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  1. #1
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    All Winter Park trails are downhill only now?

    I just found this over at 303cycling.com Can anybody tell me when this went into effect? Seems very strange that you hold XC races there but now no one can train at the resort.

    As you may know, Winter Park Resort does not allow uphill mountain biking anymore. Since the development of the Trestle Bike Park, all of the trails are now designated as downhill trails. Most riders typically spend the day at the park and access the trails by riding up the chairlift and then blasting down the trails (hence the downhill designation only).

    Maybe this is just about lost revenue from those skinny XC guys or has there been trail conflicts lately?
    Proud Tribe member since 1992 - looking for better singletrack to be ridden year round

  2. #2
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    You can't ride up the service roads?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkaredShtles View Post
    You can't ride up the service roads?
    I see guys riding up the service roads all the time. Just can't ride up the trails, which makes sense.

  4. #4
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    climb the service roads...
    DO NOT climb the single track... you will not be yielded for, you will cause a crash, people will not like you..

    There is a gazillion miles of single track you can climb OUTSIDE of the Trestle Bike park.

  5. #5
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    For the safety of all Trestle® Bike Park guests, riding or hiking up trails is not permitted during operating hours. Uphill riding is ONLY permitted on the Summer Road or on Icarus Trail (outside the Bike Park).

    Seems reasonable....

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetirich View Post
    As you may know, Winter Park Resort does not allow uphill mountain biking anymore. Since the development of the Trestle Bike Park, all of the trails are now designated as downhill trails.
    True, but they do give out free skirts with the purchse of a lift ticket.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleTrail View Post
    True, but they do give out free skirts with the purchse of a lift ticket.
    Never seen one myself, but okay...
    So, would you like to ride up those DH trails (good luck with that...)? Not following the thinking behind this post...
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetirich View Post
    or has there been trail conflicts lately?
    Wouldn't it kinda conflict with the whole purpose of a lift accessed bike park?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan12210 View Post
    Wouldn't it kinda conflict with the whole purpose of a lift accessed bike park?
    no different than allowing uphill skinning in the winter (which many resorts allow).

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bagwhan View Post
    no different than allowing uphill skinning in the winter (which many resorts allow).
    Sure, no different other than the fact that a ski slope is 50 feet wide or more in most places while a mtn bike trail may only be wide enough to let 1 rider through. Gimme a break dude. You guys are just mad because it's one less place to b**** about people not yielding to uphill riders.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bagwhan View Post
    no different than allowing uphill skinning in the winter (which many resorts allow).
    For clarification: many area that do have winter uphill access do NOT allow it during operating hours.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    Never seen one myself, but okay...
    So, would you like to ride up those DH trails (good luck with that...)? Not following the thinking behind this post...

    Actually I have. We used to race UP many of those trails back in the day.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleTrail View Post
    Actually I have. We used to race UP many of those trails back in the day.
    Were there people going 30mph going down them at the time? If there was, was it even a concern that you might get knocked off your dinosaur?

  14. #14
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    Just go after the lifts close and have at it. Why would anyone want to pedal uphill against traffic moving at 30+mph in full body armor is beyond me?

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  15. #15
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    I think what yetirich is referring to, is NOT the Dbl-Black & blue trails that have always been DH only, but what is being questioned is the stuff that many hardcore DH riders never really touched anyway... like the network of greens & blues (Little Vasquez, Cherokee, Roof of the Rockies come to mind) that are off to the north & west of what is the original DH Trestle Park.
    When you dig into the link rich posted, it seems a little ambiguous if the those trails are what they are referring too, because the official trail map on WP's site still shows directional arrows up & down on several trails...

    http://trestlebikepark.com/downloads...ap2013_web.pdf

    But if it is true that everything is downhill only now, I guess I can understand (but not necessarily like it)...
    I might guess that as the sport is growing, there are plenty of beginner DH'ers, families with kids that want to expose them to the sport, and heavy-breathing flatlanders that go there now & they are most likely to be riding the greens & mild-blues down to practice or just have a mellow ride ride, and the uphillers are getting in the way...?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan12210 View Post
    Sure, no different other than the fact that a ski slope is 50 feet wide or more in most places while a mtn bike trail may only be wide enough to let 1 rider through. Gimme a break dude. You guys are just mad because it's one less place to b**** about people not yielding to uphill riders.
    Breathe. Relax. I'm not mad, I've only ridden WP once (and stay away from all lift served as a rule). I was just pointing out that it is possible for the two to coexist, like having a trail or two or three designated as two way. There's no inherent conflict. Years ago, I rode uphill at WP when the lifts were spinning, and IIRC, the trail map directed us to certain trails that we could ride.

    Quote Originally Posted by Full Trucker View Post
    For clarification: many area that do have winter uphill access do NOT allow it during operating hours.
    And many allow it during operation (with rules); I wasn't intending my post to be a full explanation of all uphill skinning policies. :shrug:

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by liqwid View Post
    Were there people going 30mph going down them on 40lbs DH sleds, and armored up like a linebacker at the time?
    Fixed it for you...
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleTrail View Post
    Actually I have. We used to race UP many of those trails back in the day.
    me too, but mtn biking has evolved greatly since then, thankfully.

    in the end there are many more miles of trails you can ride up than there are trails that you can only ride down, get over it and go pedal, it will make you happy.
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  19. #19
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    You should be happy that places like TBP are providing lift services for the DH crowd, it keeps them (us) in one place and away from multi-use trails. With bike tech and personal preference shining the way it does, it's only good that trails like these be designated one way.

    Also, as mentioned, there are ways to get up the mountain on multi-directional trails and service roads where you won't conflict with the DH crowd.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetirich View Post
    Seems very strange that you hold XC races there but now no one can train at the resort.
    I raced there a couple years, and don't remember any of the courses going up the resort trails. Maybe a little on Green World, but I think it was mostly riding up the road on your way to Frasier, or down Green World coming back to the resort.

    I like no uphill traffic or hikers on the trail. Resorts are the only place you can bomb downhill, and not worry about other users (minus slower riders and crashes).
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    You guys suck im all bummed now

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigSteve in CO View Post
    Resorts are the only place you can bomb downhill, and not worry about other users (minus slower riders and crashes).
    Man, the thought of crashes gives me the heebee geebees! There are plenty of blind drop-in that someone could be rolling around in the bottom of, and it'd be a complete unknown until you're airborne...the third wood feature on Double Jep, the lower most drop-in on Beall...

    OT: has anyone on here been getting on the wall after the 1st drop on Double Jep? I've been trying to "double" it to avoid the flat area so I can keep speed to double the next two...
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    the third wood feature on Double Jep
    Its funny you mention that. First year they opened that trail I almost took out a guy who cut over from long trail at the bottom of that drop. Still makes me slow down before I drop that...

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleTrail View Post
    True, but they do give out free skirts with the purchase of a lift ticket.
    You guys should know better than to take something I say ^^^ so seriously.

    If anyone is pro bike park and DH only trails... it's me. And yes we used to race up those @ '93~'94. And I do understand bikes are different now, the speeds are higher, and the experience levels are lower.

  24. #24
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    I understand having a DH park, but one uphill/ downhill trail that isn't part of the DH parks trail system should have been added to allow visitors a chance to ride an uphill trail. Not everyone wants to bomb downhill in a padded suit, and telling a visitor to go off mountain because we can't accommodate any uphill riders anywhere on a 3000 acre mountain isn't the best management.

    Here in Steamboat MtWerner has added several DH specific trails, and taken away one of our climbs to make an easier DH only trail, but Valley View is still open for uphill riders, its posted for two way traffic, but is passed over by most DH riders who prefer the more DH designed trails. or the service road is available to climb. Choices. It's great to get these DH specific trails, it has removed DH shuttled riders from other trails in the area. I'm glad that Steamboat hasn't closed all the trails to uphill riders.

  25. #25
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    All Winter Park trails are downhill only now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bagwhan View Post
    And many allow it during operation (with rules); I wasn't intending my post to be a full explanation of all uphill skinning policies. :shrug:
    And there are also bike parks in this state that have designated uphill and/or multi-directional trails open for use during operating hours in the summer time, with rules. The intent of my post was to show that there are many uphill access policies utilized in the winter, just like in the summer. Each resort area will have their own policy based on the particular needs and constraints of that area. In the specific instance if Winter Park, is it a drag that uphill access on bike park trails is no longer available during operating hours? For some, yes. But objectively evaluating the usage of the bike park trails would lead me (and I would hope most others) to believe the uphill policy is in place mainly for the safety of all users. And not just the armor clad DH set, but the other 50%* of the bike park users: dads, moms, kids, people on vacation trying something new, etc.





    *percentage estimated by personal experience, not intended to be a cited statistic from any known source.

    **EDIT: Also, as the OP alluded to, this policy is most likely financially driven. Caring for the safety of their customers, as well as their overall bike park experience, is what makes a bike park profitable. They are, after all, a business.
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  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by liqwid View Post
    Its funny you mention that. First year they opened that trail I almost took out a guy who cut over from long trail at the bottom of that drop. Still makes me slow down before I drop that...
    I've stopped pre-jumping that one and floating over the top, unless I know it's clear...
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbsbiker View Post
    I understand having a DH park, but one uphill/ downhill trail that isn't part of the DH parks trail system should have been added to allow visitors a chance to ride an uphill trail. Not everyone wants to bomb downhill in a padded suit, and telling a visitor to go off mountain because we can't accommodate any uphill riders anywhere on a 3000 acre mountain isn't the best management.
    Yes it is. Go somewhere else if you don't want to ride the terrain presented by the bike park.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbsbiker View Post
    I understand having a DH park, but one uphill/ downhill trail that isn't part of the DH parks trail system should have been added to allow visitors a chance to ride an uphill trail. Not everyone wants to bomb downhill in a padded suit, and telling a visitor to go off mountain because we can't accommodate any uphill riders anywhere on a 3000 acre mountain isn't the best management.

    Here in Steamboat MtWerner has added several DH specific trails, and taken away one of our climbs to make an easier DH only trail, but Valley View is still open for uphill riders, its posted for two way traffic, but is passed over by most DH riders who prefer the more DH designed trails. or the service road is available to climb. Choices. It's great to get these DH specific trails, it has removed DH shuttled riders from other trails in the area. I'm glad that Steamboat hasn't closed all the trails to uphill riders.
    Considering that you live in the 'Boat, why would you EVEN want to mix it up w/ the DH scene when you want to trail ride? Emerald, Rabbit Ears, S/N Routt are ALL way better than The Mountain for getting out for a trail ride...no?
    Naysayers never apologize. Critics go to their grave thinking everyone else is wrong.
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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbsbiker View Post
    I understand having a DH park, but one uphill/ downhill trail that isn't part of the DH parks trail system should have been added to allow visitors a chance to ride an uphill trail.
    The good news is this already exists, everywhere other than the DH parks trail system. Feel free to enjoy, there is more than just the one hill here in Colorado.

  30. #30
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    timing is everything...

    All Winter Park trails are downhill only now?-img_1433.jpg
    We don't need more to be thankful for; we just need to be more thankful.

  31. #31
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    I'm an old-school XC rider, but I have accepted that the sport continues to evolve. I "let go" of the ski mountain at Winter Park years ago. It was hard at first, since I did a ton of riding up and down those trails in my early years of riding in Colorado in the 90's. It makes sense that DH'ers would have some places to ride to call their own. No doubt it's good for the resort's bottom line, charging for lift access and all. They didn't get a dime out of me when I would ride from the bottom to the top and back down again.

    You'll get over it, OP. Give it time. There's no shortage of trails for riders of all types in CO.

  32. #32
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    I would guess this is driven by liability concerns as much as anything else. You have to sign a waiver to get on the lift, but anyone pedaling up could get in over their head on the way down without signing anything, and the resort could be in a much weaker position if it needed to defend legal claims.
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by golden boy View Post
    You'll get over it, OP. Give it time. There's no shortage of trails for riders of all types in CO.
    There is nothing to get over GB. I have not ridden in Winter Park in decades. I was just doing the community a service by bringing to everyone's attention.
    Proud Tribe member since 1992 - looking for better singletrack to be ridden year round

  34. #34
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    You can ride up them just get there before the lifts open and you an ride up any thing you want. The trail up the Mary Jain side is open to climb aswell.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleTrail View Post
    You guys should know better than to take something I say ^^^ so seriously.
    But I want a gift T-shirt...gifts are cool!
    Naysayers never apologize. Critics go to their grave thinking everyone else is wrong.
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  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    Considering that you live in the 'Boat, why would you EVEN want to mix it up w/ the DH scene when you want to trail ride? Emerald, Rabbit Ears, S/N Routt are ALL way better than The Mountain for getting out for a trail ride...no?
    To note, I do not want to ride up the DH trails.

    That's the point, Winter Park has lost me, I know they don't care as I'm easily replaced. But why not just toss a bone to the visitors that don't know better places to ride, and may be traveling to this area and want a nice place to try their fitness without the "dangers" that the real trails offer up. The bike park has safe, well designed trails and the safety of the on mountain experience, but if you can't, or don't want to DH ride, you are left to your own resources. Like you said, I'm in Steamboat, got plenty of great trails to ride, Just thought I would add my opinion, that a "bike park" should include a uphill/ downhill multi use trail for visitors.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbsbiker View Post
    To note, I do not want to ride up the DH trails.

    That's the point, Winter Park has lost me, I know they don't care as I'm easily replaced. But why not just toss a bone to the visitors that don't know better places to ride, and may be traveling to this area and want a nice place to try their fitness without the "dangers" that the real trails offer up. The bike park has safe, well designed trails and the safety of the on mountain experience, but if you can't, or don't want to DH ride, you are left to your own resources. Like you said, I'm in Steamboat, got plenty of great trails to ride, Just thought I would add my opinion, that a "bike park" should include a uphill/ downhill multi use trail for visitors.
    The last thing the park wants to do is offer uphill trails. Then they can't charge you outrageous fees for lift tickets.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbogner View Post
    I would guess this is driven by liability concerns as much as anything else. You have to sign a waiver to get on the lift, but anyone pedaling up could get in over their head on the way down without signing anything, and the resort could be in a much weaker position if it needed to defend legal claims.
    That's probably a good guess, and one that there is no real response to. All the other reasons don't explain why having one or 2 designated uphill trails is bad. The money lost is minimal, as the person riding up the mountain there isn't likely to buy a lift pass. And one reason why someone might want to ride up is because they are there with a group (family, friends, whatever) and riding uphill allows them to do what they want and stay with their friends. Not allowing them to do that might not hurt the resort at all, but it might make a family choose somewhere else to go. IOW, I see no harm or loss to the resort by designating an uphill trail. Except for the liability reason, and while that is still likely covered by signage and whatnot, I can see the decision to just make that person a trespasser.

  39. #39
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    Occasionally I'l use the ski areas at Breck or Keystone to do loops but only after operating hours. I can't imagine riding uphill, against the storm troopers when the lifts are spinning. I value my life too much.

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    Service roads are still fair game right? What's the problem? In CO we are blessed to have thousands of FREE trails, all over the friggen place. I ride Keystone all the time. Ride up the service road, then down their trails. It's fun, I feel no need to ride up singletrack, the service road is just fine with me. Guess I just don't see what the problem is.

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    There are plenty of free places to climb. I ride XC and DH and respect both. I think its nice to go somewhere and have a chance to bomb some trails and not be concerned about stopping every 2 minutes for climbers and hikers.

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    Look at the map people

    I count two different ways to climb trails at Trestle. And if you know where to look, there are a couple more.

    Please review the map

    So you can have your cake and eat it too.

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    I rowed up Rainmaker today, everyone was really nice and courteous. I used Stravers and set a PR, it was teh rad!
    the drugs made me realize it's not about the drugs

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by WKD-RDR View Post
    I rowed up Rainmaker today, everyone was really nice and courteous. I used Stravers and set a PR, it was teh rad!
    Well boats do always have the right of way, up or down.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by splitter_66 View Post
    I count two different ways to climb trails at Trestle. And if you know where to look, there are a couple more.

    Please review the map
    So you can have your cake and eat it too.
    Yep, there are ways to ride up to the top without hitting any of the designated DH trails.

    There are also 1000's of miles of great trails outside the small confines of the Bike Park.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by splitter_66 View Post
    I count two different ways to climb trails at Trestle. And if you know where to look, there are a couple more.

    Please review the map

    So you can have your cake and eat it too.
    Yup. I don't think anything has changed since, what, the mid-2000s when they banned uphill on Cheyenne/upper Arapahoe? Icarus is still bidirectional.

  47. #47
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    normal people go places to mountain bike and have fun, usually its best to head for what a certain area is good it. within trestle bike park... clearly that has become trails that head down the hill. you'll have more fun if you just ride the lift up and rip down shy anne and long trail, have a beer, some fish taco's, give some dudes high fives and smile. I see TONS of people on regular trailbikes having a blast at the park.

    if thats not your idea of fun... its not like we are lacking in non lift serviced trails.
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  48. #48
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    I climb up the service road with no problems, once you are up there you can go both directions on Roof of the Rockies. You can also climb up Icarus on the Mary Jane side and lower Arapahoe on the WP side...that said there is so much good single track in the Fraser Valley you should be able to find all the climbing you want.

  49. #49
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    Rode WinterPark last Friday and had the GoPro going. GPS said I maxed out at 41MPH. They have placed berms on most of the trails so the speeds are much higher, not to mention that there are many blind corners. Pretty sure one of us would be seriously injured if I ran into you on the way down.

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  50. #50
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    In the interest of continuing a thread that should have died long ago, anyone know the penalty for breaking this rule....other than a broken jaw, crushed bike, and ruptured spleen?

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