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  1. #1
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    ...I hit a hiker...

    Last week, I was riding Enchanted Forest (on an even day of course, and yes I earned my turns) heading downhill at about 7:45. I was having a grand old time until that steep rooty section shortly before the bridge... When I got there, I saw a runner heading up that section and slowed down to a reasonable speed and kept right, and everything was fine, I was in control and he was in control..

    Then I slipped a pedal (I ride flats) and all of the sudden I wasn't in control anymore. My tire washed out on a root and sent me OTB and to the left where I collided with the runner. Luckily my bike bounced clear of him, and it wasn't a very fast crash... he didn't fall over or anything, but he was still pretty pissed. Although he did seem more concerned with his run (he didn't break stride much)
    I tore up my shin, tweaked my neck pretty good, ruined my derailleur, grips, and riding gear, and completely trashed my dignity...

    I'm pretty young but I'm no DHer, and I wanted to ask you what advice you have to this situation, whether it was my fault or if these things just happen sometimes?

  2. #2
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    Apex Trail Profiles - Open Space - Jefferson County, CO

    Enchanted Forest West trail junction w/ Apex Trail 1.3 mi +237' /
    -647' Densely wooded, crosses creek and has an average grade of 8%. One way mountain biking on odd-numbered days.

  3. #3
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    A general rule, something I picked up riding moto., is to come to a complete stop and let the hiker pass. Otherwise, Murphy's law is, nearly, unavoidable in this situation. Mountain biking is unpredictable and using due caution is necessary to avoid user conflicts.

  4. #4
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    Ultimately you're responsible for what happened. Many times there may be enough room to safely pass, but situations like this happen.

    A friend of mine and I were rising Kenosha when we came upon two good looking hikers. I was in front and stopped completely, although he had enough room, decided to do a stoppie (nose wheelie) to stop himself. It went all wrong and he went OTB. Landing inches from the two hikers.
    "what are you doing?" I asked my buddy, in denial language and partial embarrassment.

    One hiker responded quickly "showing off, but it didn't work out so well".

    We picked him up all had a laugh and went on.

    The day ended when he did it again in front of a bunch of Japanese tourists at the very end of the trail (literally within 15 feet of being done). OTB, except this time the cameras were flying.
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  5. #5
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    I thought the rule is you stop for hikers. You don't go slow and try to go around them...especially on a trail like Enchanted Forest.

    I would have been pissed as $#% if some biker hit me, because they're too lazy to stop and put a foot down.

  6. #6
    Front Range, Colorado
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    Quote Originally Posted by FooserX View Post
    I thought the rule is you stop for hikers. You don't go slow and try to go around them...especially on a trail like Enchanted Forest.

    I would have been pissed as $#% if some biker hit me, because they're too lazy to stop and put a foot down.
    Depends on the width of the section of trail. If it's wide enough for both to pass safely the biker should at least come to a slow crawl and pass. If the trail is a narrow singletrack the biker should stop and allow the hiker to pass. In any scenario the biker IMO should "always" greet the hiker a hello or good day or nod your head hi just to keep good vibes towards our sport. With the OP it sounded like he didn't at least slow to a crawl. And I hope the OP apologized more than once.
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  7. #7
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    Yeah, if you don't see them stop and get off the trail, you should stop. I think most hikers/runners know that it's harder for us to stop and start again and let us have the trail, but we have to yield to those that don't.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fuglio View Post
    You guys suck im all bummed now

  8. #8
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    It's the old, "the trail is wide enough for two" thinking that confuses the issue. Are there trails that are wide enough for two experienced riders/trail users to pass one another, sure. The problem is not everyone is an experienced rider or in control of their ride. Newbs get on here and read this...

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE, View Post
    Depends on the width of the section of trail. If it's wide enough for both to pass safely the biker should at least come to a slow crawl and pass. If the trail is a narrow singletrack the biker should stop and allow the hiker to pass. In any scenario the biker IMO should "always" greet the hiker a hello or good day or nod your head hi just to keep good vibes towards our sport. With the OP it sounded like he didn't at least slow to a crawl. And I hope the OP apologized more than once.
    ...and think they can roll past other users. I'm not calling you out DJ, you seem like a good dude who is an experienced rider, someone who can make that call. I just doubt that 1/2 the posters here are intelligent enough or experienced enough to make that call. Add a touch of "you're ruining my flow, dude" and you get situations like that described above. Error on the side of caution when encountering other users, get your flow on deserted trails.
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  9. #9
    Front Range, Colorado
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    .....
    Last edited by DIRTJUNKIE; 07-04-2012 at 12:57 PM.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE, View Post
    .....
    Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise:
    and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding


    you're on your way, son

  11. #11
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    This isn't you by chance?
    From the Police Blotter...

  12. #12
    Clyde on a mission!
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    Quote Originally Posted by fly-noon View Post
    Luckily my bike bounced clear of him, and it wasn't a very fast crash... he didn't fall over or anything, but he was still pretty pissed. Although he did seem more concerned with his run (he didn't break stride much)
    I tore up my shin, tweaked my neck pretty good, ruined my derailleur, grips, and riding gear, and completely trashed my dignity...
    The "didn't break stride much" part doesn't sit right with me, maybe I'm just reading it wrong, but he saw you crash, tear up your shin, tweak your neck and he didn't even slow down to check if you were alright?

  13. #13
    Front Range, Colorado
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    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise:
    and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding


    you're on your way, son
    Yeah right I was riding MTB while you were still in diapers. Wait from what I've witnessed over the 10 years on this site is you may be still in diapers KC.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandrenseren View Post
    The "didn't break stride much" part doesn't sit right with me, maybe I'm just reading it wrong, but he saw you crash, tear up your shin, tweak your neck and he didn't even slow down to check if you were alright?
    Is Strassholing only for bikes? Maybe there's a runner version...and just couldn't be bothered w/ another goddamn biker?

    Edit: STRAVA BLOWS GOATS! HAHAHAHA!
    Last edited by Pau11y; 07-24-2012 at 05:57 PM.
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  15. #15
    Front Range, Colorado
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandrenseren View Post
    The "didn't break stride much" part doesn't sit right with me, maybe I'm just reading it wrong, but he saw you crash, tear up your shin, tweak your neck and he didn't even slow down to check if you were alright?
    Exactly what went through my mind what a jackass not even a "are you alright".
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoney98 View Post
    This isn't you by chance?
    From the Police Blotter...
    Certainly wasn't me, as there was only one of him and only one of me

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandrenseren View Post
    The "didn't break stride much" part doesn't sit right with me, maybe I'm just reading it wrong, but he saw you crash, tear up your shin, tweak your neck and he didn't even slow down to check if you were alright?
    It wasn't a very spectacular crash, and I immediately hopped back up and started apologizing. My general demeanor would have suggested that I was just fine. He may well have asked if I was fine but with the rush of adrenaline and my worry about pissing him off I honestly don't remember. If he did ask if I was alright I'm certain I said yes (it's a bad habit of mine to say I'm fine no matter the injury)

  18. #18
    Clyde on a mission!
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    Quote Originally Posted by fly-noon View Post
    If he did ask if I was alright I'm certain I said yes (it's a bad habit of mine to say I'm fine no matter the injury)
    Kinda like this Eric Idle National Lampoon's European Vacation part 1 - YouTube ??

  19. #19
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    I'm not sure what to tell you. Maybe next time stop sooner if you can.

    Mistakes happen, you and everyone here will get over it.

  20. #20
    A guy on a bike Moderator
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    Your judgment of the conditions and your level of control was wrong, and you hit him--so it's 100% your fault. Maybe it would have been nice if he had understood that you were trying to be careful and all, but in the end you almost took him out. If he actually saw how banged up you were, he probably was damn glad that you didn't hit him harder--which obviously could have happened because you weren't in control and were apparently going fast enough to do real damage.

    Personally, I'd chalk this up as a good learning opportunity, and just be glad that it wasn't far worse. Had you done as much damage to him as you did to yourself, you might very well be sitting in court right now, contemplating more than a damaged ego. You got lucky this time. Be humbled, fix your bike, and keep riding--albeit more carefully.

  21. #21
    The Notorious S.L.O
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    on the jeffco trails....

    They were kind enough to put those cute little triangle signs with the neat graphics to show that the mtb rider has to yield to all other trails users, mentioning nothing about uphill/downhill. As I understand the rules/laws, a mountain biker must yield the right of way to every other trail users, walker, hiker, runner, dog walker, horse and rider, regardless of the uphill/downhill path of the mtb rider. We are at the bottom of the food chain.
    The user with the legal right of way is the only one who can surrender or share the right of way, ie, the other trail users has the right of way until he states for you “come on by”, otherwise the rules state that the mtb rider must stop and yield to the other user.
    In this situation, the user with the right of way, the runner, was the only person who could make the determination that the trail was wide enough for the two pass, and call out and surrender of share the right of way with the mtb rider.
    The uphill v. downhill right of way only applies to two mtb riders, with the conventional rules stating that uphill rider has the right of way and therefore, is also the one that makes the determination of safe passage of two, and calls out to share or surrender the right of way.
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  22. #22
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    Accidents happen. And there are many sections on Jeffco trails with blind corners or sections where it is hard for a downhill rider to completely stop. I would hope hikers and even other bikers understand that. That's why I say yield to downhill ;-) Even if the downhill biker slows down on these sections to be cautious of uphill traffic close calls still happen.

    I was coming down Chimney last week right above the lower foot bridge. Blind corner. Rider coming up. I jam the brakes and stop just in time. Rider says "nice stop bro". That's a guy who gets it.

    I wouldn't worry about it. If it happens again let the hiker blow off some steam and realize how dumb they are for getting all upset about it.

    Now if you were bombing down recklessly and didn't bother to make any attempt to avoid the person, well that's another story. But it sounds like you did the right thing.
    Yield to downhill

  23. #23
    Bad Andy!
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    btadlock. FooserX and rogbie, FTW.

    If it is the section I am thinking of - (right above the creek/trickle crossing - with a left as you go through creek/trickle, then the short off camber section), there is no way you should ride down that with anyone coming up.
    I have not seen anyone crash there, but it is easy to imagine - especially if you are on a line you are not familiar with - which is probably anywhere to the right, which is where you said you were. The left/middle is the line I have seen 99% of the riders take. Definitely wide enough for 2 people there, but way too steep and a bit techy to consider a safe pass with another user.

    Even if someone verbally gives the go-ahead on a wide/buff enough trail, and they keep coming, if there is any chance of an accident, STOP! It will only take a couple seconds, and potentially provide much more good will for MTBers.

    I was on Cent Cone on the 4th, coming down Mayhem, and a rider was coming up on a pretty narrow stretch of ST. he said to keep on coming, but we both would have had to be pretty careful right where we would have met, to not at least knock bars, and who knows from there. It's not worth it.
    If I was the runner, I would be pissed too - you hit him!!!

    Definitely your fault, but good job for questioning the proper way to handle it in the future. Learn from it and move on.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by PuraVida View Post
    Accidents happen.
    word

  25. #25
    The Notorious S.L.O
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    Whoa....upon a re-read.

    Looks like I came across a bit condescending and judgmental against the OP, that was not the intent in the least, the JeffCO rules that have mtb bikers at the bottom of the trail user chain is offensive, as our rights are subjugated to all others, regardless of their behavior, right or wrong, we have to yield to their right away.

    Unfortunately, the rules are the rules and we have to live within them until we can have them revisited.
    BT
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