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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleTrail View Post
    You're wise to do so. Remember back in the Clinton Administration when there were these big debates over the ethics of whether or not we should attempt splicing human-animal genes? Well, not 15 feet away from me sat an incubator with human/mouse hybrid cells inside. We were already doing it before the media even began discussing whether or not we should. Happy Halloween.

    As far as UAV's in a domestic setting. My issue is that they will start to be used for traffic/code enforcement, and other revenue generating operations, in addition to violating my 4th Amendment rights. That's how things are rolled out. Kind of like the microphones in street lights. At first it's "to get the bad guys", then before you know it, we're snooping on private conversations of everyone walking down the street and then running the words through key word filters.

    With the introduction of UAV's, it's not too difficult to understand many cities quick discontinuance of red light cameras. They probably got a DHS grant to purchase UAV's...
    traffic enforcement will be the next step. Maybe that's the reason why CDOT still has the aerial speed enforcement signs up?

    EDIT: Think about how many speeding tickets could be written in one day by a single drone with an automated camera system. Hundreds if not thousands of tickets a day. You don't think that type of revenue stream is tempting?

    I think you really have jumped the shark. You may need a titanium hat at this rate.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnauzers View Post
    I think you really have jumped the shark. You may need a titanium hat at this rate.
    Paranoid IS patriotic.

    The 2nd Amendment isn't there so you can shoot your pop gun at the range or go deer hunting... think about it. It's there because our founders were PARANOID.

  3. #53
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    fixed wing is so passé

    rotors are where it's at...

    Public safety surveillance drone debuts
    Thursday, October 27, 2011

    Public safety surveillance drone debuts
    -
    .And following our will and wind . . .
    . . .We'll ride the spiral to the end
    and may just go where no one's been.

  4. #54
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    I can see drones' usefulness in a military capacity but, as a habitual speeder I don't want to see a swarm of drones ticketing all of us ordinary citizens as we go about our mundane otherwise lawful days. Its like another electronic babysitter. I cannot see a municipality resisting such a revenue stream and I can see the use of drones to monitor citizens spiraling out of control because domestic law enforcement agencies don't know when to quit. I can see why the military needs to be able to train with drones but unfortunately domestic law enforcement must be salivating at the prospect of utilizing them as well. I'd be cool with drones if they were only used to kill bad guys over seas.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by russman View Post
    I'm probably in the minority, but I have no problems with drones, nor their use. They make the bad guys quiver in their caves and it puts no American service members at risk. I hope they use more.
    Rah Rah and all, but something tells me that our indiscriminate use of "drone diplomacy" is going to result in some serious "drone blowback" in the coming years. We are diving headlong into the age of the "Video Game War" (aka Drone-Kill Nation) and we seem to have a "if a little is good, then more is better" (giddy even) mentality about it. We are definitely in uncharted territory, especially when it comes to international law. Just the mental health issues that have been reported by drone pilots are enough to give one pause. When you're killing anywhere from 10 to 50 civilians for each intended target and then going home to have dinner with your wife and kids, how could you not break down?

    Drone-Kill Culture: Predator Playstations

    "I have two words for you, predator drones. LOL"

    "We came, we saw, he died. LOL"

  6. #56
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    I'd be cool with Drones if we could legally shot them down - Pull!

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnauzers View Post
    I think you really have jumped the shark. You may need a titanium hat at this rate.
    Don't be so naive, it's already happening.

    The Department of Homeland Security is issuing 100% grants for Local Law Enforcement Agencies to purchase drones equipped with non-lethal weapons and surveillance equipment under the Homeland Security Grant Program(HSGP).

    Local Law Enforcement Agencies are now connected to the Homeland Security Information Network (HSIN) and ALL "collected data" is uploaded, stored and shared with local, state and federal agencies across the nation as needed (actually the HSIN site says "federal, state, local, tribal, territorial, private sector, and international partners"). Our local "Fusion Center" is located in Centennial and is called the Colorado Information Analysis Center(CIAC).

    Obviously the Department of Homeland Security is not giving away $500k drones to help give speeding tickets, but once the price comes down, that would be a pretty obvious application. Many states have used small planes to identify speeders for decades and that plane and pilot isn't cheap... of course that plane and pilot isn't equipped with high-resolution optics, FLIR and thermal imagining, nor can it fly silently and invisibly a mere 600 feet above your neighborhood either.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by topmounter View Post
    Don't be so naive, it's already happening.

    The Department of Homeland Security is issuing 100% grants for Local Law Enforcement Agencies to purchase drones equipped with non-lethal weapons and surveillance equipment under the Homeland Security Grant Program(HSGP).

    Local Law Enforcement Agencies are now connected to the Homeland Security Information Network (HSIN) and ALL "collected data" is uploaded, stored and shared with local, state and federal agencies across the nation as needed (actually the HSIN site says "federal, state, local, tribal, territorial, private sector, and international partners"). Our local "Fusion Center" is located in Centennial and is called the Colorado Information Analysis Center(CIAC).

    Obviously the Department of Homeland Security is not giving away $500k drones to help give speeding tickets, but once the price comes down, that would be a pretty obvious application. Many states have used small planes to identify speeders for decades and that plane and pilot isn't cheap... of course that plane and pilot isn't equipped with high-resolution optics, FLIR and thermal imagining, nor can it fly silently and invisibly a mere 600 feet above your neighborhood either.
    If you are not breaking the law than it isn't a problem. Right?

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnauzers View Post
    If you are not breaking the law than it isn't a problem. Right?
    It's against the law for you or I to peep in peoples windows, why do feel it's ok for the cops to do so using a drone?

  10. #60
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    I can see the "authorities" nit picking us even more then they already do with these automated methods. Nobody's perfect but it'll be about revenue so we'll have to be perfect little good citizens or we'll automatically be photographed, tried, and convicted, repeatedly before we even know about the infraction. It'll start with traffic enforcement and then balloon from there. I know its politically incorrect to admit it, but I don't trust the police to be reasonable, especially with budgets tightening up.

  11. #61
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    this thread is so full of awesome

  12. #62
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    One mans opinion

    First off the fear mongering in this thread is out of control, if you think the Gov't want's to spend money on stupid things like traffic patrol, your putting to much confidence in the bureaucratic process. The one thing we have in this country is freedom, not in my life will they ever take that away, we can always vote them out and change the laws back. Salazar is a joke, the man is worse than Newt Gingrich but because he has a D the drones in human form think what he is doing is OK.
    The comment that the US should not use drones in other countries is idiotic, there is still a human behind the machine an I believe it makes no difference if the person is 35k in the air or 3500 miles away, they are both looking into a monitor for video verification. If your talking Afghanistan we tried the boots on the ground and the men got there arses shot off because we put them in a no win situation given the terrain and the tribal environment. Simply put we are hated in that part of the world, our belief in freedom, equal rights and religious choice make us an enemy, we won't change that. I also believe if we sit here and do nothing the fight will return to our soil, get some balls and understand the US and most of Europe are the enemy, freedom is not free nor is it easy.

    As for the Pinion Canyon site all I will say is the NIMBY attitude has gone to far, Colorado is poised to take billions of dollars in the coming years as most training facilities are being downsized or closed for a number of reason around the nation. If we don't give our military a place to train I can see Mexico stepping up and charging us to use land south of the border, is that really in our best interest. This site is ideal for training, not much else can be done with the land but because it has been passed through generations they feel it there inherit rite to keep the land, to me the whole situation should be resolve as fast as possible, we are way to empathetic in a moronic way.
    Kinda like the occupy wall street people, "Anti capitalist is all they are" Federal regulation has cause the problem and this is just a distraction from the truth

    I have more but will wait to see the Saul Alinsky tactics come to fruition.

    Dam,
    Bikes are FUN

  13. #63
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    Dang. My bad. I thought I was in a mountain bike forum.

  14. #64
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    Wow what a thread of retardness. Go ride your bikes

  15. #65
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    Things get VERY murky now that we're flying these things anywhere we want, anytime we want, with little or no cooperation (or knowledge even) by the country in question.

    If I was an innocent civilan living in a country with armed drones flying overhead that were killing 10x to 50x more civilians than their intended targets... who am I going to consider the "enemy"? Of course fear of getting moved to the naughty-list would keep me from complaining publicly.

    At least when politicians and generals decide to put boots on the ground and butts in the seat, there is a direct correlation between and understanding of the risks and the rewards, not to mention the consequences (intended or otherwise) and accountability of any given mission.

    But I digress, we need to turn these swords into plowshares... or rather... drones that can carry extra water bottles, food, tools and contact emergency services when things go bad

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    this thread is so full of awesome
    Agreed. I'm loving the debate between conspiracy theories & who cares about collateral damage, just git er done!

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnauzers View Post

    Don't worry, I only have the wireless cameras focused on my neighbor.
    You spy on your neighbor? Seriously?

    And you call UT paranoid?!
    A man must have enemies and places he is not welcome. In the end we are not only defined by our friends but those against us.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by DWF View Post
    You spy on your neighbor? Seriously?

    And you call UT paranoid?!
    Depends how hot the neighbor is...

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by DWF View Post
    You spy on your neighbor? Seriously?

    And you call UT paranoid?!
    No, not spy. You'd have to read through my past threads about the issues with the neighbor. He has been caught taunting my dogs (tries to get them to bark for more than 10 minutes), which is a fine-able offense. It was recommended that I put in cameras focused on the dog run to document the next time it happens. They are security cameras, not peeping Tom cameras.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottap2003 View Post
    Depends how hot the neighbor is...
    68 years old and rides her bike in the basement. Need I say more?

  21. #71
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    Don't know which is more disturbing, this thread and people that believe in the silly poor me the spies are going to get us tin foil hat crap or
    http://pixyland.org/peterpan/
    click you know you want to!!

    I tapped that

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnauzers View Post
    68 years old and rides her bike in the basement. Need I say more?
    She can still whup your ass with her pinky?



    ok, ok, ok... this thread wouldn't be right without a picture of a girl
    on a grandma bike. ‘omafiets’

    so there you go. Thoroughly derailed from the original topic.

    Why does Ken Salazar keep proposing wilderness areas, but also supports sharing of public airspace with military hardware built by a company that does this:

    "Uranium contamination from Schwartzwalder reaches Ralston Creek northwest of Golden, which flows into a reservoir that supplies drinking water for 1.3 million metro residents."

    "Tests along Ralston Creek have found elevated uranium levels as high as 310 parts per billion, well above the 30 ppb state health standard for drinking water."

    Colorado demands Cotter Corp. clean up mine that's leaking uranium - The Denver Post

    Don't drink the water! It's not just for Mexico any longer.

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnauzers View Post
    If you are not breaking the law than it isn't a problem. Right?
    Well, no, it is a problem. As Ben Franklin said, "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." So regardless of whether or not you're breaking the law, we, as citizens, have to hold the government to the rule of law. Being apathetic because you're "not doing anything wrong" is a slippery slope.

    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    this thread is so full of awesome
    No, this thread is so full of fail that that word doesn't even come close to doing it justice!

    Quote Originally Posted by lidarman View Post
    Hey people. Just FYI

    Do your homework.

    Sadly, you might even find out your uncle is a wacko.
    And that's being nice. Now where's that ignore button?
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  24. #74
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    A cattle mutilation bump

    Yeah?
    Naysayers never apologize. Critics go to their grave thinking everyone else is wrong.
    ╭∩╮( º.º )╭∩╮

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by KarateChicken View Post
    this thread is so full of awesome
    No, THIS is the awesomeness: Chicken Power
    Naysayers never apologize. Critics go to their grave thinking everyone else is wrong.
    ╭∩╮( º.º )╭∩╮

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