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  1. #1
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    What's "the law" about sharing a road with a roadie

    I'm going down the loooong hill on 93 going north, down towards the light at the turnoff to Eldorado Springs Blvd. There's always a roadie there doing maybe 35 where us drivers are doing 55. There's inches to spare to the biker who's hugging the white line on the right, there's loads of traffic in the other lane going the other direction (south) so it's not like we can all go into the other lane to give the roadie some mythical "law defined" space.

    So, what's the law? Is passing this rider with not really much clearance OK? If the guy hits a rut and swerves in front of me am I technically at fault? Hope it doesn't happen but someone has mentioned that "the law" requires I give this rider some law-defined space for him to swerve around obstacles. Two things are for sure in that scenario: he'll ram into me or somebody else and he'll be in a world of hurt.

    No one is more considerate of a biker on the road than I am but the last thing on my mind was slowing down to give this guy some space if I can't go into the other lane to do so.
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

  2. #2
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    The rule is three feet. Lanes are a minimum of 12 feet wide in general. Surprisingly your car is actually about half if it. Even if your car was 8 feet wide, you still can hug the center line and give the cyclist clearance--assuming they are not in the lane.

    Funny, you always see a roadie.... of the 300 times I have driven that road, I have maybe seen three. You have bad luck.

    93 is a dangerous road for cars....to ride bikes there is like skydiving we a poorly packed chute and no backup.

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    If they're in...

    Your crosshairs, 'punch it'...

    J/K, just wait for them to finish their text, 'sent from their iPhone..."
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  4. #4
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    Oh come on...

    Have you no common sense? Don't buzz the guy, don't hit the guy. How hard can that be?

  5. #5
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    Im not sure but im thinking we need a 2 page thread on it.

  6. #6
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    It depends on whether he's wearing Lycra or not.

  7. #7
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    Tough crowd.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckred
    Have you no common sense? Don't buzz the guy, don't hit the guy. How hard can that be?
    +1 for common sense; why was this question even posed?

    I don't care how considerate you might be. Without application of common sense, best intentions can kill people just as fast as any other d!psh!t moves.
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    Funny how the morning after I start this thread there's a front page story in The Post about the 3' rule. OK, my car is just over 6' wide. Let's say I don't really have an opportunity to hug the left line 'cause there's a line of cars doing the same coming the other direction. At 55 mph. I'd sure like to clear them by as much as I can, a head-on being a poor way to start the day.

    Now we've got the roadie trying to hold his line let's say a foot from the right white stripe. My 6'+, my 2' clearance of the white stripe on my left (hold your hands in front of you 2' apart, not much is it?), the roadie's swerving side to side with some maniacal grin on his face ("boy, I feel so alive!"). OK, technically he's got his 3'. But it sure doesn't allow for much error on his part which is my whole point.

    Slight miscalculation=death just seems a weird way to approach a Saturday morning ride.
    But then I've never had the roadie's desire to ride in heavy fast moving traffic.
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

  10. #10
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    hmm...

    I ride that stretch on my road bike all the time, same direction. Probably close to 20 years now. And I drive it 5 days a week home from work. It is not that difficult. Really. There is generally plenty of room to pass as a driver. If there is a lot of traffic coming the other way, just slow down a little bit until you have a window, then give the cyclist 3 feet. As a cyclist I have never been buzzed of scared by a driver. I avoid that route during morning rush hour coming in to Boulder because of the volume--(and because I am usually on my way to work) just makes sense, but otherwise no problem.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy
    Funny how the morning after I start this thread there's a front page story in The Post about the 3' rule. OK, my car is just over 6' wide. Let's say I don't really have an opportunity to hug the left line 'cause there's a line of cars doing the same coming the other direction. At 55 mph. I'd sure like to clear them by as much as I can, a head-on being a poor way to start the day.

    Now we've got the roadie trying to hold his line let's say a foot from the right white stripe. My 6'+, my 2' clearance of the white stripe on my left (hold your hands in front of you 2' apart, not much is it?), the roadie's swerving side to side with some maniacal grin on his face ("boy, I feel so alive!"). OK, technically he's got his 3'. But it sure doesn't allow for much error on his part which is my whole point.

    Slight miscalculation=death just seems a weird way to approach a Saturday morning ride.
    But then I've never had the roadie's desire to ride in heavy fast moving traffic.
    I'm pretty sure that if you don't believe you can give the cyclist the required 3 feet, and you can't push further to the left due to oncoming traffic, then you must slow down and follow the cyclist at his speed until you have a safe opportunity to pass. There is no law requiring vehicles (or bikes) to maintain the speed limit. I am fairly certain there are no minimum speed requirements on that stretch of road. It is possible for the cyclist to be charged with impeding traffic if the regular flow of traffic is moving much faster than the cyclist and the cyclist does not pull over to allow the impeded traffic an opportunity to pass...although, I am skeptical the police would charge the cyclist that way in your scenario.

    All things considered, even if you have to follow the cyclist a mile or two at his speed (35 mph) before you have a safe opportunity to pass, the net delay to you is pretty minor. I prefer to just slow down and not risk the cyclist's life or my freedom.

  12. #12
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    interesting precedent set

    i'd be really surprised if some co municipalities don't follow suit in the next year

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  14. #14
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    I drive 93 almost every day both into then out of Boulder. I have been amazed at the number of roadies I see on this stretch of road and have come to the conclusion that most of these riders must have a death wish. There is no friggin way I'd ride into work on this road! I've seen several close calls as the cars pass the slower cyclist and the wind catches the bike just right.... Nor is there a shoulder for the cyclist.

    Technically, there is a 3 ft space given to a cyclist. IMHO, I believe it is now the state (or county's) place to provide the space of safety without endangering either the car traffic or the cyclist. This stretch of road has generated long debates regarding the need for a bike path or bike lane. Interesting that nothing has been done as yet....
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    No one is more considerate of a biker on the road than I am but the last thing on my mind was slowing down to give this guy some space if I can't go into the other lane to do so.
    Huh?

    Just slow down and wait 30 seconds until it's safe to pass. Don't buzz the guy and worry less about the legalities of a potential accident and more about avoiding one in the first place. My fault or not, I know how I'd feel if I killed a cyclist or anyone for that matter. For what it's worth I think 93 desperately needs a bath path.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    interesting precedent set

    i'd be really surprised if some co municipalities don't follow suit in the next year
    Can I still yell "get off the road Armstrong" to the Touron De France season roadies?

    Good thing they think there's only one race a year.

  17. #17
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    Hey, I didn't dredge up my old thread. The situation that prompted this thread originally was: traffic was stacked up behind me, we're all doing 55, we all come up on this roadie hugging the white line, I'm in front. It seems like he's kinda wobbling back and forth and I sure wanted to get over to the left, cross the yellow line. We're heading down that long hill, going north, with Marshall Mesa on our right.

    But, no, here comes a solid line of traffic coming the other way and they're hugging the yellow line. I'm not gonna ram on my brakes to slow down to this guy's 35 mph with everyone on my azz. So I pass the wobbling roadie at 55 with maybe 12 inches to spare. I chose not to get any more left because I decided wiping out this roadie with a death wish trumped me clipping the fenders of the oncoming traffic. Split decision.

    Maybe I had more room to get over to the left, maybe I passed him closer or farther away than 12 inches. The situation presented itself and was over with in about 3 seconds. Glad nobody got hurt. I wonder if he really felt safe riding that road. I wonder if he ever thinks about his safety. I wonder if I'd have gotten a ticket if he'd wobbled over into my path? I wonder why this thread was bumped back up.
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

  18. #18
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    I think elderly drivers holding up traffic in the canyons are a bigger problem than the occasional roadie (it isn't hard to safely pass roadies). Maybe we should be able to perform a pit maneuver when old people are blocking traffic.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    Maybe I had more room to get over to the left, maybe I passed him closer or farther away than 12 inches. I wonder why this thread was bumped back up.
    look a few posts up
    buzzing a cyclist in the manner you describe could be considered harassment
    this thread was resurrected with a topical post

    if you buzzed me like that and i caught up with you, the cops would be the least of your worries

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    look a few posts up
    buzzing a cyclist in the manner you describe could be considered harassment
    this thread was resurrected with a topical post

    if you buzzed me like that and i caught up with you, the cops would be the least of your worries
    If you put yourself in a similar position to get "buzzed" like that you need to go see a shrink now about your own death wish before it's too late. I dunno, death by traffic must sound cool to guys like you. At least you'll die knowing you're right, that's all that matters yeah?
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

  21. #21
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    Chicken dude, are you dredging up year old posts just to rekindle a dead debate? I thinks you need to go ride more.
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  22. #22
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    look a few posts up
    buzzing a cyclist in the manner you describe could be considered harassment
    this thread was resurrected with a topical post

    if you buzzed me like that and i caught up with you, the cops would be the least of your worries
    Ease up internet tough guy, your last name Lesnar? I doubt anyone on this board would intentionally buzz another cyclist, but there are times, more than not, when I see road riders in dangerous situations / traffic areas riding on or over the white line with no regard to what is going on around them or taking into consideration that MAYBE the next car in line coming at them at 55 is a 85 year old who gets too spooked to move over &.....well. Just saying, it's both parties responsibility to watch out for each other, car & biker.

    Now, time to crack another beer & head to da pool

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    I'm going down the loooong hill on 93 going north, down towards the light at the turnoff to Eldorado Springs Blvd. There's always a roadie there doing maybe 35 where us drivers are doing 55. There's inches to spare to the biker who's hugging the white line on the right, there's loads of traffic in the other lane going the other direction (south) so it's not like we can all go into the other lane to give the roadie some mythical "law defined" space.

    So, what's the law? Is passing this rider with not really much clearance OK? If the guy hits a rut and swerves in front of me am I technically at fault? Hope it doesn't happen but someone has mentioned that "the law" requires I give this rider some law-defined space for him to swerve around obstacles. Two things are for sure in that scenario: he'll ram into me or somebody else and he'll be in a world of hurt.

    No one is more considerate of a biker on the road than I am but the last thing on my mind was slowing down to give this guy some space if I can't go into the other lane to do so.
    It doesn't matter what the law is. No don't laugh, I'm serious; if you hit a guy on a bike, and you're in your car or truck, you're going to get sued. I suggest giving them all the room they want.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetigirl View Post
    There is no friggin way I'd ride into work on this road!:
    This. Riding on 93 is just plain dumb. I hate even crossing that road on Community Ditch. I question the sanity of those who choose to ride it same as those who ride down 28th Street in Boulder when there is a perfectly good bike lane that runs parallel.

    I still always give lots of room - even for the dumb ones - but ultimately you can't fix stupid.

  26. #26
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    As someone who has been mountain biking for some time and just started road biking, I can assure you its quite uncomfortable to be on a road with no shoulder. Please just slow down and give the guy some room. Do you really care what the people behind you think? I'm reasonably confident the cyclist would have preferred to be as far away from you as possible. And the wobble comes from the nervous look over the shoulder to see if you are about to be whacked.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by stinkpad View Post
    Ease up internet tough guy, your last name Lesnar?
    negative, on both counts
    Quote Originally Posted by stinkpad View Post
    I doubt anyone on this board would intentionally buzz another cyclist,
    reading comprehension much? xcwannabe posted up just that, 55 and a foot away is a buzzing
    Quote Originally Posted by stinkpad View Post
    but there are times, more than not, when I see road riders in dangerous situations / traffic areas riding on or over the white line with no regard to what is going on around them
    so, attempting to avoid broken buttweiper bottles and crossing over the sacred cow white line is somehow having no regard to what is going on around them? you also need to read up on the vehicle code, pal
    Quote Originally Posted by stinkpad View Post
    Now, time to crack another beer & head to da pool
    yay for you

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndecentExposure View Post
    Chicken dude, are you dredging up year old posts just to rekindle a dead debate? I thinks you need to go ride more.
    i was going to start a new thread about lost angeles leading the way by passing their cycling anti-harassment ordinance, but became incensed that someone who may consider themselves a "cyclist" has such gall and verve to consider their obvious harassment of another cyclist being somehow alright

    my posting of that article is on-topic as far as both this thread and forum go

    believe it or not, there are some people on here who may actually *gasp* ride their bikes on a roadway to get to a trailhead

    besides all of that, starting new threads for evely piddly little piece of news is trite and boring, as well as uber-newbish

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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndecentExposure View Post
    Chicken dude, are you dredging up year old posts just to rekindle a dead debate? I thinks you need to go ride more.
    nah....15 more and (angels singing)......

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  31. #31
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    Why is this so hard to figure out? A cyclist has the same rights and responsibilities as a motor vehicle, so effectively to other drivers, they are a motor vehicle. So let's look at the original situation a slightly different way:

    I'm going down the loooong hill on 93 going north, down towards the light at the turnoff to Eldorado Springs Blvd. There's always a driver there doing maybe 35 where us drivers are doing 55. There's inches to spare to the driver who's hugging the white line on the right, there's loads of traffic in the other lane going the other direction (south) so it's not like we can all go into the other lane to give the driver some mythical "law defined" space.
    Pretty damn simple isn't it? Whether it's a bike or a car driving 20 mph under the speed limit, it makes no difference. Wait until it's safe to pass, and then pass.

    The unfortunate thing I've noticed with this thread (and others) is that even cyclists don't seem to think that "bikes belong."

  32. #32
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    Why would anyone ride a road bike? Last time I checked this was a mountain biking forum?? Moderators, can you move this to the proper forum?
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  33. #33
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    Most true 'cyclists' I know ride the road often, whether it is riding to a trailhead on a mountain bike, commuting to work or school or the store, or riding a <gasp> road bike when the trails are too damn muddy to ride. I too am a bit disappointed that any mountain biker would digress into the non-productive and boring mtb vs. roadie thing. We are ALL cyclists. Debates like this provide fodder for the 'anti-cyclists', who would love to see the roads reserved for their Hummers and SUVs. Lighten up folks and share the road!
    Ok, here's the deal. I have a hangover. Who knows what that means?

  34. #34
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    As for "why" people ride that section of 93, that is a section of the old Morgul-Bismark race (think: American Flyers)... so it's no surprise that there are going to be a steady stream of people riding it, there is a lot history, nostalgia, etc. tied up with that route.

    Of course that makes it even more perplexing as to why Boulder County, CDOT or whomever hasn't done something to make that section of road at least a little bit safer for cyclists and automobiles alike. I absolutely hate driving that section of road, much less riding it.

    And unless you're a volunteer fireman or doctor on your way to save a nursery full of babies, just slow the f*** down for 30 seconds until you can safely pass and spare everyone the drama.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by fcrider View Post
    Most true 'cyclists' I know ride the road often, whether it is riding to a trailhead on a mountain bike, commuting to work or school or the store, or riding a <gasp> road bike when the trails are too damn muddy to ride. I too am a bit disappointed that any mountain biker would digress into the non-productive and boring mtb vs. roadie thing. We are ALL cyclists. Debates like this provide fodder for the 'anti-cyclists', who would love to see the roads reserved for their Hummers and SUVs. Lighten up folks and share the road!
    lighten up Francis, just trying to add a little humor to the thread..
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  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    No one is more considerate of a biker on the road than I am but the last thing on my mind was slowing down to give this guy some space if I can't go into the other lane to do so.
    You can't be the most considerate driver yet not think to slow down. It seems you're contradicting yourself. I know you tend to be a positive contributor to these forums, and I thank you for that, but I don't know about this post. I don't want to judge too harshly, but why was slowing down the last thing on your mind. I would think it would have been the first thing. See biker on road, slow down. Who cares if there are cars on your azz? I'm sure you would have hit the brakes if there was a car going 20mph slower, so why not a biker. If you would have had to slam on the brakes, you probably weren't paying attention. The biker has as much right to be there as you do in your car, which I'm sure you're aware of, regardless if you think he has a death wish. Just slow down and pass safely. It wouldn't have been more than a 30 second inconvenience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ebry74 View Post
    You can't be the most considerate driver yet not think to slow down. It seems you're contradicting yourself. I know you tend to be a positive contributor to these forums, and I thank you for that, but I don't know about this post. I don't want to judge too harshly, but why was slowing down the last thing on your mind. I would think it would have been the first thing. See biker on road, slow down. Who cares if there are cars on your azz? I'm sure you would have hit the brakes if there was a car going 20mph slower, so why not a biker. If you would have had to slam on the brakes, you probably weren't paying attention. The biker has as much right to be there as you do in your car, which I'm sure you're aware of, regardless if you think he has a death wish. Just slow down and pass safely. It wouldn't have been more than a 30 second inconvenience.
    You had to be there. If you think my reaction to that three second encounter was not what you'd consider perfect, think of the non-biker driver who is not, in fact, looking for bikers on the road and, in fact, resents them when they do encounter them. This roadie was putting himself in jeopardy not by folks like me but the other 99% of drivers out there.

    And again, I didn't dredge this thread up, somebody else did. I haven't had an experience like that since then.
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CombatMutt View Post
    It doesn't matter what the law is. No don't laugh, I'm serious; if you hit a guy on a bike, and you're in your car or truck, you're going to get sued. I suggest giving them all the room they want.
    I'm sorry, but it matters very much what the law is. We are a country of laws, not men. The rule of law is what really distinguishes the United States and a handful of other successful countries from the majority of the countries of the world. If it is not important what the law is, be it the law regarding cyclists using the road or whatever, we as a people and a nation are in a lot of trouble.

    If a lawsuit is initiated, the substantive law matters because the losing side will likely have to pay all of the prevailing side's costs. Also, if the losing side had no substantial justification in it's side of the case, the losing side might also have to pay the prevailing side's attorneys fees. Moreover, if you broke the law, your insurance company won't be too happy and that will affect your rates. Of course, if you don't hurt someone, either intentionally or accidentally, this won't be an issue.

    In the meantime, it wouldn't hurt to know the law: http://colobikelaw.com/law.php
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pabs View Post
    I'm sorry, but it matters very much what the law is. We are a country of laws, not men. The rule of law is what really distinguishes the United States and a handful of other successful countries from the majority of the countries of the world. If it is not important what the law is, be it the law regarding cyclists using the road or whatever, we as a people and a nation are in a lot of trouble.

    If a lawsuit is initiated, the substantive law matters because the losing side will likely have to pay all of the prevailing side's costs. Also, if the losing side had no substantial justification in it's side of the case, the losing side might also have to pay the prevailing side's attorneys fees. Moreover, if you broke the law, your insurance company won't be too happy and that will affect your rates. Of course, if you don't hurt someone, either intentionally or accidentally, this won't be an issue.
    I'm not a lawyer. Everyone of my family members is. Trust me, you hit a bicyclist, it doesn't matter what the law is.

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    I read the entire thread and no one pointed out that the speed limit on that stretch of 93 is 45 mph, not 55. Forty-five.

    I've driven that stretch thousands of times, ridden it hundreds.

    I go 40 down that stretch on my bicycle. I have numbnuts pass me in an unsafe manner all the time. You know what? You all suck. It is a ONE mile stretch of road. Since most people are so f*&king stupid these days they can't do math, I'll do it for you:

    One mile at 45 MPH = (60/45) * 60 = 80 seconds.

    One mile at 40 MPH = (60/40) * 60 = 90 seconds.

    TEN SECONDS.

    Even if the rider is riding their brakes and is only going 20, it would cost you an entire one minute and forty seconds. 1:40.

    Chill out. If you get stuck behind a gravel truck leaving the gravel pit on the county line do you make an unsafe pass?

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    There was some organized roadie ride going over Swan Mtn and up Rt 9 today. Made me embarrassed to be a cyclist. A bunch of fat slow pokes in goofy clothes making a point of riding out in the lane instead of on the shoulder. Despite wearing bike clothes while driving to a bike race with a bike in the back of my van I found myself muttering, "F***ing bikers."
    Am I the only roadie who makes it a priority to not impede traffic?
    Keep the Country country.

  42. #42
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    ouch that hurt

    Quote Originally Posted by mtbklutz View Post
    Huh?

    Just slow down and wait 30 seconds until it's safe to pass. Don't buzz the guy and worry less about the legalities of a potential accident and more about avoiding one in the first place. My fault or not, I know how I'd feel if I killed a cyclist or anyone for that matter. For what it's worth I think 93 desperately needs a bath path.
    Yea, but if someone is going to ask that question in the first place there is a pretty good chance that you can lump them in the same class as John Q public. (since "roadie, etc" is just as bigoted as what JohnQ does with all athletes/damn bikers on his trail/road every day.)

    ...and also a pretty good chance they haven't quite evolved enough to get it even if you tell them.
    wish I had never opened this thread, some much needed brain cells just died.
    Last edited by glovemtb; 07-25-2011 at 06:03 AM.

  43. #43
    zrm
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lelandjt View Post
    There was some organized roadie ride going over Swan Mtn and up Rt 9 today. Made me embarrassed to be a cyclist. A bunch of fat slow pokes in goofy clothes making a point of riding out in the lane instead of on the shoulder. Despite wearing bike clothes while driving to a bike race with a bike in the back of my van I found myself muttering, "F***ing bikers."
    Am I the only roadie who makes it a priority to not impede traffic?
    Courage Classic. Great event.

    I'm always glad to see overweight people on bicycles, it means they're out trying to do something about their situation. Events like Courage Classic, RTR, etc provide a great, supportive environment for folks like that to get out and push themselves and maybe change their lives for the better.

    Personally, I don't care what people wear. I'm sure there are people who think your, or mine, or the skater kid down the street wardrobe is silly but so what? You'd like to think folks have better things to occupy their minds with.

    It's not like there wasn't plenty of warning that the event was going on and Swan would be swarming with cyclists for a few hours that day Going around the other side could have easily saved you the aggravation if it was a big deal for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CombatMutt View Post
    I'm not a lawyer. Everyone of my family members is. Trust me, you hit a bicyclist, it doesn't matter what the law is.
    If you are saying that if you hit a cyclist it "doesn't matter" what the law is to the limited extent that there will be likely some negative consequences for you as the driver, I would perhaps agree. However, in addition to what I said before, the law matters because it forms that background assumptions and leverage for settlement talks to resolve the resulting conflict, with or without a lawsuit. For example, there will likely be fewer consequences for you as the driver if the cyclist was also at fault.

    I apologize, but I don't trust your assertions because you have family members who are attorneys. There are no lawyers in my family except for me, and my family members don't necessarily know anything more about the law simply because I'm in the family. You don't have to trust me, but I would suggest we all take heed from the general thrust of your opinion that we don't injure others. In that we can agree.
    "Fact is only what you believe; fact and fiction work as a team." Jack Johnson

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    Quote Originally Posted by zrm View Post
    It's not like there wasn't plenty of warning that the event was going on and Swan would be swarming with cyclists for a few hours that day Going around the other side could have easily saved you the aggravation if it was a big deal for you.
    That's not my point. Riding slowly in the lane on Rt 9 could piss off drivers who will later take it out on other riders. It just seems like a simple matter of courtesy and self respect to not force drivers behind you to slow down, whether you're on a bike or in a car. I guess I'm one of the few people who feel this way.
    Keep the Country country.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lelandjt View Post
    That's not my point. Riding slowly in the lane on Rt 9 could piss off drivers who will later take it out on other riders. It just seems like a simple matter of courtesy and self respect to not force drivers behind you to slow down, whether you're on a bike or in a car. I guess I'm one of the few people who feel this way.
    This just seems to be the case in organized event type rides. I did E-Rock earlier this year and it was the same thing. It seemed like the slower someone was the further into the middle of the lane they were. I think most of them just get caught up in the "event" and forget all rules of the road, and many of them tend to be inexperienced riders.

    These events don't take place every day though, so I think a little patience is in order.

  47. #47
    zrm
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lelandjt View Post
    That's not my point. Riding slowly in the lane on Rt 9 could piss off drivers who will later take it out on other riders. It just seems like a simple matter of courtesy and self respect to not force drivers behind you to slow down, whether you're on a bike or in a car. I guess I'm one of the few people who feel this way.
    No, I understand what you're saying and agree in general. When I ride on the road I usually 1) avoid high traffic areas with little or no shoulder and 2) stay as far to the right as practical. I've never been real big on the whole "I have a right to so much space and I'm going to take it" mentality. While I understand the argument and it has some validity, preservation of life and limb takes priority.

    All that said, when there's a big event like the courage classic or RTR on the roads, the dynamic is different - lots more cyclists using the same amount of road. I treat it the same as if I was trying to thread my way through any other large public gathering - with patience and a different set of expectations. Or, as mentioned before, if possible, just avoid that stretch of road tell everyone is through. For instance, when the TBP was coming through this year I was coming back from Denver. Sometimes I like to take the old Hwy and go over Loveland Pass just for the scenic value but knowing the the TBP was on the road I stuck with good old I-70.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit View Post
    ...TEN SECONDS.
    Multiply that by 100 cars trying to get down the road and you have gridlock.

    I never buzz a cyclist with a car, even an asshat cyclist, but to the whole "what's you're hurry, just slow down" roadie crowd - you do realize on a busy road it's not just one short slowdown right? I can't count the number of times I've sat in Boulder Canyon stacked 20 cars deep behind a cyclist that doesn't want to use the shoulder. It can take half the drive down before you get up to the position you can pass and if one driver is a tourist you could be stuck the whole way. No, I'm not on my way to save a busload of orphans, but I certainly don't appreciate a bike adding 50% to my commute time just because "they can".. and neither does anyone else.

    Most the time the slower cars figure out to pull over and let the faster traffic by when it stacks up, why can't the cyclists?

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    No one is more considerate of a biker on the road than I am
    I beg to differ, your posts say otherwise. The fact that it's an old thread is irrelevant.

    That's not to say that you are inconsiderate, I don't know you well enough to say that.

    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit View Post
    I read the entire thread and no one pointed out that the speed limit on that stretch of 93 is 45 mph, not 55. Forty-five.

    I've driven that stretch thousands of times, ridden it hundreds.

    I go 40 down that stretch on my bicycle. I have numbnuts pass me in an unsafe manner all the time. You know what? You all suck. It is a ONE mile stretch of road. Since most people are so f*&king stupid these days they can't do math, I'll do it for you:

    One mile at 45 MPH = (60/45) * 60 = 80 seconds.

    One mile at 40 MPH = (60/40) * 60 = 90 seconds.

    TEN SECONDS.

    Even if the rider is riding their brakes and is only going 20, it would cost you an entire one minute and forty seconds. 1:40.

    Chill out. If you get stuck behind a gravel truck leaving the gravel pit on the county line do you make an unsafe pass?
    Actually, though you sound so certain that it is a 45mph limit, it may very well be 55, not 45. It drops to 45 just before the light, shortly before it becomes two lanes heading north, as I'm sure you well know. Since the OP's post made it clear that there was only one lane going north (and didn't mention the almost immediate widening to 2 lanes), it's unlikely that the speed limit was 45. I'm guessing he mentioned the light at the bottom of the hill to make it clear where this was generally speaking, not to indicate he was at the light.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by thump View Post
    <snip>
    Most the time the slower cars figure out to pull over and let the faster traffic by when it stacks up, why can't the cyclists?
    It's actually the law. They are supposed to pull over when 5(?) vehicles are behind... something like that.

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