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  1. #1901
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
    ^^ What other cars have you driven? What were you expecting from a 5 year old base model? Where do you live?
    I've also driven a '09 Jetta Sportwagen. More money than the Soob, but it felt very nice inside. I sat in it and thought "wow, this is a nice car!". However, at least on the test route that I took it on, I can't say it drove any better than the Soob did. A no D, so I'm hesitant to go that route.

    I live in RI. I wasn't expecting a Mercedes or anything like that, but I keep hearing how much people love their OB's and how nice they are. I guess I had set my expectatations too high.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ilikebmx999 View Post
    We're talking about a regular outback or an outback sport? Big difference in size. The sport is an impreza chassis which is fairly small inside. The regular outback is pretty large.

    And yes, base model cars are just that...base model. I'd say shop around more and find one with more options. That body style is the best looking for the regular outback IMO.
    I drove the regular wagon. I wouldn't describe it as "large" though. I sat in the pass seat, and to get mostly comfortable I had to put the seat back all the way. Then, I sat in the pass side rear seat, and my knees were jammed up against the back of the front seat. Cargo area with the seats down looked decently sized though.

    And I agree 100%, that body style is the best looking, and to go even further, I think the 05-07 models are the best of that body style. The '08-'09 front end doesn't look as good IMO. I like the extra size of the 4th gen though, and despite it's wierd looks that's the one I'd pick if cost were not a factor.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tystevens View Post
    Funny analysis, b/c in my mind, that is exactly what an Outback is -- a very useful transportation appliance. It can get you where you want to go in most any conditions, and allow you to bring your stuff there, too. I don't think anyone would confuse a 2.5i as being a driver's car! Is is a transportation appliance, plain and simple. It is a pair of trail runners or light hiking shoes, not a pair of athletic shoes or nice dress shoes! If you want to get bikes, skis, or whatever up rough or snowy roads, that is where an Outback seems to shine. That said, I don't think the Outback feels any different than a comparably equipped Accord, Camry, Malibu, etc, which is part why I went w/ the Outback. It felt the same as the other cars, but just had a little more capability for the things I like to do.

    If you want a few more bells and whistles, the limited models are a little nicer inside, and might help you have that warm and fuzzy feeling. I drove a couple, and the leather seats and upgraded stereo were nice. Plus, that sunroof is pretty neat -- it is huge. But in the end, I was only shopping for an appliance to get myself to and from work, to the trails, and give me secure transportation in inclement weather. So I went with a pretty standard 2.5i wagon (not the "basic", but the "i" model w/ the 17" wheels and stuff like that). If I want to feel special, I'll climb in the fully loaded Suburban my wife drives!
    Actually, after thinking about it more over the weekend and talking to some friends, I have to agee with you. With what I'm looking for in a car at this point, an appliance is what it's going to be.

    This is replacing my '97 Grand Cherokee, and what I really want is another SUV, but I just drive too much to be able to justify getting that type of mileage. Four hundred miles a week at 17mpg just doesn't work for me.

    So basically what I need is an AWD wagon if I want something comparable to the Jeep with better mileage. So that leaves the Outback, the Volvo XC70, and the Audi as pretty much the only options. It's hard to find a Volvo with under 100k miles for a decent price, and from what I've read about Audi's, they're the kind of car you do not want to own out of warranty. So I might have to just get over it and learn to love the Subaru.

    Plus, I still have my LS1 Firebird as a fun car, so I suppose it won't kill me to have a boring daily driver, haha.

    I'd like to find a LTD, but I don't see too many around. Before I looked at the '07, there was an '06 LTD at a nearby dealer that I had actually set out to drive that day. Turns out it was sold, so I went around the corner to where the '07 was and drove that one instead.

    I'm thinking of offering them my Jeep in trade, plus 11k. I'd be happy with that deal, and even private party I wouldn't expect to get any more than 1500 for the Jeep, so that owuld save me a few bucks on sales tax and the trouble of selling it. I guess it depends on how bad they want to get rid of the car. The saleman told me they usually have a 15-18 day turnover, and that car has been there for at least a month that I know of.

  2. #1902
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    I don't want to quote the entire previous response, but a couple thoughts:

    1) I agree that the 3rd gen isn't a very big car on the inside. That is probably my main complaint about the car after nearly a month of owing an '07 OB. Drivers comfort is ok, but at 'only' 6' tall, my seat is all the way back, which leaves very little room for a rear passenger, even a small one. Then there's the width of the seat, which is kind of a joke. A car seat and 2 boosters are a no-go. I never really crawled around back there much before buying -- I mean, you see Outbacks touted as a "family vehicle" all over the place -- but the car really isn't big enough to transport 3 kids in seats, at least on a regular basis. We have child #4 due to arrive in the spring, so the Outback really never was intended to be our family hauler, anyway, but I am a little disappointed with the interior seating capabilities.

    2) I just think the OB is a different car than the Audi or Volvo. Quattro is a great AWD system, but is more performance oriented than 'offroad' oriented (good snow cars, though). Plus, there is the ride height (at least on the A4). And if you find a bi-turbo Allroad, you won't get much better mpg than the Grand Cherokee. The OB is a good alternative to an SUV that is not used to tow or 4x4 a lot, IMO.
    '11 Specialized Enduro Expert for the trails
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  3. #1903
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Ok, at least there's a place more expensive than California.
    Yep, it is worse than California. I truly hate this place but my job is in Manhattan. How much are the premiums in California?
    “You can always count on Americans to do the right thing - after they've tried everything else.”

  4. #1904
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    A Jetta wagon and Outback aren't in the same class of cars at all. If you don't need AWD there are plenty of cars to consider besides an Outback.

  5. #1905
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    Had an LL bean H6 3.0, never found it to be "small", in fact found the rear seats pretty generous. It may not be crown-vic large, but it's better than pretty much any midsize SUV I've ridden in, any wrx/mazda3-sized car by FAR.

    And yeah, the outback is made to travel off-road. It's anti-sway bars are weak to soak up asymmetrical bumps (even though it feels like it's clawing the road on the dry and flat), it's springs are soft for similar reasons and ease of driving off road. Now my parents have a 2012 outback and it goes much further in this direction than the old H6 3.0, it's more specialized for it's intended role. It's not going to carve up the dry like a low and stiff performance car. If it did, it'd ride like poop off road.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  6. #1906
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    Quote Originally Posted by PatrickK View Post
    Yep, it is worse than California. I truly hate this place but my job is in Manhattan. How much are the premiums in California?
    Not very cheap. I have State Farm's highest driver safety rating (42 years old) and pay a little more than 400 every six months for an 2009 Impreza Premium (non turbo). The old 2002 Forester is like 300 or so. I know "TV insurance" could be less.

  7. #1907
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Not very cheap. I have State Farm's highest driver safety rating (42 years old) and pay a little more than 400 every six months for an 2009 Impreza Premium (non turbo). The old 2002 Forester is like 300 or so. I know "TV insurance" could be less.
    We are still talking about full coverage, right? I had State Farm, the greedy bastards were jacking up my rates for no reason. I cancelled them and asked my accountant to find me a better deal. I went with Hartford insurance.
    “You can always count on Americans to do the right thing - after they've tried everything else.”

  8. #1908
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    Quote Originally Posted by PatrickK View Post
    We are still talking about full coverage, right? I had State Farm, the greedy bastards were jacking up my rates for no reason. I cancelled them and asked my accountant to find me a better deal. I went with Hartford insurance.
    Full coverage and lots of it; I've had the same agent since I was 16, maybe that helps.

  9. #1909
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilikebmx999 View Post
    That seems quite high if you're 54. I'm 28 and pay $52 a month for full coverage on my 04 wrx.
    Thats kind of comparing apples to oranges. Insurance is always lower on an older car because the value decreases with the cars age. Full coverage also varies and with a $250 deductible my rate is pretty low. It's farm bureau so no internet insurance. I suppose having two driving age teenage sons doesn't help either. Considering all of that, I think the rate is pretty good.

    Compared to other performance cars I have owned the subarus have always been more durable and less costly to own.

  10. #1910
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilikebmx999 View Post
    That seems quite high if you're 54. I'm 28 and pay $52 a month for full coverage on my 04 wrx.
    Thats kind of comparing apples to oranges. Insurance is always lower on an older car because the value decreases with the cars age. Full coverage also varies and with a $250 deductible my rate is pretty low. It's farm bureau so no internet insurance. I suppose having two driving age teenage sons doesn't help either. Considering all of that, I think the rate is pretty good.

  11. #1911
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilikebmx999 View Post
    That seems quite high if you're 54. I'm 28 and pay $52 a month for full coverage on my 04 wrx.
    Thats kind of comparing apples to oranges. Insurance is always lower on an older car because the value decreases with the cars age. Full coverage also varies and with a $250 deductible my rate is pretty low. It's farm bureau so no internet insurance. I suppose having two driving age teenage sons doesn't help either. Considering all of that, I think the rate is pretty good.

  12. #1912
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Full coverage and lots of it; I've had the same agent since I was 16, maybe that helps.

    Cool. I do not have much choice for the time being. It is great to hear that you are a loyal customer and your agent is doing his job. I no longer own a Subaru so my premium is higher right now.
    “You can always count on Americans to do the right thing - after they've tried everything else.”

  13. #1913
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    Finally got to go ride yesterday, here's my Subaru, bike, and rack.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Who else here drives a Subaru?-niner-ob-kuat-small.jpg  

    There is no magic bike, it is all about the magic you put in it.
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  14. #1914
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    Nice bike, car, and rack!

  15. #1915
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    Good job!

    Nice set-up Camel Toad! I have the same color OB but a 1Up rack...
    Current ride(s) 2011 Santa Cruz Blur LT

  16. #1916
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    Thanks, I am pretty happy with all three (car, bike, rack).

    I saw a 1up yesterday, and it's really solid. I like it a lot, too! I bought the NV based on a few people I know that have one.

    The OB is a big change from a Nissan Titan. It doesn't feel like it's mine yet, but I just crossed 400 miles on the ODO. In the last 8 days I've driven a whopping 49 miles
    There is no magic bike, it is all about the magic you put in it.
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  17. #1917
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    You'll be putting more miles on soon.. I am almost at 40K miles in 2 years...
    Current ride(s) 2011 Santa Cruz Blur LT

  18. #1918
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    My 9yr old truck had only 69.5k when I sold it...I work from home


    Anyway, what kind of mpg are you getting? Looks like my first tank was 21.5, which is disappointing since I didn't drive aggressively. I can't remember for sure if I reset the trip meter when the dealer topped it off. We'll see how it goes.
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  19. #1919
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    My 2006 WRX has 170,000 miles on it. I bought it new in the fall of 2006.

    My 80+ mile a day commute recently went to 12 miles a day.

  20. #1920
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    ... and if we just ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Camel Toad View Post
    My 9yr old truck had only 69.5k when I sold it...I work from home


    Anyway, what kind of mpg are you getting? Looks like my first tank was 21.5, which is disappointing since I didn't drive aggressively. I can't remember for sure if I reset the trip meter when the dealer topped it off. We'll see how it goes.
    I have the 3.6 as I tow my skiff around, which the car does very well BTW. Last 1000 miles I averaged 27.6 MPG. That includes towing, city/Hwy and going to the trail-system doing maintenance. If I just drive on the Hwy than the OB gets 29-31 MPG and I am not driving like a granny as that gets you killed down here..
    The mileage will improve but IMHO after 500-1000 miles you need to drive it like you stole it. Keep an eye on the engine oil and change at 1000 miles regardless of what the dealer and manual tell you. I use synthetic oil and from now on will only use Redline as Mobil1 sucks. Both my mom's and my OB seem to evaporate that oil, unlike Valvoline or Pennzoil we used before. My brother drives a GTI and on the forums he is on, the talk about Mobil1 is not good either...
    Current ride(s) 2011 Santa Cruz Blur LT

  21. #1921
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    Good job!

    Quote Originally Posted by Turbopit View Post
    My 2006 WRX has 170,000 miles on it. I bought it new in the fall of 2006.

    My 80+ mile a day commute recently went to 12 miles a day.
    WRX's rock!
    Current ride(s) 2011 Santa Cruz Blur LT

  22. #1922
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    Just bought my third Subaru. The only cars I've ever owned. I scored a 91 Legacy wagon with only 122k original miles on it.

    The shop I took it into to just do an alignment after buying even mentioned how crazy good condition the engine looked to be in.

    I'm planning on putting a 2-3" body lift in and see what tires I can snug in there because out of all I've owned, I've always wished for just a touch more clearance.

  23. #1923
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    Pew Pew Pew!

    Alcohol may lead nowhere, but it sure is the scenic route!

  24. #1924
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    Just picked it up today -


  25. #1925
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    Nice color.
    konahonzo

  26. #1926
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    The XV in orange is niiiiice.

  27. #1927
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    Nice XV! I have a Venetian red pearl 5 speed coming in hopefully in the next couple weeks.

  28. #1928
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
    The XV in orange is niiiiice.
    I love it too.

  29. #1929
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    Nice looking XV! I originally went to the Subi dealer looking for one, but ended up with an Outback only b/c the cargo area in the XV was a bit too small for my scuba gear (doubles, deco bottles, and so on for technical diving).
    There is no magic bike, it is all about the magic you put in it.
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  30. #1930
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech420 View Post
    Nice XV! I have a Venetian red pearl 5 speed coming in hopefully in the next couple weeks.
    So, no 6 speed yet? The 2014 forester will have one I guess.

  31. #1931
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    Decided to go Kayaking the other day!

  32. #1932
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    2011 Outback limited in Burgundy.

  33. #1933
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    So, no 6 speed yet? The 2014 forester will have one I guess.
    Nope It's silly to make cars without a 6 speed nowadays. The car could certainly use an extra gear for highway cruising.

  34. #1934
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech420 View Post
    Nope It's silly to make cars without a 6 speed nowadays. The car could certainly use an extra gear for highway cruising.
    All depends on the gear ratio's. The STI has a 6pd gearbox, but all the gears are quite short and there's virtually no added benefit over the 5MT in the WRX.

    I just wish they'd make the FXT in a manual again
    Alcohol may lead nowhere, but it sure is the scenic route!

  35. #1935
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    Just bought a '09 Forester XT Limited last Friday. I'm pretty damn excited about it! I've owned nothing but Nissan Sentras my entire life (1993, 2002 that I built the engine on and added a huge turbo... now it sits in the garage for no good reason, and a 2005), so I was very happy to get away from those, though I still own the '02 and '05. I got my AWD and factory turbo, finally! Now I just need to get crossbars for the roof rack so I can swap over my Thule bike stuff. I have a hitch, but not a fan of doing a hitch mounted rack, too many nightmares of some dumbass rearending me and taking out my precious bikes.

  36. #1936
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miltony527 View Post
    Yeah ive never heard of anybody or any shop replacing just one head gasket. As I said before thats just plain bad practice period. There is really no additional work involved. You probably save $35 for the cost of the gasket.
    No additional work required? Have you ever looked at a Subaru engine?

  37. #1937
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    Just picked it up on Sunday afternoon.


  38. #1938
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
    No additional work required? Have you ever looked at a Subaru engine?
    If the engine is out and one head is already off then no; not a lot of work to do the other one. Maybe another book hour at a shop tops. No additional work is not quite what I'd say though lol

    That's just bad practice though especially on a Subaru. If one leaks the other will follow soon enough.

    I've done plenty of work on subarus just to clarify.

  39. #1939
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech420 View Post
    Nope It's silly to make cars without a 6 speed nowadays. The car could certainly use an extra gear for highway cruising.
    The Impreza, XV Crosstrek, and WRX are now the only vehicles with a 5-speed manual. The rest have the 6-speed manual available

    Heck, I think Subaru is sending all the leftover 5-speeds to the USA, because the rest of the world gets the 6-speed with the 2.0 liter FB20 engine.

    Quote Originally Posted by OO7 View Post
    All depends on the gear ratio's. The STI has a 6pd gearbox, but all the gears are quite short and there's virtually no added benefit over the 5MT in the WRX.

    I just wish they'd make the FXT in a manual again
    Probably not happening due to lack of sales

    Also, the new Forester XT is a CVT-only combination. If you want manual control, there are 6-speed and 8-speed shiftable modes, SI-Drive...

    and X-Mode, Subaru's low-traction and hill-descent control.

  40. #1940
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech420 View Post
    Nope It's silly to make cars without a 6 speed nowadays. The car could certainly use an extra gear for highway cruising.
    Our 2002 Forester is geared very low compared to our 2009 Impreza. The new car seems fine on the highway, the old car is yelling at speed.
    Last edited by SS Hack; 12-05-2012 at 11:47 AM.

  41. #1941
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Our 2002 Forester is geared very low compared to our 2009 Impreza. The new car seems fine on the highway, the old car is yelling at speed.
    Not exactly a fair comparison, because Subaru often gives the Forester and Outback shorter gearing (most likely for potential towing and light off-road use) due to a different final drive.

    The final drive ratios for Foresters and Outbacks (the soft off-roaders) often are shorter than their regular-Subaru counterparts.

    I believe for the longest time, the Forester and Outback with the 5-speed manual had a final drive ratio of 4.11 while most regular 5MT Imprezas and Legacies made do with a taller, 3.90 final drive ratio.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilikebmx999 View Post
    If the engine is out and one head is already off then no; not a lot of work to do the other one. Maybe another book hour at a shop tops. No additional work is not quite what I'd say though lol

    That's just bad practice though especially on a Subaru. If one leaks the other will follow soon enough.

    I've done plenty of work on subarus just to clarify.
    I know you have. I think removing another cylinder head qualifies as additional work though, especially if the engine is still in the car. Although, I wouldn't want to do it while still on the car either.

  43. #1943
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    Here's my '07 Legacy




    Bike fits in the back pretty well



  44. #1944
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    Figured I may as well post mine, as a new member here. Here's my '03 on a trip to Big Bear a few months ago. My friend is posing proudly next to his Jamis steed.

  45. #1945
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    I used to ...2010 Subaru WRX STI and 2000 Subaru Impreza RS.

  46. #1946
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    Quote Originally Posted by OO7 View Post
    All depends on the gear ratio's. The STI has a 6pd gearbox, but all the gears are quite short and there's virtually no added benefit over the 5MT in the WRX.

    I just wish they'd make the FXT in a manual again
    No, I second the "it's silly to not make cars with 6spds these days". My wrx had a great spread of the gears, and the short gearing of the sti is great, but you really need a nice long gear for the highway or the proper speeds to drop the RPM and increase the mileage significantly. With the WRX you'd see a pretty good boost in mileage if you could drop the rpm to say 2000 at 65. You'd have to downshift for steep hills, but it would be more efficient. 5 is the least I'd consider, but only in some rare cases. Autos and manuals should be 6spd to start with, go 7 or even 8. That subaru is still making a 4spd auto is inexcusable IMO. They are the last to really take hold of new technology (direct injection, twin scroll turbos on us models, etc), but usually when they do, it's pretty solid. Here's to hoping they see the light.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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    I have thought about test driving a XV but I'm afraid that I'll have to bring it home. I really don't like car payments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    No, I second the "it's silly to not make cars with 6spds these days". My wrx had a great spread of the gears, and the short gearing of the sti is great, but you really need a nice long gear for the highway or the proper speeds to drop the RPM and increase the mileage significantly. With the WRX you'd see a pretty good boost in mileage if you could drop the rpm to say 2000 at 65. You'd have to downshift for steep hills, but it would be more efficient. 5 is the least I'd consider, but only in some rare cases. Autos and manuals should be 6spd to start with, go 7 or even 8. That subaru is still making a 4spd auto is inexcusable IMO. They are the last to really take hold of new technology (direct injection, twin scroll turbos on us models, etc), but usually when they do, it's pretty solid. Here's to hoping they see the light.
    I'm with you about needing a low final gear. My Outback is a 5 MT, and in 5th gear it hangs at 3200 rpm for 65 mph. It really needs to be brought down to around 2500 for such a speed.

    Subaru, however, no longer offers a 4 speed auto for their Legacy and Outback. Now its either a 6 MT or a CVT, which gets great mileage for a full time awd car.

  49. #1949
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zuarte View Post
    I'm with you about needing a low final gear. My Outback is a 5 MT, and in 5th gear it hangs at 3200 rpm for 65 mph. It really needs to be brought down to around 2500 for such a speed.

    Subaru, however, no longer offers a 4 speed auto for their Legacy and Outback. Now its either a 6 MT or a CVT, which gets great mileage for a full time awd car.
    My Subaru OB 3.6 has a 5 speed automatic, and I get 30 MPG on the highway @ 70 MPH...
    Current ride(s) 2011 Santa Cruz Blur LT

  50. #1950
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
    I know you have. I think removing another cylinder head qualifies as additional work though, especially if the engine is still in the car. Although, I wouldn't want to do it while still on the car either.
    I don't know why people would even bother wasting time doing it IN the car. Sounds like a nightmare.

    I just put an engine in my boss's car earlier in the week. I'm getting disturbingly quick at it all by myself lol. Took 40 minutes from it sitting on a stand to being bolted to the trans.

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