If the bead stretched on your Piranhas, then you probably didn't have the most current version of the tire. Curious, but how did you set up your A23s for tubeless use, just tape or with a rim strip?
I've got three sets of tubeless A23 wheels, all using the Stan's std 26" rimstrip, and whether I've run Bulldogs, Piranhas, Happy Mediums, or any number of tubeless ready road tires on them, I have not had a single lick of problems with them.
If you're not using a rimstrip, try the std 26" strip. My guess is all your problems will go away.
I say this with a completely straight face, you are not fast enough to realize the superiority of tubulars.
Originally Posted by tiflow_21
Well, I know this is true for me.
Originally Posted by Rivet
The biggest obstacle for me to go to tubs is tire pricing, and needing another set of wheels. I'm a mid-pack 4, racing singlespeed in an area that has no separate singlespeed cat.
There's a lot I could do that would make me faster than tubs.
I rode and raced tubs in the 90s on the road, and completely understand why tubs are superior in CX, I just can't justify the expenditure for a hack like me.
Clement pdx tubeless on stan's 340 rim at 45 worked great for a half lap. Took a g-out as if i was on the mtn bike (didn't want to endo). BOOM
That was a long walk back to the pits to get the other bike :(
I had a hard time sealing those tires up. Worked great on girlfriend's bike but my luck with them was obviously not the same. I was burping them in warm ups. Damn i wish i was 50lbs lighter haha
good tires. ive got a pair, been running them tubeless since september. 1 race, lots of nights rides, tight corners and techy features and some rim-banging rocky sh!t. no burps, no flats, no problems.
Originally Posted by ms6073
dt tk540 rims, 2 layers gorilla tape, stans valve.
i aired them up with a compressor, but no sealant. the bead set fine. i took out the valve core and put in sealant the clean way and aired them up again. holding the wheel sideways while pulling on the bead around the tire will really help to seal any potential leaky spots. they hold air for weeks no problem.
the ride is good. i have had them as low as 33/35 but thats generally lower than i would run here in texas, given the rocky nature of many trails. i also have 32/36 spoke wheels (they still make those??), so its really fun to barrel through **** most wheels would cringe at, knowing that i a)wont fall over b) wont pinch flat and c) wont break my sh!t.
cant really speak to the weight, im not that guy.
been tubeless on the mtb for years, im never going back to tubes for cx now that tires like this exist.
(with Shimano 105 hubs & DT Comp 15/14/15 ga spokes & 1 layer of Stan's 21mm tape)...
100x easier to do tubeless than my MTB setup:
Stan's Arch EX 29er with Specialized Renegade Control & The Captain Control....
Here is my experience with tubeless cross:
I weigh 150 lb and have been racing cross for over 10 years. I'm fast but not super fast.
This year I bought Stans Alpha 400 and mounted them tubeless with Michelin Mud. I just used the yellow tape. They surprisingly did not mount with a floor pump but aired easily with a compressor. 1 scoop of Stans.
I did 7 races this fall and mainly ran pressures about 27/28 psi. Twice I went with pressures at 25/27 psi.
The first race I burped my front tire on the last lap and had to run it to the finish. But I crashed hard on the last lap and not sure if I that caused the burp.
After that, I never totally trusted the system but I must admit they worked great every other race. And the Michelin Muds were great all season. Good on the hard pack and good enough in the little mud we had this season.
27 psi feels so much softer in cross than mt bike. Unbelievable difference. With the squeeze test they feel way too soft but once ripping over hard, bumpy grass course they feel great. And they do ride different at that pressure than mt bike tires. I think one has to know they'll feel a little wiggly and put up with that for the float and traction benefits.
The Alpha are not the stiffest rim. I rode a teammates bike for one lap this fall with HED Stingers tubulars and they blew me away. Stiff, precise with great float. But for the money, the Alpha tubeless are great.
Another benefit; I can train/race on the same wheelset. I never could do that when I used tubulars. For a 45+ Masters racer with not enough time/money this is a huge benefit.
An extra plus is I can set them up in 20 minutes. I glued tubulars a few times and really, really disliked it. And when I looked at new tubular tire prices this past August, I just couldn't do it.
No, they are not as good as carbon tubulars but for the price/convenience/performance, I will probably use them again next year.
After a couple flats I decided to move forward using my Bontrager Rhythm Comp wheelset that I was no longer using. My 700x40 Kenda Happy medium mounted up with a floor pump w/o issues.
The 700x35 SB8 is being a pain in my ass. I couldn't get both beads to seat. A friend suggested I seat both with a tube, carefully pop one bead, remove the tube, then proceed with tubeless inflation attempt. Still couldn't get it to seat with my floor pump. I have a compressor...but my inflator tool broke. Think I can get the one to pop on with a compressor so I have to go buy another inflator.
Last winter, I mounted 32mm Paselas with tubes on my CX bike for road use when the trails got buried, and thought they rode pretty well around 75-80 psi. I'd love to try them tubeless though.
Originally Posted by Deeps Elgnis
But I've read a lot of warnings about converting non-tubeless road tires to tubeless, because the tube actually helps press the tire's bead against the rim's hook. A non-tubeless road tire's bead will stretch under the higher pressure, and without the tube holding the bead in place, a catastrophic blowout will likely happen with typical road tire pressures (roadie wrench Leonard Zinn talks about it here).
Non-tubeless mtb and cross tire conversions usually doesn't have the same problems because the pressures are much lower.
I like the idea of being able to mount higher pressure road tires on my cross wheels in the off season, since my cross bike is my only road bike currently. I emailed NoTubes about using higher pressure road tires on some of their cross oriented rims, and got this reply from Peter Pelychaty:
You cannot use road tubeless tires with the Iron Cross because they are too tight. You can use road tires with a tube, but we recommend staying under 90 psi, especially with the larger road tires because it can slightly shorten the life of the rim. The Arch EX is a good choice, but it also cannot be used with road tubeless tires, but only tube-type road tires. We can make you a custom Alpha 400 wheelset...
Until Hutchinson's Intensive 28 road tubeless tires become available, I'm still a little curious (and a little cautious) about having some fat tubeless road tires. So Deeps, have you had any problems with your Pasela tubeless conversions?
Which Pasela model (ie width) have you converted to tubeless, which rims have you used, and most importantly, what pressures are you using?
Thanks in advance!
I was able to get the SB8 mounted on the Bontrager rim with a new blow gun attachment for the compressor. Battling some tiny bead leaks still on both tires. Going to throw an extra scoop of Stans in each and go out for a ride to help seal them up.
I'm running stans arch with schwalbe marathon extreme.
Probably jinxed myself by saying this, but they appear to be holding air just fine now. First real ride tomorrow:
I have been running Michelin Mud2 tires with Mavic Askium rims and Stan's rim strips. I have been running 28 psi front and 32 rear. I have raced them all season and even ridden them on single track. They have been working perfectly until Saturday, during practice before a race, when I went off of a small drop to an off camber turn. The front tire burped all of its air, the rim stuck into the dirt and I went OTB. I noticed afterwards that the inside of the tire had very little Stan's sealant left. I am not sure if being low on sealant caused the problem but, I am no longer as confident with the setup.
I've got wire bead Serfas Vidas (700x38 commuter tread) on Stans Crests and no problems. Using Stans juice.
Originally Posted by bo_vk
It is 4 weeks since the last post - here is an update to the "wire bead tubeless".
Originally Posted by mudrock
I was riding A23 with wire bead Clements for another 4 weeks, 2 races and probably 50 MI of MTB singletrack at 27F, 34R verified by Topeka digital gouge (I am 195 lbs after Christmas). I think if this setup can be burped by now it would. Had one crash and badly damaged rear wheel, getting the tire off the bead was very difficult.
Question for everybody - Anybody tried wire bead road tubeless setup? All they claim for road tubeless bead is that it does not stretch SO -> the wire bead may do the trick for 1/4 of the price??
My LBS does a lot of tubeless and consults with Stan about what works ( we are in Ithaca, 30 miles from Stan's facility in Elmira), and says most wire bead tires will work, but not folding (kevlar bead can stretch apparently). Must have a smooth bead seat, not ridged like you see on some tires, and no skinwall.
is that a response to Bo_vk? if so... then stan's website is outdated as it says road tubeless specific must be used. AFAIK, there are no wire bead tubeless road tires
Originally Posted by mudrock
For liability reasons, no manufacturer, including Stan, will endorse tubeless conversions for wire bead or other tires if they were not intended for that purpose. And Lennard Zinn on the Velonews site has cautioned riders from converting regular tires and running at high pressures (90psi+). But many people have experimented with different setups, at their own risk of course. I can only speak for what works for me.
Should have quoted bo_vk for more clarity.
This is my first post, I and arrived here trying to find information about going tubeless in my brand new cx bike, a Cube X Team.
I regularly use it as an all mountain, not competition yet (cx season is over in Spain).
So, after reading lots of threads, I decided to go tubeless, and the first choice was to buy a specific tubeless pair of wheels. My choice was DT Swiss R1800, because they were at an excellent price. I have not read so much of this wheels, but I swear it will work for my purpose.
Now, my doubts are choosing the tires. I would prefer going again to specific tubeless tires, but the options are very limited, and I've read good reviews using regular clinchers. If I go in that way, does anyone now if Maxxis mimo cx is a good choice? And the most important, do I take the wire or foldable version? And at last, with a non tubeless clincher, do I need to use some tape in the rim?
Thank you very much for your answers, and happy trails!
Experiences with Mavic SL and Alpha 400
Vittoria's are a breeze, on both.
My wife's commuter (Alpha 400) and Clément USH were a pain to get airtight, in the end had to resort to NoZisch, after 3 weeks of battling with NoTubes.
I'm running alpha 400's with continental CX race (700x35 folding model) with a stan's rimstrip on top of the tape.
Had them burp once at ~27 psi while pre-riding a race course, then had the tire blow off the rim while taking a very tight turn on pavement on my way to work at ~55 psi. Admittedly the 55 psi was probably pushing it, but I do like to run at higher pressures on the road so I have a tube on the front for now.
I think I'm going to make the jump to a tubeless specific tire soon - I had some trouble getting my front tire back on even with a tube. The bead was very stretched out, making it almost too loose. This makes me think the bead wasn't really strong enough to run tubeless (at least at a very high pressure). Hoping a stronger bead will help me run higher pressures on the road without issue.
Any experiences with the new TCS rims from WTB with cross tires? Specifically I'm looking at the I19 and want to run them tubeless. I emailed WTB, but they were pretty useless. I dont have the cash to buy the rims and build the wheels just to test out some combos.
I had a pair of MiMos for a while, and they were pretty loose on a few different rims. I doubt they'd set up well tubeless.
Originally Posted by Playmobil
You may want to check out the Vittoria XG TnT, or Specialized's 2Bliss Ready tires.
Yeah, I also agree the best way is to go for a specific tubeless tire.
Kenda Kommando, Vittoria XG TNT & Spe Captain 2bliss are my options, but they are hard to find. Which one will you prefer for hard pack, rocks, dry trails?
Hmmm, I have not ridden any of these in those conditions, but judging from the tread I'd say the Spec.