Results 1 to 70 of 70

Thread: Cyclist Hatred

  1. #1
    Moderator Moderator
    Reputation: mtbxplorer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    7,007

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Straz85's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,348
    So true. One thing I always found it frustrating that drivers argue that cyclists break the law, yet they do the same in their cars but feel it's okay. The irony being that there's a FAR greater risk of them hurting others when they do it.

    The good news is that I think it IS the minority that hate cyclists to the point where they put us in danger and are aggressive towards us. My immediate family for example, none other than me are cyclists, but also none have any issue with cyclists. They all realize that most cyclists aren't causing any issues and that's it's the minority that ride like idiots.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    95
    ^^ This, as with all things it's really just few crazies that gives everyone a bad name.

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation: junior1210's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,001
    Gotta say while I understand and agree with what the article is trying to say, I really dislike the comparison of anti-cycling hatred to racial hatred. As a black person (who has experienced both), I know both are invidious, stupid, irrational, destructive behaviors without rhyme or reason, but comparing the two actually diminishes both in my mind. The only comparable thing is the indefensible arguments put forth by the perpetrators of either bigotry group and the ridiculous tolerance shown to them by people who "don't want to get involved", or "lets just leave them to stew in their own misery", and my personal favorite "even though they're wrong, they're entitled to their own opinion". Meh!
    The ridiculousness of cycling clothes increase exponentially in relation to the distance from your bicycle.

  5. #5
    No Stranger to danger....
    Reputation: Tone's's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    4,596
    Quote Originally Posted by junior1210 View Post
    Gotta say while I understand and agree with what the article is trying to say, I really dislike the comparison of anti-cycling hatred to racial hatred. As a black person (who has experienced both), I know both are invidious, stupid, irrational, destructive behaviors without rhyme or reason, but comparing the two actually diminishes both in my mind. The only comparable thing is the indefensible arguments put forth by the perpetrators of either bigotry group and the ridiculous tolerance shown to them by people who "don't want to get involved", or "lets just leave them to stew in their own misery", and my personal favorite "even though they're wrong, they're entitled to their own opinion". Meh!
    Agree with Junior 100%.
    The comparison to racial hatred is ridiculous and a poor choice.
    Im a cyclist but i understand why plenty of people dont like us on the road, its not rocket science, and i dont blame them one iota from what i see from some of the road cyclists here in sydney..
    Imo, cars and bikes dont mix on congested narrow city roads, either widen the roads and put bike lanes in, or carry on with the present situation.
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    12,083
    Quote Originally Posted by junior1210 View Post
    Gotta say while I understand and agree with what the article is trying to say, I really dislike the comparison of anti-cycling hatred to racial hatred. As a black person (who has experienced both), I know both are invidious, stupid, irrational, destructive behaviors without rhyme or reason, but comparing the two actually diminishes both in my mind. The only comparable thing is the indefensible arguments put forth by the perpetrators of either bigotry group and the ridiculous tolerance shown to them by people who "don't want to get involved", or "lets just leave them to stew in their own misery", and my personal favorite "even though they're wrong, they're entitled to their own opinion". Meh!
    and I disagree with you.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    12,083
    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    Agree with Junior 100%.
    The comparison to racial hatred is ridiculous and a poor choice.
    Im a cyclist but i understand why plenty of people dont like us on the road, its not rocket science, and i dont blame them one iota from what i see from some of the road cyclists here in sydney..
    Imo, cars and bikes dont mix on congested narrow city roads, either widen the roads and put bike lanes in, or carry on with the present situation.
    Yeah that solution has never worked well, because the demand for the bike path never occurs because everyone is terrified to start riding a bike.

  8. #8
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    I was subject to racial AND anti-bike hatred recently...at the same time. It was indistinguishable where the racial hatred and the anti-bike hatred started. Thankfully, the driver did not make good on her threat to run me over (she hit the accelerator, nonverbally threatening to flatten me at an intersection).

    I think the article is spot on. It's an uncomfortable truth. I see it from my own father, too. Both the racial hatred AND the anti bike hatred.

    I do think some aspects of it are missed in the article, though. I think there's a huge socioeconomic thing going on in the states. A lot of people see a kitted up roadie and know the rider spent a lot of money. A lot of people who then see a rider in street clothes think the rider is poor. I know I get treated differently if I look like I'm in street clothes or actually in street clothes vs in a spandex kit.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation: junior1210's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,001
    Seems to me the biggest problems are the lack of driving education and enforcement on both cars and bikes. I remember as a child seeing my mother getting a ticket for 'failure to signal lane change' 30 some years ago, but now you hardly see anyone using turn signals anymore for lane change or turns. That's just one example of how it seems that most people's driving is far more sloppy and ill considered than in years past, but enforcement of traffic rules are haphazzard at best except on targeted enforcement days or for revenue generation. Then add those of us who ride that do the foolish/stupid stuff we've all witnessed, (perfect example is the article MTBX posted of the bike club in New Haven with the bike lights), and it's no surprise how those who are already frustrated on the roads look for an easy scapegoat for their anger. You can also see it in the anger at semi-trucks on the highways, and how complaints about how they should be restricted to 1 or 2 lanes or their speed limited,even when truck vs passenger car accidents were caused 85-90% by the passenger cars (as per Michigan University). There's no easy or quick solution to the problem, and close quarters only exacerbate the situation.
    The ridiculousness of cycling clothes increase exponentially in relation to the distance from your bicycle.

  10. #10
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    Quote Originally Posted by junior1210 View Post
    Seems to me the biggest problems are the lack of driving education and enforcement on both cars and bikes. I remember as a child seeing my mother getting a ticket for 'failure to signal lane change' 30 some years ago, but now you hardly see anyone using turn signals anymore for lane change or turns. That's just one example of how it seems that most people's driving is far more sloppy and ill considered than in years past, but enforcement of traffic rules are haphazzard at best except on targeted enforcement days or for revenue generation. Then add those of us who ride that do the foolish/stupid stuff we've all witnessed, (perfect example is the article MTBX posted of the bike club in New Haven with the bike lights), and it's no surprise how those who are already frustrated on the roads look for an easy scapegoat for their anger. You can also see it in the anger at semi-trucks on the highways, and how complaints about how they should be restricted to 1 or 2 lanes or their speed limited,even when truck vs passenger car accidents were caused 85-90% by the passenger cars (as per Michigan University). There's no easy or quick solution to the problem, and close quarters only exacerbate the situation.
    Yeah, those things exist. And they do create animosity. But I understood the article as referencing specific types of attitudes about bikes. This article def came from the UK, and the climate there has been getting hairy in recent years. But the kinds of attitudes they were describing get manifested in the states, too. Like the doctor who pulled in front of a cyclist and slammed on his brakes, resulting in the cyclist rear ending the car. Or the old man who chased down and ran over the lady on a bike when she fled from him (into a golf course IIRC).

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation: junior1210's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,001
    Best I can tell the attitudes come from a general frustration of deteriorating driving conditions, on top of people just driving badly, then toss in daily stresses. People are at 90% ready to blow their top, and here comes Clyde cyclist who might or might not do something to upset that driver, but they are a convenient target for their ire, especially when other than Lance and George, the only cyclists most people remember are folks with DUI's or 'long hair hippies' (the ones who keep saying gas prices should be $2-3 higher), or some health nut (telling people they are fat and stupid for driving, usually found next to the hippies). Like what was mentioned in the article a lot of people think if you ride a bike other than for recreation, you must be 'mentally infantile' or you can't drive.
    The ridiculousness of cycling clothes increase exponentially in relation to the distance from your bicycle.

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation: newfangled's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    3,317
    Bringing racism into is a little dicey, so as a Canadian white guy I'll stay clear of that.

    But I will say that it's tribal. Cyclists are the "Other."

    Being behind the wheel encourages and basically requires drivers to profile others based on very limited data.

    When I'm driving I watch out for: taxis, couriers, buicks, volkswagons, sunfires, mini-vans, out-of-province license plates, most bumper stickers, and anything outright douchy that people have chosen to do to their vehicles. These are all signals of vehicles that I'd rather not be around, because from my experience their drivers will either be stupid, inattentive, or lazy. If I could demand that volkswagon drivers be given their own lanes to keep them away from the rest of the traffic I totally would, because as far as I can tell you must need to pass an idiot test to be allowed to drive one.

    It doesn't make sense, and it's certainly not accurate, but every driver does it for everyone on the road to one degree or another. And in that sea of useless data, being a cyclist is like holding up a big glowing billboard that says "I am not one of You. If you are annoyed, it must be my fault."

  13. #13
    I'm SUCH a square....
    Reputation: bigpedaler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,952
    We puncture their delusion of power -- what they get from being able to go INCREDIBLY FAST without any real effort. It's like a super-power, and when traffic conditions -- the idiot in front who isn't going as fast, didn't signal, or is just THERE -- frustrate their "need for speed", the last thing they need is some two-wheeled fa**ot rolling by them on his sissy little bicycle.

    Only in America can manhood be directly equated with a heavy right foot, enabled by a fat wallet.
    A bike is the only drug with no bad side effects....

  14. #14
    Moderator Moderator
    Reputation: mtbxplorer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    7,007
    I think the haters hate for different reasons. The real thugs, that throw things or run people off the road on purpose, are just bullies and probably have been since the 1st grade. It's easy to pick on a slower smaller cyclist.

    A lot of the screamers/honkers all like to think of themselves as "big shots" but are more like the anonymous obnoxious people on the internet - they only do it because they feel anonymous, safe, and mean, but would never act like that of they were face-to-face. The internet cyclehate type commenters are similarly attention-seekers and may or may not actually be obnoxious to cyclists on the road - they may just stay at home and type.

    The water-cooler complainers are also a tough nut to crack, they are the folks most likely to generalize from some dodo cyclists to "all cyclists", and to be a more insidious anti-cyclist element. They are unable to mentallly put themselves in a cyclist's shoes and act accordingly. They have de-personalized them. Many can only be "helped" if someone close to them rides or is hurt by a car..

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: junior1210's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,001
    ^^ Good point. Reminds me of the first year I was driving truck, took my then girlfriend for a ride since she never had been in a 'big rig'. She was shocked and appalled by how cars cut in front of us all the time, and railed about foolish drivers, until I mentioned to her how she drives the same way. We broke up a few months later but her driving improved dramatically. Too bad that wouldn't work for bikes.
    The ridiculousness of cycling clothes increase exponentially in relation to the distance from your bicycle.

  16. #16
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    Quote Originally Posted by junior1210 View Post
    ^^ Good point. Reminds me of the first year I was driving truck, took my then girlfriend for a ride since she never had been in a 'big rig'. She was shocked and appalled by how cars cut in front of us all the time, and railed about foolish drivers, until I mentioned to her how she drives the same way. We broke up a few months later but her driving improved dramatically. Too bad that wouldn't work for bikes.
    very true. I try to give trucks plenty of space. I wait quite some time before pulling in front of them, but I couldn't tell you how many times some impatient azzhole cuts the truck off, passes me on the right, and zooms away.

    Quote Originally Posted by mtbexplorer
    I think the haters hate for different reasons. The real thugs, that throw things or run people off the road on purpose, are just bullies and probably have been since the 1st grade. It's easy to pick on a slower smaller cyclist.

    A lot of the screamers/honkers all like to think of themselves as "big shots" but are more like the anonymous obnoxious people on the internet - they only do it because they feel anonymous, safe, and mean, but would never act like that of they were face-to-face. The internet cyclehate type commenters are similarly attention-seekers and may or may not actually be obnoxious to cyclists on the road - they may just stay at home and type.

    The water-cooler complainers are also a tough nut to crack, they are the folks most likely to generalize from some dodo cyclists to "all cyclists", and to be a more insidious anti-cyclist element. They are unable to mentallly put themselves in a cyclist's shoes and act accordingly. They have de-personalized them. Many can only be "helped" if someone close to them rides or is hurt by a car..
    you're very right. but different from the "why" of the behavior is the way it comes out, and I think that might be where the author is drawing similarities with racism. people have all kinds of reasons that they stereotype people of different races, too

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation: metrotuned's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    1,770
    Two instances of "hate" in the past week. Justified? You be the judge.

    1) An hour before midnight. No traffic. Bikes allowed on sidewalk. School zone. Luxury European wagon pulls through the crosswalk, yielding for a right turn. I am riding across crosswalk at my commute speed and hit the brakes as I approach driver door. In the same motion, I ride around the front of the car and onto the sidewalk. My light is on so I see the driver throw his hands up in the air in frustration. I turn around when I hear that the driver has actually stepped outside of his vehicle to yell, "$*%$ you, turn around!"

    My response is... "Really?!" and ride on knowing this ****** is way low on his own sorry excuse for life and not worth another second of my time. I think it was a teenage kid in his parents vehicle. Maybe not enough testosterone in his daily life?

    2) Rush hour weekday. Sideroad with little traffic. Riding a cargo bike with a 10ft. table trailer, emptied after a 400lb cargo run to the FedEx express package drop off across town. I take a left turn at mid-block onto a bike lane. Oncoming car speeds up as I veer left then right to accommodate some 15 ft. length of total bicycle to fit into a 90 degree bike lane curb entrance. As the car slams on the brakes, the driver exclaims "what are you doing?!" with hands up in the air in frustration. I throw a thumbs up and point at the bold bike lane signage and the extreme length of my bicycle trailer, stating factually, "This is a bike lane."

    Feel sorry for these drivers. They make for sad stories.
    Lead actor Will of the Sun, Author Platform Pedal Shootout 900K+ views

  18. #18
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    maybe you need one of those "this vehicle makes wide turns" signs for the back of your cargo trailer.

  19. #19
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Quote Originally Posted by illnacord View Post
    Two instances of "hate" in the past week. Justified? You be the judge.

    1) "$*%$ you, turn around!"

    2) Rush hour weekday. -snip-, "This is a bike lane."

    Feel sorry for these drivers. They make for sad stories.
    Most people who mess up and did not mean to are apologetic. Most people who think the rules don;t apply seem to take the aggressive defense posture.

    Assuming you were in the crosswalk when the station wagon driver blocked it, he was in the wrong. Here, he likely did not stop at the stop line and so had failed to stop for the red, too.

    All drivers must avoid the accident. Speeding up on a vehicle turning left likely qiualifies for road rage, too.

    My brother and a guy he ran with had a sedan pull into the crosswalk they were jogging across. This was before automatic door locks. So they opened the back door slid though and out the other rear door. "Excuse us, coming through!"

    Not sure they'd get away with that in Edmonton now.

    BrianMc

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Raymo853's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    743
    Quote Originally Posted by bigpedaler View Post
    Only in America can manhood be directly equated with a heavy right foot, enabled by a fat wallet.
    You need to travel more, that applies to huge portions of the entire planet.

  21. #21
    Monkey Junkie
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    593
    It's unfortunately very common that people turn into major A-holes the second they step into a car. Not even just from a cyclist standpoint, but even just as another driver. I think cars give irresponsible people way too much power that can be abused extremely easily.

  22. #22
    weirdo
    Reputation: rodar y rodar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    6,223
    Quote Originally Posted by BrianMc View Post
    My brother and a guy he ran with had a sedan pull into the crosswalk they were jogging across. This was before automatic door locks. So they opened the back door slid though and out the other rear door. "Excuse us, coming through!"
    Recalculating....

  23. #23
    Unhinged Aussie on a 29er
    Reputation: hunter006's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    452
    Quote Originally Posted by junior1210 View Post
    Best I can tell the attitudes come from a general frustration of deteriorating driving conditions, on top of people just driving badly, then toss in daily stresses. People are at 90% ready to blow their top, and here comes Clyde cyclist who might or might not do something to upset that driver, but they are a convenient target for their ire, especially when other than Lance and George, the only cyclists most people remember are folks with DUI's or 'long hair hippies' (the ones who keep saying gas prices should be $2-3 higher), or some health nut (telling people they are fat and stupid for driving, usually found next to the hippies). Like what was mentioned in the article a lot of people think if you ride a bike other than for recreation, you must be 'mentally infantile' or you can't drive.
    ^^^^ This is what I think is the primary case for a lot of non-confrontational angry drivers. The kind that honk the horn, get annoyed, but also are apologetic when you knock, say hi, and tell them you're just trying to get home to your family. Or, as was in my case, the guy that realised the "******* on a bike" was the guy that helped him move in to his apartment and would hold the elevator door for him at least once a week every day for the last 2 years.

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mtbklutz's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    108
    Wow, reading this makes me feel lucky to live in an area that appears to be more tolerant of cyclists. Denver is not the Netherlands but I ride almost every single day and have for the past 8 years and I've yet to have any of the confrontations that others are describing here. Before that, I lived in TN and I had beer cans tossed out at me, encountered aggressive dogs frequently and had my fair share of pickup trucks either flooring it as they go by or not giving sufficient room (buzzing). I still get that on occasion here on mountain roads.

    It seems like the more cyclist there are in an area, the more accustomed drivers become to seeing and dealing with them safely. There's also the increased likelihood that the driver himself rides or knows people who ride. We are fortunate to have a fairly active cycling community here. The obvious solution is to get people out riding bikes

    On another note, it seems like Prius and Subaru drivers tend to be the most conscious. Just curious if others have observed that trend.

  25. #25
    weirdo
    Reputation: rodar y rodar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    6,223
    Quote Originally Posted by mtbklutz View Post
    Wow, reading this makes me feel lucky to live in an area that appears to be more tolerant of cyclists.
    I often feel that way reading horror stories from the road. Sure glad it isn`t that bad here!

    Priuses and Subarus? Maybe since bad apples are so few and far between here, the good ones don`t seem to stand out in particular. The bad ones are what stand out, and the worst for me all drive very similar vehicles. For some reason, they seem to prefer large orange busses that say Washoe County School District on the back. Must have gotten a group buy on them.
    Recalculating....

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    361
    Wow... Over the last 5 years in Germany the cyclist-hatered incidents I have had are:

    1-I was occupying the middle of the traffic lane to avoid car doors of parallel parked cars. Driver passes me rather closely (within a foot) honks and waves fist. We get to the red light, exchange words, and go on about our days.

    2-A driver in an audi pulls up next to me on a country road where there is a cycling path paralleling the road, not knowing that the cycle path ends in 50 meters, and that my speed was NOT safe for the multi-use cycling path that has pedestrians on it. He rather snidely (froma safe distance at a safe speed) tells me there is a bike lane I should use... then drives on after a choice response from me.

    3-Occasionally during heavy traffic, drivers pass closer than they ought to (within a meter and a half) or seem to... well, 'pass in an irritated manner' is the best way I can describe it... sudden acceleration, somewhat close cutting (again, just inside of a meter and a half) and occasionally I catch them giving me the 'stink-eye' as they pass.

    That's really about as bad as it gets here... guess I should consider myself quite lucky.

  27. #27
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    ^ A meter and a half! I should be so lucky! Often less than a meter from my center, about 1/2 meter or closer to my shoulder and their door. Big pickup truck mirrors are often within a foot when the drivers try to intimidate.

    BrianMc

  28. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    435
    It drives me nuts. I live in lake county Illinois which is about 40 minutes north of Chicago. I ride in the city no problems but when I commute to work and back i get yelled at and honked at daily. Mostly it is the guys in large pick up trucks who will yell something out the window as they gun it so i cant hear a word they say. The roads suck and there isnt much of a shoulder so i ride as safely to the right as i can. What makes it worse is the trails i used to take home to avoid these idiots are now closed because they are only open during the day. I dont understand why some people are in such a hurry to get stuck in traffic.

  29. #29
    Moderator Moderator
    Reputation: mtbxplorer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    7,007
    ^^ That's a lot of yelling And that's too bad about your alternate trail route being closed after dark. I wonder what the penalty is, if it is safe, if it is patrolled, and if it might be worthwhile riding anyways...

  30. #30
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    I have that nighttime closure thing to worry about where I'm moving to in Indianapolis. The rail trails there close at night, so if you use one to commute on during the daytime, you are forced onto the streets after dark. Last I heard, the local mtb club was pushing to get the hours on the rail trails changed even before they tried to get permission for night riding on the local mtb trails in city parks.

    I rode on one of those greenways at night years ago during an organized ride with police escort, but I'm not sure what happens if you ride it at night in stealth mode. I guess a bike covered with reflective tape and a glow-in-the-dark frame would be hard to ride in stealth mode in such a case.

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    435
    Yeh ive said f-it a few times and just ridden on the trails. I can always just play stupid. I think there is like 2 ranger police so i dont think it is enforced. I have written a few letters to the county board asking why they cant keep the trails open till say 8pm or something to account for commuters. As far as the yelling its sucks but if i stick to side streets it isnt so bad. I just dont understand why they have to gun the truck and burn all that gas just to have to slam on the brakes and get stuck in traffic. I can think of better things to spend 3.50 on. Thanks for letting me rant.

  32. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    435
    also when i sneak on the trails i dont go stealth at all. I got all my lights and reflective gear on. Maybe if they see me with all this stuff on they will realize im just commuting and not sneaking around and give me a break.

  33. #33
    weirdo
    Reputation: rodar y rodar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    6,223
    ^^If you do get caught, I`m sure it`d be a lot less embarrassing all lit up than if you were trying to be sneaky about it.

    Trails closed at night? Weird.
    Recalculating....

  34. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    12,083
    Quote Originally Posted by rodar y rodar View Post
    ^^If you do get caught, I`m sure it`d be a lot less embarrassing all lit up than if you were trying to be sneaky about it.

    Trails closed at night? Weird.
    They "close" a lot of parks around here....jut a sign so the cops can roust the bums or load partiers.

  35. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    28
    I actually was stopped by a cop on a trail by a lake last winter at about 1am. He told me the trail was closed but that it was no big deal. We then chatted about bikes and the unseasonably warm weather before he reminds me that the trail is closed but it was no big deal. Pretty cool

  36. #36
    Hi.
    Reputation: jtmartino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,868
    It's the idiot cyclists who ruin it for everyone else. Yes, there are a lot of bad drivers, but the bad cyclists really stand out to me because I think they should know better. Unfortunately, many of the people on bikes around here and in SF are riding them because they think it's hip, and they know jack sh*t about the rules of the road and how to ride safely.

    I have no problem yelling at a dumbass cyclist when they do something illegal, but I usually reserve that behavior for when nobody else is in the car.

  37. #37
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    Quote Originally Posted by jtmartino View Post
    I have no problem yelling at a dumbass cyclist when they do something illegal, but I usually reserve that behavior for when nobody else is in the car.
    I will keep my comments more civil when that's the case. Usually for me, though, the cyclist is gone before I even realize what a bonehead they were so yelling (or even honking) is beyond its usefulness.

  38. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Does a beep-beep when passing indicate a thank you for riding sensibly. (as compared to a full doppler effect blast going by) or is it a 'neener-neener'? I did not recognize he cars as being owned by anyone I knew.

    BrianMc

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    12,083
    Quote Originally Posted by BrianMc View Post
    Does a beep-beep when passing indicate a thank you for riding sensibly. (as compared to a full doppler effect blast going by) or is it a 'neener-neener'? I did not recognize he cars as being owned by anyone I knew.

    BrianMc
    beep beep is a non emergency warning.....I am passing are you ready...

    Or a sign of approval, yes you are paying attention.

    Or a gently wake up call.....the light just turned...or you can turn right on red.

  40. #40
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    173
    So very hard finding someone else who understands the proper use of the horn.

    A horn is only a sign of aggravation or annoyance when its blaring or extensively used. Although this goes along with what is going on in your surroundings as well.

    So was just looking through some of those posts at CycleHatred (twitter) it's quite amusing seeing that when the idiots get tired of being corrected they claim being bored and tell every one to go away. I wonder if this approach works for them in a real life argument.

  41. #41
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    173
    LMFAO.... I had to share this

    sophie pritchard ‏@sophpritchardxx
    @benbawden @footie124 well I don't pay road tax cus I have Eco friendly car 😊 but u are a cheap twat who doesn't pay for petrol insurance


    Anyone know what petrol insurance is? Is this insurance to keep prices higher?

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation: newfangled's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    3,317
    ^ thanks for the twitter link. That's going to keep me amused.

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation: newfangled's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    3,317
    Quote Originally Posted by jtmartino View Post
    It's the idiot cyclists who ruin it for everyone else. Yes, there are a lot of bad drivers, but the bad cyclists really stand out to me because I think they should know better.
    Normally I think people are way too forgiving of moron drivers, and way too judgemental of cyclists.

    But I have to admit that the popular "Lookit me everybody! I'm blowing through a 4way stop with no hands! I'm not even going to pretend to stop for the rest of you losers!" maneuver reaches a level of douchiness that it's just not possible to match in a motorvehicle.

    So on two occasions I had the pleasure of freaking the @#$% out of those hipster $%^&$#s by calling their bluffs - once on my bike and once while driving.

  44. #44
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    On the whole, I don't approve of being honked at by drivers behind me who are or wish to pass. Chances are, I know they're back there already, and the horn only serves to startle me. I'm apt to shoulder check suddenly to see what the problem is. But yeah, the beep beep is about as nonthreatening as a horn can be, and it's the one I use when the person ahead of me isn't paying attention to the green light that changed 30 sec ago.

    The beep beep if they're alongside me isn't so bothersome. I can easily see the vehicle and the vehicle is already creating a good bit of noise, so the horn isn't so startling. Problem is, so few people use the horn for positive reinforcement that it's not the first thing I think when I hear a horn.

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Harry Mackenzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,080
    Quote Originally Posted by BrianMc View Post
    Most people who mess up and did not mean to are apologetic. Most people who think the rules don;t apply seem to take the aggressive defense posture.

    Assuming you were in the crosswalk when the station wagon driver blocked it, he was in the wrong. Here, he likely did not stop at the stop line and so had failed to stop for the red, too.

    All drivers must avoid the accident. Speeding up on a vehicle turning left likely qiualifies for road rage, too.

    My brother and a guy he ran with had a sedan pull into the crosswalk they were jogging across. This was before automatic door locks. So they opened the back door slid though and out the other rear door. "Excuse us, coming through!"

    Not sure they'd get away with that in Edmonton now.

    BrianMc
    Jogger ass sweat on the back seats? I'd love to have seen the drivers face.

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Quote Originally Posted by jeffscott View Post
    beep beep is a non emergency warning.....I am passing are you ready...

    Or a sign of approval, yes you are paying attention.

    Or a gently wake up call.....the light just turned...or you can turn right on red.
    Forgot to mention I was doing about 17 mph on the 8' wide shoulder of a 4 lane and one driver went mostly into the left lane coming back after he was by and the other hugged the dotted line going by, so I am taking it as a sign of approval that they saw me at some distance and could plan. They were both in lines of spaced out but still audible distance cars with no one else beeping. I have never had this before and got I got two on one ride one outbound one returning. One White Honda Civic and one Burgundy Buick Century.NOW 70's Plymouth Roadrunners and if I had a large "ACME" across my jacket and the name Wile E., I'd understand.

    BrianMc

  47. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Quote Originally Posted by AnonymouseTech View Post
    Jogger ass sweat on the back seats? I'd love to have seen the drivers face.
    Johnny Carson told a story of he and Sid Caesar (a big man) having a NY cabbie rolling into the crosswalk and almost over their toes. Sid steps up to the partially open driver's window, and asks. "Do you remember your birth sir?

    Cabbie, says in foreign accent,"No, I..."

    Quick as a flash Sid reaches in and grabs the guy by the lapels and drags him out the window saying. "Well, we're going to reenact it!"

    Now that would have been something to see!

    BrianMc

  48. #48
    Hi.
    Reputation: jtmartino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,868
    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled View Post
    Normally I think people are way too forgiving of moron drivers, and way too judgemental of cyclists.

    But I have to admit that the popular "Lookit me everybody! I'm blowing through a 4way stop with no hands! I'm not even going to pretend to stop for the rest of you losers!" maneuver reaches a level of douchiness that it's just not possible to match in a motorvehicle.

    So on two occasions I had the pleasure of freaking the @#$% out of those hipster $%^&$#s by calling their bluffs - once on my bike and once while driving.

    It's not just the idiot noob hipsters on their fixies and mixtes. It's the seasoned roadies and messengers who think they own the road in the city. Ones who clearly ride a ton, yet still think blowing through stop signs is OK, as is cutting off cars when there's no bike lane.

    There's no excuse for bad drivers. They do not deserve forgiveness. I just figure, on average, cyclists are superior humans to non-cyclists, so I expect more of them .

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    173
    I think this video says a lot:

    Man Crossing Road Gets Hit By Bike Going the Wrong Way - YouTube

    Although personally I'd be scared shitless travelling down roads that busy against traffic.

  50. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,196
    Around these parts if one rides a bike it cuz of too many DWI's or one can't afford a car because of mental illness. When I ride on road I feel like I have a "kick me" sign on my back..
    lean forward

  51. #51
    Hi.
    Reputation: jtmartino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,868
    Quote Originally Posted by midnightlost View Post
    I think this video says a lot:

    Man Crossing Road Gets Hit By Bike Going the Wrong Way - YouTube

    Although personally I'd be scared shitless travelling down roads that busy against traffic.
    I don't think the bald guy handled it appropriately. That cyclist is a complete idiot, and deserved an earful. Or some legal intervention. Numerous pedestrians have died around here from irresponsible cyclists not obeying traffic laws. Guys like that should be treated just like car drivers who are at fault in collisions with pedestrians.

  52. #52
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    173
    I agree jt, he shouldn't have left at just that, and yea that suit must have been on some high doses of prozac or something being that "chill" after getting hit hard like that.

  53. #53
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    They are both dumb. However salmon riding a busy one way street is asking for drivers to do much the same so he is lucky it was a pedestrian. Dumber for cyclist to post it.

    BrianMc

  54. #54
    mtbr member
    Reputation: newfangled's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    3,317
    Quote Originally Posted by jtmartino View Post
    Numerous pedestrians have died around here from irresponsible cyclists not obeying traffic laws.
    Would you happen to have any stats on that? I've tried to find examples in the past, and the best that I could come up with is that NYC has 0.5 deaths caused by cyclists per year, and the entire UK has 2 (or maybe 4...or possibly 1/3? I can't quite remember) per year.

    Edited to add: Cyclists Injure 500 People Yearly in New York City; Cars Injure 70,000 - New York - News - Runnin' Scared - I'd love to find more info on this stuff.

  55. #55
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    12,083
    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled View Post
    Would you happen to have any stats on that? I've tried to find examples in the past, and the best that I could come up with is that NYC has 0.5 deaths caused by cyclists per year, and the entire UK has 2 (or maybe 4...or possibly 1/3? I can't quite remember) per year.

    Edited to add: Cyclists Injure 500 People Yearly in New York City; Cars Injure 70,000 - New York - News - Runnin' Scared - I'd love to find more info on this stuff.
    I believe Calgary had one bike caused fatality two summer ago now....

    Old lady was hit on a MUP at a corner.

  56. #56
    Hi.
    Reputation: jtmartino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,868
    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled View Post
    Would you happen to have any stats on that? I've tried to find examples in the past, and the best that I could come up with is that NYC has 0.5 deaths caused by cyclists per year, and the entire UK has 2 (or maybe 4...or possibly 1/3? I can't quite remember) per year.

    Edited to add: Cyclists Injure 500 People Yearly in New York City; Cars Injure 70,000 - New York - News - Runnin' Scared - I'd love to find more info on this stuff.
    Two people died last year in SF. One was from a collision with a roadie who was trying to beat a Strava downhill record - turned into the Strava controversy. That cyclist was charged criminally. Another was a cyclist who hit a pedestrian in a crosswalk downtown. I don't have stats outside of that, but when the Strava controversy occurred stats were thrown around by the media which made it seem like it's a regular occurrence.

  57. #57
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    268
    OK, I have a question. Background, I'm not a bike commuter, at least not for 10 years. I drive a VW, somehow this mattered to a previous poster, and I live in Portland Oregon. We have a ton of bike commuters. Here's my situation and question. I leave work about the same time every morning as a fellow biker in my neighborhood. He rides pretty aggressively and is very capable of keeping up with traffic, most of the time. The thing is the guy dresses in dark or black clothing. He has on small blinking red light under his seat and a small light on his handle bars. First time I came across him in the dark winter morning I almost pulled out in front of him. He promptly flipped me the finger and yelled at me.

    Now, I like road bikers and Portland has a ton of good bike friendly roads. But after a few exchanges like that I'm starting to think that there should be some minimal requirement for lighting and safety gear. If I pulled out in front of that biker I probably would have been deemed at fault. That doesn't seem fair. Should there be some minimal requirements for bikers that choose to share the road with cars?

  58. #58
    mtbr member
    Reputation: newfangled's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    3,317
    ^ I'm the one who has issues with VW drivers. Sorry about that, but they really are the worst.

    But I've also got issues with turtle lights and little blinkies. I'd really prefer that they weren't sold, because a lot of people buy them and think that's good enough. "$4.99 for my safety - sounds good to me!" There are also the flashing arm/leg bands that don't do a thing, and lit vests which are useless.

    I recognize that those stupid things will continue to be sold, but I wish that responsible bike shops would warn people that they should only be used as backup lights, and that they should also buy a real light to actually be seen (and I'm just talking a ~$20, not a magicshine or whatever else).

  59. #59
    weirdo
    Reputation: rodar y rodar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    6,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Poe4soul View Post
    Now, I like road bikers and Portland has a ton of good bike friendly roads. But after a few exchanges like that I'm starting to think that there should be some minimal requirement for lighting and safety gear. If I pulled out in front of that biker I probably would have been deemed at fault. That doesn't seem fair. Should there be some minimal requirements for bikers that choose to share the road with cars?
    There ARE minimum lighting requirements. They vary by state, and probably even by municipality, but I`ll eat a pile of chicken turds if OR doesn`t have any. Unfortunately, minumum legal often isn`t enough. In my opninion, anyway, sounds like that`s also your opinion, and the opinion of most other people on this board. Other people disagree, but they`re out to lunch.
    Recalculating....

  60. #60
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    20,882
    Quote Originally Posted by rodar y rodar View Post
    There ARE minimum lighting requirements. They vary by state, and probably even by municipality, but I`ll eat a pile of chicken turds if OR doesn`t have any. Unfortunately, minumum legal often isn`t enough. In my opninion, anyway, sounds like that`s also your opinion, and the opinion of most other people on this board. Other people disagree, but they`re out to lunch.
    Texas doesn't define how bright it needs to be, except for the vague "visible at 500ft" thing, which really depends on a lot of variables. namely, is it "practically" visible at 500ft (meaning, it stands out enough that someone who has no idea you're there can see you) or is it "technically" visible at 500ft (meaning, you will only be able to see it at 500ft if you are already looking for it).

    street lighting varies, so visible at 500ft in a dense city with a lot of lights is different than visible at 500ft on a rural road with no street lights.

  61. #61
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    268
    Quote Originally Posted by rodar y rodar View Post
    There ARE minimum lighting requirements. They vary by state, and probably even by municipality, but I`ll eat a pile of chicken turds if OR doesn`t have any. Unfortunately, minumum legal often isn`t enough. In my opninion, anyway, sounds like that`s also your opinion, and the opinion of most other people on this board. Other people disagree, but they`re out to lunch.
    Are they enforced? Not in Portland.

  62. #62
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    ^^ First point- I have owned two VWs. I find Ram truck drivers the worst. Especially with rich running Cummins belching smoke. Though I have seen my share of cut and thrust VW drivers. Hot rodded Civics are worse IMHO followed closely by hot Cavaliers. Sometimes literally.

    The law does not require much of bicycle lights in most jurisdictions. A ninja rider with minimal lights who expects you to see him or her has spent no time examining how he looks in traffic at a distance. Likely trusts that legal means you can see him or her. Not an entirely dumb assumption, when you think about it in theory and don't look at the real world. He or she likely doesn't drive. Or they among those who don't think about the ninja with crappy lights that they can't see is just like them on their bikes. Doh! However, if stupid was illegal we'd all have situations that would put us in jail. The attitude is that he meets the legal requirement so it must be your fault. The concept that he can be dead right about that requires a certain maturity and ability to see consequences. That requires a good frontal cortex that usually appears about age 25 but in some not before 95.

    There is a thread here on reflective tape and another thread on commuting lights. So for most here you are preaching to the choir. If you have a video cam and can record His Invisibleness to show him the problem, have at it. Maybe send him links to these forum threads. Maybe with the note: I like you but I really can't see you on your bike with those lights, and I doubt that anyone else can either in time to keep you safe. Legal is one thing safe is another.

    My 2 cents. Well more like more than a thousand dollars and lots of day and night bike light videos. They are in the commuting light thread.

    BrianMc

  63. #63
    weirdo
    Reputation: rodar y rodar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    6,223
    Quote Originally Posted by NateHawk View Post
    Texas doesn't define how bright it needs to be, except for the vague "visible at 500ft" thing, which really depends on a lot of variables.
    I don`t know how many feet "visibility" are required, but NV (and probably all states?) use the same method both for bicycle and for MV lighting. I agree that it can be interpreted a lot of different ways, but not so sure it would be better using lumens or watts or whatever else. Look at the mixup for bike lights specs- all the major manufacturers attempt to list them and they still can`t be compared apples to apples. I also agree completely that a lot of factors come into play when it comes to how much light is needed, but it would take volumes to outline requirements to account for all the variables. Don`t know whether that was your point to begin with or if you were making an argument for more specific laws.

    Quote Originally Posted by Poe4soul View Post
    Are they enforced? Not in Portland.
    Not usually enforced very strictly, but that`s a whole different matter. Like BrianMc implies, personal responsibility is the only real solution, and it isn`t universal.

    As for your neighbor, I don`t know what to suggest. You`re right, he`s a bonehead, and I hope you continue to see him in time. And my appologies for assuming you meant Oregon if you happen to be from a different Portland. Hope Bedwards forgives me, too
    Recalculating....

  64. #64
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    268
    Quote Originally Posted by rodar y rodar View Post
    I don`t know how many feet "visibility" are required, but NV (and probably all states?) use the same method both for bicycle and for MV lighting. I agree that it can be interpreted a lot of different ways, but not so sure it would be better using lumens or watts or whatever else. Look at the mixup for bike lights specs- all the major manufacturers attempt to list them and they still can`t be compared apples to apples. I also agree completely that a lot of factors come into play when it comes to how much light is needed, but it would take volumes to outline requirements to account for all the variables. Don`t know whether that was your point to begin with or if you were making an argument for more specific laws.

    Not usually enforced very strictly, but that`s a whole different matter. Like BrianMc implies, personal responsibility is the only real solution, and it isn`t universal.

    As for your neighbor, I don`t know what to suggest. You`re right, he`s a bonehead, and I hope you continue to see him in time. And my appologies for assuming you meant Oregon if you happen to be from a different Portland. Hope Bedwards forgives me, too
    It's Oregon.

    Reflective clothing seems to be a no brainer as well.

    My point is that I'm perfectly happy sharing my road with bikers but I can see how other people can develope a hatred, although hate is a bit strong from my experiences, of bikers due to negative experiences.

    Again, this is Portland, and there are some very aggressive bikers, although a very small minority, that feel bikes have the right of way everywhere, all the time. For example, I was just on a local bike forum and the issue of how many ninjas can be spotted near this hip business district late at night. One of the posters seriously suggested that all cars just need to drive slower. It's the drivers responsibility to look for bikers and pedestrians in the middle of a 30 MPH road. Btw most of these bikers are there to drink and are probably legally drunk. He was getting his ears boxed by responsible riders, but it doesn't matter. He'll be riding down the middle is jeans and a leather jackey and our police will look the other way. OK done with the rant. Stupid bikers give all bikers a bad rep.

  65. #65
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BrianMc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Quote Originally Posted by Poe4soul View Post
    ...Reflective clothing seems to be a no brainer as well.... Stupid bikers give all bikers a bad rep.
    Common sense is uncommon. The no-brainer actually requires some thought. And so a brain. It is not hard to figure out that you are not being seen.Some close calls failure to yield, or provide safe space, etc should do that. Desiring to remove your role in that equation as much as is reasonable, and so placing the onus on the driver as much as possible, is another matter. IMHO a driver who says "I did not see you" should be condemned by those very words as you are so visible that the meaning is "I screwed up and somehow did not see you". Around here it means they did not look carefully enough but did a quick scan and go.

    Light and reflective clothing helps under street lights and when you are in a car's headlights. The majority of serious bike car accidents are from the side. Reflective gear doesn't give warning soon enough because the returning reflections are poor until the cyclist is almost dead ahead of a cross street vehicle. However, combined with good lighting it clearly states I am working my butt off to be seen, so what are you doing to help me be safe? Of course that suggests the driver is not texting, drunk, or brainless.

    BrianMc

  66. #66
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    12,083
    Quote Originally Posted by Poe4soul View Post
    It's Oregon.

    Reflective clothing seems to be a no brainer as well.

    My point is that I'm perfectly happy sharing my road with bikers but I can see how other people can develope a hatred, although hate is a bit strong from my experiences, of bikers due to negative experiences.

    Again, this is Portland, and there are some very aggressive bikers, although a very small minority, that feel bikes have the right of way everywhere, all the time. For example, I was just on a local bike forum and the issue of how many ninjas can be spotted near this hip business district late at night. One of the posters seriously suggested that all cars just need to drive slowergood suggestion. It's the drivers responsibility to look for bikers and pedestrians in the middle of a 30 MPH road.As always Btw most of these bikers are there to drink and are probably legally drunk.You had the Breathalazer out? Phoned it in to the cops? He was getting his ears boxed by responsible riders, but it doesn't matter. He'll be riding down the middle is jeans and a leather jackey and our police will look the other way. OK done with the rant. Stupid bikers give all bikers a bad rep.
    Take it easy....it is everyone's responsibility to avoid accidents and hurting people...

    That means if you don't phone in a drunk (ped,biker,car) you are part of the problem.

    This world gets by on compromise.

    Stupid people give stupid people a bad rap.

  67. #67
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    268
    Quote Originally Posted by jeffscott View Post
    Take it easy....it is everyone's responsibility to avoid accidents and hurting people...

    That means if you don't phone in a drunk (ped,biker,car) you are part of the problem.

    This world gets by on compromise.

    Stupid people give stupid people a bad rap.
    So, how slow is slow enough to avoid hitting a ninja biker? A person should have reasonable expectation of fellow dirvers/bikers/pedestrians. I guess it's legal to stop and tie your shoe in the middle of a dark road wearing dark cloths, but...

    No, I didn't have a Breathalyzer, as if - WTF? No I didn't call the cops, they are not visibly drunk but probably legally drunk. That's why I said probably. They've been in a bar, it's late, etc. duh!

  68. #68
    Bedwards Of The West
    Reputation: CommuterBoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    5,444
    I actually got freaked out this morning by a ninja DRIVER It was raining, it was dark..sky was just starting to lighten up, but still mostly dark. Bad visibility conditions anyway, but in my rural situation I can tell when cars are coming up behind me because I see their headlight beams long before the car actually gets to me... I started hearing the hiss of tires in the rain, and all of a sudden a black car with black wheels and no lights on goes zipping by... I was safely on the shoulder and they were safely in their lane, but I almost jumped out of my skin. It was waaaaay to dark to be rolling with no headlights.
    You have no excuse for driving to work
    (unless you don't have studded tires)
    (no excuse for that either)

  69. #69
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    268
    Quote Originally Posted by CommuterBoy View Post
    I actually got freaked out this morning by a ninja DRIVER It was raining, it was dark..sky was just starting to lighten up, but still mostly dark. Bad visibility conditions anyway, but in my rural situation I can tell when cars are coming up behind me because I see their headlight beams long before the car actually gets to me... I started hearing the hiss of tires in the rain, and all of a sudden a black car with black wheels and no lights on goes zipping by... I was safely on the shoulder and they were safely in their lane, but I almost jumped out of my skin. It was waaaaay to dark to be rolling with no headlights.
    I work in traffic for a living surveying. The worst are the electric cars. You rely on all your senses and when the sound of the engine is gone, all you got is the hiss of the tires. I hope I don't step out in front of one someday.

  70. #70
    Bedwards Of The West
    Reputation: CommuterBoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    5,444
    I hear that. I've had them sneak up on me when I was riding too. No warning. They might as well scream "BOOO!" at you as they go past.
    You have no excuse for driving to work
    (unless you don't have studded tires)
    (no excuse for that either)

Members who have read this thread: 0

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •