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  1. #1
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    1UP-USA.COM vs 1UPUSA.COM....who knows what?

    UPDATE AS OF TUESDAY, SEPT 5TH

    I called the "old" 1UP and was told over the phone almost the exact same thing as J Westy which was.....Thanks for reaching out to 1UP USA. We’re very sorry for the current confusing matter of a “new rack”. 1UP USA.com LLC and www.1up-usa.com are not introducing a new rack model in 2017 or near future 2018. We have nothing to do with the other company and are not working with them in any manner.

    I guess to comes down to personal choice at this point....do you stay with the tried & true or decided you like the new updates and/or want to save a lil' money at the risk of getting an inferior product? I personally want the current model but will wait it out because if the "new" company can make any headway, I think the "old" company will be forced to lower their prices. A win-win for the consumer!!

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    OK, I'm starting a new thread because this discussion is getting buried on the old "1UP USA" Review thread...

    Apparently the tried and true 1UP racks website is 1UP-USA.COM while there is also a "new" 1UPUSA.COM (notice there is no hyphen). Anyway, people are asking if they are the same company even though the listed phones numbers and addresses are different.

    The "new" site highlights design changes and "improvements" but to ME, the product looks like a copy that isn't built as well. Some people may be aware of the RTIC cooler brand that came on the scene and is a near exact replica of Yeti coolers but selling for half the price. I think the same thing is going on here. How else are the prices lower all of the sudden?

    I will be calling the original company on Tuesday and will have some answers.
    Last edited by k2rider1964; 3 Weeks Ago at 08:41 AM.
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  2. #2
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    Thanks for clarifying this. I look forward to hearing what the hell's going on.

  3. #3
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    Also curious. Assuming the new design is as rugged and reliable it does seem to be a lot more convenient. However, I'd really like the opportunity to get one more add on before they discontinue the old design...

  4. #4
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    If you google map satellite the "new" street address, it doesn't look like anything is there...
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  5. #5
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    According to whois, the 1up-usa.com address is the newer one (created in 2016) whereas 1upusa.com was created in 2000. Both on godaddy.

    That said, the hyphenated address has a much more complete site with all the product offerings (not just a hitch rack).

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_Westy View Post
    If you google map satellite the "new" street address, it doesn't look like anything is there...
    There's a light industrial building nearby. I don't necessarily trust Google to display address locations at exactly the correct spot every time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    According to whois, the 1up-usa.com address is the newer one (created in 2016) whereas 1upusa.com was created in 2000. Both on godaddy.

    That said, the hyphenated address has a much more complete site with all the product offerings (not just a hitch rack).
    The one without the hyphen is the URL they used to use. It is even on their labels on older racks.

    Another oddity, the YouTube video for the new rack is not posted under 1UP USA's YouTube channel.

    Hoping this mystery gets solved soon. Need a new rack and was going to order a 1UP, but if the new rack is legit and coming out soon, it seems to have some nice features. Just want to make sure it is backed by the 1UP everyone knows.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oktavius View Post
    Hoping this mystery gets solved soon. Need a new rack and was going to order a 1UP, but if the new rack is legit and coming out soon, it seems to have some nice features. Just want to make sure it is backed by the 1UP everyone knows.
    Exactly why I'll be calling on tuesday morning. I'm in the same boat.
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  9. #9
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    If the new rack is the real deal, I'm glad I got the old one.
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    Well, if you're interested in the "old" 1Up. Here is the new EZ Pull handle. Works as good as it looks. But the "new" tilt release mechanism being put out by the "new" 1Up appears to work nicely. WTFO

  11. #11
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    I just ordered a rack from them a couple weeks ago. If you go to the old site and try to buy it willl redirect you to the new site. So, no worries as they are he same company.

    edit: The new, new site looks different than the old, new site which is what I was talking about. The racks are different as well. So disregard my statement, they are definitely different.

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    I don't think so. Go to the links posted by k2rider1964. Totally, well not totally, different products. The new company has some nice features, but it doesn't look as heavily built as what I've purchased. YMMV

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    Yeah, I just looked at both websites. I'll be interested to hear the answer. Looks to me like two companies who branched off of one. Different phone numbers, different addresses, different towns.

    FWIW, the old website has new website content from before the time that it redirected to the current new website. I bought another rack at that time and remember what the original website looked like. Seems a little odd to create a new website, direct everyone over there and then update the old site. In other words, if it was the same company, they are updating both the new and the supposedly obsolete website.

    I'm wondering if someone who worked there before, and had left, now has a noncompete that expired and it's game on. The guy who started the company and was the original designer (Cal was his first name) hasn't been there for a number of years now.


    J.

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    I imagine k2 will clear things up on Tuesday.
    I wish the 1Up2 video showed a close up of the tilt mechanism. Also, it's nice to have a locking feature for the rack. That being said, I think the padlock solution could be defeated much easier than the Kryptonite lock I have on my 1Up1 rack.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 72guy View Post
    I don't think so. Go to the links posted by k2rider1964. Totally, well not totally, different products. The new company has some nice features, but it doesn't look as heavily built as what I've purchased. YMMV
    Just spent some time looking at the racks and the new one doesn't look as robust as the old one. It's definitely a different product, they are careful to call it a Quick Rack everywhere except in their URL.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig S View Post
    Just spent some time looking at the racks and the new one doesn't look as robust as the old one. It's definitely a different product, they are careful to call it a Quick Rack everywhere except in their URL.
    "robust"
    That's what struck me. The side panels of the rack don't look nearly as robust. Of course, they'll say it's as strong and saves weight.
    Again, I think the tilt release looks interesting. Too bad the video didn't show some close ups. And the whole locking issue. Why didn't they just go along with the rest of the trailer hitch industry and make the thing work with a simple 'J' lock that's been around forever.

  17. #17
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    One thing I like about the original 1UP is the aluminum construction. The "new" one utilizes plastic rollers for the arm latches. While it may have the benefits they claim, I would be concerned about them aging in UV. Their failure/cracking would be catastrophic.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by 72guy View Post
    I imagine k2 will clear things up on Tuesday.
    I wish the 1Up2 video showed a close up of the tilt mechanism. Also, it's nice to have a locking feature for the rack. That being said, I think the padlock solution could be defeated much easier than the Kryptonite lock I have on my 1Up1 rack.
    Yeah, will be interesting to hear.

    And you're right about the U lock vs the lock they have. The U lock is probably the most robust rack theft preventer I've seen.

    J.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    I'm wondering if someone who worked there before, and had left, now has a noncompete that expired and it's game on. The guy who started the company and was the original designer (Cal was his first name) hasn't been there for a number of years now.


    J.
    The guy in the YouTube video for the "new" one introduces himself as Cal Phillips, owner of 1UP USA (channel name is Corky Phillips). So Cal was the original designer and left the company? Do you know why or more? This might be the clue we need.

    https://youtu.be/43WSDih6mOQ

    EDIT: Just noticed that Cal is wearing the same shirt the other guys wear in videos on 1UP USA's channel.

    https://youtu.be/cNHjx0sHzxw

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oktavius View Post
    The guy in the YouTube video for the "new" one introduces himself as Cal Phillips, owner of 1UP USA (channel name is Corky Phillips). So Cal was the original designer and left the company? Do you know why or more? This might be the clue we need.

    https://youtu.be/43WSDih6mOQ

    EDIT: Just noticed that Cal is wearing the same shirt the other guys wear in videos on 1UP USA's channel.

    https://youtu.be/cNHjx0sHzxw
    I have one of the original racks back from about 2009/2010 or so. I wound up talking to the original designer when I convinced him to make some trays for me that could go on the back or the roof. The guy I worked with was "Cal" and he was a mechanical engineer.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    I have one of the original racks back from about 2009/2010 or so. I wound up talking to the original designer when I convinced him to make some trays for me that could go on the back or the roof. The guy I worked with was "Cal" and he was a mechanical engineer.
    This news article says ownership and management changed in 2011 but Cal still retained share in the company.

    Dickeyville bike rack business on a roll | Tri-state News | telegraphherald.com

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oktavius View Post
    This news article says ownership and management changed in 2011 but Cal still retained share in the company.

    Dickeyville bike rack business on a roll | Tri-state News | telegraphherald.com
    That's really interesting. When I called in some time after I had bought my rack, they said he was no longer with the company. Curious.

    What is strange though isnwhy both websites are changing if one is new and one is old. Very interested to hear how this all fits together.

  23. #23
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    The email address on the new 1up website is a gmail account.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    I'm wondering if someone who worked there before, and had left, now has a noncompete that expired and it's game on.
    I think this is a good guess, but why have essentially the same company name?

    Maybe he's just trying to get the "old" company to buy his "10 patent pending features"?

    All very strange for sure.
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  25. #25
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    When I purchased my 1up rack in July 2016, the website was www.1upusa.com. It seems as though www.1up-usa.com is fairly new.

    Based on the info in some of the links above, this is my speculation as to what happened:

    Cal Phillips, original designer and owner of 1upusa, starts building and selling racks.
    Company grows, he brings in Robbie Lange to be manager and co-owner.

    Cal wants to make improvements and redesign the Quick Rack (which as a fellow mech. engineer I totally understand). Robbie doesn't want to risk it as the rack is popular and successful as is. There is some kind of falling out and Cal goes off on his own to bring the redesigned rack to market. Cal owns www.1upusa.com and keeps using it, which forces Robbie to create www.1up-usa.com.

    I'm happy to see a redesigned version of the rack, as most of the new features do address the issues with the original design. That said, I don't see why they couldn't have two options; keep the original design as the heavy duty option, and use the new design as the lighter weight option to better compete with some of the other racks out there.

  26. #26
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    A division doesn't look good to prospective customers. While the 1UP is great, there is always room for improvement. The current 1UP is expensive on its own plus I would have to buy locks separately and now if I want the new release handle, that seems to be an additional chunk on top. Don't mind spending extra if it will last and the company is there to support.

    I'm already trying to figure out what my 2nd choice would be. Maybe the Yakima Dr Tray (want 3 bikes on 1.25" plus I get a discount).

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    Looks like some corporate restructuring happened, and not necessarily friendly.
    And yes, when I bought the rack, I used 1upusa.com.

    1Up was founded by Cal (Corky) Phillips in the year 2000, and according to LinkedIn, Robbie Lange is its owner/manager since Jan 2012. Cal probably sold it to Robbie then.

    I would assume that the original racks are still sold by original company using the new site, 1up-usa.com, registered by Robbie recently, and 1upusa.com which was registered by Cal in 2000 is now used by him to promote his new design and probably new company. He most likely still owns the patents and trademarks. Otherwise this move would face huge legal scrutinity.

    https://www.whois.com/whois/1upusa.com
    https://www.whois.com/whois/1up-usa.com
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/robbie-l...p-usa-54506b68

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    Created an account here today because I was just about to pull trigger and am wading through the two sites. My read is that he current content on 1upusa.com accomplishes nothing other than confusing people and getting them to hold off on a purchase.

    "Give me your email address so I can sell you something that's awesome when it comes out"...great marketing pitch.

    What I think is the oddest aspect of this are the comments on the YouTube video claiming other companies are frauds. This is so strange....

  29. #29
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    Simple. Cal sold to Robbie and had a non compete. It is up now up. He is starting again with what he thinks are improvements. Probably a poor agreement which didn't protect the name and original design therefore Cal knew it and is back in biz.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by kosulin View Post
    Looks like some corporate restructuring happened, and not necessarily friendly.
    And yes, when I bought the rack, I used 1upusa.com.

    1Up was founded by Cal (Corky) Phillips in the year 2000, and according to LinkedIn, Robbie Lange is its owner/manager since Jan 2012. Cal probably sold it to Robbie then.

    I would assume that the original racks are still sold by original company using the new site, 1up-usa.com, registered by Robbie recently, and 1upusa.com which was registered by Cal in 2000 is now used by him to promote his new design and probably new company. He most likely still owns the patents and trademarks. Otherwise this move would face huge legal scrutinity.

    https://www.whois.com/whois/1upusa.com
    https://www.whois.com/whois/1up-usa.com
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/robbie-l...p-usa-54506b68
    Quote Originally Posted by bogeydog View Post
    Simple. Cal sold to Robbie and had a non compete. It is up now up. He is starting again with what he thinks are improvements. Probably a poor agreement which didn't protect the name and original design therefore Cal knew it and is back in biz.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
    Good work. This pretty much confirms what I was thinking.

    2012-2017 is 5 years which is a pretty standard noncompete exclusionary period.

    J.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by bogeydog View Post
    Simple. Cal sold to Robbie and had a non compete. It is up now up. He is starting again with what he thinks are improvements. Probably a poor agreement which didn't protect the name and original design therefore Cal knew it and is back in biz.
    Seems like a logical conclusion, and that whatever happened between the two groups was not friendly. I'd speculate that they're battling over control of the brand, which isn't going to turn out good for either of them unless resolved quickly.

  32. #32
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    The 'new' version is less expensive in several ways.
    Lower list price. No added charge for black. All products ship free. So no minimum threshold. Weight is noted as 30% less so maybe 17-3/4 lbs for a standard single.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hill Billy View Post
    I'd speculate that they're battling over control of the brand, which isn't going to turn out good for either of them unless resolved quickly.
    Won't turn out well for anyone except the attorneys. If true, this is just too bad.

    J.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by eb1888 View Post
    The 'new' version is less expensive in several ways.
    Lower list price. No added charge for black. All products ship free. So no minimum threshold. Weight is noted as 30% less so maybe 17-3/4 lbs for a standard single.
    It also looks like it's built to be less expensive as well. I like some of the "improvements" such as the release mechanism but I'm not a fan of having padlocks hanging off my rack...just a cheap looking stop gap design. The qwik release concept on the arms looks kind of cheesy to me as well.
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by bogeydog View Post
    Simple. Cal sold to Robbie and had a non compete. It is up now up. He is starting again with what he thinks are improvements. Probably a poor agreement which didn't protect the name and original design therefore Cal knew it and is back in biz.
    Even if it's a "poor agreement", it's very confusing to customers. Even in the comments section of the YouTube video Cal states the following:
    "Unfortunately, other companies have attempted to hijack the 1up USA name, and deceive the public, by altering their domain name slightly, in order to lure customers to their website. Our domain name since 2000 has been 1upusa.com. Therefore, any other URL other than 1upusa.com is not our original company 1up USA, LLC, but a knock-off. The company has been notified."
    It makes it sound like the company that many of us purchased our racks from is doing something shady. To me, the "old" rack looks sturdier and I still plan to purchase an add-on from them. I really look forward to hearing what is going on here.

  36. #36
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    [QUOTE=burgrat;13322401]Even if it's a "poor agreement", it's very confusing to customers. Even in the comments section of the YouTube video Cal states the following:
    "Unfortunately, other companies have attempted to hijack the 1up USA name, and deceive the public, by altering their domain name slightly, in order to lure customers to their website. Our domain name since 2000 has been 1upusa.com. Therefore, any other URL other than 1upusa.com is not our original company 1up USA, LLC, but a knock

    Really leaves a new or potential customer in an awkward position.

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    Really leaves a new or potential customer in an awkward position.
    Which is why I joined this forum today...which company is legit? I wanted to place an order for the "original" but couldn't figure out left from right.

    Seems that the original domain doesn't actually offer anything at the moment. So it's the "new" domain offering the "old" product, yet it's being bad mouthed as the knock off. WTF?

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    I ordered a rack from 1up-USA at the end of July. Came to me fast and as expected. Great rack. I'm not sure I like the changes. The design I bought is very sturdy. Love it...

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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeMac View Post
    I ordered a rack from 1up-USA at the end of July. Came to me fast and as expected. Great rack. I'm not sure I like the changes. The design I bought is very sturdy. Love it...
    Likewise. Rack works great. Still, this is very confusing for consumers.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by bogeydog View Post
    Simple. Cal sold to Robbie and had a non compete. It is up now up. He is starting again with what he thinks are improvements. Probably a poor agreement which didn't protect the name and original design therefore Cal knew it and is back in biz.
    bogeydog, Do you know this, or is it a logical guess?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Won't turn out well for anyone except the attorneys. If true, this is just too bad.

    J.
    Agreed... unfortunately.
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  41. #41
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    [QUOTE=Steve_MTB_22;13322451]
    Quote Originally Posted by burgrat View Post
    Even if it's a "poor agreement", it's very confusing to customers. Even in the comments section of the YouTube video Cal states the following:
    "Unfortunately, other companies have attempted to hijack the 1up USA name, and deceive the public, by altering their domain name slightly, in order to lure customers to their website. Our domain name since 2000 has been 1upusa.com. Therefore, any other URL other than 1upusa.com is not our original company 1up USA, LLC, but a knock

    Really leaves a new or potential customer in an awkward position.
    His wording doesn't sound completely honest either. Makes it sound like 1up-usa.com is a complete knockoff when it is more of a division.

    1up-usa.com even had access to 1upusa.com for a while when they were redirecting everyone from 1upusa.com to 1up-usa.com.

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    Got an email from 1up-usa this morning:

    Thanks for reaching out to 1UP USA. We’re very sorry for the current confusing matter of a “new rack”. 1UP USA.com LLC and www.1up-usa.com are not introducing a new rack model in 2017 or near future 2018. There appears to be another entity claiming to be 1UP USA as well making these claims and using the old domain.

    We do have everything offered on our site, www.1up-usa in stock. Orders are shipping the same or following business day.
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    And an email from email1upusa@gmail.com which appears to be Cal:

    We are 1upusa.com we are selling the new version of the quik rack. Our company has been selling since the year 2000. The other company has been selling for about one year. You can do a Whois search and get the details on both companies. The other company is selling the old version of the quick rack only.
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    Obvious hostile split to a management driven entity selling the original product and to the original owner/designer driven company pushing the new design. Let's hope both original and new design survive.

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    If you own a business and your email address ends with @yahoo.com or @gmail.com I assume you are terrible and I am not interesting in giving you any money.

    That may not be fair, and it might be making assumptions without merit, but that is how I feel.

    I assume a minimum level of competency and having a proper email address is part of that.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_Westy View Post
    Got an email from 1up-usa this morning:

    Thanks for reaching out to 1UP USA. We’re very sorry for the current confusing matter of a “new rack”. 1UP USA.com LLC and www.1up-usa.com are not introducing a new rack model in 2017 or near future 2018. There appears to be another entity claiming to be 1UP USA as well making these claims and using the old domain.

    We do have everything offered on our site, www.1up-usa in stock. Orders are shipping the same or following business day.
    UPDATE AS OF TUESDAY, SEPT 5TH

    I called the "old" 1UP and was told over the phone almost the exact same thing as J Westy which was.....Thanks for reaching out to 1UP USA. We’re very sorry for the current confusing matter of a “new rack”. 1UP USA.com LLC and www.1up-usa.com are not introducing a new rack model in 2017 or near future 2018. We have nothing to do with the other company and are not working with them in any manner.

    I guess to comes down to personal choice at this point....do you stay with the tried & true or decided you like the new updates and/or want to save a lil' money at the risk of getting an inferior product? I personally want the current model but will wait it out because if the "new" company can make any headway, I think the "old" company will be forced to lower their prices. A win-win for the consumer!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    A win-win for the consumer!!
    ...assuming at least one company survives...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig S View Post
    If you own a business and your email address ends with @yahoo.com or @gmail.com I assume you are terrible and I am not interesting in giving you any money.

    That may not be fair, and it might be making assumptions without merit, but that is how I feel.

    I assume a minimum level of competency and having a proper email address is part of that.
    You're not wrong. That's like dealing with a lawyer that has an Aol.com email address...

    So, I was confused too and bought a rack last month from the 1up-USA site. I assumed the 'New Site' tagline was due to poor DNS handling and whatever.

    Either way, got the super duty version and just got back from a weekend in the Needles District of Canyonlands, including a drive down Bobby's Hole with the rack and two bikes. Performed perfectly. Happy customer over here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Klainmeister View Post
    You're not wrong. That's like dealing with a lawyer that has an Aol.com email address...
    Another perspective: if the explanation above turns out to be accurate and the original designer/founder Cal is the same guy running the "new" company with the "old" URL, then I'd forgive his skipping the pretty basic step of using an email address that ends with his new URL. Either way he'll very likely use gmail to read and reply to emails like so many other startups, so all this shows is that he may not be all that up to speed on internet marketing basics.

    It doesn't mean he's any less talented a designer and engineer, or competent a manufacturer. Those are the things I care about, at least as far as who I'm going to buy a rack from.

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    i think we brokes the interwebs for the new site... HA - site goes nowhere as of 2:26pm mt. i see the refresh of the hyphenated site. Certainly better and Im contemplating the ez pull handle add on.

    There are some cool feature/functions of the new version... but don't think ill be getting rid of my current bombproof 1 up anytime soon as there's just no reason and resale while good - still means a fair bit out of pocket to change. Hope they can both survive but gonna be tuff given the naming confusions alone ... if Im launching the new version - I'm getting creative with branding and marketing. A couple well placed banners and proper social presence would be enough to differentiate with a good message...

    and - if either company/entity is reading the forums - you'll get all you need in feedback to start to differentiate... its like free consulting. If not - I could envision a price war which may benefit consumers in the short term, but not when one of em eats it in and shuts down

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    I bought some roof trays from the 1up-usa.com site back in the spring. I'm super happy with them, but this kind of uncertainty, confusion, and lack of honesty is disheartening.

    As far as I'm seeing, the folks running the 1up-usa.com site are the ones handling themselves about as professionally as can be. Being honest about not being affiliated with the 1upusa.com site and straightforward that they are releasing no new products, etc.

    What I'm seeing people post from 1upusa.com is what's a damn shame to me. The comments on youtube about the folks running the "newer" website seem disingenuous at best. There's a lot of truth not being told there, and what sounds like a lot of bitterness. Seems to me that if a solid legal claim on those issues could be made, that it would be playing out in the courts, not on the comments section of a youtube video. Fact of the matter is that whoever is running the 1upusa.com address is more or less starting completely from scratch due to whatever happened in the past. He should dump that address and product name and start over there, too, if in fact he has no legal claim to the 1upusa name, logo, and other stuff.

    I had been thinking about replacing my older Kuat with a 1up hitch rack, but at this point, considering all of this bs, I'm not spending money with either company until they figure out their differences and a way to coexist without confusing people. Maybe that process will involve lawsuits. I hope it doesn't, but it very well might.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    What I'm seeing people post from 1upusa.com is what's a damn shame to me. The comments on youtube about the folks running the "newer" website seem disingenuous at best. There's a lot of truth not being told there, and what sounds like a lot of bitterness. Seems to me that if a solid legal claim on those issues could be made, that it would be playing out in the courts, not on the comments section of a youtube video.
    Totally agree...it's the "old" 1upusa.com site with the "new" product (aka vaporware until proven otherwise) that seems quite disingenuous. I certainly wouldn't give them my money given this roll out.

    Since I'm in need of a rack ASAP I decided to roll the dice and order the "old" rack from the "new" 1up-usa.com site. Yes, there are things that could be improved with it based on what I've read, but it still seems like the best option if you can afford it.

    I placed the order this afternoon...fingers crossed that there aren't more surprises looming.

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    After all the updates here today, I still can't figure out who is running what...however the one I have and the one that looks like all the ones in the review thread came from 1up-usa. It's awesome.
    NTFTC

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    I've been looking at the 1up racks for a while, but I haven't quite decided to pull the trigger on one yet. I think the main reason has been cost. I always seem to find something else that takes priority and just keep dealing with my 10+ yr old Saris rack. Like others have said, I too am disappointed with the lack of complete honesty about what is going on from both companies. The confusion they are creating for customers can't be good for either company in the long run. I think there is potential good to come from this from the customer side, mainly lower prices potentially as happened when similar happened to Yeti and their stainless drinkware. The difference is the new company didn't also call themselves Yeti and have a website address that differs by a hyphen.

    All that said, I think I like the updated style for its lower pricing and that it comes with a built in lock. As much as these things are it is nice not have to buy additional stuff to be able to secure it to your vehicle. I hope things get worked out and both companies survive. Competition is good for the consumer. Time will tell I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ericridebike View Post
    I've been looking at the 1up racks for a while, but I haven't quite decided to pull the trigger on one yet. I think the main reason has been cost. I always seem to find something else that takes priority and just keep dealing with my 10+ yr old Saris rack. Like others have said, I too am disappointed with the lack of complete honesty about what is going on from both companies. The confusion they are creating for customers can't be good for either company in the long run. I think there is potential good to come from this from the customer side, mainly lower prices potentially as happened when similar happened to Yeti and their stainless drinkware. The difference is the new company didn't also call themselves Yeti and have a website address that differs by a hyphen.

    All that said, I think I like the updated style for its lower pricing and that it comes with a built in lock. As much as these things are it is nice not have to buy additional stuff to be able to secure it to your vehicle. I hope things get worked out and both companies survive. Competition is good for the consumer. Time will tell I guess.
    How exactly has the "old/original" 1UP been less than honest? They haven't done anything other than go along with "business as usual". It's obviously not in their best interest to call tag other company out and get in a flame war/pissing match. The "new" company is the one coming on to the seen and implying they have been in business selling the original rack for many years when in fact their FIRST products won't even be out until December. Also, there is no BUILT IN lock. There is a hole/space to put in a padlock.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    What I'm seeing people post from 1upusa.com is what's a damn shame to me. The comments on youtube about the folks running the "newer" website seem disingenuous at best. There's a lot of truth not being told there, and what sounds like a lot of bitterness. Seems to me that if a solid legal claim on those issues could be made, that it would be playing out in the courts, not on the comments section of a youtube video. Fact of the matter is that whoever is running the 1upusa.com address is more or less starting completely from scratch due to whatever happened in the past. He should dump that address and product name and start over there, too, if in fact he has no legal claim to the 1upusa name, logo, and other stuff.
    I agree. How is this possibly going to work with the difference between the 2 company names being a hyphen?! He should just rebrand the whole thing. He could even sell the rack through distributors, instead of the direct to consumer route (which I actually like better) which would get this product out to a lot more people. I have a feeling that since he (Cal) is the original designer behind the rack (right?), it's his baby and he doesn't want to be the one changing the name, etc. In the end, this is going to be quite the cluster.
    IMO, the "original" site (the one with the hyphen), are the guys staying the course and producing the sturdier product. Is the new design and add-ons even available yet, and more importantly, are the compatible with the other racks (the 1up-USA ones) that so many on here have? I am more than happy with my current rack and I do plan to purchase one bike tray soon with the old company (hyphen). I don't think I would purchase one from the new company yet, not knowing what is going to happen with any possible legal stuff and if they will be around for years. Overall it's just a really strange situation that I have never seen before. Anyone else see something similar to this happen?

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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    How exactly has the "old/original" 1UP been less than honest?
    ...
    Also, there is no BUILT IN lock. There is a hole/space to put in a padlock.
    Which the old/original 1up has a hole for a lock also. It blocks access to the security Allen release bolt.

    The "new" design looks to have a built in arm to release the bolt. The arm is prevented from loosening by the lock. Which then brings up the question... how adjustable is that built in arm to tighten to your hitch? It would have to be suitably tight just as the arm is above the brace so you can attach the lock.

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    ugh. Have been considering a 1upusa for sometime. Stability, small co, was part of their draw. This just seeds uncertainty.

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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    How exactly has the "old/original" 1UP been less than honest? They haven't done anything other than go along with "business as usual". It's obviously not in their best interest to call tag other company out and get in a flame war/pissing match. The "new" company is the one coming on to the seen and implying they have been in business selling the original rack for many years when in fact their FIRST products won't even be out until December. Also, there is no BUILT IN lock. There is a hole/space to put in a padlock.
    I think the honesty part I meant is that neither one seems to be completely open about what is going on. As a potential customer I would appreciate a notice on each company's website or something with at least a brief explanation of the split.

    As far as the lock, I should have said included lock. Sorry for the confusion on that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hill Billy View Post
    I placed the order this afternoon...fingers crossed that there aren't more surprises looming.
    You won't be disappointed. The rack is a piece of engineering art. The EZpull handle made it even better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ericridebike View Post
    I think the honesty part I meant is that neither one seems to be completely open about what is going on. As a potential customer I would appreciate a notice on each company's website or something with at least a brief explanation of the split.

    As far as the lock, I should have said included lock. Sorry for the confusion on that.
    Right, I don't think either is being honest. To be honest, 1up-usa would have to say something along the line of them buying the company and design from Cal whereas 1upusa would have to say that 1up-usa bought the design of the original but not the company name.

    Since neither is being fully honest and saying the other is an imposter, I'm going to get a rack elsewhere. Maybe in a few years when I need a new rack they will have things sorted out.

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    Just got my rack from "1up-usa" the other day. Fast shipping, no issues, heavy duty a$$ looking rack. Satisfied so far.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oktavius View Post
    Right, I don't think either is being honest. To be honest, 1up-usa would have to say something along the line of them buying the company and design from Cal whereas 1upusa would have to say that 1up-usa bought the design of the original but not the company name.

    Since neither is being fully honest and saying the other is an imposter, I'm going to get a rack elsewhere. Maybe in a few years when I need a new rack they will have things sorted out.
    I don't understand this logic at all. This scenario happens all the time where an original owner or management type employee of a company leaves, is paid off and that person signs a "do not compete" clause. When the contract is up, that person goes off and starts up another/new company. A very prominent example is Ruth's Chris steakhouse where a management employee left and went over to start up Flemings steakhouse. A near carbon copy business model but at least they changed the name and didn't name it Ruth's MEAThouse. In any case, there was no statement issued by Ruth's Chris to distance themselves from the copycat Flemings.

    Cal left 1up-usa one way or another and new owners took over. Now that Cal is back, he is the one stirring the pot by introducing a near identical product AND implying he's been selling it for 15 years when that's simply a lie. Maybe you would like 1up-usa to issue a statement on their website throwing Cal under the bus but they may have been advised not to do that and/or that may seen unprofessional to do and they don't want to act like children on their website. They have chosen to take the high road. I imagine there is a court battle looming at some point.
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    I don't understand this logic at all. This scenario happens all the time where an original owner or management type employee of a company leaves, is paid off and that person signs a "do not compete" clause. When the contract is up, that person goes off and starts up another/new company. A very prominent example is Ruth's Chris steakhouse where a management employee left and went over to start up Flemings steakhouse. A near carbon copy business model but at least they changed the name and didn't name it Ruth's MEAThouse. In any case, there was no statement issued by Ruth's Chris to distance themselves from the copycat Flemings.

    Cal left 1up-usa one way or another and new owners took over. Now that Cal is back, he is the one stirring the pot by introducing a near identical product AND implying he's been selling it for 15 years when that's simply a lie. Maybe you would like 1up-usa to issue a statement on their website throwing Cal under the bus but they may have been advised not to do that and/or that may seen unprofessional to do and they don't want to act like children on their website. They have chosen to take the high road. I imagine there is a court battle looming at some point.
    Think you are filling in the blanks too much. We know there has been a split but do not know who actually retains what rights, whether it be naming or product design. Without knowing who has the legal rights to what, it is hard to say who is actually taking the high road.

    Will agree that Cal's representation doesn't look good though, from the negative portrayal of the original rack, to the unprofessional email address, to the oddly shot/edited YouTube video, and the cheaper parts on the new rack.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oktavius View Post
    Right, I don't think either is being honest. To be honest, 1up-usa would have to say something along the line of them buying the company and design from Cal whereas 1upusa would have to say that 1up-usa bought the design of the original but not the company name.

    Since neither is being fully honest and saying the other is an imposter, I'm going to get a rack elsewhere. Maybe in a few years when I need a new rack they will have things sorted out.
    100% honesty as you suggest has serious legal implications. This is why I said that this might have to be settled in court if the two parties can't agree to more solidly distinguish from each other. The "old" company is not claiming that the "new" one is an impostor. They're claiming no affiliation. Which is entirely correct since the businesses do not have a relationship. However the design similarity and the name similarity do suggest otherwise, again, there are legal implications for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    I don't understand this logic at all. This scenario happens all the time where an original owner or management type employee of a company leaves, is paid off and that person signs a "do not compete" clause. When the contract is up, that person goes off and starts up another/new company. A very prominent example is Ruth's Chris steakhouse where a management employee left and went over to start up Flemings steakhouse. A near carbon copy business model but at least they changed the name and didn't name it Ruth's MEAThouse. In any case, there was no statement issued by Ruth's Chris to distance themselves from the copycat Flemings.

    Cal left 1up-usa one way or another and new owners took over. Now that Cal is back, he is the one stirring the pot by introducing a near identical product AND implying he's been selling it for 15 years when that's simply a lie. Maybe you would like 1up-usa to issue a statement on their website throwing Cal under the bus but they may have been advised not to do that and/or that may seen unprofessional to do and they don't want to act like children on their website. They have chosen to take the high road. I imagine there is a court battle looming at some point.
    Right. It may be that Cal is trying to force the other company to change its name. I have no idea how that strategy will play out in the end, but it seems to me that his youtube comments won't help.

    I know of a situation where the issue of who owned the naming rights came up and it had the potential to be an expensive, nasty, and lengthy court battle. It happened in a small community and while one party had consulted with lawyers on the issue and felt it had standing to assert control of the name, doing so would have left a lot of bad blood in the community so it decided to just drop the issue and use another name. That happened a few years ago, and now the two parties have an amicable relationship and people make jokes about it.

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    I have had an original 1up rack for over 5 years now. It's been a great product, but not without it's quirks - which it appears Cal has been trying to improve upon. A couple points on the 'new' version that strike me as questionable:

    • Less aluminum on the new rack - My rack has virtually no rust after being mounted 365 days/year outside, through northeast seasonal changes. Are the materials on the new rack As durable against rust and such?
    • Those quick-release wheel adjustments look like an extremely easy way to steal a bike. :O
    • More use of plastics, more wear and tear - will the new rack be as sturdy to begin with, and remain as sturdy?



    We'll see how the chips fall in the end, but Cal's not doing himself any favors with the video. It doesn't show any detail about the new mechanisms and begins with an awesomely odd pause, reminiscent of infomercial/dramatization vids.

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    I ordered a rack from 1up-usa.com back in May, after some questions both via email and phone. All 5 stars for service, rack, quick shipping. If I recall correctly, I started out visiting 1upusa.com and then learned that they launched 1up-usa.com as what I believe was a website overhaul and improvement. I believe that both sites at that time were active and the same company had them during a transition period.

    I don't know what happened between the two entities, but it is just plain wrong for Cal or whoever he is to try to jump in with basically the same name. My advice: buy with confidence from 1up-usa.com

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    The new rack looks less aesthetically finished than the original, but it's undoubtedly a prototype, and will look great upon release unless he's forgotten most of what he learned the first time around.

    The only thing I really don't care for is some of the bolts are not flush, and the use of black spacers on a silver rack. Things that may get changed for the production run, though.

    Appears he's made a number of changes to avoid copyright infringement, like the straight instead of bent wheel retention arms, a slider slot instead of multiple holes, etc. But the trays appear to be the exact same extrusion. Maybe that extrusion design isn't copyrighted?

    I'm get the comments on it not appearing as beefy. The frame is obviously not as thick. This, however, doesn't say anything about it being strong enough. The original frame always appeared to me to be a bit of overkill. We also don't know what series alloys are in use. The original could be a 6063, the new 6061. These two alloys cost about the same, but 6063 has about half the yield strength of 6061.

    Someone commented that the tire rollers are plastic. What is the source of this info? Being a larger piece doesn't mean it's plastic, although that would make sense from both a weight and cost perspective. If it is plastic, I'm not too worried as it would need to be a tough ABS plastic to prevent long term compression, and should have UV inhibitors. Done correctly, they will last decades. Not done correctly, they are plastic, won't cost much to replace.

    I am curious to see the final product, some reviews, and how the ensuing 1UP USA war plays out.
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    I'm a very happy owner of an original super duty rack. The new design does seem to address some of the minor annoyances of the original design. I think the QR on the wheel spacers seems unnecessary but we trust QRs to hold our wheels and seatposts so it shouldn't be very risky. The revised tilt release is way overdue. I've learned how to avoid over-rotating the slider latches, but having a stop seems good. Finally, the straight wheel arms are probably much cheaper to manufacture and I'm not sure I see any drawback, though perhaps that's the reason for the QR adjustable spacers ... to allow a better location and angle for the tire/spacer contact and thus wheel retention. However, if I were the original inventor and regained rights to the design and even the company and domain names, I'd still launch the revised design with a new name. Heck, call it 2UpUSA. It's confusing and disingenuous at best, dishonest at worst, to imply it's related. He can state in his bio that he's the original inventor, and is launching a new state-of-the-art bike rack, and let it stand on its own merits.

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    i think Cal - if he's the originator - should indeed go high road and re-invent the brand. if he has the patents pending and legalities covered - the new rack can't/won't be replicated by the other entity and there alone - should be fine and easy to rebrand as the next evolutionary step forward in bike rack technologies "from the inventor of the original 1Up-Usa Bike racks". I get he's proud of the original and we all know it works and is bombproof - that can't be taken away... time to move on and start fresh and clean IMO and do him and us a solid in the process!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dman_mb1 View Post
    However, if I were the original inventor and regained rights to the design and even the company and domain names, I'd still launch the revised design with a new name. Heck, call it 2UpUSA. It's confusing and disingenuous at best, dishonest at worst, to imply it's related. He can state in his bio that he's the original inventor, and is launching a new state-of-the-art bike rack, and let it stand on its own merits.
    Yeah. The original rack sold largely on word-of-mouth and its own merits, so there's no reason a revised version designed and sold by the original designer wouldn't. And frankly, 1Up USA isn't that great a name. I've generated sales of at least half-a-dozen of them locally, and when I told people the name of the company making the rack, their expressions always included raised eyebrows.

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    What a mess. I'm glad I got the original.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kamper11 View Post
    i think Cal - if he's the originator - should indeed go high road and re-invent the brand. if he has the patents pending and legalities covered - the new rack can't/won't be replicated by the other entity and there alone - should be fine and easy to rebrand as the next evolutionary step forward in bike rack technologies "from the inventor of the original 1Up-Usa Bike racks". I get he's proud of the original and we all know it works and is bombproof - that can't be taken away... time to move on and start fresh and clean IMO and do him and us a solid in the process!
    I agree with this, if he actually holds the patents, the old company should be paying him licensing fees anyways. His rack looks similar, but is actually pretty different. He should rename his company, create some way to differentiate his product from the old one and sell the hell outd of it. He suggests that he has made a more affordable, lighter, better product; if he's right, the market should settle their differences soon enough.

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    That is extremely confusing. I have two of the original racks and they are awesome. Can't speak to the new design.

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    I was in the air between the Rocky Mounts Split Rail and the 1UP and just started researching the 1UP this past week - not happy about what's going on but I really want to buy one.

    I think I'm going to pull the trigger on the 1up-USA site instead of waiting for the 'newer' version.

    Does anyone know what the lifetime warranty covers? Or doesn't cover?

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    I bought a 2-bike heavy duty model beginning of this year. I'm also glad I got the original.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rsanjuan31 View Post
    I was in the air between the Rocky Mounts Split Rail and the 1UP and just started researching the 1UP this past week - not happy about what's going on but I really want to buy one.

    I think I'm going to pull the trigger on the 1up-USA site instead of waiting for the 'newer' version.

    Does anyone know what the lifetime warranty covers? Or doesn't cover?
    It's on the website under 'Services'.
    NTFTC

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    after reading through this thread-wow!! work it out or spend $$$$$ on attorneys. the disturbing part to me is that the new old guy, the guy who was bought out, thinks that somehow this is good for his new business.

    this makes him look unethical at best or at least on the border, and he loses credibility with respect to his knowledge and skill. I wouldn't now trust anything he sells or does with a ten foot pole. the guys is destroying his own credibility and ability to compete.

    you got a better mousetrap? have some confidence in it and sell it as a distinct and unique product. Instead this comes across as a confused attempt at a knock-off or as the equivalent of "Talk-Up v 7-Up" for bike racks.

    Maybe no one here is an angel, but this new guy is untrustworthy in my opinion, and that is due to how he is conducting himself and his business approach.

    the winner in all this, oddly enough, is Specialized. If Cal tried to sell his new tangled rack as Specialised, the attorneys would have put him 6 feet under in a nano second.


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    Well that sucks. This is exactly how small companies disentegrate. Obviously Cal was bought or forced out of the original company and somehow figures he retained product and naming rights. Can't see that being the case - especially with the seemingly outrageous claims he's making about being the original, given that the dash site has been the active one for many years - but seems like that the lawyers will have to be well-paid to figure this out. There go the already tight bottom lines - I don't see much of a consumer advantage....

    Having said that, if Cal is at all interested in modifying their roof rack with more durable anodizing (mine was peeling at the front and rails contact points within a year) and figuring out a clever way to put the crossbars on the inside of the rack so you don't need to lift your bike over them - take my money immediately you cheating bastard.

    I really like my 1Up roof rack but the common complaints seem fixable with a little ingenuity that the existing company doesn't appear at all interested in applying. I even had a fairly common rattling issue with the arms when folded down at higher speeds that they could provide me no help with - I ended up putting two clear little Home Depot silicone sticky buttons on the ends of the arms ($1 for a pack of 16 or something) which instantly fixed the problem for good. Called to tell them it was a super-easy fix - they said thanks but they wouldn't be doing it themselves because not everyone complained about rattling. Super easy and cheap way to improve the experience of many of your customers? No thanks....

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    I like some of the features of the "new" design but it does to seems very solid or as solid anyway. The original rack could use 2-3 improvements for sure but does anyone know what a "no weld" design means. Does it mean they just bent the metal instead of welding it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer View Post
    I like some of the features of the "new" design but it does to seems very solid or as solid anyway. The original rack could use 2-3 improvements for sure but does anyone know what a "no weld" design means. Does it mean they just bent the metal instead of welding it?
    No, you do not bend aluminum blocks. Most likely they now carve it from a single billet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer View Post
    I like some of the features of the "new" design but it does to seems very solid or as solid anyway. The original rack could use 2-3 improvements for sure but does anyone know what a "no weld" design means. Does it mean they just bent the metal instead of welding it?
    Looks to me like it's all bolted instead of being welded together


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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastcoastroots View Post
    Well that sucks. This is exactly how small companies disentegrate. Obviously Cal was bought or forced out of the original company and somehow figures he retained product and naming rights. Can't see that being the case - especially with the seemingly outrageous claims he's making about being the original, given that the dash site has been the active one for many years - but seems like that the lawyers will have to be well-paid to figure this out. There go the already tight bottom lines - I don't see much of a consumer advantage....
    I bought one of the very original 1UpUSA racks back when they first came out just after Cal started offering them to the public. There have been changes to them since that time as it morphed. Several years ago, when I called and asked to speak with Cal, I was told "he was no longer with the company."

    Cal started the original 1UpUSA . I think it's a pretty good bet that he retains the name, the patents, domain name and other intellectual property or it would be very quick work to shut it down with a restraining order. Too, the most recent rendition (1up-usa) of the company of would not have changed it's name. Given that Cal remains in business it's reasonable to presume that he is likely in the clear and it's very likely that he owns it the original company. Therefore, his version IS the original company.

    Given that, and it if is his and the guys who came after him forced him out of his own company - that puts a much different light on things.

    Cal is a very talented designer. I found him great to work with.

    So there really have been three versions of the rack - the original rack (which I own), the 1up-usa rack (which I also own) and now the new version that Cal is putting out there (which I don't own - yet). So be careful when you talk about the "new" and "old" rack/company - that's not accurate.

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    I bought one of the very original 1UpUSA racks back when they first came out just after Cal started offering them to the public. There have been changes to them since that time as it morphed. Several years ago, when I called and asked to speak with Cal, I was told "he was no longer with the company."

    Cal started the original 1UpUSA . I think it's a pretty good bet that he retains the name, the patents, domain name and other intellectual property or it would be very quick work to shut it down with a restraining order. Too, the most recent rendition (1up-usa) of the company of would not have changed it's name. Given that Cal remains in business it's reasonable to presume that he is likely in the clear and it's very likely that he owns it the original company. Therefore, his version IS the original company.
    I don't know that there's enough information to reach that conclusion at this point. Seems to me if Cal owned everything outright, he'd be able to get a lawyer to send over some cease and desist letters and get the other company to change their name no problem.

    No, my impression here is that ownership of at least some of the intellectual property of concern is muddy and there's likely no clear owner. Seems to me that if there was a clear owner of the name, we wouldn't have the confusion we have right now. So we do know that Cal controls the domain 1upusa.com at least. And that there was likely some sort of agreement in place that required that domain to link to the 1up-usa.com domain (which I think is reasonable to assume was created because the remaining company ownership wanted a website that they controlled). I think a noncompete agreement is also reasonable to assume was in place. Why didn't Cal assert control over the company name and designs when he left the company (under whatever circumstances)? We just don't know that. I do think that it does not help Cal assert control over the name NOW, considering that he (apparently) made no attempts to do so in the last few years. Which is probably at least partly why ownership of the company name is not clear.

    From my understanding of other naming trademark cases in the past, I don't think a hyphen is enough difference for a court to allow both companies to continue using the 1upUSA/1up-USA names. I'm pretty sure this issue is destined to be decided in the courts. I suspect that Cal hasn't taken it there because of the expense, and I'll bet that the other company is discussing it, hence the particular way they responded to the inquiries about this situation earlier this week. If Cal continues the nasty rhetoric, I'll bet the other company will have little choice but to spend that money on a legal case in order to shut Cal up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    I don't know that there's enough information to reach that conclusion at this point. Seems to me if Cal owned everything outright, he'd be able to get a lawyer to send over some cease and desist letters and get the other company to change their name no problem.

    No, my impression here is that ownership of at least some of the intellectual property of concern is muddy and there's likely no clear owner. Seems to me that if there was a clear owner of the name, we wouldn't have the confusion we have right now. So we do know that Cal controls the domain 1upusa.com at least. And that there was likely some sort of agreement in place that required that domain to link to the 1up-usa.com domain (which I think is reasonable to assume was created because the remaining company ownership wanted a website that they controlled). I think a noncompete agreement is also reasonable to assume was in place. Why didn't Cal assert control over the company name and designs when he left the company (under whatever circumstances)? We just don't know that. I do think that it does not help Cal assert control over the name NOW, considering that he (apparently) made no attempts to do so in the last few years. Which is probably at least partly why ownership of the company name is not clear.

    From my understanding of other naming trademark cases in the past, I don't think a hyphen is enough difference for a court to allow both companies to continue using the 1upUSA/1up-USA names. I'm pretty sure this issue is destined to be decided in the courts. I suspect that Cal hasn't taken it there because of the expense, and I'll bet that the other company is discussing it, hence the particular way they responded to the inquiries about this situation earlier this week. If Cal continues the nasty rhetoric, I'll bet the other company will have little choice but to spend that money on a legal case in order to shut Cal up.
    I just sold my tech company (semiconductor industry) that I ran for 20+ years. Dealing with IP and noncompetes was a big part of my business. In my experience - and you're right, we don't know the answers yet - is when this sort of thing happens, there are restraining orders that go out ASAP almost as soon as the person starts work or the IP is infringed. And that's well before any real market presence is typically seen.

    It's a lot easier to stop them before they start when they have either violated an agreement or taken your IP. Once the restraining orders go out, things hold in place until it gets in front of a judge. Generally, the restraining order solves the problem (been there, done that). Given that it's gotten this far, I doubt that they can stop him (or they would of) and it's pretty likely he owns the patents and is free of any noncompete agreements.

    1Up-usa may have a license to use certain patents fora period of time. Cal had mentioned when I talked with him years ago, that the patent for the dual arm design was licensed to Raxter for one of their racks. They still sell that so I presume that license is still in place. That, incidentally, is why the big guys don't have dual arm racks and typically have some permutation of a single arm plus a restraining strap (at least as it was explained to me).

    But if Cal does own the name 1UpUSA and the patents and the domain names, then it's more up to the 1up-usa guys to do something to survive. And, also from experience, various secretaries of state are not the best on getting clean names set aside for companies - in point of fact they are terrible. It remains for the two to resolve it though the courts and often times it's just better to tie the other guy down and then take him out through competition (usually cheaper). A great example of this is the McDonald's story.

    My point is that this stuff is never what it seems. Cal is the original founder of all of the 1UpUSA companies and it's derivatives - that's a fact. And the terms "new" and "old" are not accurate since there are now three versions of the rack and, it seems, company. I'm not taking any sides here - and in fact I own one of each rack so far except for the Cal new version (which also looks nice).

    So we'll have to let this sort out. But it sounds like a bunch of really stupid business decisions were made - Cal bringing in these new guys and letting them kick him out of his company, the new guys not getting clear title to all the trademarks, service marks, and IP etc... before they booted Cal. The result is a mess. Hopefully the adults show up soon and get this thing settled, exchange checks and be done with it.

    J.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    So we'll have to let this sort out. But it sounds like a bunch of really stupid business decisions were made - Cal bringing in these new guys and letting them kick him out of his company, the new guys not getting clear title to all the trademarks, service marks, and IP etc... before they booted Cal. The result is a mess. Hopefully the adults show up soon and get this thing settled, exchange checks and be done with it.

    J.
    Whatever else is going on, I absolutely cannot argue with any of this. Poor business decisions all around that led up to where we are now.

  88. #88
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    This should be interesting to watch play out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    Whatever else is going on, I absolutely cannot argue with any of this. Poor business decisions all around that led up to where we are now.
    If Cal "owned" all that John380 claims, why didn't he sue 1Up YEARS ago to stop them from selling HIS design, using HIS company name?
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  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    If Cal "owned" all that John380 claims, why didn't he sue 1Up YEARS ago to stop them from selling HIS design, using HIS company name?
    that's one question I have

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    Why hang onto the name? The product is great but the name has always been awful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer View Post
    I like some of the features of the "new" design but it does to seems very solid or as solid anyway. The original rack could use 2-3 improvements for sure but does anyone know what a "no weld" design means. Does it mean they just bent the metal instead of welding it?
    I agree. I think this will go on and off the car faster. That's a big benefit for me.

    J.

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    I have the original rack from 1up-usa and couldn't be happier. Best.rack.ever

    The new rack has a couple of things I like and some I don't.
    1. Being a "no weld" design means it's bolted together as you can see in the video. In most cases I would think that a weld would weigh less than bolts but he claims the new design is lighter. Where did the weight savings come from? When welded correctly, there is no worry. Bolts might back out or need checking for tightness.
    2. The adjustable wheels stops are crap. Period. It seems pretty cheesy and might lend to getting loose/stolen easier
    3. The new design that stops the lift bar from coming up too high and binding is a good idea. If you watch the videos demoing the arms they place their finger under it while moving the bar (just like I do) not a show stopped for me
    4. The pin thingy that goes into the normal hitch pin hole is nice and the biggest thing that held me back from buying this rack. I got past it and have never worried about it coming loose. The locking deal is a bit of a mystery but it could be helpful (and adding more weight but he states it's lighter..)
    5. The tilting lever is good for those that might use it. You can get one for the original design but I personally never use it.
    6. Adding another rack seems cheesy also. Hooking it on the first rack is good but I would like to have it bolted too.


    Bottom line is for me, the simple well made rack is the one I'll use and purchase again if need be. I don't care who knows it or not. Those things happen in business and it will play out in time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    If Cal "owned" all that John380 claims, why didn't he sue 1Up YEARS ago to stop them from selling HIS design, using HIS company name?
    Yeah, I think we're missing part of the story for sure:

    Quote Originally Posted by Oktavius View Post
    This news article says ownership and management changed in 2011 but Cal still retained share in the company.

    Dickeyville bike rack business on a roll | Tri-state News | telegraphherald.com
    This article says that

    In summer 2011, [Robbie] Lange took over as general manager and owner. [Cal] Phillips maintains a share in the company.


    So, Cal must have licensed his patents, logos, designs at that time to Robbie... perhaps with a non-compete for a period of time. but

    Quote Originally Posted by J_Westy View Post
    And an email from email1upusa@gmail.com which appears to be Cal:

    We are 1upusa.com we are selling the new version of the quik rack. Our company has been selling since the year 2000. The other company has been selling for about one year. You can do a Whois search and get the details on both companies. The other company is selling the old version of the quick rack only.
    This note says "The other company has been selling for about one year"

    So I wonder:

    - Did Cal sell his share and leave on his own?
    - Was Cal fired?
    - Is Robbie with the "1up dash usa" company or with Cal?
    - What happened "about one year" ago?

    Regardless, as a fan of American entrepreneurs, I bummed that this is happening since both parties are going to sink a bunch of money in lawyers.
    Last edited by J_Westy; 2 Weeks Ago at 06:19 AM.
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    thanks J Westy, that saved me some time reading back and helps clarify a little.

    who knows why Cal took on others in a way where they got control. could have been upfront or a decision to sell later. this stuff happens all the time in smaller businesses.

    too bad, a simple and great product may go down the toilet for a spell.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirtrider127 View Post
    I have the original rack from 1up-usa and couldn't be happier. Best.rack.ever

    The new rack has a couple of things I like and some I don't.
    1. Being a "no weld" design means it's bolted together as you can see in the video. In most cases I would think that a weld would weigh less than bolts but he claims the new design is lighter. Where did the weight savings come from? When welded correctly, there is no worry. Bolts might back out or need checking for tightness.
    2. The adjustable wheels stops are crap. Period. It seems pretty cheesy and might lend to getting loose/stolen easier
    3. The new design that stops the lift bar from coming up too high and binding is a good idea. If you watch the videos demoing the arms they place their finger under it while moving the bar (just like I do) not a show stopped for me
    4. The pin thingy that goes into the normal hitch pin hole is nice and the biggest thing that held me back from buying this rack. I got past it and have never worried about it coming loose. The locking deal is a bit of a mystery but it could be helpful (and adding more weight but he states it's lighter..)
    5. The tilting lever is good for those that might use it. You can get one for the original design but I personally never use it.
    6. Adding another rack seems cheesy also. Hooking it on the first rack is good but I would like to have it bolted too.


    Bottom line is for me, the simple well made rack is the one I'll use and purchase again if need be. I don't care who knows it or not. Those things happen in business and it will play out in time.
    Might interest you to know that in my original 1UpUSA rack, I had a weld that failed catastrophically. The rack was replaced by 1UpUSA.

  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_Westy View Post

    Regardless, as a fan of American entrepreneurs, I bummed that this is happening since both parties are going to sink a bunch of money in lawyers.
    And possibly even worse, they are creating confusion and doubt in consumer's minds about a brand with an excellent reputation.
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    I got about halfway into this thread and stopped reading all the replies....

    AFAIK, the former site always ~redirected~ it back to the new site....

    What is odd, and you have to look at the original 1up thread, was a MTBR forum member was posting about the the new tilt release handle, etc that the *new 1Up shop* had given this member some info on.

    So the ? is, why would the state the new handle redesign if it was actually the new competing/original owner who is releasing it under HIS new entity.

    Soooo confused..

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    I ended up ordering from 1up-usa.com on Friday and just received it today (I live in MD). It's an awesome rack and I'm glad I ordered it. I exchanged emails with 1up-usa prior to ordering and they were always quick to respond, usually within a few hours.

    It sucks what is happening but I've literally been torn with what rack to buyer for the past two months but I'm glad I got one promptly. We'll see how things turn out after a year of use but I have no doubts it'll be just fine.

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