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Thread: Project bike

  1. #1
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    Project bike

    Got a box this past Wed...
    Waiting on a CCDB from Quebec...





  2. #2
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    Where do you put the water bottle?

    Nice looking bike man. Get it together so I can ride it!

  3. #3
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    Well, that looks pretty darn nice. Normally, I would have to say Disco Sucks but I think we'll have to make an exception in this case.

    Coming soon....flying off a cliff somewhere near you.....

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsj3831
    Well, that looks pretty darn nice. Normally, I would have to say Disco Sucks but I think we'll have to make an exception in this case.

    Coming soon....flying off a cliff somewhere near you.....
    Not a big huck fan. IE can tell you I prefer my bikes pluuuuush...

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y
    Not a big huck fan...
    I thought the minimum huck for a Karpiel was 14 feet to flat.

    Never ridden one, but I have a lot of respect for their past creations. Cool to see 'em reemerge.
    A trail that’s too difficult wouldn’t exist because it’d never be used. But, trails can exist that’re too difficult for you.

  6. #6
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    I think it's DunCon that was the driving force to have these frames (Discos and Armys) delivered to the US for this season. Before the sale, the old Karpiel (in Poland) had been sitting on my defective Army for months (last Aug maybe?)!
    Anyway, all reports from BrianHMC is this incarnation of the Disco is NOT like its former self... I'm hoping the lower CG will make the bike less tippy, noticable in my old Army.

  7. #7
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    It's a totally different bike than before.

  8. #8
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    frame weight?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowskilz
    frame weight?
    BrianHMC's original post. It's in here somewhere...

    It's complete!!!!!!!!! My New Karpiel Disco!!!!!

    I don't have a scale.

  10. #10
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    I'm glad to see on your bike you have the alien head. On the first batch of bikes they did away with them. When Jan was out here in October, at dinner I made mention that I loved the alien head and said I think it should continue to be the trademark of that model. Hopefully it's here to stay.

  11. #11
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    He should make them green!
    A Disco is not a Disco w/o the LGMs! Honestly tho, I didn't even notice
    Oh, when I was in Roswell, they have those dash-top dancing alien heads on springs... You should try to get one and bolt it to your stem!

    So, is Jan back in the States again?

  12. #12
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    He was here to visit family and meet with me.

  13. #13
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    A CCDB showed up today but with the wrong spring
    The initial feel of the build quality was meh...OK. This may be something buyers of new frames won't ever encounter as their shock will already be mounted, but may show up when adjusting the cams. The powder coat cracked and chipped around the bolt holes for the cam pinch on the main frame. What I get from this is they didn't clean out the hex head recess after powder. This is a very minor nitpick but now there's a chunk of red missing from that area and the white primer showing...

    Some other thoughts:
    - The eccentric cams have stops on them now so you can't push a long 10mm thru both sides and adjust them simultaneously and evenly like I was able to w/ my older (circa 2001) Army. Not too big of a deal to remedy w/ a needle file or Dremel.
    - The headtube is only reamed about 1" deep, making the deep cups of the King SteelSet a non-option, until you take it and have it reamed deeper (yikes.. I'm gonna get it on this one!).
    - I'm not sure if I received a show frame, but there's a descent amount of powder chips in the BB and the disc side rear dropout.
    - The shock fitment... As it's being sent w/ Rocos, the fit of the CCDB limits the bolt hole of the main triangle's cams to the upper half of the circle, and pretty high up in that position at that. This means there isn't much room, using a CCDB, to dial in slacker head angles, at least w/ the upper cam. I think this position turns out to be the more progressive one (for the top cam). The lower still has pretty much the full range so progression and BB height can be tweaked a bit there still.

    Next up, pressing in some Sunline V1 HS cups and Shimano BB cups from the '09 Saints.

    P
    --
    .......__o
    .......\ \,
    ....( )/ ( )

    Edit: can anyone get me a 400x3" Obtainium on a deal?

  14. #14
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    Good luck w/ those V1 headset cups. The ones I put in my Sunday were a little generous on the OD...
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser
    Good luck w/ those V1 headset cups. The ones I put in my Sunday were a little generous on the OD...
    It didn't split your head tube did it?

  16. #16
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    Ha, no. Just was a lot more trouble than E-13 reducer cups to install...
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  17. #17
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    Good bike. Is it heavy?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sindy9001
    Good bike. Is it heavy?
    Doesn't feel very heavy, but that's judging it by feel. I don't have a scale. BrianHMC has a post w/ a pic of it on a scale, fully built. It tipped in at around 41#s. Thread. I'm expecting mine to be a bit heavier, around 45#s or so, and I'm not trying to build light (Saints, older DeMax w/ 36 h rims, i-Sky cushy saddle, Azonic pedals, CCDB, etc).

  19. #19
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    Lookin' good Paul! That's one gnarly looking frame!

    Keep us posted!
    Biker? I don't even know her.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowskilz
    frame weight?
    Because if its light enough you'll need another bike to put in your garage?
    You have just been mentally Rick Roll'd. Yup you're thinking about it right now aren't you? Don't fight it.

  21. #21
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    Paul... I have a digital scale for bikes... I could bring it over for a beer (I'm such a whore)

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndecentExposure
    Paul... I have a digital scale for bikes... I could bring it over for a beer (I'm such a whore)
    I think there's like a 1/2 dzn of Coronas sitting in the fridge; I haven't had a beer in close to two months I think...
    Maybe Fri evening since you're Mr. Mom this weekend. You can bring by the Nomad bearing press too

    **I really need to get me one of them scales...

  23. #23
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    Yep, sounds good. I just finished up with the bearing kit and do need to get it back to you.... Will call you Friday.

  24. #24
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    looks good I can't wait to see it in person.
    "its not how slack your head angle is, its how you ride the bike"

  25. #25
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    have any current pics?

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    have any current pics?
    Damn you slave-driving b!tch! j/k
    Going to get a UST tire so I can slap the DeMax's on... then I'll shoot a few...
    An opportunity to visit the new Pedal Pusher





    Edit: no point at Pedal Pusher... It's currently a roadie shop - RM, Orbea, Cannonwhales, Guru(?). Didn't get a chance to talk to the guy much, but sounds/seems like he's still ramping up.

    So pics:

    I need to find a cool head badge for her...


    Unloaded, the head tube angle still look pretty steep



    An Obtainium 450# spring is coming...


    BONE HEAD! Dropped my HS press on her and wrinkled the powder


    Looks like I got the 15th production bike...
    Last edited by Pau11y; 03-15-2009 at 03:42 PM.

  27. #27
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    No wheels. Popped a spoke on the 2nd hand Dee Max trying to true out a hop. Oh well, guess I'll send it back to Mavic to get it reworked.
    Does anyone know where I can get a full set of bearings for a Hadley rear, and what the sizes are?

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser
    Ha, no. Just was a lot more trouble than E-13 reducer cups to install...
    Ya know... I'm not sure what 2nd rate, online engineering school alum of a designer Sunline tasked for this thing, but he/she needs to be taken out back and beaten like a baby seal! WTF are those bearings not IN the cups and instead, the instruction says to install as one step in the pressing in of the cups?
    Gave me fits to no end! Finally solved the problem w/ two pieces of wood, and two good whacks of a ball-peen!

  29. #29
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    Out of curiosity..why the 888?

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by $ally Hu$tle
    Out of curiosity..why the 888?
    Spring sprug, relatively light, relatively maint. free, Marz butterness, but nothing beat the fact it was only $830 to my door, NIB.

  31. #31
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    You'll need to remember the chain guide may need to be modified as the mount is not rotated forward enough because of the link. Also remember to cut the bolt flush with the mounting hole or the threaded portion will catch on the link and F everything up.

  32. #32
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    Did you have to pull a link off to install the shock or did it fit with a little maneuvering?

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    Did you have to pull a link off to install the shock or did it fit with a little maneuvering?
    Hehe... notice that did ya?
    No, I slipped the shock in w/ only one of the upper spacers installed. Once in position, I slipped the other one in by shifting the shock around a bit. I'm afraid that when the new spring shows up, I'll have to pull a link to get it back out and in. I'm thinking the main link...
    As for the guide bolts, thanx for the heads up. I typically pull the shock to check anyway...a lesson from the Tomac 204 build. The clearance there is about 1/64, after a good bit of Dremel work!

  34. #34
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    Brian, when you were messing around w/ your shock, did you actually try to slip an Avy in there? I managed to get my 9x3 one in, but the mounting hardware wasn't compatible. Clearance w/ the main link was about 1/32 per side...
    I'm thinking of talking to Craig about putting the hard piece of the Monty on my DHS for the res mount. There's no real good place on this frame to mount that remote res; I want the flat part of the seat mast to sit on when I'm just hanging out on bike.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y
    Spring sprug, relatively light, relatively maint. free, Marz butterness, but nothing beat the fact it was only $830 to my door, NIB.
    amen.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y
    Brian, when you were messing around w/ your shock, did you actually try to slip an Avy in there? I managed to get my 9x3 one in, but the mounting hardware wasn't compatible. Clearance w/ the main link was about 1/32 per side...
    I'm thinking of talking to Craig about putting the hard piece of the Monty on my DHS for the res mount. There's no real good place on this frame to mount that remote res; I want the flat part of the seat mast to sit on when I'm just hanging out on bike.
    Nope, I didn't try. I figured the spring would move too much and rub on the links.

  37. #37
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    Had a chance to mess w/ the bike some more tonight to swap out the insufficient steel spring w/ the correct Ti one. WHAT A FRIGGIN' NIGHTMARE! Trying to remove the shock was a complete PITA process! There's no room to wiggle which meant trying to remove a link plate. Long story short, IT SUCKED! So, if someone's getting this frame, get a good rear shock that won't blow out mid-season and force you to have to remove it w/ any frequency (not sure what the longevity of a Roco WC is)...
    On another note, the bearing retaining bolts are those super soft Al chainring bolts. I changed them out w/ some long steel ones of inner ring left over from the days of 5x110/74. The pivots were also in the frame quite uneven. The steel bolts may help to deal w/ things wiggling loose...

  38. #38
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    picture picture picture

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y
    Had a chance to mess w/ the bike some more tonight to swap out the insufficient steel spring w/ the correct Ti one. WHAT A FRIGGIN' NIGHTMARE! Trying to remove the shock was a complete PITA process! There's no room to wiggle which meant trying to remove a link plate. Long story short, IT SUCKED! So, if someone's getting this frame, get a good rear shock that won't blow out mid-season and force you to have to remove it w/ any frequency (not sure what the longevity of a Roco WC is)...
    On another note, the bearing retaining bolts are those super soft Al chainring bolts. I changed them out w/ some long steel ones of inner ring left over from the days of 5x110/74. The pivots were also in the frame quite uneven. The steel bolts may help to deal w/ things wiggling loose...
    Sounds like you have a pre-production frame, yes you have to take off one of the upper links, please don't whine (I guess you've never had the honor or removing a shock on a Sunday, that's even worse.) I switched out my bolts also with longer ones. The new production frames are suppose to have longer upper plates where you won't have to remove a link to swap out shocks. Hopefully I'll know for sure when my new frame arrives in a few weeks. It seems like all you've done about this frame is complain and you've never even ridden it. From what I've been told you either got it for free or for very cheap.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by $ally Hu$tle
    picture picture picture
    The only visual change is the spring... Lemme slap some wheels on the thing and have it start looking like a ridable bike before I shoot again.

  41. #41
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    Thanx to IE coming over and setting me straight on priorities...write a paper for grad school or build the Disco. So, another installment of the Karpiel Disco build.

    First thing's first, the bashring mod. I know most of you are going to run the new style w/ the taco so this might be beating on a dead horse. I just feel mo' betta having my ring sit behind a bashring. But, the e.13 bashring won't just bolt to the '09 M815-1 cranks.



    1mm of clearance after the mod


    Free-handed Dremel milling



    CCDB w/ Obtainium 450x3. The SRS and Saint fitting install.


    BrianHMC, there seems to be enough clearance (1mm) between the ISCG mounting bolt tip to link/pivot bolt head.


    I'll still need to space the cranks for chainline which means there'll be spacers fitted between the plate and the mount, so even less threads will be exposed on the back of the ISCG mount.


    I think the guys have fixed the ISGC angle. I can try to rotate the plate to a more 12:00 position (with a bunch more Dremel work), but I think this position might fly.


    The head angle still looks a bit steep. I wonder if anyone makes a drop crown for that fork?


    Brian, on 2nd look, the ISCG might not be quite right. I did some more Dremel work on the SRS bolt holes, added another 1/8" to the curvy slots. Will reshoot the bike tomorrow w/ the "better" SRS position.

    Last edited by Pau11y; 03-28-2009 at 06:31 PM.

  42. #42
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    You need to make the mounting holes even longer. I found the wide e13 backplate works best. With a little bit more modifiying you'll get it perfect. The new e13 guides may work better as the mounting holes are longer.

  43. #43
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    What size shock is on there? You know you can adjust the head angle by turning the upper cams. You should also rotate the lower cam down for max travel. You should be able to get the head angle to about 65 degrees +/-.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    You need to make the mounting holes even longer. I found the wide e13 backplate works best. With a little bit more modifiying you'll get it perfect. The new e13 guides may work better as the mounting holes are longer.
    The top part of the mod'd (wide) backplate is now sitting pretty much at the 12:00 position. I'll reshoot it later today. I'll also reshoot the BB area w/ the Saint's installed and spaced properly. There's two spacer ring on the drive side, and one on the non-drive side. This spaces out the crankarms pretty evenly against the rear triangle/long axis of the frame and the "Q" puts the neutral off the c'ring at about the 3rd or 4th cog in the back (9spd). I'll need to measure the chainline but I think it's in a pretty ideal location.
    Last edited by Pau11y; 03-29-2009 at 09:26 AM.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    What size shock is on there? You know you can adjust the head angle by turning the upper cams. You should also rotate the lower cam down for max travel. You should be able to get the head angle to about 65 degrees +/-.
    The upper cam is limited from the position I have it at, to the lower part of the arc. The CCDB's (9.5" i2i) remote rez flares out and stops the cams from going any higher on the arc as it'll bump into the seat tower support plates. On the lower, you're right, I can get it to the lowest position and get some more headtube angle. In it's current position, it's the highest position it can be before the lower link bumps into the BB shell. I'm starting there (along w/ the max mounting possible on the fork) as a baseline to tweak. BTW, as the Disco is config'd in the last full side shot, the bars sits TALLER than my Tomac 204 w/ a Monster T2 at max mounting height! I'm changing those bars to a lower rise, and wider one (Azonic DW 30"<=comes in white!, Sun's V1 745, Dirty Thirty...etc).

  46. #46
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    Its coming together. Get'er done!

  47. #47
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    You'll get WAY more adjustability from a Roco if that's the case. Plus you'll want to rotate the upper cam to get your BB heigth about 14.25. You don't want the lower links resting on the BB shell.

  48. #48
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    Alright peeps, looking for some cool head badge for this puppy. Now accepting suggestions:
    I was thinking of this... or this.

  49. #49
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    Alien head

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    Alien head
    LOL.
    I was thinking of a bit of red on red w/ the shocker...throw out some subliminal vibes

  51. #51
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    Brian,
    Did you notice that when your derailleur is in the smallest cog, it'd slap up against that replacable der hanger and make a cluck noise? Also, when it was in that gear, the pulley plate on the rear der would contact the inner face of that hanger and prevent the der from dropping down fully to line up w/ the rear cog? I'm assuming you're running a XO long der? Did you resort to Dremelling?

  52. #52
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    I'm running a med cage. I have no problem with noise or shifting and didn't need any modifcations to the hanger. Take a bunch of pics and let me see what you're talking about.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    I'm running a med cage. I have no problem with noise or shifting and didn't need any modifcations to the hanger. Take a bunch of pics and let me see what you're talking about.
    I'll slap a chain on her and shoot some when the sun comes back out again
    Can you also shoot some of your setup, with the chain in the smallest cog? This way, we can compare notes...

  54. #54
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    Ran into a problem




    Dremel to the rescue... I tried to smooth out the Dremel grind to reduce any sharp transistions and causing a stress riser.







    Almost done! The hoses are going to be replaces w/ Goodridge. Does anyone know of a place to source some Code calipers?




    So, it's not that I like to b!+ch, but at a price tag of $3000+ for this frame, the QC pretty much sucks! Now, maybe it's the fact that my frame is a warranty frame and they sent me one that needed this bit of tweaking, or early production one (#15). But the frame still shouldn't have shipped w/ this kind of oversight.
    BTW, the Sunline HS is coming out and I'm putting an old Race Race Realset DH in. There's play in the HS's top race/bearing. No good!

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    I'm running a med cage. I have no problem with noise or shifting and didn't need any modifcations to the hanger. Take a bunch of pics and let me see what you're talking about.
    Brain, I think I must have been sniffin' glue or something. I remounted the rear mech "properly" and it's just fine.

  56. #56
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    Some feedback plz: is this thread a "TMI" one? Am I being too ana1 w/ this thread/build?

  57. #57
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    OP, you're not too anal given the job, but it is now requisite to conclude this monster garage thread with some action photos.

    damn cool rig, but I could never bring myself to take a dremel to a brand spankin new frame like that, nor should it be needed, eh? agree with the comment on QC issues, regardless of pre-production/warrantee. kudos for staying with it

  58. #58
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    looks great man, but you have to lose that monster seat

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by $ally Hu$tle
    looks great man, but you have to lose that monster seat
    I really like cushy seats. I'm not racing so the idea of putting on a minimalist roadie seat is pretty much insane to me. Lazyboy-on-a-stick all the way baby!
    I have the same one on my Tomac 204. And on my AM, XC, and roadies, I rock the Terry Fly (carbon on the roadies). Plus, you won't see the thing when I'm on her going stoopid fast anyway

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by moosehead
    OP, you're not too anal given the job, but it is now requisite to conclude this monster garage thread with some action photos.
    I'll get IE to shuttle Apex with


    damn cool rig, but I could never bring myself to take a dremel to a brand spankin new frame like that, nor should it be needed, eh? agree with the comment on QC issues, regardless of pre-production/warrantee. kudos for staying with it
    Well, it was either that or Dremel the brake adapter. But I think it would have eventually caused problem later down the road if I didn't have a good flat to flat interface between the two. Hehe, Monster Garage...
    I'm only hoping those guys over there in Poland are paying attention. The frame/suspension was WAY ahead of its time; iirc, the original Disco was from 1998 (?). I had one of his first ones back then as well. Had him make it special w/ a bolt-on stub so I could run a front der for a double up front. It was a 9" bike back in the days of 6" WC DH race rigs. AND, it pedal'd pretty well as I took it up the Crest trail w/ an old 6" Boxxer on the front. I'll see if I can dig up that pic

  61. #61
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    Slapped on some Nokon shifty housing (silver) I found for dirt cheap on ebay. DeeMax replacement rim/spokes showed up and I just picked up some Minion USTs so hopefully the wheel situation will be resolved soon. Had to go to Home Depot and buy a cheap needle nose to make a tool for the DeeMax rebuild. If anyone want a pic of that, let me know. It's pretty ghetto
    Will shoot final pics after I've gotten the RaceFace headset, DeeMax/Minions and Goodridge brake hoses on.

    Edit: play in the headset solved by using the RF bearing, compression cap/race and wedge ring. Didn't need to bang out the Sunline upper cup. Goodridge hose next.
    BTW, when/if I EVER find a sock drawer gnome, I'm putting their heads on pikes!
    Last edited by Pau11y; 04-11-2009 at 03:33 PM.

  62. #62
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    Doood, this is the longest striptease thread of the year. Karpiel Tunnel Syndrome is setting in. +1 get er done and dirty.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by moosehead
    Doood, this is the longest striptease thread of the year. Karpiel Tunnel Syndrome is setting in. +1 get er done and dirty.
    Ma man, that is the sig of the year!

  64. #64
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    WTF were you thinking modifying the swingarm? My Hope adaptor clears without any problem. I would have modified the adaptor or tried a different manufacture mount WAY before touching the frame. Lets think about it, $25 adaptor or $600 swingarm. Pretty easy decision here. Looking at pics of the adaptor, there is a sh*t load of material you could have removed from that adaptor, and I mean a sh*t load.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    WTF were you thinking modifying the swingarm? My Hope adaptor clears without any problem. I would have modified the adaptor or tried a different manufacture mount WAY before touching the frame. Lets think about it, $25 adaptor or $600 swingarm. Pretty easy decision here. Looking at pics of the adaptor, there is a sh*t load of material you could have removed from that adaptor, and I mean a sh*t load.
    "Modifying?" Why the hell was there such a huge weld bead there, running up that high onto a solid disc tab anyway? That didn't make ANY sense at all! The ONLY thing I can come up with was sh!++y weld job and QC. I don't think it would have been too much to expect the mating of one of the most common brand disc adapters out there (SRAM and HAYES) to a disc tab to have zero problems.
    And Brian, unlike you, I had to operate w/in a finite budget. Buying a new set of $700+ brakes was NOT an option. Those J7's only cost me $150 for the pair. AND, I'm not entirely sold on Hope. As nice as they are, cheap and readily available replacement parts would be a major issue (but mainly the "cheap" portion of this statement). I can find J7 bits for dirt cheap all over the web, new or used. Lastly, this is after all a DH bike and I do plan on going thru some parts on it. Looking for a deal on a set of Code calipers was about the max I can (or was willing to) do, and even then, I'd only have changed my front one. Everything else I pretty much already had except for the Saint/e13, and shock (you won't believe what I got that fork for!).
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  66. #66
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    You realizes that VOIDS the warranty. Dude, grind the adaptor or try a different manufactures adaptor that's all I'm saying. Here is an Avid, look at the mounting holes.



    Or this Hayes





    See looks like you have a WAY old adaptor.

  67. #67
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    I believe Shimano would fit too.


  68. #68
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    That Hayes is what I'm running.

    As for the warranty, if my frame fails anywhere else and they void the warranty because of that grind at the disc tab, then I'll know what kind of BS company DunCon is won't I. For instance, if the yoke by the pivot snaps and they cite that grind as reason they void the warranty on my rear swingarm...seriously? I really am not expecting what I did there to cause any structural issues. It's an excess (sloppy) weld bead on a solid piece of billet of a disc tab that I took down; I didn't try to take down the entire weld to look like a fillet braze.
    BTW what is the warranty on these frame, two years or one?
    Last edited by Pau11y; 04-12-2009 at 02:06 AM.
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  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y
    That Hayes is what I'm running.

    As for the warranty, if my frame fails anywhere else and they void the warranty because of that grind at the disc tab, then I'll know what kind of BS company DunCon is won't I. For instance, if the yoke by the pivot snaps and they cite that grind as reason they void the warranty on my rear swingarm...seriously? I really am not expecting what I did there to cause any structural issues. It's an excess (sloppy) weld bead on a solid piece of billet of a disc tab that I took down; I didn't try to take down the entire weld to look like a fillet braze.
    BTW what is the warranty on these frame, two years or one?
    It's one year for the warranty. I handle warranties so if there is a problem with axle/brake mount, the swingarm will be void. My point is, there are many different mounts out there that will work without modifying the frame. I would have exhausted ALL my options first. I'm still wondering why you chose to modify the frame opposed to a cheap replaceable mount? I'm not trying to be an a-hole here, I just don't want to see anyone get hurt from a part failure, especially something that's been modified.

  70. #70
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    Karpiel is off my list

    Cannot believe the amount of fitting work required to build up that frame. Especially I would expect ICSG and brake adaptors to fit. This kind of things should be tested at factory and documented.

    I cannot believe the Karpiel 'solution' is to dremel the brake adaptor rather than the frame. Is it any better if the adaptor fails than the swingarm? Either way the rider could be in grave danger.

    Now, is this a case of a dremel happy customer? Or a case of missing documentation and low manufacturing quality?

    I don't know. But I wouldn't bet my money on a Karpiel frame right now.
    "Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetuer adipiscing elit." - And I agree.

  71. #71
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    The brake adaptor DOES fit without modifications. Paul must be using a WAY old Hayes adaptor. All of the newer mounts fit WITHOUT modification as the mounting holes are closer to the bottom (see pics above) I never had to modify mine or have I ever heard of anyone else for that matter having to modify their frame and/or adaptor.

    Unfortunately the ISCG on the frame is is not rotated to the perfect position basically due to the location to the lower link. (you would never be able to install/remove it). So with the older e13 LG-1's modification can be done, but not necessary. The new LG-1 will have longer mounting holes so there maybe little or no mods required on it.

    As far as quality goes, Karpiel's are way up there. This is the first generation frame and improvements will continue to be made. Do you recall the issues with the first Sundays? They had linkage issues, but corrected them the following year.

    I hope slight mods to a ISCG backplate wouldn't detour you from considering a Karpiel. Brake mods are not necessary.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaba Klaus
    Cannot believe the amount of fitting work required to build up that frame. Especially I would expect ICSG and brake adaptors to fit. This kind of things should be tested at factory and documented.

    I cannot believe the Karpiel 'solution' is to dremel the brake adaptor rather than the frame. Is it any better if the adaptor fails than the swingarm? Either way the rider could be in grave danger.

    Now, is this a case of a dremel happy customer? Or a case of missing documentation and low manufacturing quality?

    I don't know. But I wouldn't bet my money on a Karpiel frame right now.
    Hey Kaba, I want to put up my disclaimer that I'm only documenting my build and what I've ran into. Your milage may vary. The Dremel may have been a bit eager on my part. Was it a good means to an end, time will tell.
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  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y
    Hey Kaba, I want to put up my disclaimer that I'm only documenting my build and what I've ran into. Your milage may vary. The Dremel may have been a bit eager on my part. Was it a good means to an end, time will tell.
    Pau11y,

    I do appreciate you documenting your experience building up the frame. I absolutely love the level of detail. You did not complain, nor point a finger, nor accuse anybody of anything.

    But my very personal opinion stands: I've built up a few fames myself. I've never had issues like you had to overcome. Not from Devinci, not from SantaCruz, not from KHS, not from Specialized, not from Giant. In my mind ISCG and disk brake adaptors simply need to fit. I don't buy the claims of Karpiel. And asking you to dremel the brake adaptor is the proverbial straw.

    You seem to be a wonderfull patient and resourceful customer.

    Looking forward to see some action pictures.

    Klaus
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  74. #74
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    The more I look your bike over it looks like your frame is a production model, not a pre-production.

  75. #75
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    ... and if we just ... 100%





    IE, need to get together for a shuttle session, and a weigh-in
    You around on Sat?

    Edit: moosehead, she's full-monty for you. Now go get some ointment to address your "syndrome".
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  76. #76
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    wow, that's hawt

  77. #77
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    Weigh in

    It's roughly 41#s, give/take 1/2 #
    Size is large.
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  78. #78
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    Looks good. Let me know how you like it! I'm in the process of building up my new Disco.

  79. #79
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    Props to Obtainium (Jim?). He's letting me trade in my 450# spring for a 400# one. My sag on the CCDB should be 1/3 of the total stroke (1"), but I'm only getting a bit less than 20mm w/ no pre-load. When that's done, the Karp will be resort (or shuttle ) ready.

    Anyone know of a good place to score some 32h D521 or EX721s? Found a set of 108pt Hadleys on Pinkbike for a good deal...
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  80. #80
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    Last Pic



    In the same configuration as two posts up
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  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian HCM#1
    Looks good. Let me know how you like it! I'm in the process of building up my new Disco.
    Pictures dude, pictures
    ...or at least a link to where ever you're posting the thread.

    Also, took mine out on a couple of shuttle runs today. The a$$-end doesn't seem too compliant where as the front was following the ground like the tires had velcro. Did your old pre-production bike have a pretty active rear or was it kinda slow as well?
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  82. #82
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    Can you rotate the upper cam back down. The feel is much different than the older bikes, it's more active. What spring rate are you using? I'm about 195lbs and run a 400lb spring, 450lb I feel is too heavy. Also have you messed with the compression & rebound? I'm not familiar with the Double barrels.

  83. #83
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    Got an Elka Stage 5, feels good so far.







  84. #84
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    B,
    I think I'm going to send in my Avy and have the thing extended (currently at 9x3), and revalved for the 3.2:1 compression. I think I need to ask Craig to reduce the working fluid's viscosity for faster shock movements & min pre-load on a pretty lightly rated spring (I'm also at 400 lbs, running a RCS right now but an Obtainium is coming).

    Edit: I'm going to rotate the upper cam as close to front triangle as I can and the lower, as far out as I can. That should soften things up a bit.
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  85. #85
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    Before you spend the money on the Avalanche, make sure the spring fits between the links. I must say, so far I am REALLY impressed with the Elka, it actually has more of the Avalanche feel I prefer over the Roco.

  86. #86
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    I actually managed to snake the Avy in between the links. Couldn't mount it because Craig uses proprietary DU diameter vs Fox, Marz, Progressive, CC. When I emailed Craig, he told me the 400# spring will be slightly smaller than the 450 I have on there, and therefore more room.
    The other thought was to leave it 9x3 and just revalve. I can compensate for 1/4" on either cam, but it'll give me more slack of a head angle. I noticed Risse makes a drop crown for the 888 WC RC3...
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  87. #87
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    That would work then.

  88. #88
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    Flipped it over... MUCH faster response from the shock!
    I'm used to (and like) the undersprung and slightly over damped feel of Progressive shocks. I've had problems w/ my rear bucking before (Fox). Changed to a Progressive and no more bucking. So, gonna tune the CCDB like the Progressive.

    HS comp is pretty much off (field tweak will be necessary when I start bottoming it out)
    LS comp only has only one or two clicks.
    HS reb is about 1/3 from full off (again, prob will need field tweaks).
    LS reb is about 1/2 from full off.

    Tell ya, the '08 888 WC RC3 is pushing the feel of the Monster T2...it's not broken in yet and is already unbelievably buttery!
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  89. #89
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    got any new pics of the shock setup?

  90. #90
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    Disco CCDB shock setup

    Head angle is still pretty steep


    ZOOM...


    The skinny seat is as hard as a ROCK!


    B,
    How much of a hit was your Elka? I want to have a point of comparison between what the Avy tweak will cost vs. a new shock. PM me if you're getting dealer costs and don't want to float it online.
    Last edited by Pau11y; 05-31-2009 at 03:22 PM.
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  91. #91
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    I didn't pay a thing for it, I'm just riding it for the summer, then sending it back. However I can probably hook you up with one. I can contact Elka and get a price if you're serious about one. It does look like an Avy will fit. So far the Elka has me intrigued, and am very impressed with the first few rides.

  92. #92
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    How can I buy one///????

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by mpmffitz
    How can I buy one///????
    Frame, shock or both?

  94. #94
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    B,
    I've filled out their quote page online. Lemme see what they say first.
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  95. #95
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    Sounds good to me.

  96. #96
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    Had a chance to get the bike dirty @ Sol on Fri. The CCDB w/ the 400# spring (<30%) was a bit stiffer for me (190#s bone dry), coming from under sprung bikes (35-40% sag) that uses damping to ctrl travel (Progressive 5th). I'll be looking fwd to the 375# Obtainium next wknd. BUT, despite the spring, the back end went un-noticed...only a tiny bit of low speed rebound buck on g-outs on my last run down Cheese It.
    The head angle was pretty steep, more so than my Nomad MKI. As such, the bike likes to be ridden weigh-biased off the rear wheel (my Tomac 204 behaved better weigh biased towards the front). The bike turns better w/ angulation than w/ handle bar inputs.
    Another note: the Juicy 7's in this application and config'd for single finger braking is not quite powerful enough. Sourced out some whitey Codes from Mike's Bike...
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  97. #97
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    I had 2 good days on the new Disco, I am fully in love with the bike. I actually may be changing the spring to a 450lb, I managed to bottom out the suspension a few times.

  98. #98
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    Going to send the Avy into Craig for a revalve. It's a 9x3 but I'm debating if I should change the i2i. Will def. need to have the hose lenghtened. The CCDB is valved too slow (will try to tweak it more this wknk at WP.

    BTW, I'm not sure if anyone is interested, but Harbor Country Bikes have Goodridge parts for the Avid Codes IN STOCK! I've been looking all over the intardweb and this was the only place that had stock.

    Edit: I had some bulk hose so only go the fittings. It was cheaper than buying kits (#104).
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    Pau11y, nice looking frame. The yellow rims with the red frame really pop out at you. You can get your CCDB re-valved too. It may be cheaper or even free depending on how new it is and if you are the original owner. If you do choose to go the route of the Avy, you may want to have it lengthened a tad. I think the 9.0" i2i maybe a tad extreme and you will loose some adjustments in the cams since you will have to compensate for the shorter i2i. Maybe see if you can get it around 9.25" i2i. That will allow you to get a slacker HA and have a wider range of cam adjustments.

    I have a slightly modified Roco on my 09 Disco and it is just shy of 9.25" i2i w/a 3" stroke. I haven't run the frame in the slackest setting yet and felt great for my first race of the season. The nice thing about this is I know I can go slacker if I need to on a more extreme course. I will try to get some pix up soon.

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by MClose
    Pau11y, nice looking frame. The yellow rims with the red frame really pop out at you. You can get your CCDB re-valved too. It may be cheaper or even free depending on how new it is and if you are the original owner. If you do choose to go the route of the Avy, you may want to have it lengthened a tad. I think the 9.0" i2i maybe a tad extreme and you will loose some adjustments in the cams since you will have to compensate for the shorter i2i. Maybe see if you can get it around 9.25" i2i. That will allow you to get a slacker HA and have a wider range of cam adjustments.

    I have a slightly modified Roco on my 09 Disco and it is just shy of 9.25" i2i w/a 3" stroke. I haven't run the frame in the slackest setting yet and felt great for my first race of the season. The nice thing about this is I know I can go slacker if I need to on a more extreme course. I will try to get some pix up soon.
    Thanx for the clues! I'll give Malcome a shout about revalving the CCDB. It'll be nice to see pics of other build(s). Maybe you or others have gone a route I didn't think about (ie. 9.25 vs the full 9.5" i2i).

    Where are you out of, Poland? I know there's only a handful of Discos in the States, most in BrianHMC's backyard

    Last Q: what headset are you running? I'm using a mix of Sunline V1 and parts from an old Race Face stainless DH. I orignially intended and bought a King Steelset, but Karp/DunCon didn't ream out the HT deep enough to use it.
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