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  1. #1
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    Need Frame builder for Custom DJ bike

    Hey,

    My name is Rob and I am very interested in custom building a new DJ bike. I work in the industry and I have a lot of solid ideas on what I want. If there is anybody out there that can help me please reply.


    Thanks

  2. #2
    pvd
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    What's so special that a cheap production bike won't work? DJ bikes are pretty simple beasts.

  3. #3
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    +1

    Unless you're 400 pounds or something, go get a cheap DJ frame and ride the crap out of it. They're pretty much all good.

    Seriously, custom is great in a lot of situations, but given that people on ratty 30 pound 20-inchers that cost <$500 are out there killing it every day, I have to say there's no point in a custom DJ bike. If there's any discipline in which the talent of the rider trumps the quality of the bike, it's dirtjumping.

    -Walt

    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    What's so special that a cheap production bike won't work? DJ bikes are pretty simple beasts.
    Waltworks Custom Bicycles
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    What's so special that a cheap production bike won't work? DJ bikes are pretty simple beasts.
    Cause I want to do a custom bike. I spoke with Carter Holland (owner of black market bikes) about making a custom bike through S&M. He was very interested in my ideas but I wanted to do some one off custom bikes. I need somebody that can make some really nice steel bikes.

  5. #5
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    Well it will be more of a 4x bike. The bikes out on the market do not offer what i am looking for. If you cant help me then don't reply.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerterror
    Well it will be more of a 4x bike. The bikes out on the market do not offer what i am looking for. If you cant help me then don't reply.
    You received logical responses based on the info you provided.
    If you can't handle a reasoned response from an established pro.....then don't ask the question.

  7. #7
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    Ok...

    Um, pretty much any fillet/tig framebuilder can build a steel DJ frame. Or 4x, or whatever. Email some framebuilders and see if they're interested. Not hard. What is it in particular that you're looking for?

    I'm not trying to be a jerk, but it's hard for anyone here to help even point you in the right direction without some more specific information about what you need. And if you need a 4x bike, why ask for a dirtjumper? Be specific and do some legwork on your own, and you'll find that people here are very helpful. If you just throw generic questions out there, you're less likely to get useful responses.

    -Walt

    Quote Originally Posted by turnerterror
    Well it will be more of a 4x bike. The bikes out on the market do not offer what i am looking for. If you cant help me then don't reply.
    Waltworks Custom Bicycles
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  8. #8
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    sorry I was not being specific. I pretty much need someone who can build a steel 4x bike for me. The bike that i love to ride does not make a horizontal dropout on their frame any more so building up a geared bike is difficult. I want the frame runs similar angles but has a press fit BB and longer TT. There are a few other personal touches I want to do on the bike but that is pretty much the start.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerterror
    Well it will be more of a 4x bike. The bikes out on the market do not offer what i am looking for. If you cant help me then don't reply.
    Hi Turnerterror. I get a few inquiries a year like this. What I don't think people generally understand is that doing prototype work, especially work that needs to be optimized for production is time consuming.

    I do not want to suppose what you are thinking but most of the time these people realize that yes, it should cost more than a off the shelf bike but usually they think it will be maybe a couple of hundred more, but guys like me have to do all the actual design work and one off fabrication and don't have the economy of scale that for instance S & M would have making literally thousands of one model.

    So, I think the short of it is, there are many of us who could help you. This list is not biased to the professional builder (although they are here for sure) and I can only speak for myself but I think I have a decent understanding of what the others will want too and it is many thousands of dollars. For a completely ready to roll production oriented frame with all design drawings, CAD models and tested I would be in the five figure range.

    I wrote a blog about it.

    http://bohemianbicyclesfaq.wordpress...1/hello-world/

    Dave Bohm
    Bohemian Bicycles

    P.S. I didn't really understand if you just wanted one or wanted to go into production? Lots of people can make just one, if it uses standard stuff.

  10. #10
    pvd
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    Buy a welding machine and some files. Custom.

  11. #11
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    Try here.. http://www.simplebicycleco.com/ I think they still do custom.

    or here... http://www.ridesuperco.com/2008/

    What do you have in mind, maybe I can better direct you?

    Are you thinking toe overlap for bar spins? Light weight? Super short stays? Mounting pegs for grinds? Disk, v, 990 or no brakes? 110 or 135 hub?

    Be specific and maybe we can direct you better.

  12. #12
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    Contact Brad at Nemesis Project - he can probably help you.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    What's so special that a cheap production bike won't work? DJ bikes are pretty simple beasts.
    Same reason you make your own chain guides, you don't "need" to but you want some thing specific.

    Nobody "needs" a custom bike, but some people just want something specific.

    Heck thats why I build my own bikes, it doen't make me ride any better but it is nice to ride something thats exactly how I want it

  14. #14
    pvd
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    Based on the OP, he want's someone to do his prototyping for him. He probably wants to pay about $500 for 60 hours of work and about that much in materials. Also, DJ bikes are soo darn simple it makes little sence for anyone to do make one custom unless they enjoy the process of building. Paying someone else to to though this process makes no sence. Not for a DJ bike.

  15. #15
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    Check your PMs.

    Here's somebody to consider:

    http://www.gregmelms.com/home.html (don't let the furniture scare you. Go to 'Portfolio' and check bikes 1 and 2.

    And try Brew. He's one of the few builders that does custom and was a contract BMX builder. He ought to have the equipment needed. http://www.brewracingframes.com/
    Last edited by D.F.L.; 05-15-2009 at 02:54 PM.

  16. #16
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    turnerterror - dave makes a great point. Read it, love it, understand it. There are tons of pro builders who can undoubtedly make you what you want, are you willing to pay for it? I was on the retail side of the industry for 15 years before I started building and I can honestly say that I had absolutely no idea how much work went into a custom frame. I think that's par for the course. At least once a week, an old industry buddy crawls from the ether and asks for a hookup. Every time they get the same answer...an economics lesson and "yes, but you have to pay full price"

    pvd - some people have the $$ and will pay for custom because it's what they want, even when it's completely impractical. I get your point, and I too tend to steer people away from buying something that I see as impractical but if they insist, I'll happily build (and charge for) it.
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  17. #17
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    turnerterror, get in touch with Dobermann bikes in Canada. I've had two custom steel frames built by them - one hardtail trail bike and one DJ frame since I'm too tall for traditional DJ frame sizes. In both cases, the finished product was excellent. With the trail bike, I sent them an DWG of what I wanted and two months later I had a frame that matched my drawing almost exactly.



    A trail thatís too difficult wouldnít exist because itíd never be used. But, trails can exist thatíre too difficult for you.

  18. #18
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    Thanks guys!

  19. #19
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    I'd give Jon at Thursday a shout. He's a true small custom builder and does the kind of stuff it seems you want.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMcG
    Contact Brad at Nemesis Project - he can probably help you.
    Thanks MMcG !!!

    Man after reading this thread the first few responses reminded me why I started building custom bikes in the first place.

    Not trying to offend any of you more established builders but what makes you guys think DJ bikes are so simple ? Possibly because you dont ride DJ or street ?

    If I were to buy any custom bike I would look into what the builder rides and their first hand exsperince in this area of cycling . Sure anyone can weld some tunes together , how about building a bike that exceeeds the expectation's of your customer or even the most experienced pro rider ?
    Why should a dJ bike recive any less hands on time tha say the nicest custom TIG road or MTB frames ?
    What about material used ?
    Possibly the customer wants soemthing a bit nicer than straight guage steel or seemed butted tube set's from taiwan already coated with rust on the inside from the container shipment over
    What of say the customer wanted custom angles and has enough exsperince that they know the way they want there end bike to ride and feel when pushed to it's limit's
    You would think going to a builder who has ridden a bike to these limits and understands the customer's needs would be a good idea as well?
    If It were me going to a respected frame builder for a "custom " DJ bike I'd better hope he's ready to build something better than just a copy of the off the shelf cookie cutter bikes now coming out of Taiwan . Custom bikes are just that "custom " built to the end riders needs from the best materials possible ( you hope ) for the intended application .

    I guess if there wasent a market like this I would have a lot more free time and less orders ..right ? PM sent
    Follow me on Instagram for up to date build pics -Brad4130
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by D.F.L.
    Check your PMs.

    Here's somebody to consider:

    http://www.gregmelms.com/home.html (don't let the furniture scare you. Go to 'Portfolio' and check bikes 1 and 2.

    And try Brew. He's one of the few builders that does custom and was a contract BMX builder. He ought to have the equipment needed. http://www.brewracingframes.com/

    That melms looks exactly like the Tonic Fab Fall Guy, are they affiliated?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil4bc
    Thanks MMcG !!!

    Man after reading this thread the first few responses reminded me why I started building custom bikes in the first place.

    Not trying to offend any of you more established builders but what makes you guys think DJ bikes are so simple ? Possibly because you dont ride DJ or street ?

    If I were to buy any custom bike I would look into what the builder rides and their first hand exsperince in this area of cycling . Sure anyone can weld some tunes together , how about building a bike that exceeeds the expectation's of your customer or even the most experienced pro rider ?
    Why should a dJ bike recive any less hands on time tha say the nicest custom TIG road or MTB frames ?
    What about material used ?
    Possibly the customer wants soemthing a bit nicer than straight guage steel or seemed butted tube set's from taiwan already coated with rust on the inside from the container shipment over
    What of say the customer wanted custom angles and has enough exsperince that they know the way they want there end bike to ride and feel when pushed to it's limit's
    You would think going to a builder who has ridden a bike to these limits and understands the customer's needs would be a good idea as well?
    If It were me going to a respected frame builder for a "custom " DJ bike I'd better hope he's ready to build something better than just a copy of the off the shelf cookie cutter bikes now coming out of Taiwan . Custom bikes are just that "custom " built to the end riders needs from the best materials possible ( you hope ) for the intended application .

    I guess if there wasent a market like this I would have a lot more free time and less orders ..right ? PM sent

    Thanks for posting, I didn't have the energy.

  23. #23
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    Well said.

    Guilty as charged. I was at one point moderately competent (ie, 10'-ish semi-lippy doubles, no tricks, lots of stained underwear) at DJ. But I will not make any claims about being an expert about DJ bike geometry. For the true jumping/4x folks, I'm sure subtle changes in geometry matter a lot - just like they do to me for XC or DH riding.

    So, my apologies. An excellent riposte, Evil4bc. My criticism of this project was unfounded and I hope the thread has been otherwise helpful.

    -Walt

    Quote Originally Posted by Evil4bc
    Thanks MMcG !!!

    Man after reading this thread the first few responses reminded me why I started building custom bikes in the first place.

    Not trying to offend any of you more established builders but what makes you guys think DJ bikes are so simple ? Possibly because you dont ride DJ or street ?

    If I were to buy any custom bike I would look into what the builder rides and their first hand exsperince in this area of cycling . Sure anyone can weld some tunes together , how about building a bike that exceeeds the expectation's of your customer or even the most experienced pro rider ?
    Why should a dJ bike recive any less hands on time tha say the nicest custom TIG road or MTB frames ?
    What about material used ?
    Possibly the customer wants soemthing a bit nicer than straight guage steel or seemed butted tube set's from taiwan already coated with rust on the inside from the container shipment over
    What of say the customer wanted custom angles and has enough exsperince that they know the way they want there end bike to ride and feel when pushed to it's limit's
    You would think going to a builder who has ridden a bike to these limits and understands the customer's needs would be a good idea as well?
    If It were me going to a respected frame builder for a "custom " DJ bike I'd better hope he's ready to build something better than just a copy of the off the shelf cookie cutter bikes now coming out of Taiwan . Custom bikes are just that "custom " built to the end riders needs from the best materials possible ( you hope ) for the intended application .

    I guess if there wasent a market like this I would have a lot more free time and less orders ..right ? PM sent
    Waltworks Custom Bicycles
    Park City, UT USA
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    waltworks.com/blog/
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  24. #24
    pvd
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil4bc
    but what makes you guys think DJ bikes are so simple?...
    I guess that I come across overly simple on the subject. Yes. All bicycles are specific and have very important considerations. Yes. In the custom market, most bikes revolve around fit and specific needs that are not met with what is on the market. In my mind, DJ bikes have a lot less to do with rider fit and have more to do with the bike matching the terrain. I figure that they mostly do that and that the current crop of bikes on the market do this amazingly well. It's not like someone is going to be pedaling a DJ while seated for hours on end. Small details are rarely well worked out by non builders. I'd hate to have someone asking me for some stupid detail that makes no sense and costs tons of time and effort. I guess that that is why I don't build for money.

    I'm not a DJ expert. I'm a trail rider and a super D guy. DH dabler.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt
    Guilty as charged. I was at one point moderately competent (ie, 10'-ish semi-lippy doubles, no tricks, lots of stained underwear) at DJ. But I will not make any claims about being an expert about DJ bike geometry. For the true jumping/4x folks, I'm sure subtle changes in geometry matter a lot - just like they do to me for XC or DH riding.

    So, my apologies. An excellent riposte, Evil4bc. My criticism of this project was unfounded and I hope the thread has been otherwise helpful.

    -Walt
    One of the main complaints people have is poor placement of cable stops. I rode a bike in the early spring that handled good but had a cable stop that tore my pants and shoes every time I was on the bike, it was clear that a rider did not design the bike.

    Other thing is toe overlap for x ups and bar spins.

    If you are going to use a double peg setup you need the bb at least 1" over the axles or you end up grinding the crank arm instead of the pegs.

    If someone is into spins you have to build with much heavier stays than some one that is riding just slalom or bmx.

    Since its more about riding with style and creativity people are usually willing to sacrifice one thing for another, like having a bike that is scetchy in turns but able to double peg grind.

    And Walt, seriously, get back on the trails! Nothing is more fun or makes you feel more alive than a day at the trails with friends

    Take 5 minutes and enjoy some trail riding PA style....

  26. #26
    pvd
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    If it's just cable stops that are the problem and you have a steel frame, you can just burn off the original braze ons and put new ones on wherever you like. Rattlecan the scar or cheap powder for $125. It's a $20 solution ($200 invenstemnt if you don't have tortchs) and opens a lot of doors to you. That's what I was doing before framebuilding.

  27. #27
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    DJ = fun. Building and Jumping

    I have a few locals getting fired up to go on a DJ frame project. There are cheaper and more basic options but they really want frames from ME, They want to feel like they are part of the project and have a little more control over the tubing and various accouterments selected, They want to watch the frames come to life. From my point of view as a framebuilder, I dig the input and I enjoy having people in my shop while work is getting done. I am glad to add a little stoke to the riders general enthusiasm. .While it is important to be knowledgeable in any category of frame and generally well practiced in fabrication, I make it a point to learn something from every one of my customers. It is foolish to overestimate ourselves and underestimate our clients. I try to avoid assumptions and blanket statements and live in the gray area between what I know and what I am about to learn.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by vulture
    I have a few locals getting fired up to go on a DJ frame project. There are cheaper and more basic options but they really want frames from ME, They want to feel like they are part of the project and have a little more control over the tubing and various accouterments selected, They want to watch the frames come to life. From my point of view as a framebuilder, I dig the input and I enjoy having people in my shop while work is getting done. I am glad to add a little stoke to the riders general enthusiasm. .While it is important to be knowledgeable in any category of frame and generally well practiced in fabrication, I make it a point to learn something from every one of my customers. It is foolish to overestimate ourselves and underestimate our clients. I try to avoid assumptions and blanket statements and live in the gray area between what I know and what I am about to learn.

    Nice! some one who gets the fun of the whole thing. I would like to see what you guys come up with if you do build some trail bikes.

    I am a track and trail guy so my stuff is built to be on the light side (5.5 lbs) and a little more to the stable side. When my friend Collin picks up my bike I have to tell him "no tail whips and no 720's" the rear end isn't built strong enough to handle all that.

  29. #29
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    This thread is what came up first when I googled for "custom dj frame builder".

    I'm in search of whoever can build a 26" steel DJ/street hartdail frame with specific requirements that I don't find in Taiwanese frames. Already contacted 2 builders but they don't seem to want to build it.

    Here's what I want:

    1. Chainstay length: 385 mm. This is to allow 28-14 gear without a half-link. Other important numbers, basically a copy of Nukeproof Solum geometry.

    2. BB shell: 73 mm BSA threaded.

    3. Chainring clearance: up to 32T at 50 mm chainline (to allow for gear 32-16 in 391 mm position).

    4. Tire clearance: 58 mm wide, 58 mm high.

    5. Mud clearance: don't need any. The only provision is that there would be no (clean) tire rub when frame flexes under loads.

    6. Headtube: ZS44 both ends, 110 mm tall.

    7. Dropouts: the new Paragon trigger-type, X12 singlespeed ones. (Hub will be the next generation True Precision Poacher).

    8. Seatpost: 27.2 mm. Standard (non-integrated) clamp 31.8 mm. Forward facing slot if possible.

    9. Finish: ideally don't want any, will be okay with rat look as long as rust doesn't harm the frame structurally. Would like the builder to suggest a tubeset that rusts the least. Failing that, I'll be happy with RAL 7021 (dark grey) color.

    10. Weight. Anything within 2.5-2.6 kg will do it. Long-term durability is critical; weight, not so much. I'd even agree to go for some thick walled tubes to improve impact resistance, if the builder would advise that.


    (I would simply go for Nukeproof Solum if it had a BSA BB shell.)

  30. #30
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    Call some builders. Lots of folks can do that stuff.

    -Walt
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  31. #31
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    Issue really is the OP willing to pay 3 times what a Nukeproof Solum costs to have a one-off? My experience has been they want custom but want a mass produced price as well.

  32. #32
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    Sure many builders can do stuff like this .
    For custom stuff it's best to go to a builder who produces frames similar to this frequently.

    Prices aren't that crazy for custom DJ stuff right now , with the domestic Bmx and trick bike market picking up recently it's getting easier to produce affordable steel DJ and trick specific frames .
    PM sent

  33. #33
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    Thank you Evil4bc, I emailed you.

    dbohemian,
    I do understand that any given set of functionality is cheaper mass produced than manufactured one-off. Those are the 2 extremes, and many custom frame builders actually operate somewhere in between (that is, they build small series of similar frames which cuts on the cost of R&D). That's why it makes total sense to go for the builder experienced in creating the particular kind of frames.

    (I just checked out the bikes at bohemianbicycles.com. They are individual works of art, and I'd of course expect any art to be one-off. But I'm merely looking for a humble work of engineering, something that is not intentionally unique, just a hard-to-find combination of standard parts and techniques.)
    Last edited by J. Random Psycho; 04-24-2013 at 11:33 AM.

  34. #34
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    I wonder after 4 years if the OP ever dropped the coin on something custom. My gut tells me that answer is only two letters long.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jay_ntwr View Post
    I wonder after 4 years if the OP ever dropped the coin on something custom. My gut tells me that answer is only two letters long.
    Another zombie comes back to life! Interesting thoughts here, nice perspectives.

    Brian

  36. #36
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    Zip ties? Not on my bike!

    Want:
    650B rims or wheel set. 80's vintage 32 or 36 x 135mm

  37. #37
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    J Random, have a look at Curtis Bikes. Made in the UK, ship worldwide. They are not 100% custom, but they have a wide range of frames, aimed specifically at Street/Dirt, and are customisable to an extent (toptube length, choice of BB, Rear hub spacing, brake positions, grind plates etc).

  38. #38
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    Well;

    There's obviously FBM Bikes. A recognized Worldwide leader in the jump/trick scene. Instant cred on one of their sleds. They are small enough that I would imagine they could do what you want done. Proudly made right here in Johnson City, NY!
    Most people ply the Well Trodden Path. A few seek a different way, and leave a Trail behind.
    - John Hajny, a.k.a. TrailMaker

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by pvd View Post
    In my mind, DJ bikes have a lot less to do with rider fit and have more to do with the bike matching the terrain.....

    ...I'm not a DJ expert.
    why post then?
    look at what people are doing on dirt jumps. you think rider fit doesn't matter when you are throwing a bike around in the air? you have to be completely comfortable with the bike.

    "Also, DJ bikes are soo darn simple it makes little sence for anyone to do make one custom unless they enjoy the process of building. Paying someone else to to though this process makes no sence. Not for a DJ bike. "

    yeah, there is definitely no place for dialled geometry, nice tubing, unique touches and craftsmanship in such lowly things as dirt jump bikes. you tell em pvd.
    Last edited by sonic reducer; 04-25-2013 at 11:33 PM.

  40. #40
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    Does anyone know if all is well with Brad Hodges (username Evil4bc on MTBR, see in this thread above) of Nemesis Project? He's not been answering emails since I made the main part of payment for the frame he's been making for me, and it's like this about 6 or 7 weeks already.


    Edit: I have just received response from Brad. He said he had to redo seatstays, and that the frame is now queued for powdercoating in my chosen color RAL 7021, which had to be ordered by the paint shop.

    Looking forward to disprove the bad rumors and have on my hands a steel testament to Brad's mastery over tubesets. )

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. Random Psycho View Post
    Does anyone know if all is well with Brad Hodges (username Evil4bc on MTBR, see in this thread above) of Nemesis Project? He's not been answering emails since I made the main part of payment for the frame he's been making for me, and it's like this about 6 or 7 weeks already.
    <a href="http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/f83/scammed-nemesis-project-cycles-k-brad-hodges-229526/">25 pages pointing to <i>NOT WELL</i></a>

  42. #42
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    Marc Pfister AKA Dr. Welby
    Thanks for digging up a 4 year old BS thread started by a sour puss who order and received his handlebars . Which makes me out to sound like the new Matt Chester which I am NOT !

    Let's get back to the topic of this thread that was a custom dirt jump frame that no other builder would take on , attempt or said was possible to build for the OP JesterPsycho

    I contacted Dmitri and offered my services and through emails exchanged and sevral BikeCad revisions we came to a end design that met his requested geo #'s , was possible to build and came out to be a functioning frame in the end that he could ride and enjoy for many years to come .

    I ordered the materials and requested pieces from Paragon MAchine works like the rocker drops and 44mm HT. TrueTemper supertherm tubes are used for the DT , CS and TT the toptube is a custom tapered supertherm tube I have made to resist denting in the center sections , I also had custom seat stays bent to meet the desired look that Dmitri requested .

    In the end the frame pictured is what the OP wanted and developed with me through his direct input . Thanks

    Need Frame builder for Custom DJ bike-52077_10201631775493691_1294609980_o.jpgNeed Frame builder for Custom DJ bike-1399667_10201631769573543_907595818_o.jpg
    Follow me on Instagram for up to date build pics -Brad4130
    Nem-Pro store
    Nem-Pro Blog

  43. #43
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    Hey Brad,

    Not sure why you're using my real name, you must have a good memory from the old days riding at Calabazas Park.

    I'm glad you're turning around jobs, but considering that there's threads and threads of people pissed at you don't you think a timely email response to people who have given you money is a smart strategy to minimize the complaints?

  44. #44
    RCP Fabrication
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    All the drama aside. Sweet looking frame.

  45. #45
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    Matt Boeckman, the man behind Stout Bikes, is awesome to work with, specializes in these type of frames, and the cost is great as well. Check out stoutbikes.blogspot.com.
    I like bikes.

  46. #46
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    It's hard to mention custom DJ frames without bringing up O-Dog. Oscar has been making 26" DJ frames for decades! His brand is Simple Bicycle Company and its out of Portland, Oregon. He has a line of production DJ's, which mine are, but he does all kinds of designs.

    Here is my first one, back in 2005:



    My second and current, 2011:





    and some randoms:




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