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  1. #1
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    will the US ever get a small diesel suv or ute?

    Dear American Car CEO,

    As much as you love that your full size truck is the size of an elephant, can tow a ship, weighs 7000lbs, gets 12mpg and has a comfy leather interior, I am not a construction foreman and perhaps do want want to be Mr Excessive.

    I want something real world practical that is the swiss army knife of vehicles that can do everything. You offer it overseas, bring it here!


    2012 Volkswagen Amarok
    2.0L - 30+ mpg


    2012 Ford Ranger
    2.2L - 27+ mpg


    2012 Toyota HiLux
    2.5L - 32mpg

  2. #2
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    Sucks thats vehicles like that will probably never be brought here, beside most people think they need a yuppy sized suv/truck to haul a briefcase to work, god forbid they need to haul something more that 50 pounds cause they would buy a 3/4 or larger for that.

  3. #3
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    Agreed. Till then, I'll be driving my 14 year old, 212000 mile corrola into the ground. And then I'll ride my bike the rest of the way. Still get's ~30mpg highway (used to be 35+ back when she was younger). I'm not parting with my money till I get something with better mileage and more room. (secretly eye-ing the Sonota 2.0T and a tow hitch for carrying the bike.) And features, like functional seatbelts.

  4. #4
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    I had asked this same question on another forum. All we got are VW/Audi TDIs.

    Personally, I wanted the VW Sirocco; but it didn't make it over because the VW-US president said it would compete with the Golf and VW headquarters said it wouldn't be able to make a profit.

  5. #5
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    No, never, and you can thank hybrids plus tighter diesel emissions controls. Somebody was lobbying for batteries...Follow the money and you will find the answers.

    We were supposed to get the Accord Diesel
    We were supposed to get the Subaru diesel

  6. #6
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    The Touareg is available with VW's excellent turbo-diesel. Not cheap tho...

    VW Touareg TDI Clean Diesel < Volkswagen of America

  7. #7
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    We are American! We are afraid of diesel engines! We think they are noisy, stinky, and make big black clouds of smoke when you take off. Plus we prefer to subsidize corn and pursue an alternative fuel that cannot ever be a good alternative.

    I really wish there were more options for us besides a couple VW's and full size trucks. Stick a diesel in a small car based SUV and you can easily get mpg's deep into the 30's.

  8. #8
    Dude, got any schwag?
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    Jeep Liberty in 2005 & 2006. 2.8L VM CRD.
    Jeep Grand Cherokee in 2007 & 2008. 3.0L Mercedes CRD.
    Now owned by Fiat, Jeep will likely start seeing oil burners in a couple years.

    Where the heckfire is my Wrangler Diesel?!

    You can get new 2012 cars with diesel from VW, Mercedes, BMW & Audi.
    Billy

    Speed is sweet, it's like an avenue to
    ... Shredtopia!

  9. #9
    Machinist
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    Yep when I bought my Tacoma new in 2001 I was wishing for a diesel version!!!
    "Ya can't argue logic with ignorance.''

  10. #10
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    Yeah, I really hate all of the politics involved with cars, it amazes me people still buy suv's that get terrible gas mileage and then don't use them for anything you'd need a truck or suv for. Maybe take a look at a Suberu outback? My friend has one, and with a bike rack on the top its quite versetile... works for camping, skiing, biking, hauling friends with gear. He threw a hitch rack on the back and with the rack on the top he can haul 4 guys with 4 bikes and gear quite comfortably. Good luck in your search.

  11. #11
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    I am not holding my breath, but Mazda still hasn't decided (according to reports) whether or not to bring the Skyactive-D (diesel) to the US in the CX-5.... I would be sold (almost without a test drive) if that happens!
    Fat guys need bikes too.

  12. #12
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    You forgot to mention that most other countries in the world, often Canada, have the US models available with diesel engines.

    In Europe they have a mini-Cooper diesel that gets around 65 mpg. They also have a VW Sharan (it's a minivan that seats 7 and gets 40+ mpg; I drove one for two weeks this past summer and it was excellent), the Nissan Navarro (same as Frontier, with a diesel engine 30+ mpg), BMW 1 series (50+ mpg), and virtually every other vehicle available or not availalbe in the US with efficient diesel engines.

    Honda won't do diesel in the US, and Toyota is leaning towards hybrids. From what I've read, the RAV4 may be available as a plug-in hybrid in the next couple of years. Nissan isn't developing diesel for the US, BMW is releasing their 335D to the US market but not the ultra-efficient, smaller 1 series or Mini. Mazda and Hyundai are both rumored to be considering diesels, but it's only rumors, so it probably won't happen.

    I've been looking at this because I know eventually my 91 Civic will need to be replaced. I'd like to get a small 4WD capable machine, such as a Subaru or even a RAV4, but there's nothing on the market at this point. In the real world, Subaru's average in the low 20's MPG, and the RAV4/CRV isn't much better.

    VW makes nice diesels, but have you ever noticed that 3/4+ vehicles with a brake/tail light out are VWs? Makes me think their electrical systems aren't what they should be.

    Mercedes... they went to crap after Chrysler bought them. If I was looking to buy today, they wouldn't even be on my radar. In my opinion, they're one step up from Daewoo.

    The BMW 335D is $40k+, so it's definitely not a serious contender for me.
    Last edited by J_Hopper; 10-11-2011 at 10:38 PM.

  13. #13
    ballbuster
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom93R1 View Post
    We are American! We are afraid of diesel engines! We think they are noisy, stinky, and make big black clouds of smoke when you take off. Plus we prefer to subsidize corn and pursue an alternative fuel that cannot ever be a good alternative.

    I really wish there were more options for us besides a couple VW's and full size trucks. Stick a diesel in a small car based SUV and you can easily get mpg's deep into the 30's.
    I dunno. Here in NorCal there are tons of modern VW TDIs running around. The older ones before the emissions pinch still fetch top dollar on craigslist. Maybe were in a little bubble around here, but seems to me there is no shortage of demand for diesels.

    I think if VW ever released a Tiguan TDI here in the states, it would sell really well.

    *edit*

    Looks like it won't be imported due to the 'chicken tax', a 25% tariff put in place in the 60s and left there to protect american light truck mfgs.
    Last edited by pimpbot; 10-12-2011 at 01:54 AM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_Hopper View Post
    I've been looking at this because I know eventually my 91 Civic will need to be replaced. I'd like to get a small 4WD capable machine, such as a Subaru or even a RAV4, but there's nothing on the market at this point. In the real world, Subaru's average in the low 20's MPG, and the RAV4/CRV isn't much better..
    I don;t know how capable of 4wd you need but the Nissan Juke may work.

  15. #15
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    You would see a lot more diesels if ethanol was able to be added to it. Follow THAT corn money too, all the way back to every Iowa Caucus for either party.

    Jeep Liberty CRD is a great car, and you will pay a premium for it. (It is not really a Jeep, but it will still go most anywhere that you dare)

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_Hopper View Post
    Mercedes... they went to crap after Chrysler bought them. If I was looking to buy today, they wouldn't even be on my radar. In my opinion, they're one step up from Daewoo.
    .
    Uh, Mercedes bought Chrysler not the other way around Agree about them being plagued by reliability. BMW and VW have similar issues...and have had them for years! VW makes several models I would consider, but not with the reliability ratings they continue to post up year after year. And then they have the nerve to expect a premium for their product??
    CyclingCentralVa.org

  17. #17
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    VW is large enough and has enough money they can push forward into the diesel market, which I commend them. Its not exactly a revelation. Its a matter of beating the stranglehold auto unions and our government has on our freedom of choices and innovation.

    The new diesel mixture laws for emissions coupled with California's nazi emission laws both make America a huge cost deterant. These special blend diesel fuel for America cost much higher to manufacturer then elsewhere. Every car sold also must pass Cali's nazi emission laws, and being such a huge market, most manu will pass and just stick to gas. Just like anything in business, It CAN be done, as long as car makers are willing to push for it. Pushing typically equals money though, which VW has spades of.

    Another part of the problem is supply chain (IE unions) - existing contracts and suppliers. Folks are unwilling to risk breaking existing relationships, especially in tough times and when costs are rising. Its not about what is best for consumers, its about what sells the most, and is best for stock prices, and what keeps inflated wages up. It may cost more at first, but pushing for diesel electric hybrids is the best interium solution until Audi can figure out their new sustainable fuel e-gas. Its just sad that even at minmium, we do not have the choice to import Mexican and Canada vehicles without insane costs and paperwork.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by motard5 View Post
    It may cost more at first, but pushing for diesel electric hybrids is the best interium solution until Audi can figure out their new sustainable fuel e-gas. .
    Why wait for Audi to figure anything out, Honda already has an Accord on the road in CA that runs on a hydrogen cell. Now if the government would subsidise that technology rather then wasting money on subsidies to the fuel and ethanol industries we would be moving forward.
    CyclingCentralVa.org

  19. #19
    TrinityRiverKerplunk
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    I work on marine diesels here in Seattle, and right next door is a VW lot. I used to love VW. but apparently their quality is subpar now compared to Ford or GM, go figure! That's according to the guys here who work on them, not a Car and Driver survery, btw.

    Sigh....I vote for the diesel-hybrid option!
    Good friction shifting is getting hard to find nowadays....

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicrown junkie View Post
    I work on marine diesels here in Seattle, and right next door is a VW lot. I used to love VW. but apparently their quality is subpar now compared to Ford or GM, go figure! That's according to the guys here who work on them, not a Car and Driver survery, btw.

    Sigh....I vote for the diesel-hybrid option!
    From what I hear in the industry there is some truth there. VW's top vehicles are still quality like their Audi counterparts, but Ze Germans are taking a page from the American book and targeting lower quality higher volume.

    Its simply ironic what is going on in the Auto world right now. Foreigh auto makers are placing their production facilities in America, and we are finally starting to do the same. Just look at GM's new huge diesel engine and production plant in Thailand to make the new Colorado.

    Bottom line though is that the BRIC countries are BOOMING and have bucko demand. American auto makers can take advantage of this demand coupled with increasing our domestic exports, as overseas markets place a premium on American made products.
    Last edited by motard5; 10-17-2011 at 07:36 PM.

  21. #21
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    Subaru was teasing bringing over their diesel to the U.S. over the past few years, but it's not happening. A diesel Forester would have been sweet.

    I sell Subarus, and I love them but I was very close to considering a Jetta TDI wagon as my next car, up until the new Jetta platform ended up sucking ass and being a decontented crap box compared to the prior version- and even with the prior version I was leery of quality.

    Oh and please don't get me started on the lack of diesels in the U.S... you can thank our emissions issues with our government, and also California, plus American ignorance towards diesels.

    What I don't get is how VW will sell them left and right but everyone else is afraid to. Sigh.

    The Mahindra small pickup would have been SWEET because there are zero small pickups available in America, but that appears to not be happening, and earlier in the 2000's there was supposed to be that Crosslander venture with that Romanian company whose name I forget, which was a neat looking small SUV (poor man's Defender 110), but that turned into vaporware.

  22. #22
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    The Mazda Skyactiv Gas 4 cylinder will be available in the US late 2011/early 2012. The Skyactiv diesel is soon to follow. The Skyactiv-G (gas) is reported to see over 40mpg in the Mazda 3 Hatchback on regular 87 octane producing 155hp through a 6 speed manual gearbox. Through the same gearbox in the same car, the Skyactiv D (diesel, twin turbo 4 cyl diesel btw) is reported to make over 50mpg. What I would love to see, and would purchase in a heartbeat. Would be the return of the Mazda B series truck in a crew cab with the Skyactiv-D. But I wont hold my breath. We are getting them in the Mazda 2's and 3's though, I can assure you.
    2010 Giant Yukon FX
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  23. #23
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    Pretty sure Jeep liberty have them as an option and according to a google search grand cherokee will also in 2013..

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by XJaredX View Post
    ....Oh and please don't get me started on the lack of diesels in the U.S... you can thank our emissions issues with our government, and also California, plus American ignorance towards diesels.
    While you might be partly right, I don't think this is accurate about emissions. Emissions are often the scapegoat. If that really was the case, then:
    1- how does VW do it, but no other small diesel can?
    2- how can BMW meet US and CA emissions standards with their 3 series diesel, but not their 1 series and mini-Cooper?
    3- How can Ford, Chevy, and Dodge do it in their full size trucks, but not their small trucks?

    You see, the emissions argument doesn't make any sense. Sure, they may not be able to take something off the shelf and make it work, but with some effort it could be done.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by motard5 View Post
    Dear American Car CEO,

    As much as you love that your full size truck is the size of an elephant, can tow a ship, weighs 7000lbs, gets 12mpg and has a comfy leather interior, I am not a construction foreman and perhaps do want want to be Mr Excessive.

    I want something real world practical that is the swiss army knife of vehicles that can do everything. You offer it overseas, bring it here!
    As the owner of an 11 year old GMC truck that has been absolutely reliable, consistently gets 17mpg, and has room to spare, I agree with you. I would love to find decent smaller truck that gets better fuel economy that still manages to merge onto the freeway. The 4 cylinder compact trucks don't get it done, and the v6 trucks don't manage much better fuel economy than my Z71. Oh well, They'll never listen. The problem is that the compact trucks end up costing within ~$50/month of a fullsize, and with little difference in fuel economy, they just don't have a market.

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