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  1. #1
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    Two top mountain-bike racers face impersonation charges

    http://www.denverpost.com/ci_15043329

    Is this over the top?

    Two women are being charged with felony impersonation over one racing in the other's place at Leadville.

    Apparently one woman was injured, so rather than wasting the fee, the other woman rode. Unfortunately, she managed to get 2nd, someone (they are not sure who) collected the prizes, and now they are both facing felonies.

    I started racing at Leadville long before there was a lottery or any of that. There is no way I could ever imagine it weirding out to this level.

  2. #2
    rubber side down
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    Definitely over the top. This is ridiculous. Chlouber ought to be ashamed of what he's done to the race. He bends his own rules to get Armstrongs guys in after the race was more than full... Non-refundable $250 entry fee is ridiculous. Deadline for entry is in Feb...so you can't often tell what shape you'll be in by race time, much less injury free. I did the same thing for the Triple Bypass...was sicker than a dog when the ride rolled around..then I sold my spot to a friend.

    Felony charges for this is more than idiotic. Nice work Ken.

    R

    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit
    http://www.denverpost.com/ci_15043329

    Is this over the top?

    Two women are being charged with felony impersonation over one racing in the other's place at Leadville.

    Apparently one woman was injured, so rather than wasting the fee, the other woman rode. Unfortunately, she managed to get 2nd, someone (they are not sure who) collected the prizes, and now they are both facing felonies.

    I started racing at Leadville long before there was a lottery or any of that. There is no way I could ever imagine it weirding out to this level.

  3. #3
    zrm
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    Pretty silly to make it a criminal matter. I understand some of the reasons why promoters have no transfer - no refund policies, (although don't necessarily agree with all of them)I I can't imagine though, what Clouber thinks anyone has to gain by pressing charges.

    IMO Leadville is way overrated as a 100 mile race anyway. Unique scene and all that, I suppose that's worth something, but as a mountain bike race it's not that great.

  4. #4
    Your bike is incorrigible
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    Leadville 100 has turned into more of a road race than anything resembling a mountain bike race. You know there is no way they could have made the switch out in the open. That would never have worked. So, instead, they do it on the sly and get burned.

    I foresee some boycotting of the race in the near future.

  5. #5
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    I think these ladies are lame, it's made VERY clear to everyone that you can't do this. If they were so interested in making it right why didn't she approach Ken about the injury before the race? She didn't have a problem with pulling strings to get in. What would have happened if Lyall had gotten hurt on the course, would Ken then by responsible for her?

    I think a felony is harsh, but you know these are adults that chose to do this.

  6. #6
    zrm
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    Quote Originally Posted by mateomtb
    I think these ladies are lame, it's made VERY clear to everyone that you can't do this. If they were so interested in making it right why didn't she approach Ken about the injury before the race? She didn't have a problem with pulling strings to get in. What would have happened if Lyall had gotten hurt on the course, would Ken then by responsible for her?

    I think a felony is harsh, but you know these are adults that chose to do this.

    Personally, I think a lot of races need to have a better refund/transfer policy, (somewhere between draconian and so liberal that it becomes a huge PITA) but you should know and accept the rules when you sign on the line. No doubt if the reports are accurate it's not cool to do what they did the way they did, but I don't see anything to gain by anyone to make it a criminal matter. DQ, ban, sure, that's the race directors discretion, but does the DA really need to be bothered with this?

    Caveat: There is probably a lot more here than is being published in the paper or spread on the interwebz.

  7. #7
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    Well, they'll probably plead to a misdemeanor, pay a fine and be done with it.

    As the race organizer, I wouldn't think it's over the top. If she hadn't race to won, no one would have been the wiser, but since she had to go for the gold... and cost two people podium positions (#3 would have been #2 and #4, #3) the impact was beyond just the number fraud.

    And consider this... had the illegal racer crashed and been seriously injured or even killed, what do you think she and/or her family would do to the race organizers? Massive lawsuits, possibly costing them their insurance coverage.

    This is way beyond just one person using another's race numer/entry and for a national level race, they do have to do something to show they are serious about fraud and safety. And maybe even to meet their insurance providers requirements for continued coverage.

    Over the top? Maybe. Will they be convicted of a felony? Highly doubtful. Probably USA Cycling should chime in with a suspension from racing, too. That would probably be the most effective deterrent for a serious racer!
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  8. #8
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    Getting convicted of a felony is no joke. That can make employment extremely difficult in the future. As in goodbye corporate america, hello lawn care. Why would the race organizers pursue a felony charge unless they genuinely want them convicted? C'mon its a mountain bike race! Probation and job loss because of racing under someone else's number? Someone is taking themselves a little too seriously I think.
    Last edited by Ansible; 05-08-2010 at 05:03 PM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guyechka
    Leadville 100 has turned into more of a road race than anything resembling a mountain bike race.
    Hasn't it pretty much always been something not resembling a mt bike race? That's always been my take.

  10. #10
    Rigid in Evergreen
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    Just getting formally CHARGED with a felony is no joke. Unless there is some sort of fake ID or identity theft ring behind this, Mr. Race Organizer needs to take a chill pil and just issue the DQ or perma-ban (not to mention rethink his policies and make them more rider friendly).

  11. #11
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    Yeah, Choubler and the DA need to chill out. Wasting tax money on this, a private race for (mostly) amateurs? Choubler bends his own rules, if the entrants are famous, but calls for a felony prosecution when a racer bends the rules to avoid throwing away the $250 non-refundable fee? Remember- the women won zero money and only got a trophy (which was returned). Just ban them and/or have them give $$ to a local charity and be done with it. But a felony prosecution that will be reported on every employment app for the rest of their lives? Really Ken?

    I have attended the last 3 races and was planning on returning to watch this year but the organizers are out of control. A few weeks ago, they posted on their website that if you pay/donate $2,000 to their charity, they will let you in the race and bypass the lottery (ie bend the rules). Or, if you pay the approx $2,000 to Carmichael's training camp, you get in and bypass the lottery (ie bend the rules). Or if you are famous (Lance, Levi, etc), you can bypass the lottery (ie bend the rules). But if you get in legitimately, but are injured in the months after paying the non-refundable fee, well, you are screwed. Well, the organizers can contiune to do this since it is their race but I won't be supporting it anymore.

  12. #12
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    It will probably keep me from ever going to leadville for any reason, not just the race....BR

  13. #13
    holding back the darkness
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    The Leadville Race has lost what it was. The first time I did it I was very impressed with the community feel of it. The pre-race spaghetti dinner where volunteers wouldn't let me out the door without at least 2 free beers in my pockets. The guy who tried to give me his gloves when I realized I left mine in the car while on the start line.
    Last year there were F*ing helicopters. And don't even me started on the whole "buy your way in via Carmicheal" BS.
    It used to be something more. Something actually real that you could take away with you for the rest of the year.
    Now it's just another stupid race about money.
    I feel for these women. Makes me want to get about 300 people together and poach the race.

  14. #14
    zrm
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    Quote Originally Posted by BenR
    It will probably keep me from ever going to leadville for any reason, not just the race....BR

    Why? Ken Clouber is one person who lives in Leadville. To suggest a "boycott" of Leadville for the actionsof one person is about as over the top as Cloubers action.

  15. #15
    skillz to pay billz
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    Quote Originally Posted by subliminalshiver
    Last year there were F*ing helicopters.

    I'm guessing for the movie?





    Why didn't the girl just back off her pace to avoid the podium? crazy.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by nOOby
    I'm guessing for the movie?





    Why didn't the girl just back off her pace to avoid the podium? crazy.
    My guess is that she didn't know she was going to podium. That race is a mess...It's impossible to tell where you are in your group, or what group the person ahead of you is in.

  17. #17
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    Anyone even know how many women were in the 40-49 category? I am guessing not too many. These are women in their 40s, racing because they enjoy it, not women hoping to move up into pro racing.

    BTW, has anyone noticed that the organizers changed the website this year so previous years results can't be found. The results also contained splits, which was useful information. Wonder why they removed this section.

  18. #18
    skillz to pay billz
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    makes sense, also I didn't think about the 40-49 cat. of course you can't tell where you are in the group.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by zrm
    Why? Ken Clouber is one person who lives in Leadville. To suggest a "boycott" of Leadville for the actionsof one person is about as over the top as Cloubers action.
    Not a boycott, just no desire to visit the place now...BR

  20. #20
    Towlie for prez
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkaredShtles
    Hasn't it pretty much always been something not resembling a mt bike race? That's always been my take.
    OH PL-EASE Gimmie a f'n break.Have you done the race yourself? I am tired of people who havent done this race complaining/*****ing about it.Mostly because they are secretly mad for not making the lottery.Leadville was one of the first ultra endurance races in the country,and continues to be one of the toughest.No,it doesnt have a lot of "singletrack",But it makes up for that with high elevation climbs.There isnt a lot of singletrack in the Leadville area,but lots of fs roads that climb climb climb.People have tried to do the race on cross bikes with less than stellar results.Of course as the sport has evolved,new races (ie Breck) continue to push the envelope w/more climbing singletrack,etc...And although the race has changed(a lot) it still remains the best organized,funnest(imo) ultra's out there.The town still rallies at 6:30 am to cheer on the racers all day,and the vibe leading up to the race is great.And regarding the woman who "cheated",you deserve what you get for having the stupidity to accept a medal in front of 1000 + people in a race you knowingly "scammed".....Rant over.

  21. #21
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    Brazelton bent the rules to get herself in the race, remember she didn't make the lottery to begin with, she should hold herself to a higher standard knowing she got special treatment. Plus the women racing in her place wasn't even in the age group, she's in her 30's. Have any of you ever won in something competitive? There is nothing like that buzz from taking your spot on the podium and since this is an amateur race and nothing more than a simple "road ride", that's the prize. Someone who followed the rules got ripped off because of the lameness of these women. You guys also know that Ken isn't the one who decides this is a felony charge right? Per the race packets if you are caught violating this rule they will consider it theft of services and notify the sheriff. That's what he did. Law enforcement came up with this charge bases upon the law. Remember these are the guys up there tazering kids and arresting the fire department during 911 calls. I also wonder if how they are treating season ski pass poaching has a lot to do with it?

    For all the people on here always rooting for the LBS and small biz etc. I don't know why everyone gives Ken so much crap. He's a local guy who was able to build a successful business off of bike racing? How many people are able to do that?! I'm sure none of us in our business or personal lives are taking any kinds of liberties with people who we do biz with, or owe us favors or just because we like someone. How many times has your LBS dude hooked you up because you drop off a 12 pack now and then, and the next guy through the door pays full price?

    In the end I agree this is all pretty silly. I'm going to go ride my bike now.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by subliminalshiver
    I feel for these women. Makes me want to get about 300 people together and poach the race.
    just out of curiosity...

    would you get in a lot of trouble for riding the course at the same time as the race?
    with the exception of the dam crossing, it's all public/forest service roads...i believe.
    or do the race directors somehow reserve all the roads to registered racer rider only traffic during the day of the race?

  23. #23
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    I would assume you could ride it, even events such as the NYC marathon let runners run who did not get officially drawn...The just don't get an official time or photo at the finish...BR

  24. #24
    !Vamos, flaco!
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    Quote Originally Posted by shoulderfu
    OH PL-EASE Gimmie a f'n break.Have you done the race yourself? I am tired of people who havent done this race complaining/*****ing about it.Mostly because they are secretly mad for not making the lottery.Leadville was one of the first ultra endurance races in the country,and continues to be one of the toughest.No,it doesnt have a lot of "singletrack",But it makes up for that with high elevation climbs.There isnt a lot of singletrack in the Leadville area,but lots of fs roads that climb climb climb.People have tried to do the race on cross bikes with less than stellar results.Of course as the sport has evolved,new races (ie Breck) continue to push the envelope w/more climbing singletrack,etc...And although the race has changed(a lot) it still remains the best organized,funnest(imo) ultra's out there.The town still rallies at 6:30 am to cheer on the racers all day,and the vibe leading up to the race is great.And regarding the woman who "cheated",you deserve what you get for having the stupidity to accept a medal in front of 1000 + people in a race you knowingly "scammed".....Rant over.
    I didn't understand the comment as a "complaint." Pretty much everyone I have ever spoken with about the Leadville 100 has had a similar take. Everyone agrees it's challenging, but almost without exception people I've spoke with have always thrown in the caveat about the lack of singletrack and the minimal trails. I mean, if someone said to you, "hey, let's go on the mountain bike ride," and the route consisted of no or very few trails, I imagine you'd have appreciated a bit more explanation.
    "Fact is only what you believe; fact and fiction work as a team." Jack Johnson

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by FTC Rider
    But a felony prosecution that will be reported on every employment app for the rest of their lives? Really Ken?
    very few applications require the reporting of prosecutions. usually only convictions. and they are unlikely to be convicted of a felony.

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