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  1. #1
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    LANDIS and LANCE DOPING? GTFO

    Not that anybody here really cares about road racing..............but Armstrong is a full blown American ICON.
    What would be the fallout if Lance is proven to be a 'rulebreaker'?
    My opinion is that even though Landis is a lying sack of SH!& he probably speaks truth about Armstrong (and most of the competitive Pro field) and their doping habits.

    I think it is naive to believe that most, if not all pro level sports DO NOT use PED of some sort.
    I guess I just find it laughable that most people really believe otherwise.

    What say you?


    http://news.google.com/news/more?pz=...EsnbxM&topic=s
    EricN
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  2. #2
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    Like snow boarders, they all dope.
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  3. #3
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    BTW, doping in Denver is legal! --newsflash, right?
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndecentExposure
    BTW, doping in Denver is legal! --newsflash, right?
    I mean YEAH, but that's medicine right?!
    EricN
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  5. #5
    Rigid in Evergreen
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    Viva Sports Science

  6. #6
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    Let everyone dope, no matter the sport. If people feel winning is worth the risk of a heart attack at 20 something, that's their decision.
    Down is the new up.

  7. #7
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    Hell I'm high right now.

  8. #8
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  9. #9
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    Armstrong has been tested literally thousands of times. A lot of people don't know that cycling also has strict "out of competition" tests, where someone can show up at your door unannounced, at anytime, anywhere, and you have 20 minutes to give them pee and blood.

    Another factor now is that samples are stored, and are subject to testing years later. So, if someone finds a new drug that current tests cannot detect, odds are eventually they will still be caught.

    Given that, I find it very difficult to believe Armstrong wouldn't have been caught somewhere along the line.

    Consider this: If athletes in ANY other professional sport faced the doping scrutiny of cycling, many sports would be completely different today. Do you really think NFL teams could field an offensive line with five 300+ plus guys if they weren't dosing? They are only tested six times a year, and the very strong whisper is that they KNOW when the hit is coming. Masking agents are the norm., And, if they take off to Mexico for a month in April for some "training", they don't have WADA banging on their doors and asking for a sample. Then, if they are caught, they get a whole big four game suspension. Cyclists? Two years. It is a joke. Baseball is even more of a joke.

    Either Armstrong dopes or he doesn't, but until he is caught, he is clean, and that is all there is to it.

  10. #10
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    Or it hints at the fact that cycling is corrupt from the top down which, IMO, seems a bit more plausible than LA was clean and smoked a bunch of doped up pros or that his USPS teammates only doped (got caught) after they left Bruyneel and LA.

  11. #11
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    Last time I checked Lance never tested positive.

    If you're basing your allegations on what the f*cking liar Landis said, you should reconsider where you get your information. That guy's a douchebag and a f*cking liar to all extremes of the word.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit
    Armstrong has been tested literally thousands of times. A lot of people don't know that cycling also has strict "out of competition" tests, where someone can show up at your door unannounced, at anytime, anywhere, and you have 20 minutes to give them pee and blood.

    Another factor now is that samples are stored, and are subject to testing years later. So, if someone finds a new drug that current tests cannot detect, odds are eventually they will still be caught.

    Given that, I find it very difficult to believe Armstrong wouldn't have been caught somewhere along the line.

    Consider this: If athletes in ANY other professional sport faced the doping scrutiny of cycling, many sports would be completely different today. Do you really think NFL teams could field an offensive line with five 300+ plus guys if they weren't dosing? They are only tested six times a year, and the very strong whisper is that they KNOW when the hit is coming. Masking agents are the norm., And, if they take off to Mexico for a month in April for some "training", they don't have WADA banging on their doors and asking for a sample. Then, if they are caught, they get a whole big four game suspension. Cyclists? Two years. It is a joke. Baseball is even more of a joke.

    Either Armstrong dopes or he doesn't, but until he is caught, he is clean, and that is all there is to it.
    I agree with your points about cycling vs other sports, but the contention "never been caught means CLEAN" seems specious at best.

    http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/...172709693.html

    Oh, and the WADA official EPO page http://http://www.wada-ama.org/en/Re...EPO-Detection/

    The conservative approach used in the initial phase of implementation of the method allowed a large number of EPO abusers to escape detection.

    Consistent with the advancing science in anti-doping, work is done on an ongoing basis on all detection methods to refine their sensitivity and the interpretation of results. In the case of EPO, based on expert consensus, new interpretation criteria are introduced as science advances for a more discriminant reading of EPO results.
    EricN
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by smmokan
    Last time I checked Lance never tested positive.

    If you're basing your allegations on what the f*cking liar Landis said, you should reconsider where you get your information. That guy's a douchebag and a f*cking liar to all extremes of the word.
    I agree that Landis is a sh!tbag, but there is much more evidence to point that there is likely rampant DOPING.
    which I personally think athletes should be able to use/do PED LEGALLY.
    EricN
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by smmokan
    Last time I checked Lance never tested positive.
    Neither did Ivan Basso or Jan Ullrich or any # of pro athletes in any # of sports. Lance also never denies using PED's, just that he hasn't tested positive. That's about as big of a non-denial as there is.

    I hope work picks up on Monday cause the LA fanboys are about to implode and it's just too easy.

    Edit for linky: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/cycli...-details_x.htm
    Last edited by concretejungle; 05-21-2010 at 01:14 PM.

  15. #15
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    Whether LA is a doper or not, Landis is a sniveling b*tch for making the accusations he is. The whole thing reminds me of being 5 and trying to divert attention away from my stealing cookies by ratting out everyone else around me (not that I did steal those cookies).

    Now history will remember him as not only a doper, but a whining, backstabbing doper.
    Now with more vitriol!

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godzilla
    Whether LA is a doper or not, Landis is a sniveling b*tch for making the accusations he is. The whole thing reminds me of being 5 and trying to divert attention away from my stealing cookies by ratting out everyone else around me (not that I did steal those cookies).

    Now history will remember him as not only a doper, but a whining, backstabbing doper.
    Or someone who has realized the error of his ways and is trying to clean up the sport of cycling. Your version history will differ from some.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by concretejungle
    Or someone who has realized the error of his ways and is trying to clean up the sport of cycling. Your version history will differ from some.
    Nah, you're right. It's not like it's been widely known that professional cycling is rife with PED use for years now.

    They should give him a medal, for acting in such altruistic fashion during this - his time of suffering.
    Now with more vitriol!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godzilla
    Nah, you're right. It's not like it's been widely known that professional cycling is rife with PED use for years now.

    They should give him a medal, for acting in such altruistic fashion during this - his time of suffering.
    And they say you can't change minds arguing on the internetz.

    In other news T-minus an hour until I never have to work in Aurora again. Not really sure why they had me come in today. Thank god for the intrawebz and this Landis/LA mess or I would have been really bored.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by concretejungle
    Neither did Ivan Basso or Jan Ullrich or any # of pro athletes in any # of sports. Lance also never denies using PED's, just that he hasn't tested positive. That's about as big of a non-denial as there is.
    yeah, the whole Lance 'nuthugger' groupie thing boggles my mind.
    Yes, he is a tremendous athlete, who has done (7 tour victories), and overcome (testicular cancer) HUGE things in his life.

    That being said, I think it's pretty much a forgone conclusion that he is doing something shady.

    “I have nothing to hide,” Armstrong during a news conference with the press out at the Tour of California.

    “I think history speaks for itself here,” Armstrong continued.

    “We have nothing to hide. We have nothing to run from.”


    “It’s our word against his word,” Armstrong remarked. “I like our word. We like our credibility. Floyd lost his credibility a long time ago.”
    why not just deny the allegations...........that response sounds like an attorney speaking.
    or Bill Clinton.
    EricN
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by concretejungle
    Neither did Ivan Basso or Jan Ullrich or any # of pro athletes in any # of sports. Lance also never denies using PED's, just that he hasn't tested positive. That's about as big of a non-denial as there is.

    I hope work picks up on Monday cause the LA fanboys are about to implode and it's just too easy.

    Edit for linky: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/cycli...-details_x.htm
    Pro road cycling is a joke. There are 2 kinds of professional cyclist: those who dope, and those who get caught doping. Yes, Landis has no credibility, but he's got absolutely nothing left to lose. Just with the Lance accusers of the past (Frankie Andreu), the Armstrong character assassination team has cranked up to tear down and discredit Landis as much as possible. How many ex-USPS riders got nabbed! They learned the system somewhere. I wonder if Tyler Hamilton will come clean too. So from the late 90's, early 2000's posties, you have Heras, Hamilton, Landis, Pena, Beltran, Salvoldelli, O'Bee...on and on.

  21. #21
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    People said that Jose Canseco was a lying sack of sh&* that was full of sour grapes when he wrote his tell all. He had no credibility and was a full scale chump. Afterwards all of his allegations were proven true as one by one, the sports icons confessed. That means he is still a sack of sh&* - just not a lying sack of sh&*.

    I'm still on the fence but my weight is shifting more and more to the side of "everyone dopes"...

    This is one more weight in that side of the scale.

  22. #22
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    I'm here to post in this very important and enlightening thread.

  23. #23
    Your bike is incorrigible
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    Texas trailer trash usually doesn't dope, just drink a lot. Let's talk about how team Trek ruined the Leadville 100 by turning it into a road race. Now there's something to whine about.

  24. #24
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    If Landis was doping for years and only got caught once (and even now he says he was using hgh, not the steriod he tested positive for), it shows how bad/behind the times the testing is. If he can be tested for years on end and only tests positive once, WADA and other drug testers should hang their heads and work on improving their testing.

    Pro riders apparently know how to scam the system and really limit their chance of getting caught.

    What Landis is mad about is the system. Most top riders dope but when one gets caught, they are expected to go quietly (like Tyler Hamilton), i.e. get thrown to the wolves while staying quiet and protecting the rest of the peloton.

    FYI, the funny thing about the Amgen Tour of California is that Amgen, the main sponsor, is the drug company that makes EPO. Nice to those ads splashed everywhere on a pro event.

  25. #25
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    they sponsored it to help clean up...i mean literally or uh figuratively

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