Results 1 to 19 of 19
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14

    Idea! Fork shudder/chatter problem solution (works for me)

    Dear bikers,

    Here is my collection of solutions for this terrible problem.
    • While looking for the solution in the Internet, I found this post. Let me quote the most important part of it:
      I tried cranking the headset, and considered cutting my pads down.. but I found the solution with a zip tie. I threaded the tie through the straddle and looped it back behind the fork. I tightened the loop so that the straddle sat back closer to the frame, but not so tight that it interfered with the operation of the brake. It made the brake line travel along the same line as the headtube.

      This brings the straddle under tension towards the frame when you are braking... It also changes the angle that the brakelines travel at the brakes themselves. I'm not completely sure of the whys... but I went from having the worst shudder to none in two minutes!
      Here is my pictures of author's idea realisation:
      Name:  IMG_9709.JPG
Views: 1253
Size:  27.8 KB

      Name:  IMG_9712.JPG
Views: 1194
Size:  29.1 KB

      Name:  IMG_9714.JPG
Views: 1243
Size:  31.4 KB

      It definitively requires a bit of extended testing and polishing, but the basic idea works just fine for me and Planet X Uncle John's default fork.
    • Toe-in and reverse toe-in
    • Find your brake pads. Some manufactures supply brakes with Kool-Stop Thinline pads - salmon, dual, or traditional black compound. Give it a try, it could really make the difference.
    • Make yoke (straddle) higher - this action reduces the power.
    • If the brake pads are long, cutting them could be an option.
    • Tightening the headset - remember not to be fanatical
    • Note a solution, rather an observation - braking from hooks reduces the chatter (obviously ).


    The list of interesting articles concerning canti's


    Hope it was useful for you.

    If you supply the other ideas, it would be great to put it in the first post together with author's name - this would make the search easier.

    Thank you for your reading!
    Last edited by Raido; 03-17-2013 at 03:56 PM.

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    66
    I'm surprised a properly tightened headset and toe in wasn't a sufficient solution. Did you have your shop check it out?

    Not sure what model cantis they are, are they low end? Is it possible the brakes are flimsy enough to cause that?

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14
    The brakes are Tektro CR-720. The same was with shimano cx70 brakes with toe-in, which are not low end at all on the Focus CX bulldog fork
    Kool-Stops (thinline) have some bulge at the end of the brake pad, so they are toed-in during the usual setup. And with the time going, you need to re-do the toe-in (traditional or reverse anyway.

  4. #4
    ejj
    ejj is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    113
    Shudder has nothing to do with your brakes. Modern forks don't have the cable hanger three inches above the rim; this is the problem! See if you can find an aftermarket hanger that doesn't mount at your stem. The problem is the long drop from your stack-hung cable. This makes your fork flex a bit. The cable won't flex at all.

    I have dealt with this on hundreds of bikes. It won't ruin your bike or anything. It's just annoying.

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    66
    since he has a high end frame and fork, there shouldn't be enough flex in the fork to cause this. if it were me, i'd bring it to a trusted shop to inspect it. makes me wonder, is the headset top cap tightened properly? is there enough of a gap between the top of the steer tube and the top of the stem (2-3mm)? worse, is the steer tube cracked?

    mares cx are great frames and highly regarded, i would think more stories of brake shudder problems would be around if this was an issue.

  6. #6
    251
    251 is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: 251's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    496
    Quote Originally Posted by ejj View Post
    Shudder has nothing to do with your brakes. Modern forks don't have the cable hanger three inches above the rim; this is the problem! See if you can find an aftermarket hanger that doesn't mount at your stem. The problem is the long drop from your stack-hung cable. This makes your fork flex a bit. The cable won't flex at all.

    I have dealt with this on hundreds of bikes. It won't ruin your bike or anything. It's just annoying.
    Good advise. This is the type of fork-mounted hanger you're looking for:

    Fork shudder/chatter problem solution (works for me)-tf-br7468-3.jpg
    Dave
    Blog / Strava

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    101
    I get fork shudder on my CX bike if I run skinny tires at high pressures. When I run 32c's at 80 psi there is no shudder but 28's at 115 psi is a nightmare. I think a fork mounted cable stop would work but I am happy running bigger tires with less pressure.
    Last edited by Glenrexellyn; 03-27-2013 at 06:57 PM.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by 251 View Post
    Good advise. This is the type of fork-mounted hanger you're looking for:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	TF-BR7468-3.jpg 
Views:	410 
Size:	113.4 KB 
ID:	784908
    I have exactly this fork-mounted hanger, and it can not be mounted on the default Planet X carbon fork because of the fork's bulge right above the hole where it should be mounted. The other problem, that the nut can not be inserted in the hole of the Planet X Carbon fork as well.
    Last edited by Raido; 03-28-2013 at 02:11 PM.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,211
    I have a Focus cross bike. I have my handlebars fairly high. I cannot brake from the hoods when I'm standing or riding fully upright or else I get horrible brake shudder. As soon as I get my weigh down in the drops the problem goes away. This is an annoying problem though, so maybe something in this thread can help me...

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14
    Could you please tell, what brakes do you use?

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Wish I Were Riding View Post
    As soon as I get my weigh down in the drops the problem goes away.
    I also noticed this.

    I also have Planet-X frame set. And i also had problem this shudder/chatter. Brakes -
    Cane Creek SCX-5.
    Properly tightened headset and standart toe-in don't solved the problem.
    Just a few days ago set reverse toe-in for brake pads and now there is no shudder.

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14
    Recently I've tried the Genetix CX Mid-profile brakes - Genetic CX Cantilever Brake. I've got an impression, that these brakes work much better, than Tektro CR720, and much less prone to chatter/shudder with Planet X fork. These brakes (arms) a much more solid, and therefore, a bit heavier. Also, the yoke hanger is worse and the hardware is worse a bit as well (but this is pure saesthetics), than tektro's default, so I've combined The pads are still Kool-Stop Thinline in front.
    Last edited by Raido; 04-16-2013 at 02:37 AM.

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    194
    If you can't use a fork mounted cable stop, it may be time to seriously consider Mini-V brakes instead. This eliminates the bowstring effect of the canti cable which is the root of chatter and simplifies setup. The cheapest option is the Tektro 926A BMX break along with some Jagwire adjustable noodles. The nicer option is the TRP CX9 or CX8.4 depending on which brake levers you have.
    2009 Redline Conquest Pro, 2008 Trek Fuel Ex8
    2007 Kona Cinder Cone utility bike
    Yes I spent too much on bikes.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by Raido View Post
    Could you please tell, what brakes do you use?
    If you were asking me, I have Avid Shorty 4 cantis? I zip tied my cable, and I think I can tell a difference already. But I won't get to really test it until this weekend. Here's a pict:
    Fork shudder/chatter problem solution (works for me)-photo.jpg

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: StuntmanMike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    574
    I'll have to give this a shot. I just picked up a Ridley and it chatters like a MoFo.

    No hole in the fork to mount a lower hanger, and I'm certainly not drilling one in a carbon fork.

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14
    I would say, that it would be better to switch to the tektro yoke hanger - in Europe I would buy it from lisanna - Triangles de freins CYCLO-CROSS. It will add adjustability to the brakes and will simplify the zip-tie-ing it.

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,211
    I hear what you are saying, but I'll just try the zip ties for a bit. I haven't done any serious downhills yet, but I took the bike out after work and got it going fast and then applied the front brake with my weight up high. I noticed a significant improvement. I am actually amazed. It does change the throw of the lever, making it travel less far before the brakes grab hard compared to the rear. But I don't think I'll have a problem riding like that (unless I forget)...

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    2,641
    I used to have a Empella with a horribly loud front brake, I try at least 6 sets of brakes (avid tri-alights, XTR, Ritchey's ,techtro's, etc), countless pads and 20 years of bike tricks, in fact I even made some "chop-chop" XT V-brakes, nothing work until I got Paul brakes and then the fork was quiet and the brakes actually work..


    Fork shudder/chatter problem solution (works for me)-img_5523-l.jpg

  19. #19
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    14
    Glad to hear good news! I think, that zip-ties prevent bow-effect, and therefore prevent fork chatter-shudder. Also, I should admit, as patineto mentioned, the quality of the brakes matters.

Similar Threads

  1. AYUP problem and possible solution
    By troutie-mtb in forum Lights DIY - Do It Yourself
    Replies: 46
    Last Post: 04-18-2014, 02:13 AM
  2. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 06-16-2012, 09:53 AM
  3. Replies: 33
    Last Post: 05-11-2012, 02:18 PM
  4. Is brute strength solution to every technique problem?
    By Daemon[CRO] in forum All Mountain
    Replies: 56
    Last Post: 05-08-2012, 10:13 PM
  5. Replies: 12
    Last Post: 05-29-2011, 01:45 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •