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Santa Cruz Tallboy?

9K views 109 replies 24 participants last post by  Pau11y 
#1 ·
Who rides a Santa Cruz Tallboy here?

Do you like it and have you ever wished for more travel?

Backstory: I'm finally in a position to get a new trail bike. I would like to keep around $5k but can go higher (say 6-7k) for the right bike.

Most of my regular riding is at night on Marshall Mesa over to Springbrook so it is a lot of XC type trails. However I also wanted something more trail worthy for the rock fest we can have higher up. In mileage terms I would say my riding is 70% XC, 20% trail (whatever that means) and 10% AM.

I weren't sure if a 29er was my thing and I was holding out for a 650b trail bike but I must say the 29ers do fit me well and I am not wanting to wait for Fall to see how the 1st gen 650b trail bikes stack up.

So I was looking at the Tallboy LT carbon at Sports Garage and they are talking me down to the regular Tallboy Carbon stating it would be better for my general riding style and terrain.

So if you have a regular Tallboy have you ever wished for more travel or is the 135mm LTc overkill for my generally XC type riding. I will be test riding both.

And before you ask I don't want a separate hard tail for XC and a trail bike for gnar. I've had that before and I could never decide on the bike to take when the trails were a bit of everything.

I want one bike. One bike to rule them all!

:D
 
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#2 ·
I demo'd the TalboyLTc and don't think you should let someone talk you out of it without trying for yourself. I did one fire road ride with it and one trip up Bergen. I never once thought I needed something less travel to improve efficency and the extra beef was welcome when it was needed. The bike was really comfotable and pedaled great. Ultimately, I bought another 26", but I have nothing but positive things to say about the LTc.
 
#3 ·
My buddy rides a Tallboy and loves it. We live at the base of Apex and ride pretty hard on the "rock fest" that is out our back doors. Given that 80-90% of his riding is on those more techy/ rocky trails, he has definitely wished he had an LTc, but if his riding were more balanced your way, I think he would be more than happy. Again, he loves his bike, but has sometimes be craving a little more cush. Also, fwiw, he's had to replace the grease fittings and the lower sway bar a couple of times. I think SC bikes are awesome, but putting grease fittings on the bottom of the bottom bracket is just poor design.
 
#6 ·
I was looking at 29ers earlier this year and thought the Tall Boy was too XC only for me. I like a slacker head angle and a 5" bike appealed to me more than a 4". So that left the Blur TRC. Not as aggressive as a 6" enduro style bike but will handle that and serious XC rides, but it was a 26" So I went with a Specialized Stumpy 29er. Then 3 months later SC comes out with the Tall Boy LT. Both have 135mm travel, same head angle, etc.

I like the 5" 29er since it is not a full on XC bike. For me the only real difference is FSR vs VPP.
 
#11 ·
Well, you have a point, but I'll throw in here:

It's easier than it has ever been to spend more than $5K on a mountain bike. Especially if you're going to do something speshul. Used to be a very good fork was 4-500 bones. Now it's dead easy to spend close to a grand on just a fork.

I'm counting pennies on bike stuff these days now that I've left the bike shop world. But if I was going to throw down coin to replace what I'm riding now, it would be super easy to spend 5-6K.

In case anybody out there wants to make my simple dream come true:

LenzSport Mammoth
Fox Talas 34 29er fork
Full XT 3-ring group
hand built wheelset on a new pair of DT 240s hubs

PM me with info about when and where I can pick it up, and there will be a really nice case of beer in it for you. And a heart felt thank you.
 
#9 ·
As a guy who recently rode a 100mm 29er for 2 years, and now is on a 130mm 29er, I definitely like the 130 better. I put some more $$ into the 130mm bike and they weigh the same. In your price range you can get the weight to be very similar too, it's just a matter of what you like.

so it's a riding style question. You're coming off an old bike, so a couple test rides would be in order particularly if you are going to keep this one as long as your current bike :)
 
#13 ·
As TomP states it is very easy to exceed $5k these days. In fact I originaly though that $5K would be plenty but I have kind of been horrified at the price of bikes these days. Just when did $1000 for a fork and $2600 for a frame become the norm?

Still my last bike probably cost around $3-4k in mid 90's money and I've had that bike near 15 years so I got my money's worth out of it. This bike will probably be with me for 10+ years as well so there are some things I don't want to compromize on. It has to be reasonable weight, so looking at carbon, repairable - carbon again, Shimano XT with XTR rear mech, decent wheelset and a non single pivot rear suspension (looking at DW-link, VPP etc). I want components that should stand the test of time and not make me feel like I need to upgrade them a couple of years down the road. I have money now. In a couple or years I may not.

It seems the bikes I'm most interested are slipping over that $5k mark...Santa Cruz, Intense, Pivot...
 
#19 ·
kerryn, I have been trying to talk my friend/acquaintance THE GIANT into coming out from lurk mode, and getting a handle to start posting, if nothing else, just to help you here. But doesn't look like that's happening, so I will speak for him.
He Tried a Tall Boy and LIKED it a lot, but not enough to buy, then tried a Tall Boy LT (not carbon) and LOVED it a lot. Sprang for it, and you can't get the guy off a bike now.
I am probably screwing the story up some how, but that's the jist.

On another note, I just added up all the MTBs I have had in my life, and they total $4398.
(6 MTBs in 22 years) -
In 1990 - bught a Raleigh - $399
In 1991 - bought a Haro - $699
In 1995ish - bought a used GT Zaskar - $400
In 2001 - bought a Specialized - $1200
In 2002 - bought a Specialized (crash replacement - long story - shop did me a favor, not an actual crash) - $700
2009 - bought a Mongoose - $1000

Man, it sucks being poor.
 
#20 ·
<snip>
On another note, I just added up all the MTBs I have had in my life, and they total $4398.
(6 MTBs in 22 years) -
In 1990 - bught a Raleigh - $399
In 1991 - bought a Haro - $699
In 1995ish - bought a used GT Zaskar - $400
In 2001 - bought a Specialized - $1200
In 2002 - bought a Specialized (crash replacement - long story - shop did me a favor, not an actual crash) - $700
2009 - boughth a Mongoose - $1000

Man, it sucks being poor.
Hey - I like this game.

1991 - Giant ATX-760 - $500
1996 - Trek Y-22 (used) - $1200
2001 - Giant XtC-Team (used) - $500 (net after insurance claim on Trek)
2010 - Giant Reign 1 - $2600

$4800 total for 21 years of quality rides. And in the end - it's *all* about the rides... :cool:
 
#23 ·
K,
My $0.02...go however big you need to to make yourself happy in the next decade.5 of riding you'll do. If it's a $6-7k TBLTc, then so be it! And if any of these guys offer to subsidize your purchase, then I'd listen to their suggestion to talk you out of what you want. Until they do (especially SS), I'd tell them to get stuffed, because it's you who'll ultimately be living w/ your purchase. I think they're just jealous that you can and they can't. :D
 
#37 · (Edited)
As an FYI, after riding the Tallboy LTc this weekend I determined it's not the bike for me. Good bike yes, but ultimately I didn't like the wagon wheel feel of it. It felt like I was steering a bus.

It gripped well, was a demon downhill (I got at 2nd overall time on one downhill Strava segment and PRs on other downhill segments) but on undulating terrain and uphills it was only so so. I felt the weight of the wheels slowing me down, and ultimately it just wasn't that much "fun". Also, and this was surprising for me, but I have never had so many pedal strikes in my life and that put a downer on the ride feel.

Things I did like were the suspension. Hugely impressed with the VPP at the back. Now I should probably compare it against a DW-link like and that of the Yeti SB66... Also I did like the rollover of the big wheels. I rode up some stuff I usually just walk so I do see advantage in a wheel bigger than 26 but not quite as big as 29.

So, I still think a 650b trail bike will be my ultimate ride (4.5-5 inch being the sweet spot). One thing I did notice is that my current Boulder Starship while 15 years old, when compared to state of the art moden trail bikes, still rides superbly for such an old design. Yes not as efficient as the VPP, but not that bad either.

So under my new consideration are: Santa Cruz TRc and the Intense Carbine. Both of these bikes can run 26er now and be converted to 650b later on. Alas, 650b won't fit on the Yeti. The wise thing would be to just wait till Fall but I am not sure I want to.
 
#38 ·
So under my new consideration are: Santa Cruz TRc and the Intense Carbine. Both of these bikes can run 26er now and be converted to 650b later on. Alas, 650b won't fit on the Yeti. The wise thing would be to just wait till Fall but I am not sure I want to.
Don't forget the Ibis Mojo HD -- fully 650b compatible in the 140mm config.

there's a review coming from MTBR shortly on the bike. Here's the one about the wheels on the bike:

ENVE Twenty7.5 (650B) AM Review | Mountain Bike Review
 
#39 ·
Not all 29ers feel like wagon wheels

FWIW, not all 29er ride the same. I have ridden some where it felt like I was on top of a horse- waaaaay up above the ground and I felt how you describe. However, I have also ridden, owned, demoed and borrowed several others that don't have that feel. I would recommend trying a few others out before you limit yourself to 650b's- there are so many more options out there for 29ers- not just bikes, but wheels, tires, forks, etc- and more of those bikes are designed around the 29" wheel- where with some that you're talking about, the frame/ geometry is built around a 26" wheel and you're talking about throwing a different wheel on there, which will change a lot of how the bike rides/ was designed to ride. Try a regular Tallboy, or a Turner, or a Stumpjumper, or any number of other 29ers that might not have you feeling like you're riding a circus bike...

just my .02.:thumbsup:
 
#41 ·
FWIW, not all 29er ride the same.
I like a lot about the TBLTc, just not the wheels. I think if it had a quality carbon wheelset with lighter (more XCer) rubber I would like it more. But then it would be $2k more as well.

I weighed the rear wheel and it weighed over 1.1 lbs more than the rear on my Starship. That's a significant amount of rotating mass. I weighed the bike and compared it against the Starship. It weighed 2+lbs more. I'm guessing that all that weight is in the wheels and that the frame and components is comparable to my current bike even though it has 2-3 inches more travel on each wheel.

Admittedly I have not ridden to many 29ers but so far the one I liked the most was a single-speed hard-tail. That one was fun.

I wish the GBS demo was not canceled. I was planning on attending that to get some multiple bike trail time in to get a better feel of what I like. I hope they can reschedule soon.

I've come to the conclusion that I don't like shopping for bikes. I would just rather ride them.
 
#47 ·
K,
650b the TRc sounds like a solid plan! :thumbsup: I've been reading a lot about the bennies of "b"-ing the TRc, and no drawbacks!

I can't wait to "b" my Blur LTc! A slight short shocking to drop the BB...oh yeah!
 
#48 ·
Wait for the fall offerings. Scott genius coming out with expenisive weight weenie carbon trail bikes that might suit perfectly. Genius 27er and 29er.
The marketeers are really pimpin the 27er movement these days. No one is going to miss out on sales by being slow to the pony show like w/ 29ers.
 
#60 ·
Support your local bike builders! Sure I had Santa Cruz' (2 of them) and they are nice bikes,
but these guys are in your own backyard. And I live in California. But If I had to get a SC TB I'd get the LT version.

If I had your budget, I'd get a LunchBox with (another local) White Bros. 140mm Loop! :thumbsup:
 

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#63 ·
I think that Lunchbox is a bit extreme for my riding.

So I read today that Intense will officially announce the 27.5 versions of the Tracer and Intense at the Dealer Demo later this month. That puts the Intense on my shopping list. The SC TRc is still there as well but I have renewed concerns about 'b'ing this.

A 29er may still be an option in the shape of a Turner Sultan Exp (though I would probably prefer the Burner but it may not be available in time). Perhaps a Spot 5?

The Yeti SB66 carbon looks interesting and is local.. An Ibis Mojo HD with 650b wheels? Or a Pivot Mach5.7 carbon?

I'll be at the GBS demo tomorrow and I'll see what that does to my thoughts on this.

Any others I should try that veer towards the cross country side of the longer travel "trail" bike?
 
#68 ·
Well I didn't get to test ride all the bikes I wanted as Rawhide kicked my butt and I ran out of time. I did get to test the Niner RDO, Turner 5.Spot and (for curiosity sakes) a Niner SIR9.

The RDO was by far the fastest bike of the bunch but the large was a little too big for me making the front end seem a little too light and the front wheel keen to wash out on the gravel. Climbing improved substantially with the Talas dropped to 95mm. I found getting the bike up and over the logged steps (up to 1 foot in height) easy. However the bike was poorly set up with poor brakes, skipping drive train, and creaking and vibrations through the cranks that would drive you mad and that put a downer on the enjoyment factor.

The Turner 5.Spot was the most fun in the downhills. This bike just eats the Rawhide trail when the incline goes down. I found going uphill more difficult. Even with propedal the rear if very active and bobs a lot. Also found the step-ups that the RDO managed with ease would hang up on the 5.Spot. Perhaps there is a pro to the 29er sized wheel afterall. The brakes were lousy on this bike as well as an FYI.

I took the SIR9 out as it was getting close to the end of the Demo time and the bike was there. I'd been wondering how much hill climbing efficiency I may be losing with suspension over a hard-tail. Well on smooth single track this thing is FUN! However as soon as it got rough I remembered why I dumped hard-tails 15 years ago. Also, the revelation is that this bike climbed no better (for my tired legs atleast) than the full suspension RDO (or even the Tallboy LTc) from the previous week.

I was hoping to try an Intense at the demo but I didn't see one.

Things I learned was that I still prefer:
- modern suspension trumps hard-tail for climbing
- triples over dual chainrings
- XT over X9
- my '99 Hope Hydos over any current brake out there (except the XTR on the SIR9 which was awesome) and
- that Talas rules! I love the ability to drop the front end and tighten up the feel of the bike. Though I still don't know my next bike I am 90% sure it will have a Talas on it...

Talking to the GBS guys about my riding and the feedback on the bikes I rode I am still getting recommendations that I should probably go for a regular Tallboy......


Hmmmm.
 
#69 ·
You'll get used to it.

... Perhaps there is a pro to the 29er sized wheel afterall...
I'm totally sold on 29, and that's my bias. I accept the flak that I inevitably take for that.

The wagon wheel feeling is an initial reaction. Of course it will be heightened if the bike is slack up front. With the 29" wheel you see a bunch of wheel out in front of you. If the HT angle is slack, it's even further out front. Bigwheel bikes are just longer. The length from the leading edge of the front tire to the trailing edge of the back is significantly longer (obviously), but on a slack AM/FR style bike it's more so. My Stump 29 felt huge to me, my Tomac is much more XC and it just feels normal.

And also of course the wheels and tires are heavier. They are just going to be. I'm totally used to that too. I ride big chunky rubber on big 29" hoops. My wheels are heavy. Doesn't feel funny to me at all, feels normal.

So you get used to it. I find that when I jump on a 26 the lack of front wheel out there feels funny, kind of a vulnerability. Kind of like jumping into a little car with a radically sloping hood when you're used to driving around in a pickup truck. Feels like you're looking right at the road. I find the little wheels skitterish when cornering and I totally notice how they catch in every gap and on every log or rock. After 8 years riding a big wheel I find the handling of a 26 bike spooky.

But, but you will get used to whatever.

I think bigwheels work for bigger people because the proportions are more correct. If you're a little too small to fit a Large, IMHO you are right there in the middle. Plenty big to fit a 29" wheeled bike, but small enough that proportionally the 26 wheels will work plenty fine too. As I say, both wheel sizes (or 650b) will work, you'll get used to whatever.

OK, now it's time for KC to post his "29ers, they're magically ridiculous" image.
 
#71 ·
I must say that I am beginning to lean towards the TBLTc again. On the downhills this thing is just a rocket sled and I agree that I'll "learn to ride it". After the demo yesterday, I realized that this bike felt perfectly sized for me and rode everything that I want to ride well. The pedal striking I was suffering may have just been a consequence of the suspension being set too soft on the rear (that would also slacken the bike, slowing its steering) as the BB height is the same as my current bike and I don't strike on that.

Unfortunately in the build kit price you only get the Fox 34 140 Float. I would prefer the Talas with 140/110. I think the 110 would tighen this bike on the XC and climb better (though that would lower the BB as well). A set of Chinese carbon hoops would probably help with the "big wheel" syndrome as well.

I still think that if I went with the regular TB that I would be questioning if I should have gone with more travel. While the TB is fine for my regular weekday loops, when I get to the rougher stuff (White Ranch/Apex for example) I'm going to be regretting not going big.

Perhaps I'll have to go custom build...




Edit: It's my 42nd birthday today. I'm getting an ichy finger and I'm tempted to pull the trigger. Plus I'm getting old and long travel soft suspension sounds nice to my stiff old back muscles :)
 
#72 ·
I must say that I am beginning to lean towards the TBLTc again. On the downhills this thing is just a rocket sled and I agree that I'll "learn to ride it". After the demo yesterday, I realized that this bike felt perfectly sized for me and rode everything thing that I want to ride well. The pedal striking I was suffering may have just been a consequence of the suspension being set too soft as the BB height is the same as my current bike and I don't strike on that.

Unfortunately in the build kit price you only get the Fox 34 140 Float. I would prefer the Talas with 140/110. I think the 110 would tighen this bike on the XC and climb better (though that would lower the BB as well). A set of Chinese carbon hoops would probably help with the "big wheel" syndrome as well.

Perhaps I'll have to go custom build...
KerryN,
I'm in the process of collecting bits for my TBLTc. I refuse to ride Fox anymore. Also, good luck on getting a kit w/ a Fox fork at the moment.
For fork, I'm looking at a Marz 44 Micro Ti Air 29er (2012). I had the 55 Micro Air Ti on my Nomad, and it's an UNBELIEVABLY supple fork (even compared to a coil!), once it breaks in. But, no ext travel adjust.
The rear shock, I'm thinking X-Fusion Vector HLR. I've heard nothing but good about X-Fusion. For me, I'd just need to figure out coil or air. AND, if you put a 2.25" stroke shock on (2.0 stock), at least on the XL TBLTc, you can get zero interference (per NoahColorado) and a bump in travel to just shy of 6" :thumbsup:
 
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