I got a call from an OSMP rep this morning. Rangers on the Goshawk Ridge Trail ticketed a cyclist recently (Friday). When asked if he saw the signage, he stated that "All my buddies say it's cool to ride the trail."
People, it's not cool to ride the trail. This idiot gets a $250 fine and gets to visit the judge; you can't mail this one in.
BMA is working hard to get access to the West TSA (Mountain Parks region) and the Eldo to Walker connection. Crap like this deals a blow to our efforts. We are working with OSMP on signs like these to make it abundantly clear:
As a graphic designer I must give just a little design feedback. I can't help it.
If this sign is posted at open trailheads as a PSA then it's pretty effective, although a headline like "POACHING" would help.
alternatively, If this is posted at a closed trail there will be confusion. The sign is green, which means go. The biker icon is not crossed out, signifying that it is legal to go as well. Also It still needs the previously mentioned headline so when people are scanning the sign at 10-20 mph, it will catch their attention.
The design of that sign is fine, if it's posted on a trail that is open to bikes. Isn't that the case with the placement shown above?
The small font and subtle graphics make it clear that the message is not meant to be absorbed with a glance while riding at 10-20 mph. It's clearly a sign that's meant to be read in full -- an informational piece, not a stop sign or similar warning. It's not being used to mark a trail that's closed to bikers, so a red slash or similar marking would confuse, not clarify, the message. Green is a friendly, low-key color that matches the message of the text.
Keep it as it is. Perhaps develop another version in red, with a slash, or otherwise similarly marked, to post at trailheads where bike access is prohibited.
"If the B.M.A. can post signs at trailheads, does everyone have the right to post signs also?"
Everyone who has a partnership agreement with the land manager, represents a group that performs hundreds of hours of volunteer labor each season, and develops a signage program to benefit the public should have the right to post signs at trailheads.
Hey Mike, I bet you didn't know that sign was socialist. It's green... and uh... that guy on the bike is clearly a proletarian.
For everyone providing the well thought out criticism, Mike never said this sign was being posted at closed trails. I'm sure they will continue to be marked with the unmistakable bike with a red slash through it.
This sign is probably for other prominent locations to inform those that choose to poach about the larger implications of their actions.
Does a OSMP rep contact you everytime someone gets ticketed for poaching? If so, do you post everytime you are contacted by one of these reps?
"My buds said it's cool" is a weasel like cop out. I doubt there are rouge bands of riders hitting GRT (or you'd hear about it I assume). Just one a$$hole's opinion. Thanks for all you do!
I'd read your sign simply because it has a bike on it and HEY!! I'm on a bike!!
Last edited by jugdish; 05-30-2009 at 09:06 PM.
Gone are the days we stopped to decide,
Where we should go,
We just ride...
I think it's great that these signs are going up. I do agree with some of the tips about the signs look, but it's a great start. I think too many people do not know trail etiquette, and need to be taught the proper way to use these areas. Kudos!
Does a OSMP rep contact you everytime someone gets ticketed for poaching? If so, do you post everytime you are contacted by one of these reps?
there is a distribution list that is ciruclated - but in order to be on the list you have to be politically connected - JD: with all of your political connections i should be able to get you added.
we never got clarification. is this sign actually on an open or closed trail?
is there more than just the 1 sign on just the 1 trail?
These two signs are on either side of the entrance to Goshawk, which is a bridge off of Spring Brook. If bikers are riding Goshawk and didn't come over the bridge (ignoring the sign on the right "hey, nobody told us") that means they poached some other trail (a clearly marked Fowler) to get onto Goshawk somehow.
Yes, Goshawk is an open trail...open to hikers and runners and probably horses but like the sign clearly says, no dogs or bikes.
Last edited by xcguy; 04-03-2011 at 10:57 AM.
So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.
So mountain bikers are lumped in the same category as Dogs? Sweeet!
You got that right! Remember that Bruce Lee film, maybe his first one ("Fists of Fury"), where he's living in a China that had just been invaded by Japan and the Chinese were being persecuted in their own country. He looks up and sees a sign that says "No dogs and Chinese allowed". Of course, he jumps up about six feet off the ground, kicks the sign up into the air, then shatters it again with another kick. Chinese audiences all stood up and cheered when they saw this and Bruce Lee's legend had begun. Now, back to mountain biking and dogs...In fact, here it is:
I got a call from an OSMP rep this morning. Rangers on the Goshawk Ridge Trail ticketed a cyclist recently (Friday). When asked if he saw the signage, he stated that "All my buddies say it's cool to ride the trail."
People, it's not cool to ride the trail. This idiot gets a $250 fine and gets to visit the judge; you can't mail this one in.
BMA is working hard to get access to the West TSA (Mountain Parks region) and the Eldo to Walker connection. Crap like this deals a blow to our efforts. We are working with OSMP on signs like these to make it abundantly clear:
if everyone poached trails, then nobodies access would ever be at risk
If you can't figure out the signage, well its pretty bad I guess. I don't think Mike needs the grief he's been getting. It is well known that trail is off limits to bikes. There are plenty of places to ride.
If everyone poached trails lots of people would be getting busted and there would be fewer places to ride.
The whole situation is ridiculous.
Imagine you're hit by a car. In a coma for 20 years. You come back to. You want to go for your first walk in the woods in 20 years. You get to this trail head and see all these signs: "Off-trail travel requires a permit." "No dogs." Something about "poaching" trails. And a bridge that must have cost $75,000 to build and install.
You're not sure what you're most upset about: that your wife is married to someone else now or that the world has gone to crap.
We don't think twice about it now. We forget that when we were kids, a few logs would have been thrown across the stream. If we had to pee, we could walk off the trail and go behind a tree. Our parents might have even let us throw a few rocks into the stream.
Imagine you're hit by a car. In a coma for 20 years. You come back to. You want to go for your first walk in the woods in 20 years. You get to this trail head and see all these signs: "Off-trail travel requires a permit." "No dogs." Something about "poaching" trails. And a bridge that must have cost $75,000 to build and install.
You're not sure what you're most upset about: that your wife is married to someone else now or that the world has gone to crap.
We don't think twice about it now. We forget that when we were kids, a few logs would have been thrown across the stream. If we had to pee, we could walk off the trail and go behind a tree. Our parents might have even let us throw a few rocks into the stream.
There's a lot more people and lawyers now. I grew up in Washington state near Tacoma and my memories are of nothing but woods where we'd just wander about all the time, catching fish in some large stream and running over to a "lake" we'd dammed up on some other creek to create our own fishing hole. The last time I visited the old neighborhood that entire area was a subdivision.
So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.
There's a lot more people and lawyers now. I grew up in Washington state near Tacoma and my memories are of nothing but woods where we'd just wander about all the time, catching fish in some large stream and running over to a "lake" we'd dammed up on some other creek to create our own fishing hole. The last time I visited the old neighborhood that entire area was a subdivision.
Yep, times have changed, there's a lot more people and a lot more demands on the land. That little reality requires more rooles and wreckrulations. Without them, it would be a mess. The good news is, that there are still and will continue to be many, many great places to ride mountain bikes as long as the mountain bike community remains a legitimate partner at the table. Poachers, renegades, etc, take away some of that legitimacy.
I rode Spring Brook yesterday. As I passed the bridge that is the entrance to Goshawk I looked again at signage. In fact, as you can see, there are FOUR signs saying "no bikes".
Of course, the poachers can still use the time honored excuse of "nobody told me" as if that makes them innocent
Last edited by xcguy; 04-03-2011 at 10:57 AM.
So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.
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Originally Posted by jugdish
