tie to forks
    3 - you are done
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Demo + 40 + Special Bumpers = Dents!!!!!-bump.jpg  


  43. #43
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    I wouldnt want to spend a load of g's on a sweet frame and fork like a demo and a 40 to then have to use a ghetto as fook solution like that!

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuumbaq
    So correct me if Im wrong but it appears that you cannot run any other fork than the BoXXers ( and possibly 888, Dorados ???) on that frame .Neither can you run ANYTHING else than the stock RC4...no DB, no Elka, BOS and not even the RS yet( which to me is the most laughable thing ever since the development on this thing was done on a RS shock)
    http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/6133548/
    Vivid adapters are available from Specialized as well.

  45. #45
    The Other Dude
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    Quote Originally Posted by CorollaRWD
    http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/6133548/
    Vivid adapters are available from Specialized as well.

    That is actually my bike! Thats a cane creek double barrel on there, not a vivid.
    Sponsors: Specialized, Honey Stinger, The Hive, Twenty6, 661, Elka Suspension, www.Chainsmokeracing.net

  46. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by CorollaRWD
    http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/6133548/
    Vivid adapters are available from Specialized as well.
    Isn't it just universal?
    Given that all eyelets have the same thickness, that is.

  47. #47
    The Other Dude
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    Quote Originally Posted by hafnz
    Isn't it just universal?
    Given that all eyelets have the same thickness, that is.

    You have the right thinking with the thickness, but on some shocks the rebound adjuster gets in the way of it sliding in far enough, i know this was the case with the Elka.
    Sponsors: Specialized, Honey Stinger, The Hive, Twenty6, 661, Elka Suspension, www.Chainsmokeracing.net

  48. #48
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    Nice Bike.

    I was showing you can fit a CCDB and saying you can also get Vivid adapters from Specialized as well.

  49. #49
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    Those look like more than dents.

  50. #50
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    Yeah, i would be pissed in spesh didn't own up to getting me a new frame.

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