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  1. #751
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot

    Dang... just looked it up. WRX weighs 3200 pounds? Dang! I thought it was much lighter..
    You ever go look up what AWD cars weigh? They aint light. That Subaru can do a 3200 AWD car while other manufacturers (lots of american ones) are way over that with 2wd is a pretty good testament to their engineering. The older WRXs have aluminum body panels to keep weight down, the downside is that they dent pretty easily due to this. Still, go look up what other AWD sedans weigh and you'll see just how heavy they are.

    I'm looking at 2011 audis on yahoo and I see 3600lbs for a4 quattros, 3800 for the wagon.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  2. #752
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superorb
    Plus, I'd feel a lot better knowing she doesn't have ~250hp on tap.
    Snap!
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  3. #753
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    Dang!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    You ever go look up what AWD cars weigh? They aint light. That Subaru can do a 3200 AWD car while other manufacturers (lots of american ones) are way over that with 2wd is a pretty good testament to their engineering. The older WRXs have aluminum body panels to keep weight down, the downside is that they dent pretty easily due to this. Still, go look up what other AWD sedans weigh and you'll see just how heavy they are.

    I'm looking at 2011 audis on yahoo and I see 3600lbs for a4 quattros, 3800 for the wagon.
    I somehow thought the newer ones were going on a diet. The MPG figures are pretty impressive.

    Depends on the AWD system. Audi's AWD only adds 150 pounds or so. I thought Subie used a similar kind of arrangement.

  4. #754
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    The 2.0s are damn close to 30mpg, I usually average right around 28, but that's driving around 80 on the highways we have here with lots of ups and down. I'd imagine 29-30 isn't hard given flat ground and lower speed limits.
    Not on my car. I'm only stage 2 and get terrible mileage: 20-22 highway and 16-18 city. I'm running an off the shelf tune, so maybe I need a dyno tune to dial it in. And I drive like a grandma, I hardly ever go into boost which is pretty tough to do on such a tiny turbo.

  5. #755
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    A proper tune will do wonders if you can keep your foot off the go pedal.

    I got 27mpg on a long flat highway trip with my old 20G turbo. Around town on the other hand is bad for the wallet.

  6. #756
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot
    I somehow thought the newer ones were going on a diet. The MPG figures are pretty impressive.

    Depends on the AWD system. Audi's AWD only adds 150 pounds or so. I thought Subie used a similar kind of arrangement.
    I feel that Audi-s FWD-based Quattro system might be heavier than the Symmetrical AWD of Subaru... I don't know for sure...

    And yes, the MPG figures of the newer Subarus are impressive considering that they're all AWD. And Subaru is trying to make their cars lighter. However, I must say that the newer generation of Subarus are extremely safe when it comes to unibody strength (thanks to stuff like heavily reinforced pillars)

  7. #757
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    Um....

    Quote Originally Posted by AWDfreak
    I feel that Audi-s FWD-based Quattro system might be heavier than the Symmetrical AWD of Subaru... I don't know for sure...

    And yes, the MPG figures of the newer Subarus are impressive considering that they're all AWD. And Subaru is trying to make their cars lighter. However, I must say that the newer generation of Subarus are extremely safe when it comes to unibody strength (thanks to stuff like heavily reinforced pillars)
    .. the A4 Quattro is symmetrical. it even has equal length half shafts (no torque steer!). The output shaft of the tranny directly drives a Torsen center diff with a 50:50 torque split between front and rear (except the new S4 which is like 60:40 rear biased... or is it the RS4?). It's always on, always applying torque to all wheels (that have traction... mostly).

    heh... I saw some Youtube vids of guys out there who removed the front driveshafts and welded the Torsen diffs to make RWD drift cars.

    The A3 (and TT and Golf 4Motion R:. ) is a FWD with a Haldex clutch. It only engages when the front wheels slip. They still call it Quattro (or 4Motion in VW land). IIRC, the new B6 gen Passat uses the A4 chassis, but they went to transversely mounting the engine, and a Haldex. Maybe that is the system you are thinking of when you say FWD based.

    There is a vid put out by Subaru on Youtube comparing the different systems, and Subie has it all over the B6 Haldex based sideways engine Passat 4Motion. I wish they compared it to an earlier B5 or B5.5 Passat with a Torsen (basically an A4) based system.

    The difference is that the A4 (and up) use a longitudinally mounted engine (like Subaru), and the A3/TT/Golf are transversally mounted engine. Of course, the major downside of the longitudinally mounted engine is that there is a ton of engine weight overhang over the front axle, shifting a lot of weight forward. Subie's H engine layout is way shorter than VW/Audi's inline 4 cylinder. so there is a more even weight distribution.

    Skip to 1:18 to see how it works:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuzJqH46JzI

    The only real change with modern quattro is that they went from an open diff with an electronic locker to a Torsen center diff, and they use the ABS to stop a spinning wheel on the same axle.

    GAWD. I am such an Audi geek.
    Last edited by pimpbot; 10-12-2010 at 06:11 PM.

  8. #758
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    Just bought my new 2010 Subaru Forester! My 29er HT fits in the back with the front wheel on, but I need a rack of some type for winter so that I don't have to put my filthy bike inside my nice new car. This thing rides great, off-roads great, handles great on-road, gets decent mileage, has TONS OF HEADROOM , but the front seats and gas pedal foot position could be better. Overall I'm happy with it though.

    Already figured out how to disable the stupid DRLs, programmed my remote to NOT make any noise during lock/un-locking of the vehicle, and preparing to un-solder the stupid seatbelt/door open with key in ignition buzzer.

    What rack should I get to haul 2 29ers, brand, model, roof or hitch rack?
    Last edited by Natedogz; 10-18-2010 at 11:40 PM.
    Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life son...

  9. #759
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    Quote Originally Posted by Natedogz
    Just bought my new 2010 Subaru Forester! My 29er HT fits in the back with the front wheel on, but I need a rack of some type for winter so that I don't have to put my filthy bike inside my nice new car. This thing rides great, off-roads great, handles great on-road, gets decent mileage, has TONS OF HEADROOM , but the front seats and gas pedal foot position could be better. Overall I'm happy with it though.

    Already figured out how to disable the stupid DRLs, programmed my remote to NOT make any noise during lock/un-locking of the vehicle, and preparing to un-solder the stupid seatbelt/door open with key in ignition buzzer.

    What rack should I get to haul 2 29ers, brand, model, roof or hitch rack?

    Congrats on the purchase. I would definitely recommend a hitch rack. I just don't understand the allure of putting the bikes on top of the car - its a PITA, gives you overhead clearance worries, and not to mention poor gas mileage. Hitch racks are definitely the way to go unless you're planning on towing something at the same time - in which case you might have other options to carry the bikes, too.

    I got the Sportrack from e-trailer.com and have been pretty happy with it, but have heard good things about the Swagman, too.
    Oh noes. I'm going to drink the Kool-Aid.

  10. #760
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    The 2.0s are damn close to 30mpg, I usually average right around 28, but that's driving around 80 on the highways we have here with lots of ups and down. I'd imagine 29-30 isn't hard given flat ground and lower speed limits.
    You're way outside the norm to get anywhere near 30mpg, the 2l was rated at 27mpg highway back with the old system. I've had my WRX for over 9 years and typically see 25 mpg on flat highways. Most guys see much lower. The 2.5l is significantly worse.

    Subaru needs to get those numbers up. Direct injection would be a great place to start.

  11. #761
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot
    .. the A4 Quattro is symmetrical. it even has equal length half shafts (no torque steer!). The output shaft of the tranny directly drives a Torsen center diff with a 50:50 torque split between front and rear (except the new S4 which is like 60:40 rear biased... or is it the RS4?). It's always on, always applying torque to all wheels (that have traction... mostly).

    heh... I saw some Youtube vids of guys out there who removed the front driveshafts and welded the Torsen diffs to make RWD drift cars.

    The A3 (and TT and Golf 4Motion R:. ) is a FWD with a Haldex clutch. It only engages when the front wheels slip. They still call it Quattro (or 4Motion in VW land). IIRC, the new B6 gen Passat uses the A4 chassis, but they went to transversely mounting the engine, and a Haldex. Maybe that is the system you are thinking of when you say FWD based.

    There is a vid put out by Subaru on Youtube comparing the different systems, and Subie has it all over the B6 Haldex based sideways engine Passat 4Motion. I wish they compared it to an earlier B5 or B5.5 Passat with a Torsen (basically an A4) based system.

    The difference is that the A4 (and up) use a longitudinally mounted engine (like Subaru), and the A3/TT/Golf are transversally mounted engine. Of course, the major downside of the longitudinally mounted engine is that there is a ton of engine weight overhang over the front axle, shifting a lot of weight forward. Subie's H engine layout is way shorter than VW/Audi's inline 4 cylinder. so there is a more even weight distribution.

    Skip to 1:18 to see how it works:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuzJqH46JzI

    The only real change with modern quattro is that they went from an open diff with an electronic locker to a Torsen center diff, and they use the ABS to stop a spinning wheel on the same axle.

    GAWD. I am such an Audi geek.
    Yes, that's what I meant, the FWD-based Quattro systems. I know very well that Audi does have a symmetrical AWD system as well (since many are longitudinally mounted engines).

    These days, electronics serve as the "eLSD". Not exactly ideal IMO, but it does work.

  12. #762
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowphun
    You're way outside the norm to get anywhere near 30mpg, the 2l was rated at 27mpg highway back with the old system. I've had my WRX for over 9 years and typically see 25 mpg on flat highways. Most guys see much lower. The 2.5l is significantly worse.

    Subaru needs to get those numbers up. Direct injection would be a great place to start.
    Yeah I get 26-ish with my 2.0l WRX wagon. Avg for my driving with mix of hwy and city is 20-21.
    :wq

  13. #763
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    Quote Originally Posted by Natedogz
    Just bought my new 2010 Subaru Forester! My 29er HT fits in the back with the front wheel on, but I need a rack of some type for winter so that I don't have to put my filthy bike inside my nice new car. This thing rides great, off-roads great, handles great on-road, gets decent mileage, has TONS OF HEADROOM , but the front seats and gas pedal foot position could be better. Overall I'm happy with it though.

    Already figured out how to disable the stupid DRLs, programmed my remote to NOT make any noise during lock/un-locking of the vehicle, and preparing to un-solder the stupid seatbelt/door open with key in ignition buzzer.


    What rack should I get to haul 2 29ers, brand, model, roof or hitch rack?
    I don't understand the people who disable DRLs... I personally like the idea of DRLs. I'm fine with replacing bulbs more often for the sake of safety (and a reduced chance of an accident, however low it may be). I mean, sometimes it's just plain hard to see cars even in the daytime, and having the headlights on helps a lot!

    And I know about the horn issue with the keyless entry. My Outback was already programmed with the horn off. I tried turning it on, the horn is obnoxiously loud so I turned it back off. If I had it on, my neighbors would hate me!

    As for the seatbelt/door open...
    My Outback doesn't have the seatbelt alarm
    But it does have the annoying "door open" alarm

  14. #764
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    Quote Originally Posted by AWDfreak
    I don't understand the people who disable DRLs... I personally like the idea of DRLs. I'm fine with replacing bulbs more often for the sake of safety (and a reduced chance of an accident, however low it may be). I mean, sometimes it's just plain hard to see cars even in the daytime, and having the headlights on helps a lot!
    I prefer to make my car more visible. Since the Subaru headlights turn off with the ignition, I just leave them on full time (my wife leaves hers on in her car as well). 94,000 miles and five and a half years, still on the original bulbs in my 05 WRX. Six years with the 01 RS (wifes car) and have replaced one bulb.
    :wq

  15. #765
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    Quote Originally Posted by AWDfreak
    I don't understand the people who disable DRLs... I personally like the idea of DRLs. I'm fine with replacing bulbs more often for the sake of safety (and a reduced chance of an accident, however low it may be). I mean, sometimes it's just plain hard to see cars even in the daytime, and having the headlights on helps a lot!

    And I know about the horn issue with the keyless entry. My Outback was already programmed with the horn off. I tried turning it on, the horn is obnoxiously loud so I turned it back off. If I had it on, my neighbors would hate me!

    As for the seatbelt/door open...
    My Outback doesn't have the seatbelt alarm
    But it does have the annoying "door open" alarm
    When I want my lights on, I'll turn them on. If alternator dies and I need to drive out from somewhere, the DRLs will kill my battery faster, thus increasing the chance that I'm stuck out on a dirt road in the middle of nowhere. The bulbs heat, the heat of the alternator working harder and the extra bulbs burned out increases global warming too.

    Quote Originally Posted by jcaino
    Congrats on the purchase. I would definitely recommend a hitch rack. I just don't understand the allure of putting the bikes on top of the car - its a PITA, gives you overhead clearance worries, and not to mention poor gas mileage. Hitch racks are definitely the way to go unless you're planning on towing something at the same time - in which case you might have other options to carry the bikes, too.

    I got the Sportrack from e-trailer.com and have been pretty happy with it, but have heard good things about the Swagman, too.
    Thanks!
    Last edited by Natedogz; 10-25-2010 at 12:54 AM.
    Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life son...

  16. #766
    I Tried Them ALL... Moderator
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    Mad Skillz...

    Here is former Works Subaru USA Rally driver Ken Block in his new, 650hp Ford Fiesta....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHrhaiCLRNg
    "The mind will quit....well before the body does"

  17. #767
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachariah
    Here is former Works Subaru USA Rally driver Ken Block in his new, 650hp Ford Fiesta....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHrhaiCLRNg
    Wrong link

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TshFWSsrn8


  18. #768
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    Neato!

    Quote Originally Posted by AWDfreak
    Makes me wish my car had 660 hp... and an autodrome all to myself to drive it in!

  19. #769
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    Quote Originally Posted by nachomc
    Yeah I get 26-ish with my 2.0l WRX wagon. Avg for my driving with mix of hwy and city is 20-21.
    I get around 22hwy and 18 city. I just fixed a massive up pipe leak so we'll see if it does any better on this tank.

  20. #770
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    I like my 06 subaru outback but its starting to worry me lately with all of the issues that are arising. It just turned 60,000 miles and it has been in the shop quite a bit, although everything has been covered by my warranty and the issues were somewhat minor I just have started to lose faith in the brand.The transmission is starting to act up as well and the dealer says they couldn't find anything wrong and wanted to charge me $50 for looking at it, I didn't pay it and left. I also don't think the fuel mileage isnt all that great for the size of the car and am starting to consider buying another chevy silverado, maybe I just have a lemon, besides that I do get tired of all the flack I get for driving a wagon!
    The snozberries taste like snozberries!

  21. #771
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    Not sure if any one has posted this.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Who else here drives a Subaru?-chris.jpg  


  22. #772
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    Here is my wife's car 09 Forrester loaded up and ready for vacation.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Who else here drives a Subaru?-picture-341.jpg  


  23. #773
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    I made some straps to fit on the inside of the hood that are used for tie down straps, took some old cordura 1" wide and made a loop and used the inner fender bolt to attach it. When I don't need the strap I fold it to the inside of the engine compartment. I think this would work a lot better than having a tie down rope across your bumper and head lamps. I can post some pics. if your interested.
    The snozberries taste like snozberries!

  24. #774
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    Quote Originally Posted by Habits76
    I made some straps to fit on the inside of the hood that are used for tie down straps, took some old cordura 1" wide and made a loop and used the inner fender bolt to attach it. When I don't need the strap I fold it to the inside of the engine compartment. I think this would work a lot better than having a tie down rope across your bumper and head lamps. I can post some pics. if your interested.

    Yes that would be great! Thank you.

  25. #775
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    For a tiedown point you guys can also use the tow hook that plugs into that little square on the front and back bumpers

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