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  1. #1
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    Bike light "etiquitte"

    A thought just occured to me, is there a use for each of the modes of lights that exist? For example, I have a set of Ascent lights, front and back. Each one has a solid light, flashing light and a sort of strobe light that goes back and forth.

    What mode do you generally use? Is one better than the others for certain situations? I know if I was a driver and I saw the strobe light thing it might be distracting, I dont know

  2. #2
    Sweep the leg!
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    When I'm in traffic I have the lights set for the most annoying blinkie mode they have so I can be seen by motorists. When I'm in traffic I don't need the lighting to see so much. The street lights or ambient light is generally more than enough for me.

    But when I'm on the bicycle/multi-use trail I try to be thoughtful of other cyclists. If I have the headlight set on high beam and I see an approaching cyclist I'll tone it down or set it back on blinkie. It annoys me when another rider is blazing my retinas with their lights, but I'm not the trail lighting nazi so I try to close one eye to avoid temporary blindness/spotting.

    My bottom line, do right by the other cyclists. Screw the motorists.
    Authorities speculate that speed may have been a factor. They are also holding gravity and inertia for questioning.

  3. #3
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    Blink away on the streets it is the only way cars will notice you from dusk until dawn. When motorists see any sort of blinking light they think police, causing them to slow down and look. That's all I can ask of a light when I'm out commuting.
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  4. #4
    Squeaky Wheel
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    I use strobe mode in traffic. I've left my light on solid in traffic in the past and it's amazing how many drivers don't see/pay attention to a solid light vs. a strobing light.

    I wear my light on my helmet, so when I pass another cyclist, I aim the light down and off to the side so I don't blind them.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeine Powered
    When I'm in traffic I have the lights set for the most annoying blinkie mode they have so I can be seen by motorists. When I'm in traffic I don't need the lighting to see so much. The street lights or ambient light is generally more than enough for me.

    But when I'm on the bicycle/multi-use trail I try to be thoughtful of other cyclists.
    If I have the headlight set on high beam and I see an approaching cyclist I'll tone it down or set it back on blinkie. It annoys me when another rider is blazing my retinas with their lights, but I'm not the trail lighting nazi so I try to close one eye to avoid temporary blindness/spotting.

    My bottom line, do right by the other cyclists. Screw the motorists.
    I've seen rants at BikeForums.net by people who don't like other cyclists running blinking/flashing headlights, and wonder what the point could possibly be for doing so. Best option if you're coming head-on towards other cyclists on a bike path, in my opinion, is to reduce power and make sure your light's hotspot is on the pavement, not aimed straight out horizontal like a high beam.

    Another suggestion: those of you with helmet lights, don't aim them at people if you can help it (yes, should be self-evident, I know). Those of you with fantastically-powerful taillights like a DiNotte or Nova BULL, turn them off if you're on a bike path where there's no rear-collision danger, and just run a small taillight in steady-burn mode.

    In my own case, I have several very powerful lights, and I do dim and/or re-aim them when I'm coming head-on at people (in cars, on foot, on bike, on horseback). For those who may be interested, here's a YouTube video showing various ways of reducing the impact of a Seca 700 Ultra: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovlrz5afG3U

  6. #6
    No-Brakes Cougar
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    I always have my tail light on blink if I'm on a public street and it's anything other than broad daylight. If it's cloudy, foggy or dusk I have my headlight on blink. I figure it at least makes me a little more noticeable and the flashing doesn't bother me. If it's night time I have to have the headlight on steady. The flashing in my face is distracting!
    R.I.P. Ronnie James Dio ~ July 10, 1942 – May 16, 2010

  7. #7
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    thanks guys

    I just biked home in the dark with solid front light and strobe back light. I will change to blinking front light, what you say makes total sense

    thanks for the wisdom

  8. #8
    Off the back...
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    I always run strobe for the rear [PBSF FTW]. I don't care how annoying it is, I want to be seen. On the front, I like to fool drivers into thinking I'm one of them. Solid beam on the side streets and wherever I'll be away from streetlights. My next light will put out around 2000 lumen, and it will have a flash mode. For foul weather in high-risk situations [rain, fog, etc. on a fast downhill] I will probably run it on flash, but a 2000 lumen strobe might be a bit much...
    @pinkrobeyyc
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  9. #9
    Blind biker
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmccune
    Blink away on the streets it is the only way cars will notice you from dusk until dawn. When motorists see any sort of blinking light they think police, causing them to slow down and look. That's all I can ask of a light when I'm out commuting.
    I wonder what would happen if i put a set or blue or red filters over the light.

  10. #10
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    On the road, I try to be visible as possible, and I actually try to be annoying as possible with drivers.

    I had my Niterider Flight mounted on my helmet. To conserve battery power, I had it only on the LED's, not the full HID. I also had a blinker going on the front of my bike.

    A woman coming from a side street ignored my lights and proceeded to pull out in front of me. I tried to shine my LED's into her eyes so she would see me, but seem to ignore them.

    Normally, if I shine my HID into a driver's eyes, they respond by covering their face. I know they have seen me then.

    On the trail, I usually cover my light up so I don't blind passing riders.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by harry2110
    I wonder what would happen if i put a set or blue or red filters over the light.
    You would be arrested for impersonating an officer.

    Niterider does make an blue and red flashing light set for law enforcement.

  12. #12
    ol'guy who says hi &waves
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    I had a bar mounted NR Trinewt, on strobe, on a dark foggy commute last night.A couple vehicles, on both sides of the road, pulled over at different times. The looks on their faces, when they realized it was a bicycle, was priceless.
    .

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  13. #13
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    Hmmm, it would almost be worth getting red and blue bulbs, right up until the police notice and start writing tickets.
    Authorities speculate that speed may have been a factor. They are also holding gravity and inertia for questioning.

  14. #14
    jrm
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    The brightest thing i have..

    Quote Originally Posted by Shwaa
    A thought just occured to me, is there a use for each of the modes of lights that exist? For example, I have a set of Ascent lights, front and back. Each one has a solid light, flashing light and a sort of strobe light that goes back and forth.

    What mode do you generally use? Is one better than the others for certain situations? I know if I was a driver and I saw the strobe light thing it might be distracting, I dont know
    a L in M ARC HID. The reason is that with anyrhing with less power the beam or effectivemness of the light is washed out by car headlights. This really decreases a lights affectiveness.

    With the HID ..drivers cant help but see it and me coming. Its really confidence inspiring. .

  15. #15
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    I use all 3 modes on my Mars 3.0

    Solid mode for when I have my Superflash flashing.
    Strobe mode for extra attention in the day.
    Chase mode for when I am on the MUP or when riding with others (only 1 LED comes on at a time and doesn't blind people behind you like Strobe mode does).
    '15 Soma Wolverine '12 Soma Analog SS '10 Transition TransAM '07 Felt F1X '97 Schwinn Mesa SS '89 Fuji Saratoga '86 Fuji Club

  16. #16
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    I'm with mechBgon

    Theres a gearfreak person who runs the latest and greatest mega lumen lights on her helmet AND bar at full intensity in the middle of nowhere on the bike path we commute on. This "goddess of light" literally blinds anyone passing in the opposite direction.

    IMHO bike lights have gotten just as stupid as needing a V-10 haul your ass to walmart.

    Mahns biggrn' urn'

    Snort snort. . . .

  17. #17
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    I'm a light freak. But then I ride a lot at night, in both urban traffic and streets/trails/paths where there is little or no lighting.

    I typically run two lights on the front -- a small Knog blinky for general visibility, and a Stella 200N to drive by. Most of the time in urban traffic I run the Stella in blinky mode as well... that gives me enough to reliably see by, and attracts the motorists' eyes and attention. My blinky is no more annoying than their high beams ;-)

    On the dark part of the trails, especially where there are joggers, I run the Stella in full power, steady beam. This is primarily to keep a sharp watch out for the "unenlightened," those ninja wanna-bes who go off running on dark paths in black clothing with no lights or reflectors. A selfish way to put it is that if they won't help me to see them, it's still my responsibility to detect and avoid them, so the Stella gets set in ninja-detection mode. Where sight lines permit, I can usually pick them up at a quarter-mile or more if they have any kind of reflectivity or motion going on.

    In the back I run a Planet Bike Superflash in blinky mode, and a Cateye TD-1100 in steady mode. Regular blinkies attract drunk drivers, and even the average motorist has difficulty distinguishing distance/depth perception if there's only a blinky and no steady light source. So, if you run a blinky-only in the rear, reinforce your chances by adding a steady red light in the rear.

    I also run another small Knog blinky - red this time - off the back of my helmet to give a little more spatial definition that identifies me as a cyclist.

    And of course, I back all this up with reflectors -- red reflective tape on the back of the rack stays, 3M tape on the back of the panniers, rack trunk, and helmet, and a reflective vest when out at night. I look like some sort of starship when the headlights hit me, and that's okay by me.

    Being visible and predictable is probably the most important safety principles you can follow when riding at night, or in inclement weather for that matter... It can keep you alive and unharmed.

    Generally you shouldn't shine your bright beams in others' eyes, whether another cyclist or a motorist. However it can be a good tool to get an errant/inattentive motorist's attention to use your handlebars or helmet lamp to "flash" him if he's obviously overlooking or not seeing you.
    Ride a mountain bike... you will not regret it if you live.
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  18. #18
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    I generally don't commute in total darkness and run blinkies in front and rear and assume cars CAN'T see me. In full-on dark I run 600 lumens on my helmet on the road and back it down a little on the bike path but not so much that I can't see the ped-idiots dressed in dark clothes.

    Caz
    I am a Mountain Biker therefore I am late

  19. #19
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    A quarter mile visibility at 20 mph eh?

    If I ever need 45 seconds lead time in this situation I will consider something else more fitting such a reaction time.

    Thanks for the heads up pokey.

    The freakin' blazing light display is inconsiderate, unnecessary, a waste of money and to keep it short

    Stupid.

    If you're that sight impaired you shouldn't be riding a bike in a shared space, especially at dusk or in the dark you yuppified gear freak moron.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by pedalitup
    A quarter mile visibility at 20 mph eh?

    The freakin' blazing light display is inconsiderate, unnecessary, a waste of money and to keep it short

    Stupid.

    If you're that sight impaired you shouldn't be riding a bike in a shared space, especially at dusk or in the dark you yuppified gear freak moron
    .
    You don't know me very well, do you?

    But it takes all sorts of knuckleheads to make a bike forum interesting. Welcome to the group.
    Ride a mountain bike... you will not regret it if you live.
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by pedalitup
    A quarter mile visibility at 20 mph eh?

    If I ever need 45 seconds lead time in this situation I will consider something else more fitting such a reaction time.

    Thanks for the heads up pokey.

    The freakin' blazing light display is inconsiderate, unnecessary, a waste of money and to keep it short

    Stupid.

    If you're that sight impaired you shouldn't be riding a bike in a shared space, especially at dusk or in the dark you yuppified gear freak moron.
    Whoa Whoa Whoa, hold on there name caller.

    Now what if the yuppiefied gear freak moron traveling at 20mph sees a ped-idiot ninga runner traveling in the opposite direction at 10mph?

    The answer is 30 seconds and I wasn't making a point, just pointing out that I can do math too.

    I generally stop my vision at 100 yrds; anything past that is just useless future stuff and I could die before I even get there. What does it look like past 100yrds when I stop my vision? I don't know.

    Caz
    I am a Mountain Biker therefore I am late

  22. #22
    No-Brakes Cougar
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    What's with all the pointless bickering as of late on this forum? I hope this place isn't turning into another bikeforums.net.
    R.I.P. Ronnie James Dio ~ July 10, 1942 – May 16, 2010

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by pedalitup
    A quarter mile visibility at 20 mph eh?

    If I ever need 45 seconds lead time in this situation I will consider something else more fitting such a reaction time.

    Thanks for the heads up pokey.

    The freakin' blazing light display is inconsiderate, unnecessary, a waste of money and to keep it short

    Stupid.

    If you're that sight impaired you shouldn't be riding a bike in a shared space, especially at dusk or in the dark you yuppified gear freak moron.
    LOL!

    I might be riding a ti bike using a HID/Lithum light system, but I am riding entirely at night, through the heavily populated Silicon Valley.

    I even had a mountain bike ride that started in Orinda and ended up in downtown Oakland, most of it on dirt.

    Trust me, I wish I could see everything from a quarter mile out. I might be handle an obstacle I can only see from 20 feet away, but if you screw up at night, the results are BAD.

    But hop into your car tonight and head back to the the cycle-trainer in front of the TV.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by cazloco
    Whoa Whoa Whoa, hold on there name caller.

    Now what if the yuppiefied gear freak moron traveling at 20mph sees a ped-idiot ninga runner traveling in the opposite direction at 10mph?

    The answer is 30 seconds and I wasn't making a point, just pointing out that I can do math too.
    This would probably be the time for a "teachable moment," to break out the Powerpoint & video on reaction time and the "12-Second Rule." But that's likely over this dude's head even if he's in a mood to listen.

    I tell my students to never ride any faster than their guardian angel can fly. If I'm doing 20 mph in the dark, I'm in the traffic lane. The bike path, sidewalk, and sometimes even the bike lane where you have to share with pedestrians -- ninjas or not -- ain't the place to try and make up lost time.
    Ride a mountain bike... you will not regret it if you live.
    (with apologies to Mark Twain & The Taming of the Bicycle)

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by PscyclePath
    This would probably be the time for a "teachable moment," to break out the Powerpoint & video on reaction time and the "12-Second Rule." But that's likely over this dude's head even if he's in a mood to listen.

    I tell my students to never ride any faster than their guardian angel can fly. If I'm doing 20 mph in the dark, I'm in the traffic lane. The bike path, sidewalk, and sometimes even the bike lane where you have to share with pedestrians -- ninjas or not -- ain't the place to try and make up lost time.
    The bottom line at night is this: get the most powerful lights you can carry/afford and be as visible as possible.

  26. #26
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    Back on track...

    I would like to ask bikers to stop wearing headlamps or helmet lights. It's cool if you want to be as visible as possible, I do too, but headlamps are a hazard. Wherever the biker looks, someone is blinded.

    Usually, a commuter needs to look around and see what's around them to be safe, a bright light on someone's head, is potentially dangerous to both the rider with the head lamp and whoever is in the direction he or she is looking.

    A lamp on the handlebar should suffice, even 2 or 3 if you feel you need it, just aim it a bit low. Headlamps are not a good idea.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkMJ29
    I would like to ask bikers to stop wearing headlamps or helmet lights. It's cool if you want to be as visible as possible, I do too, but headlamps are a hazard. Wherever the biker looks, someone is blinded.

    Usually, a commuter needs to look around and see what's around them to be safe, a bright light on someone's head, is potentially dangerous to both the rider with the head lamp and whoever is in the direction he or she is looking.

    A lamp on the handlebar should suffice, even 2 or 3 if you feel you need it, just aim it a bit low. Headlamps are not a good idea.
    That is a horrible suggestion. Headlamps are the safest choice for any kind of night riding.

    Off road I primarily ride with my light mounted on my helmet. The terrain is rarely in a straight line on level ground, and a helmet mounted light allows me to point the light on the line I am going to ride, not the direction my bike is traveling at the moment.

    On the pavement, I prefer to mount my light on my bars to minimize weight on my neck. However, my biggest concern about visibility is cars pulling out from side roads.

    Cars running parallel to me in either direction have headlights pointing at me. But vehicles from side roads can only see me if they see my light. Making it even more dangerous is that some drivers will ignore any light that does not look like car headlights.

    I actually point my helmet mounted light directly at drivers' eyes of cars about to turn into my lane. When they cover their eyes or flinch, then I know they see me.

    No one has ever cut me off if they saw my helmet mounted light. That has not been the case if I just had a handlebar light.

    I do agree that pointing your light in other riders is eyes is annoying and dangerous, and I will even cover my light up while I pass. But I think the helmet is the best place to mount a light.

  28. #28
    Squeaky Wheel
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkMJ29
    I would like to ask bikers to stop wearing headlamps or helmet lights. It's cool if you want to be as visible as possible, I do too, but headlamps are a hazard. Wherever the biker looks, someone is blinded.
    I want to be as visible as possible so I wear my headlight on my helmet. Being visible is the point, right? When riding on roads in traffic, I set it to strobe mode. Drivers see it and the extra visibility helps to keep me from being cutoff at intersections, driveways, etc.

    On the trail, I set it solid on and it helps me to ride safely. I am able to look down the trail and around corners for ninja bikers/runners or trail obstacles

    But, as with any light, you have to be aware and responsible. I keep mine aimed at the road. I never aim it at on-coming cars (unless it's a driver about to cut me off), and when bikes pass me in the opposite direction on the trail, I aim my light down and away from them.

    If you use the light responsibly, I do not believe that it is any more annoying or dangerous than a handlebar mounted light.

  29. #29
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    It may be true that headlamps are safest for the individual biker, to give the biker a clear view of everything. I guess I'm arguing that, not only in terms of etiquette, but other people's safety as well.

    It might seem I'm speaking in extreme examples, and "what-if's", but I think some what-if's are valid. Such as, riding home in the dark, there's a biker or car on the side of you, you glance over to check your distance, make sure you're not going to be hit, by then, you have just flashed those people with your light, or you didn't flash them by ducking your head down, but then you didnt get a good look.

    Roundaboutly, I'm suggesting that it could prevent you from viewing obstacles around you. People will see you, but do you lose some of your ability to view obstacles? Because if you don't blind (I mean "blind" as in creating a spot in their night vision, or making them look away from your direction) them, you might not be looking right at them, hindering your own ability to view your surroundings.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkMJ29
    It may be true that headlamps are safest for the individual biker, to give the biker a clear view of everything. I guess I'm arguing that, not only in terms of etiquette, but other people's safety as well.

    It might seem I'm speaking in extreme examples, and "what-if's", but I think some what-if's are valid. Such as, riding home in the dark, there's a biker or car on the side of you, you glance over to check your distance, make sure you're not going to be hit, by then, you have just flashed those people with your light, or you didn't flash them by ducking your head down, but then you didnt get a good look.

    Roundaboutly, I'm suggesting that it could prevent you from viewing obstacles around you. People will see you, but do you lose some of your ability to view obstacles? Because if you don't blind (I mean "blind" as in creating a spot in their night vision, or making them look away from your direction) them, you might not be looking right at them, hindering your own ability to view your surroundings.
    I'm not sure of what point you are trying to make, and I strongly suspect you have not ridden much at night and you trying to argue a hypothetical point.

    I been momentarily blinded countless times by car headlights. I haven't crashed yet.

    I've also looked at my cyclocomputer, my cellphone, street signs, hot chicks, and storefronts without crashing. I use common sense here. If I am a smooth road with little chance of a car turning in front of me, my eyes wander. If I am in a danger spot, I pay attention.

    If I shine my light into a driver's eyes, it is almost always when the car has stopped to make a turn. Even if their night vision is impaired, like that wouldn't happen from other car headlights, as long as they do not turn in front of me, I'm good.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro
    I'm not sure of what point you are trying to make, and I strongly suspect you have not ridden much at night and you trying to argue a hypothetical point.

    I been momentarily blinded countless times by car headlights. I haven't crashed yet.

    I've also looked at my cyclocomputer, my cellphone, street signs, hot chicks, and storefronts without crashing. I use common sense here. If I am a smooth road with little chance of a car turning in front of me, my eyes wander. If I am in a danger spot, I pay attention.

    If I shine my light into a driver's eyes, it is almost always when the car has stopped to make a turn. Even if their night vision is impaired, like that wouldn't happen from other car headlights, as long as they do not turn in front of me, I'm good.
    I guess it's easy to lose focus on a broad category like this. I was initially speaking about the etiquette of headlamps, which I was asking bikers to stop wearing.

    I didn't want to say it's very annoying to be blinded and it ticks me off sometimes, because this thread was going very negative already, and that might just fuel the fire. But yea, it does get me when I pass an oncoming biker with a headlamp and if the person moves their head a bit in my direction, it's annoying and distracting to me. Headlamps are can be very powerful and mess with your night vision if you get hit straight on.

    So that's my point of other people's safety, and my etiquette point as well. I, personally, have a problem with it. I just didn't want to rant and be another heckling jerk-off. No one likes them

    I guess I'll refine my statement and say, it it my personal opinion that headlamps, for bike commuting, are bad etiquette, and potentially hazardous to other bikers and possibly drivers.

    It might be the safest method for you (the wearer of the light), but how much is enough? Barring any real personal experience, or research, I have not found myself less safe without a headlamp. Are we sacrificing etiquette to other bikers, for our personal need to feel safe by wearing a headlamp?

    I think yes.

  32. #32
    ol'guy who says hi &waves
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    I've been using a helmet light along with a bar light for 12 years. Out of courtesy, it has become second nature to use some peripheral vision instead of dead on blinding light...unless there's a chance the motorist may not have seen me. Depending on circumstances, even motorist approaching from behind on a shoulderless section, may get an occasional frontal flash. Etiquette whenever possible, but survival reigns when in doubt.

    .
    .

    I may not have the best of everything, but I have the best everything that matters.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkMJ29
    Barring any real personal experience, or research, I have not found myself less safe without a headlamp. Are we sacrificing etiquette to other bikers, for our personal need to feel safe by wearing a headlamp?

    I think yes.
    Why don't you try wearing a light on your helmet for a while, and then come back and report on your experience vs. a bar mounted light? I think you might be suprised at how it enhances your personal safety.

    I have ridden both, and I prefer a helmet mounted light. My experience is also that I have been blinded by plenty of cyclists with bar mounted lights who do not cover or dim their lights when they pass me. Cyclists with helmet mounted light, in my experience, almost always look down and away when they pass.

    A helmet mounted light can be ridden just as safely as a bar mounted light. Like anything else, it just takes awareness and consideration.

  34. #34
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    I don't shine my lights into other cyclists or pedestrians' eyes. I actually make the effort to prevent it from happening by covering my light.

  35. #35
    LCI #1853
    Reputation: PscyclePath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro
    I don't shine my lights into other cyclists or pedestrians' eyes. I actually make the effort to prevent it from happening by covering my light.
    When it happens to you, shut one eye to preserve the night vision in that eye. As soon as you get past the lights, open up, and you can see again.
    Ride a mountain bike... you will not regret it if you live.
    (with apologies to Mark Twain & The Taming of the Bicycle)

  36. #36
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    If you're the blind guy that races DH with a spotter or someone of that stripe, my humble apology.

    Otherwise. . .

    Leave us knuckleheads alone when were fine by the light of the full moon.

  37. #37
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    The police analogy is a little off.

    People notice flashing lights because our brains are setup to look at things that flash.

    It is also hard to look away from flashing lights. kids find looking away from flashing lights very difficult. i think the best setting is getting the lights to stobe in tandem, it is the brightest flash and attracts the attention of the drivers. the back and forth motion strobe looks cool because of the old Knight Rider TV series (I saw one of the new ones, shockingly bad!).
    Mint condition Marzocchi 66RC for sale (170mm) pm to make an offer!

    Ride in Japan? Come to the Forums!

  38. #38
    Known Mountainbiker
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkMJ29
    I guess it's easy to lose focus on a broad category like this. I was initially speaking about the etiquette of headlamps, which I was asking bikers to stop wearing.

    I didn't want to say it's very annoying to be blinded and it ticks me off sometimes, because this thread was going very negative already, and that might just fuel the fire. But yea, it does get me when I pass an oncoming biker with a headlamp and if the person moves their head a bit in my direction, it's annoying and distracting to me. Headlamps are can be very powerful and mess with your night vision if you get hit straight on.

    So that's my point of other people's safety, and my etiquette point as well. I, personally, have a problem with it. I just didn't want to rant and be another heckling jerk-off. No one likes them

    I guess I'll refine my statement and say, it it my personal opinion that headlamps, for bike commuting, are bad etiquette, and potentially hazardous to other bikers and possibly drivers.

    It might be the safest method for you (the wearer of the light), but how much is enough? Barring any real personal experience, or research, I have not found myself less safe without a headlamp. Are we sacrificing etiquette to other bikers, for our personal need to feel safe by wearing a headlamp?

    I think yes.
    I can do this thing where I can point my helmet light down and or away from oncoming traffic, whether it is a car, bike or "hot chic". My eyes and helmet light do not have to point in the same direction. I am not going to sacrifice my safety because you can't look away from bright shiney things.

    When I try to not shine my barlight into oncoming traffic; I tend to go in that direction.

    When riding with groups at night, the newbies learn pretty quick to not shine lights in people's eyes/face. This is where/when the technique of turning your head/helmet light away from people and yet still able to look at them.

    Amazing, I've never heard any biker suggest that helmet lights are unsafe.

    Caz
    I am a Mountain Biker therefore I am late

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